Atheists Convince TN University to Ban Prayer Before Football Games
Prayer at public school football games has been a frequent target of atheist activist groups, particularly when it comes to high schools and colleges in Tennessee. Last September, high school football coaches in Westmoreland found themselves in hot water for bowing their heads during student-led prayers. And now, the University of Tennessee at Chattanooga has taken the extraordinary step of banning prayers before games.
WATE-TV has more about how the ban came to fruition:
University of Tennessee at Chattanooga officials banned public prayer before football games after receiving a complaint. Now some Knoxville student fear the same kind of ban will be put in place at Neyland Stadium.
The prayer complaint sent to school officials in Chattanooga came from the Freedom From Religion Foundation. The organization says a local person complained in May about prayer at games.
Freedom From Religion Foundation officials say it is rare to get complaints about universities, but that is not keeping students on Knoxville’s campus from speaking out on the issue.
The school’s chancellor, Roger Brown, announced this week that the university will now issue a moment of silence rather than a spoken prayer before each game. The decision comes after the FFRF complaint and after the university’s Secular Student Alliance (SSA), an atheist student group, protested the previous prayer practices.
“We believe this allows all in attendance to reflect and address their individual beliefs in their own ways,” Brown said, according to The Chattanooga Free Press reports. “Events such as football games should provide opportunities to bring all members of our community together.”
Naturally, the atheist student group is praising the new-found ban.
“In order to have separation of church and state, public schools do not need to be having prayers at these public events,” SSA member Elisabeth Spratt proclaimed.
But Christian students aren’t happy with the prayer change. TJ Earl, a Baptist Collegiate Ministry intern, for one, made his discontent known. Aside from claiming that he’s disappointed, he expressed anger over the ban.
“Not shocked at all,” he said. ”Disappointed, and kind of puts a little bit of rage inside me, to be honest. I don’t think it’s appropriate.”
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Comments (213)
Elena2010
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:41pmGood thing we Christians do not riot when our sensibilities are offended.
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kinja8787
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:54pmMaybe we should start. We could go all Joshua on them. Go all Crusader on their ass. That might make them back off a little bit in the future.
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:13pm“Maybe we should start. We could go all Joshua on them. Go all Crusader on their ass. That might make them back off a little bit in the future.”
As a Christian, I sincerely hope you are joking.
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PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:25pmBILLY HOLLOWELL does not want to print this Chancellor’s contact number, but just type in Chancellor Roger G. Brown UT Chattanooga and you will see his phone number. BE NICE. They are getting lots of calls, but make sure your message is: Announce that PRAYERS ARE COMING so Atheists get to cover their ears…. let’s see if this gets posted :)
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kinja8787
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:32pm@Locked…Serious as I can get. At some point we have to stand up and defend our selves.
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momrules
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:35pmWe are told by Muslims that if we say anything that insults their god they will kill us.
We are told by militant God haters that if we pray in a stadium they will sue us into submission.
Two sides of the same coin.
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:39pm@Kinja
“Serious as I can get. At some point we have to stand up and defend our selves.”
Calling for a Crusade against non-believers because it is unconstitutional to lead a prayer before a public school’s sports game is not what I would call “defense.”
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turkey13
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:48pmI’m thinking about calling the ACLU. I feal like as a Christian I am being discriminated against. Within another year these Athiest will be sueing if they see a sign in front of a Church that mentions God or religion. It might hurt their feelings or make them go nuts. We have two generations out there that have never been to Church or heard a prayer and we wonder why there are so many shootings at schools or colleges across the country. These kids get their feelings hurt and this is their way of lashing out. They have no experience with good or bad until they get to prison. The kids that did Columbine had no relation to God but probably scream it every night whie being Big, Big John’s B_itch.
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Republichic
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:53pmNow’s the time for a good letter writing event to the Dean. Sounds like he needs some schooling.
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usedCZARsalesman
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:25pmLOCKED…while I share your sentiment about “crusading”, you are just absolutely wrong about the Constitution. The Founders WANTED religion in EVERY SINGLE aspect of government…they wanted religion and religious themes be a permenant, engrained fixture in American politics…what they DID NOT want, is for government to have ANY influence on religion WHAT-SO-EVER!
