See This Atheist Blogger‘s Stunning Announcement That She’s Converting to Catholicism
- Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:30am by
Billy Hallowell
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Atheist blogger Leah Libresco shocked the secular community this week when she announced on her Patheos blog that she has converted to Christianity. Her article, entitled, “This is my last post for the Patheos Atheist Portal,” explained her conversion to Catholicism, which has sent shock-waves through the atheist blogosphere.
In her post, Libresco details her personal struggles with understanding the root of moral law. Obviously, non-believers don’t see morality as coming from a central source. Instead, they see humanity as living on its own, disconnected from any fertile source of knowledge and goodness. For Libresco, this ideal has come full-circle, as she inevitably arrived at an understanding that aligns with a Christ-centered world-view.
Debate after debate and discussion after discussion, the non-believing blogger details how she found herself constantly exploring this paradigm — that is, until she finally accepted the notion that truth and moral goodness come from God. She explains:
I believed that the Moral Law wasn’t just a Platonic truth, abstract and distant. It turns out I actually believed it was some kind of Person, as well as Truth. And there was one religion that seemed like the most promising way to reach back to that living Truth. I asked my friend what he suggest we do now, and we prayed the night office of the Liturgy of the Hours together (I’ve kept up with that since). Then I suggested hugs and playing Mumford and Sons really, really loudly.
After I changed my mind, I decided to take a little time to make sure I really believed what I thought I believed, before telling my friends, family, and, now, all of you. That left me with the question of what to do about my atheism blog. My solution was to just not write anything I disagreed with. Enough of my friends had accused me of writing in a crypto-Catholic style that I figured no one would notice if I were actually crypto-Catholic for a month and a half (i.e. everything from “Upon this ROC…” on).
Despite making this major announcement, Libresco admits that there are some elements of the Christian faith — and Catholicism in particular — that she’s still not sure about. Among them, the church’s teaching about homosexuality. But based on her final blog post announcing her conversion, she seems set on a path to explore these specified issues as diligently as she has the overarching existence of a higher power.
Libresco continues, promising to further discuss her conversion in future blog posts:
This post isn’t the final word on my conversion. I’m sure there’s a lot more explaining and arguing to do, so be a little charitable in your read of this post and try to give me a little time to expand my ideas over the next few weeks. (Based on my in-person arguments to date, it seems like most of my atheist friends disagree two or three steps back from my deciding Morality is actually God. They usually diverge back around the bit where I assert morality, like math, is objective and independent of humans. As one of my friends said, “Well, I guess if I were a weird quasi-Platonist virtue ethicist, this would probably convince me”).
Image Credit: Patheos
Responses, thus far, have been intriguing. Obviously, many people in the secular community are opposed to this massive transition, but at least one prominent atheist is being somewhat supportive. On his “Friendly Atheist” blog, Hemant Mehta wrote the following about the conversion:
It happens. Far less frequently than the other way around, but it happens. (A few years ago, a popular blogger called The Raving Atheist announced he was a Christian and changed his site to The Raving Theist.)
I won’t pretend to understand whatever she’s going through. But whenever you make a big announcement like that, it’s like a huge weight has been lifted off your shoulders. It’s even harder to do that when you talk about religion so publicly. Anyway, I wish Leah the best.
The comments on the post in which Libresco made the announcement range from surprised to enthusiastic. He blog, “Unequally Yoked,” will be moved to Patheos’ Catholic channel starting today, where she will continue to blog about her transformation.
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Comments (560)
searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:43amOne thing is for sure – you have been granted a unique opportunity to win over a lot of young people. For, one does not come to God ; God draws them to Him.
Report Post »rangerp
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:37amHmmmmm, she is going from unbelief to belief in a works based false religion.
She would do better to leave “religion” alone, pull out the Bible, and discover truth. Starting with the gospel of Johne would be good.
Report Post »poverty.sucks
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:56amCatholic or Mormon is no different than Atheist, unbelief that only through Christ is the path to God our Father.
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you had known me, you would have known my Father also. From now on you do know him and have seen him.” (John 14:6)
http://www.PeaceWithGod.Jesus.Net
Report Post »angelcat
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:56amRanger, Catholicism is based on faith and works. It is not enough to believe and then sit back and do nothing or, even worse, do evil. One must have faith and then live that faith through works. Please don’t talk about what you seem to know little about and disparage a religion based on your misinformation.
Report Post »iampraying4u
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:00amThe roman catholic church is the best man made religion in the world.
Report Post »Operaman
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:08amWow, the anti-catholicism on display here is really eye-opening. How ’bout you guys just allow people to worship the way they choose, hmmm? Or maybe that’s just too wacky an idea for you. Truthfully, you sound about as tolerant as some of the raging muslims lately.
Report Post »FedUpWithLibs
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:15amNo..no, I think Marke or maybe Mathewe. I’m just kidding. I was wondering if you are saying Catholicism is false or Christianity altogether is false?
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:22am@poverty.sucks
James 2:20 “But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?”
See I can do it too, try reading the whole bible and not just cherry picking a few verses that meet your vain definitions.
Mathew 7:3-5 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in they brothers eye, but considerest not the beam that is thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote our of thy brothers eye.
Report Post »thecid100
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:22amCatholicism a Man made religion? The God-Man started it, made Peter and the Popes the head of it, and said the gates of Hell would never prevail against it. I’d rather follow Christ with the religion he founded than some guy named Luther or Calvin.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:24amPerhaps if she used that nifty Star Trek symbol of faith atheists like BRUCE P and PHILLYCHEESEATHEIST used to have before people kept asking “why the Star Trek symbol?”, then she’d still be an atheist?
Report Post »heroc
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:35am@Anglecat
Either way the bible is clear about being saved through grace, and grace alone. Even though the catholic bible includes the Apocrypha (4,000+ verses) that was never canonized by the jews (due to inaccuracies and anachronisms), the message is even clear there ;)
Report Post »ColoradoCassie
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:35amShe was drawn to God and answered, yes. @ Rangerp: The Catholic church is not false. Jesus Christ instituted the Catholic Church. He promised us that He would never leave us and that His church would never fall to satan. The church has been around for 2,000 years and many have tried to destroy her. The middle ages were probably the worst and she has even survived the protestant heresy. In say that the Catholic faith is false is saying that Jesus is either a liar or made a mistake. He did neither. He will be with us always.
Report Post »NHwinter
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:42amFor those who post anti-Catholic sentiments, I can only say you do not know what you are talking about. Why not rejoice in the news that an Atheist has found God!!! There is so little good news and then you take the opportunity to bash other religions. Shame on your tiny minds. God bless her and may she be a light to other Atheists.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:48am@ rangerp
Ranger, it is definitely time for you to update your personal knowledge base. The “works only
accusations of groups like the old Chick publications, and groups of evangelical Christians who’s main “work in life” is to “save” the “misled” from the “pit of H*ll” called the Catholic Church is SO OUTDATED, that usually, instead of “discussing” with you guys, we just laugh at your repeat of others’ quotes in a pattern of “whisper down the lane” (where you don’t really know what your are discussing).
We pray for you to realized the fullness of God’s grace in a community that believes in the ENTIRE BIBLE, including the seven books that were removed in the 16th century, by the “protestant” churches, and the full 6th Chapter of John, including the fact that when Jesus a large group of His disciples (not just the twelve who became the Apostles), that He was giving them is Body and Blood (just as God gave the Isralites the Manna in the dessert which they ‘knew not’ but had to eat to live!), that the Jewish followers of the time knew they were not to be cannabals so many walked away. Jesus did NOT CHASE AFTER THEM, but asked the small group of twelve “Will you leave to”? Peter, a man, stood on faith and answered Jesus, “You have the words of Eternal Life.”
What we Christians don’t always understand is that for the Sacrifice in the Temple to be valid, the person offering had to partake (eat) of it!!! It is so much more than “just” a mem
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:48amAnother poorly written article by religious propagandist Billy Hallowell. Here is an example of Hallowell’s insidious method of slipping his personal bias into his “news” stories: “Instead, they see humanity as living on its own, disconnected from any fertile source of knowledge and goodness.“ ”disconnected from any fertile source of knowledge and goodness”
Fertile source of knowledge and goodness? And what would that be? The fertile imaginations of a collection of bronze age goat herders who lack the basic knowledge to change a lightbulb and who believed that food spoiled because of evil spirits? The primitive minds that cobbled a collection of myths together and claimed there was a god?
Please Billy. Stick to the facts or keep it in Sunday school.
http://religionpoisons.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/538764_366811116699062_679433170_n.jpg
Report Post »NHwinter
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:49amheroc – Catholics believe we are saved by grace. The Bible also say we will be judged by our works for out of grace comes works. I believe God alone knows the heart and He will judge. We are not to judge only to evaluate situation for good or evil and then to avoid the evil. Those that are always judging and condeming will themselves be judged very harshly. We are all trying and I find the bashing of other religions to be very distasteful and honestly, very ignorant.
Report Post »scarletworm
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:07amRangerp- If the bible alone has all of the answers, why don’t protestants agree on what it means? Why isn’t there one religion to match one truth? Do you believe that God wants disagreement about Him? Christ did build his church on “the rock” of Peter and Catholicism was the result. It would have been far easier to hand everyone a bible and say- figure it out for yourself and it doesn’t matter to Me what you decide- than die on the cross. Christ instructed the apostles after his resurrection BEFORE he sent them out to teach all nations. None of that instruction is included in the bible. Does the Catholic church have flaws- yes. There are evil men in every institution. Remember Judas?
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:07amUh… @Heroc… have you actually read the book? If you are still confused, you might crack the book of James. Yes we are saved by grace. After all, all are fallen. We can not follow a law in perfection. That is why the grace of our Lord Jesus is the only thing that can save us from this fallen state. However, the Lord Jesus instructed us in things we must DO in order for his grace to be of benefit. Would it make sense for a man to murder and plunder after he had “accepted” Jesus as his savior, receiving the same blessing as all who followed the commands of our Lord? If that were the case, there would be no need to keep any commandment. After all you can’t trust in your works, can you?
