Amazing Video Emerges of China‘s ’Ghost Cities’
- Posted on March 29, 2011 at 10:55am by
Jonathon M. Seidl
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If you‘re not familiar with China’s “ghost cities,” they are some of the most fascinating images you will see.
“It’s estimated that 10 new cities are being built every year,” Australian news program SBS Dateline says. That may sound impressive, until you realize that many of the cities remain vacant long after they’re built.
See, even though China has become the leader in development, it’s adopted the idea that “If you build it they will come.” There’s just one problem: they’re not coming. And so China has a problem — ghost cities:
According to Business Insider, some estimates say that nearly 64 million properties are vacant in China. The country is plagued with empty homes, malls, and businesses.
“There’s city after city full of empty streets and vast government buildings, some in the most inhospitable locations. It is the modern equivalent of building pyramids,” BI quotes the group Forensic Asia Limited as saying.
BI has provided satellite images showing some of the ghost cities:
See the rest here.
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Comments (273)
hochnessmonster
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:46amGreat article. My favorite part is at 13:58 when the little guy “gets jiggy with it”.
Report Post »sodun
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:45amOkay…this is just plain weird…the government building cities…what?. How backwards is that?
Report Post ».
PEOPLE build cities, they always have.
.
Only BIG Gov’t would build a city…no, CITIES!!…where no one can can afford to live.
.
What waste of materials, money, effort…everything!
Gasparri
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:49pmYou can thank the Great Wall of China Mart – WaMart for short.
Report Post »caprica
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:40amEmpech obama – he is the enemey of our country ruling ! like some kind of african queen.this guy must be impeach and investigated……where is congress ! what they are waiting for
Report Post »caprica
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:38amChina is building the cities for global people not for china only ! they own Amrica, they will own Europe soon ……..soros and obama are happy for now …their plan hope and change is going well for them……where the hell is congress to impeach and to investigate soros, van jones, obama holder, all obama ‘s criminal czars ! these people are criminils – they conducting a crime agaisnt our Country! with our money and Presidential Power !
Report Post »StanO360
Posted on May 10, 2012 at 1:38pmBoy you misunderstood the article. First off, China buys about 27% of our treasury bonds that are bought by foreigners. Half of the bonds are sold to US citizens, so that means only 12-15% of the total bonds sold are to China. Germans and Brits are right behind them.
The point to be taken from this story is that like all government controlled entities, China is inefficient and inept. This is just housing that they are botching, remember China is at a negative population growth now. My guess, in 30 years China will be a threat to the world because it will be imploding on itself. Aging population, 2/3 in poverty. Massive crumbling infrastructure, all the phony number crunching and artificial GDP like in this story (but add telecom, medical, and every other industry) will come back to bite them.
Personally, look to India, where their growth is not as exciting but is real and much more free-market, or Brazil.
Report Post »rienheart
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:33amthese are make work projects so the Chinese people have work. If they didn’t, the people would rise up and overthrow their Leaders. Of course it also helps to have cities ready for all the Liberals and Commies here that finally realize that Communism doesnt work, and rise up against the regime. It is doubly worse for people who have drank the Koolaid and believed everything that was told them about the Utopian Society, just to have the Truth thrust upon them, than the ones who knew the Truth all along and are better prepared for the destructiveness of the Lie of Communism. The latter are better able to come to grips with their fate if the Communists ever are able to take control of the world. Same with Islamic rule being the World Religion. Resistance to Oppression will be the “IN” thing to be part of if and when they are able to impose their Utopian Society on the World. Be Prepared.
Report Post »Rob
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:29amOk, this is a bit out there….but *WHAT IF* these cities are actually re-location camps for westerners? Think about it, if you gotta lock-up hundreds of thousands, or even millions of westerners- the easiest way to do it will be to put them in a setting that they are already familiar with; malls, sprawling urban and suburban environments. If you were China, and were strategically going to invade the West, where would you put all of the dissenters?
Report Post »Islesfordian
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:44amIn graves.
That’s the normal solution to such a problem by an invading power. It’s much cheaper.
Report Post »jsoucheray
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:28amLooks like North Korea… weird.
Report Post »ClockKing
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:26amSomething else we shouldn’t forget: this is part of Agenda 21, put people in human habitats. China will want to move their people out of the country and into the cities to “purify the Earth.”
Report Post »Gasparri
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:25amAnd I was foreclosed on. That house is abandoned and returning to nature but I legally cannot live there any more. China build ghost cities, Chase Mortgage building a ghost America,
Report Post »and Obama building bridges of friendship and love with the middle east, passing out welfare
checks and $200.00 in food stamps per child to criminal mexicans, while as a disabled WHITE
American taxpayer with only SSI and no other income, qualify for $16.00 in food stamps for month.
Hey, anyone should be able to live on a jar of peanut butter, jelly, several loaves of bread and a quart of milk per month. Damn good thing I live next to a river, the fish and crabs full of 30 weight so I don’t have to sell blood to by cooking oil, the fish come ready to fry right out of the river.
1952
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:35amholy crap…. and this is our future!
Report Post »Pattondog
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:23amwell its just a matter of time till they implode on them selves. all the growth is artificial “demand”. this will come back to bite them in 10years or so. they will not remain the faux super power that everyone one is making them out to be currently.
Report Post »Liberalismsamentaldisorder
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:55amthey are not a faux superpower. beware china. unlike us, they have a long term view. a setback today is fine if it leads to victory tomorrow. they can cripple us economically anytime they want to. we have big ships and fancy planes that all run on money. take that away and it’s a street fight. unfortunately for us it will be 300 million against 1.5 billion. bad odds.