You are talking about a group of people that began EVERY session with a CHRISTIAN prayer…men that HELD CHRISTIAN CHURCH in the CAPITAL every single Sunday (and most of them attended EVERY week…Washington and Jefferson for sure)…these folks were the VERY SAME PEOPLE that commissioned the building of ALL the federal buildings of the day and EVERY ONE OF THEM has bible scriptures, religious quotes and religious art ALL THROUGHOUT! You are just plain wrong brother, just plain wrong…
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:01pm@Used
Nice to see you again! I feel we’ve debated the point before, but I could be mistaking you with someone else.
“while I share your sentiment about “crusading”, you are just absolutely wrong about the Constitution.”
I’m pretty confident in the Constitutionality of this, actually. The Supreme Court ruled in 2000 with Santa Fe Independent School Dist. v. Doe that prayer before a game that is led by public school officials or using public school equipment is unconstitutional.
You may disagree with their ruling, of course. But as far as I know that’s the current stance of the SCotUS in regard to the matter.
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Sosorryforyou
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:09pm@Usedczar
And, this was the same group of people who wrote in our Constitution that Americans shall have the Freedom of Religion, and that no established religion shall rule America. Like it or note, we are not and never have been a Christian Nation because of the “no established religion” clause, even if those who wrote the Constitution were Christian. So even if you as a Christian want your religious prayers represented at a public institution, unless you are also okay with allowing every other religion’s prayers to be represented, you are asking a public institution to act unConstitutionally.
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colt1860
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:25pm@lock LOL. Yeah, the same court that says child rapists can’t get the death penalty, and the same court that just barely confirmed our right to bear and keep arms. LMAO! What a freaking wonderful court. LOL.
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TheLeftMadeMeRight
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:27pmI don’t understand, at what point do these atheists violate our rights to worship freely?
Isn’t it about time to change the playbook and start suing atheists groups out of business?
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Jezcruzen
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:48pmWell, “LOCKED”… you can get down off your phony Christian horse now. What do you think YESHUA will be coming back to do? Let me help you. He is coming with a sword! He will be kicking a$$ and taking names!
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:59pm@Jez
“you can get down off your phony Christian horse now. What do you think YESHUA will be coming back to do? Let me help you. He is coming with a sword! He will be kicking a$$ and taking names!”
Being non-violent means being a phony Christian? Well dang, I guess you caught me. I should totally go kill non-believers like the Bible commands. I think it was in the commandments somewhere… Something about “Thou shall murder everyone”? I tend to forget.
If your statement is true, it still doesn’t refute my point. If Jesus comes back with a sword, then so be it. Nowhere does that give YOU a spiritual blank check to slaughter people with whom you disagree.
When Jesus comes back (if it happens during my lifetime), I’ll be sure to ask him “Lord, isn’t it justifiable to murder non-believers if I’m not allowed to force my prayers upon them in public?”
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usedCZARsalesman
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 5:31pmLOCKED, the ruling ITSELF is unconstitutional period! The Founders would have lynched those judges without a doubt…it’s pretty obvious that they have ignored the constitution for decades now! And good to hear from you as well, and I’m sure we have fought this battle before LOL
SOSORRY, you are too ignorant about this subject for me to spend much time, but read the first amendment again…CONGRESS (not football teams/schools/WHATEVER) shall make no LAW (not a prayer, like I said the Founders opened EVERY SINGLE session of CONGRESS with a CHRISTIAN PRAYER YOU TWIT) respecting an establishing of religion…meaning they didn’t want a “Church of America”, as they just fled Europe to get away from the CHURCH OF ENGLAND…read history before you come to a battle of whits UNARMED…at least LOCKED knows what he’s talking about.
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tcoyne
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 5:42pmYou don’t need to riot to get your point across. You can organize a prayer group before the game and better yet organize alot of prayer groups where someone conducts the prayer for each group around the stadium. Freedom of speech issue if they try and stop you. Imagine the whole stadium arganized into groups with each having a vocal prayer to take the place of the loud speaker.
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sillyfreshness
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 5:54pmThere is a total war against Christians and conservative Americans. Marxists and Muslims know most Americans are weak and see the more they cave in, the weaker they are. They are going in for the kill. Political correctness is weakness and they know it. America’s time is almost finished. Obama getting reelected will see our total destruction to where we become a 3rd world banana republic–to fulfill the dreams of Obama’s Marxist, alcoholic, deadbeat father. His dreams-our worst nightmares!
