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Faith

Five Insights From Faith Leaders on ‘Evil’ & ‘Free Will’ in Light of the Newtown Shooting Massacre

Dec. 25, 2012 3:30pm Billy Hallowell

In the wake of the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting, there are still many questions being asked among startled and grieving Americans. One of the most pertinent, of course, surrounds evil and the reasons a loving God would allow such a horrific massacre to take place — especially one that took the lives of so many innocent children.

Today, we’re looking at some of the insights that faith leaders have had about the very real presence of evil in our world. The difficult subject is frequently tackled by preachers, rabbis and other religious leaders, but questions tend to intensify following tragedy. So, we’ve assembled five of the most interesting recent responses and commentaries. Here they are:

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Pastor Rick Warren: “Free Will Is a Blessing & Curse”

First, there’s Rick Warren, the pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forrest, Calif. In his view, evil is sometimes the unfortunate result of free will — the ability that God has given human beings to make decisions for themselves. In freedom, Warren argues, pain and poor decision-making may arise, thus leading to occasional evil that can be inflicted upon others.

In speaking on-air with Fox News’ Neil Cavuto last week, he said:

“Our greatest blessing is our greatest curse. God could have made us puppets, where none of us did anything wrong, we prayed all of the time, we always did what’s right. But God wanted us to choose to love Him, and in giving us this choice, I often make bad choices, and so do other people, in fact everyone does – the Bible calls it sin. Because of that, the world is broken.”

Faith Leaders Weigh in on Evil in Light of the Newtown Shooting Massacre

Pastor Rick Warren speaks at The Elton John AIDS Foundation and UNAIDS breakfast at the Russell Senate Office Building on July 24, 2012 in Washington, DC. Credit: Getty Images North America

As for mourning and grieving in the wake of tragedy, “The Purpose-Driven Life” author also had some other important insights:

“The deeper the grief, the fewer words are needed. A lot of folks are looking for wisdom, or the right word, and are asking ‘what do you say?’ – but there is nothing to say. You just need to be there. You need to show up. And when people are grieving, they don’t need a lecture, and they don’t need an explanation. Explanations don’t comfort us.”

“What comforts us is the presence of others, the presence of God, and the first thing we have to do is we have to learn how to release our grief and we need to do that right now.”

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Pastor Doug Posey: “The Slaughter of Innocence”

Pastor Doug Posey of Living Oaks Community Church in Newbury Park, Calif., reflected upon the tragedy, like Warren, by discussing free will and its prime role in yielding good and evil.

“That’s the big question…Where was God in all of this?” Posey said, according to the Ventura County Star. “God has given us free will, and when there is free will there has to be a choice between good and evil…One day he will do away with all evil, but until he does, evil will happen.”

Mourners embrace following funeral services for Connecticut elementary shooting victim Emilie Parker, Saturday, Dec. 22, 2012, at The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, in Ogden, Utah. Emilie, 6, whose family has Ogden roots, was one of 20 children and six adult victims killed in a Dec. 14 mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Conn. Credit: AP

The preacher also mentioned a Bible story that is capturing quite a bit of attention following the Sandy Hook shooting — King Herod and his “slaughter of innocence.”

“When the wise men came looking for Jesus, they wound up going to Bethlehem. When Herod found out, he had all the boys killed who were 2 years old and under,” he said. “There is and always will be loss associated with Christmastime. Herod was an evil guy, and he had free will, just like this shooter.”

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Rabbi Aryeh Spero: ‘God Mostly Does Not Interfere’

Rabbi Aryeh Spero, president of Caucus For America and the author of “Push Back: Reclaiming the American Judeo-Christian Spirit”, also contends that God affords human beings free will and the power for personal decision-making.

“So as to allow us continued free will and, more or less, control our own destiny, God mostly does not interfere,” he recently told TheBlaze. “We learn lessons and grow, as individuals and as a society, by living with the results of what we do and don’t do.”

And unfortunately, these “results” and negative choices can be monumentally damaging. Notice, though, that the rabbi said that God “mostly” leaves free will to its own devices. Spero also noted, though, that at times God does intervene but that the reasons for this protection are a “mystery.”

Crosses bearing the names of the Newtown shooting victims are displayed in the Sandy Hook village of Newtown, Conn., Saturday, Dec. 22, 2012. The funerals for the victims of the school shooting are wrapping up after a wrenching week of farewells. Twenty children and six adults were killed at Sandy Hook Elementary School on Dec. 14. Adam Lanza, the lone gunman, killed his mother before going on the rampage and then committed suicide. Credit: AP

“Occasionally God spares us from impending doom, and sometimes He even performs the extraordinary in our behalf,” he added. Moses wanted to know precisely this: What is God’s yardstick? But it is not mathematics; and man, not being God, does not know all the whys and whats of God.”

