During a Thursday broadcast of MSNBC’s “NOW,” a panel of like-minded journalists decided that rather than explain away the 1998 audio of then-Sen. Barack Obama saying he “believe[s] in redistribution,” they would embrace the term and wonder aloud, “gee, why don’t more Americans like this idea?”
“This redistribution word, which is a word that I’m sure is intended to be befuddle people because it’s not a word that real people use,” said Chicago Sun-Times columnist Lynn Sweet. “By using this word — I think it’s a bit coded, first of all. But why don’t we call it ‘Robin Hood-ism?’”
Time out.
Robin Hood didn’t simply steal from the wealthy and redistribute it to the poor, as anyone who has actually read the book will tell you. He reclaimed what the king’s tax collectors stole through unjust taxation. For the sake of your argument, Miss Sweet, we’d advise against referring to the bumper sticker version of Robin Hood.
Okay, time in.
“I think that Romney goes into this argument at his own peril because you’re not necessarily saying, ‘redistribute – bad,’” she continued.
“I’m confused,” said New York Times reporter Nicholas Confessore. “I assume they have some focus group data than tells them this word is a hot button for some voters that they want to reach. But the fact is that this concept is baked into American government.”
He went on to argue that America’s progressive tax rates are a perfect example of “redistribution.”
“Lynn said the word is a ‘bit coded,’ and I think it’s a lot coded,” said New York Times reporter Hugo Lindgren. “It’s meant to, sort of, confuse people and create this complicated concept that government is doing something sort of devious that you didn’t think they were doing, or that is going to, kind of, double-cross you.”
Or it could be that people react negatively to the word because a) the idea of an overreaching and confiscatory government isn’t a foreign concept and b) the belief that government gets to decide who gets what is closely associated with the likes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao, etc., who, you know, are kind of scary.
Watch the panel discussion here [via MSNBC]:
“If you don’t believe in redistribution, then you don’t believe in any public services at all,” said MSNBC contributor Richard Wolffe.
Obviously, people making a big deal over the ’98 audio just don’t understand that government is here to help. Let’s face it, people only react negatively to this word because, well, they just don’t get it.
This is honestly what the panel argues.
“Perhaps the panelists should spend less time in the echo chamber and more time digesting polls. The most recent Gallup survey which showed that a majority of respondents — 54 percent, in fact — said that government is trying to do too much,” writes Mediaite’s Noah Rothman.
“Just 39 percent said that government should do more to solve the nation’s problems. Another clear majority, 51 percent, said that government has too much power. 8 percent said that they did not have enough power,” he adds.
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Comments (350)
getourcountryback
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:16pmIs there anyone on the left that actually has a brain? Must not be; too much Kool aid I am afraid……………
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Wilma
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:38pmLiked!
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MIBUGNU2
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:43pmMSNBC Panel Genuinely Confused, usualy the case for
Tingles, CommieO’Donnie, Sharpie and EdSchlutz too….
nothing new here, can’t wait to see their heads explode
on November 6th…..
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starman70
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:21pmHOW CAN YOU CONFUSE A MORON OR GROUP OF MORONS?
rqd lc
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sun_yat_sen
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:16pmTo Richard Wolffe: Most people, especially conservatives, want government to provide certain thing called common goods. These are things that they can’t individually afford, but if the money is pooled it makes it feasible. For example, I can’t afford to build a street from the store to my property, but if I get all my neighbors to pitch in so we all benefit, then we can afford the street. Everyone is better off. There are many examples like this. For example, police, fire depts, national defense, etc. (I know this is 4th grade level, but I’m hoping Richard Wolffe reads this) However, redistribution of my money for something that is not considered a common good only benefits the recipient of my money. Any other benefits are difficult, if not impossible, to quantify (that means measure, Richard). When these types of redistribution schemes escalate over time, more and more people on the giving side become upset, they join movements (tea party) and some give up (Who is John Galt). The receivers of said redistribution will ask for more, because you won’t take anything away if they ask, so what’s the risk in asking for more. They will also have changes in attitude; why work — I may lose my welfare. Why try to better educate myself — it won’t change my welfare amount, so why do all that work. Heck, I’ll even teach my kids how to game the system. And the pattern continues. And grows. Like a cancer.
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korbin
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:28pmAwesome analogy, great job…….
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MDECKER
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:48pmVery well stated. There are those that are patriotic citizens and there those that are not. Yes Hillary, you are UN-patriotic because you disagree!
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kenboo1
Sep. 20, 2012 at 9:38pmI say take everyone’s wealth. Pool it then evenly divide it and everyone gets a $1 million… Then ask the question: How much will a loaf of bread cost?