Report Post »PJT520
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 7:45pm@mentaldis, to bad much of our 300 million wouldn’t be willing to fight for America!
Report Post »tige33
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:23amThey tried central planning in Houston when the government built a huge Asian mall in the SW area and patted themselves on the back thinking this is where all the Asian imigrants will migrate to. But lo and behold it sat empty and decaded for years till it was finally bulldozed and the street widened,
Report Post »ginger100
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:19amDeposit Micheal Moore here
Report Post »Sharon
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:18pmsend Soro’s, Obama, Bill Ayers, Benadine Dorhrn, Saul Alinsky and Hillary there too!!
Report Post »1952
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:18amWhy don’t we send all of our gang bangers there. There are terrorists that no one talks about. Our lives would be so much better without them.
Report Post »jim
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:15amProblem #1 with planned economies: people forecast where to spend precious resources… instead of leaving it up to the more efficient forces of supply and demand. Result: a wasteful system, full of human error and shrunken potential… exactly what Obama is forcing upon us.
Report Post »chips1
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 7:52pmI didn‘t see Obama’s high speed rail system anywhere in the pictures. He is going to be pissed when he goes home.
Report Post »inexiletill2012
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:11amWe can give China all our illegal immigrants for the empty cities and call our debt even
Report Post »walkwithme1966
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:42pmGood idea – and solves problems for both of us!!! http://wp.me/pYLB7-Od
Report Post »Islesfordian
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:10amThe brilliance of central planning.
Report Post »G.W. Dobbs
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:24amSIXTY-FOUR MILLION residencies with no one in them. I wonder how they keep these homes from
Report Post »going to trash like we have in Detroit?
Islesfordian
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:37amIt‘s easier to keep a city from becoming trahsed if you don’t have people living in it. Detroit‘s problem is that it doesn’t have enough EMPLOYED people living in it.
Report Post »Country
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:06amWhy don’t the commies here move there?
Report Post »ORSO
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:31amThat’s a brilliant idea!!!!!!!!!!!! Not sure the Chinese’s would want them though. And the Chinese Government would force them to work and most think there entitled to a free ride so the 0.75 cents an hour wage may not work out so well for them.
It’s nice to dream though………
Report Post »dcwu
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:04pm@orso
but you get free housing and you get free healthcare and you get free food and you get free work and you get someone to watch over you …
Report Post »ProgressiveLiberalMarine
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:03amLooks like the beginning of a Zombie Movie.
Report Post »NOBALONEY
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:20pmlarger versions of what the u.s. government built in the nevada, or new mexico desert to test effects of of a nucear blast.
Report Post »13th Imam
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:02amFar East Detroit.
Report Post »Dakota
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:43amNo…if it was Detroit, there would be windows broken and drunks outside.
Report Post »starman70
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:52amAnd don’t forget the druggies.
Report Post »LikesToFightGuy
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:48pmand a few houses burning…
Report Post »JP4JOY
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:02amIs this where the Chinese are going to send us when they foreclose on the US
Report Post »8jrts
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:00pmJP,
Report Post »Don‘t think that’s quite right…after they foreclose on us, we won’t have 50% to put down nor anyway to pay the rest in 3 years even if we had the down payment. I think these are for the Chinese. We will be in the “one room/two person only” slums visiting our kids once a year.
And the left looks to China as a model for us?? WOW!! Time is now to do something about it!!
JP4JOY
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:06pmI was being silly, yes you may have hit the proverbial nail on the head!
Report Post »sWampy
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:02amWoo, woo, take our wealth, export it to China so they can piss it away, good plan liberals/free trade morons.
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:30amSo your argument against free trade is that people shouldn’t be free to spend their money as they like, as somebody else may use it for things you do not like? What’s your solution, controlling our individual economic decisions down to what kind of toilet paper we’re allowed to buy and ensuring that whomever receives our money does the “right thing” with it?
Isn’t that called fascism? Just wondering.
Report Post »sWampy
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:12pmNo limiting our export of raw materials going out and limiting our import of finished goods through tariffs. As long as nations like China use slave labor, and pollute the world like there is no tomorrow, free trade is a lie to redistribute the wealth of this nation to other nations. We are sending all our raw materials over seas to be turned into finished goods. The entire textile/furniture industry left the us not because of labor costs, but because the government gave bonuses to the cotton farmers/and to the cattle producers that made them more money to give the cotton/hides to china than to sell it to companies here. Then they tax tanned leather coming in from china, but not finished goods, tax bolts of cloth, but not finished clothes/furniture.
Report Post »RightPolitically
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:01amStore our DEMOCRATS and associated criminals there!
Report Post »urrybr
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:10pmI wonder if Spooky Dude would like to buy some real estate? Socialists, Progressives and Democrats will never understand that IT JUST DOESN’T WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DO YOU UNDERSTAND, NOW??????????????
Report Post »flagbearer
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:00amWhy do I get the feeling that there’s more to these cities than meets the eye? The Chinese are known for puzzles that fool the eye.
Report Post »felina g
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:02pmI am with you.
I had a friend who lived in China and she said they have vast underground cities as well. Panels pull back and their are networks of them. Wish I would have asked more questions.
Obviously they plan ahead, but for what ? And whom ?
Report Post »bassist237
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:00amI could not imagine seeing that place from the ground level… walking around. It would be so eerie, yet so incredibly AWESOME at the same time.
