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‘Dehumanizing’ Gays? Justice Scalia Defends His Views on Banning Gay Marriage During Princeton Speech

Dec. 11, 2012 7:16am Billy Hallowell

PRINCETON, N.J. (AP) — U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia on Monday found himself defending his legal writings that some find offensive and anti-gay.

Speaking at Princeton University, Scalia was asked by a gay student why he equates laws banning sodomy with those barring bestiality and murder.

“I don’t think it’s necessary, but I think it’s effective,” Scalia said, adding that legislative bodies can ban what they believe to be immoral.

Justice Antonin Scalia Defends His Views on Gay Marriage | Princeton

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia speaks at the University of Wyoming in Laramie Thursday, Oct. 25, 2012. Passing through Laramie after an unsuccessful antelope hunt, Scalia stopped at the university to make an impassioned and humorous case for sticking to the original meaning of the U.S. Constitution. Credit: AP

Scalia has been giving speeches around the country to promote his new book, “Reading Law,” and his lecture at Princeton comes just days after the court agreed to take on two cases that challenge the federal Defense of Marriage Act, which defines marriage as between a man and a woman.

Some in the audience who had come to hear Scalia speak about his book applauded but more of those who attended the lecture clapped at freshman Duncan Hosie’s question.

“It’s a form of argument that I thought you would have known, which is called the ‘reduction to the absurd,’” Scalia told Hosie of San Francisco during the question-and-answer period. “If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?”

Scalia said he is not equating sodomy with murder but drawing a parallel between the bans on both.

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia speaks at the American Enterprise Institute (AEI) October 2, 2012 in Washington, DC. The American Enterprise Institute and the Federalist Society held a book discussion with Justice Scalia, who co-authored the book ‘Reading Law: The Interpretation of Legal Texts.’ Credit: Getty Images

Then he deadpanned: “I’m surprised you aren’t persuaded.”

Hosie said afterward that he was not persuaded by Scalia’s answer. He said he believes Scalia’s writings tend to “dehumanize” gays.

As Scalia often does in public speaking, he cracked wise, taking aim mostly at those who view the Constitution as a “living document” that changes with the times.

“It isn’t a living document,” Scalia said. “It’s dead, dead, dead, dead.”

He said that people who see the Constitution as changing often argue they are taking the more flexible approach. But their true goal is to set policy permanently, he said.

“My Constitution is a very flexible one,” he said. “There’s nothing in there about abortion. It’s up to the citizens. … The same with the death penalty.”

Scalia said that interpreting laws requires adherence to the words used and to their meanings at the time they were written.

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Related:

‘There Is No Right to Secede’: See the Alleged Letter Where Justice Scalia Shoots Down Idea of Leaving the Union

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Comments (414)

cashprize
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:46am
Very few od the politicians have the guts to speak so plainly. There is NOTHING in the Constitution that stipulates that Gayness is a right. The Constitution speaks about righs coming from God and Nature and both those sources testify against it.

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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:04am
  “The Constitution speaks about righs coming from God ”
  
  You might want to reread the Constitution. God is never mentioned; the closest you get is “In the year of our Lord” for the date, a common way to express the date in the 18th century. You’re likely mixing up the Declaration and the Constitution.
- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:30am
  “Scalia told Hosie of San Francisco during the question-and-answer period. “If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?””
  
  Wow, this type of silly argument is coming from one of our supreme court justices?
  
  You can have moral feelings about homosexuality
  You can have moral feelings about murder
  
  The difference is in that homosexual acts are consenting actions between two adults while murder is imposing your will on someone else and taking their life.
  
  Judging by Scalia’s example, I think it’s immoral that there are so many obese people in the United States, therefore I think we should vote to pass laws to limit how big of soda drink people can get. I’m sure you’d all be for that right?
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:31am
  Nobody is saying Gayness is a right, no more so than one’s race or other physical condiction is a right. What they are arguing is that all Americans are owed and guaranteed equal proctection under the law. Also the Constitution make no mention of rights coming from some sky deity, nor does is provide a finite list of rights, the 9th Amendment actual says that citizens enjoy more rights than listed in the Bill Of Rights.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:02am
  ENCINOM….You talk about ‘rights’, but what you really project is hatred of anything wholesome. I know that you look at “the good ole’ days, as some oppressive kind of limitation, but we had it extremely good. We had honor and respect and love….maybe that IS what you hate.
  Unfortunately, you missed the good stuff, and now you need to have everyone in your world of misery. It won’t happen. What I was born into will stay alive and well no matter what you do to try to sully it. I actually feel sorry for you. You obviously were not nurtured in truth, as a child, and have become a pitiful adult.
  I would NOT walk across the street to save your empty life. You are better off going to the devil. At least you’ll have someone to relate to.
  
  Report this comment
- cessna152
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:11am
  @encidope,
  
  Where does it say government gets to hand out rights? Oh, that’s right, in the Communist Maifesto and if you were an honest guy you’d admit you’re a Marxist at heart.
  
  BTW, the Constitution is a LIMIT on what government can do and the only thing we are afforded is to be equally free from government oppression, which ironically, is government forced rights. BTW, I serve a REAL God, you serve a master and that is your government. Yours will end, mine will last for all eternity. My God treats me with mercy and grace, your god treats you with contempt and tyranny. Amazing how someone can chose slavery and tyranny over freedom.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:13am
  Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:51am
  MODERATIONISBEST….hello bud. I know you have no particular attachment to Christ, but don’t you see that Gayness is suffering? Debasing. De-humanizing?
  Why would you allow this death-style to be promulgated, if you are moral at all? Am I to assume that you believe some children should be reared in this scenario? The marriage thing is to allow more homosexuals to be ‘manufactured’ in the homes of ‘married’ homosexuals. I know misery loves company, but this is satanic
  _____________________
  What’s satanic is the parade of ignorance you and other “Christians” are demostrating to deny equal rights to fellow Americans.
  
  Report this comment
- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:19am
  Actually yes ENCIDIOT…the left and the homosexual lobby is saying homosexuality is right. They’re saying it’s no different to heterosexuals. Essentially it’s no different to merely being left-handed.
  
  They equate it on the same level as heterosexuality while never mentioning that homosexual couples-without exception- cannot procreate with out a third party aiding them. That over 64% of new HIV cases each year in this country are attributed to homosexuals who make up less than 2% of the population. That just recently a new strain of Syphillis has become prevelant among homosexuals that is resistant to medication. All these things take place because of the unnatural and contrary nature of homosexuality Hollywood and the left would have us believe there’s absolutely nothing wrong with homosexuality however, no matter what you bleat here. Go peddle your non-sense somewhere else you dullard.
  
  Report this comment
- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:25am
  You want proof of what I said ENCIDIOT? Look at Orwellianly named “MODERATIONISBEST’s” post.
  Contrary to your flaccid assertion…Orwellianly named MODERATIONISBEST indeed believes one cannot have moral objections to the sexual proclivities and mores of homosexuality, thus…homosexuality is “right”. Apparently one cannot have moral objections to the disproportionately higher levels of promiscuity, HIV, gonorrhea, syphillis, ..etc that result from homosexual practices.
  Orwellianly named MODERATIONISBEST goes on to blather about murder being a poor analogy by Scalia while being completely oblivious to the fact that homosexuals are killing each other in higher numbers through HIV by the mere “virtue” of the type of sex they have. But of course..being a protected class thanks to liberal dolts like you…one cannot bring up these things as homosexuals are “right” and just like us apparently.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:34am
  ENCINOM….What is suffering is common sense and decency. You will see that ALL of the rights you so adamantly support will be gone, because you and those like you can’t tell a ripe sweet apple from a rotten one. You have been distracted from the one saving grace this country has always stood for MORALITY! Without it, none of the rest is worth a second glance. You are adrift in a sea of complacency and self absorption. There will be nothing left when you are done.
  While Rome burned, Nero played his sweet sad songs on his fiddle…..While America falls you sit and jerk off.
  
  Report this comment
- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:43am
  I am shocked at the amount of people who are saying the government should have anti-sodomy laws…..
  