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DarkJello
Sep. 21, 2012 at 2:05amNice post. I especially like the definition of words like quantify. Classic.
Remember when libs used to believe all or nothing ideas were bad? Times have sure changed.
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PIGSWILLNEVERFLY
Sep. 21, 2012 at 9:51amIt is a growing Marxist cancer…all carefully planned; “they” have figured basic uneducated, ungodly human nature and are using it to craft the “New International Economic World Order”. When it all collapses we will all be even but, “they” will have accomplished what they seek …POWER. The most important thing is WHO will be in charge when it all falls down. My prayer is that it will be the least damaging and most restorative of the two choices: ROMNEY/RYAN 2012. I also pray that the Trilateral Commission does not co-opt them like “they” did to Reagan. Oh My, did I say that?
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barber2
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:13pmDear God. Now instead of being horrified by the exposure of the camel’s nose of Marxism under the Obama tent, these idiots are selling Marxism to the American public ?? Living proof that the young Americans don’t know Diddley about life in Communist Russia. Poor, dumb, naive, clueless , young dupes and suckers ! CALLING JOE MC CARTHY !!
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NoTrashTalkHere
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:13pmI couldn’t listen to this crap. How can people watch these guys?
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Mike Benton
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:36pmWho pays them? Soros?
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burningsodium
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:28pmwhen I need a fast purgative
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thibx
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:12pmthese dumbasses been confused since they been in business.
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spickard2101
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:51pmLOL… Yup.
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UNALIEN
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:10pmnow that you have thoroughly beaten that straw man,,,
what does “redistribution” mean to the left???
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MIBUGNU2
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:36pm“Real people don’t use the word”
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coolidge
Sep. 20, 2012 at 11:00pmFrom our pockets to theirs.
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mdman
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:09pmGovernment is not there to help.. they are there with their hand out collecting your hard earned money
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TSUNAMI_22
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:09pmHey MSNBC, go look up the definition of the word “pirate” and you’ll understand why people are disgusted with his remark.
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diverdan
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:08pmIf they are confused, or pretending to be confused, it is because they believe in and want socialism. They are afraid to say “socialism” because they know that it would be rapidly rejected by the population. They believe, and perhaps they are correct, that if they call it something different, that people will be too stupid to figure out what is going on. Here it the truth folks-the real concept of socialism is that a few will control the many. The few will have everything while the rest will have nothing.
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The Third Archon
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:23pm“The few will have everything while the rest will have nothing.”
I’m sorry, do you mean THE STATUS QUO?
Maybe you haven’t looked at wealth inequality recently/ever, but “in terms of types of financial wealth, the top one percent of households have 38.3% of all privately held stock, 60.6% of financial securities, and 62.4% of business equity. The top 10% have 80% to 90% of stocks, bonds, trust funds, and business equity, and over 75% of non-home real estate.”
http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html
You might not, hell probably won’t agree with the opinions of the author of that article, but his STATISTICS are incontrovertible objective FACT–you can’t make that **** up, at least, not if you expect to keep your job (too many opponents to what you have to say would call you on it).
Just thought you should know since you show such concern for gross wealth inequality.
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The_Cabrito_Goat
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:54pmOkay, what’s your point?
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Git-R-Done
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:18pmTTA – Why should everybody make the same amount of money? What gives you the right to tell others how much money they should be allowed to make and keep?
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RepentYe
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:47pmThird Archon, ok, I’ll take this dance. Sure the top one percent they are the object of scorn. Your numbers however prove nothing. We live in the most prosperous nation in human history. Our poor would nearly reach the top 1% in most third world nations (I have lived all over the world. What we call poverty would be considered the lap of luxury anywhere else.) Point is this is not a reflection of the welfare state, but a reflection of the free market. Exhibit A, the quality of living experienced by illegal imigrants; specifically those who receive no assistance reflecting a pure capitalist economy built in the shadows. (This is not an argument for or against, this is only an observation. An observation that I have personally made as someone with ties to this community.) The upward mobility that existed before our socialistic slide was felt by all. Sure we may not all be like Scruge McDuck taking dunks in our vault of money, but the luxuries we enjoy are the envy of the world. Furthermore what you advocate is greater Bureaucratic control. Since when has a bureaucrat ever done anything to put himself out of a job? Exhibit B: the war on poverty, 6 trillion spent and there are more people trapped in the welfare system than when the government started. I declare the war over, poverty won! If you give control to the fed, you will never see that liberty surrendered without a fight. So instead of envying the rich, try to become one.