Report Post »Yea a man may say, thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works and I will shew thee my faith by my works. …. For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. (If you need some help finding that one in the bible it’s James chapter 2)
sensibleadult
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:08amYou’re right, @RANGERP,the Catholic religion is false. It bears no resemblance to the New Testament church in the book of Acts. But neither do the “love and grace only-no works” churches. After the book of John, the book of Acts is the place to be if you want to see the original pattern of what the true church looks like.
Report Post »HummingbirdHaveYouHeard
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:11amNo, Peter was not a “Pope” nor was he what the Church was founded on. It was the truth that Jesus is the Christ the Son of the Living God. The GOSPEL (the truth) that JESUS is the ROCK is what HIS church is founded on. Not a man. There is no such thing as a pope in the bible. That is why it is a man-made religion.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:15amI have never heard of this woman before.
Catholicism only became the main church because it killed the gnostics(people who gathered at their homes reading their books/versions of the Bible) and then through together a Bible of books they thought came from God and disregarded the books that people were reading which they thought didn’t come from God. It wasn’t some divine bringing together of the books to create the Bible, it was literally men picking and choosing which books to add and which books to omit.
But yup, all of it is TRUE!
Laughable.
Report Post »@leftfighter
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:15amLet‘s hope she doesn’t do what this guy did:
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/atheist-activist-who-converted-to-christianity-emails-to-say-hes-once-again-an-atheist/
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:18am@beckisnuts… So I guess I have to post this again, I will give you the short short version. You see if Morality is based upon what is good for society, or what society demands based upon our collective knowledge, then you have to defer to the teachings of Darwin. In the Origin of Species he speaks of how the black man is a less evolved white man. This thought line led to the Eugenics movement and the likes of Margret Sanger who founded Planned Parenthood. It also led to the horror of Adolf Hitler. After all that was the point behind the Master Race. Destroying the less desirable, jews, blacks, mentally handicapped, homosexuals, etc. in order to remove the “less evolved” from breeding with the more evolved. Under your definition of Morality, based upon current knowledge, man kind can do anything to another man as long as it is for the “good” of society. So Eichman Jr. under your logic the women who’s knees were tied together during child birth, and who died as a result, were just lesser life forms who’s suffering was for the advancement of societal good?
Report Post »freedom for sale
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:31amUs “conservatives ” are just as divided as the liberals are. If we ever win this war on socialism,(and we won’t) Marxism, or whatever, we will turn on each other just like the anarchist will turn on the communists. The so call Christians in this country have no tolerance for any other “religion”. Just like the muslims have no tolerance for Christians.
Report Post »I spent fathers day with a mixed gaggle of religions, once all the Mormons left, the “Christians” went to talken on how screwed up the Mormon religion is.
People are people no matter what they believe.
Privateeye2000
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:36amI note that she referred to Christianity and Catholicism as if separate. She was correct to do so, but does not appear to have realized she did so. I agree with a previous post by RANGERP. Catholicism is based on Works. True Christianity is a personal one on one relationship with Jesus Christ. “He” paid the price. “He” did all the work when he climbed up on the Cross and spread his arms wide for all of us and paid the price for our sins. No one can “work” themselves in to Heaven. To even try to shows lack of faith and is prideful. Pride is Sin. Pride was Satan’s downfall. All one has to do is believe. Of course, true faith will produce good works, but it is by faith and true repentance that we are saved. I pray this young girl will come to see that as she reads the word of God. Scripture is quite clear on this. I would urge her to join a Bible teaching Church, enter into Fellowship with like minded Born Again Christian (Jesus Himself said “one must be Born Again to enter the Kingdom of God”) and to pray all the time. I would urge her not to enter into captivity of works. No one is good enough to take the place of Christs work on the cross. If it were possible to work our way into Heaven then there would have been no need for the ultimate price that Christ Jesus paid for us all. Just believe unto “Him”. Forget about Religion. It is not about Religion. Religion is man made and falls short of the glory of God. A good start for this young girl is to begin with the Gos
Report Post »SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:40amI see a lot of arrogance and opinion about a great many things in this comment thread and very little truth or objective reasoning. Truly sad when we as people speak so authoritatively on subject matters we don’t undertsand like we think we do…Pharisees did the same thing to the point the were correcting God. Better to be slow to speak and quick to listen. Food for thought for my fellow blazers….
Report Post »dblaess
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:43am@beckisnuts
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:54am
All religions are man made. Or do you think bears thought them up? They’re all founded on myth and primitive concepts that no longer are believeable in light of our current body of knowledge.
BTW, if you religious believers want to own slaves, it’s okay if they came from other countries. It says so in Lev. 25, 44-46
“The male and female slaves which you have are to come from surrounding nations…”
Report Post »———————————————————————————————————————-
I perfer to go with Jesus on this and as He said do onto others as you would have them do onto you. I do not belive Jesus believed in slavery. Nor is religion made up by man, rather religion is based on Word of God. I will let you and God talk about this when your days end.
beckisnuts
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:47amRepenty, your Bible is rife with inconsistencies and contradictions. The primitive minds who cobbled it together reveal it to have nothing at all with any divine spirits (not that divine spirits are real in the first place) and it shows. This poorly written story is useless on so many different levels. Religion is on the way out and the sooner it’s gone the better for all of us.
Report Post »Turrbine
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:52amThe Catholic Church founded by Christ himself is constantly persecuted by those who think they know what the Catholic Church is about. There are over 33,000 protestant denominations claiming they have the truth and in some respects they do have a piece of it, but the fullness of truth resides in the Universal church. Upon this rock…the gates of hell shall not prevail…
Ask yourselves if the persecution you throw at the Catholic Church are not inspired by the ruler of this world trying to prevail…
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:57amDblaess, there’s no such thing as god. The supernatural is neither super nor natural. Science is both. Jesus is not returning, and if he ever really existed, he was not the product of a virgin birth. Science has proven that through genetics, which were unknown when the virgin birth myth was recycled for Christianity. It’s all made up and it shows. Another fact is the way religion has regarded and treated women. Why would a divine creator of all things allow half of his created people to lord over the other half until only very recently? Women are accepted as equals in the Western world now. According to myth, “GOD” supposedly communicated with humanity and provided behavioral guidelines, yet somehow missed this gigantic glaring issue of women’s rights. And where was “GOD” for all the 10′s of thousands, perhaps even hundreds of thousands of years we modern people roamed the planet? Anyone with the ability to think critically can easily see that the religious narrative does not hold up under scrutiny. It’s fading too, but not soon enough.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:05pm@REPENTYE
Hitler was a roman catholic with a roman catholic army.
He constantly mentions a creator
He says he‘s doing God’s work
“I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews. I am doing the Lord’s work. In 1938, he quoted those same words in a Reichstag speech.”
“My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God’s truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter.”
The oath Nazi soldier’s took.
“I swear by God this sacred oath that to the Leader of the German empire and people, Adolf Hitler, supreme commander of the armed forces, I shall render unconditional obedience and that as a brave soldier I shall at all times be prepared to give my life for this oath.”
The belt buckles of nazi’s say “Gott Mit Uns” or ‘God with us.”
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pictures/view/1069962/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gott_mit_uns
Need more? I have it.
I also loved how you gave us the page number of the “Origin of Species” as definitive proof that Darwin said what you claim. Nothing backs up claims like no evidence. Let me guess though, like all other people you are going to say, “I don’t need to provide evidence, in fact you need to prove that he DIDN’T say it.”
It’s really sad how religion can d
Judeo_Christian
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:23pm@heroc…. “Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.” James 2:17
As to the deuterocanonical books not being part of the jewish canon, you are absolutely wrong. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03267a.htm
I for one, believe that Jesus Christ did not leave us orphans.
Report Post »NHwinter
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:40pmReading these posts has been one of the saddest experiences of this day. A woman who was an Atheist finds God and all some of you can do is bash each others religion. Really a very sad commentary on acceptance of each others journey. Shame on some of you. God shall makes fools of those who think they know it all about other religions.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:41pm@glennisnuts, aw yes. I see, my bible and religion is the result of primitive minds, yet I am to trust in your superiority and the intellect of those I have already named. My BiBle, as you put it, is full of inconsistency, yet you failed to even address the atheistic horrors of the last century. I would rather be stuck in the inquisition of Spain were 3,000+ people were said to have died, than Pol Pots enlightened Cambodia where a third of its population was murdered. prey tell my enlightened overlord, where is the atheistic example of virtue and knowledge you wish for me to follow?
Report Post »bigpew
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:48pm@ thesid100
Report Post »Constantine stated the catholic church. Christ set Paul as the head of His church which is true believers in the Kindom of God and salvation through a risen Christ.
SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:49pm@ Moderation. Even Satan appears as an angel of light…so to do his servants often appear as ambassador’s of God. And if it is history you would like to point to then atheists hold the record for the number of lives taken in world history. In fact, it isn’t even a close race. Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao themselves are responsible for over 100 million deaths not to mention the other self-proclaimed irreligious leaders of history. All your “proof” proves is that men of all cultures, times, beliefs, and race are wicked and evil with hatred for their fellow man. It does nothing to discredit the existence of God or of the bible. You should know as well as any just because someone labels themself something does not make it so or accurate. For example, suppose you claimed to be smart and wore a belt buckle stating as much. It neither means you are smart or represent intellignece. It is rather by the fruit of your actions as to whether you are known to be smart. Hitler was no more a Christian than Satan who likes to appear as an angel of light is.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:55pmActually @ heroc, you are COMPLETELY WRONG about the Apocrapha and Judiasm. The seven books which are part of the “Catholic Bible” WERE accepted by Judaic leaders UNTIL AFTER THE DESTRUCTION OF THE THIRD TEMPLE IN 70 A.D.
