Elderly Man Angrily Tears Large Christian Cross Out of the Ground and Hurls It Into a Duck Pond — But Why?
Photo Credit: ShutterStock.com
An 82-year-old man in Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England, was so disgusted by the presence of a five-foot cross on public land that he mustered the strength to tear it out of the ground and toss it into a duck pond.
Alan Pickard, a retired lawyer, found himself so offended that St. John the Baptist Church posted the cross on public land in an effort to commemorate Lent that he decided to take such extreme action.
A parishioner was later dismayed to find the cross in the water. So, she retrieved it and sent an e-mail to the village community in an attempt to announce what had happened and to discuss the future of the religious artifact.
Rather than avoiding responsibility, Pickard admitted his actions in an e-mail reply, noting that he believes that the cross should remain on private, church property, the Daily Mail reports.
“I might have dressed the bit of wood up as Worzel Gummidge, but chose instead to pitch it into the pond and if it is replaced will continue to pitch it into the pond,” the culprit wrote in his response (Gummidge is a fictional British children’s character).
In a series of messages sent between the village’s 140 residents, 21 people noted having no issue with the cross on public land, while six people did inevitably disagree with its placement. When these results were sent out to residents in a subsequent e-mail, Pickard sent another reply, renewing his threat.
“If the cross appears on the green again it will end up in the pond again,” it read. “I do not accept the validity of this voting process and I will not yield to the obvious arrogance of the church.”
Now, the Christian symbol is planted on church land, where Pickard says it belongs. While he’s delighted with the result of his protest, some in the town are less than thrilled with his behavior.
Numerous residents who spoke with the Daily Mail believe he could have taken his grievances with the cross being placed on public property to the head of St. John the Baptist Church rather than taking matters into his own hands.
One church member called his actions “sacrilege.”
“I am not religious, but it doesn’t bother me if someone wants to plant a cross on the green. What I do think is that the gentleman should have gone about it in a different way,” said another.
(H/T: Daily Mail)
Cross Photo Credit: ShutterStock.com
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Comments (237)
COFemale
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:31amHmm so he offends me, can I go pick him up and throw him in the pond when he stands on the public land and tell him he does not belong on public land?
This is so asinine and that old geezer needs to get a life. It is not all about you, you arrogant B. Perhaps you should look in the mirror who the arrogant one is. He stated he did not care how the voting went, he would not accept the results. Sounds like Obama.
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walnutportconservative
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:05amClose… the old fellow and Obama.
Christ did not come to bring peace… no… but division.
Well, this looks like division. Actually, a goat… an old goat, from the sheep who placed the cross.
Now the sheep should just put that cross in another location, because we should never argue with a fool.
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HOOT_OWL
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:28amThese fools can try and erase Christ from the world all they want.
But they never will …. He is…
The ‘Bread’ of Life..
The Great ‘Physician’ ..
Our blessed ‘Hope‘..
The morning ‘Star.’
The ‘Carpenter‘..
The ‘Chief Cornerstone‘.
And ‘The Door ‘to our salvation..
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Walkabout
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:37amHe could have carried the cross a few feet to the church grounds & leaned it up against the church once or twice. He could have talked to the pastor & made it into a news items. He would have garnered more support then.
Now he is just an @$$. I don’t think he will enjoy living in the village now.
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2Taxed
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:44amIf you threw “him” in the pond that would be “intolerant.” You might even be arrested for a hate crime, unless of course you said you were just helping with swim lessons.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:45amNo you can’t do that.
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The_Doors_Of_Perception
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:48amhoot
I’m not trying to erase Jesus. I’m trying to play my infinitesimally small part in educating people, in the 21st century none the less, that human sacrifice does not really work.
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stolasJC
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:38pmI find this actually most offensive:
In a series of messages sent between the village’s 140 residents, 21 people noted having no issue with the cross on public land, while six people did inevitably disagree with its placement. When these results were sent out to residents in a subsequent e-mail, Pickard sent another reply, renewing his threat.
“If the cross appears on the green again it will end up in the pond again,” it read. “I do not accept the validity of this voting process and I will not yield to the obvious arrogance of the church.
So this one guy gets to decide what is good for the whole village? Is he related to our POTUS?
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MarineMike27
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:38pmCan we go find his car on public parking land push it in the river if we dont like it???
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redfish52
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:22pmI agree…first thing I thought of…I know me and if I witness this I would give the old man two options..either swim out on his own and bring back the cross or swim out under my arm and retrieve the cross. Either way he’s getting wet. Is there no British men there that have no testicles?
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audaxrex stigimoloch
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:42pmWalkabout has it right. I guess the old guy just snapped.
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tradcatholicgirl
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:25pmDoors,
Christ dying on the Cross was not human sacrifice. He is the Lord, a Divine being who was not sacrificed, ie., a passive victimization. He willingly gave himself to death.
Just clarifying.
