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Faith

Is It Okay for Christians to Smoke Marijuana?

Dec. 10, 2012 3:39pm Billy Hallowell

With marijuana legalization taking form in Washington state and Colorado, much discussion continues to surround the drug and its continued presence and usage in society. While proponents for decriminalization contend that weed is harmless, others argue that legalization holds numerous moral pitfalls that will profoundly impact society.

Mark Driscoll, pastor of Mars Hill Church in Seattle, Washington, recently penned an article about this very subject for Relevant Magazine. In it, he weighed whether Bible-believers are violating scripture if they use and abuse pot. Considering that his church is located in a state that recently legalized the drug, it’s no wonder the preacher, who has known his share of controversy, is commenting so fervently on the issue.

Mark Driscoll Asks: Is It Okay for Christians to Smoke Marijuana?

Pastor Mark Driscoll (Photo Credit: AP)

Prior to his state’s legalization, Driscoll said that he would tell parishioners seeking answers about the drug that Romans 13:1-7 holds all of the answers. The verses essentially explain that it’s essential to follow earthly laws, so long as they don’t conflict with God’s scriptures.

But Washington’s legalization of the drug changes this dynamic, as marijuana is now legal, with some restrictions. And since the Bible doesn’t speak explicitly about the drug, it’s difficult to discern a definitive answer. After asking a question about whether the act of smoking weed is sinful or wise, Driscoll answered his own curiosity:

Some things are neither illegal (forbidden by government in laws) nor sinful (forbidden by God in Scripture), but they are unwise. For example, eating a cereal box instead of the food it contains is not illegal or sinful—it’s just foolish. This explains why the Bible speaks not only of sin, but also of folly, particularly in places such as the book of Proverbs. There are innumerable things that won’t get you arrested or brought under church discipline, but they are just foolish and unwise—the kinds of things people often refer to by saying, “That’s just stupid.”

The preacher went on to note that he’s not in favor of recreational smoking and that he has never taken any drugs, including marijuana. He also noted that self-medicating is not necessarily a positive action and that using anything — whether it be pot or food, for that matter — to ease pain is not advised.

“Furthermore, as a pastor I have noticed that people tend to stop maturing when they start self-medicating,” Driscoll wrote. “Everyone has very tough seasons in life, but by persevering through them we have an opportunity to mature and grow as people.”

A man shows a cannabis sativa plant in Montevideo on December 7, 2012. (Photo Credit: AFP/Getty Images)

Additionally, he noted that his main concern is with young men, who are more likely to use the drug, claiming that these individuals are less likely to attend college, get married and attend church — all indicators that, to him, could be problematic, should these young men choose to self-medicate.

As for getting to the bottom of the issue, Driscoll warned that figuring out the proper answer surrounding the moral issues associated with marijuana use “requires a great deal of consideration” before a Christian position can be found on the matter. Rather than a definitive call for believers to abandon or refrain from the drug, the pastor hopes that his analysis will help individuals make an informed decision.

Photo Credit: AFP/Getty Images

“It is by no means meant to serve as a definitive word on the subject, nor are these thoughts meant to be comprehensive, or even unchangeable,” he added. “I have a lot to learn and consider on these issues, and along with many fellow Christian leaders am seeking to develop thoughtful and helpful answers to these questions.”

Read Driscoll’s entire analysis of marijuana here. What do you think? Is it permissible for Christians to spoke pot?

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Comments (383)

BlasberryStrat
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:20pm
And the Lord saith, “Let the fields be plentiful with Weed…..and the storage bins overflow with Count Chocula”.

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- Wilsonpd
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:23pm
  Captain Crunch
  
  Report this comment
- fastfacts
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:32pm
  Don’t listen to the billion dollar Pot Lobby.
  
  If you can’t trust where the truth comes from, try the conservative comedian Steven Crowder. He lays it out in an simple and telling format: http://www.thedailycandidate.com/video/2012/nov/crowder_marijuana_truth.html
  
  Report this comment
- Gold Coin & Economic News
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:16pm
  I support the legalization of it in Washington state and elsewhere, but I would never smoke it…any longer. We spend far too much money policing this drug rather than the government actually collecting some revenue for in in the form of taxes:
  http://www.isthatbaloney.com/recreational-marijuana-smoking-is-now-legal-in-washington-state-what-do-you-think-about-that/
  
  Report this comment
- PATTY HENRY
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:23pm
  IT IS NOT OKAY to smoke pot, to put anything in our “TEMPLE” and anyone asking the question knows it. ANYTHING that keeps us from relying on GOD for our direction, our answers, our PEACE is from Satan. Wine in moderation, Beer in moderation, but drugs ? no. Don’t argue with me about
  beer/wine being a drug too… you know better.
  
  Report this comment
- usedCZARsalesman
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:46pm
  Patty, I am going to assume that you NEVER eat trans fats? Or Pizza? Potato Chips? Soda? I’m sure you have also NEVER taken ANY legally prescribed medication? Not one hydrocodone, not one ambien…Do you also refrain from taking tylenol? I ask these things because they are ALL MORE DANGEROUS to your “temple” than pot. Not only is weed NOT harmful to you in ANY way (outside of all smoke that inters your lungs have a small health risk associated with it), but it actually replaces DOZENS of man made drugs that cause serious negative side effects from long term use. Your view is a VERY narrow minded one, and this comes from a person that generally agrees with you 75% of the time.
  
  For one small example, pot literally replaces my entire PTSD “cocktail”. It replaces my anti anxiety meds, my sleeping pill, and my anti depressant…all with ZERO side effects and 1/4 of the cost. I know that it is “scary” to allow yourself to be open to the idea that God would be “ok” with weed, but I’m pretty sure it easily falls into the “all things are permissible, but all things are not beneficial” category
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:48pm
  Gold Coin & Economic News
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:16pm
  I support the legalization of it in Washington state and elsewhere, but I would never smoke it…any longer. We spend far too much money policing this drug
  
  We spend alot of money policing rape and murder and fraud which one of those do you want to legalize next?
  
  Report this comment
- KidCharlemagne
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:09pm
  PATTY HENRY
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:23pm
  Don’t argue with me about beer/wine being a drug too… you know better.
  ==========================
  
  You would lose that argument then:
  
  ———–
  “A drug is a substance which may have medicinal, intoxicating, performance enhancing or other effects when taken or put into a human body or the body of another animal and is not considered a food or exclusively a food.”
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug
  
  Alcohol meets every one (except for performance enhancement) of the characteristics described above….
  
  However, not all of these characteristics apply to all drugs anyway…
  
  Report this comment
- valiant1776
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:11pm
  God also made poison ivy, and I try to stay the hell away from that. And it naturally grows in my backyard, legally!
  
  God does not prohibit any herbs, but he does prohibit drugs, especially those made by man. He also prohibits idleness, laziness and gluttony. So, anything that promotes or invites such behavior is greatly warned against, whether it be the TV, XBOX or pipe of tobacco. Of course, moderation is best in all things, but uncleanness is never OK.
  
  Report this comment
- FreedomPurveyor
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:12pm
  “Don’t argue with me about
  beer/wine being a drug too”
  
  Alcohol is a far more potent drug than THC
  
  Report this comment
- Jim S
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:13pm
  I can drink 1-2 beers, for example, and have little or no effect on me and just enjoy the flavor…pot is more a 6 pack at once…or 12 pack…that makes it different. However, if you sit home getting drunk on booze I see little difference. I’m not sure God cares if you get buzzed, but what you do after or instead of, matter quite a bit. To ignore your actions after smoking or drinking might point to a problem. The bible repeatedly cautions against drunkenness…I don’t think the method is as important as the effect.
  
  Report this comment
- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:15pm
  @BYFAITH
  
  You can’t actually be comparing rape and murder to pot? Rape/murder violate someone’s rights, smoking a joint does not.
  
  @PATTY
  
  Bad idea? Yeah. So is drinking, since Christians are to be set apart. However, it is not wrong to drink in moderation or even smoke pot. You’re being hypocritical and inconsistent if you think it’s ok to drink in moderation yet wrong to smoke pot.
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:18pm
  I don’t drink alcohol, use drugs, or smoke but I see members of pretty much all the other Christian religions drinking alcohol and smoking cigs and somehow justifying it. Weed is less harmful than alcohol and I have always believed that if you are going to keep alcohol legal then weed should be legal. It’s not what Jesus Christ would partake in.
  
  So…
  
  Legal under man’s law? Yes
  Legal under God’s law? No
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:26pm
  PATTY HENRY
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:23pm
  IT IS NOT OKAY to smoke pot, to put anything in our “TEMPLE” and anyone asking the question knows it. ANYTHING that keeps us from relying on GOD for our direction, our answers, our PEACE is from Satan. Wine in moderation, Beer in moderation, but drugs ? no. Don’t argue with me about
  beer/wine being a drug too… you know better.
  
  ================================================================
  Although I abstain from everything now, I used to be a hardcore substance abuser – you name it, I did it – and it didn’t take long before I dispelled all the urban myths about drugs. ALCOHOL IS A DRUG. I would break it down for you why alcohol is a drug but I’ll refrain since you think Science equals Satan.
  
  Report this comment
- scarebear83
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:27pm
  Is it okay for Christians to smoke marijuana for recreational use? No. Christians should use the Bible as the go-to guide right? So what does the Bible say? “Likewise exhort the young men to be sober-minded” (Titus 2:6). A young man cannot be sober minded if he has even a “little” weed in his system. “But let us who are of the day be sober…” (1 Thess. 5:8) “that the older men be sober” (Titus 2:2) “teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly” (Titus 2:12) “Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober” (1 Pet. 1:13) “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.” (1 Pet. 5:8)
  
  Now I understand there is an entirely different discussion for medicinal purposes. It’s hard to be sober when one has come out of surgery and is on pain medications for a short term. But when it becomes sinful is when one continues taking the pain medication when there is no need for it. However the Bible should be a Christian’s guide and the Bible tells us we should walk soberly. So no, it’s not okay for recreational purposes.
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:32pm
  Black
  I personally know of a 22 year old man who was killed by a Pot smoker, because he was high.
  You really think no rapes were commited because someone was high?
  