At that time, many of the prophecies that appear in these books at least pointed to the Messiah that was Jesus, if they did not outright confirm that Jesus WAS THE MESSIAH.
Therefore, after 70 A.D., Jewish Rabbi’s put this books in to the category of “holy books” but not inspired of God.
After the Reformation, Protestants did the same, HOWEVER (again), THESE BOOKS WERE INCLUDED UP TO AND APPEAR IN THE FIRST PRINTING OF THE KING JAMES VERSION OF THE BIBLE! (”The original 1611 King James contained the Apocrypha, and King James threatened anyone who dared to print the Bible without the Apocrypha with heavy fines. . . ” See: http://www.greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/ )
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 12:58pm@moderation… not sure how to combat such galactic ignorance. Hitler was anything but Roman Catholic. He would be best described as a pagan who cobbled together theories that suited him best. However that is not even the issue here. I never said he was an atheist,you assumed that. I said his ideas were birthed by atheists, or are you going to call Darwin, Margaret Sanger and the like devout Christians? As to what Darwin wrote in the Origin of species, how about picking up a book once in a while, or do atheists worry about polluting there religion with knowledge. When i get time I will have that page number for you. now how’s about trying to figure a way to call Mao a Christian or at least a deist. Hitler was only one of many examples. read mein kampf if you doubt the origin of his thoughts on Eugenics. and before you go spouting off again, why not learn the fate of so many catholics that stood in his way. Ignoramus!
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:02pm@ privateye
Please read those postings sent to “rangerp’s” attention as they apply to you and your comments too.
Catholic Church bashing does not theologicall or philosophically compair opinions. Let’s have some facts if you must repreat all the misstatements of some many, many years!
Report Post »lornaduwn
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:09pmI suggest that she should start with James. The brother of Christ stated, “faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.”
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:14pm@ ModerationIsBest
You’re correct, Hitler was Baptized a Catholic and raised by a “severe Catholic mother and a ”scoffing” ex-Catholic father!
Read this atheist‘s opinion of Hitler’s “Christianity”: An interesting side note: Two of my sources, both of whom are well-versed in WWII history, said something to the effect that Hitler acted as if he had a messianic complex and perhaps believed himself to essentially be a god or the messiah. As one put it, you could certainly make the argument that he was a firm believer in God, if by “God” you mean “Adolf Hitler.” (from http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1699/was-hitler-a-christian)
Hitler took over control of the state Lutheran church and was restricting other churches in Germany, including the Confession Church of which Bonhoffer was one of the founders.
True Faith will not allow a “controller” or “leaders” complete control, as God is the Lord and Ruler of our life!
Report Post »SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:37pmWhere words are many (spoken or typed) sin is not absent. Pride is above all the most dangerous, deceptive, self-disguising sin of all. May our communication be flavored with humility and respect. Food for thought for my fellow religious blazers…..
Report Post »Dismayed Veteran
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:48pmAs much as Protestants claim the Catholic Church was established at the Nicene Council in 325 AD that is simply not true. There is an unbroken historical timeline from Jesus through to today.
Report Post »During the Age of the Apostles, the men who were taught directly by the Savior spread across the Middle East. They did this at Jesus’ direction. All power in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, until the end of the age.” (Matt. 28:18-19)
Dismayed Veteran
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:49pmI don’t know if Protestants believe this but it was Christ Himself, not His followers, not even His Apostles, who established the Church: Christ declared His intention of founding a Church, by the institution of a living authority, when He said to Simon Peter: “And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.” (Matt. 16:18). Now, if Christ intends personally to build His Church, it is not to be the work of man. Christ Himself will therefore give it all the necessary elements of a true social body, and, consequently, a ruling authority. And, that there might be no room for doubt, He added: “I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.” (Matt. 16:19).
Report Post »Protestantism, in all essential elements, merely borrows wholesale from Catholic Tradition, or distorts the same. All doctrines, upon which Catholics and Protestants agree, are clearly Catholic in origin (Trinity, Virgin Birth, Resurrection, 2nd Coming, Canon of the Bible, heaven, hell, etc. Whatever life or truth is present in each Protestant idea always is derived from Catholicism, which is the fulfillment of the deepest and best aspirations within Protestantism.
Hollywood
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:50pmThe RC church,sadly is a FALSE church, and therefore a church of satan. Her ATTEMPT to find truth, is leading her in the same direction that stan wants her to go. stan loves Religions. He should. He invented them! What satn truly HATES is true Christianity, which teaches God is attmepting to reach US through HIS SON, Jesus Christ. I pray she reads Eph Ch 2 Verses 8&9. The RC Church teaches salvation by faith AND ,with priests a middlemen, and Mariology. Both are provably FALSE, by Scritpure. Mary was a sinner, in need of slavtion as she stated in Luke Ch 1 V47 I rejoice in God my SAVIOUR! The RC Church teaches their Traditions are equal to, and actually supercede Scripture! Christ said the Pharisees were guilty of teaching the traditions of men, rather than GODS’ truth. The RC Church teaches praying to the DEAD[Mary], for the dead. The RC Church has a LOT in common with islam, since the Koran mentions Mary 47 times, and reveer her. Islam, and the RC Church will get closer and closer[along with the majority of Protestant "Religions"] SOLA SCRIPTURA.
Report Post »Maranatha
Dean1964
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:53pmThis is for all the anti-catholic post misrepresenting what the Church actually teaches
“With regard to God, there is no strict right to any merit on the part of man. Between God and us there is an immeasurable inequality, for we have received everything from him, our Creator.” (CCC 2007).
“Thus in communion with Christ, in a FAITH THAT CREATES CHARITY, the entire Law is fulfilled. We become JUST by entering into communion with Christ who is Love.”…..For this reason Luther’s phrase: “faith alone” is true, IF IT IS NOT OPPOSED TO FAITH IN CHARITY, IN LOVE.”(Gal 5:6)
Council of Trent Canon 1 “If anyone says that man can be justified before God by his own works, whether done by his own natural powers or through the teaching of the law, without divine grace through Jesus Christ, let him be anathema.”
The Catholic Church does not teach that one can earn salvation
Report Post »Dismayed Veteran
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:06pm@Hollywood
I love it. You believe in Sola Scriptura. God’s whole truth is in the Bible. Why then do you deny Christ’s very words?
All power in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, until the end of the age.” (Matt. 28:18-19)
There is an unbroken historical timeline connecting Jesus to us. Fact not fiction.
You just choose to ignore God. That is why Protestantism is a heretical false religion. I pray that you truly find Christ the Savior before your soul is lost forever.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:07pmHey Mod,
Which atheist instruction manual, or website, did you get those talking points from?
Gimmee a break.
Report Post »SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:24pmMany here have distorted the historical timeline and events surrounding Catholic and Protestant origins and what actually took place. I suggest rather than speaking as if you know (half truths are more deadly than complete falsehoods many times) you do some objective research that does not come from a psoition of prejudice and is therefore skewed before you even evaluate the base of evidence. Protestants returned to the faith of the early church fathers such as Polycarp and the apostles. The RC church strayed from what she inherited and protestants sought a return to the original because of the wandering in doctrine that occured when church and state became an unholy alliance and the traditions of ambitious men began to creep into the teachings of the Catholic church. I would beg many here to examine the real facts without prejudice….
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:32pmIt’s really sad how religion can delude ones mind.
If you want to discuss whether or not Hitler really believed what he was saying(in reference to believing in a God and doing God’s work) that is another argument.
Something that isn’t up for argument is that he used religion(and the strong religious upbringing of the people) to claim to do God’s work, and all of those people went along with it. What he used most was the Christian hatred of Jews(have you ever read stories of how Christians would steal Jewish babies because they thought they were saving the babies from living their lives as a Jew in sin?).
Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot all believed in their own kind of religion. All saw themselves as more then me. The State was the church.
Report Post »John655
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:34pmYes the gospel of John. Your can’t get anymore catholic then the gospel of John. And yes Catholic are a religion of works. Works of love and charity and compassion. We are not a religion that just says once saved always saved. That is anti-bibilical. Many of Pauls letters are to christian communities that had been saved and were losing their salvation by persisting in their sins. And remember on judgement day, Jesus will seperate us based on those who saw him naked and clothed him, and saw him hungry and fed him or saw him as a stranger and welcomed him. If your not doing such things then you’re risking your eternal soul. I pray for you all.
Report Post »Simonne
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:38pmToo many Christians believe their beliefs are the only true beliefs. I’m a Catholic, not a devout one, but I have lots of faith & see Jesus working in my life everyday but I don’t have a problem when it comes to gay people. I know some, they are good & decent & are Christians. I have enough looking at my own life before I start judging others who belong to any religion. I do have a problem with bigot, racism or hatred of any kind but I was raised by devout Catholic parents who didn’t hate & never called anyone names. My motto is less hate & more love. If we all did that, the world would be such a better place. It starts with us by paying more attention to what we say or do or even thing which is an everyday struggle.
Report Post »CHRIS260
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:48pm38 “Teacher,” said John, “we saw someone driving out demons in your name and we told him to stop, because he was not one of us.”
39 “Do not stop him,” Jesus said. “For no one who does a miracle in my name can in the next moment say anything bad about me, 40 for whoever is not against us is for us. 41 Truly I tell you, anyone who gives you a cup of water in my name because you belong to the Messiah will certainly not lose their reward.
Hmm…seems Jesus isn’t too worried about “denominations”. Nothing more foolish than Christians arguing amongst each other.