He did it out of infinite love. To show us the way. He asks that we sacrifice for each other in much smaller, more human ways each day.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:33pmIt was done BECAUSE god required a sacrifice. It doesn’t matter that you have the doctrine of “Christ willingly laying down his life”, . . . . even though he was actually bowing to god’s will, not his, . . . . it was still required that a sacrifice was made, and since it was the plan from the beginning, . . . a human sacrifice.
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Walkabout
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:49pmThe_Doors_Of_MisPerception
I’m not trying to erase Jesus. I’m trying to play my infinitesimally small part in educating people, in the 21st century none the less, that human sacrifice does not really work.
***
Jesus died on the cross. Yes, true. But Christians are not asking anyone to commit human sacrifice. So where do you get off saying that Christians do?
On another note human sacrifice goes on all the time. It usually happens when someone miscalculates or some one with “no skin in the game” does not give $#it. At least one of the people who died in Ben Ghazi sacrificed himself. He knew whether or not he was supported that he had a not insignificant chance of buying the farm by popping up & illuminating the target. A not insignificant # of soldiers do this.
What do you consider the Blaze? A place for you to come and proselytize among the religious? You are so sweet.
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midnightvelvet
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:53pmAs far as I can tell, Britain has been thoroughly de-Christianized. They are being overrun by unassimilatable Muslims, and they have been completely denuded of any weapon to fight it. I’m afraid that there will not always be an England.
Of course, the media is completely silent on the invasion of Europe and Britain. Off topic, I know, but it is all related, in my humble opinion.
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midnightvelvet
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:02pmDespite the attacks on Christianity in this country, the US is still much more Christian than Britain is now. Just recently, a woman had to file a lawsuit in order to be permitted to wear a tiny little gold cross at work. I read the comments in the Telegraph (I know, it’s a leftist rag) Very few could even see where this woman was coming from.
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sunsu
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:04pmI read all I needed to when the article got to the line “Alan Pickard, a retired lawyer”.
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armyofnibiru
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:18pmgood thing for him it is a christian symbol not a muslim symbol,or his headless body would have been thrown in the pond.
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LiberalsRParasiticRacistEvilNIgnorantTraitors
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:38pmClose to Obama. The difference: Obama might burst into flames if he touched a cross.
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OldSkoolDJ
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:56pm“Alan Pickard, a retired lawyer”……all you need to know about him.
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DLV
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 4:04pmdrye- Ah no. Jesus wasn’t “bowing to God’s will.” He is God.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 4:11pmThen why say, “Let this cup pass from me, . . . but not my will, but yours be done.” If he is god, that statement is rather odd, wouldn’t you think? Jesus is praying to “his father”.
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DLV
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 5:07pmdrye- He is setting up roles, setting an example for the church. Him and the Father are equals but like husband and wife the church and christ there roles, that’s the reason. Christ laid his life down for the church, the husband should do it for the wife, but Jesus also pointing out that while He and the Father are equals, but he as god decided to do this for humanity. As Jesus said he can lay down his life for whoever he wishes and he chose humanity.
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hpyagl
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 8:07pmReally, it’s just an object made of wood. It has no real significance unless one were to break off one leg. Then it would look suspiciously like a Remington 870 with a pistol grip. And God knows, we can’t have that object around, especially around kids and school teachers close by!
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milez5
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 2:56amit’s funny how this story refers to him as a retired lawyer. Old lawyers never retire. They just keep raising hell without bothering to go into the office anymore.
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rzraick
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 3:16amSorry to disagree, but he was right in princple even if extreme in his actions. I realize that this was England, but freedom of religion which we cherish is coupled to the concept of separation of church and state for good reason.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 9:12amDLV, I guess we won’t agree on this one. I just don’t see anyone attempting to set up some sort of “role” when being faced with a horrific experience, . . . sweating blood, . . . . “If it is possible, let this cup pass from me, yet YOUR will be done, not mine”. Not seeing where they were “one” here.
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RobbieTLHughie
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 11:45amBoring arguments.
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DLV
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 12:52pmDrye- “If it is possible, let this cup pass from me, yet YOUR will be done, not mine”.
Yup, but this quote fits in perfectly because Jesus was 100 percent God and 100 percent human. Jesus knew exactly what was coming and he was VERY afraid. His human side was very afraid but at the same time he knew what had to be done. At many points in the bible he knows he has to do this for humanity and also because he wants to. I pointed out the I can lay down my life for whoever I wish. The roles also come in when Jesus washes his disciples feet. So you may think he is God what is he doing washing the disciples’ feet. Setting up roles. Doing a kindness for the church so that people can have a reference point on how to act in the future. Trust me, I took Christian Theology last year, we learned all about Jesus as God, Jesus as human, what the points of view were in the early church etc.