Spero believes that pain is a part of life and the human condition and that, regardless of how hard we seek out an answer, obtaining a complete one will never be possible. Some people are certainly uncomfortable with this notion — not knowing why an all-loving God would permit such intense horror.

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Pastor Miles McPherson: “Pray Against Evil”

In a reflective article published in the North County Times, Pastor Miles McPherson of the Rock Church in San Diego, Calif., addressed Sandy Hook, by presenting a dialogue he imagines having with God. Here’s a portion of that discussion:

Whenever tragedies like this happen, everyone wants to know, “Where was God when all of this took place? If God is so loving and good, how could He have allowed something like this to happen?”

I have a suggestion: Why don’t you ask God?

He might answer:

“I’m so happy you have looked to me in prayer expecting comfort, wisdom and protection. But what I want to know is, why did you wait until after the tragedy to pray to me? If I am the first person you pray to when tragedy strikes, why are there so many controls exerted by your culture to prevent my little ones from learning about me?

“If you truly believe prayer can bring hope, why don’t you focus on teaching my little ones to pray against evil in advance of tragedy?

Pastor Miles McPherson (Photo Credit: MilesMcPherson.com)

The piece goes on to show God lamenting that both he and guns have been banned from schools, while also providing what McPherson assumes the Lord would say to those questioning why he didn’t step in to prevent the attack:

“My heart breaks for these little ones and their families more than you can imagine, and in the end, justice will be served. That’s why it is especially offensive to me that some of you would go so far as to blame me for not stopping this evil act. I did not create you as robots, but have given all of you the same freedom to choose to obey me or not. Murderers obviously choose not to obey me, but what about you? The freedom you are exercising to blame me for these killings is the same freedom people abuse when they commit a crime.”

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Pastor Joel Osteen: “God Is Good & God Is for Us”

Another familiar face in the American evangelical scene is Joel Osteen. The preacher, like Warren, appeared in media following the tragic shooting, speaking out about the need to comfort those in need, while also addressing the presence of evil.

“God gave us all our own free will. He gives us freedom of choice, He didn’t make us his robots,” Osteen recently told “Today’s” Matt Lauer. ”Unfortunately, some people choose to do evil, and we don’t always understand it, but I still believe that God is good and God is for us, but He doesn’t make us do what’s right.”

Osteen reiterated the importance of faith in the face of evil and tragedy: Watch his comments, below.

–

Related:

Why Does God Allow Pain and Suffering?

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Comments (104)

athiest-infedel
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:32pm
Really, if no god would stop this then why would you think any prayers would have any affect on anything accept sweaty hands. No worship of any troll that would allow that crap to happen if he could stop it.

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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:56pm
  What do you care about God? You don’t believe. Troll elsewhere….
  
  Report this comment
- taethne
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:13pm
  If you are truly an atheist then why would you even waste your time here on this article? I mean if you seriously do not believe in God then why even come to this article to read it much less try to insult those who do believe? Are you trying to convince us, or yourself?
  I always wonder why atheists pass value judgements on a God that they say does not exist. If God does not exist then why do you care one rip about Him or what any person says about Him? Move on to something more important in your life.
  According to atheist I have known, He is simply an invention of someone’s imagination. So why? If I hear of someone having an imaginary friend I could care less about them, cause I believe they do not exist. So I go on, no big deal. No need to insult their imaginary friend cause I do not believe he exist and therefore cannot know anything about him. He is imaginary.
  But somehow this imaginary God who does exist, you call a “troll”? Can you name something that does not exist? Then you say no worship on a God who would allow this? But He does not exist to you, therefore He could not have allowed it, and therefore He cannot be worshiped or blamed?
  Very strange for you to pay so much attention to something you believe does not exist.
  
  Report this comment
- Pastor Melissa
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:16pm
  When God did step in it was with plagues and floods. We weep for the actions of the few and rejoice God gives us another chance at redemption. That isn’t for you, that is for all those people who need hope after your comment.
  
  Report this comment
- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:18pm
  1776, this isn’t a dedicated christian site. He has the right to be here as much as you.
  
  Report this comment
- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:16pm
  @DEV
  
  IT Ain’t a dedicate troll site!
  
  Report this comment
- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:20pm
  @DEAVON
  
  If all you are here to do is troll, then the trolls will be removed. Check out the absence of some of our finer trolls that used to frequent the Blaze. Check it out now,
  
  Report this comment
- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:43pm
  Who gets to decide what is “troll” posting? Maybe Atheist-Infedel is just speaking his mind. A First Ammendment thing.
  
  I don’t agree with many of the christian posts, and even though there are more of them, that doesn’t make them any more valid than mine. I’m just concerned that “you’re a troll” is just a step away from denying the First Ammendment. Don’t like what is said, move on.
  
  Report this comment
- Dismayed Veteran
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 3:07pm
  I have a set of personal beliefs which are quite simple. God gave me my soul, my free will and my physical body. With free will, I can chose what I do with my soul and my body.
  