  My original comment was specifically a response to the claim we spend too much money trying to stop it, so we should not worry about it.
  So, my comment said we spend alot of money trying to stop other things at what point do we say it cost too much?
  
  Report this comment
- Favored93
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:46pm
  This Pastor was EXTREMELY wise in what he said here.
  For a Christian all things are permissible but not all things are profitable. Can we drink until we are stupid? Yes. But should we? NO!!!
  In my mind there is nothing worse about pot then drinking or cigarets and ALL of them are stupid things to do. (It should be said here that I am addicted to cigarets but I hate it! It is a TRAP!)
  The Government should not be in the business of telling us what we are allowed to hurt ourselves with (although I do think the hard stuff like heroine should NEVER be legal).
  Can Christians according to scripture smoke weed? Yes. But is that how the children of a Holy God should behave? NO!!! NO!!! NO!!!!
  STAY AWAY FROM ALL OF THE TRAPS YOUR ENEMY WANTS YOU TO FALL INTO!!!
  Are you free to walk into his traps? YES. lol But should you? …. lol Walk in wisdom all ye people of God!
  
  Report this comment
- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:54pm
  @BYFAITH
  
  Pot did not kill that person. It was either more than pot in his system or it was something else altogether. Yes, no one commits rapes due to being high…no evidence to support that. Pot does not cause crime and it certainly would not cause violent crime.
  
  Spending money trying to police it doesn’t even matter because it doesn’t work when it comes to drugs. Any money is a waste of money also because it is a “crime” that doesn’t violate anyone’s rights.
  
  Report this comment
- Favored93
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:58pm
  I answered Yes on the poll because it is permissable but like this pastor I can’t see how you can mature and be all that God wants you to be if you are high.
  Is it “allowed” yes but it is also allowed that you listen to and follow the devil… you are not a mindless slave.
  
  Report this comment
- M1A2_Tanker
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 7:27pm
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabinoid_receptor
  
  Someone please explain the Cannabinoid receptors in our brains if we were not meant to partake? “Coincidence? I Think Not!” RELAX PEOPLE we are not talking about smoking Nuclear Weapons now are we?
  
  Report this comment
- bobdog19006
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 7:42pm
  If we had legalized weed a long time ago, we would still have Twinkies today.
  
  But NO. Can’t have that. How many snack food companies must die before weed is provided to everyone by the federal government?
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:17pm
  @Black, it’s refreshing to read your level-headed posts. I think the people who think it’s abominable to smoke weed but okay to drink have never toked up. They grew up believing government anti-drug propaganda and have heard too many urban myths about drugs, especially weed.
  
  @everyone,
  
  It’s easy to drive safely while high on weed.
  It’s hard (but doable) to drive safely drunk on beer.
  It’s pretty hard to drive drunk from liquor.
  It’s VERY hard to drive safely while rolling on xtc/MDMA
  It’s damn near impossible for me to drive safely after taking a 10-strip of LSD
  
  I have lost count how many times I have driven stoned/drunk/rolling/tripping/etc – probably at least a couple hundred times – but I never wrecked,caused someone else to wreck, been arrested, etc.
  
  Actually, all of my wrecks have one thing in common: I was texting or on the phone.
  
  Report this comment
- TheValley
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:21pm
  By Faith, that is a total crock of Bull Crap. I know a guy that was killed when a painter dropped his ladder, let’s outlaw painters! All of you self-proclaimed, so-called conservatives would even be discussing this if you really believed in Liberty, it is NO MANS business what I do, where I do it, and with whom, unless I am impeding someone else’s pursuit of happiness. All of you “good Christians” should learn to mind your own business. It doesn’t concern you what I do.
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:24pm
  @M1A2, we also have opioid receptors so, by your logic, God created me to mainline heroin. lol. Anyways, I know what you are saying, I’m on your side, but I just didn’t agree with the logic.
  
  It’s crazy to see people like PATTY HENRY say alcohol is fine but hate on weed. She and others view weed as a WMD haha nuts!!
  
  Report this comment
- Hanner
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:55pm
  Lev 10 – 8 Then the Lord said to Aaron, 9 “You and your sons are not to drink wine or other fermented drink whenever you go into the Tent of Meeting, or you will die. This is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. 10 You must distinguish between the holy and the common, between the unclean and the clean,
  Prov 31 – 4 “It is not for kings, O Lemuel—
  not for kings to drink wine,
  not for rulers to crave beer,
  5 lest they drink and forget what the law decrees,
  and deprive all the oppressed of their rights
  
  I know these scriptures only cover alcohol, but look at the effects it has. The mind is polluted and cannot discern between good and evil. Drugs also have this effect. Now that we are the Temple of God, how much more does this apply to a Christian? Put down the Peace Pipe, and pour out the drink.
  Rev 5 – 9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
  Who was forbidden to have strong drink in them???? Kings and Priests!
  I hope this is helpful to those that aren’t quite sure about how God views mind altering things that we should stay away from, and why.
  
  Report this comment
- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 9:41pm
  Marijuana is not technically illegal. Schedule I Narcotics are illegal, and marijuana just happened to be placed in that category.
  
  What most people don’t know is that this system was designed by Richard Nixon, who got Congress to go along with this categorization “temporarily” and promised to re-categorize it after medical research results were established. However, when Nixon’s hand picked committee found that the plant shouldn’t be illegal to own, use or study, Nixon told them to go to Hell.
  
  Nixon’s DEA gets most of its funds to maintain marijuana Prohibition. However, they are also the gatekeepers of medical research on Schedule I Narcotics, and if a beneficial medical use were found, they would have to re-classify the plant, ending Prohibition, and their funding. That’s a clear conflict of interest and the reason why Prohibition remains.
  
  The DEA has admitted that they refuse permission to do medical research on marijuana, unless the goal of the study is to find detrimental effects of the plant. In fact, the active molecule in marijuana, THC, was discovered in Israel. It was illegal to discover this molecule in the US. And if you need treatment with any marijuana derived drugs, go to Israel. Their federal government grows marijuana and turns into beneficial drugs.
  
  Report this comment
- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:05pm
  @V15, if you’re ever in massive pain, you’ll thank God for those opioid receptors.
  
  Report this comment
- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:15pm
  @ V15
  
  Thank you sir.
  
  Yeah, that’s what it comes down to. So many lies for such a long time.
  
  Report this comment
- El Pistoffo
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:51pm
  V15
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:17pm
  @Black, it’s refreshing to read your level-headed posts. I think the people who think it’s abominable to smoke weed but okay to drink have never toked up. They grew up believing government anti-drug propaganda and have heard too many urban myths about drugs, especially weed.
  
  @everyone,
  
  It’s easy to drive safely while high on weed.
  —————————————————————————————————————
  
  I could never drive for crap on weed back years ago when I smoked quite a bit, so your argument in my mind is mute. No one should be driving on any of this stuff anyways. That’s part of the problem. Irresponsibility. I don’t like it anymore, haven’t for many years.
  
  I don’t condone pot use. It’s pretty much used only to get high ( apart from SPARSE medicinal use). Let’s not kid ourselves, that’s what everyone wants it legalized for, getting stoned. And I don’t condone getting drunk. The difference between the two is that you can have a drink to no effect. You can’t smoke a joint to no effect.
  
  Lets not forget Brother Louv, he tried to bend scripture to condone his own stoner church/religious cult.
  
  http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1310&dat=19801113&id=3_hVAAAAIBAJ&sjid=9uEDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6891,4169531
  
  Report this comment
- SimpleTruths
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 11:38pm
  HANNER
  Lev also says eating shellfish is an abomination. Why aren’t we shutting down Red Lobster?
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:25am
  @advection, I used to abuse the hell out of Oxys and Percocet a long time ago. So when I broke some bones the hospital staff asked my bro if I was a drug user cuz they had given me a ton of morphine and still I was screaming (this was when I woke up after surgery). I have a low pain tolerance and they put me on 30mg Percocet every 4-6 hours for a month, then down to loratabs. I’m 32 and haven’t abused drugs hardcore since I was 22. Pain pills are still a weakness and I usually cave every time. I’m wondering if my past abuse has depleted my serotonin and dopamine levels. So now I’m on benzos and SNRIs just so I feel semi-normal. One thing for sure is that if I had stuck to weed and shrooms then I wouldn’t have the problems I have today.
  
  @El pistoffo, I’m not condoning driving under the influence…I was just pointing out that weed is safer than alcohol.
  
  Report this comment
- usedCZARsalesman
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:29am
  FAVORED, you have the right idea brother. It may not be wise to cloud your mind, and it is wide open to sin for Christians. However, there is no denying The Lord put many things on this planet to help us cope. I don’t mean “escape reality”, I mean cope.
  
  Pot has given me my life back in many ways. After returning from Iraq the second time, I had problems…sleeping, with anger, panic attacks, depression…I was taking 6 different meds from the VA but my wife and I still got separated because she couldn’t handle what I was going through. 2 years ago I left the army, 6 months after that I got into a church run marriage counceling program and started illegally using pot to see if I would get the same effects other vets told me they were seeing. After 6 more months, I was down to just 1 med, sleeping through the night, my wife was back at the house and feeling normal again.
  
  I’m not saying that Christians should just run out and buy some weed if its legal, just that taking those kinds of hard line stances that closely resemble putting words in GODS mouth and passing that sinful kind of judgement
  
  Report this comment
- v15
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:30am
  btw, I love how PATTY HENRY has no rebuttle whatsoever. PATTY knows that her logic is completely flawed but I have a feeling she has gone back to 100% denial. Just an old woman set in her ways….
  
  Report this comment
- snooop1e
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:47am
  This is a little confusing to me, why is a “Bible Alone” Preacher preaching about something that isn’t found anywhere in scripture? (isn’t that the definition of “un-scriptural”?) The Bible is silent about Pot so why is there any Preaching at all about Pot? I’ve never understood why “Bible Alone” Preachers preach about things that aren’t found anywhere in scripture? Isn’t preaching about things that aren’t found anywhere in scripture “UN-BIBLICAL”?……..Seems like a obvious contradiction but then again what do I know? (no need to answer that one) Peace in Christ ;)
  
  Report this comment
- Al J Zira
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:40am
  @Patty Henry: Even Christ drank wine. Hell, He even made wine out of water! I believe the problems comes with abuse and over-indulgence. If you can smoke pot and keep your faculties, have at it. If you smoke it and start sitting in your basement playing video games for hours on ends trying to placate the munchies, you probably shouldn’t be smoking. I really don’t think a loving and forgiving God will leave you in the earth for smoking pot when you could walk with Him for eternity.
  