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cdcg22
Posted on May 20, 2013 at 7:54pmlol I agree with you . I would love to go and stick some christian cross decal to annoy the hec out of him
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RestoreCapitalism
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:31amThey should have told the old geezer that as soon as he’s planted, they’re going to dig him up and throw him in a pond to rot.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:46amThat’s incredibly vulgar.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:50amAgreed. It is absurd to equate grave robbery with an icon/symbol vandalizing.
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smv803
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:53pmNo, he should be thrown into the pond while alive…… This guy doesn’t know it yet, but he’ll need to be wet where he’s going.
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sunsu
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:08pmWhat they should have told him was as soon as he was in the ground they where going to drill a hole in the center of his grave and put the cross there.
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VS
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:33pmThey should let him know that when he passes they will plant numerous Crosses on his grave!!
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txswalker
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:15amMaybe it was joe biden…he looks like a grumpy old man puppet
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Buddynoel
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:14amViolent?? I’m not being violent.
I’m being an environmentalists by helping clean up a duck pond and washing away the smell of an 82-year-old liberal by giving him his first bath this month. Let’s just call it a baptism. Jesus loves us all, ya know?
And for Balding-birdbrain – cold water can help cure that depression of yours. Get well soon, my friend.
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JGraham III
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:31amWhether it is Britain or America, I find it very curious how vehement the unbelievers are in their actions against Christianity or any of its many symbols. Curious because it is through Christ alone that mankind can find true freedom. Personally I find the cross redundant as the focal point of Christianity has always been the resurrection and not so much a Roman death instrument. But, to millions the cross represents that event, so I don’t make it a big issue with my Christians brothers and sisters.
This old man (and of course he is a lawyer and so knows more that the rest of society..) is greatly to be pitied because in the twilight of his life he finds the need to be noticed by doing a hateful act. Yep, that’s what it is, except of course because it is Christianity, the world doesn’t see it so. Father forgive them for they know not what they do.
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MadJuan
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:54pm@ JGraham III
Thank YOU! Very well stated…
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midnightvelvet
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:10pmI tend to agree. Somebody called it “sacrilege”. It’s a piece of wood. The Bible is a book. God is bigger than these things. It is a symptom, as you say.
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NewCreationDave
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:08amGee, I wonder if the brave folks who do these things would toss pitch some symbol of Islam into a pond! What do you think? ;-)
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Walkabout
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:23amAlan Pickard, a retired lawyer, is without doubt not a Christian.
If he were and thought that the cross should not be on public land he would have walked into the church & talked to a pastor 1st.
Any membership of his would have to be in an Unitarian church or liberal church at best. If we looked at his voting or work history, it would show us that he is not comfortable in a Western society but would much rather be somewhere else.
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:41am-hi walk
not sure about English law, but both parties are probably guilty of minor indescretions; a simple lack of good judgement.
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Walkabout
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:14amjohn vincent
” but both parties are probably guilty of minor indescretions”
Agreed, but you don’t correct one misdemeanor with another one.
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midnightvelvet
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 3:22pm…but one party is Christian, that will weigh heavily against them in PC Britain.
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Gargent_Furball
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:56amI Protest.
This news bite should not be on the Public Air Ways. I Protest, I’m tossing my computer into the pond.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:47amPlease do.
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From Virginia
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:55amNo, no, no! To truly make your point you must travel to the newsagency and toss THEIR computers into the pond!
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moreteaplease
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:55amBaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:24am
No doubt? Really? You like to judge. You’re often wrong. This is the place for people who judge a lot and are often wrong, so I guess you feel home.
————————————-
It also seems the place for those with a hypocritical bent as well….JUSTSAYIN
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jetthepatriot
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:03amso please explain how the cross was hurting anyone, and what gave this person the right to do what he did?
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:19amI don’t know how I’m a hypocrit but I would rather be a hypocrit than a mindless, drooling theist with a fetish for mythology any day. So thank you!
BlueStrat
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:29pm@ JustSayin456
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You talk that crap now.
But, just like every other chicken-crap atheist and militant non-believer/anti-Christian, when death is nigh, when the bullets & bombs are whizzing around you, when you’re staring at your best friend’s sucking chest-wound…or YOUR sucking chest-wound…you won’t be able to start praying to God & Jesus fast enough or loudly enough.
You aren’t fooling anyone, save possibly yourself.
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Yuuperguy
Posted on March 8, 2013 at 7:49amIn reply to Bluestrat who said “But, just like every other chicken-crap atheist and militant non-believer/anti-Christian, when death is nigh, when the bullets & bombs are whizzing around you, when you’re staring at your best friend’s sucking chest-wound…or YOUR sucking chest-wound…you won’t be able to start praying to God & Jesus fast enough or loudly enough.” I have known many atheists who have gone to war and come back atheists, who have fought in battles, who have bled for their country, and not one of them converted because they fear death or eternity, it’s only idiots like you who have that problem. Atheist does not equal coward. I think its quite the opposite. Pat Tillman was an Atheist, ask the 200 member of the Military association of Atheists and Freethinkers (soldiers all) what they think about the Atheists in foxholes statement.