  I have chosen to try to do good. Sometimes I fail. Some of those failures can’t be corrected.
  
  Finally, I believe that athiests who make a point of denigrating the religious are really afraid and the only way to deal with that fear is to scorn that which is feared.
  
  Report this comment
- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 3:24pm
  Dismayed, . . . I highly doubt it is a “fear” thing with most atheists. Often times, it is an “I can’t believe they actually believe this stuff”, and an attempt to get people to see reason. For most of them [if not all], the fantastical parts of christian doctrine and biblical accounts are nothing more than fairytales. Now, before you get upset at me and start throwing stones, . . . it IS a legitimate concern. It can be said [by the atheist], “if they believe this, they are susceptible to believing other “crazy things”. The most important part about this is, . . . though you see it as “denigration”, it is no different than how you see the muslim faith and how “they are wrong and often dangerous”. Or how you may feel about those who TRULY believe in the Fae world. I’m sure you aren’t “afraid of that world”, right?
  
  It is just a matter of pride that christians MUST assume that they ARE the only “right religion”, and [therefore] anyone who goes against it is “in fear of the truth of god and such, lies about the truth so they aren’t held accountable”. It is a misinterpretation, at best.
  
  Report this comment
- Eternal
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 5:19pm
  Must suck to be so depressed to live with no hope and lashing out at that which is good such as prayer. You have no clue of what God is and does.
  
  Report this comment
- Greenwood
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 10:28pm
  @ATHIEST…………Ecclesiastes 9:11 returned to see under the sun that the swift do not have the race, nor the mighty ones the battle, nor do the wise also have the food, nor do the understanding ones also have the riches, nor do even those having knowledge have the favor; because time and unforeseen occurrence befall them all. TIME and UNFORESEEN OCCURRENCE
  
  Report this comment
- vaman
  Posted on December 27, 2012 at 1:43pm
  Hello, I am god. I can do everything and I know everything. I am testing you all the time with free will to see what you’ll do. Although I already know in advance what you will do. And although I created you and I know what you will do, I will still punish you for what you will do, although all of it is my plan. I knew some nut was going to blast little kids, but I was testing the shooter and he failed. I’m sorry all of those kids had to die, but as god there was nothing I could do.
  
  Report this comment
- mcsledge
  Posted on December 28, 2012 at 2:27pm
  Life is but a probationary state in the eternities to determine who will advance and return to the presence of the Father and become like Him. Those who choose evil will receive their punishment. Those who choose good will receive their reward. And those who don’t believe, well…..why would you care?
  
  Hint: Returning to the Father requires desire, action and perserverance to the end. He who does nothing will not make it.
  
  Report this comment
nocommie
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:20pm
Humans do have predators as do all creatures on earth.No one is exempt. The lesson to be learned form this.Good people should carry guns to protect themselves from the predators,to eliminate the predators.Only the strongest and the smartest survive in nature.In time we can eliminate most of the threat or at least drive them back into hiding.They seem to rise with liberalism.

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nocommie
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:11pm
One thing for sure,we are all not alike.To live as a productive member of society one has to accept the rules and some people cant! Psychopath,sociopath,bipolar,anti social disorder are all just names.It’s my personal belief that these people are a species.They are here,they are real,they have always been here and they will always be here.This is the problem.It happens again and again and will continue to happen.If they cant find a gun,they will stab you,if they cant find a knife,they will beat you.They wont stop until they kill.This goes beyond free will as something in the D.N.A.is different.God does step in from time to time and given the fact that nothing in this wonderful universe can be explained as fact,it’s all just theory.

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vaman
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 11:32am
One common factor = god is never to blame. Always the fault of free will or something else. There is no god, but if there is he/she is totally responsible for all actions, even the massacre of small children. Your god butchered defenseless children.

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- DoGooder
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:41pm
  Always someone elese’s fault isn’t it. Very small minded of you. Very supperficial. Try to think on a deeper level…
  
  Report this comment
- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:57pm
  A liberal is responsible for their deaths.
  
  Report this comment
- mycomet123
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 5:26pm
  VAMAN, God (whom I know you don’t believe in, doesn’t matter, God still loves you even though you don’t believe) gives all His creatures free will so they can choose to love Him freely. What you stated is partly right. God does ALLOW all things to happen, good & bad. WHY does He allow evil? For a greater good. Only God knows the infinite amount of souls He will draw closer to Him due to this tragedy in Newtown.
  
  Report this comment
Glennda
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 11:14am
How conveeeeeeeeeenient.