Report Post »2Fedup
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:49pmOk people, wanna kno why church attendance has dropped to an all- time low in america? Read the posts here. Telling everyone that theyre going to hell if they dont belong to ur specific brand of christianity is pretty damn bold and pretty damn foolish. If christians stuck together and focused more on their similarities than differences, we prob wouldnt b losing america to actual threats like the commies and muslims. The catholic church as well as protestant churches have major issues. Remember when jesus said in the end ppl who think they r christians he will tell them he doesnt knobthem? Focus on obvious enemies of jesus, and not the discrepancies between how different christians worship. How many converts have u gotten telling a stranger theyre going to hell if they dont believe everything exactly as u do?
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:49pm@REPENTYE
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA
In my response to wanting the actual page of the book you choose to respond with
” As to what Darwin wrote in the Origin of species, how about picking up a book once in a while, or do atheists worry about polluting there religion with knowledge. When i get time I will have that page number for you. ”
You then go on to finishing typing another paragraph and then respond to ANOTHER post of mine.
Pure nonsense.
Yeah, I’m done with you.
You continually make claim after claim with ZERO evidence and like every other Christian say, “oh evidence? Yeah, I’ll get back to you later about that.”
It’s a sick joke.
I have provided evidence as to why Hitler wanted to exterminate the Jews(which had to do with his Christian upbringing than anything Darwin ever said).
How do you respond to this? By claiming with absolute certainty it was Darwin’s work and again with no evidence.
Yeah I’m done with you.
Typical religious person makes tons and tons of claim and then when asked for evidence says, “well I don’t have to provide that.”
Pure nonsense.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:02pm@THERIGHTSOFBILLY
It’s called history, I suggest you learn about it.
Report Post »Levinite
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:09pmThe replies to this comment illustrate, precisely, why some of those folks just left-of-center end up voting for people like Obama. The inter-Christian bigotry perpetrated against Catholics by you other so-called “Christians” is pretty disgusting. I’m not sure how reverence for Mary or those surrounding Jesus, worldly or spiritually, is cause for being called a heretic of sorts. I can assure you, however, if our mutual God is just in his actions then you will face a far worse fate in judging those who may follow a slightly misguided form of your own religion than those who follow it, in good faith.
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:20pm@ RangerP
Report Post »Have to disagree with you on this one bro. A step in the right direction is better than no step. And I agree that it’s not the exact course she should take, but faith is a vector with magnitude and direction. She’s getting magnitude, and can make course corrections as she goes, as can we all.
@ Moderation
You claim to be the brainiac unpolluted by myths, and yet your reasoning is twisted and dishonest. Case in point: Hitler.
Your idea that Hitler was a Christian, and used Christian ideas to further his genocidal megalomania completely mislabels both Hitler and Christianity. Hitler claimed to be Christian, no dispute, but he didn’t USE Christian ideas, he ABUSED them. On the other hand, the ideas of Darwin he absolutely used, not abusing a whit of their principles: Mien Kampf touts the eugenics movement for sterilization laws removing “undesirables” from the gene pool. (will this suit?: https://people.creighton.edu/~idc24708/Genes/Eugenics/History%20of%20Eugenics.htm)
Furthermore, strong religious upbringing is what STOPPED Hitler and the axis. It was political appointees unaccountable to the German parliament that solidified Hitler’s power, enabling him to set up a police network that kept people in genuine fear of the state, not a “mythical” fear of divine retribution, as you would put it.
Irreligion is making your mind mush, Mod. Stop projecting, and start testing out the ideas: a Supremely powerful, wise, and generous Being LOVES YOU! Act like it!
SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:20pm@ Moderation…the men I listed as leaders were well known staunch atheists..And why wouldn’t man use religion for evil purposes? Satan uses religion all the time to accomplish evil works. For goodness sake it was the religious of Jesus day that had him crucified for religious reasons. Their motivations were all evil even though their belief that they were doing God’s work was real. They hardened their hearts to what was written and therefore justified evil and called it good. Anyhting inherently good has typically been corrupted and twisted into evil. Sex with a spouse is GREAT, evil twist sex (a good thing) into evil when it is cheating or with a child. Food is wonderful, in fact even necessary for life, but when not used as intended can bring death in the form of heart disease. So just because something is altered or twisted and used as evil does not make that particular thing or idea evil it is how it is applied. It seems to me your trouble is more directed toward religious hypocrisy rather than the idea that God may in fact exist? You use science to justify your position but the fact of history is that many of the early scientists were men of faith and they laid great foundations for modern day science. Yet you still use what they discovered. That doesn’t make you a christian anymore than it makes christianity evil because evil men use it ot their advantage….
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:20pm@POVERTYSUCKS – John 14:15 – “If you love me, you will obey what I command.”
Report Post »Albacheeser
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:35pmCatholicism, contrary to what some have posted here is NOT a “works based” religion. Catholic teaching is clear that salvation is received entirely through the Grace of God (through faith) and by no other power or act. The question is, what does one do once they are a Christian? Simple, BE ONE! Evangelize? Sure, but evangelization in the absence of example is manifestly ineffective. Remember, “both and an”, not “either or”. We know we can’t be perfect, but we must try just the same in the believe that he could make us so if our faith was sufficient and if he saw fit to provide the grace to enable us to do so.
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:42pm@HEROC – Where is the verse in scripture that states that we are saved by “grace alone”? (Ephesians 2:8-9) – “For by grace you have been saved through faith” Did you mean to quote (James 2:24) “You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone”?. Also the Jews are the ones who crucified Jesus Christ and they do not accept Jesus Christ as their “personal Lord and savior” so why are citing the Jews as the authority for what goes in the Chrisitan Bible? Seems counterintuitive. Also the “Apocrypha” are in the Septuagint (the “Bible” that Jesus and the Apostles referred to) If it was good enough for Jesus and the Apostles why is not good enough for you? Lastly, the “Apocrypha” are in the ORIGINAL 1611 King James Bible. Who removed them and why? Peace in Christ
Report Post »scarebear83
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:43pm@ HEROC- I know people have quoted to you James 2 and while that is a good source to look at I want to direct to you other verses. You say salvation is by grace alone but what did Jesus mean when He said in Luke 13:5 “I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish?” Did He mean that grace will repent for you? Or that repentance is a command that you do? What about Faith? Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. So it cannot be “grace alone” or even “grace alone through faith alone” as that would be a contradictory statement. How about confession? Romans 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. How about baptism? Mark 16:16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. Acts 2:38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. What would happen if we do not obey these commands given to us? I’ll give you a hint Luke 6:46-49.
Report Post »opinionated
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:44pmRangerP: Before you condemn Catholicism, please consider that the Catholic Church brought you the Bible that you rely upon so exclusively.
Report Post »REPUB1
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:56pm@rangerp
Good Catch!! Your’e Right On!!!!! such an EASY SELL By catholics, PURGATORY, where you go to Sort Things Out??? Not the Right Side Of The Gulf (Paradise) Or The Wrong Side Of The Gulf,( Hades Bound) BUT INSTEAD THE MIDDLE ????? Go Figure It…
Report Post »XenokRoy
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:56pmThis is a great story. Its good to see someone go from the belief in chance existence to the believe in a planned existence with a master planner who loves us. I like seeing this regardless of the religion joined.
I saw a few posts on here about “works” based faith. You are comparing two separate principles that Christ taught to us all; much like comparing an apple to an orange
First Christ taught that we are saved by grace. This is a true principle of the gospel of Christ, however it does not preclude works from being needed for a person to be found in the love of Christ.
“Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellow servant, even as I had pity on thee?”
Mathew 18:33
“For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.”
John 13:15
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love.”
John 15:10
All of these references come from Christ mouth and in some way tell us to be like him, to do as he did. Over 50 times in the 4 gospels Christ commands us to do as he has in some way. These three references are examples of this. Isn’t this doing works? How do we do as he has done without works? While works is not a condition on salvation they are a gospel principle and asked for by Christ of us, not as a condition of salvation but as a condition of abiding in his love, which is not the same thing.
Report Post »stjoseph1
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:02pmYou can not be Christian and criticize another religion. There are Protestant, Muslim and Catholic individuals today who are living the lives of saints.
For all of the misconceptions about the Catholic faith, please read the catechism or go to catholicanswers.org for clarification.
@Heroc…It was Luther who added the word “alone” to faith alone.
I think you are referring to the Deuterocanonical books, Apocrypha is not the correct term. The deuterocanonical books comes from the Septuagint. Jesus and the disciples used the Septuagint which was the Canon of the Diaspora/Essenes. We know this because it is quoted in the New Testament. This Canon continued to be the Canon of all Christians until after the Reformation and until about 200 years ago when the Protestants adopted a condensed version of the Canon eliminating the Deuterocanonicals from their Bibles. Even the AKJ originally contained the complete Christian Canon.
The OT Canon chosen by the Protestants is actually a Jewish Canon chosen by Jews after the establishment of Christianity. They removed the second cannon at the council of Jamnia as an attempt to slow the growth of Christianity in Jerusalem after the fall of the Temple in 70AD. It was converting many Jews to Christianity, because it strongly referred to the coming Messiah. They did say the decision was not permanent and could come back. Hmmm prophetic maybe? Also, it is divinely inspired.
I hope this will help us on our journey for peace
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:12pm@SLEAZYHIPPOS ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Oh….my…..goodness
Someone on The Blaze who can actually read a statement, comprehend it and then make coherent arguments. I commend you.
I have consistently said on here that while I don’t think a God exists, I can‘t prove it and have always admonished that religion doesn’t act the same way(saying that while they believe a God exists, ultimately they can’t prove it). I’ve had someone say to me, “My belief in Jesus is both fact based and faith based.”
I then get called the “arrogant” one when I’m the one admitting I could be wrong.
The difference in using religion though is that it can be used for evil by assuming some divine intent by it.
When religion commands something, it does so because it believes it has God on its side(and there were MANY times even during the Bible where genocide was committed because God was supposedly on one side).
It says, “Not only is what I’m doing right because I say so, but because God says so.”