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Disgusted_in_CT
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:47pmThe Third Archon
Posted on September 20, 2012 at 7:23pm
“The few will have everything while the rest will have nothing.”
I’m sorry, do you mean THE STATUS QUO?
Maybe you haven’t looked at wealth inequality recently/ever, but “in terms of types of financial wealth, the top one percent of households have 38.3% of all privately held stock,
The one thing progressive liberal pukes like you fail to point out when quoting all these figures and raging at the rich is this one thing;
Here in America, anyone can get to that top figure if they have the brains and determation to do it.
Regardless of what you progressive liberal pukes say otherwise.
Stick that in your pipe and smoke it.
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TSUNAMI_22
Sep. 20, 2012 at 11:26pm@ Third Archon
Wealth inequality is usually directly related to motivation inequality or lack thereof.
If I don’t feel that I’m wealthy enough I go out and hustle to a higher degree, I don’t bitch about my own situation or how much better the guy next door has it.
I make it happen. I don’t acquiesce to victimization.
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RJJinGadsden
Sep. 20, 2012 at 11:52pmGIT-R-DONE, LOL, good point. I’ve spoken with some Russians, East Germans, and Czechs during the Cold War era while in Europe. The Russians on their SMLM mission spoke English quite well, while the East Germans were decent, but it was hit and miss with the Czechs sometimes. I could speak some German and French, so we managed to muddle along. A common theme that I picked up from them when they would talk openly but only when they knew nobody else was around. “They (the government) pretends to pay us, so we pretend to work.” For the most part if you were not in one of the few elite government positions, everybody was paid the same. Regardless if you did a horribly dangerous job, or sat on your ass. All incentive to succeed or to accomplish goals had been removed. Does not work for most.
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2MINUTESTOMIDNIGHT
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:08pmThe headline on this story was far too long. More accurately it should simply say: MSNBC Panel Genuinely Confused
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The Third Archon
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:08pm“If you don’t believe in redistribution, then you don’t believe in any public services at all,” said MSNBC contributor Richard Wolffe.”
Okay, THAT’S not true–public services fall into one of TWO categories; EITHER redistributive OR distributive. The former targets a specific class with its benefits, whereas the latter provides all enjoy, but couldn’t easily supply on their own. Example of distributive policies include: the military, education, roads, public parks, public libraries, emergency services, etc.
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diverdan
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:36pmThe problem is-you do believe in redistribution
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The Third Archon
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:47pmSo you’re opposed to Medicare (or any equivalent) then?
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Git-R-Done
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:21pmTTA – Spoken like a true Marxist propagandist. Most of those services are provided by state and local governments, which is Constitutional. But the Constitution means nothing to you psychopaths and you want to establish a socialist dictatorship.
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Contrarian51
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:04pmAmong other things that will confuse a panel on MSNBC:
Ratings – what are they?
Viewers – what are they?
Opposing views – what are they?
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Ben__Franklin
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:10pmTheir parent company subsidizing their butts because its a loosing network, they do understand. Its “someone elses” money paying their way.
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The Third Archon
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:04pm“I’m confused,” said New York Times reporter Nicholas Confessore. “I assume they have some focus group data than tells them this word is a hot button for some voters that they want to reach. But the fact is that this concept is baked into American government.”
Correction: It’s a concept inherent to ALL modern governments–ANY policy that takes money from a general base of taxpayers to use it to fund programs for a SPECIFIC class of people (anywhere from as small as taxation to fund government ADA accommodations, to the large programs affecting millions like Medicare, etc.) is BY DEFINITION “redistribution.”
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Git-R-Done
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:20pmIt’s only a concept that’s accepted by tyrants like you who want to force all of us to live in poverty. Excuse me if I’m not going to downsize my house or do without air conditioning or do without a washer and dryer or do without a dishwasher or do without a car or do without any goods or services that I purchase with my own money.
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68Patriot
Sep. 21, 2012 at 3:41pm3RD, don’t you mean MEDICAID?
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progressiveslayer
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:03pmThe tools were confused? Not likely since that’s all they learned from their communist/socialist professors in college.
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loafer4952
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:02pmThey are not clueless but know they are about to get beat and beat bad…….
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Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:02pmMainstream
Socialist
Nationaly
Broadcasting
Communism
Now we know why they want us to “lean forward”, they already have, and like it.