Report Post »Your Name Here
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:45pmThis would be the perfect place to film disaster, end of the world, and living dead movies.
Report Post »avenger
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 7:44pmdude…try hiking in the rocky mountains or snorkeling in the caribbean..
Report Post »TheBMT
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 1:53amIve seen these awhile back. The vid is new. But the pics are old news. There was a pic of a college campus that was able to hold a million students?
Report Post »Gonzo
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 10:59amSweet! no traffic, no Obama. Let’s go.
Report Post »GrannyATL
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:03amWell, just think about it. When China rules the world, they‘ll be ready to take on all the residents of countries they’ve overtaken.
China thinks long term…..they’ve been planning on owning the world for a while, it seems.
Report Post »Revere1
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:04amYeah, sounds like a great deal! Central planning fails spectacularly again. Because the government thinks it works on paper, they go ahead without any evidence it will work: http://www.battlefield315.com/2011/03/socialism-explained.html Socialists are the same all over, and they always fail.
Report Post »Ironmaan
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:07amIt reminds me of a Twilight Zone episode.
Report Post »http://guerillatics.com
hersey10
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:08amThis what happens when an economy is based on infinite growth .
Report Post »Clydie_Clyde
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:12amChina is a dangerous enemy that needs to be reckoned with.
Report Post »Libertyluvnmomma
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:15amWell I guess when you kill one millions of babies every year. They just won’t come if you build it. cause they are dead.
Report Post »rwsasinger
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:16amChina is readying itself for its new citizens; cities made for its debtors; those who cannot repay their loans. Better start learning Mandarin.
Report Post »Libertyluvnmomma
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:16amexcuse my -“one millions of babies ”typo
Report Post »Anti_Spock
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:16amChina isn’t doing this for no reason. Maybe they are future gulags for the liberal elite.
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:21amChina’s not first at this. African countries have been trying to get villagers out of mud huts and into wonderfully built concrete homes. Only problem: it’s not where they want to live, floor plans aren’t adapted to their families, and, oh yeah, forced mortgages. That’s right, they don’t want to live there, never did, but the govt is forcing them to pay anyway. How’s that for socialist, statist realities for ya?
Report Post »ClockKing
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:24amThat’s what I was thinking. A whole bunch of Gault’s Gulches. Wonder how much the Chinese want for them?
Report Post »TexasCommonSense
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:28amSilly Communists…
Report Post »SnapTie
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:34amThis just shows how the poorest of Americans live better than many Chinese could ever hope for…
Report Post »Uncle Crusty
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:54amROFLMAO!!! So this is China’s boom huh? What a waste…Communism doesn’t work progressives – see for yourselves – still want to bring revolt here to have this? I have to laugh and the ignorance and sheer stupidity of the left!
Report Post »Showtime
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:57amCrime level must be zero!
Report Post »vic138
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:08pmExports are down and this is how china is keeping up its gdp. Can’t last forever.
Report Post »Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:10pmThis is what they do for expanding their economy each and every year, to keep the population happy and their government in power. No cars is similar to what the dingbats in Europe are now squaking about by the year 2050, with over 1/2 the vehicles gone by 2020 at the earlies.
Report Post »Lincoln1
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:12pmSeeing as the debt we owe China perhaps they can take it out in trade. We can foot the bill to ship all the illegals coming across our border to them, they can settle there, cities and housing is plentiful and I am sure there are jobs that the Chinese won’t do, so this has to be a win win situation
PS……and for all those that hate the US they now have a place to go also, double win win
Report Post »MinnesotaMARINE
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:13pmOOOOhhh Don‘t worry they need a place for the American’s that owe them in debt.It’s housing for us. So we can be the labor force for the elite in the new world order. Also look for camp style structures
Report Post »for the Re Education of the stubborn Americans that will not conform. And if you do not “re educate” there will be a place for you two.
tradexpertbuysell
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:17pmOh that reminds me:
Ayn Rand’s movie comes out on IRS Day (April 15th).
Report Post »davuf
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:24pmKind of makes you think China might be a bubble. They have mandatory unsustainable growth. They build these cities while not providing thier poorest citizens with the education and healthcare they were promised.
Report Post »smithclar3nc3
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:28pmWell there you have all these communist and socialist that don‘t like capitalism there’s 64,000,000 vacant homes in China waiting for you.
Report Post »free2bme1961
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:29pm@rwsasinger, since most who live here, probably aren’t accustomed to a steady diet of rice, that thought sorta’ makes my stomach turn. :((
Report Post »BarbieBabe
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:40pmNow we know where we can send Soros, Both Clinton, Van Jones, Dohn, Ayres,Farrakhan and all the others. This is Utopia? Let them have it.
Report Post »Gold Coin & Economic News
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:49pmChina just doesn’t seem to get it. They have a long history of deluding themselves. During Mao‘s Great Leap Forward he wouldn’t listen to anyone and as a result of trying to amp up agricultural product to unrealistic levels 45 million people starved, froze, were beaten to death or died of exhaustion. Mao completely looked the other way until he couldn’t any longer and the country went bankrupt.
The same thing is going to happen here with these ghost cities. They probably had some sort of city building campaign that they thought would bring them into the forefront of modernization and it will only bankrupt them because they are fools. Kind of like the same path we are on.
Report Post »gman46
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:16pmGrannyATL;
China thinks long term…..they’ve been planning on owning the world for a while, it seems.
True but China is very unstable, They have done this before and collapsed several times before. Read, “The Next Hundred Years” by George Friedman.
Stoic one
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:28pmIf this is what they are doing publicly, just imagine what is being spent on the military.