Not only that most religions are an “all or nothing” proposition(which most of life isn’t like) and since those books were written so long ago it is a “all or nothing” approach to a way of life by people who lived more than 2000 years ago. Any new moral/philosophical teachings/ideas are irrelevant and wrong(especially if they counter what the Bible says). That’s just not realistic or wise.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:20pmNo Mod,
No one calls you arrogant for admitting that you could be wrong.
We know you are wrong.
It’s when you demand that we should also admit the possibility of being wrong that we have a problem with.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:21pm@HAPPYSTRETCHEDTHIN
Eugenics has nothing to do with Darwins work of natural selection.
It’s also very silly to say, “Hitler abused Christianity ideals.”
Christians had hated the Jews for a long time before that(again, read about how Christians used to steal babies from Jewish couples because they thought they were saving the baby).
Whether or not the premise behind Christianity is “hating” Jews is irrelevant, fact is they did, for a very long time.
I could simply say that hating the Jews was that persons interpretation of the Bible. You could say that their interpretation is wrong, but there is no authority on deciding whose interpretation is correct as evidence by the Christians on here hating on the Catholic church.
Both sides have their own interpretations, believe their interpretation is divinely inspired and believe that the other interpretations are false.
Why do you think Christianity finally came under the guise of just being called “Christians” instead of Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, Protestants? Because there was so much in-fighting that they had to find some kind of common ground. That doesn’t take away the fact that many Christians still say that other Christians are misunderstanding the Bible.
Didn’t Santorum just accuse Protestants of no longer being Christians?
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:24pmHey Mod,
Let’s hear some of these “new” moral teachings and ideas you think we should know about.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:27pm@Billy
And here comes Billy swooping in to prove my point.
“We know you are wrong, we don‘t have evidence to back it up and we don’t need any!”
Arrogance
Hypocrisy
Stupidity
Delusion
All defined in one short sentence.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:38pm@THERIGHTSOFBILLY
Well it’s not really new, but I guess it’s new to you and to other people.
How about not chopping off parts of the genitals of newborn baby boys?
Or is that too moral for you?
Report Post »Thomas Paine
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:42pm@poverty.sucks
God doesn’t care what house you worship in as long as you worship him & for you to criticize another Christian because he worships in a house different from yous does not serve God, It serves Satan.
Report Post »If God believes as you do, Why does he continually bless Glenn Beck (a Mormon) with so much success with everything he does ?
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:45pm@Moderation
Report Post »Saying eugenics has nothing to do with Darwin‘s work is like saying Hiroshima had nothing to do with Einstein’s theory of relativity. Of COURSE Darwin wasn’t advocating for eugenics, but to deny that eugenicists weren’t attempting to apply (with deadly success in some cases!) Darwin’s principles of evolution to “ improve” the gene pool and create the “ultimate” species is anti-historical.
As for Christians hating Jews: again, you can’t come at a Christian idea head on. There is NO warrant for the hatred of Jews in ANY Christian idea. Why is it so hard for you to understand that the Christians who DID hate Jews were ABUSING their own principles? It’s NOT irrelevant, it’s CENTRAL. Your argument falls apart under the scrutiny of THAT precise distinction.
You’re like the guy who wants to do away with rubber because some people get flat tires. Religion’s not the problem, abuse of religion is.
The fact of competing interpretations of scripture just puts you all the more on the defensive, makes you overgeneralize (which you’re prone to anyway), and I’m sorry but complaining about a moving target just makes you sound even sillier. If you can’t find the target, it‘s because you’re not honestly looking for it.
If you want to be convincing, demonstrate cause and effect without distortion and in context. Otherwise, you’re just blowing smoke, and us Blazers see right through it.
Navyveteran
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:57pmthecid100 and ColoradoCassie
You’re both wrong Jesus did not start the Catholic Church, nor did Peter. Peter wasn’t a Pope, he was Jewish, and a disciple of Christ, not a religious leader. If you read your bible closely Jesus confronted religious people. He despised the sin of religion and its leaders. In fact Jesus related religion as idolatry. Jesus spoke of relationships not religions, if you have a relationship with Jesus, you are the Body of Christ, the Bride of Christ, and yes the Church. The Church that Christ speaks of is all believers, we are the church. Not a particular religion, the catholics, baptist, lutherans, calvonists, and etc are not the church. The people who love God, have a relationship, and follow His teachings are the Church, and you can have people in those religions that do have a real relationship with Christ. The true church is what Jesus was talking about when he said even the gates of hell will not prevail against it. He wasn’t talking about the Catholic Church, sorry to burst your bubble on that.
cid100 be careful about isolating religions preferring your religion over lutherans, calvanists, because God sees the heart, not the religion and there will be catholics, lutherans, and calvanists in heaven just as in hell. Where is your trust? Is it in the Catholic Church or your relationship with Christ? Really depends on the relationship, that is the only thing we can take to eternity with us is our relationship with Christ!
Report Post »TunaBlue
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:26pmSeriously? My religion is better than your religion. No, my religion is better than yours. Grow up! The intolerance is intolerable.
That a young woman is willing to explore her ideas to a point that she has chosen a better path for herself, and a desire to better for herself and others, is all I need to understand.
The intolerance displayed by so many here doesn’t mean crap in the end. We all live and die by our beliefs.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:30pm@HAPPYSTRETCHEDTHIN
The “ideas” of Darwin were once again, evolution through natural selection, not wiping out people to get some kind of super race.
To say that it’s a “use” and not an “abuse” is being intellectually dishonest.
You see, that‘s where you’re wrong(and I sure hope you give the same leeway to radical Islam that you do Christianity).
People interpret the Bible differently and each one has their own divine authority and acceptance behind it. The only reason you say that hatred of the Jews has nothing to do with Christian ideals is because that’s what YOU believe. Those people could easily say that you‘re abusing the Bible by not following Jesus’s strict teachings to hate the Jews.
There are Christians who believe in original sin.
There are Christians who don’t believe in original sin.
There Christians who take the Bible completely 100% literally(yes, talking snake and all).
There are other Christians who pick and choose which parts they see at literal and which they see as metaphorical.
Christianity and religion in general is so much mumbo jumbo that ANYTHING could be done in its name and they could equally be right and equally justifiable. It’s always the “we’re not as bad as these people” who come out and say that the others actions aren’t rooted in (insert religion) teachings.
People seem to forget that Christianity was just as ruthless as Islam. They just didn’t have 21st century weapons to prove how peaceful th
Report Post »EmeraldTheParrot
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:51pmThe Catholic church is a sun god worshipping church. It is PSEUDO-christianity that seduces & tricks millions into believing that it’s true Christianity.
Yes…faith without works is dead…but your works are not what get you into God’s kingdom. ONLY BEING BORN AGAIN THROUGH THE ‘SPIRIT’…(John 3:3 – 8). And the catholic church omits that info to it’s millions.
Read ‘THE TWO BABYLONS’ by Alexander Hyslop for the sun god worship history of the RCC…& ‘A WOMAN RIDES THE BEAST’ by Dave Hunt, for more info.
Those two will explain everything about it.
Hopefully this girl allow the Spirit to lead her into the full truth regarding this as she goes along…& leave it for God’s Word of TRUTH.
Report Post »mycomet123
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:54pmI’m reading some of these comments here from supposedly “Christians”. Do you think when all is said & done, Jesus is going to be more concerned with which denomination you were affiliated with OR how much you loved. LOVE is patient & kind, it does not envy or boast, it is not proud or self-seeking. Romans 13:2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:54pmMod says:
“And here comes Billy swooping in to prove my point.”
Mod,
What is it with you not being able to wrap your mind around the meaning of the words “faith” and “Belief”
You are hell bent on getting a Christian to say that they will accept the possibility that GOD does not exist.
Why?
What kind of sick pleasure does one derive from turning someone away from their beliefs?
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:55pmThis is good Moderation. You’re beginning to do a little thinking.
Report Post »You’re still missing the point though: Darwin’s INTEGRAL principles of evolution enabled SOCIAL Darwinists to envision a “final solution”. You’re right that Darwin never intended genocide, but I’m NOT being intellectually dishonest, you just have a mental block to understanding my honesty. Let me try again: It is Apples and Oranges to compare the ABUSE of Christian ideas that resulted in Jew hatred with the kind of WHOLESALE ADOPTION of Darwinism that resulted in Jew genocide.
Also, in your inability to understand belief systems beyond your own in their context, you’ve become completely morally relativistic.
Many Christians believe different and sometimes contradictory things about what Christianity is, but YOU are choosing to believe ONLY the NEGATIVE. You cherry-pick abuses and claim they’re core principles, then back off and state you can‘t tell what’s a core principle at all. But really it’s just your own laziness. You choose not to see what’s common.
Slow down and put cause to effect.
The truth is that Christian ideas are what OVERCAME the Jew hatred, what stopped slavery, what enabled limited government, what perpetuates a republic.
Equality, liberty, sanctity of property, family, self-denial, self-sacrifice, service, generosity, tolerance, love, and the possibility of an eternal reward for a life turned over to a benevolent higher power: these are Christian beliefs. Read their fruits.
cmsgreek
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:40pmBut if Martin Luther started the Lutheran Church, and John Calvin started his related churches, doesn’t that make those churches “man-made” as well? The anti-catholic sentiment here is sickening. I am not Catholic, but Greek Orthodox; and I am not going to lie, we have some major theological differences. However, we have more in common with each other than with the Protestant faiths, so I must defend the Catholic church in this case. For the Protestants: if God commanded you to love your brother as you love yourself (that’s in the Bible verbatim), why do you spew so much hatred towards other Christians, much less people of other religions?
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:51pm@HAPPYSTRETCHEDTHIN
You are creating a false link between what Darwin taught and eugenics. If your thinking is true, anything that has any link to anything could then be linked to something else.