  Report this comment
- ThriCeSLewis
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:41am
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_3TF-ajLHQ
  
  Report this comment
- KidCharlemagne
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:03am
  Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 9:41pm
  And if you need treatment with any marijuana derived drugs, go to Israel. Their federal government grows marijuana and turns into beneficial drugs.
  ===================================
  
  Our federal government grows marijuana too:
  
  ——————-
  “We are in the Coy W. Waller Laboratory Complex on the campus of the University of Mississippi, getting a look at the only legal marijuana farm and production facility in the United States. This is the government’s “cannabis drug repository.”
  CNN.com (May 18, 2009): “Government runs nation’s only legal pot garden”
  
  Report this comment
- LDSmommy
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:05am
  FASTFACTS: Crowder is one of my favorite people online, he is also full of &^%*^. Almost everything he says in that video is bunk and can be proven as bunk. The one thing that REALLY gets to me is the psychosis argument that Dr. Boniface gives. The ACTUAL claim she gives is that it hastens the *onset* of psychosis in people who will get it already anyway. The prison argument..what about jail? The entire video is weak and absurd. I haven’t smoked pot for so long, but c’mon. Anyone who has ever smoked can tell you the HUGE difference between driving high or driving drunk. If you want to argue against smoking pot, fine, but don’t lie about it to try and make a point. In the meantime, people who would benefit from it medically are suffering needlessly. It isn’t the RIGHT of the government to tell us what we can smoke. Not their job. If someone chooses to not smoke for religious reasons, fine, but NOT because the gov’t says so.
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:12am
  Black
  I’m pretty sure by your comments, that you are a pot smoker. So I’m sure nothing I post will persuade you, but the death was caused by a person who was smoking dope, decided to get into his car and in his own words was sooo stoned he dozed off and crossed the center line. Head on collision with a 22 year old waiter who was heading home from work. Now is the part where you defend this “killer” not because you know him, but because you want to be able to spoke.
  You have no idea of what I am talking about, yet you have the nerve to tell me I am wrong about the facts of the case. All for the sole purpose of justifying your need to get high.
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:22am
  THEVALLEY
  Thanks for the attack on something I didn’t say.
  Show me where I said anything about banning pot or not allowing people the freedom you claim.
  
  I’ll type this slow so maybe you can keep up.
  My original comment was in reference to a claim that it cost too much money to police this issue, so we should just ignore the law. When are we spending too much money on other crimes?
  
  Funny.
  You infer that I am a judgmental hypocrite while you are being a judgmental hypocrite.
  Smoke a little less and maybe your reading skills will improve
  
  Report this comment
- black9897
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:19am
  @BYFAITH
  
  I have never smoked pot in my life or done any drug. Not only that but I’ve never smoked a cigarette and can count on both hands the number of times I’ve had alcohol. I’m 23 btw and never plan to do drugs and do not think people should be doing them.
  
  So he was driving under the influence? Well that should be treated the same as drinking. I’m sure you would be on a campaign to make alcohol illegal if it had been a drunk driver? No one should get behind the wheel while under the influence of anything….pot, alcohol, nightquil, etc. As tragic as that is, to say pot caused this is not correct. Someone abusing drugs/drinking and driving is what causes things like this.
  
  Report this comment
- ChuckVaughan
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:42am
  Our government was fairly successful in its brainwashing to make cannabis out to be evil. They started out by playing the race card, stressing that only blacks and low-life white people smoked marijuana, then progressed the brainwashing by making it illegal in order to benefit big pharma and the alcoholic beverage companies. Everyone needs to forget what they think they know and open their minds to the truth. People in nineteen states have done this, and before long the entire nation will wake up to the fact that cannabis is one of the most important herbs on earth. Our government knows this, and that’s precisely why the government owns the medical patents for cannabis. The real crime was making it illegal in the first place. It should be in the hands of doctors, and out of the hands of politicians.
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:09pm
  @Black
  I don’t know if you know this or not, but there are already laws against driving under the influence
  
  Now, let’s go back to your original post to me:
  “You can’t actually be comparing rape and murder to pot? Rape/murder violate someone’s rights, smoking a joint does not.”
  
  First you missed or just want to ignore your first comment to me was wrong.
  Once again, my original comment was to question @GoldCoins assertion that it cost too much money to prosecute drug violations, so we should just ignore the problem.
  
  Why so defensive? Go back and re-read my original post and you will see I asked 1 question. At what point do we declare a law invalid because it cost too much to prosecute?
  Never said anything about marijuana being good or bad until you questioned me. Then I gave you a fact. I know a young man who was killed because of drugs.
  We spend a lot of money because of car accidents, should we stop people from driving?
  Calm down and read what is there, not automatically become a victim.
  
  Report this comment
- by faith
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:19pm
  @Black
  You wrote:
  “So he was driving under the influence? Well that should be treated the same as drinking. I’m sure you would be on a campaign to make alcohol illegal if it had been a drunk driver? No one should get behind the wheel while under the influence of anything….pot, alcohol, nightquil, etc. As tragic as that is, to say pot caused this is not correct. Someone abusing drugs/drinking and driving is what causes things like this.”
  
  So if you read my post without your preconceived bias, you would already know:
  
  “Well that should be treated the same as drinking.” Yes, it should
  
  “…be on a campaign to make alcohol illegal if it had been a drunk driver?” When did I say anything about making pot illegal?
  
  “to say pot caused this is not correct” The driver who caused the accident blamed pot
  
  Abuse of anything is “bad” Abuse being the key word
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:36pm
  @BYFAITH
  
  I wasn’t being defensive. The way you were talking it sounded as if you were for making pot illegal. I’m very glad you are not for that.
  
  “Abuse of anything is “bad” Abuse being the key word”
  
  Absolutely correct.
  
  Report this comment
- StanO360
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:10pm
  UsedCarSalesman – your case is an anecdote not a basis for policy. I’m glad that works for you, but you have a legitimate medical condition. I’m not in a position to question or affirm your medical treatment. However, pot has the potential to do a lot of harm, and is typically used to get high, in fact it’s the only way it’s used (unless you’ve got very weak pot). Alcohol, is NORMALLY used without getting drunk, for the majority of people.
  
  And no one would argue that an unhealthy diet, and on consisting primarily of junk food is NOT a sin. Gluttony is certainly a sin.
  
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- usedCZARsalesman
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:33pm
  STANO, you are right that mine is not basis for policy, that wasn’t what I was arguing. I was simply saying that these broad brush strokes used to paint pot users in a negative light or to suggest that pot is even in the ball park (in terms of negative side effects) of alcohol or pain pills, ect is just stupid
  
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- k2weaver
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:45pm
  Perfect point Gold. alcohol is far worse and society has accepted it. That doesn’t mean it’s right. With FREEDOMS come choices. However people believe we are free, God given (me) or natural(?), we make our own choices. Wisely or stupidly. We have a better handle these days to punish people who enable minors, but why not tax the users. would that not be a 14 point turn around in the economy, however minor?
  
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- Amarath01
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 2:49pm
  Jesus was not in anyway anti drug use. HECK HE MADE DRUGS FOR PEOPLE. One called alcohol.
  
  Report this comment
- Sweets McSweet
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:22pm
  “sedCZARsalesman
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:46pm
  Patty, I am going to assume that you NEVER eat trans fats?”
  Yeah, I’m with you. I’m not into inhaling burning plant vapors but…. This is a great piece for discussion. God gives us a lot of latitude to make mistakes and learn from them, and learn what works for us. He also does tell us to avoid behaviors that will make others “stumble” in their walk through this life. So smoking or drinking in front of others with a more sensitive nature is not advisable.
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:32pm
  @ snooop1e- The Bible doesn’t say anything about Crystal Meth either so is it ok to use it? Jesus never mentioned anything about bestiality so is it ok to engage in that practice? There are some things the Bible never mentions “thou shalt not do” and even if it did, it would be a loooooooong list. So the best way to condemn certain practices is to give a specific command. Jesus mentioned that marriage was between one man and one woman since the beginning. By Him stating that it rules out any other “marriage” without having to go down a long list of “you shall not marry multiple people, you shall not marry children, you shall not marry your neighbor’s livestock etc.” It is understood that anything outside of one man and one woman for life is sinful (Jesus gave only one exception and that was for adultery but that’s for a different conversation). The Bible tells Christians to live soberly, to be sober-minded etc. Sober is not specifically for alcohol, it is for all things which can affect the mind in which one is not able to think clearly. Pot would be included.
  
  @Amarath01- People don’t understand that the word “wine” in the Bible could also mean grape juice. Yes, they had ways of preserving it without fermenting it. And since Jesus was righteous and the Bible speaks out against drunkenness do you really think Jesus would attribute to people getting drunk?
  
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- UnknownUser1
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:33pm
  It does say in the Bible “Don’t get drunk” I would think that would include any kind of mind alteration. I don’t really care either way long as you stay in control of your actions and thoughts.
  
  But to say there is zero side effects, come on give me a break. Never had the munchies?
  Seriously though you’re burning something and breathing it in… cant be good for you and I smoke cigs… wish to God I didn’t, but he knows I’m trying.
  
  And from personal experience, I know the weed is less physically addicting. I quit in one day after I saw some shadows moving about my room and placing their hand on my chest along with this vortex thing. yeah that was some “gooooood #*$&”!
  