Report Post »ltb
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:34pmThey may have built these cities for people who will be displaced by the Three Gorges Dam, because several huge cities (huge for us, a small city in China has 10 million people) will be underwater after the land behind the dam has been flooded. I could be completely wrong though, it’s just what I heard from someone in my family who visited China a couple of years ago.
Report Post »AriBenTZion
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:38pmCan you guys imagine what it would feel like to walk around this city at night?
Twilight Zone
Report Post »benbibik
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:46pmThis is what happens when China’s rulers requested an upgrade of their Sim City Game.
Report Post »gman46
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 1:59pmHers the basics, For the Chinese Economy to keep the gap between the U.S economy, not to even begin to close that gap, it has to keep a constant growth of 8.2 % to our 2.5% approximately.
Report Post »Please take a look at StratFor, the think tank they do this for a living.
Remember what Beck said, the left likes to repeat things, hoping people will believe it.
t00nces2
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:11pmWe should buy them….
Report Post »abc
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:17pmWow. I cannot believe how ill-informed the folks commenting here are about China. But then I recall watching Beck talk about the subject a few times and hearing my 9-year-old son (and this is a true story) gasp when he heard Beck make two factually incorrect statements within a 5-minute span. I had taken my kids to China last August, so they already knew that what he was saying is false, but apparently many others commenting here are as ignorant as he was when my son and I happened to catch him ranting on television. But enough about Beck’s ignorance…
China has achieved, since Deng Xiao-ping opened the first free economic zones in Shenzen in 1978, the fastest rate of sustained economic growth of any nation in the history of the world. It far outpaces the progress made by Germany or Japan after WWII, or the US since the late 1800′s, or the UK during its period of rapid industrialization before that. There is no precedent for this level of wealth creation that has lifted hundreds of millions out of poverty. It has shamed India, the other major country with roughly one billion citizens, to go faster in its economic reforms; hwoever, India continues to lag far behind China and now fears the Middle Kingdom’s economic prowess, rejecting free trade arrangements with a country that will crush it in nearly every industry.
How did this happen? Because China has become more capitalist than the West. The Communist Party came very close to losing control just before and after the Tiananmen Massacre, when students began to coopt workers to protest against the lack of opportunity in the country. Mao had defeated Chiang Kai-shek and his US backers decades earlier by winning the idealistic students and then the workers, so the Communist Party was sensitive to this risk to its hegemony, which it sees as critical also to stability in China. As a result, the Communist Party jettisoned communism in favor of capitalism to an extent that not even Deng could have imagined. This process had already started, but it accelerated rapidly, with larger free economic zones being launched and more effort to free capital controls. Hong Kong and Taiwanese money rapidly flowed into the country and the manufacturing base grew rapidly. Controls on migration were also lessened, so cheap labor from inland could come to work in those factories. All of this freedom was cordoned off on the economic side, with the Communist Party continuing to demand one-party rule on the political side. But even here, there have been reforms, since the Communist Party is now run in a consensual way rather than under a single all-powerful dictator like Mao or even Deng. An enlightened bureaucracy has emerged that can be more efficient and intelligent in policy-making than Western democracies, although it is susceptible to greater corruption and failure over time. For the moment, it puts our Congress to shame.
The Chinese are unified in their goal to return to normalcy. China has been the leading economy and civilization in the world for 9 of the last 10 millennia, and it wants to put the humiliation of the last 400 years (in which Britain, France, Germany, Japan and even the US has humiliated it). Therefore, the entire country is energized around the goal of material progress. Polls show that the Chinese love their country and government more than any other country’s citizens do theirs. Corruption is remarkably low, although it is also met with Saudi like ruthlessness when it occurs. People are indeed crushed by this system, as when farmers lose their land without fair compensation to build roads, or when workers commit suicide at FoxConn because working conditions are terrible. But the conditions that would shock us in America are still far better than they were under Mao, when the Great Leap Forward killed millions, or under Deng. Without a proper understanding of historical perspective, the narrative (like Beck’s) becomes unhinged.
Given the unified goal of the Chinese people, their adoption of capitalism (which in many ways makes all countries including the US, UK or even Hong Kong look staid in comparison), and their relatively honest and extremely intelligent formation of policy by enlightened bureaucrats, it is likely that China will continue to grow another 30+ years at unprecedented rates. The growth will slow from 10-12% to 7-8%, but that is still fast enough for China to pass the US in wealth and size in the next 20 years. It will take more time than that for them to take over global leadership, since they will still lag us in terms of technology, business practices, rule of law, political stability/democratization, development of civil society, etc. But those who are putting down or underestimating the Chinese do so at their own peril. China already has put together an unprecedented track record over the last 30+ years, and the long view, measured over millennia, shows great superiority to much of the West.
I don’t know whether the city photographed here will be filled in a year, as many others have been over the last two decades, or will require a few years to grow into. Either way, to judge China on a single picture and Glenn Beck rant, while ignoring both the short and long views of the country’s history seem rather foolish to me.
abc
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:28pmGMAN, you need a think tank to solve that for you? Please. What you wrote is not even correct. If you grow out economy ($14.66T in 2010) versus China’s ($5.87T in 2010) at the 2.5% and 8.2% growth rates over time, then you find that the gap between our economies shrinks from $8.8T in 2010 to $39T in 2023 and falls from 60% of the US economy to under 20%. China passes the US in 2027 on these growth assumptions, which I think are a little high for China and about right for the US. Based on these calculations, what you wrote is TOTALLY WRONG!