Where do you get that I only cherry pick and use the negative of the Christian myth? I constantly use the true CORE of Christianity which is the sacrifice of Jesus for the sake of humanity and say how I think it is immoral. Surely that’s not “cherry picking” anything.
I think it‘s flat out immoral that people could say that they wouldn’t stop the crucifixion of Jesus if given a chance. To be a Christian, you(not you specifically) have to say that Jesus had to die. He had to die for your sin(which has never been proven, the “sin” existing part). You want him to die, because if he didn’t, you would be damned to an eternity in hell.
Granted, I guess not every Christian feels this way but that just goes into the mine field that is religion, all which claim the same divine authority behind their beliefs.
I then hear rationalizations, “well he was both God and man(idiotic in itself)” or, “well, don’t you believe in sin?(no I don’t think sin is a real thing)“ or ”well look at all of the bad in the world(which isn’t evidence of anything)”
Fact is, Christians have to believe Jesus’s death was necessary to save our “souls” from an eternity in “hell.” All of which has yet to be proven and strains credulity. Above all else, it’s not moral.
Report Post »SJvet
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:58pmI’m replying to some who replied to “Searching for the Truth.” Catholicism is the very first Christian religion.
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:22pm@ Moderation
Report Post »Interesting that you engage less and less of my ideas, still refuse delivery on my logic and demonstration, and then keep right on plowing with fallacious logic and rampant misrepresentation.
Honesty, man-otherwise truth will escape you.
I’ll slow down: Darwin had a system of ideas > Eugenicists swallowed up all of these ideas and their own application. Therefore eugenicist thought includes Darwinist thought integrally.
Hitler had a set of eugenicist (and genocidal and evil on all counts) ideas > No Christian idea supports his idea set, but he twists them to claim “ God is with us”, etc. > YOU claim this is an example that Christian ideas support genocide.
And again, you have to mischaracterize the entire essence of the great Expiatory Sacrifice in order to claim it’s immoral. You refuse to entertain the notion that someone can believe a Being of infinite power laid down His own life as a sacrifice, but before you can understand objectively, you have to suspend judgment. You can engage it later after you’ve understood. Don’t believe now, but AT LEAST admit it’s LOGICAL IF someone believes in Christ, that He might have to make an infinite sacrifice to pay for the infinite demands of justice our sins have incurred, so that we wouldn’t have to pay ourselves. In context, His sacrifice was love, which IS moral-the highest!
If you don’t want to believe then, it’s your choice, but intellectual honesty demands you stop claiming it’s immoral.
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:43pmAnd since you asked, I’ll expound some more.
Report Post »You imply that Germans supported Hitler because their Christianity, which DOES teach respect for authority, made them soft and unable to resist the furor.
That’s a hugely cynical reading of Christianity that fails to take into account its positive teachings: respect for life, courage in the face of temptation, self-sacrifice. Do you know that Priests worked to save as many Jews as they could? Why don’t you include THEIR stories in your reading? Because it destroys your craft if you do. You‘d have to admit there’s a positive force in believing that a higher power than you is lending you His strength to accomplish moral actions you wouldn’t otherwise have it within you to do.
Cause and effect. Belief leads to action.
The Christian need to repent for sin logically makes individuals work hard to improve themselves (they call it walking in faith, or being Christlike, or some such). Can’t you admit that such a belief can be a powerful motivator, and a force for good? Why does it bother you so much that some people claim that motivation as the reason they learn and grow? If you admitted that, you’d drop accusing believers of idiocy, and just accept the good for what it is, even if for yourself you choose not to believe. Your insistence on arguing about it makes me suspect that you’re not merely neutrally in favor of reason, though. You have left religion, but you can’t leave religion alone. Your loss…
Goldie52
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:45pmMy religion is the Bible and Gods word, not necessarily a church.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:52pmMod says:
“I have never heard of this woman before.”
Hey Mod,
You always claim that you do not belong to any atheist organizations, nor do you attend any atheist functions, or even hang out with any atheists.
You have posted here many times that you feel no desire to associate with people that share your non-beliefs.
With all that being said, I have one lingering question.
Why WOULD you have ever heard of this woman? And why did you begin your post saying that you never heard of her, as if to diminish her, or her actions in some way?
Report Post »korbin
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:03pmrangerp is correct, the truth is so simple people can’t handle it. You believe that you are a sinner and Jesus died for your sins and he rose from the dead on the third day, when you truly accept Christ you will walk in his path and therefore will do good works however faith alone is all one can do to abstain eternal life. narrow is the path to life the wide road is where most are traveling, no man can work his day into heaven. PERIOD. how many doors do you have to knock on before you have achieved what you believe is enough to get to heaven? how many children do you need to get to a higher plain in heaven??
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:08pmFor over 500 years Protestants have relied on Scripture Alone to guide them, 10′s of thousands of Bible Based Protestant Churches all reading the same Bible for over 500 years but coming to COMPLETELY different conclusions unable to agree about Baptism, divorce, ordination of homosexuals, ordination of women, birth control, abortion, the “rapture” (is it pre-trib, mid-trib or post-trib) etc and what is necessary for salvation. This failure to agree has necessarily resulted in the teaching that the church is INVISIBLE. This removes any need for the unity that Jesus prayed for and makes all of the disagreement seem normal. Despite all of the division Protestants seem to agree that anyone outside of THEIR particular church does not have the true Gospel and is most likely not saved. Ironically in the midst of all of this confusion, division and disagreement Protestants accuse the Catholic church (which for over 2000 years has been united under ONE Bishop practicing ONE Faith the world over) of being a “man made” religion. Protestants have been using “Scripture Alone” to “restore” Chritianity for over 500 years and the only thing it’s resulted in is thousands of new churches that disagree on what scipture says. God is not a God of division and confusion. God Bless.
Matt 12:30 “”He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters
John 5:39 “You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess et
Report Post »HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:11pm@scarletworm: Christ did build his church on “the rock” of Peter and Catholicism was the result.
Thats a freaking JOKE! lmfao. What book are you reading FROM!?
Let’s get this one thing straight people. THE ROMANS KILLED the Hebrew Messiah. They scourged into hamburger MEAT and stapled him to a symbol of Tammuz, if that’s not humiliating, I don’t know what is. As for Adolf being a Roman Catholic. haha, it makes sense, Rome is Rome, no matter who it embodies.
Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone who says to Me, “Lord, Lord,” shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, “Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?”
And then I will declare to them, “I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness.”
I don’t think killing 6 MILLION JEWS, who didn’t do anything to him, and causing World War 3 was part of doing the Will of the Father LOL, that was all him bro.
Report Post »Besides this dufache was a JEW anyway. LOL @ ModerationIsBest, nice try. Constantine of ROME said he was Christian too, but he murdered his entire FAMILY, the guy is a real winner.
HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:16pm“Constantine had a father-in-law, whom he commanded to be hung; he had a brother-in-law, whom he ordered to be strangled; he had a nephew twelve or thirteen years old, whose throat he ordered to be cut; he had an eldest son, whom he beheaded; he had a wife, whom he ordered to besuffocated in a bath.”
“Constantine had no respect for human life, and as emperor he executed his eldest son, his own second wife, his favorite sister‘s husband and ’many others’ on doubtful charges. He was also responsible for wholesale massacres in north Africa.”
- History of Christianity (Johnson; (p.68)
- Voltaire Philosophical Dictionary, article “Constantine”.
Your argument is now invalid.
@ bigpew – Truth, total Truth.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:17pm@THERIGHTSOFBILLY
There‘s a thing called the internet which I do use to look at other people’s thoughts and ideas. I assumed(I guess falsely?) since the Blaze made a post about her(and her being a blogger) that I would have at least run across her once online. I merely pointed out that I hadn‘t heard of her because I literally hadn’t seen her name once online.
As I’ve said before, “conversions” from Atheism to Christianity, Christianity to Judaism, Judaism to Islam, Mormonism to Christianity provides NO evidence to the claims that any side makes. So why would I try to minimize what some lady has done ESPECIALLY to the most obviously mad made church like the Catholic church(had to get my Catholic bashing in there for you Billy)
I don’t look at some Atheist who used to be a prominent figure in religion and think that it somehow validates my claims.
Secondly, I always said that I have no desire to hang out with people ONLY because they’re atheists(which would go with me saying i don’t belong to any atheist functions, websites, etcs). I wouldn‘t not be a friend with an atheist because they’re an atheist. Just like I won’t refuse to be a friend to a Christian, Jew, Muslim, Mormon, conservative, liberal, libertarian, straight, homosexual.
Can you say the same? How many non Christian friends do you have? And I mean serious friends, not people you “know.” How often do you spend legitimate time with non Christians? I hope it’s a lot.
Report Post »HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:30pmNavyveteran – Wow, Wow, great post. Traditions of (any)Religion is Not what Johushua talked about.
When it comes to Modern Christianity and Catholicism, lets look at the History and the Facts.
Peter (Keifer) was crucified and Paul (Sho’ul) was beheaded by persecutions under Emperor NERO (AD 64) – Fact
The Anointed One spoke Aramaic Hebrew (not Greek) – He didn’t even speak to the Greeks (and they came to see him).
The diciples who did follow “The Anointed One”, never called themselves Christians. It was the Roman pagans and other pagan peoples of Antioch that called the followers of “The Anointed One” the name of “Christianos”. The Hebrews that believed in the “Anointed One” never called him “CHRIST”, nor did they call themselves “Christians”.
Lent is Babylonian: The word “lent” is of Anglo-Saxon origin meaning “spring”. The term Lent is a shortened form of Lenten, which derives from the Old English term lencten, which means spring. This word is from the Old English root word lang which means “Long” (Online Etymology Dictionary, http://www.etymonline.com). Lent developed from the pagan celebration of weeping, fasting, and mourning for 40 days over the death of Tammuz (one day for each year of his life).