  Report this comment
- snooop1e
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:27pm
  @carebear- You said “The Bible doesn’t say anything about Crystal Meth either so is it ok to use it?” That really is a question for “Bible Alone” Protestants. Protestants have posed this same question to me regarding things such as artificial birth control and self gratification (aka m@sturb@tion) telling me that neither are mentioned explicitly in scripture and therefore they cannot be sinful. My question was why do “Bible Alone” Pastors preach about things that are not found anywhere in the Bible? You also wrote “There are some things the Bible never mentions” I completely agree, Jesus didn’t give us a Bible He gave us a Church and He gave the keys to the kingdom of heaven to Peter (not the Bible) and He gave the Apostles (not the Bible) the power to forgive and retain sins and He gave the Apostles (not the Bible) the power to bind and to loose. You say that the command to be sober pertains to all things that cloud our judgemet. I completely agree. Would you then also agree that fornication refers to any sexual act outside of the marital act between one man and one woman? God also tells us to be fertile and multiply, would you also agree that making ourselves infertile either by surgical means or through chemicals or barrier methods is also sinful? Scripture tells us not to kill, would you agree that this would include the killing of a baby in the womb even though “Abortion” is not found anywhere in scripture? Peace in Christ.
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:02pm
  @SNOOP1E
  
  Bible alone preacher? As opposed to Bible and Quran? Bible and newspaper?
  
  To answer your question no, it’s certainly not un-biblical. You’re thinking that if the Bible doesn’t mention something specifically or the exact word isn’t used then its ‘un-biblical’ which is not true at all. Much of the things we know not to do are based on principle. For example, the Bible never says “don’t punch your friends in their face when you’re mad” however, we are told to love. If I love someone am I going to treat them badly and hurt them? Of course not. This goes for many things.
  
  Using pot (not abusing) is not a sin or wrong, however it’s not a good idea, especially for a Christian.
  
  I’d like to mention a few things from your 2nd post.
  
  While he didn’t give them the Bible (because it wasn’t around yet) he did give it to us. The Church does use the Bible and that’s where we as believers come together to study it and worship. Jesus’ words (the stuff he told them) are in the Bible.
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:11pm
  @Scarebear83 – You wrote “People don’t understand that the word “wine” in the Bible could also mean grape juice” If the wine that they drank in the Bible was mere grape juice how were people getting drunk? In his letter to the Corinthians (1 Cor 11:17-32) Paul chastised believers for getting drunk on wine when they met to celebrate the Lords Supper. The argument that the wine spoken of in the Bible was mere grape juice doesn’t really stand up to close examination, there are numerous passages in scripture that refer to wine making people drunk.
  
  Gen 9:20-21 “Noah, a man of the soil, proceeded to plant a vineyard. When he drank some of its wine, he became drunk and lay uncovered inside his tent”
  
  Ephesians 5:18 “Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit”
  
  Luke 1:15 “for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from birth.”
  
  Isaiah 5:11 “Woe to those who rise early in the morning to run after their drinks, who stay up late at night till they are inflamed with wine”
  
  Isaiah 28:7 “And these also stagger from wine and reel from beer: Priests and prophets stagger from beer and are befuddled with wine…”
  
  Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker and beer a brawler; whoever is led astray by them is not wise
  
  Proverbs 23:20 “Do not join those who drink too much wine….”
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 12:24am
  @snooop1e If they call themselves “pastors” then 9 times out 10 they don’t know what the Bible is saying in the first place. I take it you’re Catholic? Jesus never gave us popes or rosaries or never once instructed the Apostles to pray to or through Mary. Jesus’ words, which are recorded in scripture, state that they “are spirit and they are life.” Here’s the thing, I know the Bible is true and know that is where we should get our truth because it was written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. By the way what will man be judged by on judgement day? That he kept to man-made traditions or that he kept the Word of God? He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him—the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day. John 12:48 -I will trust what Jesus says.
  
  I have to disagree with fertile/infertile idea. Between husband and wife it’s ok to use contraception. Do you think God would want a man to have more children than he could physically care for? That in no way gives permission for abortion or destroying an already fertilized egg.
  
  Read my words again carefully, I did not infer that “all wine is grape juice” I said that the term “wine” can ALSO mean just grape juice. Isaiah 16:10 “No treaders will tread out wine in the presses” -Obviously the “wine” here is not fermented (the grapes are still being pressed!).
  
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- by faith
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 6:01pm
  Google search to define:
  
  wine /wīn/
  Noun
  An alcoholic drink made from fermented grape juice.
  Verb
  Entertain someone by offering them drinks or a meal: “lavishly wined and dined”.
  Synonyms
  vintage
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 12:14am
  @scarebear83 – you wrote “If they call themselves “pastors” then 9 times out 10 they don’t know what the Bible is saying” Is this your personal fallible opinion or are you alluding to something found in scripture? You wrote “Jesus never gave us popes or rosaries or never once instructed the Apostles to pray to or through Mary” Jesus never gave us a “Bible”, Jesus never told anyone that they should read the scriptures in order to have eternal life, Jesus never once mentioned a “New Testament” Jesus never once mentioned the “Sinners Prayer” Jesus never once mentioned the “Altar Call” Jesus never once mentioned a “Bible Study” Jesus never once mentioned “Accepting Him as your personal Lord and Savior”Jesus never once mentioned being saved by “Faith Alone” Jesus never once mentioned using “Scripture Alone” Jesus never once said anything about “Eternal Security”, Jesus never once said anything about a “Holy Trinity” Jesus never once mentioned anything about a “Rapture” and yet many “Christians” hold to one or all of these beliefs so I am not sure what your point is here? You wrote “I know the Bible is true and know that is where we should get our truth because it was written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit” How do you know that? Why do you accept the 2nd Canon giveas determined by the Catholic church? Continued Below
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 12:30am
  @scarebear83 cont’d – You wrote “I have to disagree with fertile/infertile idea. Between husband and wife it’s ok to use contraception. Do you think God would want a man to have more children than he could physically care for?”
  
  Where in scripture does it say that it is holy for a man and a wife to use sex purely for physical pleasure while preventing the natural result of the procreative act? Scripture is very clear that we are to be fertile and multiply, where in scripture did Jesus or the Apostles rescind this command?
  
  God calls us to put our full trust and faith in Him knowing that even the birds are under His loving care. The idea that we can actually have more children than we can care for shows a complete lack of faith and trust in Almighty God. Where in scripture are we told that we cannot trust completely in God and therefore we need to interrupt the natural procreative function of a womans body so that we don’t have more kids than “we can afford”?
  
  You wrote “That in no way gives permission for abortion or destroying an already fertilized egg” Going back to my original question, where is this mentioned in scripture? If you cannot show me where this is explicitly mentioned in scripture than those are your words and scriptures warns us against following laws of men.
  
  You wrote ” -Obviously the “wine” here is not fermented (the grapes are still being pressed!”
  
  I am confident that when the Holy Spirit says wine, He means WINE ;
  
  Report this comment
- snooop1e
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 12:38am
  @black9897 – Hey brother, it’s been a while, hope all is well : ) You wrote “Using pot (not abusing) is not a sin or wrong, however it’s not a good idea, especially for a Christian.”
  
  If those words are not found in the Bible how do you know them to be true? The point here is this, we know that scripture is the word of God, we also know that your words and scarebear83′s words are not scriptural (inspired by the Holy Spirit) so anything you say that is not found in scripture is simply your opinion, you are not infallible correct? Do you get my point? Sola Scriptura means that scripture and scripture alone are binding, that means that anything you say that not is found explicitly in scripture is just your personal, fallible opinion, how do you know you are right? You don’t, that’s the whole point.
  
  P.S. How do you know that the Bible is scripture?
  
  PAX CHRISTI.
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 2:07am
  @snooop1e- It’s Biblical. A Pastor refers to one who is an elder, an overseer of the church and it’s always plural so there should be no one “pastor” or elder (Titus 1:5; Acts 14:23; 1 Pet. 5:1-2) They must meet scriptural qualifications (1 Tim. 3:1-7; Titus 1:5-9). Just because one preaches the Gospel doesn’t mean they are Biblically a “pastor.”
  
  Jesus did mention He would send the Holy Spirit (Luke 12:12, John 7:39, John 14:26). Through the Holy Spirit these men were inspired and the writing of the Bible is thusly inspired. Let me ask you this, if Jesus has the words of life (Matt. 4:4) then where, pray tell, will we find those words if they aren’t found in scripture? (Meaning the Bible should be our guide). I do agree with you on these points, faith only is mentioned only once in the Bible with James 2 saying it’s NOT by faith only. Once saved always saved is also false because the phrase and idea are not once mentioned. The rapture is also false because we are told that men die once and after this is the judgment. No rapture, no tribulation, no millenial reign.
  
  Okay then if sex is purely for having children and can only be used for such then a barren couple would have to refrain from intimacy because their union will not produce offspring. I would also read 1 Corinthians 7:1-5 Paul discusses that within the confines of marriage sexual intimacy can be for pleasure and not specifically for child conception.
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 2:20am
  (cont’d) I’m sort of confused, first you say Jesus didn’t give us a Bible and you accept what fallible men (pope) tell you to be true. But then you ask me where in scripture can one find about the issue of sexual intimacy while warning against following the laws of men. Do you not see that is what exactly the Catholic church does? They teach you commandments of men which are not found in scripture. We can know the Bible is our only guide because Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Romans 10:17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Jesus said we will be judged by His words (John 12:48) so again I ask, where is the only place we can find Jesus’ words? In the Bible. So I have to ask are you going to be judged by how good a catholic you are or are you going to be judged by Christ’s words?
  
  You’re looking at the word “wine” through 21st century glasses which carries the conotation of a fermented drink (think of the word “gay” and what it meant 50 years ago and what it means today). So I ask if the grapes are being pressed does it make it a fermented drink?
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 9:56am
  @SNOOP1E
  
  Yes it has SNOOP1E.
  
  As I stated I know this based on what the Bible says (based on principle). If we only listened to the things that were directly stated there would be a lot of things left out which we would either know to be wrong or right. That’s why Jesus used many principles; could you imagine God spelling out every little thing we can and cannot do? The Bible would be as long as the Great Wall of China. I understand exactly what you mean and I agree…the only part that I differ is sola scriptura includes principle teachings which can apply to many things. I think this was very smart on God’s part (duh he’s God) because if he did that we would become very legalistic and worry so much on what we can and cannot do.
  
  We don’t. There is evidence but at the end of the day it must be taken on faith.
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 4:05pm
  @scarebear83- you wrote “if sex is purely for having children and can only be used for such then a barren couple would have to refrain from intimacy because their union will not produce offspring.”
  