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Flyingfish
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:51amWhen will religious people get it through their thick skulls. You have the right to “spread the world” as much as it annoys the rest of us, but keep your symbols on your own property where they belong.
If it’s on public property it makes it just as mine as yours which means I can do to it pretty much what ever I want if you leave it unattended. To bad he through it in the pond, it would have made good firewood.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:06amSomebody else failed to read the story. This occurred in England where they abide by their own laws. Not ours.
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theaton
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:06amI’m not a religious person but I do believe Christ died for me. Let’s take a look at this from the perspective of the left. You know, those who always demand tolerance from others but are never tolerant themselves. I didn’t like the Occupy people planting themselves in parks and on sidewalks. However, I didn’t go throught their crap in the pond. I didn’t even want police to remove them. All people have the right to free speech, free expression and to peacefully assemble. As long as they do not infringe on the rights of others, they can do anything they please. The cross was private property. For someone to remove it without the owners permission would be theft. I would bet that flyingfish often parks his car on public property. I hope he’ll let us know where and when he does so that we can come remove it. After all, it is abandoned on public property. The cross was harming no one. If you have such guilt over seeing a cross that it cause you enough rage that you must throw it in a pond, you have some problems in your life.
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Ditto Head
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:24amYour State-funded and propagated religion of Evolution is financed by the taxpayers, and its symbols and icons are scattered throughout our public lands. It has to be, because it would not be believed nor could it survive without the richly-resourced Goverment forcing it down people’s throats. Christendom, OTOH, thrives on its own, financed by people who care about other people.
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abefij
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:10pmIs there such thing as public property in England? Does the “public property” in fact belong to the Queen, who is also the head of the church?
What does this man propose to do about the cross (St. Georges) in the flag? The flag of England is a cross, and it’s included in the Union Jack at it the center.
What he has is a disdain and hostility toward his own culture, history, and towards religion in general. Such people believe religion is the the cause of all conflict in the world as a result of being less than honest with themselves. Some religions are just easily hijacked and used.
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nzkiwi
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:46amIt seems that this sad old man has ignited a warm coal of spite with which to comfort himself as he watches the TV alone at night bereft of significance and hopeful future.
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Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:55amHe acts like a bitter person who has no love or respect for anything in his life.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:57amYou seem to hope this is the case. How Christian.
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nzkiwi
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:26amYou seem to be enjoying yourself this morning, Justsayin.
Actually, I’m an atheist. I cannot decide whether you are stupid or ignorant. I hope it’s the latter as the former can’t be remedied…
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13th Imam
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:31amSaul Alinsky being spoken here.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:48amCongratulations? I don’t care if you’re an atheist you’re a jerk in my book if you wish ill on others.
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theaton
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:21pmJustsayin, when you trip and fall later today, remember the word Karma.
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Montana Made
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:35pm@justsayin
Since you profess that anyone that holds dear to religion is a “mindless, drooling theist with a fetish for mythology”, just how would you know anything about what is or is not Christian? You are certainly last on the list of those who judges others- along with me. I try not to judge, but find myself doing it every day- and repent and try to do better tomorrow. But, I find it amusing that those that complain the loudest against this or that have always been proven to have the most to hide from God (i.e. the Jimmy Swaggert fall). What exactly is your beef with God?
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sta
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:34amImagine if he was offended by a Crescent and Star. Oh the hate all over the MSM.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:41amNone of those should be allowed on public land either.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:50amJUSTSAYIN456. I say that Great Briton can abide it’s own laws and not by your perception.
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MBA
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:53amRemember the yellow star of David forced to be worn by the jews by the N a z i s. Liberals love that one.
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13th Imam
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:53amChristians don’t seem to be part of the “Public”
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:03amYou are all acutely retarded.
HOOT_OWL
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:03am@MBA
Good one.
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Pontiaku
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:18amI didn’t know an unattended object was a “christian” entitled to special rights and privileges. Funny how that works. If I happen to see unattended objects left behind on public land chuck them in the trash, not the pond.
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abefij
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:24pmSo, JustSayin
Do crosses, stars, and crescents not belong in Arlington National Cemetery? There are appropriate public places for religious symbols. Banishing them is like telling a priest he can’t use a public drinking fountain. You are asking for two classes of people, with restrictions being placed on one.
Abe
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Neils60
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:50pmHe probably would be offended by other religious symbols, as he’s an atheist, as reported in every other news outlet, with the exception of The Blaze.
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KickinBack
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:34am“I might have dressed the bit of wood up as Worzel Gummidge, but chose instead to pitch it into the pond and if it is replaced will continue to pitch it into the pond,” the culprit wrote in his response
I just couldn’t read that without hearing the voice of Groundskeeper Willie from the Simpsons.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:40amLoL!
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momrules
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:29amOh, how that Cross offends the the unbeliever. Their anger just makes my belief stronger.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:33amIt doesn’t offend me at all but keep feeling smug how Christian of you.