  The only thing on the table should be gay marriage. Obviously the government has ZERO business banning consensual sexual acts. If you think government should make sodomy illegal, move to middle east
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:46am
  @Max,
  
  America’s saving grace was never morality. We are a nation founded by cast offs, misfits and others looking for a second chance to start over. Morality was never our concern as we stole the lands of the Native Americans and enslaved the African Americans. America’s savinf grace is that we believe in the individual and the rights of the individual to define their lives for them. The American heros, the frontiers men, the cowboys, these were individuals defining their lives for themselves, not submitting to outdated teachings.
  
  America will always be the land of the individual, where the individual his free to attempt something new, to blaze a new trail down the road less taken, knowing that this country is also a forgiving land of second chances.
  
  Report this comment
- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:56am
  “stole the lands” ENCIDIOT…by all means…put your money where you mouth is..return your “land” to any native american you see…I dare you.
  
  Tell me sport…should Nomandy return Britain to the Britons? When William the Conqueror took England from Harold he changed the language, the law and the society there for ever. He changed the course of European history. Bear in mind…the Saxons had done exactly the same before William.
  Does speaking English bother you today? You do realise you speak what you speak today because of what William did to Britain yes?
  You know why if you’re of British descent that you have a last name today champ? Because of the Normans. Native Britons didn’t have last names nor the engineering and economic savvy of the Normans.
  Enough of your “stole native american lands” banalities. Weak cultures give way to stong ones…it’s the natural order. Deal with it and stop your insipid lefty catch phrases in lieu of actual thoughts.
  
  Report this comment
- 4x4conserve
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:57am
  Who do you think “the creator” is?
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:35pm
  ENCINOM wrote that Christians standing against homosexuals’ rights is Satanic. But what about Christian’s right to have a society where our children are not exposed to filthy, deviant sexual behavior?
  Huh? Encinom, are you there?
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:05pm
  Encinom…..Your statement about “saving grace’ NOT being our moral stance is the exact reason I never took Ron Paul as a real choice. If you stand for nothing you will fall for anything. I have something to live for, and some thing that I believe in that is worth dying for. Can you say that?
  “Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” You don’t seem qualified to participate, and that is why you NEED blind equity. If there was a true standard of purity of thought and actions, you, son, would be cleaning toilets the rest of your life. So the only way for you and those that think like you is the coming communistic globalist world order. That is where your philosophy belongs, and whether you know it or not, that is what you work toward….Its called lack of foresight, and it is endemic in your generation. You seem to view yourself as a patriot but in my opinion you are an anarchist with a penchant for self indulgence. You won’t be able to pay the debts you are accruing……and through your own actions, and words, you alienate those who have the ability to help. I won’t even wish you well, That would be against my religion!! I do not support stupidity……Or insanity. Get professional help. Soon.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:14pm
  Max are you capable of making a valid argument and not straw men BS. From Penthouse to Playboy to the Jersey Shore there is plenty of straight smut that kids are exposed to or are you objecting to two individuals in a loving relationship holding hands and kissing because it offends your outdated morality?
  
  Report this comment
- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:30pm
  Please more to Iran or Saudi Arabia. You will be much happier there. They take their “rights from god” much more seriously.
  
  Report this comment
- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:31pm
  @Max Jones
  did you consider Newt Gingrich as a ‘real choice’? That guy has very little morals
  
  Also hope you are not a fan of Donald Trump – for the same reasons
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 2:53pm
  Max I can quote the Founders to, here an actual drafter of the Constitution, James Madison:
  
  “Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise.”
  
  “During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution.”
  
  And of course it was John Adams, the author of your quote that, while President, signed a treaty with the following phrase: “the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion.”
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 2:58pm
  Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:05pm
  Encinom…..Your statement about “saving grace’ NOT being our moral stance is the exact reason I never took Ron Paul as a real choice. If you stand for nothing you will fall for anything.
  _____________________
  Another dishonest Christian. I didn’t say I stood for nothing did I. I said the bedrock principal of this nation, the quality of character that we base our legends, myths and heros on is not morality by individualism. This nation’s greatest strength is not our religious values but the freedom and liberty it grants to the individual to define the world and their lives. You define your life one way, others are not bound by your definitions, that freedom. What you are other are attempting to do is restrict the freedom of your neighbors to conform to your definitions (definition not even shared by all Christian Churches).
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:18pm
  ENCINOM SAID ”Max are you capable of making a valid argument and not straw men BS. From Penthouse to Playboy to the Jersey Shore there is plenty of straight smut that kids are exposed to or are you objecting to two individuals in a loving relationship holding hands and kissing because it offends your outdated morality?”
  Yeah there is a bunch of that smut, but the difference in a ‘moral’ home there are parental protections….A gay couple adopting would certainly ‘initiate’ a boy child. Don’t say I’m wrong, I know better….
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:38pm
  ENCINOM Apparently you do not have discernment enough to tell the difference between productive behavior and destructive behavior. Maybe you do and you just don’t care. I think it is the latter. I do commend you for thinking. at all. But, I put your ignorance of human nature down to inexperience. You have put quite a bit of energy into your arguments and you seem to believe what you are saying. My MUCH younger brother asked me one time, “Do you believe that, if it isn’t a Duncan, it isn’t a yo-yo? “, referring to a commercial he saw on television. His understanding of the statement confused him. I look at your immature viewpoints in the same light. The only difference is the gravitas of the subject matter. In your case, you are putting the cart before the horse. While you are talking about the patient Qualifying for care….I have already made the diagnosis and have prescribed a course of treatment. You will play catch up till the bitter end.
  
  Report this comment
- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:46pm
  MAX: “A gay couple adopting would certainly ‘initiate’ a boy child. Don’t say I’m wrong, I know better….”
  
  Stereotype much?
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:47pm
  @Max
  “A gay couple adopting would certainly ‘initiate’ a boy child. Don’t say I’m wrong, I know better”
  
  You don’t know better, you are just an old fool set in his bigotted ways. And that is what this comes down to your inability to admit that your bigotry is wrong.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:09pm
  SOYBOMB About my choice last election, No. Gingrich is a rino, and though smart, was not my choice. My guy never got going….I knew that Bah Rahk was not going anywhere….The degradation of this type of government is written in prophecy. I also know that Bah Rahk has been chosen for the job. There is no way out. The only thing for the faithful to do is keep on exposing the devils around us and to try to dismantle the structure they are building. Soon, this gay rights thing will be a moot point, too.
  It won’t be long till the Roman church, in an attempt to be the only church on the planet will “adopt” all the morally bereft, and in their hour of desperation, they will bow. It will be that, or death.
  The Roman church has its ‘emissaries’, in our govt., too. I think Newt is one.
  I keep score, on a global scale, and the score is a lopsided rout, in favor of the NWO. I hope you are fond of rice.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:44pm
  @TMOVERBECK&ENCINOM….Look guys I started playing music professionally at the age of 12. And went on the road at 14. I have seen it all and I will tell you that homosexuals are predatory, and prefer the young ones. I myself have been in defense mode several times. I KNOW. If you say I’m full of it, you are ignorant or lying.
  
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- Walkabout
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:05pm
  What might happen if a person engages in bestiality? Diseases might jump species & cause extremely virulent diseases.
  What might happen when people engage in sodomy? Diseases, killer disease, might readily spread.
  It looks like government has an interest & the problems look similar in enough ways to be comparable.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:43pm
  @MAx
  
  “While you are talking about the patient Qualifying for care….I have already made the diagnosis and have prescribed a course of treatment. You will play catch up till the bitter end.”
  
  No, cause there is no illness to be treated. You are sitting in your corner hunting imaginary pink elephants and wondering why the rest of the world doesn’t see them. You are a prisoner of your own bigotry, paranoia and fears nothing more.
  
  Report this comment
- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:14pm
  @AVENG
  
  Okay now I think you’re just being ignorant on purpose and not just because you’re mentally handicapped by your delusional world view. Or maybe you can’t read.
  
  How can you honestly say the statement of, “”Contrary to your flaccid assertion…Orwellianly named MODERATIONISBEST indeed believes one cannot have moral objections to the sexual proclivities and mores of homosexuality, thus…homosexuality is “right””"
  
  When in my post I said,
  
  “You can have moral feelings about homosexuality
  You can have moral feelings about murder
  
  The difference is in that homosexual acts are consenting actions between two adults while murder is imposing your will on someone else and taking their life.”
  