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nonwinger
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 6:25pmIf Christians really want to make a point, why not boycott any university sponsored public events where prayers are normally held OR have the entire Christian population pray aloud during the moment of silence?
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Sail Away
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 7:32pm@Locked (regarding your response to Kinja8787) Get a sense of humor and stop being so religious and self righteous. I wonder what your critique of Jesus with a whip in the temple would entail. Would you have told HIM to settle down and just let all the business men keep selling their merchandise? LOL Grow a set buddy and lighten up. :)
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NHwinter
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 8:23pmI think the Lord will ask us what we did when others were trying to get Him out of our schools, government, and our way of life. Did we just sit back and let it happen or did we fight for our right to express our faith freely. Isn’t it time we sued the atheist for offending our faith and right to express it? They are a tiny minority, yet they are succeeding in taking God out of our lives.
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dmerwin
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 9:19pmWhen they fund the university, THEN they can make the rules.
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ModerationIsBest
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 9:21pmTalk to the guy who got death threats for stealing a Jesus wafer from a Catholic church and threatening to destroy it.
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colt1860
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 10:40pmNext time a Government official or politician says, “God bless you”, after you sneeze, or says, “God bless America”, after his speech, make sure to inform him that he just established a religion, thus violating the “first amendment”, and that he will soon receive a call from the FFRF and ACLU. Tell him that if he doesn’t leave religious expression at home, that he is a fascist theocratic and that he’s not allowed to say anything “religious” that offends others’ or differs from other religious beliefs. Also tell him, that any time he mentions anything religious for whatever reason, that he must also include a diverse cast of gods, other sacred books and various “holy” traditions in order to not exclude or “favor” any one. After you tell him all that, give yourself a knock on the head, erase yourself of all Marxist BS shoved down on you by closet communist politicians and public officials, and wake yourself up from Lala land.
Liberals, militaristic atheists, ignorant “secularists”, and arrogant progressives are pathetic and deluded. God have mercy on our blind, arrogant, self righteous, degenerate nation.
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JesusIsAsRealAsSantaYouIdiots
Posted on September 13, 2012 at 1:33amYou christians are so whiny. Just be glad you can have your moment of silence and pray on your own, have you ever thought praying to your christian god might not be in line with what others think?, we don’t live in a country where christianity is the only religion one can practice. There is no more proof that christianty is the “real” religion, Allah and the flying spaghetti monster have about the same chance of being real that any of the others do.
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dimitrisokolov
Posted on September 13, 2012 at 9:54amYeah because I’m sure God really cares who wins the football game when people are getting murdered, tortured, raped, hacked to death, blown up or starving to death around the world.
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davecorkery
Posted on September 13, 2012 at 12:33pmYou want to throw wishes into the air at your imaginary friend, go right ahead. I will not stop you, and will stop anyone who tries to prevent you from doing so. That is what makes America great, We can all have our own opinions and no one goes nuts. Might get a little PO-ed, but that’s it.
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Nobugginme
Posted on September 17, 2012 at 5:12pm@TheLeftMadeMeRight I don’t think atheists don’t want you to pray. they just don’t want to listen to people in unison praying to the “Flying Spaghetti Monster” (http://www.venganza.org/ <<< Legitimate religion In US)
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saneromeo
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:41pmHow can a rational individual think you can BAN religious worship in the United States, look at what is going on in the UK with their right to wear a cross at work under attack, this is religious tyranny… I propose a coordinated Lord’s Prayer by the TN football crowd, drowning out the announcers, and after the the cameras have started broadcasting….
http://saneromeo.wordpress.com/
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Trance
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:32pmReligious worship cannot be banned in the United States. However, the US government cannot establish a religion. And courts have found that a religion is established by promoting religion. Then again, would it even be possible to establish a religion without promoting it?
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usedCZARsalesman
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:31pmWhat is happening in the UK is a perfect example of what IS happening here…they are working closer and closer to the point were ALL external “prothlytizing” will be outlawed…no church marquees in view of ANY public road, no handing out bibles to soldiers, no military chaplains of ANY kind, no “in uniform” clergy on public grounds, on and on…we will be forced to practice in the “privacy of our own homes” as to not “offend” anyone…this IS coming, just wait.
The Court’s interp of the 1ST Amendment is PURE INSANITY and the ruling itself is unConstituitional…the Founders would have lynched those Judges, no doubt
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Balpit
Posted on September 13, 2012 at 12:49pmIf they can force people to buy Obamacare when it clearly goes against the Constitution, then they can certainly find ways to ban religious freedom.