NHwinter
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:44amjustsayin456 – if anyone on here feels smug, it is you. Are you enjoying yourself today? Have nothing else to do but try to bug Christians? I don’t know what you believe in, but if there were a symbol for it, would you mind if someone threw it in a pond? Perhaps you believe in nothing so all this conversation gives you the chance to spout nasty comments that just make your day.
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momrules
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:11amJUSTSAYIN456……….Smug? No. I am simply a sin filled woman who has accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior and through my acceptance I have been saved.
I do believe the Cross offends you. I believe we Christians offend you, I believe Jesus Christ offends you, otherwise you would not have spent so much time here today trying to offend us.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:45amMom, . . . as an unbeliever myself, . . . I am not offended by a “cross”. I don’t understand why people would be so attached to them [no pun intended], but for me, . . . it is just an icon.
When I was a christian, I used to be frightened at even the possibility of holding a deck of Tarot in my hand or a penticle. I have, now, . . . . and there is no more to them than any other symbol/icon created by men.
As for the old man, . . . his anger was certainly in the forefront. Some people allow their emotions to dictate behavior rather than reason.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:56amSick burns guys. I’m really cowed. You guys are awesome!
momrules
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:43pmHi there Deavonreye………I don’t think you would ever do something like this man did but I do believe that many, many unbelievers do hate the Cross and they hate seeing it. The Cross is just a symbol of Christ’s sacrifice. I wear one but I don’t believe it is necessary for me to to be a Christian.
Anyway, you are not an angry, hysterical atheist like some that come here to the Blaze hoping to get a rise out of Christians. I think you like the conversation and I enjoy talking with you.
You are one of the unbelievers that I pray for by name……well, at least by the name Devonreye. I don’t know who you really are but God knows who I am talking about.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:57pmMom, I’ve been known to get a bit rowdy on here at times. Mostly because “I couldn’t believe someone actually said that”. But mostly, I don’t harbor any anger towards religious icons and can walk by them without any derision. Some do. Heck, . . . sometimes I may even get a bit “eye rolling” with icons, . . . but it quickly passes.
I appreciate your concern and care about me. Of far more value than someone telling me “Jesus loves me”.
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DLV
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:04pmDrye- Well he does, that’s why he died for humanity. His love is worth a lot more than mine. But I understand your statement.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:15pmDLV, I understand the need for christians to say such things, . . . but it truly is meaningless. I mean that as well as I can say it. If such a being existed, the silence [for me] says “I have no care for you at all” . . . not “I love you”. I suppose it is a matter of perspective.
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DLV
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:23pmdrye- The silence is, I feel, more of a test of faith and obedience. Funny thing I wrote a short story using characters in my fantasy universe (I wrote actual books from this fantasy timeline) to talk about the issue of God’s silence and how the main character dealt with it. I read it in front of my creative writing class and they loved it. Nonetheless, he does speak to us through prayer, the bible etc. I’ve heard it before. and when he speaks to us through the bible, especially when reading Christ’s sacrifice, it is definitely “I love you.”
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:27amLittle wonder that Alan Pickard is so whacked. This is his hero.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiP0j-LHv88
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RaydocX
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:22amAnd when he sees a hunter on public land, because he is opposed, he can destroy the hunter’sweapon?
Unless the government placed the cross or maintained the cross,nunless somehow he had previously reserved the patch of land for the temporary celebration, his behavior insists that his belief system and sense of right and wrong is more important than others who wanted to briefly do something on land that by definition they have EQUAL right to use and enjoy.
Sad that any group would believe this is an appropriate way to demonstrate their opposition to another group’s position. And trolls, I know this was one man, but he will be held up and praised by the activist non believers
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:32amLOL I doubt an 82 year old man throwing a cross into a duck pond is going to be a rallying cry. You just made up a bunch of law by the way. Is that how you think the law works? Silly.
Buddynoel
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:19amEngland is far too polite. Had that been Arizona, we would have seen a photo of Mr. Pickard, having somehow been thrown in the pond to help retrieve our cross.
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BaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:23amIf it were AZ, he’d be depressed.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:32amBALDINGBEAGLE, I see that your first post today was right at 9:00. Guess we’ll just have to put up with your blather until you sign off at 5:00 this evening.
I have to ask again since I never got an answer when you were ETCHASKETCH. Is this your job, or can you only use a computer while the local library is open?
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:36amYeah, take violent action against an 82 year old. Score.
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DexterMorgan
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:40am@Bald I live in AZ and I’m not depressed. Maybe a change of scenery would help you. But then you’d probably be depressed there too. Doesn’t seem like our snowbirds are depressed here. They keep returning winter after winter.
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BaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:49amRJ, sorry you have no life and that you’re on here 24 hours a day. Maybe one day you’ll find something better to do.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:59amBEAGLE, we’ve had this discussion before. I’m not on here all day, or for that matter, anywhere near that. Its simply that your appearance is as predictable as the sun rising in the East every morning. You have hours that are carved stone. Nice attempt at obfuscation though.