  I never said that sex is solely for procreation. My question was/is, where specifically in scripture are we told that Christians should chemically or surgically alter the natural (God given) function of our bodies in order to prevent the creation of life within the marital act?
  
  You wrote “I would also read 1 Corinthians 7:1-5 Paul discusses that within the confines of marriage sexual intimacy can be for pleasure and not specifically for child conception.”
  
  Again, I am asking where specifically in scripture does the Holy Spirit instruct us to prevent the creation of life within the marital act, by altering the natural function of our bodies? Where in scripture are we warned not to have too many children because God might not provide for us?
  
  The original question still stands, Why do “Bible Alone” Christians affirm things not found anywhere in the Bible? This is a self defeating principle.
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 6:01pm
  @black9897 – You wrote “You’re thinking that if the Bible doesn’t mention something specifically or the exact word isn’t used then its ‘un-biblical’ which is not true at all.”
  
  What assurance do you have that the above statement is true if isn’t found anywhere in the Bible?
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 13, 2012 at 8:36pm
  @SNOOP1E
  
  It’s a matter of using my God-given brain to understand what I’m reading. God gave us brains to use them, not so we can be zombies and read off some giant list of commandments.
  
  If I am facing a situation and the Bible doesn’t talk directly about it I must then look for the principle that speaks to it. I gave an example in an earlier post. Another one would be cussing. The Bible says nothing about not saying the F word, however it does tell us let no corrupt word come from your mouth and since that is considered “corrupt” in our society at this time then it would fit.
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 2:24am
  @black9897 – So if I understand you correctly, as Christians the way that we know what is objectively right or wrong is to weigh what scripture says (or doesn’t say) against what is acceptable to society, If scripture is silent on a specific matter (such as smoking pot, cussing, using birth control, gay marriage, abortion,artificial insemination, cloning, surgical sterilization etc) we must consider what is morally acceptable in society, is this what you are saying?
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 2:44am
  @scarebear83 – Thanks for the response, a few thoughts before I hit the rack.
  
  1. I think you are missing my point, I’ll ask again, how do you know that the NT is indeed inspired? When the letter to the Hebrews was written the NT did not exist yet, so Paul was refering to the Septuagint (the Bible during Jesus lifetime) I think you are overlooking timelines here which are very important, when Paul wrote 2 Tim 3:16 and Hebrews the New Testament canon did not exist yet, so how do you know what books and letters are inspired and should be in the Bible? Why were 7 books that were in the Septuagint removed from the Protestant Bible? You see there are MANY MANY letters, Gospels, books etc (some written by the Apostles) that did not make it into the Bible, why do you suppose this is? Who decided out of the thousands of writings in existence which ones were scriptural and which ones were not? Here is simple question, which came first, the Church or the Bible?
  
  Secondly, you asked how could grapes be pressed into fermented wine? To that I ask the question how could fermented grapes be pressed into non-fermented grape juice? You are assuming that the grapes were not already fermented, presuppositions sometimes cloud our perspective. : )
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 4:07am
  @snoop1e I will have to tackle the rest when I have more time but I just had to ask, how in the world does one ferment a grape before it is pressed? The only way to get fermented wine is that the grapes have to be pressed first. You have to make grape juice before the fermentation process. Therefore grapes that are being pressed are not alcoholic… its just grape juice.
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 11:01am
  @SNOOP1E
  
  No..that’s not what I’m saying. I used the cussing example because that would fall under corrupt talk. Now there is corrupt talk that has been around forever and is objectively wrong, as far as the F word specifically or other words that have come about are really cultural. “Bad words” are manmade. What we call bad words now may not have been around 500 years ago. They are only as “bad” as how society views them. Homosexuality, abortion is always wrong because the Bible speaks to it (directly or on principle). Smoking pot, birth control, AI, surgical sterilization is really up to each individual. If they don’t’ want to do it or feel that it’s wrong for them, then fine.
  
  Personally, I do not do (or ever have) pot or any drug/smoking simply because I don’t want to and I thinks it’s a bad idea. It’s foolish to not use birth control, although I’ve known people who don’t. That’s really none of my business anyways. AI, again that’s up to personal choice. Surgical sterilization I think shouldn’t be done simply because you could change your mind in the future of wanting more children, but if you really don’t want any more kids then ok that’s up to each person. Personally I would never do it because I would not want to alter my body like that and my wife and I would simply use some type of BC.
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 12:00pm
  @scarebear83 – Have you ever lived in the middle east? I have and I can tell you it gets hot with a capital H. The temp routinely gets up to 116 degrees (in the shade) So imagine filling a big pit or a vat with about 500 lbs of grapes and letting those grapes sit in 116 weather for a day or 2. What do you think is going to happen to those grapes? Again we are going down a rabbit hole here but for me, when the Holy Spirit says WINE I trust He means WINE. No riddles, no confusion, the Holy Spirit means what He says. Just as when Jesus said “My Body is REAL food and My Blood is REAL drink” I take Him at His word. If you think about it, truthfully your argument is with the Holy Spirit, not with me. I’ve shown you in scripture (Genesis and other passages) where wine clearly made people drunk but you hold to your presupposition that wine was not fermented. Ask yourself why you have to wrestle with scripture in order to make it fit your presuppositions? Ask yourself why some of your presuppositions are utterly absent from Church history until say the 16th or 17th century. Ask yourself how you got the NT and why you trust the authority of the church that determined the NT canon but reject everything else. Ask yourself why Protestants removed 7 books from the original 1611 version of the KJV.
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 6:45pm
  @black9897 – you wrote
  
  “They are only as “bad” as how society views them”
  
  “Smoking pot, birth control, AI, surgical sterilization is really up to each individual”
  
  “If they don’t’ want to do it or feel that it’s wrong for them, then fine”
  
  “It’s foolish to not use birth control”
  
  “AI, again that’s up to personal choice. Surgical sterilization I think shouldn’t be done simply because you could change your mind in the future”
  
  “if you really don’t want any more kids then ok that’s up to each person”
  
  Are you familiar with the terms “Relativism” and “Subjectivism”?
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 8:45pm
  @SNOOP1E
  
  I am.
  
  And no, I do not believe morals are relative. There are some things however that while ok may not be ok for someone else. For example, we know that drinking (not abusing it or getting drunk) is not morally wrong, but for someone who is a recovering alcoholic or drinking causes them to stumble in their faith it would be wrong for them.
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 9:46pm
  @Snoop1e- Ask yourself this and be very honest. Do you think our Lord and Savior would honestly provide fermented wine to the guests as a means to get drunk (as they have already drunk plenty by this time) when verses upon verses speak out against getting drunk? Do you think Jesus would honestly cause someone to sin? Because if Jesus caused someone to sin then He is not blameless and cannot be our Savior. When God’s word tells us it’s wrong to get drunk then you have to ask would Jesus really have provided alcohol to those people for the purpose of getting drunk? I’m going to have to go with no. Our 21st century vocabulary may say “wine” is alcoholic but again this is why a study of scripture is very very important.
  
  You asked what came first, the church or the bible? Was the Old Testament not written before the New? Did Christ sometimes quote scripture from the Old Testament? In the Beginning was the Word and the Word was with God (John 1:1) So the Word came first. Granted the Bible we have today was not compiled until a little while after but it was being written as things happened or shortly thereafter as these men were guided by the Holy Spirit. Those who are saved are part of the church, the called out, but the church is not the authority on things, God’s word is. Anyone who teaches tradition over God’s word forgets what Jesus said to the pharisees Mark 7:1-12
  
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- scarebear83
  Posted on December 14, 2012 at 10:16pm
  @ snooop1e- Also to answer your question about what will happen to those grapes in the heat… What will they do? Rot. Grapes do not become fermented on their own, you have to go through a process to turn them into alcohol (press them into juice then add yeast). Other than that, a grape left out in the heat or anywhere will just become a rotten grape. Webster’s 1828 dictionary states Must as: n. [L. mustum; Heb. to ferment.] New wine; wine pressed from the grape but not fermented. So in the 1800′s you have the word “wine” which can also mean not fermented. Words change over the years so what one word meant 40 years ago can mean something entirely different today and we have to keep that into account when coming across certain words.
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 15, 2012 at 11:19am
  @scarebear83 – You wrote “Do you think our Lord and Savior would honestly provide fermented wine to the guests as a means to get drunk”
  
  Where in scripture does it say that Jesus turned water into wind so that people would get drunk? According to your logic Jesus turning the 12 loaves into enough bread to feed the 5 thousand was inviting people to gluttony. Again, I believe the Holy Spirit when He says WINE. You are saying that you better understand what the Holy Spirit actually meant to say and that the Holy Spirit is confusing people so they should listen to you. Wouldn’t you agree that accusing the Holy Spirit of mischaracterizing something is a bit arrogant on our part? I am quite sure that if the Holy Spirit wanted to convey grape juice the Holy Spirit would have said grape juice. Are there other places in scripture where you believe the Holy Spirit didn’t accurately state something? If so please point this out.
  
  The NT wasn’t firmly canonized until 300 to 400 years after Christ death and resurrection. I would hardly call 300 years “a little while after” You seem to magnify those things that you believe support your position and brush aside things that don’t support your presuppositions. 300 to 400 years is a pretty long time. For 300 to 400 years there was no NT as we know it today. You still haven’t answered the question(s). Do you accept the NT as being the word of God? Who determined that the books of the NT are divinely inspired?
  