This is math. Let me introduce you to it.
He who fails to run the numbers is doomed to talk nonsense.
Report Post »t00nces2
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:28pmHoly WOT, ABC!!!! I should read that.
Report Post »american1st
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:35pmi propose a exchange, we send all the American socialists there to fill their empty city‘s and live out there utopian fantasy’s, and they send us the Chinese who are seeking real freedom
Report Post »longhorn mama
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 2:49pm@ABC
Report Post »There is a lot of truth to what you wrote but there is a glaring omission. China’s one child policy. Even if the government completely lifts it, most ChiComs are already brainwashed to believe that extremely smaller families are better for their personal future. Government incentives to increase birth raters have been spectacularly unsuccessful in other countries. See Singapore and Japan. You cannot continue to grow a country or its economy with a constantly shrinking population. All the modernized countries are dealing with this problem and none of them had the girl killing, one child atrocities that China did. The only one that has been able to continue population growth has been the USA and that has a lot to do with our constant stream of immigrants. So, go ahead and blow me off as ignorant if you want but my husband is Chinese and was born over there. (And we have four beautiful children!)
paperpushermj
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:06pmThis explains the shortages and subsequence higher prices for US made building supplies.
Report Post »A Doctors Labor Is Not My Right
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:36pmParkour is going to take off so fast over there! :D
Report Post »Anonymous T. Irrelevant
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:42pmI thought they had an enourmas population, where are the people living, on farms?
Report Post »Taquoshi
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:48pmLincoln1 Posted on March 29, 2011 at 12:12pm
Seeing as the debt we owe China perhaps they can take it out in trade. We can foot the bill to ship all the illegals coming across our border to them, they can settle there, cities and housing is plentiful and I am sure there are jobs that the Chinese won’t do, so this has to be a win win situation
PS……and for all those that hate the US they now have a place to go also, double win win
******************************
I like your idea, I like it alot. There are also alot of misplaced Arabs in the refugee camps. I bet they would like living there. And that would make everything nice and multicultural.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:49pmFree housing for all!!! This is the liberal dream!!! Does each house come with an iPod and laptop, or does each house come with a ghetto kid…I get confused!!
Report Post »UPSETVET
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:53pmJbbs have long been “outsourced” to China. What’s next, American citizens to fill the ghost towns China has built that the Chinese don’t want to live in ?
Report Post »abc
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 3:57pmLonghorn, you are correct. That was an omission, and hardly the only one. It is tough to cover much of such a rich and complex civilization in a mere blog entry. And you are both right to conclude that most Chinese saw that dramatic step as necessary to ensure that the country would not face starvation–people forget that China actually has far less airable land than countries of roughly equivalent size like the US or Brazil–so that was a very real risk for a long time. And you are correct that it now presents another great challenge because the Chinese could grow old before they grow rich. This is another key reason why they are so singularly focused on rapid economic development. They want to have health care and a decent amount of savings in their old age, when the population greys. They are saving and working like mad for the next 20 years because they are aware of this demographic (self-imposed) time bomb. But they are not like Japan. They have no problems getting families in the rural areas to have more than one child, which is now being allowed, as it also is with the very well-to-do. They also have more time than Japan before they grow very old. But while you can debate the merits of the one-child policy and whether starvation averted and food self-sufficiency achieved was worth the demographic pressures they now face, you would be hard-pressed to find someone that doubts that China will not overcome this problem as well in its quest to retake the top spot in the world. India, which will be a more populous country by 2030 than China, will also be poorer on a per-capita and aggregate basis. The Chinese will point to that and argue that they followed the right path for themselves. Unlike Americans, Chinese do not proselytize and do not believe that their modernization path is right for everyone. They are the opposite of us, who believe that we have the best system and all should follow it. I’m not judging, by the way, although I do have views… I’m just stating facts.
Report Post »butler180
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:22pmThe Chinese can entice all the welfare people in the US who are homeless to move there but
Report Post »I doubt it, they are required to work in China as well as pay their bills.
Plus they (welfare recipients) can only have one child. They will not be paid (as in USA) for having children.
avenger
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:32pmah..I love it..government planning at its best…owe bama must loving it…
Report Post »Lord_Frostwind
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:34pmDo these images remind anyone of “I Am Legend”? Seeing these cities that are just empty like humans simply vanished is just disturbing. Here’s looking at Detroit within another decade, if it still exists.
Report Post »gman46
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:49pmActually ABC your wrong as well, I over stated true but calculating it by hand here is what I get;
China
2010 5.87 Trillion
2011 $6,351,339,999,999
2012 $6,872,149,879,998
2013 $7,435,666,170,157
2014 $8,045,390,796,109
2015 $8,705,112,841,389
2016 $9,418,932,094,382
2017 $10,191,284,526,121
2018 $11,026,969,857,262
2019 $11,931,181,385,557
2020 $12,909,538,259,172
US
2010 $14.7 Trillion
2011 $15,067,500,000,000
2012 $15,444,187,500,000
2013 $15,830,292,187,500
2014 $16,226,049,492,187
2015 $16,631,700,729,491
2016 $17,047,493,247,728
2017 $17,473,680,578,921
2018 $17,910,522,593,394
2019 $18,358,285,658,228
2020 $18,817,242,799,683
Which shows,
Difference at 2010 : $8,830,000,000,000
Difference at 2020 : $5,907,704,540,511
which makes
a delta of $2,922,295,459,489 in ten years if extrapolate for another 10 years
They still won’t exceed us by 2030, maybe by 2040-2050 if they can remain stable for that long, and they can keep a constant 8.2% and U.S at 2.5%, not likely since for 2010 GDP was 3.30% and is right now 3.1% for 2011 so far.