  Again Aveng. I think it’s immoral that there are so many horribly overweight people in this country, therefore I would be perfectly justified in wanting to pass laws regulating what size soda you can buy and what kind of food you can eat.
  
  You “liberty” people are hilarious. You are only for liberty and freedom for things you agree with.
  
  “Apparently one cannot have moral objections to the disproportionately higher levels of promiscuity, HIV, gonorrhea, syphillis, ..etc that result from homosexual practices.”
  
  You are being so disingenuous with this statement like these are problems solely because of “homosexual practices” when in reality, they’re problems for all sets of people.
  
  Stop being a moron please.
  
  Report this comment
- pmjme
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:52pm
  It is quite ironic and contradictory @E, that you are attempting to promote individualism, the freedom and liberty to define the world and our lives, through forced collectivism. In one sentence you say we can define the world around us and in the other that the collective has decided the issue and anyone who doesn’t agree is a bigot. What a crack up.
  
  Report this comment
- Wartface
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 2:12pm
  The Thirteen colonies required what the Federal Goverment had the legal right to do and also spells out what they can’t do. There are nine things the Federal Government has jurisdiction over legally. Deciding who can and who can’t get married is NOT one of them. That is the right of the States. Protecting our border is their total responsibility… They do NOTHING! Income tax was illegal until 1913. The Progressives passed the 16th Amendment which eventually allowed them the right to confiscate 91% of some people’s income. Then they passed the Death Tax. Owebama wants 55% of your already taxed assets when you croak! Progressive’s are crooks… Woodrow Wilson gave our banking system to a privately owed corporation and had the gall to write into the agreement that NO ONE in our government would have the right to know who owns it and… No one in the government has the legal authority to audit their books.
  
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lefty5005
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:41am
When Duncan Hosie of San Francisco left he went out and got “hosed.”

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- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:17pm
  SOYBOMB….I want to tell you that I found a new respect for you today on this forum. We have more in common than i thought. Maybe its the contrast between you and Encinom, but whatever it is, be sure that I have read your posts with honest attention, and responded likewise.
  
  Report this comment
- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:23pm
  Max Jones i never understood why you have come at me with such gusto. During the primary i was called “aka encinom” more times than i can count, but it was usually because the person did not understand.
  
  Yes, we share alot. I also believe in the traditional protestant interpretation of end times – which has the catholic church as the head of the beast power
  
  Report this comment
- savagenatn
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 5:09am
  LOL yep some other ho mo dunc’ed his hose into hosie
  
  Report this comment
TAC616
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:34am
I’ve seen you trolling here before and seen your posts get removed for it. Grow up.

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FifthWheel
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:15am
In Washington State, we’ve solved the problem by legalizing Gay Marriage and Marijuana on the same ballot. This makes us compliant with scripture because it says in Leviticus 20:13 “If a man lies with another man he should be stoned.” :-)

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- GrayPanther
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:28am
  Thanks for my laugh of the day! Yes, Mr. Truck Driver, you have nailed it! Personally, I am not as charitable about the militant gay movement. Homosexuality is abnormal human behavior and contrary to the reproductive cycle. And it ALWAYS will be. Passing a law will change nothing and Adam and Steve will always be an abnormal couple to most people.
  
  Report this comment
- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:32am
  Gray: You’re entitled to that opinion, and I won’t fault you for it. But as long as Adam and Steve are living a civilized life, adopting and raising children responsibly, and being productive members of society, it’s not our business to dictate their lifestyle choices.
  
  Report this comment
- lefty5005
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:42am
  Sweet! Quote of the day…lol
  
  Report this comment
- cessna152
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:02am
  @TMOverbeck,
  
  And it’s not their right to interfere with my right to have an opinion and live as a Christian. Do I believe being gay is wrong? Yup! Are they allowed to be gay? Yup! Can I have an opinion of their gayness without being labeled a bigot? Yup. However, I have been on the wrong side of the so called tolerant gay community. I was sent threats, my bank account was compromised, shunned by many teachers, etc. Because I had an opinion about a gay film being shown to a 8 year old child.
  
  I believe government needs to get out of our lives and stop granting rights. It’s all about equal freedom not rights.
  
  Report this comment
- Sidney Allen Johnson
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:04am
  TMOVERBECK: Its not dictating lifestyle choices. It is a self-determining citizenry setting its standards. No one will stop homosexuals from behaving as they wish. But they should NOT be allowed to set the standards for the rest of us.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:40am
  @Cessna
  
  “Can I have an opinion of their gayness without being labeled a bigot?”
  
  No, you can’t. You do not have a right to avoid the truth. The truth is your opinions, which are your right to have, are bigotted by today’s standards. Sorry, the world has past by bigotted, old white men. The polls show that the Baby Boomer generation will be the last generation where a majority oppose civil rights for all and where your bigotted opinions are exceptable.
  
  Report this comment
- cessna152
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:06am
  @encinom,
  
  Why I waste my time with you is beyond me, but I’ll humor you. So what you posted is free speech only pertains to certain groups and proves your ignorance to freedom. BTW, I would assume bashing Christians is free speech, but having an opinion against gays is bigoted, hateful, unacceptable speech.
  
  Wow… the irony is astounding.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:17am
  @Cessna, you are free to make your bigoted, hateful, unacceptable rants, you are have no right not to be called out for your comments, you have no right to expect others will remain silent as you spew you bible based hate.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:17am
  ENCINOM….Actually, the ‘baby boomer’ generation, is the last generation of “whole” people. We sit back and watch as you guys scurry about your cage, scavenging what was left to you, never building your own version of life. You can’t understand how this ‘infrastructure’ you depend on, was built.
  We tried to protect you, but you would have none of it. You bought the lie of forced equality. Sooner or later you all will realize that ”Dad was right”……You don’t get anything lasting, without working for it.
  You got your ‘participation’ trophy, and you thought you won……poor thing.
  Born equal…but growing up means accomplishing something lasting.
  
  Report this comment
- charles116
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:31am
  Good one!
  
  Report this comment
- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:36am
  What about your incessant bigotry against Christians ENCIDIOT? In typical lefty style..that’s acceptable to you right?
  
  Why do you insist others have to stand back and allow the fantasies of homosexuals to change standards and norms that have served human civilization for centuries?
  Why do we have to accept the sexual mores and proclivities of homosexuals as “normal” or “acceptable” when they make up over 64% of new cases of HIV in this country each year while only making up less than 2% of the population”? The disproportionately higher cases of gonorrhea and syphillis among them? Their exaggerated promiscuity?
  
  What possible benefits does this behaviour and characteristics of homosexuals offer society and why should we just turn around and ignore it all?
  Answer the bloody question you cur.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:39am
  Sorry Max, its over, the bigots lost. The younger generations have learned from your mistakes. You can not say you beleive in a Constitution like ours and in the next breath deny a group equal protection under it.
  
  Your post makes very little sense. Equal rights have been a struggle, its only now that a majority of Americans are seeing that bible based bigotry has no place in a secular Republic like ours. Your doom and gloom opinion is your grieving over the loss of a America that never was. Leave it to Beaver and the mythical 1950′s was a white washi fo rthe unrest and dirt under the surface. The others was swept under the carpet and kept out of sight. America is moving beyond the need for fairy tales to help us sleep at night. While you hold onto your myths and a past that never was, America is moving forward and truly becoming a Nation that respects the rights of all of its people.
  
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- jeffile
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:42am
  The excess use of “civil rights” when one desires to push an agenda is becoming boring. Gays have and have always had the same right to marry as non homosexuals. Any person can marry a person of the opposite sex – period. Using the arguments of the homosexuals community regarding changing the definition of what constitutes marriage opens a can of worms. If changed then only bigoted people would deny two loving siblings or parent child to marry.
  
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- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:48am
  You bandy words around like a true reptile ENCIDIOT. Insidious and slimy to a fault.
  “Equal protection”? Tell me what protection homosexuals are denied? They have EXACTLY the same rights and protections you and I have.
  