  P
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 15, 2012 at 11:32am
  @scarebear83 – It’s been several days now that we have been dialoguing about whether or not the Holy Spirit actually meant WINE when He said WINE. This is probably going to upset you but I was subtly making a point and I am guilty of dragging it out but when I saw the opportunity to really drive the point home I couldn’t resist. On the one hand you affirm that any sincere believer can pick up scripture and fully understand it while on the other hand you have spent the last 4-5 days explaining to everyone how confusing scripture can be and how the Holy Spirit didn’t really mean WINE when He said WINE If people need scarebear83 to explain to them what the Holy Spirit actually meant to say when He said wine then “Sola Scriptura” cannot be true, you have demonstrated that you firmly believe that scripture can be confusing. There are many other sincere Christians who do not agree with your interpretation of “wine” in scripture So if 2 or more gather in Jesus name and disagree with your interpretation of scripture…. who is correct? God gave us a church not a Bible and that church determined which writings were divinely inspired. So who should people listen to? The church that determined the 2nd canon and can trace it’s lineage all the way back to the Apostles or some guy who affirms Sola Scriptura and then spends 4 days demonstrating that it doesn’t really work?
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 16, 2012 at 11:23am
  @scarebear83 – just for clarification, when I say God didn’t give us a Bible I don’t want to be misunderstood, I am saying that God established His Church on Peter and He gave Peter and Peter alone the keys to the kingdom of Heaven and Earth. God gave all of the Apostles the authority and power to bind and to loose and to forgive and retain sins but to Peter and Peter ONLY He gave the keys to the kingdom of Heaven. So when I say that God didn’t give us a Bible I mean that He gave us a Church FIRST and promised that Peter held the keys to bind on earth and in heaven. Scripture tells us that the CHURCH is the Pilar and Bulwark of truth (Not the Bible) So it is through the church that Jesus Christ established that we have assurance, not through our personal fallible interpretations of scripture. The Church authoritatively (Jesus keys given to Peter) determined the 2nd canon. So then the question then becomes, by what authority do you interpret scripture and tell people what it means and doesn’t mean? The church has Jesus promise that the gates of hell will not prevail and we can trust in Jesus promises. What is better, someone who constantly reads scripture and comes to the wrong conclusions or someone who trusts in Jesus Church? You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life (John 5:39) but Jesus was VERY clear that UNLESS you EAT His Body and DRINK His blood you have no life within you.
  
  PAX CHRISTI
  
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- snooop1e
  Posted on December 24, 2012 at 6:51pm
  @scarebear83 – It’s been a week or 2 now and I’m not sure if anyone is still checking this thread but I figured I would finish up with a parting statement. scarebear83 insists that the “Wine” spoken of at the wedding at Cana was not fermented because according to him Jesus would not tempt people to get drunk. Lets take a closer look based on the original Greek text.
  
  The Greek word for un-fermented grape juice is Gleukos (Strongs Greek 1098). Which means – new wine, sweet wine Akin to glukus; sweet wine, i.e. (properly) must (fresh juice), but used of the more saccharine (and therefore highly inebriating) fermented wine — new wine. So even un-fermented “grape juice” was highly inebriating.
  
  The word used for wine in John 2:10 is Oinon, it occurs 34 times in the Bible. It comes from the Greek word Oinos (Strongs 3631 Oínos – wine made from grapes) John 2:10 says that hosts usually wait until the guests are drunk or have drunk to much and then put out the good wine because once they are drunk they don’t know the difference.
  
  Secondly, “Gleukos” (unfermented grape juice) only occurs ONE time in scripture and that is in Acts 2:13. When the people saw the Apostles filled with the Holy Spirit they accused them of being drunk on “Gleukos” the Greek word for “un-fermented grape juice”
  
  So even un-fermented “grape juice” made you drunk in Jesus day. The idea that the WINE Jesus made was non-alcoholic has absolutely no basis in scripture wha
  
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Ash_Kiker
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:19pm
God made pot… man made alcohal !

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- Lloyd Drako
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:52pm
  You’re sort of right and sort of not.
  
  Alcohol in small quantities is present in fermenting fruit; humans in prehistoric times learned how to concentrate it to make beer and wine. Distillation in turn was invented in the Middle Ages, whence vodka, whiskey, etc.
  
  Cannabis was apparently domesticated somewhere in Central Asia, whence its cultivation travelled in two directions: into Europe, where it was bred mostly for hemp fiber, and into South Asia, and ultimately the Middle East and Africa, where it was bred into ganja, kif, dagga, etc., for its intoxicating qualities.
  
  Same plant, “tweaked” different ways, sort of like broccoli and Brussels sprouts. Not entirely “natural,” not entirely man-made either.
  
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- toiletclogga
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:54pm
  God also made hemlock.
  
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- by faith
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:09pm
  God made lava, I don’t recommend you smoke or drink that either
  
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- Smokey_Bojangles
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:56pm
  Ever see drunk moneys? Where do they hide the still?
  
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- Favored93
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 7:06pm
  Sorry… God also made wine.
  There was a flock of birds in England that flew into a building and died… THE WHOLE FLOCK! The Government thought it was bird flew and the locals were scared. So they did an autopsy and found that they were all DRUNK! They had gotten into a bunch of berries that had fermented on the vine!
  Wine is the ONLY natural form of alcohol on the planet! All others require heat to make!
  God did make wine…Jesus first public miracle was turning water into wine!
  I am not justifying drinking but I am saying we have to be honest about this stuff or the world will not hear us when we talk!
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:02pm
  @TOILETCLOGGA, you said “God also made hemlock”.
  
  That’s true, but its also true that we make beneficial medicines from hemlock.
  
  Funny that the lethal does of hemlock is very low, while the lethal does of marijuana is astronomical, and yet marijuana is the plant that’s illegal.
  
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- 702TruthSeeker
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:05pm
  you put the seed in the dirt, it grows into a plant, you pick off the flowers, dry them, and smoke them.. now tell me how those alcoholic beverages that you’re totally cool with are produced. you’ll never see a domestic violence incident with someone who smoked a joint, but a few drinks… DUI incidents? bar fights? seriously, the effects of alcohol are far worse. the only reason it’s illegal is because it’s so easy to produce, they’d never be able to tax it since anyone can have a plant with almost zero effort, it’s simple as that
  
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- plugemin.com
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:24am
  Mark 7:15-20 That’s All.
  
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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 6:19pm
  Alcohol is produced naturally in the fermentation process. Vast quantities of alcohol are being produced naturally all the time by the natural action of yeasts. Alcohol is produced as a byproduct of bread making (it evaporates). Alcohol is a totally natural product, as is marijuana.
  
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brigott
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:16pm
Is it permissible for Christians to drink alcoholic beverages?

I know good Christians on both sides of this same issue.

The real question for a Christian isn’t whether or not something is permissible or not; it is first of all whether or not something will glorify God, the whether it is best (as opposed to okay). ”

Whether therefore ye eat or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.” I Cor. 10:31

I fail to see how marijuana use would glorify God, therefore, I will not.

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- 1TrueOne55
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:30pm
  Yeah well there is the argument that since in Genesis God gave us plants and animals for our survival then you could say yes to smoking pot.
  What Paul was referring to was idol worship and partaking in feasts with pagan neighbors in the region of Corinth where this church was located. The church took to heart the process of “Forgiveness” of sins and then believed that all things were allowable under the laws of man since Jesus had paid the price for Mankind’s Sins/shortcomings. Now you have the Ultra Right of Christian life saying that anything that does not “Glorify God” then it is not to be done but when you read the Gospels and the Wedding Feast Miracle turning plain water into the most prized wine of the feast and how it nearly created a riot at the feast. How then would you say that creating animosity for the host was Glorifying God?
  It’s all in how you believe.
  
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- ashestoashes
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:33pm
  Bread and wine are used for Communion..anything to excess is not good..but Jesus did turn the water into wine at the wedding party..and the head of the household said that most masters serve the good wine first..and the cheap wine at last..but He chose to serve the good wine last.Paul also told Timothy that a little wine for the stomach was good.. I have nothing against marijuana..it has its medicinal uses for severe pain.. and it is a cancer cure and if you were not that person experiencing that pain.or trying to cure that cancer..then I would not judge..but I was told by a messianic Jew that marihuana is considered Pharma..and that is witchcraft..and practioners will not inherit the kingdom of heaven.. Although it is an aphrodisiac..for most people..it destroys their ambition..for school..for work and it destroys their purpose and focus in life..good reasons to not use it for recreation..
  
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- brigott
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:00pm
  When God created all things in Genesis and provided them for our benefit, the world was a perfect place.
  
  Since the Fall of Man, sin has had some very negative effects.
  
  And it is possible to use the marijuana plants in beneficial ways (such as the use of the hemp fibers to produce excellent ropes) without subjecting oneself to negative effects (such as making yourself stupid).
  
  The fact that a plant or animal is beneficial doesn’t mean that the only way to get that benefit is by eating or smoking it.
  
  And many, many things are beneficial in small amounts in the right places, but deadly in other amounts or in other places.
  
  I’m talking principles here, not cut-and-dried “always” or “never.”
  
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- loriann12
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:01pm
  I’m against recreational use, just to get a high. But, that said, I would have lost a tremendous amount of weight on chemo had I not done an occasional bowl due to nausea and pain. I haven’t in a long time, because my pain is mostly gone. Pot is much better for the body than vicadin, which is addictive.
  
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elosogrande
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:13pm
It doesn’t matter what your religion is, pot is a bad idea.
It makes you undependable.
It will make you unemployable.
It makes you a pain in the ass.
It makes you seem stupid, even if you’re not.

This country has been going down hill for the last fifty years. Pot is one of the common denominators in the “I don’t give a damn” society in which we live today.

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- toiletclogga
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:56pm
  Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes and Yes! ….to all your points!
  
  The stupidity quotient is already at a high level, and we do not need to increase it!
  
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- SCREW-WINDOWS
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:59pm
  A pot smoker would be the first to disagree with your claims as he is to blind to see.
  
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- Snake
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:02pm
  Your comments are as dumn as they get. POT does NOT make YOU do anything!!! If you are stupid before you smoke pot then you are just as dumb afterwards! You make all these claims of how aweful people are who smoke pot and yet around you every day I can assure you more people than you would ever guess also smoke pot. Yes some how as a pot smoker I managed to finsih high school, go to college and create a multi-million dollar areospace engineering company. Stop talking about things you know NOTHING about!!! Stop judging the many by only looking at the few!!!!
  
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- SCREW-WINDOWS
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:05pm
  @ Snake
  Nice Hallucinations Dude !!!
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:24pm
  @ELOSOGRANDE
  
  Yes, pot is a bad idea. However, it does not make you undependable, unemployable. No, I have never tired it or any drug (including smoking). The problem isn’t drugs; it’s abusing them, which can go for anything. It becomes a problem when you allow it to be what you live for and what your world revolves around. Working out can be bad when it starts to interfere with relationships, jobs, etc. This goes for almost anything.
  