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perry1980
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:40pmWhy are we letting the Fringe run this country?
Show some Backbone America.
We Will Not Comply!
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TheLeftMadeMeRight
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:30pmand what have you done to further this cause, beyond your post that is?
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Nobugginme
Posted on September 17, 2012 at 5:14pm..Avoided further compliment with this website apparently.
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john vincent
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:35pmA serious question for all you GOd deniers,and proponents of the ‘separation between church and state’ in regard to prayer:
WHAT church is being represented at a football event, where a prayer is uttered???
What CHURCH is represented when a govt official utters a prayer at a breakfast???
What church is REPRESENTED when somebody says to you ‘God bless you when yopu sneeze???
What church is represented WHEN the president says ‘God bless AMerica???
Answer carefully, lest everyone see your foolery.
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TEIN
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:21pm@John, by using the justice system and threat of law suit is the way the religion or church of Atheism will become the state church, that is the goal!!! Your logic is lost on the dogma of Atheism…cause if there is no God, then there is no prayer therefore just poetic philosophy….Atheist’s are doing exactly what T.J. feared would happen when he made the “separation of church and state” statement. Atheism has become the voice of religion or state church supported by the justice system of USA Federal Government…
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Trance
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:29pmWHAT church is being represented at a football event, where a prayer is uttered???
If it is a Christian prayer, then it is the Christian church that is being represented.
What CHURCH is represented when a govt official utters a prayer at a breakfast???
Same answer.
What church is REPRESENTED when somebody says to you ‘God bless you when yopu sneeze???
I’m not sure of the origin of “God bless you”, but most likely the Christian church again.
What church is represented WHEN the president says ‘God bless AMerica???
The Christian church. I’m surprised you didn’t know the answers to these questions. Seemed very obvious to me.
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biggreenboo
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:37pmSorry Trance… that’s a religion not a church. Wrong answer…try again.
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john vincent
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:45pmcmon trance-
your answer misses the point; ‘prayer’ is not always christian.
For God’s sake, a Jewish wrestler could utter a prayer before a match; would he be representing the Jewish church??
Praying does not make it a church issue, thats the point.
If a person prayed ‘Lord, bless this victory for the catholic church,’ then your argument would be valid; but honestly, have you ever heard such nonsense??
There remains the clear separation or ‘church and state,’ by uttering a prayer; nobody, nor any institution is threatened. In addition, invoking GOd, threatens nothing nor no one; His existence was never questioned; just read the Declaration of Independence.
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encinom
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:58pmAn individual uttering a prayer is not the issue, the issue is a school endorsed public pray, the wrestler is fine, the coach of a PUBLIC SCHOOL that demands his team pray is not.
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john vincent
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:34pm-tein
Seems common sense can used here. If a group wanted to pray, go ahead; if you do not want to participate, walk away. Nobody is coerced, and nobody is denied. It does not to be made a federal case for GO’d sake, and it allows all to excercise whatever they belief they wish.
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TEIN
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:43pm@Trance…the point is Christian is not a church..that is the point….it is a belief based on teachings…England state church Church of England, Italy Catholic Church….both Christian different church…saying a prayer at a public event does not promote any church….
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scarebear83
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:50pmYa know, I had to think about this one… I’m sure most of you have seen an infomercial and most likely have seen it before it starts. The part where the network states that the “following broadcast does not reflect the views of Such and Such Network.” The schools should state, “the following atheist statements do not reflect the views of Such and Such School nor the administrators or students.”
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nolefan2
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:33pmI’m sick and tired of atheists attempting to get prayers banned at public events. They are not made to bow their heads and pray so what is the problem? No one is making them do anything against their will like they are trying to make believers stop praying against their will.
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littleberry
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:43pmI totally agree. They can put cotton in their ears. We should take the drones they have spying on us in the USA and put them over Libya and Egypt and hit the demonstrators with a missile. After a few hits they wouldn’t be so ready to demonstrate and kill Americans.
shawshank45
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:20pmWhy are Muslims allowed to drop to their knees and pray anytime anyplace. They have also been given special considerations for this “necessity” at their workplaces, our universities, and pretty much anyplace they demand, yet this christian nation remains constantly under attack.
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Eric_The_Red_State
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:31pmSee that stadium?