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LBRTYorDTH
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 11:02am
My article about the people’s voices being ignored at the Ellenville board meeting and the American politician’s tyrannical shredding of the Constitution.
A consensus of 29 speakers and a total of 99 attendees argued against the mayor’s proposed gun ban and the Mayor, in a news interview after the meeting, went right back to talking about his ban as if we didn’t exist.
I titled it:
Our Right to Live FREE of Tyranny -DID NOT- End With The Defeat of The British.
Hope you like it.
Feel free to use any part you’d like if your are pro-Constitution and pro-2nd Amendent and you think it will help to wrest America back from the tyrants on either side of the aisle.
Any pro-gun control and or anti-2nd Amendment dirtbags are not permitted to use any of it.
http://wp.me/p2RKc5-3F

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Knot4u2no
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 10:12am
If people are going to preach and teach about Evil, seems that the first step would be to define it. The following link is to a PDF file:

PROFILING EVIL … Defining Evil in operational terms,
http://www.braceanalysis.com/downloads/12.24.11%20Profiling%20EVIL%20article.pdf

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- Knot4u2no
  Posted on December 27, 2012 at 8:38am
  Considering Evil and related free will, the following link is to a PDF file profiling Satan’s character as depicted in the King James Version of the Bible:
  
  http://www.braceanalysis.com/downloads/12.24.11%20Satan%20BRACE%20Character%20Proifle.pdf
  
  Report this comment
DeavonReye
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 9:28am
We must look at this topic with reason. Bad things happen because people are either out of their minds, or ruled by a fit of emotion. Sandy Hook was a result of someone out of their mind. Crazy. And steps weren’t taken [in light of this] to keep him from doing something stupid. There was no “deeper meaning” behind it. It was just a tragic random event. That’s it.

As for “free will” and “evil”, . . . I wonder why people are so up on “free will” and us “not being robots”, . . . yet that is exactly how you will be in the christain heaven [for the sake of argument here, it all exists as described by christianity]. You cannot be who you are on earth, and be sinless in heaven. Humans can’t help themselves. And it doesn’t take “the devil on your shoulder” to act wrongly! Humans who will never again act LIKE humans [in heaven] will no longer be who they are here, and will basically BE like “robots”. Else, you will not like the heaven you’ll be in where you run the risk of “sinning” at any time, for an eternity, and facing that potential judgement [being imperfect, thus not fit for heaven].

Back to reality. Life and death [even horrific death] are a part of our existence. The best we can do is live good and decent lives while we can and to stop violence if we can.

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- TROONORTH
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 10:24am
  Agreed DEAVONREYE on most points.
  
  But putting all the religious mumbo-jumbo aside for a minute, there is one person in this tragedy who is truly responsible; the shooter’s Mother. She knew he was mentally disturbed. She knew he had violent tendencies. She knew he was getting worse. She warned people about his dangerous condition. And yet she chose to have guns in the house. She stored them, if stored at all, in such a manner that he had easy access to them. She taught him how to shoot. She provided the tools and he finished the job.
  
  This is not a story about violence in America. It is not a story about the dangers of guns or gun control. It is a story about a stupid person who knowingly provided access to guns to a disturbed and violent person. Legally required, safe. secure storage of guns would have stopped this and most of the other school and theatre shootings without gun control or seizure.
  
  Report this comment
- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 10:38am
  Perhaps I wasn’t clear on this. Yes, the main point is the mother who should have KNOWN that her son was a high risk and should have kept her stuff either in a case that only SHE had the combination to, or in the safe of a friend or family member. This tragedy would most likely not have happened if she had. Very sad.
  
  Report this comment
- mandmsgirl
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:35pm
  @deavonreye
  So..as I understand you, making rational, moral and correct decisions makes you a robot. We will be making decisions in heaven also, God says He will give us the ability to judge, we will just have the knowledge to make the correct decisions, and the desire to, same as we do here on earh, is that robotic?
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 27, 2012 at 10:00am
  Are you entirely sinless now? Do you always do good in every decision you make? If so, then you might make it in your heaven.
  
  Report this comment
sbenard
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:14am
After the Sandy Hook tragedy, I was reminded of this beautiful message in song:
http://youtu.be/tI4jb-Aca9M
Alfie Boe, the great Scottish tenor, sings “Bring Him Home” from Les Miserables. The song is a prayer for protection.

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sbenard
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 6:46am
Great wisdom in those quotes.

My own religious tradition is harmonious with all of the above, with this addition.

We are taught that the REASON Satan was cast out of Heaven, and there was a war, was that he proposed a plan to save EVERYONE, but do it through compulsion rather than persuasion. He would have denied us all free will, using force, almost certainly through GOVERNMENT, rather than allowing us free will to choose.

For this reason, every time I see do-gooders who want to deny us our freedom (eg., by destroying our 2nd Amendment rights, redistribution of the fruits of one person’s labor to another through coercion, or the “green” tyranny movement), I know instantly that they are getting their inspiration from the “dark side of the force”. That’s Satan’s plan!

To God, choice is so critical to His plan that he allows us that choice so that He can then hold us accountable for those choices. The result of those choices will determine our reward (or punishment) following the final Judgment.

Choose wisely! It matters!

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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 9:57am
  Then this god should make a personal anouncement, or it isn’t a true/valid “choice”. Here’s what I know.
  