Report Post »Tammuz (the son/husband of the Babylonian idol Ishtar) was killed by a wild boar and then allegedly resurrected. This mourning of Tammuz is specifically prophesied by Ezekiel in the Bible and is characterized by God Himself as being detestable (Ezek
HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:31pmLent is celebrated worldwide by Roman Catholic Christians. But it is also popular among some Protestant Christians, including Episcopals, Lutherans, Methodists, some Presbyterians and Anglicans.
Easter The Queen of Heaven: (Easter, Ostara, Astarte, Ashtoreth, Ishtar, Venus, Aphrodite (Cytherea), Inanna, Isis) – This is a description of an ancient system honoring the resurrection of their god, Tammuz, who was brought back from the underworld by his mother/wife, Ishtar (after whom the festival was named). As Ishtar was actually pronounced “Easter” in most Semitic dialects, it could be said that the event portrayed here is, in a sense, Easter.
Is the system developed in the ancient world, the priests of Easter would impregnate young virgins on the altar of the goddess of fertility at sunrise on Easter Sunday. A year later the priests of Easter would sacrifice those three-month-old babies on the altar at the front of the Sanctuary and dye Easter eggs in the blood of the sacrificed infants.
The forty days of Lent – or weeping for Tammuz, starts the Easter fertility season. The festivities culminate on Easter Sunday, when the priests of Easter slaughtered the “wild boar that killed Tammuz” and the entire congregation would eat the “ham” on Easter Sunday.
Report Post »HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:32pmThe 7th Day Rest:
The Hebrew calendar has nothing to do with the Solar calendar of the Romans. The Hebrews worked on Lunar cycles and their days start by the sunset. Their Sabbath day was always and is the 7th day, which is Shabbat (Saturday) and it starts the Sunset of Friday. The Worship of the Romans was on Sun-Day (Solar Day) – Sun god worship.
Daniel 7:25 –
“And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.”
The word of Rome says:
“The Pope has the power to change times, to abrogate laws, and to dispense with all things, even the precepts of Christ.“ ”The Pope has the authority and often exercised it, to dispense with the command of Christ.” -Decretal, de Tranlatic Episcop. Cap. (The Pope can modify divine law.) Ferraris’ Ecclesiastical Dictionary.
(Abrogate: To abolish, do away with, or annul, especially by authority.)
Report Post »HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:38pmChrist(Greek word BTW) didn’t start the “Holy Roman Catholic Church” – That blame goes on The Roman Emperor Constantine. Constantine, the self proclaimed “Pontifex Maximus” or “High Priest of Pagansism, faithfully celebrated Mithra’s birthday on December 25th. The historical creator of the Christian Religion was Constantine and the first Pope (High Priest / Pontifex Maximus) – (The Catholic Church states that Peter was the first pope, but if you read what happend to him, Peter was crucified because NERO didn’t like him that much.) – Mithra is another name for Tammuz (who’s image of slaying the bull later became the favorite motif of the Roman Sun-god worshipers)
Constantine’s reign as Roman emperor (A.D. 306-337) dramatically changed the direction of “Christianity”. This grew out of his strategy for unifying his empire by creating a “catholic”— meaning universal —church that would blend elements from many religions into one. The “Christianity” Constantine endorsed was different from that practiced by Christ and the apostles. The emperor accelerated the change by his own hatred of Jews.
Constantine himself said, “Let us then have nothing in common with the detestable Jewish crowd.”
-(Eusebius, Life of Constantine 3, 18-19,
Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, 1979,
second series, Vol. 1, pp. 524-525).
(Ezekiel 8:13-15) in Reference to the Lent STuff
Report Post »SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:07pm@Moderation……let’s start where we agree and you correct me if I am wrong in my assessment. We both agree that evil men can and have used religion and “divine authority” for evil purposes. Often times institutional religion is very corrupt and many may label or call themselves this or that and they may or may not represent the essence of that religion. What should determine if they are genuine or not is the fruit of their life (not in perfection since none are but within their overall character). I believe we would also agree that evil and evil people have been numerous in all times, cultures, civilizations, and religions (based on their own confession of faith genuine or false). I believe that we would both agree that there is an ultimate objective truth that reflects reality and that this truth is discoverable at least in part, which means we must be about sifting through falsehoods, lies, deceptions, and inaccuracies. To pursue that truth one must look at evidence to arrive at the best and most precise conclusion based on that evidence. My question would be what test or tests do you use to evaluate evidence and how do safeguard against prejudice and subjectivism when evaluating that evidenc? I will be more than happy to reciprocate to your questions or these, your choice. Thanks in advance.
Report Post »HoneyBager7x7
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:09pm“Constantine corrupted and perverted Christianity more than he aided it. He was an ambitious and
superstitious Emperor who murdered his own kindred (his wife and son) while promoting Christianity. He paganized Christianity while using it as a political tool to solidify his Empire.”
- Paganism Surviving in Christianity, By Abram Herbert Lewis
“The Control of Christianity by the State
Under Constantine and his Successors”
Chapter X; pg. 203
“Christians” should really know their history if they want to be scripturally correct. The Vatican is a complete JOKE.
Report Post »BigCity
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:43pmTo Poverty Sucks,
Report Post »There are 30000+ interpretations of the Bible. Could you tell me why yours is the right one? Jesus gave the authority to the Catholic Church to interpret His Word. The One True Church is the Catholic Church. It is more likely that we are the one true church as oppose to one of the 30000+ ones. No hate from me here I only hope and pray you find your way HOME. God Bless.
the_truth_or_not
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:48pm@ RANGERP
I agree with you. I often wonder if it is religion itself driving people from ‘religion’ to atheism. It is a start though. May GOD Bless her as she has just now awakened. She now can answer for her misgivings going foward. This is a huge responsibility and a blessing in itself.
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:52pm@HILLBILLYINNY – well said. To those who embrace the Protestant doctrines of Sola Fide, Sola Scriptura and Once Saved Always Saved introduced by Martin Luther in the 1600′s stack them up against the scripture verses below and see if they hold true. God Bless.
Numbers 15:30
Report Post »Job 34:11
Psalm 5:5-7
Psalm 11:7
Psalm 34:9
Psalm 66:18
Proverbs 10:3
Proverbs 10:29
Proverbs 15:8
Proverbs 15:29
Proverbs 28:9
Ecclesiastes 12:14
Isaiah 57:2
Jer 11:6
Ezekiel 33:13
Mal 1:11
Matt 7:21
Matt 12:30
Matt 12:36-37
Matt 12:50
Matt16:24
Matt 16:27
Matt 25:40-46
Matt 28:16-20
Mark 3:35
Mark 4:24
Mark 7:15
Mark 8:34-35
Mark 9:42-50
Mark 10:11-12
Mark 10:29
Mark 11:25
Mark 13:13
Mark 13:36
Luke 9:23
Luke 11:28
Luke 14:27
Luke 18:9-14
Luke 18:29-30
John 6:48-58
John 6:66
John 8:51
John 9:31
John 12:48
John 12:50
John 13:17
John 14:15
John 14:21
John 14:23
John 15:10
Acts 10:34-35
Rom 2:6
Rom 2:9
Rom 2:13
Rom 2:7-8
Rom 14:12
1 Cor 6:9
1 Cor 10:13
1 Cor 11:27
2 Cor 5:10
Gal 5:16-21
Gal 5:24-25
Gal 6:7-8
Eph 1:18
Eph 2:1-3
Eph 4:17-24
Eph 5:3-12
Col 3:5-8
Col 3:23-25
2 Thes1:8
2 Thes 2:11
2 Thes 2:13-15
2 Thes 3:6
1 Tim 3:15
Heb 5:9
Heb 6:4-6
Heb 10:26
Heb 13:16-17
James 1:12-15
James 1:21-22
James 1:26-27
James 2:14-27
James 4:3
James 4:6-9
James 4:17
James 5:16
1 Peter 3:12
1 Peter 3:21
1 Peter 4:17
2 Peter 2:20
2 Peter 3:7
2 Peter 3:16-17
1 John 5:3
1 John 5:16
1 John 1:5-7
1John 2:3
1 John 2:4
snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:58pm@POVERTY.SUCKS – You seem to contradict yourself, on the one hand you claim that faith alone in Jesus Christ is all that is necessary for salvation but at the same time you claim that a persons doctrinal beliefs can undo the finished work of Christ on the Cross? Which is it? Saved by Faith Alone in Jesus finished work on the cross or saved by faith alone in Jesus PLUS agreeing with you and attending YOUR church? Why is someone who accepts Jesus Christ as their Personal Lord and Savior not saved if they are Catholic?
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:33pm@ PRIVATEYE2000 – below are satements that you’ve made that contradict scripture. Should people listen to you or to what God teaches us through His holy word?
PRIVATEYE2000
“No one can “work” themselves in to Heaven. To even try to shows lack of faith and is prideful”
HOLY SPIRIT
(Rom 2:7) “To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life”
PRIVATEYE2000
“Pride was Satan’s downfall. All one has to do is believe”
HOLY SPIRIT
(James 2:14) “What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him?”
(James 2:17) “In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead”
(James 2:20) “You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless”
(James 2:24) “You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.”
(Romans 2:13) For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.
PRIVATEEYE 2000
Just believe unto “Him”. Forget about Religion
HOLY SPIRIT
(James 1:27) “Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world”
PRIVATEEYE 2000
Religion is man made and falls short of the glory of God
HOLY SPIRIT
Report Post »(James 1:27) “Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and
SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:14pmThe righteous shall live by faith
Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as righteousness.
Then they asked, “what must we do to be saved?”. Repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sin (Peter)
All our righteous acts are like filthy rags
For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law (Paul)
Know that a person is not justified by works in the law but by faith in Jesus Christ (Paul)
Make a tree good and it’s fruit will be good (Jesus)
First clean the inside of the cup the the outside will be clean (Jesus)
Both Hebrew and Egyptian were saved from the death angel not because of what they did but because of their faith in what God said produced obedience to apply the lambs blood to the door frames of their houses. It was their faith that produced obedience. Their obedience didnot save them, God’s mercy did. Obedience and living a godly life is the product or fruit of faith not the condition for salvation.