It seats 20,668
So we let ONE guy with a problem with prayer —- dictate to the rest of us — whether we can pray or not?
Does anyone see a problem with this?
Anyone at all?
Army_of_One
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:39pmIt’s like the tail wagging the dog! Thank our beloved attorneys for this! These institutions need to grow a pair and blow these idiots off! If you don’t like / believe in prayer, then feel free to stand OUTSIDE..!!
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My Two Cents
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:52pmSeems to me that weak kneed people like the school’s chancellor Roger Brown are the problem and not the atheists.
JustOnePerson
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:39pmNO Kidding! It only takes One person to start the Lords Prayer (Out Loud) in that time of silence to start a Ripple Effect! Can you Hear 20,667 people praying now?
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USA DJ
Posted on September 13, 2012 at 1:27amYes, I see a big problem with this and so should any American. Our first amendment rights are being violated at the expense of a few people who want to change our traditions, our country and our values. It is sad that the school gave in to this pressure at the expense of the students and the spectators who want prayer before the game. This organization is dispicable and evil. They are systimatically changing our country and they are a small minority yet they seem to be calling the shots. Christians need to stand together against this group of thugs because they are no better than terrorist. We can not give in to their twisted, warped interpertation of our constitution. I agree that a boycott of the games or vocal prayer would be a great way to stand up for our rights as Christians. Don’t take this sitting down. Stand for what you know in your heart is right. What are they going to do, expel everyone from the game! Remember, we surround them!
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mtsnj
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:30pmWoah!!! hold your horses… “Naturally, the atheist student group is praising the new-found ban.”
They can’t praise anything! it’s against their religion.
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lildrummerboy
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:57pmmajority rules implies a democracy, we are a republic
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Sirfoldallot
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:29pmTN university is weak 4 not standing up 2 a bully.
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GlennaBeckski
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:29pmHow is it such a tiny minority rules the day? Don’t Christians outnumber athiests 99-1?
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HorseCrazy
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:45pmbecause lawsuits are expensive and the person suing doesn’t have to pay, they have these idiot freedom from anything that hurts our feelings foundations that cover all costs while just to get to court the schools have to spend a ton of money on court fees. In my business my insurance co makes me settle all of the time just to avoid the cost of court even when I am 100% in the right. its the garbage lawsuits that our tax dollars pay for and back up our court systems that need reform. too bad no one will take a stand, I for one pray in every restaurant my family eats at and get dirty looks from all the athiests in the room as if its highly offensive my saying grace. oh well too bad. I guess we live in a society where prayer hurts peoples feelings now. go figure
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:00pmwe have the law and the constitution on our side. that beats a majority any day.
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:04pm“How is it such a tiny minority rules the day? Don’t Christians outnumber athiests 99-1?”
Since when does “majority rules” decide anything when it comes to Constitutionality?
And no, atheism in the US is somewhere between 2 and 15% of the population. Agnosticism (or lacking an actual religion) is likely higher.
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:07pmwe’ll remember you said that in 20 years when Atheism/Agnosticism is the majority. somehow, however, i think we’ll have empathy, unlike so many of you folks here.
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TEIN
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:33pmNo @Philly…you do not have the law on your side, you have the judicial system on your side,because there is no law banning religious expression or religious speech in public or at public events..The Libby/Progressive civil courts cow-tow to the church and religion of atheism…
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encinom
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:55pm@TEIN
there is the Establishment Clause that binds public schools, so yes the law and the Constitution is on our side.
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TEIN
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:23pmTry again @Encinom…that would be a very far reach to encompass public schools into the establishment clause, but it is upheld by civil courts, so it is still as I have stated, as well as by these judgments and stretch of interpretation the civil courts are making the Church of Atheism the religious voice of the Federal Government…
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encinom
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 5:59pm@Tein, you do realize, that in a common law nation, like the US, a courts interpretation of the Constitution and statutes, unless changed by an Amendment to the Constitution or act of the legislature, depending on the ruling is law. Supreme Court rulings bind the nation. You are arguing against the very foundation of American law.
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mtsnj
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:28pmWhat happened to Majority rule.. Time out.. pray for an atheist today at least they believe in something. Bow your heads for a moment of silence, atheists go stand in the corner and prepare for your loss.
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:01pmjust like with all prayer, you’re wasting your time.
PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:26pmSATAN ON THE MOVE, ISLAM on the MOVE hidding under the Atheists banner. IF the good people of TENNESSEE allow these thugs to get away with this, you are not the SOUTHERNERS I know and love.
HEY ATHEISTS!! IF HEARING GOD’S NAME SPOKEN by Thousands of Football fans so worries you …the name of our PRECIOUS LORD JESUS CHRIST burns you, just wait. You will have an eternity in which you will awake, aware and unable to move, speak, stop the information for eternity. You think all you do is just die, turn to dust and that’s it? NOPE. Go read any account of near-death experience people who did not believe in GOD PRIOR to this near death experience. YOU can keep your Satanic inspired mind set , but ANY PERSON IN TENNESSEE at these GAMES who doesn’t SAY IN JESUS’S NAME or THANK YOU LORD or some clear statement of faith after their moment of silence is turning against GOD. And this weanie, this Chancellor Robert Brown: I have suggested to Chancellor Brown that INSTEAD OF STOPPING OUR PRAYER, he says : We are now going to have our prayer and those who don’t want to hear it are invited to COVER THEIR EARS, (and then proceed with our prayer) YOU must be kind when you call. this is a terrible position for people to be in. The bloody ACLU will sue on pro bono and they probably make a fortune doing this. School’s budgets are tight. so? These Atheists do not have to hear it. They get a 30 Sec. Warning !
His #
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DeavonReye
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:46pmSame old statements with not proof. Attempting to “scare people with a burning eternity”. . . “Satanic inspired”. . . . . . all just words. Words without evidence. Opinion. And “near death experiences”? What about those “near death experiences” that were NOT christian based? Were they lying?
In my ~20 years of christian living, I never saw anything convincing of a “supernatural god”. I DID see good works of the people. The PEOPLE. There is your “god”. People having compassion for others in need/pain. Even a non-religious person can attest to this feeling.
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PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:59pmMan, you tried to come to the party but you stayed outside. You missed the Banquet. I am a CHRISTIAN. I have been for many years and I have seen a large number of MIRACLES (things that have no explanation but that of a LOVING GOD) I have no doubt about a GOD ALMIGHTY…so you keep doing SATAN’S WORK, hear? You make sure to stand up and let people know there is nothing Christians can expect …. Man, do you have some work to do…before you can keep calling yourself Christian.
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DeavonReye
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:25pmFirst reply didn’t take. Trying again.
I was a christian for ~20 years. . . . and a very sincere one [well before I ever doubted or had a reason to doubt]. No longer am, based upon actually doing my own homework.
As for “doing Satan’s work”, or “being used by Satan”, . . . . . if what I go on is actual EVIDENCE, and repeatable data points, . . . and that is “the way Satan operates”, then there is NO god who can justly punish me for only being honest in that stance. There isn’t any evidence for “the supernatural at work”. No evidence for “the god found in the bible”.
You may have seen “miracles”, . . . but other religions [non-christian] make those claims. And even IF “a miracle” happened in your presence. All you have to go on is . . . . an opinion of the mechanism. However, just because you uttered words to a god being, and something happened, that doesn’t mean “a god did it”. There could be MANY reasons.
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americanfoodblister
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 11:10pmAnother example of how religion poisons everything …
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:23pmSome times you don’t know who is more ignorant: the atheists that keep feeding the fallacy of “separation of church and state” or those who choke themselves swallowing it.
Public colleges don’t give away education for free. Students pay their tuition. Even federal scholarships are taxpayers funded.
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PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:46pmLETS reiterate one more time: THE SEPARATION OF CHURCH and STATE: This is law that says
THE GOVERNMENT cannot ESTABLISH A CHURCH (like ISLAM) and force people to belong.
OKAY. reread that. GET IT? IT’S SO THE GOVERNMENT can’t SET UP a “FAITH” that we are forced to believe in. It has nothing to do with 1 zillion faiths that WE, The People, establish or can establish..it has to do with GOVERNMENT CONTROL in the name of GOD. GET THAT would you people, Please?? I get nauseated every time I hear some sheeple say ” But it’s supposed to be Separation of Church and State “… THE GOVERNMENT cannot CONTROL what RELIGIONS do, say, how they perform…that includes colleges having prayers before a football game…and don’t even go to the fact that colleges are funded in all or in part by GOVERNMENT…. ONE LAST TIME: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS GOVERNMENT MONEY…it is OUR…O U R MONEY… okay? THE GOVERNMENT HAS -0- money!!!