  1. I see the natural world. I am made aware of it down to the sub-atomic either through my own understanding, or the understanding of others with knowledge [experts] in their field of study. The experimentations they have done, and the peer review afterwards. These are facts.
  
  2. Some ancient superstitious writings were created by various belief groups. A few became more dominant, based upon power. They all claim to be right, but non can prove it with any real credibility. People believe them to be true and fight with each other as per “who is right”.
  
  You tell me what “choice” I have. I tell you, there IS no “choice”. There is only what is beneficially evident, thus #1 [above]. If my “free will” is based upon the above two, then the only “will” I can accept is that which IS more true. Again, #1.
  
  You can read my post [below] about the idea of “free will”.
  
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- Pontiaku
  Posted on December 27, 2012 at 10:38am
  Oh no, someone got crass with you. Boo freak’n hoo. You just further reinforce my comment. You and I don’t have it nearly as bad today as those in the past that had more belief in magical sky daddies than people today.
  
  Andrew Kehoe
  Murdered 43 in 1927 (38 were children)
  He was Roman Catholic yet THIS was somehow the result of “years of erosion”…
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Kehoe
  
  Report this comment
HOOT_OWL
Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:10am
. I’m so sick of reading Atheist commenting about ‘it Gods fault‘.

Atheist it called Cause and effect ..! CAUSE AND EFFECT…!

It just didn’t happened over night.

What we are witnessing the EFFECT now, from years of erosion .

From the CAUSE of a societal acceptance of every perversion know to man .

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- YAHSHUARULES
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:27am
  You got that right. Our enemies can see our morality is our greatest strength. Freedom – Free Enterprise is fruit on the Tree of Morality. Marx was at war with God, sought to dethrone god and deify man. Family falls apart, church looses influence and a free people’s government collapses. The Ideas that made America great and unique came straight out of the bible.
  Founders understood this principle and so do our enemies.
  “Out Constitution was made for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other” John Adams
  
  Left plans and goals are at WAR with God: a moral people who believe their rights come from God would never want nor need what they are selling and they know it. Stalin said “If I could control Hollywood, I could rule the world.” Lenin founder of Soviet Union said “Give me four years to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted.” John Dewey went to Russia and influenced education to socialize child to be a tool of the state – to dumb down. not teach to critically think. Once there is control of teacher’s unions, education colleges this becomes self perpetuating you remake the country in the schools rather then by throwing bombs.
  
  Less then 10% of children in a poll believe in absolute right and wrong. There is so much filth and depravity it is just background noise. So much of what is acceptable today would horrify our Founders that we have sunk so low:
  https://vimeo.com/520091
  
  Report this comment
- Pontiaku
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:40am
  [What we are witnessing the EFFECT now, from years of erosion.]
  Lol yeah. Because a long history of god-fearing millions dying (even in a single year) due to wars, genocide, plague, famine, etc etc wasn’t worse than you sitting comfy in your central heated & cooled home pounding your stupidity out on your keyboard.
  
  Report this comment
- sbenard
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:42am
  @Pontiaku
  Funny! I thought the same of Pontiaku’s pontificating! Crass is the only description that matches the arrogance expressed in that comment.
  
  Report this comment
JEANNIEMAC
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 10:46pm
There is a painting in which the artist used thousands of dots of color. Up close, all you see are dots. When you move back, a picture starts to appear, until finally there is a full country scene with many people.
We see only the dots. God sees the whole picture. We do not know how events will fit into the picture.

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- vpeva1
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:25am
  Very true but I’d like to add more. There are rules and laws in heaven as there are on Earth and God is bound by them. He CAN NOT take away a persons free agency. A person who disobeys any of these laws/rules ( in this case murder) WILL one day stand before the bar of God and be held accountable and these souls (who were afflicted) will stand against him to plead their case. Since Christ’s atonement wasn’t used here on earth this person will have to suffer even as Christ suffered (so much so that Christ, who was a God himself shook with pain) to pay for the sins he commited. That’s why it is imperative that we always seek forgiveness and try to use our free agency to make good choices as to pass any sufferings from our sins on to Christ ( who takes them willingly) so that we dont have to suffer ourselves. Christ is amazing for He has done and continues to do so much for mankind.
  
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Luisa48
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 9:58pm
Even schools are no longer safe, especially since they kicked God out of the schools. Now parents need to pray for their own kids every morning before they go to school. So you could say it’s the school officials and government who are at fault. And then there are the voters who vote the wrong way. Then…………

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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 9:44am
  You are depicting a petty “god” if it is uncaring about 20 kids JUST because school officials decided to not have any ONE type of religion associated with it [out of respect for other faith beliefs].
  
  Report this comment
txjb
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 9:46pm
Evil is in the world because of the one act in the garden of Eden . Adams wife picked of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil and she and Adam ate of it, that was the fall of mankind . Because of the fall is why we have sickness,murder,wars and the list goes on . God has given satan the privilege of being the god of this world .