You sound like some progressives I ran into, they almost said the same thing to the letter, and there were two of them, (they seem to go in packs to support one another, good tactic, just we know about it so it doesn’t work) they also said they were there.
I just don’t see them maintaining that growth for the next 40 years.
And oh ya there a lot of corruption in China as well as drug use, it’s one of the growing problems, illicit drug use has grown even faster than their economy.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/778357.stm
and corruption,
http://www.theage.com.au/world/corruption-in-china-growing-at-least-as-fast-as-the-economy-20100108-lyxe.html
Take in the fact that the Government will “cook the books” so they look good, they will never want the rest of the world to think of them as inferior. We really can’t trust what they tell us.
Then add they have almost zero innovation themselves, people can’t be blamed, you can only innovate in a free society.
So no it ain’t quit what you say it is. You can take your BS somewhere else.
Report Post »Gas137
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 4:51pmI want to live there. But I’ll need someone to cut the grass.
Report Post »Thatsitivehadenough
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 5:08pmI‘m not sure if this isn’t something more ominous.
Are the Chinese in cahoots with someone who may be planning to ship people from other countries to these cities in China?
The equivalent of sending people East to ‘work camps’?
Report Post »abc
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 5:24pmGMAN, your figure for the US in 2020 is about $50B too high, which might be because you rounded up in the initial year, or it might be because you simply made a mistake in your hand calculations. But you really should run your numbers out to 2030 on those growth rates. As I said before, you’ll find that China passes us in around 2027. The math doesn’t lie. Furthermore, those were your assumed growth rates, not mine, so you cannot start changing the growth rate assumptions on me to make your case. That doesn’t fly.
As for the validity of the assumptions, as I said, I thought China would grow 7-8% over the next 30 years, as opposed to the 10-12% posted over the last 30. Many China experts have put out similar numbers/forecasts. While you would like to suggest that the US can grow at 3.3% going forward since it has averaged that rate since ‘47. The problem with this is three-fold: 1) WWII produced outsized growth in the US in the post-war boom since the rest of the world had no capacity to grow for several years after the war when they were trying to just get basic infrastructure up and running again; 2) WWII produced a ton of technological innovation (e.g., the transistor, the jet engine) that led to a productivity boom measured in unprecedented rates of labor productivity growth that have since dissipated and are not expected to return (barring another major war); and 3) the US benefited in the 90‘s and 00’s from excess expansion of credit, which also inflated the growth numbers in the recent past, but now the country faces ten years of painful deleveraging to unwind those boosts to growth. All of this means that growth will likely lag that 3.3% rate going forward.
In any case, you should really pay more careful attention to the math, which doesn‘t support your claim that the delta between our economy’s size and China’s will remain roughly constant over the next ten years, nor does it support your claim that China will take longer than 20 years to exceed the size of our economy. Try pulling out Microsoft Excel and running the numbers properly.
Report Post »abc
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 5:41pmGMAN, you also wrote:
“I just don’t see them maintaining that growth for the next 40 years….there a lot of corruption in China as well as drug use, it’s one of the growing problems, illicit drug use has grown even faster than their economy.”
The Chinese have a huge surplus of college-educated workers, as well as poor factory workers from the poor rural areas. They have relatively high underemployment rates, so the drug problem is not an employment problem. The government deals with drug users and dealers ruthlessly, so it will not cause crime or interfere with economic activity in any way. I have visited China many times and I have taken my wife and small kids through cities twice the size of NYC late at night without any fear of being harmed or robbed. The drug problems there would be dreams for our police and social workers in our major cities or even small towns. You have no idea what you are talking about. Fast growth off of a super tiny base is not a problem, but a statistical anomoly.
“Take in the fact that the Government will “cook the books” so they look good, they will never want the rest of the world to think of them as inferior. We really can’t trust what they tell us.”
There is no question that we have better corporate governance and accountability–thanks to regulations, enforced by the SEC. Conservatives like to malign FDR and his “socialist” policies, but the Securities Act helped make America into the modern financial capital that it now is, ending the corruption that still exists in China and elsewhere. Score one point for the government and regulations… But China is rapidly fixing those problems. Their securities laws are still immature. I have a friend who used to be chief counsel for Lehman Brothers (when it existed) and who now is based in China helping the Chinese modernize their laws. It will take time, but they are moving in the right direction. They are less corrupt than India or Brazil or Russia or Mexico, so of the major emerging economies, they are in relatively good shape. This is not going to stop their growth. Not by a long shot.
“Then add they have almost zero innovation themselves, people can’t be blamed, you can only innovate in a free society.”