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:58pm@ Patty
You should at least make your position clear invoking the correct language of the Constitution:
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…”.
That is the correct “separation church and state” not what atheists and people like you bring to the table every time communities want to pray in public schools (funded by taxpayers money), in public universities (tuition paid by students or funded by tax payers money), in public parks (funded by tax payers money), or in any place your atheists friends consider property of the Government. Nothing and nobody in the United States of America belongs to the Government. Re-read that Patty, Government belongs to US, WE THE PEOPLE.
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:06pm“the fallacy of “separation of church and state””
How are you using “fallacy” in this statement?
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PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:09pmU do it your way FLORIDAREADER, I’ll do it mine. IF PEOPLE get what you are saying better than what I am saying…fine. IF the reverse is true fine. THE POINT IS THAT WE SHOULD NOT LET THESE ATHEISTS HAVE ANY SAY in stopping PRAYER, anywhere, ever.
What I’d rather see you do, FLORIDAREADER, is work within your State to make sure that OBAMA, the MUSLIM TRAITOR, doesn’t get away with fooling these people again… Like DENYING his wish to gut MEDICARE $ 716 BILLION dollars … and USE it for his OBAMACARE to try to make it ‘appear less expensive” that OBM is stating it is. BY helping the JEWS in FLORIDA understand that their mortal enemies are showing up more and more in DC GOVT offices – at will – not only in the DEPARTMENT OF STATE, but that OBAMA, being MUSLIM has NO INTENTION of meeting with NETANYAHU. I’ll communicate how I communicate. You do your own communication. The point is that people finally understand that RELIGION is NOT THE ENEMY.
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:20pm@ locked
I call it “fallacy” because atheists try to take advantage of the letter Thomas Jefferson wrote back in 1802 to The Danbury Baptist Association regarding his position that Government shouldn’t have business in a person’s religion.
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:25pm@Patty
We definitely agree in the freedom of people to exercise their religion in public and private places. But the “separation of church and state” concept atheists use in their arguments is being totally manipulated.
And down here in Florida, we conservatives are doing our part to make sure that BHO is out of America’s White House by January 20th, 2013.
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PATTY HENRY
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:58pm@FLORIDAREADER : THIS “concept” needs to be thoroughly sifted down and put out in the most understandable words possible. Most of the people I’ve met/discussed this with have – at First – thought that “since the Pilgrims (seriously) came to America to escape Religious Authority” that this new Government had the right to tell American Religions what to say/do to make sure THAT didn’t happen again” TOTALLY WRONG. These people understand the way I say it (not quoting from the Constitution word for word) but simply put: Government cannot FORCE RELIGION to do anything. Religion, Religious, supporters of religion. Government cannot STOP RELIGIOUS from expressing their RELIGION. It’s really important that people understand how this all goes together. ISLAM is the direct opposite from our CONSTITUTION. KNOW that.
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Locked
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 3:35pm@Florida
“I call it “fallacy” because atheists try to take advantage of the letter Thomas Jefferson wrote back in 1802 to The Danbury Baptist Association regarding his position that Government shouldn‘t have business in a person’s religion.”
But since the Supreme Court has ruled that the Establishment Clause does in fact include a separation of church and state, wouldn’t “fallacy” be the incorrect term? It’s not a false premise or mistaken belief; it’s part of our legal history now. I could understand calling it a hijacked ruling or some such, but it certainly is not mistaken or false.
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:48pm@Patty and Locked
Thanks so much for this illustrative exchange
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AllLost
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:23pmWell the Muslims have shown us the proper response right? Didn’t Pres Obama just say we do not stand for people who insult religion? How many people have died over this…must be thousands as we know it is the WASP that is the real threat to America.
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piper60
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 4:16pmThe constitution forbids laws which infringe on the free exercise of religion-and state schools must abide by the rule.
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13th Imam
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:20pmA (one), 1 complaint? One? Just 1 (one)?
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oldguy49
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:26pmdown with christianity and up with islam…………this country is going to end very bad if we don’t wake up…………..
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momrules
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:18pmPray anyway. Pray out loud and loudly. Defy these persecutors of Christians.
Do not comply with the demands of these God haters. I’m through placating anyone.