  Report this comment
- z32tt
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:53am
  @tmoverbeck:
  What research can you site proving that a gay couple raising a child will have no adverse effects on that child’s preferences of sexuality? Are you like most of the other gay marriage advocates who have done little or nil to consider the consequences this would have on society? Scandinavian history sites an increase of divorce rates and increase of out-of-wedlock birthrates after the right of gay marriage was passed 10 years ago. In Sweden, the divorce rate among gay men is 50% higher than among heteros, and lesbian divorce rate is 170% higher! Where is your research? I’d love to hear it, and please site your source(s). Here is mine: http://byfaithonline.com/the-cultural-argument-against-gay-marriage/
  
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- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:00pm
  Just say it openly ENCIDIOT…you don’t want “equality” you want to elevate a liberal protected class and want to enshrine your delusions about that class in legislation so as to make sure those delusions are forced onto the entire society. Statism in it’s purest form.
  
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- RightMeansRight2
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:12pm
  @Fifthwheel, thank you. I am still laughing. I needed that. Uh oh…AAHAHAhaha….uh oh, can’t stop…AAHARHHARHAHRHARHARHAHAHR%HARHarharyharhharharhahr…….*~*
  
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- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:13pm
  “Learned from mistakes” ENCIDIOT? Tell me champ…what mistake is there in making sure kids know the health and psychological risks of homosexuality? Or does the thought of giving your child HIV appeal to you? A little extreme you say? Not at all little fella…groups like GLSEN and the “It gets better” project through their voices and advocates in the education system recommend that children should “experiment” with homosexual sex and the lifestyle. Don’t believe me? Look it up champ. Hate me all you want afterwards…it doesn’t bother me in the least.
  
  By all means ENCIDIOT..tell your son or daughter to “experiment” with a homosexual lifestyle for a while….I dare you.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:16pm
  jeffile
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:42am
  The excess use of “civil rights” when one desires to push an agenda is becoming boring. Gays have and have always had the same right to marry as non homosexuals. Any person can marry a person of the opposite sex – period. Using the arguments of the homosexuals community regarding changing the definition of what constitutes marriage opens a can of worms. If changed then only bigoted people would deny two loving siblings or parent child to marry.
  _______________________
  I have heard these arguments before, they were made in support of laws that prevent mixed race couples from marrying.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:35pm
  ENCINOM said”While you hold onto your myths and a past that never was, America is moving forward and truly becoming a Nation that respects the rights of all of its people.” You are a LIAR!! You know as well as anyone that what you say is not what is going on. What you want is to have a society that allows you unfettered access to any and all sin with a non-judgemental attitude. You obviously believe that ‘license’ is preferable to prudence…..You will find out that it just ain’t so!
  Go on with your bad self, We’ll see what happens. What you don’t know is that ALL the things you do follow you till the day you die, and every choice you make, good or bad, lives on your face forever.
  Your philosophy is an affront to every faithful parent, and is proof of your decayed soul.
  
  Report this comment
- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:02pm
  @Max
  
  “What you don’t know is that ALL the things you do follow you till the day you die, and every choice you make, good or bad, lives on your face forever.”
  
  What you are failing to understand is that they ARE MY CHOICES TO MAKE. Not yours, not anybody else’s. What right do you have to dictate who others should live their lives? If it doesn’t break your arm or pick your pocket of what concern is it of your’s?
  
  Report this comment
- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:04pm
  Z: I’ll see you that and raise you a… http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/514477
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:10pm
  ENCINOM….wrote” Sorry Max, its over, the bigots lost. The younger generations have learned from your mistakes. You can not say you beleive in a Constitution like ours and in the next breath deny a group equal protection under it.”
  What did you learn? That you can screw indiscriminately? That you can smoke dope in school?
  That stealing is OK, as long as you don’t get caught? That lying gets you out of a lot of trouble? That making promises you don’t intend to keep, to get what you want, is par for the course? That your hoodlum friends are more important than your family? How to cheat on exams? How to cheat on your girlfriend? How to get away with vandalism? How to talk and walk like a rap star? Where to go to score at 2 AM. Which neighbors leave their doors open when they’re gone? How to fake an I.D.? How to hotwire a chevy? How to roll a blunt?
  I’ll bet there is one thing you don’t know……Do you know the “Key of David?”
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:43pm
  ENCINOM wrote…..What you are failing to understand is that they ARE MY CHOICES TO MAKE. Not yours, not anybody else’s. What right do you have to dictate who others should live their lives? If it doesn’t break your arm or pick your pocket of what concern is it of your’s?
  
  I think that you just made my point for me….You just expressed how self absorbed you really are. I would break my own arm and toss my wallet onto the highway to keep you and those like you who put the welfare of innocent children on the altar of Baal, in the name filthy, deviant sexual behavior, away from any child, If homosexuals get to marry they get to adopt children, and that is unacceptable…..I put it right up there with fetal murder.
  
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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:53pm
  @Max
  “I would break my own arm and toss my wallet onto the highway to keep you and those like you who put the welfare of innocent children on the altar of Baal, in the name filthy, deviant sexual behavior, away from any child, If homosexuals get to marry they get to adopt children, and that is unacceptable…..I put it right up there with fetal murder.”
  ________________________
  You are chasing pink elephants. We are not a theocracy and you have no right to force your moral codes on others. This concern about children is a product of a paranoid mind with no place in reality. Talk of Baal and other demons from myths again show maybe you are not playing with a full deck if you believe in this stuff. Let me guess this is all a conspiracy dreamed up by the freemasons/Catholic Church? Key of David is further evidence of your cultish beliefs.
  
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M40-A1
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:10am
If you want to see gays dehumanized just watch one of their ‘Pride’ parades, if you can stomach the stench.

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- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:22am
  “If you want to see blacks dehumanized just watch one of their ‘Rights’ marches, if you can stomach the stench.”
  
  I knew you sounded familiar.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:24am
  M40-A1…….Exactly right. The de-humanization is “self-inflicted”.
  
  Report this comment
- remnantofthe-D
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:34pm
  “They fly their flag of sin like Sodom” That is the Truth of the mattter!
  
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DougHuffman
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:10am
Sodomites are not gay, happy children might be gay. Sodomites are more furtive than anile church-ladies banning PDA’s – Public Displays of Affection. Ever see sodomites do it in public, ever smell it? It is like walking past an overflowing sewer. There’s nothing gay about them.

Good people ought to be armed as they will, with wits and Guns and the Truth. God Bless Bitter Clingers, damn progressives.

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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:16am
  “Ever see sodomites do it in public, ever smell it?”
  
  … what kind of places do you pass by regularly that people (gay or straight) have sex in public?
  
  Report this comment
- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:20am
  @Locked
  
  That is what I want to know.
  
  Report this comment
- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:38am
  Stuff like public lewd conduct SHOULD be prosecuted. It may not harm anyone else physically, but if children are in view of it, that’ll mentally harm them. Not to mention that there’s a health hazard in there somewhere.
  
  It IS possible to allow for equal marriage benefits without having to approve of other ridiculous things that those few militant gay-nation folks want.
  
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- ashestoashes
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:56am
  @LOCKED..I saw some people on here last night (on one of the “gay” articles)..and one of them said that men do it in public restrooms..not any of the decent moral men of course..but just the same..they said that public restrooms and prisons ..it happens…and they were asking if it made men gay?..Oh..but that’s right..it’s kind of a “right of passage” in a certain church known for turning out gay men and little boys..
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:11am
  @Ashes
  
  “..I saw some people on here last night (on one of the “gay” articles)..and one of them said that men do it in public restrooms..”
  
  So… you’re saying that Doughuffman spends his times in public restrooms on the off-chance that gay men might sneak in to have a quickly in the stalls and he can smell it and get offended?
  
  Well, that makes about as much sense as his post, so I guess you might have a point.
  
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- ashestoashes
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:29am
  @LOCKED Are you a priest?
  
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- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:34am
  I think Doug is a troll.
  
  No one is this stupid.
  
  Maybe i just give people too much credit, who knows.
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:40am
  @Ashes
  
  “Are you a priest?”
  
  Not even Catholic, actually. I follow the Bible only; not a pope, priest, pastor, or preacher.
  
  Report this comment
- ashestoashes
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:46am
  @LOCKED..I have followed you on here for quite some time..and I always suspected that you had Catholic leanings..but one thing that I want to convey to you is that biblically..God says to obey manmade laws..except when they go against Him..His laws supercede man’s laws..I take my orders from Him only..He is the One whom I will answer too.. So glad that you are into your Bible..Blessings Locked.
  