You have no proof at all for this claim, which is not surprising, since it flies in the face of the facts. There is a wonderful museum in Taipei that contains the most important pieces of Chinese art that could be moved, and which Chiang Kai-shek and the Nationalists moved to Taiwan when they lost to Mao. It contains more pieces than the Louvre, Uffici and Moma put together. In the atrium of the museum is a time line running near the ceiling all the way around the room. On top, it shows Chinese historical milestones and underneath Western ones. What is amazing is that for nearly all of human history until about 400 years ago, China was the innovator. All major innovations moved from East to West. Examples: paper, gun powder, cross bows, horse stirrups, double entry accounting, etc. The Chinese civilization was copied by the rest of th world. That innovative spirit has not died at all. There are many overseas Chinese that have won Nobel Prizes in the sciences for innovative discoveries (e.g., current Energy Sec’y Stephen Chu), and many Chinese have started companies and created new organizations (e.g., founders of Wang Labs, Zappos, Broadcom, etc.). And the Chinese in China have come up with new technologies that are ahead of the West in key areas, like in wireless (TDS-CDMA) and energy (CO2 sequestration technology). I have a friend who has licensed the latter technology outside of China. He has told me that they have to lower their efficiency estimates, since the real numbers are dismissed as fake by Western companies like Duke or Bechtel. The Chinese just produced a stealth fighter. They just broke the record for the fastest computer in the world. You really are ignoring a lot here, but claiming that they have produced zero innovation. Your ancestors of 10,000 years ago were still living in caves when the Chinese first started composing poetry and calculating mathematics (that you still haven’t mastered).
“So no it ain’t quit what you say it is. You can take your BS somewhere else.”
Facts are never BS. And your opinions masquerading as facts do not fool anyone.
Report Post »DisillusionedDaily
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 5:59pmWe could send a bunch of our illegal aliens over there to help the Chinese populate those cities!
Report Post »A Doctors Labor Is Not My Right
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 6:07pmHere’s what I came up with.
Year | China (8.2%) | USA (2.5%) | Difference
Report Post »2010 | 5,870,000,000,000 | 14,660,000,000,000 | 8,790,000,000,000
2011 | 6,351,340,000,000 | 15,026,500,000,000 | 8,675,160,000,000
2012 | 6,872,149,880,000 | 15,402,162,500,000 | 8,530,012,620,000
2013 | 7,435,666,170,160 | 15,787,216,562,500 | 8,351,550,392,340
2014 | 8,045,390,796,113 | 16,181,896,976,563 | 8,136,506,180,449
2015 | 8,705,112,841,394 | 16,586,444,400,977 | 7,881,331,559,582
2016 | 9,418,932,094,389 | 17,001,105,511,001 | 7,582,173,416,612
2017 | 10,191,284,526,129 | 17,426,133,148,776 | 7,234,848,622,647
2018 | 11,026,969,857,271 | 17,861,786,477,495 | 6,834,816,620,224
2019 | 11,931,181,385,567 | 18,308,331,139,433 | 6,377,149,753,865
2020 | 12,909,538,259,184 | 18,766,039,417,919 | 5,856,501,158,735
2021 | 13,968,120,396,437 | 19,235,190,403,367 | 5,267,070,006,930
2022 | 15,113,506,268,945 | 19,716,070,163,451 | 4,602,563,894,506
2023 | 16,352,813,782,998 | 20,208,971,917,537 | 3,856,158,134,539
2024 | 17,693,744,513,204 | 20,714,196,215,475 | 3,020,451,702,271
2025 | 19,144,631,563,287 | 21,232,051,120,862 | 2,087,419,557,575
2026 | 20,714,491,351,477 | 21,762,852,398,884 | 1,048,361,047,407
2027 | 22,413,079,642,298 | 22,306,923,708,856 | -106,155,933,442
2028 | 24,250,952,172,966 | 22,864,596,801,577 | -1,386,355,371,389
2029 | 26,239,530,251,149 | 23,436,211,721,617 | -2,803,318,529,532
2030 | 28,391,171,731,743 | 24,022,117,014,657 | -4,369,054,717,086
cemerius
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 7:07pmah ha! that’s their plan with comrade obama? lol
Report Post »avenger
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 7:13pmdude…you can find this peacefulness in detroit,cleveland and parts of philadelphia…..yes all run by lib democrats…
Report Post »ottodiedacktick
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 8:34pm@ABC
I can see that Soros pays you by-the-word, but don‘t forget that he doesn’t pay us to read it!
Report Post »ottodiedacktick
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 8:47pm@ABC
You sound like you are ready to join China when it tries to invade us through Mexico. What’s wong wee havva tu meenie gans?
Report Post »Salamander
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 8:58pmBarney Frank-the second coming? (No pun intended!)
Report Post »WINNEBAGOMAN
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 9:01pmAnd don’t forget: China must… MUST… MUST!!! grow at that rate just to stay afloat. Beck has been asking what the next “bubble” was. China may not be the next bubble, but they are a growing bubble. Don’t be too speedy with investing in them.
A bigger problem is that if we don’t start to get our financial affairs in order, and stop HAVING to borrow from China, when they fall, we’ll fall further.
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 9:14pmAh I see. That’s where they are going to take Americans when Americans are taken into captivity, they think.
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 9:16pmI see, some Americans will go into captivity in China, and some into Europe. They think.
Report Post »ottodiedacktick
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 9:26pm@ABC:
American civilization in the New World is roughly 400 years old (1607-2011) and Chinese civilization is at least 3,500 years old (1,700 BC – 2011 AD). Our (U.S.) civilization is roughly 1/9 th as old as theirs and our GDP is almost 3 times greater than theirs with 1/4 the population.
So what are you talking about? I know that I‘m stupid because I don’t understand the logic of your “thesis”.
I use sensitive skin Dove soap to wash my brain, what did you use on yours?
Report Post »Pelling1020
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 9:33pmWonder if Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae hold the mortgages and they’re forclosed properties?
Report Post »gman46
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 10:04pm@ABC, I did calculate it twice, came out to the same thing. It’s easily possible to off a little, I did use the numbers exactly as I stated them, 8.2% China and 2.5% for the US. I was throwing in a little reality since yes it has been over 3% since 2010, I wasn’t changing them, just stating facts. If we use the progression I used, with approximately $2.9 Trillion every ten years closing the gap, it still will take longer than 202, in the 2040′ – 2050′s if the rater holds out.