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truthranger
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 8:39pm
First of all these people are not “faith leaders.” It is unscriptural to be led by any man or group of men. The preachers of this day are like religious politicians saying whatever is needed to keep the $$$ rolling in.
The truth is that God doesn’t answer to man, and doesn’t have to explain Himself. On one end of the spectrum are those who blame God and there are others who deny God’s existence.
If you are a Spirit-filled Christian you have the Spirit of God living within you. All of things that you say God should do are what you yourselves should be doing. The believer is the body of Christ in reality, not virtually.
Blaming God for the evils of the world is the utmost on copouts. The next time you want to blame God, look in the mirror and repeat “I am the body of Christ.”
The body of Christ is the presence of God upon earth, and must move as His body. The body of Christ has the Holy Spirit as as it’s leader, and not any stuffed shirt preachertician.

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ClemBradshaw
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:38pm
The topic of “free will” needs to be applied to the million plus abortions each year. Even the existence of God is questioned because of the “free will” of this gunman, but the abortion decision of each mother is defended as a right by the abortion supporter. Yes, the school should be a safe place, but womb should be a safe place also.

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- Jenny Lind
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 8:24pm
  You say that as if God didn’t care for the unborn, He does, but each and every one of these women have free agency from God-and they must answer for the decision to destroy life. We could try to outlaw it, but it’s still their decision. The same as any other sin. We make many laws, and they are broken every day, as if we could really change the actions of anyone. By giving women a law that said it was OK, we unleashed the feeling it WAS OK. Women started turning off their consience after all, it was legal, but almost everone I have known who did this, discovered they couldn’t turn off their heart’s. It is theirs to repent and seek forgiveness, but I wonder if their heart’s will ever heal.
  
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nesmond
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:21pm
I wonder if the atheists who decry the murders of the 20 children and six adults at Sandy Hook Elementary School, will also decry the murders of almost 60 million children since Roe v. Wade.

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- mcsledge
  Posted on December 28, 2012 at 2:32pm
  Doubtful. No one who condones or participates in an abortion (save for fear of the mother’s life and incest) can claim to respect life. They can squawk all they want but their value of life is known.
  
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TheCalmOne
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 6:52pm
It is a very valid question to ask why God allowed these poor children to be shot to death. Given that He is omniscient and omnipotent He must have granted to the gunman the right to do this terrible thing. Therefore God Himself is evil, because this is not the kind of thing a “God Of Love” could conceivably do. Or, alternatively, there is no God. Take your pick.

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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:11pm
  There are now some reports that Adam Lanza was a devil worshiper.
  
  The Lord allowed his own son to be crucified to pay the price of your sins. So that you may be saved.
  
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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:17pm
  But what could possibly be the benefit for mankind by allowing these children to be shot to death (if that is your point)?
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:18pm
  @TheCalmone
  Your life is easy and mostly safe here in the USA. Consider the alternatives. The evil that occurs to the innocents abroad. The USA is a Christian nation although many do not want to admit this. Hence we are off today because it is Christmas. Christ and the USA is what is good in the world and the bad guys (Evil, Communists, Satan, Islam) are never going to stop trying to take us down.
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:23pm
  I am not making the point that somehow these childrens deaths “benefit” mankind. God doesn’t work to “benefit” mankind. Mankind works to God’s benefit.
  
  Can you understand that?
  
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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:31pm
  @1776FREEDOMOFSPEECH – I know I’m being a devil’s advocate here, and I don’t mean any personal offense, but with all due respect, you are avoiding my question. You appeared to equate Christ’s crucifixion with the death of these children. Jesus was allowed to be crucified to save us from our sins, but what possible benefit to mankind could there possibly be in allowing these children to be shot?
  
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- Spitfire1938
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:41pm
  These wanton acts of criminality are incredibly diffacult to understand or explain. But God has given every single person in this world ‘Free Will’. Today, more than at any time in history, it’s easy to receive the word of God. And, since you have been gifted with ‘Free Will’ you can listen… or not! It’s totally up to you what you do with your life. Look around you… everyone has, or is, making a choice to listen to Him, or not! You are the ultimate arbiter of your fate… nothing happens by chance. All God can do is tell you he loves you and that he will save you if you simply recognize His love for you. So, it’s your choice to indulge yourself and your every earthly desire; regardless of the morality and eternal consequence of your choices, or you can follow Him. You choose….
  These people chose their own fate!
  
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- revron
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:41pm
  calm,
  This is the strategy of the Devil. If you can’t deny the existence of God, then shed doubt on his character. “If God was powerful and loving, how could this happen?” Satan knows that a diminished God receives diminished worship. Did you watch Iron man 2? Iron man wins against his nemesis and when they talk later on, his adversary treats the defeat like a victory. The reason is because Iron man’s reputation took a beating because he struggled to victory. He said “All you have to do is make God bleed to get people to stop believing in him.”
  