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- AndYetItMoves
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:06pm
  I find it fascinating that anyone on the intellectual ghetto that is this website would be concerned with people acting stupid as a form of escapism. Look around you.
  
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- HOOT_OWL
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:59pm
  Snake.
  There is no way you can be serious .
  Unless you have a job being a taste-tester for Cheetos .No person in their right mind
  would have someone work for them while their high on pot.
  
  Let me ask you something . If you were to go into the hospital to get brain surgery..
  How would feel if you saw the whole surgery team in a circle getting high,
  before they cut you open..?
  
  If that wouldn’t bother you, you’re either delusional or stoned out of your mind.
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:30pm
  Pot basically turns you into a bum, huh?
  
  Richard Branson started Virgin corporations smoking pot.
  
  Ted Turner started a media empire smoking pot.
  
  Steve Jobs started Apple smoking pot.
  
  Bill Gates started Microsoft smoking pot.
  
  William F. Buckley started modern conservatism smoking pot.
  
  Shakespeare wrote many works smoking pot.
  
  Many of your favorite actors and musicians did their best work smoking pot. And the list goes on and on. Just google it and wake up,
  
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- SCREW-WINDOWS
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 11:49pm
  There are thousand of pot heads in court who said pot doesn’t affect me until they meet the judge then all they can say is I was under the influence or I have a drug problem. Own up to your own stupidity you will fool no one. See it every day.
  
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- jhrusky
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:01am
  @ hoot_owl
  
  “There is no way you can be serious. Unless you have a job being a taste-tester for Cheetos .No person in their right mind would have someone work for them while their high on pot.”
  
  Perhaps I missed something, but I saw nowhere that @snake said he built his business and career WHILE he was on a perpetual high. He merely stated he was a pot smoker thoughout school and work. While he MAY have been high the entire time, I suspect he was not and recreationally used weed whilst away from building his business.
  
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- H.I.Mcdunnough
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:23am
  Intellectual Ghetto…love it
  
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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 6:15pm
  ADVECTION: Shakespeare smoked pot? Citation please.
  
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momof5children
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:06pm
speaking as a christian, as long as it”s legal, i don’t have a problem with someone using it. i don’t have a problem with christians who drink occasionally either. there are even christians who smoke.
big deal, what we do is between god and one’s self.
too many denominations bring in their own rules, when most of these rules are not even in the bible.
that’s when it becomes “religious”. being a christian is a way, a choice, a daily walk with god. it’s not about being good, it’s a heart matter. churches try to make it hard, when really it’s very simple.
i really don’t care what mark driscol says, he’s mostly wrong about everything that comes out of his mouth. christians would be better off reading their bibles for guidance then listening to these new age preachers who are following a different jesus.

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- Highland
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:19pm
  If you assume a glass of wine is the equivalent of a joint, well, okay. I don’t think it is, but can’t say there’s really a lot of scriptural guidance on that particular point. The Bible tells us not to get drunk, and getting high is the functional equivalent of that, though.
  
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Rational Man
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:04pm
“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.” -1 Peter 5:8

“But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.” -1 Peter 4:7

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- GhostOfJefferson
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:14pm
  Right. So as long as you don’t go to the point of intoxication, then you should be good.
  
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- Rational Man
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 2:29am
  How does one not go to the point of intoxication when smoking pot?
  What’s the point then? Libertarians always have the lamest arguments concerning pot usage and legalization.
  
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Joyzee
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:03pm
Is there food storage for Pot smokers!.One Day shelf life i presume

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whatthecrazy
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:00pm
UH oh dang i forgot what i was saying, happens all the time.

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Landon410
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:00pm
is it ok for christians to get drunk? sleep around? break any law?
of course not……

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- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:13pm
  What you just described is an abuse of things that are not inherently wrong. Drinking is ok, having sex is ok. Getting drunk is wrong, sleeping around and having sex outside of marriage is wrong. Personally, I’d say it’s not a good idea for Christians to drink or smoke, because it just looks bad and we should be set apart…but it’s not wrong or a sin.
  
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- OldSurfRat
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:21pm
  Black
  
  Once agian you have a good answer.
  Smoking anything is inherently bad for you.
  However the bible says that we should not over indulge at anything we do. Now some like to try and claim the old sorcery line but to that I have to say REALLY?
  I also would have to ask those who drink a beer etc why are they drinking?? Grow ****, look good or maybe its to relax. Yep relax.
  So other than the law why such a big fuss over this. If it is only because it is illegal than so much for their view on smaller government.
  This is the narrow hypocritical veiw that continuse to hurt the conservative voters ability to make a difference.
  If you dont like it than dont do it. Pretty darn simple.
  
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- black9897
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:28pm
  Thanks man.
  
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SquidVetOhio
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:58pm
Come on Blaze. This is just stupid.

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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:05pm
  If you want real news go to drudge, brightbart or moveon. Im warning you now readers of TheBlaze crave non-news. In fact the more trivial the better.
  
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BasketFullOfPuppies
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:55pm
I don’t see why not. But, I think that our culture takes many things to excess, and therein lies the sin. JMHO

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ResistSocialism
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:53pm
Ok for Islamic radicals to smoke pot? Maybe it would mellow them out.

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- vaman
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:08pm
  Same for christian radicals or evangelicals.
  
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- Lloyd Drako
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:57pm
  We normally think of potheads as mellow and non-violent, but weren’t the original Muslim “Assassins” supposedly given to hashish? It’s surprising what different effects this drug apparently produces. In some cultures, people use it to make steady physical labor more tolerable. In others, couch lock and total inability to move–except to reach into the bag for another Tostito.
  
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- jhrusky
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:07am
  @ lloyd drako
  
  “We normally think of potheads as mellow and non-violent, but weren’t the original Muslim “Assassins” supposedly given to hashish? It’s surprising what different effects this drug apparently produces. In some cultures, people use it to make steady physical labor more tolerable. In others, couch lock and total inability to move–except to reach into the bag for another Tostito.”
  
  I would think that, like alcohol, pot brings out what is truly inside you while under the influence. I know it did me and others I know. The muslim assassin culture that uses hashish, I believe, were a violent bunch to begin with, thus the hashish just made that more apparent.
  
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yippeya
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:52pm
Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

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- TIME_2_END_THE_PAUL_CAMPAIGN_IN_12
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:59pm
  Great line from the Mattie Ross character in True Grit: “I would not put a thief in my mouth to steal my brains.”
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:13pm
  @YIPPEYA, “be sober” or be imprisoned?
  
  I’m not an advocate of smoking pot. I’m a critic of Prohibition. If someone wants to smoke, that’s bad, but its only made worse by the federal government taking their kids away, seizing their property and throwing them in prison.
  
  LIBERTY! FREEDOM!
  
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- Smokey_Bojangles
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 11:41pm
  Noah lands the ark, plants a vineyard, gets drunk off its wine, lays around naked in his tent and is seen by his son Ham who reports it to his two brothers. Noah sobers up knowing what Ham did and curses his grandson Canaan who apparently was not even there.
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:09am
  @SMOKEY, what’s your point? Are you saying its unfair to inherit consequences? Would it also be unfair to inherit blessings?
  
  We all inherited death. Also, the sins of the fathers are visited for generations on their children and grandchildren. Interestingly, geneticists have discovered evidence that the sins of the fathers are imprinted into the genome and epigenome.
  
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- yippeya
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:38am
  @Advection–I don’t remember saying any of those things. I also think pot is less damaging then alcohol. I don’t think the government should ruin your life over it. As a former chronic user of weed, I will say it had detrimental effects on me. Freedom??? No. I was a slave to it. Some people could smoke a little and be satisfied, I was not. Plus many people here are confusing mans law with Gods law . If the supreme court rules homosexual marriage legal, does the trump Gods law? It should not to a born again believer. God gave you free will, you will have to make that choice.
  
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hologram5
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:52pm
All things have their season, and in their times all things pass under heaven ECC 3:1
The Bible preaches moderation in all things but especially in strong drink 1 Timothy 5:23

Why put it on this earth if not to use it? We are to have dominion over ALL things.

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fastfacts
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:52pm
THERE ARE A LOT OF LIES GOING AROUND ABOUT THE USE OF MARIJUANA…

You need to hear it from the Conservative comedian Steven Crowder give the statistics on Marijuana, don’t listen to the billion dollar Pot Lobby. Here is the truth: http://www.thedailycandidate.com/video/2012/nov/crowder_marijuana_truth.html

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- BlessedONE333
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:03pm
  STEVEN CROWDER IS A MORON REGARDING THIS ISSUE! just another brainwashed pagan pretender
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:44pm
  Half truths and outright propaganda.
  
  I love where the kid says “[pot] is natural” then the interviewer thinks he’s made a point by saying “Uranium is natural”.
  
  Ever heard of nuclear medicine? Lets apply prohibition to radioactive isotopes and end cancer research!
  
  Hurrah for the Police State!
  
  Report this comment
GhostOfJefferson
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:51pm
Ah, another self proclaimed expert who admits to having no real world experience. Thanks holy guy.

Plenty of people smoke a joint now and then, or drink a beer, or whatever, without becoming the emotional equivalent of a 15 year old. He presumes an outcome that validates only his view of the world, while rejecting all other real world outcomes as inconvenient to his point.

Further, if not taken to the extremes of gluttony in consumption, and if it doesn’t make you violate any other commandments, then there is absolutely nothing wrong, in a Biblical sense, with smoking a blunt on occasion. Anything taken to extremes generally falls into the category of sin, including eating boxes full of communion wafers and drinking gallons of holy water every week.

Last of course is just an observation, about following earthly laws. It’s interesting the article got it right regarding “as long as they are consistent with God’s laws”. Under that standard (which I agree with), we are not bound to follow much government, if any, at all these days.

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- Raging_Waters
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 8:43pm
  Thanks for the coherent opinion, GHOSTOFJEFFERSON.
  
  And now, in honor of your avatar:
  
  …It was once said he rolled a pack of joints using only his feet..
  