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nzkiwi
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:53amThat was observant of you, RJ. I guess Beagle is a working troll.
It’s kind of sad to observe someone with such a weak, spiteful character that they must resort to trying to tear down others rather than build themselves up.
Perhaps Balding Eagle identifies a bit too closely with the subject of this story…
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:11amNZKIWI, Ever since he first arrived here as ETCHASKETCH, then resurrected himself as PORK ANVIL, and I believe he had another name after that. I just can’t remember at the moment. It was obvious that his mission in life was to simply stir up trouble here. Then his peculiar hours just began to stand out. He does a five day work week, 9 to 5 Eastern. There do seem to be breaks in his time line, apparently time spent trolling other sites. If you have the opportunity, watch for him to disappear from the site at 5:00 this evening.
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Gonzo
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:18amI have no doubt that Alan Pickard would remove the cross AND the church from private land as well… if he could.
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BaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:24amNo doubt? Really? You like to judge. You’re often wrong. This is the place for people who judge a lot and are often wrong, so I guess you feel home.
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huey6367
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:34am@balding
Settle down
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:37amWhy is that? Seems it was the public land which he sought to vindicate. Strawman anyone?
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:39amHey BEAGLE, that’s quite the judgmental statement you made there regarding GONZO. Funny thing is that I don’t see any amount of judgement in his post. That’s it, just accuse others of doing what you actually do.
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Zipit
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:40amI Dub Thee BALDWANGO, and therefore Judge Thee to be “Irrelevant “! It is slow!
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BaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:51amReally, RJ? No judgement in Gonzo’s post? How is Gonzo stating that he thinks this guy would do something that he hasn’t done NOT judgement? You are a dropout. Plain and clear. I’m surprised you can even log on.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:56amZIPIT, He’s the former ETCHASKETCH/PORK ANVIL. I wonder how long he will last under this moniker?
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Cavallo
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:01amIn England if it had been a Homosexual symbol, the man would be charged with a crime and thrown in jail. Some animals are more equal than others.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:04amBEAGLE, but nothing judgmental in your statement though? You spend five days a week here turning your 9 to 5 trick being nothing but judgmental. You are quite the little whore to the left aren’t you. How much do they pay you by the work week?
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BaldingEagle1776
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:17amOh RJ, always shifting the blame. The blame is on Gonzo for judging in his original post. Try to keep up!
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Dan_o
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:29amStrawman = the new term/mantra of the left for an argument they can’t win.
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Gonzo
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:42amYes, no doubt. The sanctity of public lands is not his or your concern. He and you have a problem with Christianity. I know you won’t admit it, but we both know it’s true.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:17amBEAGLE, I call it the way I see it. And, I see just what you do here during your five day work week. Its simple observation, and I am not the only one who does see you for just what you are.
LOL, have you picked out your next name yet? I get the feeling that you will need it in a few weeks. Remember the Boy Scout motto. Always be prepared!
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Zipit
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:30pmOuch RJJ! Those are some scathing comments from sketchy! You must feel awfully “hurt”? And “inferior”! My!
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DLV
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:54pmBaldingeagle- will you admit you are Etchasketch and Pork Anvil?
Rj- What is your evidence that Baldingeagle are thsoe screen names? I’m just curious.
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who_is_john_galt_in_RI
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:18amwhy get so angry over a small case letter “t”? what’s next, getting angry over the letter “x”? chose to believe or chose not to believe, just leave the rest of us alone.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:39amHow about the same rule for believers? That’s the point of this mans indignation.
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USPATRIOT101
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:15amEven if he’s a nonbeliever, given his age, do you really think he should be testing his luck?
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biohazard23
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:12amIt won’t be long before the angry, nasty old coot can take up his grievances with his Creator.
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Zipit
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:23amBio! The way things are going over there, this old coot will soon be forced to kneel before Allah five times a day, or lose his noggin! Poetic justice? Maybe……
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mdlwoods
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:24amThat’s exactly what I was thinking! He’s 82 so probably doesn’t have too many more years and then he will be standing before Christ trying to come up with the answer to the question: Why did thou forsake me???”
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65Mustang
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:12amExhibit that behavior on the Day of Judgement and see where it gets you.
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The_Doors_Of_Perception
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:24amThank god there is no evidence for such a thing..
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:53am-hi doors
There is certainly evidence for the NEED of a ‘judgement day;’ a day of finally making things right with the tresspassers on God’s earth;
as far as the evidence for the DAY, I suppose that is yet to be determined
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:34amJohn, most people live a lifetime without hurting hardly anyone. Yet, they would receive the same “hell” as the serial rapist/murderer [unrepentant and glad he did it]. That’s malevolent, . . . and really quite revolting.