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- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:24am
  TMOVERBECK…..When gays marry they qualify for adoption…..hows that for protecting the children?
  can’t have it both ways!
  
  Report this comment
- charles116
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:33am
  Location please. Porn is SOOOO expensive.
  How many hours do you spend there. Email some pics.
  
  Report this comment
- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:25pm
  ASHES…LOCKED has a short memory and is quite myopic you have to understand.
  
  A real world example of the “restrooms” point you mentioned?
  
  Where was George Michael arrested in Beverly Hills a few years ago? Why in a restroom at a park in the area that’s notorious for homosexuals meeting and having anonymous sex there.
  
  Until we have an honest discussion about the real world of homosexuality then the left will keep telling us homosexuality is “normal”. The real world of homosexuality is they high promisciuty, HIV, syphillis and gonorrhea rates among them. It’s not unusual for a homosexual to have had hundreds of sex partners in his or her life. Homosexuals have websites and even apps for their phones where they can “hook up” immediately for sex..no strings, no names..just choose a location and a time.
  
  Is this really what you want to put an “OK” stamp on and have your children accept as normal?
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:18pm
  @Avengerk
  
  “a short memory and is quite myopic you have to understand.
  
  A real world example of the “restrooms” point you mentioned? ”
  
  Doughuffman said he’s seen and smelt this himself. Your response is to point out that these meetings can happen in public bathrooms. Do you also believe he hangs around in public restrooms to watch and smell gay men have clandestine sexual meetings? Your response seems to indicate such.
  
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- ashestoashes
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:06pm
  @AVENGERK..My stamp of approval was not on homosexuals or their behavior..but on Locked reading their Bible..I stand with God..and you are absolutely right about homosexuality..It is because of their blatant rebellion against God that they suffer for it..
  @Locked..It would seem that you are biased toward homosexuals..because your argument makes no sense at all..Doug would not have to hang out in men’s restrooms to encounter ..see or smell the the scenario..All he would have to do..is to walk into the restroom and turn around..if not taking advantage of the facilities while there..I would imagine many men have run into this..most public men’s bathrooms do not lock..LOCKED..
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 11:10am
  @Ashes
  
  “It would seem that you are biased toward homosexuals”
  
  I am biased against hypocrisy. I don’t care who is being the hypocrite. My view on homosexual actions are that they are sinful. Full stop.
  
  -That doesn’t mean I think homosexual acts should be outlawed
  -That doesn’t mean that gay marriage should be banned
  -That doesn’t mean that, if they break the law, gays should not be prosecuted just because they are a “protected group”
  
  Doug (and Avengerk) seem to think that allowing gays to marry will lead to an epidemic of public orgies and a surge in STD rates. How would monogamous relationships have an effect on either? They are being hypocritical by pushing homosexuality as some kind of worse sin than others. There’s only one sin that’s worse than all others, and it isn’t being gay.
  
  It’s the kind of hypocrisy that runs rampant through articles on gays and gay marriage. It gets my goat.
  
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Shamrock241
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:08am
My message to gay people is simple, show me mike and mark can reproduce our species or shutup and get back in the closet.

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- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:19am
  What does that have to do with anything?
  
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- Shamrock241
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:29am
  @Youcantexplainthat I think it’s self explanatory but let me simplify for you one step further. No humans reproducing then no life on EARTH, that is not a scenerio i desire.
  
  Report this comment
- TAC616
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:40am
  And how exactly does letting gays marry magically turn every human on Earth gay?
  
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- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:40am
  Um… donating sperm to a willing surrogate lesbian friend, perhaps?
  
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- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:44am
  Okay I understood that. What that does that have to do with allowing people to marry?
  
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- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:31am
  @SHAMROCK241
  
  Let me ask you. Do you think homosexuality is contagious?
  
  I always hear the, “well if everyone were gay the species would be wiped out!” argument and I never understood how people were so stupid to even say that.
  
  Not everyone is gay.
  
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- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:42am
  YOUCANTEXPLAIN..Gay marriage thing goes like this, for bible bangin’ scripture believin’ Christians….We are held accountable not only for our own conduct, but for the welfare of the weakest ones, in this case children. If you don’t believe in the Lords ‘laws’, or don’t care about ‘judgement’, then by all means go to your perdition…..But I will fight for the souls of the innocent. Keep your nasty hands off the kids or I will show you what the Wrath of God might resemble. Keep the deviant sex in your closet….Knock yourself out, but don’t even try to pretend it is ‘normal’ or without serious repercussion.
  Gay Matt and steve being able to ‘adopt’ children, is an abomination….Goes for lesbians too.
  
  Report this comment
- tonyloaf
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:30am
  You miss Shamrock’s point, which is that the government should not endorse and thereby promote behavior (i.e. the homosexual life style) which if practiced by enough people would result in our extinction. It’s bad public policy.
  
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- ams9999
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:45am
  I am straight and don’t necessarily plan on reproducing. Do I belong in the closet too? What about straight women who are infertile? Do they belong in the closet? What about straight men who are sterile and can’t reproduce. Do they belong in the closet? Not everyone reproduce or wants too. You’re obviously using the fact that they can’t reproduce (with each other) as an excuse to justify your negative feelings for gays. You fail.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:52am
  Guys how got a vasectomy…..JAIL
  
  Report this comment
- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:52am
  *who*
  
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- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:24pm
  @Max Jones
  
  Your comment in no way answers my question. And looks like others have realized what I was getting at.
  
  The argument that says “gays can’t marry because they cannot reproduce” holds no water. You would not dream of banning marriage for straight people who, for any number of reasons, don’t, can’t or won’t have children.
  
  Report this comment
- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:05pm
  CAN”TEXPLAINTAT….I think you got confused by all the posts….my main objection is letting gays adopt….They are predators by nature. and pederasty IS how they “procreate”. They ‘make’ new homosexuals. If marriage is Ok for them ….they will adopt new victims.
  
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YouCantExplainThat
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:06am
Let’s not forget this is the man who also said states don’t have a right to secede. Reported on this very website.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/there-is-no-right-to-secede-see-the-letter-where-justice-scalia-shoots-down-idea-of-leaving-the-union/

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- Micmac
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:16am
  And he quotes a song as his evidence that we cannot secede. “…one nation under god, indivisible…”
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:20am
  It’s bad enough we have to deal with John Roberts….But now we cant even trust the “good justices”
  
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hauschild
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:04am
How else can you reasonably and accurately describe “behavior” that runs contrary to nature???

Preferring the same sex is simply not natural, so there is no reason to accept it as such. My view is do what you “choose” to do, but don’t expect me to subsidize it (in any form).

Man, I wish I were either 75 or 20. With the former, it’s almost over. With the latter, I wouldn’t have been raised properly, so I wouldn’t have noticed or learned how things should be, so I could fit right in to today’s culture; certainly would eliminate all worry about the future and make it – at least psychologically – a much easier life. Ignorance and idiocy is bliss.

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- jay1975
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:28am
  Monogamy is not natural for nearly every species on earth.
  
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- z32tt
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:37am
  @JAY1975:
  And same-species killings are natural to most other species on earth. What’s your point? Humans are not held to the same standards as other species. By your definition, murders are acceptable since they are natural according to other species.
  
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- jay1975
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:14pm
  z32tt
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:37am
  
  @JAY1975:
  And same-species killings are natural to most other species on earth. What’s your point? Humans are not held to the same standards as other species. By your definition, murders are acceptable since they are natural according to other species.
  
  My point is when the OP says that homosexuality is not natural, but most of the people who are against gays preach the “one man, one woman” line over and over, but that isn’t natural either. The fact that we have murder and other such same species crimes only further illustrates how not unlike animals we are.
  
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- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 6:10pm
  JAY…..What you don’t grasp is the same as most people….We are here to glorify the Lord. Marriage is a crucible of sorts. A man and a woman together for life, causes heat. When they are young the heat is sexual and as they grow older the differences between man and woman, causes friction which increases the heat. This heat refines the ‘gold’ they are made of and as they grow old together the dross of a lifetime is burned off leaving them pure enough to accept immortality. Its part of a grand plan.
  