  …It has been said a man once asked him if he smoked weed. As he turned and locked his blood red eyes on him, the man burst into a cloud of weed smoke and was never found again..
  
  …He once killed a bear using only his mini-bong…
  
  He is…the most interesting stoner in the world.
  
  “I don’t always smoke weed, but when I do…I get fully-baked. Stay hungry my friends.”
  
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Chromo200
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:50pm
God tells us not damage our bodies, and smoking does. Am I against drinking booze, yes .. Am I against sex outside of marriage, yes ..

But I do go over the driving speed limit .. I must work on this

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- GhostOfJefferson
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:02pm
  Clearly then you abstain from all fatty fried foods, all red meat, you filter your water to within an inch of sterilization, you do not eat processed food, you avoid dairy and generally eat just natural grown (no pesticides!) vegetables, fruit and a bit of no-mercury fish. Right?
  
  I’m not certain I cotton to the notion that we were put on earth to reject the bounty over which we were given dominion. The important thing, I’d think anyway, would be to avoid sin while still enjoying the bounty bequeathed to us by the Almighty.
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:13pm
  “The important thing, I’d think anyway, would be to avoid sin while still enjoying the bounty bequeathed to us by the Almighty.”
  
  You nailed it, Jefferson. Well said, as usual!
  
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- Chromo200
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:14pm
  Good point but I was being sarcastic about the speeding .. I am a sinful person that is working on my sins Tell me where it says I can’t eat read meat? .. The issue is moderation.
  
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- WEBWITHDEB
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:27pm
  One does not need to “smoke” marijuana in order to get the effects. There is a whole burgeoning industry vying for the marketplace in producing edible marijuana products.
  
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RANGER1965
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:50pm
“Is it ok for Christians to use Marijuana?”

Wow, what a slippery slope.

Is ok for Christians to drink alcohol, or smoke/chew tobacco?

How you answer the above determines your answer in a state where Marijuana is legal.

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glckgrl
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:50pm
On both a scriptural and legal analysis, this is a no brainer. Paul wrote to the Corinithians about this very issue and 1 Corinthians 6:19 states the instruction Jesus taught. My body is a gift from God and we are supposed to treat it well. Inhaling pot smoke even longer than tobacco is clearly defiling our lungs and the scriptures. Moreover, federal law prempts state law so despite the state’s new law, possession, using or selling pot is still illegal. Imagine if your state voted to never pay federal taxes to the IRS, so employers stopped taking it from your checks and did not pay federal income tax or FICA; big brother would breathe fire upon the people and the principle of premption applies, as federal law will always trump a less restrictive state law, although a state law can be more restrictive than the federal law.

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- KidCharlemagne
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:01pm
  “Moreover, federal law prempts state law so despite the state’s new law, possession, using or selling pot is still illegal.”
  ===========================
  
  The US Constitution doesn’t allow the federal government to confiscate powers that rightfully belong to the several States:
  
  ————-
  “The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government, are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce; with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, be connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the State.”
  -James Madison, Federalist No. 45, January 26, 1788
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:50pm
  That’s where the federal agents and police captured religious people. It’s obviously biblically immoral to smoke pot, soooo……it should be a felony, and we should ruin lives while wasting Trillions of Dollars trying to stop it?
  
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BetsyRoss1513
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:50pm
This subject (pot) is where me and most Republicans part ways, I think. I think there’s nothing wrong with smoking MJ.

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- sta
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:05pm
  I think that if the GOP stood with the legalization like the libertarians do, they would win every election for years to come.
  
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- WEBWITHDEB
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:32pm
  I know someone who used to be a pot farmer, but got busted and quit because it was not worth the hassle thereafter. Now, 25 years later, the ratio of what he has gotten in government assistance to what he would have been contributing through taxes on this product is at least 3:1. What might have averted the fiscal cliff went up in smoke a quarter century ago . . .
  
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- booger71
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 6:22pm
  It was actually Democratic Social Justice women and preachers who got Prohibition enacted and most of our drug laws with the help of a Democratic majority in both Houses and signed by Democratic Presidents.
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:20pm
  Obama was supposed to at least ease up on medical marijuana patients, but he has broken new records in raids. Obama has also dared to threaten governors, state legislators and civil servants with prison of they adhere to state laws on medical marijuana. He also threatens banks to not open accounts with medical dispensaries. He also threatens gun stores to not sell self defense weapons to dying patients who are targets of criminals because they use marijuana to ease their suffering.
  
  What a gem these Democrats are!
  
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jman-6
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:48pm
Why he would want to pen an article in the pro-Palestinian anti-Jew hating Relevant mag is the equivalent of arguing with idiots.

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GoodStuff
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:46pm
Mmmmm brain damage.

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- Ash_Kiker
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:24pm
  Mmmmmmm Drain Bamage
  
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48Straights
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:46pm
More useless news. It is a wonder why Blaze readership is down 24% from last month?

I see lots of people commenting here like it is a news site, but all it is is entertainment.

If you want news go to drudge, breightbart, or even MoveOn. At least they report the news over there and talk about it.

If you want girly gossip non news stores go to Glenn Beck and TheBlaze.

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- TIME_2_END_THE_PAUL_CAMPAIGN_IN_12
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:55pm
  Yet you are here commenting…
  
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- Polarized America
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:56pm
  .
  and yet you stick around, now don’t cha …../;-)
  
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- BODYBAG
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:59pm
  Agreed. Really irritating when I stop by and see feature stories about what some preacher thinks about smoking hash, what some girl’s cat lived through, some g o o k rapper named “Psy”, what stupid comment Bill Maher made today, “Watch this outrageous video showing ______ going ________”
  
  Rename it the official Jerry Springer fanclub site
  
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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:03pm
  I love watching the uninformed masses comment about trivial news. Quite entertaining. But sadly it is things like TheBlaze and its readers that lost us the election.
  
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- Polarized America
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:10pm
  .
  BODYBAGGER …needs more bodies………sorry ..i should have resisted
  
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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:16pm
  Just trying to wake up people and tell them there is a real world outside of TheBlaze with really bad things going on that Glenn beck is too much of a wimp to report on.
  
  Wake up people and get involved with large things and pay no attention to trivial irrelevant things like Saturday Night Live, Homer Simpson, and Glen Beck.
  
  They are purposely distracting you while they are attacking your freedoms.
  
  Beware of people that want to keep you uninformed and wish to use your ignorance against you, like Beck and TheBlaze.
  
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- Fubared
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:19pm
  Perhaps you should stick to 8 or 12 straight. Sleep deprivation can give you a buzz akin to cheap mexican brown weed from what I hear. Saw it on moveon.orgy.
  
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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:48pm
  Lol
  
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- Schteveo
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:20pm
  I guess I’m unsure how this is NOT news.
  
  It’s a huge change in legal policy and precedent, and one that puts states rights at odds with federal powers. Our prisons are packed with people who got caught with MJ, who sols miniscule amounts, or who got caught driving with a roach in their cars ash tray. The vast majority of people think the current laws are overbearing and should be changed. Our local, state and federal governments spend billions of $$$ every year for pot interdiction. Gangs and criminals are killing each other and innocent bystanders for control of drug sales and smuggling.
  
  OK, I still can’t begin to guess how this is NOT news.
  
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OldSurfRat
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:44pm
There sure are a lot of stories about pot here on the blaze. I think maybe someone is hitting the bong around there. If not then maybe they might want to start.

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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:49pm
  TheBlaze editors are liberal. That is why you see so many stories like this and links to Saturday Night Live.
  
  This is not a great place if you want the real news or want to be informed on the drastic tearing apart of our nation. But hey if you like pot, SNL and Homer Simpson, TheBlaze is right down your alley.
  
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- OldSurfRat
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:06pm
  48
  
  I come here to sound off and have some fun.
  Yes I do like the simpsons, big bang theory and have smoked in my past. However I have not liked SNL since the original cast, do not agree with most left wing views, have voted Rep since GW.
  So now where do I go???
  Guess I’ll just stay here and run my mouth until something better comes along but thanks for the advise.
  
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- sta
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:08pm
  Blaze editors are libertarians. Watch Real News and you see the Libertarians giving opinions.
  Personally I am less GOP and more conservative. With that comes freedom. I’ll stand with many more libertarian than liberal ideas.
  
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- Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:13pm
  @48,
  
  So what if they are? (which I don’t think that they are) Do you really want to live in some sort of echo chamber? Why wouldn’t you want to see what the other side says, does, believes, etc? For example, I’m a laissez faire, minarchist, austrian ecnomist. I’ve read Das Kapital, General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money, Trade Policy and Market Stucture. I didn’t finish them as a Keynsian Collectivist. Rather, I understood my own points of view more clearly. I understood and rejected the cases that they were making. I can weave the moral, philosophical and economic arguments together to support my own point of view and reject theirs.
  
  The idea that you should immerse yourself in a stream of supporting information is sorta creepy. It certainly doesn’t end with a logical, reasonable and informed population in the future.
  
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- 48Straights
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 4:46pm
  If TheBlaze actually had a point of view let alone a point to make it would be worth reading.
  
  I read moveon, drudge and brightbart. The Blaze use to be my favorite. I would read the others and then come here because TheBlaze usually had more detailed stories on the subject and better research than the others. Now it is just a webpage devoted to trivial, non news gossip.
  
  TheBlaze and Glenn Beck have lost their way. As a patriot I am calling them on it and trying to wake up what intellectual readers it has left. TheBlaze has joined the MSM in distracting the American population from the real news and therefore the ability to do anything about it.
  
  You are an interesting guy Roth, keep up the good work and keep your mind free of propaganda.
  
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- Advection
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 10:25pm
  The left hate it when conservatives openly discuss issues which they arrogate to themselves.
  
  What most liberals don’t know, or don’t want you to know, is that the founder of modern conservatism, William F. Buckley, was a pot smoker and life long advocate of personal liberty on this issue.
  
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- MGrilla
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:09pm
  It’s called the BLAZE hello.
  
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M40-A1
Posted on December 10, 2012 at 3:42pm
Where are all of the anti-smoking nazi’s?

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- Sol Invictus
  Posted on December 10, 2012 at 5:07pm
  I don’t know – where are all the anti smoking nazis?
  
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