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:43am-hi d-rye
That’s what makes him God, and not you nor I. He judges perfectly. I would not want the job.
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:22amOr, John, . . . this doctrine has no grounds in reality, regardless of whether or not this god is real. A human invention, because it sounds more scary that “anyone who rejects god will see their judgement as an eternal existence in a tormenting fire”. And to say, “he’s god and I’m not”, . . . how do you even know the ancient words were even “from a god”, . . . or if they were metaphorical? I understand that it is a major doctrine of many denominations, . . . . . . . but it was still penned by men.
What would an actual “loving god” do [including one that uses true justice]? It is claimed, “he expect perfection”, . . . but that is yet another unfalsifyable doctrine. What would be logical/ethical/moral? If there is a god, or gods, I would hope he/she/they would be far more advanced than our understanding/interpretations.
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:53am-d rye
(sorry 65 stang)
It appears you never had a vision of the uglyness of sin——————-
This is the issue of the ages my friend, and it is your dilemma not God’s, as He provided relief.
But it appears you judge using the wrong standard. Try looking at the egregiousness of sin from heavens point of view, and you may find help.
You are no different than Job’s three friends who try to persuade him of God’s defects- you may want to read their arguments, as they tried to ‘reason.’ (by the way, God said ‘let us reason together…….’ that is, God wants you to agree with him about his assessment of you…………..)
the word for the day——————– propitiation
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:15pmJohn, I am well aware of “ugliness” found in the actions of men. But no one deserves an infinte punishment for finite crimes, regardless of how much they are despised here. Punishment, sure. Infinite? No. Annihilation? I suppose.
I have no dilemma with any deity. . . since I have no contact with him/her. But requiring “perfection” . . . is not a realistic “standard”. Nor is any interpretation of what “heaven” may be like, or even require, . . . just because a denomination has a believed doctrine about it. Again, I restate, . . . a person may never do anything abhorant in their life, and may even help people a great deal [feed, cloth, visitations, etc], but because they couldn’t be credulous about a specific god [with no evidence, just the assertions of men], they would receive the same hell as an unrepentant rapist/murder of little girls? That isn’t justice. If that runs contrary to a doctrine of “god”, so be it. Morality doesn’t concern itself with doctrines.
[For the sake of argument that god is real, and the story of Job was literal] I’m not like Job’s friends. Job had it right. God did all of it for no reason. He did it because he could. Job’s friends claimed that “Job must have sinned greatly in his life for God to inact such horrors upon Job”. Nope! Job suffered because his god wished it for no reason but to prove to Satan that Job would remain faithful.
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:35pm-drye
back on point-
u said ‘I am well aware of “ugliness” found in the actions of men.’
as to the topic at hand, the fellow who ‘threw the cross into the pond….’ was a criminal long before he showed up to toss it………………’ his actions PROVED what was in the heart- God does not need to see actions, hence, my previous post: He judges perfectly-
and I will not comment on man number one.
hagd
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:39pmOkay, . . . let’s just say that his “throwing the cross in the pond” was his only “sin”. Is it moral for him to spend an eternity in pain for this action?
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 12:52pmd-rye
you are not reading with a discerning eye friend-
I said he was criminal long BEFORE he showed up at the pond………………..
it is not what man does, it is what he IS………..ALL are criminal as the good book says; but some folks have a different relationship with the judge………………..
you are asking the wrong questions Deavon-
gotta go tkx
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DeavonReye
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:01pmOkay, John. Reply when you get back.
So, let’s say he is as you say. Does he deserve an eternal painful punishment for it? Let’s put it in my place. I’m not one to get so angry that I would uproot a religious icon and throw it in a pond, . . . but I deny the claims of those who put it there. Do I deserve “eternal painful punishment” for what I state?
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 2:27pm-d-rye
included is a better response than can be offered here, I apologize for its length, but it would wrong to further usurp this format- (yes, your answer is included)
Please do not react or respond here- really think about the contents- I’ll catch up with you in time- tkx for your attention
http://sienna48.blog.com/2013/01/21/glory-of-god/
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U4eeeahhh
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:12amI wish more people around the world would follow his example and eliminate the incursion of religious symbols on public space.
Time to let the silly myths and legends from ancient superstitions go.
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The_Doors_Of_Perception
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:20amHear Hear!
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:35amU4EEEAHHH, Would expect no less from someone who puts this on his of all things, a motorcycle forum:
Date of Birth:
September 5, 1952
Age:
60
Biography:
Contrarian
Location:
Texas
Interests:
BDSM Photography
Occupation:
philosopher
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sta
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:37amSo if he didn’t like the float by the LGBT community going down a public street, you would have no problem with destroying it?
Vandalism should not be encouraged. There are ways to handle that which you disagree about.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:44amYup, now you’re comparing sexual orientation to tacit condo nation of Christianity. Logic fail.