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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:59pm
  Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 6:10pm
  JAY…..What you don’t grasp is the same as most people….We are here to glorify the Lord. Marriage is a crucible of sorts. A man and a woman together for life, causes heat. When they are young the heat is sexual and as they grow older the differences between man and woman, causes friction which increases the heat. This heat refines the ‘gold’ they are made of and as they grow old together the dross of a lifetime is burned off leaving them pure enough to accept immortality. Its part of a grand plan.
  ________________________
  What are you smoking?
  
  Again, you problem is that you seek to impose YOUR religious views on OTHERS. We are not a theocracy, citizens are free to accept or reject religious teachings and you have no right to impose them on anyone.
  
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- jay1975
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 1:04pm
  Max Jones, I am not here to “glorify” your lord. Marriage is a contract, subsidized by the government created to protect property and ensure that an individual is not erroneously harmed if the contract is broken (divorce). Your self righteous religiousness is not a part of that contract any longer. Get over it, the government took your god out of marriage. You can have a ceremony at your church, but without it being sanctioned and subsidized by the government, it is meaningless in the eyes of the law. You go glorify your god all you want, I will remain in the real world and deal with what is tangible.
  
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HOLYSMOKES
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:57am
Gay people will argue that they are just 2 people in love just like anyone else. Well, by this definition a mother and her son or a father and daughter shoulld be able to marry, right? What about the number 2? Why shouldn’t 3 people be allowed to marry?Who are we to limit love to just 2? It is amazing that the same people who support gay marriage rail against polygamy. I always turn the arguement back on them by saying, who are you dehumanizing polygamists? It is a slippery slope we travel on when we don’t have moral standards. I believe in the Bible and the Bible is quite clear that homosexuality is an unnatural act.This is why they spend so much time trying to discredit the Bible. Next time a gay person brings up the” 2 people in love” arguement say ” What about incest?, that’s 2 people in love” and see what you get. Coming soon: What’s wrong with beastiality?

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- K Harlan
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:47am
  The Sears website sells a book called, “On Bestiality”. Yes, that Sears.
  
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- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 9:26am
  Ah yes, the old “incline with questionable traction” argument. The fact is, marriage (in the pure legal sense) is a contract. Only adults of legal age can enter into a contract. Plural marriages may still be in play, as is blood-related ADULTS, but please stop saying this will end up in marriage to minors, animals, plants, cars, etc. It sounds ridiculous at this point.
  
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blackbean
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:52am
I want to think that the moral grounding of our founders in Judeo/Christian values still guides us as a nation. But, my eyes and ears tell me differently. We are lost as a nation until such time as great upheaveal and turmoil come our way. A tsunami of evil is overrunning us and has reached the highest levels of leadership as evidenced by our present potus. Too bad. I am now in my senior years and have nothing to look forward to but the ending.

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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:44am
  Actually it is the libertarian teachings, the notion of personal freedom that the founders instilled in the Nation that is being expressed.
  
  We where never a theocracy and religion never was a guide for this nation , just a talking point for politicans and pundints.
  
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APROUDVETERAN
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:45am
Sodomy is an abomination before God…….cant get much simpler…….

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- jay1975
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:29am
  Luckily, your god is kept out of the government, thanks to the 1st Amendment.
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:42am
  @ JAY; actually you have it backwards. The 1st amendment keeps the government out of our religion. However, the past 20 or 30 years has turned that upside down. This nation was founded on the freedom of religion. Now the 1st amendment is used to promote freedom from religion. Not its original intentention. The 1st amendment text: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
  
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- Shamrock241
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:49am
  @Jay1975 luckily my God does not worry about the !st Ammendment and with the way things are going here on earth,very soon i think he will show you personally how little he care’s about your government right’s and sodomite’s.
  
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- SimpleTruths
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:54am
  So is eating shellfish, let’s storm Red Lobster!
  
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- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:36am
  @Sham
  
  Oh, here we go again. We got another end times freak.
  
  It’s the old “With the way things are going…….You’ll find out!”
  
  You people look so gleefully towards the potential end of the world that it sickens me.
  
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- grampdad
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:51am
  The problems we are now facing are a result of immoral leadership. Politically correct stance defames morality and any form of absolutes. Rights are without boundarys and the push to make it discriminatory to punish “youth sexual orientation” and to have rage aginst those who participate in the lifestyle would be a hate crime, is but one small example of their ability to twist truth. Truth compromised is a lie.
  
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- charles116
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:36am
  Not my god. So there you go.
  
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- jay1975
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:44am
  All of the anti-gay arguments sound like the arguments against freeing slaves, against letting women vote and against desegregation. How can you go through life being so ignorant and bigoted? Your god is not coming to judge anyone and no one is going to burn for not following a book written by people who essentially said, “if I don’ts understands it, its must be a god doing it”.
  
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- jay1975
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:54am
  Marinebrat, you copied the 1st Amendment down correctly, but do you know what it means? It says that the government shall make no low respecting an establishment of religion and will not prevent the free practice of religion. What “Justice” Scalia said is that he would rule based on his religious views, clearly violating the 1st Amendment. No one is looking to take away your right to be an ignorant bigot, these suits are just trying to ensure that everyone enjoys the same rights and are not denied a right based on some archaic and outdated religion.
  
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- AvengerK
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:17pm
  To show you just how hateful you are towards Christians Orwellianly named “MODERATIONISBEST” while being overly accomodating to liberal protected classes-and also demonstrating your lack of knowledge of christian doctrine. You tell me champ..shouldn’t a christian be “gleeful” (your word) at the idea of seeing Jesus? It’s not the suffering they’re happy about..it’s that after the tribulation of the mankind will face, they will see their Christ and they are joyful at the thought of seeing him.
  Is there something wrong with that to you?
  
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- iampraying4u
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 2:18pm
  why do you think they call him obamanation
  
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- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:09pm
  MARINEBRAT: “The 1st amendment keeps the government out of our religion.”
  
  Including those religions that welcome gays and actually marry same-sex couples. Unless the doctrines violate life or liberty, we can’t pick and choose what qualifies as religion.
  
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- ModerationIsBest
  Posted on December 12, 2012 at 12:56am
  @AVENGERK
  
  Yes, because they worship a God that would eternally torture billions of people.
  
  Again, their supposed “meeting with their savior” is accompanied by the death of billions of people.
  
  And all I hear people say is, “I can’t wait until the world ends.”
  
  Freaks.
  
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Micmac
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:21am
He said that people who see the Constitution as changing often argue they are taking the more flexible approach. But their true goal is to set policy permanently, he said.
————————————————————————————————

This is the most important point he made. This an an argument you cannot lose in any debate.

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dublinthewagons
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:17am
Ducan Hosie needs to practice his beliefs in Iran. He will find out what dehumanizing really is.

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lgccac
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:14am
The only ones ‘Dehumanizing’ gays are gays. Homosexuality is a sin and an abomination to God.

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- claymoremacm
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:43am
  Period!
  
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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:47am
  According to bronze age goat herders. Sorry, not everyone believes your fairy tales are true.
  
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- DIR
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:27am
  @ENCINOIDIOT.
  
  Do you want to know the truth, which isn’t on your side. The reason why being gay isn’t acceptable to ‘God,’ as are most things that aren’t acceptable. because it can be seriously unhealthy, not to mention unnatural. Killing someone isn’t acceptable as well One person loving another of the same sex isn’t the ‘sin’. Basically it’s the acts that often goes with it. It’s a little more complicated than that, but to a non believer that should suffice. There are physical consequenced that go with those acts. Talk to a dr who’s not afraid to be polically incorrect and he’ll tell you why homosexuality is a bad idea. But wait, don’t take my word for it. Let someone cornhole you and find out the hard way, it’s a free country.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:00pm
  is pornography legal?
  
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- YouCantExplainThat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 1:33pm
  Which god is that? Because I’m pretty sure Thor and Zeus don’t have a problem with it. Just sayin’
  
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- DIR
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:20pm
  @YOUCANT..
  
  How do you know Thor and Zeus don’t have a problem with it? Just askin. And even if they don’t have a problem with it you should and for obvious reasons, unless you want your o-ring to look like a wind tunel or you want to make someone elses into one, or maybe get or pass on aids or any number of other nasty related illnesses. Personally I don’t care, people who like practicing idiocy is their business. It’s the cheezy sales pitch that gets me.
  