With that said, I seriously doubt it. Only way they can do that is if they keep there labor at slave wages. For 40 some years?
And yes you say they crack down on drug users. They sure do, I’ve seen how they treat criminals, or dissidents. How far do you think a country can go based on fear? You said they love their country, I a lot do, but I‘m sure there’s more that are terrified of their government. Nothing good comes from oppression. I actually don’t have anything against the people of China, but it’s government can go.
And No I am correct, your stating how China was centuries ago. Not China today or the past 100 years. Big difference, I agree China has a lot of art and a lot of advances from centuries ago, but nothing in the past 100 years, or for that matter the past 40 years.
Report Post »I’m sure since you love Communist China you are either from China or Europe and have never lived in the U.S. As a Canadian defending America, I could never believe your from the U.S. I’ve never met an American who would put a totalitarian run country over their own, besides fervently defend it over his own.
leftcoastslut
Posted on March 29, 2011 at 11:10pmI can see the headline now, Hilary takes out Nancy, “Who is getting the PENTHOUSE?”
Report Post »….funny we think it’s ludicrous… it’s real to them… baaaa… baaa
abc
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 12:16amOtto,
“American civilization in the New World is roughly 400 years old (1607-2011) and Chinese civilization is at least 3,500 years old (1,700 BC – 2011 AD). Our (U.S.) civilization is roughly 1/9 th as old as theirs and our GDP is almost 3 times greater than theirs with 1/4 the population.”
American civilization stands on the shoulders of European civilization, so it represents the development of Western civilization over the last 3,000 years or more. China is the cradle of East Asian civilization, and mostly sent innovations outward to the rest of Asia (e.g., Japan, Korea). They also happened to innovate faster than the rest for most of the last two or three millennia. Just because China went to sleep for 400 years doesn‘t mean that it was not innovative for most of the time that we’ve had civilization. The population of China has been somewhat larger than the West over most of this period, but this is because they were more innovative and able to grow and sustain a larger population.
GMAN, your numbers are wrong. A Doctor got the same numbers that I did. So you are wrong. And your claim that China has done nothing for the last 40 years is just not true. You are totally ignoring the unprecedented growth that China has put up in the last 30 years. It has never happened in human history. It is amazing, and you cannot even see it, much less appreciate it.
Report Post »snidley-whiplash
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 12:31amCome on give me a break, are you sure thats not DETROIT
Report Post »Aesculf
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 1:35amlol
Report Post »slimster
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 2:05amwhat kind of investors have enough money to buy up the properties and want to over charge on them by %1000 knowing they are not going to rent them or sell them..? it is not the poor Chinese people.
Report Post »edwierd
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 7:12amFEMA camps?!
Report Post »gman46
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 9:43amABC wrote,
“You are totally ignoring the unprecedented growth that China has put up in the last 30 years. It has never happened in human history. It is amazing, and you cannot even see it, much less appreciate it.”
Sigh, no not really, but if you realize as I’m sure at some point you can, that it’s fairly easy to have such growth when most of your country is in poverty, and you are starting out at the bottom. Sure it’s easy to have this growth, for awhile.
Report Post »ottodiedacktick
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 10:26am@ABC
American civilization stands on the shoulders of European civilization, so it represents the development of Western civilization over the last 3,000 years or more. China is the cradle of East Asian civilization, and mostly sent innovations outward to the rest of Asia (e.g., Japan, Korea). They also happened to innovate faster than the rest for most of the last two or three millennia. Just because China went to sleep for 400 years doesn‘t mean that it was not innovative for most of the time that we’ve had civilization. The population of China has been somewhat larger than the West over most of this period, but this is because they were more innovative and able to grow and sustain a larger population.
*****blah*****blah*****blah*****blah******************************************************************************
Your position makes no sense. The extension of European culture includes all of North and South America, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, etc. This is not limited to the U.S.
If you combine all these countries, your argument loses even more ground. Oh, and I guess I would have to include Europe, doh!
Report Post »Love Bandit Bestid
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 10:38amthey’ll just poison the food they sell us.
we’re doomed.
Report Post »abc
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 12:48pmOtto,
Are you totally ignorant? The folks here are saying that China has done very little, cannot sustainably grow, can’t innovate, etc. I have pointed out that they’ve been doing that forever and, in recent history, faster than anyone has ever seen. So now you are off counting countries influenced by the West vs. by China. How silly. First, China is not a country but a civilization in its own right. It has more people than all of the West combined. But so what? It is the progress that it has furthered that matters, not the number of different colors it has put on a globe. You really are not very bright, are you??
Report Post »Heather Mae 74
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 1:10pmI liked it better when China just wanted to isolate themselves from the rest of the world. Just another problem in the world that the red coats created that we are left dealing with (ie iraq, pakistan, afganistan, ect)
Report Post »Psalm 144 verse 1
Posted on March 30, 2011 at 2:21pmThey’re “practice” cities to see how well their stolen, reengineered weapons work.
Report Post »toru66
Posted on April 2, 2011 at 7:39pmGranny your missing it! Capitalism in the hands of the Chi-Coms is like children playing with a nuclear warhead, they know nothing about it can’t quite set it off at first but eventually…. BANG! Their nation will implode into chaos. Does the world UNSUSTAINABLE sound familiar…. this is on a much wider scale… , people things are about to get interesting….
Report Post »