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BoyScout_Mom
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:32pmThe only way this is going to stop, is if the stadiums go empty. Stop showing up to their games. Its time to stand. Make a stand. All the So-called “News” networks are going bankrupt. Now that Glenn is back on TV, I hope all the other useless channels and “News” stations here crickets. Its time to let them fall.
The DNC made their stand. The Dems made their stand.
Make your stand.
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floridareader
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:32pmWhere the atheists have been every time BHO has hosted gala dinners for Ramadan in America’s White House.
Oh, but if he signs the Day of Prayer proclamation they are all over the place with their false rhetoric ripping their own clothes in protest.
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Army_of_One
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:41pmhere here Momrules…!!
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doomytram
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:17pmJust compromise and ask if they can air Muslim Porno before the games, and then cover the women fans head’s with helmet shapped masks with the threat of head chopping swipe with a sword if the women don’t comply. Then you can pray for 20 seconds 20 minutes after the game is over.
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kalli
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:15pmWatch their football program falter! Atheists do not rule America. Stop letting them bully you.
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Steve28
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:12pmForget about them do it anyway in private for those that wish to participate in the locker room. Again, being PC has created another problem.
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JimL
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:11pmMaybe the state doesn’t need these events?
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banjarmon
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:09pmHEY atheist SIT DOWN AND SHUT UP!!!! WE Christian out number you!!!
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facilitiesmgr
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:37pmBANJARMON,
I’ve got a question for you. What part of the character of God does your vitriolic comment display? NONE. If you want to express to others who God is follow the guidelines for relationships shown in the Bible. If I was an unbeliever I would say, “If that’s the way Christians act I don’t want anything to do with that”.
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facilitiesmgr
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:41pmBANJARMON.
I’ve got a question for you. What part of the character of God does your statement reflect? NONE!
As a Christian, I am appalled by your lack of Christlike witness and if I was an unbeliever I would say, “if that’s what a Christian is and if that the was one acts, I don’t want any part of it.
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:04pmFACILITIES – thank you. well said.
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Lordchamp
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:08pmI’m sick of this atheist group. Since when does “a complaint” overrule all the rest of us? Again, PLEASE show me where separation of church and state is ANYWHERE in our Constitution or Bill or Rights? Well I’m complaining about it being removed, will that get any attention? NO!!
It’s time for Christians to stand up and be counted and open their mouths WIDE. Scream from the rooftops that we’re not going to be run over any longer.
Wake up and realize that groups like this will NOT STOP until they have taken ALL our religious rights away from us. Once we lose those what do we really have left that can’t be take at will?
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Luvs2golf
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:59pmAgree…..Since when does the majority have no standing anymore? Seems like a lot of this happening, 1 or 2 people complain about something and presto, they get their way. The University should have stood up to them, this is America, love it or leave it, ASAP. Grrrrrrrrrr………
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SquidVetOhio
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:05pmUgh, can we ban atheists from football games please?
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johnjamison
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:10pmHow about just ban Football…school should be about learning,educational and intellectual advancement.
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My Two Cents
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:57pmYou can’t ban them but you could certainly point them out and ridicule them.
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:05pmMYTWO – just how are you supposed to recognize us? one of us could be sitting next to you and you’d never know it. we don’t have the mark of the beast, lol.
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Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:05pmHey, queue Philly. This is exactly what he said. That you should have to pay for public land but that you should be forbidden from praying on it. Now the fun part begins. So what will they do if you DO pray on it? Police going to come haul you away? (they wouldn’t think twice about doing it) They going to expel you? We going to fill prisons with prayer offenders?
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phillyatheist
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:13pmhey ROTH. TN is a state school subsidized by state and federal dollars. players and fans may very well not be Christian. they should do their best to be inclusive to all. a moment of silence allows everyone to pray, remember, or daydream. sounds like the best possible strategy.
as for what will happen if they prayed anyway, well you’re being absurd. no one will be locked up. a lawsuit would follow, plain and simple.
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woodyee
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:05pmOne can have no victory over the evils of secular humanism, if one is consistent in his lukewarm response to it – bend forward, grab the ankles and wince…
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Rickfromillinois
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:03pmGood thing we aren’t muslims or we would be out burning buildings and killing people.
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Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 1:10pmMaybe we should and then they could prosecute the atheists.
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Republichic
Posted on September 12, 2012 at 2:55pmAbsolutely. The amazing thing is that you know who would give us the lighters to do it.
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