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GuruMeditation
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:11am
Sodomy? Think about it for a minute. Not a good thing. One with a working, healthy brain does not need someone telling them it’s a bad thing either. Even the animals know it.

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00gabooga
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:05am
Engaging in a sexual act with a member of the same sex, and thus ensuring NO POSSIBILITY of reproduction, is more dehumanizing.

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Wyerd_001
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:04am
“My Constitution is a very flexible one,” he said. “There’s nothing in there about abortion. It’s up to the CITIZENS! (emphisis added) … The same with the death penalty.”
This is the reason we are a Demicatic Republic, a government of the PEOPLE, for the PEOPLE, BY THE PEOPLE!

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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:49am
  The majority has no right to defines the rights of any minority group.
  
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- Max jones
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 3:48pm
  Encinom…You know you screwed the pooch on that one…..In this pseudo republic the minorities all get away with ramming some special interest down the majority’s throat…..
  
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- Walkabout
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:14pm
  Enci
  
  Heteros are not perfect. But is we did not share the same blood supply, if there were no bisexuals acting as vectors, we had separate schools & we did not have to pay the AIDS epidemic, people would not be as upset with gays.
  
  I just checked the CDC. White MSM equals all the new infections among heteros. That is just a portion of MSM. So the infections of 2 to 10% of the population equal that of the other 90%.
  
  Obviously, all things are not equal. Gays have a much higher infection rate than other people. They are doing something wrong. It may be the same thing heteros are doing wrong, but they are doing wrong much more often ( by orders of magnitude).
  
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soybomb315_II
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:54am
“Speaking at Princeton University, Scalia was asked by a gay student why he equates laws banning sodomy with those barring bestiality and murder.

“I don’t think it’s necessary, but I think it’s effective,” Scalia said, adding that legislative bodies can ban what they believe to be immoral.”

So Scalia thinks the government should make homosexuality illegal??? That is very surprising coming from a supposed strict Constitutionalist….

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- John WIS.
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:10am
  It already is.
  
  Illegal…unnatural……an abomination……a sin.
  
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- YAHSHUARULES
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:15am
  I have said it before and I will say it again the Communists wanted to use homosexual acceptance as a way of degrading and corrupting America along with acceptance of pornography. The left understands what made us great as a nation but they don’t want it – they rot and corrupt every decent thing. Marx hated God and Capitalism and so the attack is always against the biblical family and Judeo/Christian values.
  
  Our Founders were moral decent people and for the most part BIBLE believing Christians. Adams said that only a moral people was suitable for a Republic Representative form of government – freedom without morality destroys. Our freedoms have been used by those who hate what America was to destroy us. I doubt if our Founders could have envisioned an America as vile and corrupt as it is today. This country was started by people who loved God and wanted the freedom to worship away from a tyrant king. Their idea of freedom of speech was about political speech – not using it to keep pushing for more and more filth. The first bible printed in this country was printed by Congress. The establishment clause was turned on its head by an activist supreme court. This is not the America the Founders envisioned. We were great because we were good…
  
  The agenda of the left is to create an America so corrupt it stinks and to drive this culture in a direction designed to destroy it. If you don’t know all this you need to find out!
  https://vimeo.com/52009124
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:19am
  great – so when can we start rounding up gay people and putting them in jail?
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:20am
  His point is; there is nothing in the constitution that permits or prohibits homosexual behavior. Likewise there is nothing in the constitution that deals with murder, beastiality, abortion, adultery, lying, or cheating. It is left up to the states and, thereby, the people of that state to enact moral laws. Read the 10th amendment. Prior to the 13 colonies approving the constitution, they insisted on the first 10 amendments (Bill of Rights) that pertained to rights of individuals and states. They were extremely fearful of the concentrated power of a centeral government dictating to the states. That is being a strict constitutionalist.
  
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- nurseheidi
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:29am
  No, Scalia is saying it is up to the voters of a State to determine. You know small, local decisions that empiwer citizens. ..not edicts by Federal Kings.
  
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- Luke21
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:32am
  @SOYBOM,
  
  Well said… & completely dishonest! He said it is up to the states to decide. Murder, a crime in all 50 states, is a STATE crime. There is no federal crime against murder (yet there is a federal “protection” of abortion “rights” – sick, indeed).
  
  Using your logic, it is equally wrong to be offended by pedo philia. After all, you “were born that way”; “Its in your DNA”; you “have civil rights”; “the 9th amendment protects it”; you’ve “always been attracted to thus”…
  
  You pervert the meaning of words; you call evil “good” & good “evil”. In the end, God is not mocked. You will reap what you sow.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:57am
  WRONG – nowhere in this article does Scalia distinguish between federal and state laws. Also, isn’t murder a federal crime? Why is scalia comparing homosexuality laws with murder laws?
  
  From a Constitutional perspective, i dont think it is Constitutional for a state to jail someone for being gay – that is not equal protection.
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:01am
  @Luke21
  
  “Using your logic, it is equally wrong to be offended by pedo philia.”
  
  Using YOUR logic, it is wrong to be offended by rape. Straight men want to have sex with women… so they should. The women shouldn’t get offended and neither should we, right? It’s in their DNA. They were born that way. You’re all for rape, right?
  
  … oh wait. There’s this thing called “consent.” Children cannot legally consent to sexual relations with adults so any sexual action taken against them is illegal.
  
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- Luke21
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:14am
  @Locked
  
  Really? Do children consent to be taught “sex education” at ever younger ages? Do societies continue to re-define ages of consent? By the way, I don’t consent to the redefinition of marriage. So by your logic – it shouldn’t happen. Wake up.
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:19am
  @ SOYBOMB; Murder is not a Federal crime. It is a state crime. A case of murder is not heard by a federal judge, it is heard by a state judge in a state court. The only time federal judges get involved is on appeals, not the original case. Secondly, Judge Scalia is a sitting US Supreme Court judge. When he talks, he brings the perspective of federal law (constitution) and the flexibility of it in regards to deferring to state laws. Finally, you are correct in stating it is not constitutional to jail gays. State laws do not allow for it and the US Constitution says nothing for or against it. However, equal protection (14th Amendment) does not apply to this. It was passed in the post Civil War era to ensure blacks were protected equally under the current state, not federal, laws.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:30am
  No matter who is correct, ask yourself this question….
  
  Is it a good idea for a state government to start jailing homosexuals? Do you realize it is a victimless crime? Do you realize that police will have to investigate what happens in someone’s bedroom in order to obtain proof? Do you want the government investigating people’s sexual activity?
  
  This argument makes absolutely ZERO sense from a atheist or christian standpoint….It only makes sense from a jihadist standpoint. In Jesus day, the prostitutes walked the street and Jesus did not say they were to be arrested by local or Rome authorities….
  
  If such a law were to be enacted – our entire society would collapse due to lack of privacy and unrestricted local and federal government – is that what you want?
  
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- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:49am
  Andrew Wilkow did say that if you push to give government the power to regulate morality, don’t be surprised if that power is turned against you once someone from the other side gets in office. That should be the best reason to keep the social issues at the community/grassroots level.
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:11am
  @ SOYBOMB; You stated, “If such a law were to be enacted – our entire society would collapse due to lack of privacy and unrestricted local and federal government – is that what you want?” These laws were enacted very early in our country and we did not collapse. In fact, we prospered. The sodomy laws were overturn in the late 20th century. Looking at history, I would say we are on the decline. What I want is for marriage to remain between a man and a woman with the roots in the Judeo/Christian church. I do not care what is done in private, but do not force me or my church to celebrate the marriage of gays. Leave our sacred ceremonies to ourselves. You have no right to them.
  
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- Locked
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 10:18am
  @Luke21
  
  “Really?”
  
  You made the argument that “if it’s in their nature, we should allow paedophilia. It’s in their DNA!” How is that different from saying the same about rape? In both cases you don’t have consent from both parties. You’re infringing upon the rights of others. I don’t know if you never thought about this before, or just refuse to think of it, but your example is a bunch of hooey.
  
  “Do societies continue to re-define ages of consent?”
  
  Sure. It used to be 16 in the US. In Biblical times there was no such thing. Heck, Mary was impregnated at 13. Do you think God is a pedophile, or do you accept that “definitions” change over time? In the Old Testament, monogamy was rare and polygamy was the traditional marriage type. That’s changed too.
  