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Gregb
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:21pmNovember..lets get rid of the communist! vote him out. very simple
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Stelex
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:32pmExcept that the a very large portion of the congress and senate are socialists, as well as many of the judges, state and local gov. This won’t end with a vote. It runs way to deep, schools, colleges, hollywood. They are every where….hell Jesica Alba is asking people to pledge allegiance to OBAMA. I work with socialists and they don’t even know thats what they are…….I’m not kidding. They think they are still daddy’s dems. But there attitude is full blown socialism. I defies logic.
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pissantno.10
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:53pmsteel ya you are right we need to take back our state and local goverments take back our schools kick these people out and the fed loses a lot of power
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resme
Sep. 20, 2012 at 9:31pmCommunist
News
Network
Fascist
Opportunity
XXY-syndrome
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Ben__Franklin
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:01pmIt must be hard to defend this President. I feel real sorry for you.
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Ben__Franklin
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:00pmLoL….look at these Liberal fools try and protect their god-king. Its really sad. These are the best and brightest of MSNBC. This organization (cannot use the word news anymore) is going down the toilet as the flies are swarming it.
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Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:08pmIt’s like watching Jimmy Stewart talk to the Harvey the Rabbit, just crazy and pathetic.
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Stelex
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:25pmHey, Harvey was real. I saw him. Having said that…….My F’n god……what the “F” does it take for this country to realize we have been invaded. We have a President that hates us, hates colonialism, believes in reparations and is spreading the wealth.If the winds of change change than I stand with Islam. Thats an Obama quote. WTF do you need a written invitations to the war. Someone on this site once said, How do you catch a herd of wild boar, first you lay down some corn, the boar come and realize this is a place for food. Then you put up one side of the cage and let them adjust, then the next and the next, then you put up the wall with the door…….once they are in to enjoy the corn, you close the gate. One heard of boar ready for the slaughter. The Forth wall is up and they are about to close the gate. Stop thinking red and blue its much much bigger.
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floridareader
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:58pmCry or laugh, that’s the dilemma.
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UNALIEN
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:57pmHEY MSNBC PANEL,, REDISTRIBUTION IS STATE PLUNDER AKA THEFT
Frederic Bastiat quotes
Legal plunder can be committed in an infinite number of ways; hence, there are an infinite number of plans for organizing it: tariffs, protection, bonuses, subsidies, incentives, the progressive income tax, free education, the right to employment, the right to profit, the right to wages, the right to relief, the right to the tools of production, interest free credit, etc., etc. And it the aggregate of all these plans, in respect to what they have in common, legal plunder, that goes under the name of socialism.
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marybethelizabeth
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:22pmYou react and don’t listen.
Redistribution only to the extent that it is used to give everyone a shot.
It’s not socialism.
It’s equality of opportunity, a fundamental American value.
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Stelex
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:36pmMary…..I am so sick of your crap. Socialism is what it is. You are one sick f’n POS. I personally hope WTSHTF……you come to my door looking for aid. I will provide relief, I promise
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IMCHRISTIAN
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:43pmMary, Mary quit contrary. I am responsible for me. You are not responsible for me
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2MINUTESTOMIDNIGHT
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:48pmMary:
“Redistribution only to the extent that it is used to give everyone a shot.” What a load of utopian horsesh!t. Guess who gave me a fair shot. Answer: ME!! Guess who worked his @$$ to get through college while working full time to support his family. Answer: ME!! Guess who worked his @$$ off to get through graduate school. Answer: ME!! Guess who worked his @$$ off to start his own business. Answer: ME!!
(No wonder I have such a small @$$)
Don’t tell me “Redistribution only to the extent that it is used to give everyone a shot” I made my own shot.
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The Gooch
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:54pmmarybethelizabeth
At what point would you, as an individual, recognize that another human being has chosen to fail? “Helping” people doesn’t mean “keeping” those who CHOOSE to fail.
I’m for helping people, not for enabling them. Enabling bums makes for more militant bums and more devoted enablers. At some point, there must be the courage to say: “You’ve been given more than your fair share at a shot. Good luck on your own.”
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2MINUTESTOMIDNIGHT
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:27pmExcellent Gooch. Everyone needs a little help now and then. A lifetime support system [cradle to grave] helps no one and it certainly does NOT give anyone a “shot”.
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marybethelizabeth
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:33pmI watched the Republican convention. All you iconoclasts did not create your own opportunity.
You would all be nothing without Mitt “I Built IT” Romney. He created all the companies that created all the American jobs. You are all beholden to him. or his surrogate.
I see the sin of Cain in most of the posters here denying they are their brother’s keepers.
Secret Muslims are you?