  Maybe theres something else at stake here other than his love or power, like authority. God is a just God and does all things legally. God delegated control of earth to man (Gen. 1:28). Man yielded that control over to Satan through trickery (Gen. 3). Though manipulation was used, man made that decision of his own will.
  When tempting Jesus in the wilderness, Satan told Jesus the earth belonged to him, that it had been given unto him (luke 4). Jesus never contested it.
  
  If God stepped in and took the earth from the Devil by force, Satan displays the deed to the earth If God takes it when the devil has legal claim to men and earth, Satan could accuse God of being unjust.
  
  God needs a legal way in. That’s why Jesus came as a man. Man created the mess, man had to get himself out. Another way God is invited is through the prayer of agreement. but we love evil more than light.
  
  My bible says you’
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:44pm
  @TheCalmone
  God does not exist to benefit mankind.
  These acts were acts of free will on the part of the “actor”. Right now there is much evil taking place all over the world, every act and evil deed imaginable. And most will have no direct benefit to mankind. Did Hitler’s acts benefit mankind? There is no silver bullet to “fix” the problem that led to this tragedy. However, your renewed belief that something good will come of this tragedy is the “faith” that you need to have. The restoration of hope. These families are suffering and some of them are Christian. Worldly I can say the focus is on a solution to protect our kids better and to identify these individuals better and that may lead to the kinds of benefits you are seeking to make sense of it all.
  
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- revron
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:44pm
  We have all been played. God loves you too. Some of these parents will see their children again. The reason they will is because God did not spare us his Son but while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. How can we question the love of one who sacrifices his best for thecalmone?
  
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- jmeister8
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 3:19am
  Calmone, The fact that there isn’t a plume of smoke where the lightening bolt from God came down and blew your sacraligious A** back to the stone age is a testement that He is indeed your mercifull and loving God. Just so you know who your dealing with..,. philippians chapter 2 says in some traslations that Christ thought not equality with God a thing to be held onto. If God told me to leave my plush position as the son of the Almighty to be a sacrificial lamb somewhere I would be the first to resist but Christ left glory to come down to the third planet in a very forgetable corner of the universe. Well if I had to leave at least I would be king of that world but Christ became the lowest. If it were me it would be a regal birth, but Christ was born in a manger with the animals. If it were me at least I would live a long life but Christ lived a short 33 years and was tried and killed an inocent man and even his grave was borrowed. Christ didnt just die on the cross he gave up everything, and he did it for you. Christ was risen after death by the power of God and is seated at the left hand of God the Father, the same God that in Genesis and Job created the foundations of the world with a wave of his hand and the snap of his finger. Here’s some friendly advise, Don’t tug on Supermans cape, Don’t get into a fist fight with Bruce Banner and top of the list you dont want to call someone evil who has the power of the universe and your soul in his hands. Just saying
  
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- jmeister8
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 4:03am
  Now here’s the answer to your question. When sin entered into the world in the garden of eden so did the wheel of evil as I like to call it. The scriptures call this “wheel of evil” the World, the Flesh, and the Devil. The World oppressive governments and empires and regimes. Lifting up mayhem and destruction and cursing and denigrating anything that is of faith. Should I put you in that catagory? Remember it was the romans that put the christians to death in their arenas for sport. Then there is the flesh. That part of humanity that has pride, jealousy and selfishness. Instant self gratification no matter how destructive that gratification is. Without Christ living in our hearts there is no one to govern our passions. Pure chaos and anarchy ensues. Mayhem on a grand scale. Then there is the devil himself. No nothing was good in newtown that day and the fact of the many that lived through it that day is a testement to the mercy of God but the fact that 26 inocent kids died is a testement to the existence of the wheel of evil. The World, a government that says that the president can be protected by a trained guy with a gun but little inocent 1st graders arent allowed to be. No my friend the calamity in Newtown wasn’t do to the fact of a God allowing death and mayhem… but it is the fact that WE have allowed this calamity. A trained, armed security guard could have stopped it before it got started. Don’t blame it on God, blame it on ourselves.
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:25am
  @JMEISTER8
  
  Thanks. You said and explained it best.
  
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jp2feminist
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 5:26pm
And where is the commentary from a Catholic priest? pul-eeezzze! Give me a break!

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- SonOfThunder
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 6:35pm
  Catholicism is a hoax and thier opinion is no better than these others. Osteen and Warren are false prophets of the emergent church. The answer is satan is the god of this age and rules this world and most are blinded by this world and satan. Repent and put your faith in Jesus alone and not in your pope and statues and idol worship.
  
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- Spitfire1938
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:04pm
  Well I concur… however I do remember Glenn having a RC Priest on as a guest. Now, perhaps, since it’s fairly well known that “Traditional” Catholics do not regard Mormons to be Christian, Glenn has become a little ‘hesitant’ in regard to Catholic representation on his show. Regardless… he’s on the side of the “Good Guys”… things will work out.
  