  In the time of Jesus, divorce was a sin in almost all cases, and remarriage was ALWAYS considered adultery. Nowadays 50% of new marriages end in divorce, and most divorcees will eventually remarry. Jesus said it’s adultery, but our society allows it.
  
  You can be offended all you want. If you think that your personal definition of marriage not aligning with society’s is equivalent to rape… well, you’ve got bigger psychological issues to deal with before you get started dictating other peoples’ theological ones.
  
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- encinom
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:02am
  @MarineBrat
  
  You are confused. First there are Federal Murder statutes, if it happens on Federal lands, on high seas, agaisnt agents of the Federal Government, etc. There are no common law crimes, all crimes at the State or Federal level are via statute.
  
  Second the Fourteenth Amendment did not have an expiration date, nor is there anything within the language of the Amendment that limits its scope. The Fourteenth Amendment incorporation the Bills of Rights unto the states, ensuring that the States can not infringe upon rights the civil rights of the citizens. What good is the freedom of the Press if a State can criminalize newspapers for printing unfavorable articles or jail members of a religion with no restraint from the 1st Amendment.
  
  We are also a republic for another reason, the civil rights of an individual are not up for popular votes. The Majority has no right to vote to infringe upon the rights of any minority group. Homosexuals are owed equal protection under law, just like the african american school children in Arkansa.
  
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- Luke21
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:16pm
  @Locked,
  
  Since my last question was too hard for you to answer, how about this one:
  
  Do aborted babies consent to their murder? (Its a rhetorical question)
  
  You don’t have a problem murdering them in the name of choice. I’m kinda sure you violate not only their “civil” rights, but their constitutional rights, & more importantly God given rights too.
  
  So, there is a reasoned equality in my statement (40 yrs hs was not groovy, & 30 yrs ago no one would be seriously entertaining the redefinition of marriage let alone actual same sex marriages). Its just a simple matter of time before your like minded go there. Because the heart of man is desperately wicked & deceitful above all things… 2 Chronicles 17:11
  
  You will reap what you sew, for God will not be mocked.
  
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FreeAmerica2013
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:53am
Scalia is right. If we do not protect and defend moral grounding in our laws, then what will guide our laws? If we take morality out of the equation, then what would stop civil rights activists from claiming it’s our right to murder another human being or steal from another person or lie on the witness stand? They’ve already done it with abortion and many have tried to do it with euthanasia. The majority of Americans believe in Christ, yet civil rights activists are at war with Christianity. Why? Because Christianity teaches the morals many of our laws are based on. The Supreme Court has already done enough damage to morality reflected in our laws, most notably Roe v Wade. Activist justices who have immorally and wrongly interpreted the Constitution are responsible for the pre-meditated murder of over 50 million human beings. Our country was founded on CHRISTIAN MORALS AND PRINCIPLES and evil people are doing everything they can to erase those morals and principles! The ONLY reason God has blessed America as He has is because America stood for Christian, godly morals and principles. He is lifting His blessings and protection of America as America turns her back on God. God destroyed cities because of the practice of homosexuality and Jesus Christ PROMISED IT WOULD HAPPEN AGAIN. The fastest path to America’s complete demise is to condone and legalize that which God hates. He doesn’t hate the sinner. He hates sin. He will destroy America if we don’t stop this!

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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:00am
  “If we do not protect and defend moral grounding in our laws, then what will guide our laws?”
  
  ummmmm – the Constitution?
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:48am
  @ SOYBOMB; the constitution is designed to establish a functioning central government. The wisdom of the founders was to not get the central government involved in the decisions of the people within individual states. The constitution establishes individual rights and leaves to the states and the people of the states to enact the laws they deem appropriate for their state to function in a lawful society. The “laws” within the constitution dictating to states and individuals did not turn out to good; ie the 18th and 21st amendments.
  
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- Luke21
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:59am
  @Soybom
  
  To you & those likeminded, Samuel Adams said, “If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
  
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- Luke21
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:07am
  @Soybom
  You have to yield to the authority of the constitution for it to be of any value. Morphing the meaning of it to fit whatever your particular whim, protects no one & means you acquiesce to the authority of those who rule over you & interpret it to their liking.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:23am
  our laws should be decided based on the Constitution – pure and simple. To argue otherwise makes you a progressive. Nowhere in this article does Scalia distinguish between federal and state powers
  
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- MarineBrat
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:36am
  @ SOYBOMB; Scalia was quoted, “My Constitution is a very flexible one,” he said. “There’s nothing in there about abortion. It’s up to the citizens. … The same with the death penalty.” He is disguinishing between Federal and State laws. Concerning Federal and State powers, his comment about flexibility is derived from the 10th amendment which states, “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.” Ultimately it is up to the people within the states to enact moral laws based on the fact that the Constitution does not address what is moral or immoral!
  
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- Nepenthe
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 9:58am
  “If we do not protect and defend moral grounding in our laws, then what will guide our laws? ”
  
  So it should then be illegal to charge interest on a low income person struggling to pay back their loan? After all, that is quite immoral to do, and something that the Old Testament addresses.
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:36am
  i think it is immoral to cheat on your wife or be a bad dad – but what business is it of the government?
  
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nilo
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:49am
Sin is sin, period! It will never be anything different in the sight and judgment of God. Men may excuse sin, but God will not. America will suffer the devistating consequences of sin, regardless of what judges, or people, or high courts decide. We are not immune from God’s judgment on nations
– which is in my mind, is beginning to unfold as America suffers more and more in everythling that is now happening to us. We are clearly headed to oblivion, just like the nations before us who have turned their back on God. Sin is the transgression of Gods Law (1 John 3:4), and like Israel was warned; “…… be sure your sin will find you out.”.(Numbers 32:23) It has, and the price will be great.

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- dublinthewagons
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:02am
  God has the divine right. To destroy evil as he sees fit. It is commng
  
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- FreeAmerica2013
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 8:23am
  Amen Nilo. God has lifted His blessings on and protection of America and will continue to do so as America continues to turn her back on Him. We will become the next Sodom & Gomorrah. America, the nation, has already condoned the pre-meditated murder of millions of God’s children, God’s miracle of life. He will no longer bless us with procreation since we are throwing His gift of life in his face and saying “no thanks.” Evil people have been and are in positions of power in America and are destroying this nation from the inside out. Christians must re-educate, or in some cases educate for the first time other Americans and must inspire Americans to speak out, protest, act to change things NOW or we will lose this spiritual battle. That is what this is, it’s a spiritual battle between good and evil. This spiritual battle MUST be recognized and Christians, Jews, Catholics MUST fight on God’s side. He gave us life; He can take life away. Christ confirmed God would, again, destroy those who practice sodomy (homosexuality). How can anyone claiming to be a Christian not understand this? Is it because most who call themselves Christians have never read and/or understand the Bible? God and Jesus were clear, sodomy (homosexuality) is an abomination (reviled, evil, a perversion of what God created, a sin against nature). God will not tolerate it and will destroy Sodomites just as He did before. But he didn’t just destroy Sodomites; He destroyed entire cities of Sodom
  
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- soybomb315_II
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:53am
  good thing government does not make sin illegal – or 100% of the population would be in jail right now
  
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dublinthewagons
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:37am
Scalia’s writings do not dehumanize gays. They do it themselves.

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willingtoupe
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:35am
Identities based on sex acts…

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- charles116
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 11:35am
  Gays do not do ANYTHING straights don’t do.
  
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- Fubared
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 12:50pm
  Ah, so you would be able to blather on had your parents been same sex.
  
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- TMOverbeck
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 4:20pm
  Charles: Exactly. I find it amusing that some people seemingly assume only gay men do the sodomy thing.
  
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- Walkabout
  Posted on December 11, 2012 at 5:53pm
  charles116
  Gays do not do ANYTHING straights don’t do.
  ***
  Gays do stupid sex acts more often. Gays are less monogamous. Gay sex has a much higher rate of disease transmission.
  
  If the whole population acted on average like the gay population did on average, the AIDS epidemic would be 10 times worse.
  
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dublinthewagons
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:34am
As the morals of a country degenerate, so goes they country.
Ducan Hosie is totally out of his league.

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Grasshopper42
Posted on December 11, 2012 at 7:22am
Smart man.

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