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:19amJUSTSAYIN456, What? That is merely his own bio from his own motorcycle forum that I read a couple of months ago. Other than his photography habits, there is no mention of sexual orientation. But, you had to make it up anyway. But yes, I have found him to be rather disgusting.
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TheGrtDcptn
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:19amBoo Hoo…Cry some more, throw another tantrum…
People like you are a JOKE…You can NOT allow others to live THEIR lives yet DEMAND that they…
Tolerate…
Accept…
Condone…
Be Understanding…and…
Have Compassion…for…
beastiality, incest, homosexuality, and any day now, pedophilia, it IS coming…as well as any other perversions your heart desires…You are all like perpetual TWO year olds, I want what I want and I want it NOW…!! Keep stomping your feet while slinging your filthy accusations at those who disagree with you, you show NO respect…? You get NO respect…!! You are free to wallow in YOUR SIN, but you can NOT demand that others condone your behavior…
And I, for one, will NOT…
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TheGrtDcptn
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:35amu4eeeahhh…Interests:BDSM Photography
oh the perversions of the heart…
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spirited
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:07amStay away from Italy
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spirited
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:13amOpen the mind a bit.
A simple wooden cross or a detailed carving is art.
~>Art is subjective
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Beachbaby
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:11amAnother lawyer who cannot live up to God expectations of a real man. Like the Ten Commandments are difficult to live by. Demons hate God. He is possessed because he puts too much time in something he doesnt believe in. 82 years of screwing people. And the limp old man is now shaking in his over-priced shoes.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:55amLOL lawyers know the law and their rights- that must be so frustrating for all the religious fascists on here.
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spirited
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 11:28am“their” rights
Ah yes,
more of that transparent fundamental change
for equal rights
via
social justice
and
yes WE can
~>but you can’t.
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Kalshion
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 1:11pm@justsayin456
Yea, except you clearly don’t know the laws in England…that’s where this occured, it didn’t occur here in the US. So why don’t you stop trying to proclaim certain things about English Law that are not even true hmm?
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huey6367
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:11amWho made him the spokeperson for the village? Take religion out of it and it is vadalism. And that’s a crime. By his logic, if you disagree with something then destroy it. Wonder what would happen if someone disagreed with him?
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The Jewish Avenger
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:21amI disagree with him.
Can I throw him in the pond?
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65Mustang
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:34amHUEY6367: You are right, did not see it that way. Public vs private..vandalism. I don’t even feel sorry for those of you who refuse to believe in God.
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:53amNobody. He didn’t like it, and legally he shouldn’t, because as a member of the public he has a right to use the public space and be free from religious influence thereon. When there are religious symbols on private land there is no problem, but when they’re on public land it looks like the government is pushing or tacitly preferring one religion over another. How do people STILL not get this, it’ a basic tenet of our constitution and the basis for our free and democratic society. Oh, that’s right, most of you just want special rights. That’s ironic given the normal attitude towards special rights I witness on these threads. If someone wants to prosecute him for vandalism fine, but he vindicated a far more fundamental right than any private property rights he may have infringed upon, and even then the church might be said to have assumed the risk through its illegal placement in the first place.
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Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:53amIt might be a good time to take the old man to the Death Panel for evaluation.
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john vincent
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:04am-jewish aveng
no u cant throw him in the pond, but Der Obama may authorize a drone strike…………….thank you Dr Paul for your courage in the midst of wolves
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RJJinGadsden
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:15amJUSTSAYIN456, You may hate religion, and that is really okay. You do have free will to choose. But, do you have the ability to understand that this happened in England where they live under English law, and not by SCOTUS precedent?
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jungle J
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:05amEngland invented mentally ill old men.
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jUSTacOUNTRYbOY2
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 5:20pmaIN’T THAT THE TRUTH. eSPECIALLY IN hARROGATE, yORKSHIRE.
lIVED THERE, CAN TESTIFY TO BLOKES WITH THAT ATTITUDE EVERYWHERE.
tHEY ALL DWELL WITH DELUSIONS OF ADAQUACY THERE.
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trolltrainer
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 9:02amAh, another poor sinner angry at his Creator.
Move along, nothing to see here…
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justsayin456
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:21amWhat a witty, self-serving comment. Is this how you sleep? In arrogance?
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trolltrainer
Posted on March 7, 2013 at 10:43amSelf-serving? Arrogant? How so? This man is just like you, angry at God. Otherwise, why not simply shrug and walk by the cross? Why not simp0ly shrug and walk by the forum comment? I see things daily…hourly that I do not like or believe. Do I make a fuss? Nope. Doesn’t hurt me any, I just pass it on by. Atheist billboards with stupid, illogical wording. Do I complain? No, why bother? Just more ignorant sinners angry at God, just like you. :-)
No my angry friend, not self-serving as it does not serve me in any way. Not arrogant as I don’t feel I am any better or an less a sinner than you are. I simply love God where you hate Him. You are an ANGRY sinner. I am a SAVED sinner.
God bless and Jesus loves even you!
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