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1776freedomofspeech
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 5:11pm
Do you think these horrible Sandy Hook murders would have been committed if Adam Lanza and his mother had been members of the local Church and part of the local Church Community and the body of Christ?

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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 6:03pm
  Is the absence of Christianity in so many people resulting in these types of acts in our society?
  
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- graceunderfire
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 8:51pm
  I don’t know. I don’t think that there is good answer to any of your questions. All I know is that without my faith there is no light at all, no road worth traveling and no hope for mankind. Hopefully, someone wiser than me can help. God Bless.
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:29am
  @GRACEUNDERFIRE
  
  Thanks for your honest input.
  
  I think that the curch was exactly the place that this family should have been involved with. I think the lack of the Christian religion resulted in this and these types of acts.
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 12:24pm
  You can’t MAKE people be moral. . . . even at the risk of “an angry god”. Christians are not immune to heinous acts. Many prisoners would claim a ‘belief in god”. Though you could say, “they weren’t living right”, the point IS that they DO [most of them] “believe in god”, and usually the christain one.
  
  This is more about a disturbed guy and a mom who wasn’t responsible with potentially dangerous tools [in the wrong hands].
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:02pm
  @DEAVON
  
  Wrong, it is about lack of proper upbringing, not going to church, not being part of the church community, a part of the community that cares about you and who you are and how you are doing and what can we do to help you if at all possible in anyway, particularly in the way of counseling by church counselors and or pastors.
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 1:15pm
  Wrong? Hardly. Upbringing only works for those who it WILL work on. Many PKs and MKs have gone wild because they wanted to. Great “role models” [so one would think], yet gone wild. I understand your opinion. But you can’t “cookie cutter” kids into living morally.
  
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- 1776freedomofspeech
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:22pm
  @DEAVONRYE
  
  Wrong again, see US military draft. You will comply or go to jail! End of story. Straighten up and fly right! That is pronounced “R I G H T”!
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 2:39pm
  I believe that we are talking in two different worlds here. Church isn’t at all like the military. I don’t even get why you would bring that up. I really don’t!
  
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neverending
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 5:10pm
Osteen, warren and mcpherson? Oh please!

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JEANNIEMAC
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 4:43pm
God gives us free will and with that gift comes the burden of choice. What is free will?
We are free to do God’s will. Or not.

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JohnLarson
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 4:42pm
Or maybe we’re just alone in the universe.

These pastor hucksters are just protecting their business model.

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- neverending
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 5:09pm
  My thoughts exactly
  
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- Witness1974
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 6:59pm
  If we are alone in the universe, then the universe is amoral and there is no point in discussing good and evil.
  
  With regard to your critical comments regarding the pastor’s motives, I understand why you might come to your conclusions. However, a word of caution, don’t confuse churchianity with Christianity. Churches are often impossible to defend, while Christ needs no defense.
  
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seek.the.truth
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 3:50pm
God allows free will and He allows evil to rear its ugly head sometimes. We that are Christians must trust that God will reveal his purpose in His time.
I often refer to the very first verse that we taught our children from Proverbs 3:5. — Trust in the Lord with all you heart and lean not on your own understanding ……

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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 6:55pm
  God allowed these poor children to be murdered? And you continue to worship such an evil deity? What had those children done to deserve such a terrible punishment? What possible motive could God have had in allowing this atrocity if He is truly a “god of love”?
  
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- TheCalmOne
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 7:05pm
  “Lean not on your own understanding”. Well that explains everything. It makes no sense that these children were killed. We all know that. But Christians are given the escape hatch of not having to think or try to understand.
  
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- seek.the.truth
  Posted on December 25, 2012 at 9:31pm
  If you CHOOSE to believe God is evil then I guess you understand free will.
  I choose to believe that God is wiser than any person or evil being that walks this earth. He has a perfect plan for us all.
  
  I know that God loves each one of those children from Sandy Hook and He was waiting for them with open arms. They now know his perfect love and are safe and will never be afraid again. I CHOOSE to believe that and it has given me great comfort. Amen..
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 9:33am
  Unless your god is as the Calvinist believe, . . . then those who were “created for destruction” went to hell for “his glory”.
  
  Don’t look at my words [above] as a slam on your faith. That’s what Calvinism teaches.
  
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- seek.the.truth
  Posted on December 26, 2012 at 7:24pm
  ….have no idea where you get the idea that I believe that! God did not create anything with the intention to destroy. Do you enjoy attacking points that were never made to begin with?
  
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- DeavonReye
  Posted on December 27, 2012 at 9:55am
  Again, just making the point that SOME faiths believe there ARE some “made for destruction”. Your fight is with them. But IF they are right, then my statment is valid. Never said YOU were a Calvinist.
  
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The-Monk
Posted on December 25, 2012 at 3:44pm
Hi Billy,

Merry Christmas : ).

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