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2MINUTESTOMIDNIGHT
Sep. 20, 2012 at 8:51pmMary: Being my brother’s keeper does not equate to the government forcefully taking a large portion of the money I earn just to hand it over to a lazy POS with no ambition, drive or determination to do anything for him/herself or than milk programs designed to keep him/her dependent upon those programs. I have absolutely no problem voluntarily helping someone with a legitimate need and a sincere desire to improve him/herself. The key here is that it is my choice. Get it? MY CHOICE.
And yes, I did create my opportunity.
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The Gooch
Sep. 20, 2012 at 9:09pmMary…
Your answer is a ticket on the guilt train express? Thanks, but I’m not interested (or impressed). I’ll take that as a “The enabling never stops.”
Oh, and I volunteer my time and resources to people in my community. Not that I need to validate anything to you. But I WANT to help those who are struggling thru no fault of their own. This is where “socialism” works: ON A LOCAL LEVEL BETWIXT WILLING PARTICIPANTS.
Fie on you. What is your claim to sainthood (and I’m sure as hell no saint) other than you, like way too many busybodies, won’t allow the dregs of humanity to own their choices? Big fan of propagaging and prolonging misery are you? Nice.
I laugh at your feeble guilt play. And I sure as hell ain’t no Romney cheerleader. I wouldn’t admit to p!ssing away my time watching either partisan convention… oh, wait, it’s cool ’cause I didn’t.
Chugga, chugga, baby. Stoke the boilers ’til they’re glowing red; your destination is fiscal oblivion. THAT’S the proper course for a sane people? Sure it is…. I’ll pass… or at least watch and ruefully shake my head as you and your like-minded “do gooders” (sic) run the whole damn mess off the rails. Because you can’t let people own the fate they made themselves. Oh, the horror.
Tomorrow never comes in your world, does it?
Closeted Muslim? Cute. Nope. And I’m also not an invertentionist busybody (READ: authoritarian) who believes the vaunted social safety net is a suicide pact.
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WindyDualism
Sep. 20, 2012 at 9:24pmMbe
How big was your return on GM?
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68Patriot
Sep. 21, 2012 at 4:00pmMARY, I just want to know how you and yours define a “fair shot”. I really want to know because it is all Obama spews and now you.
What does “FAIR SHOT” mean? Someone please tell me…seriously. I hear these general terms and phrases thrown around by liberals all the time like “fair shot”, “fair share”, “equal opportunity” but they are never defined. Help me out, anyone.
68
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term limits for congress
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:57pmYes, it was a bit coded – ya know the cops are everywhere.
Redistribution = pass the choom, man!
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StarkeRaving
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:56pmredistribution -is that like Communism? sounds like it to me.
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Psychosis
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:51pmMSNBC Panel Genuinely Confused
now THATS shocking
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CatB
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:08pmI thought that was their motto. … Or should be.
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GeorgieJo
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:38pmNO PSYCH
THAT IS OLD NEWS
Lsd-NBC-Tingles and O’Donkey are overcooked.
Throw in the polish princess MEEKA along side a kosher side of Greenspan/ANDREA
Blanche BarniKULL and deep fry Joey Scaryboro
POOR JOEY SCAR
Must have been horrible finding a dead intern in your FLORIDA CONGRESSIONAL OFFICE
Wullie Wussy Gust is a robotic nobody.He has no taste.
TOURE would a dash of chocolate cajun taste.
OMG OMG NOV 2012
Democraps are dissolving into crap heaps.
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Gregb
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:51pmMSimbecile is for socialism…. Is anyone amazed at their reaction?
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kaydeebeau
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:50pmOh for crying out loud -they cannot be this clueless
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right
Sep. 20, 2012 at 6:58pmOh but they are. They really believe in what they are saying. Scary isn’t it.
But wait do they practice this? Are they sharing their salaries with the lower paid workers at MSNBC? I bet the guy or gal that cleans the floors and takes out the trash would love a big chunk of Lynn Sweet’s paycheck. How ’bout it Lynn?
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KangarooJack
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:04pmHonest to goodness, they CAN’T FATHOM the reasoning behind it. They, just can’t.
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Ben__Franklin
Sep. 20, 2012 at 7:07pmLol, there are no members of MSNBC that would ever do what they are shoveling. I mean look at Olbermann when he was still employed (Lol) over at Current. Remember he complained because his lowly driver would actually try and speak to him, oh and he smelled bad too.
Liberals are all the same. They are either standing around with their hand out or asking big daddy Govberment to steal for them. You have to pry their $$ out of their cold dead hands before they would help anyone.
The only redistribution they believe in is the redistribution of “everyone elses” money.
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