1 Cor. Teaches this in the 3rd chapter when it talks about works being evaluated by the fire of God’s judgement. Those that are pure will survive those that are not will be burned up yet the man will still be saved.
Food for thought for my fellow blazers. I welcome respectful comments or questions.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:39pmtry this again… @Moderation you are right, not in Origin of Species, however it is in the Descent of Man.
Report Post »Charles Darwin, The Descent of Man (London: John Murray, 1901), pp. 241-242. check out page 7 to get my full post… I’m not holding my breath.
keithh1981
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 1:05amRepentYe: Don’t bother with Beckisnuts. He is nothing but a troll that obviously is a resistant admirer of God. Just click on his link and see how none of those items on that list wouldn‘t be possible wasn’t for god. It is funny more atheists turn to God than believers to to unbelievers. There is a reason for that because God chooses those into faith, and even though that fact drives people like Beckisnuts crazy and they cannot legitimately disprove it, they turn to hate and lies. Truly how can one be good when they have to hide the facts with hate and lies and therefore making Beckisnuts fictitious secular ideology false.
Report Post »poverty.sucks
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 1:17amMembership of a church may have it’s privileges on Earth, only a personal relationship with Christ will you be granted exclusive rights from God. Read The Holy Bible, that’s HIStory, God breathed.
The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. (Proverbs 1:7 KJV)
You have the freedom to choose what church you attend. Attending a church that fails to warn of the wrath of God, the consequences of Sin, you just may lose the race. Satan glorifies death, only through Christ Jesus will you have eternal life.
Report Post »keithh1981
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 1:19amHitler was not a Catholic or a Christian, anybody who makes those claims can dismiss themselves of this discussion due to their lack of history and reality.
However, the Catholic Church is a false religion because they don’t teach the bible and made up the 6 chapters (the middle book) Luther came out against the church and protested against their teachings, and only church to get the full context teaching of the bible is a true Lutheran Church.
Research how at one time the pope sold notes to his followers saying by through him (the pope) and a fee for the note, can guarantee them into heaven. No one gets to heaven except through Jesus, not a man or a pope that has for years was against the principles of God. For example, The Catholics were in fact Nazi lovers since they whole willingly supported Hitler and his agenda. That is common knowledge.
The middle chapter is false works and Luther knew it because he was one of the head of the Catholics at the time and knew the inner working of the church. He knew his former church fell away from God and was only out for only power and money and this was centuries before they spent your donation money for Hitler’s agenda. Catholic Church hasn’t taught the real works of the bible and anybody who actually reads it knows it is true, that is why more followers are leaving the Catholics and joining the Lutheran Church.
Report Post »1592
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 8:06amI prayed for this girl before. I also prayed for Penn Jillette and many others.
Report Post »WAKE UP PENN. I really like you.
Locked
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 8:32am2/19/2012
Glenn Beck: “we must all stand up as one: We are all Catholics now.”
Well, good for us. Lasted almost four months! All it took was the conversation of an atheist to one particular brand of Christianity, an event that should be CELEBRATED, to bring all the good-will and “brothers-in-Christ”-ness tumbling down.
You people should be ashamed of yourselves, though looking at many of the names here I know you won’t be. Know what a Christian is? A follower of Christ, who believes Him to be the Messiah. There are plenty of things in Catholic dogma I don’t follow, which is why I’m not a Catholic. But I never for a second doubt that they are Christians. Same with Mormons: no matter what your opinions are on Joseph Smith or the Book of Mormon, no member of the LDS is going to deny believing Jesus Christ is the Messiah.
Religion is the colorful clothing we put around the Word. I don’t care what clothing you wear as long as the core is true: you believe in, and strive to live up to the example of, Jesus Christ who is our Lord and Savior.
If you spend all your time worrying about the afterlife and if your actions (or faith alone!!) will get you there… you’re doing it wrong. Christians don’t do good for a reward: we do it because it’s good, and God loves good. We don’t deserve eternal life, but we pray we‘ll receive it through Christ’s love. Anyone deny that?
Report Post »rickc34
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 10:19amThe atheist group just lost a powerful tool and will turn against her with all their might. Pray that God will protect her from harm, but now she will grow in strength defending her new faith in God and her works will be defending that faith .
Report Post »PeterBucy
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 6:18pm^RangerP “A works based religion?” Catholicism. I think you are confused.
Report Post »Do you believe that the Catholic church teaches that “you can earn salvation by works?” because the don’t. It teach that you need both. The problem is that you don’t understand the definition of works, which is, “Obedience to God through faith.” I hang out with a lot of protestants. And they agree that you can’t have true faith without works Surely you have heard James 2:17 “…faith without works is dead”. Works being virtue, also known as works of the spirit. not works of the law.
Alessandre
Posted on June 21, 2012 at 1:36am@rangerp: “Hmmmmm, she is going from unbelief to belief in a works based false religion.
“She would do better to leave “religion” alone, pull out the Bible, and discover truth. Starting with the gospel of Johne would be good.”
the Catholic Church is not a “works based false religion as you & @poverty.sucks (”Catholic or Mormon is no different than Atheist, unbelief that only through Christ is the path to God our Father”) mistakenly believe. Catholics believe that Christ is the only way to the Father, that He is “the way, the truth & the light.” we’ve also read the book of James wherein he admonishes the Church that faith w/o works is dead. we believe that genuine faith causes the believer to love God w/ all our heart, mind & soul & to love our neighbours as Christ has loved us. we believe that such love becomes evident in action or it is a feeling and not a fact. & the Gospel of John (not Johne) is at the heart of what we do each time we eat the body & blood of our Lord Jesus Christ. we know the word Jesus used when He said, “this do in remembrance of me” was anamnesis which means making the past present, it is as if a door is opened that allows each of us to be present with those who were at the last supper. the word “remembrance” does not mean what English translates it into, memorial – a memory that is the equivalent of the red poppies WWI survivors used to wear each armistice anniversary to remind them of the end of that war. Leah has come home. you’
Report Post »lketchum
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:43amI worry.
I worry that this is being done as a stunt – to be reversed soon, as a means to support the left’s assertion that God is not needed for people and societies to be moral.
I worry this is a setup designed to make the faithful look foolish and backward in their “dependence” as it will be asserted by the left.
I hope my concern remains unfounded.
Report Post »Xyskalla
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:28amThe issue isn‘t if people or societies can be moral if there isn’t a God. That misses the point. The issue is what is the foundation for morality if there is no God? I contend there is none.
Without God to define what is good, morality is just a matter of personal preferences. Murder, rape, theft, they might not be for you. But if I’m fine with it, too bad for my victims, but I’m not violating any kind of moral law. You can enact laws against them, exert all kinds of social pressure to conform, but all I’d be doing is breaking rules set up by people who had more power than I and had a different set of values than I have. But I wouldn’t be doing anything morally wrong.
Without a God, Hitler didn’t do anything wrong. It doesn’t matter that he hurt people. What makes hurting people wrong? It is what it is. No more, no less. You might think “well, it’s just obvious that violence is wrong.” No, it’s not. We tend to forget in our sensitive 21st century sterilized environment that many cultures throughout history have extolled the values of violence, oppression and deceit, and that our definition of morality is just one option among many. To others, the strong taking from the weak or the sly taking from fools seems just as obvious.
The only foundation for a genuine morality is if our Creator designed things to run a certain way, and declares, “These deviations from My planned design are wrong.” He designed us, so He gets to say how things work and shouldn’t w
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:24am@XYSKALLA
Morality is defined by societies.
Even the famed “Do to others as you would have them do to you” or “golden rule”(which doesn’t draw its origins from the Bible) only matter if everyone wants to be treated nicely.
According to the “golden rule” way of life, if I don’t care what happens to myself, I am perfectly justified in any action I take.
For instance, if I don’t care that I get murdered(the “as you would have them do to you” part) then by the golden rule I am perfectly justified to murder(the “do unto others” part).
Plus, Christians DO think murder is justified.
They are told to honor Abraham’s loyalty to God, that he would kill his kid because God told him. It is irrelevant that God intervened to stop Abraham, at that time, murder was perfectly justifiable.
You also believe that Jesus had to die for your sins. So you believe someone had to get murdered for your sake. Would you have tried to stop that murder if you were able to? If you say you would, then you‘re saying Jesus’s crucifixion wasn’t necessary for the sake of humanity. If you say you wouldn’t stop it, you are then accepting that murder WAS necessary for your sake.
It isn’t moral to think a human sacrifice was necessary to save you from being evil and thrown into a lake of fire for eternity. The fact that religion has deluded itself to think that it is moral is a testament to the stupidity of religion.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:11pm@moderation, there you go again slick. “Look at our good iintentions not our results.” The point is, without a compass on morality, anything can be rreasoned as being for the better good. you quote our source for morality as why we are so foolish, yet when we point out the result of yours, like any child, you run around trying to change the argument. Nice try moron, now go crawl back under your rock and think of another enlightened argument.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:10pmHey Mod,
You better get busy. Your ranks just went from small to smaller.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:06pmSo wait,
I point out where our morals come from.
You then point out what is in error with that.
That is perfectly okay
You then point out where you believe our morals come from.
I then point out the error in that.
But that’s not okay? That’s “changing the subject?”
Seriously, what are you babbling about?
What happened to people like ASHE? At least they were coherent and provided SOME kind of evidence in a discussion and took their thinking past an 8th grade level.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:13pmHey Mod,
When are you going to go back to posting the really ugly, hateful & venomous anti Christian comments that you were famous for?
You should let all the new folks around here see what moderation really looks like.
How come you never mention your Christian, Jewish, and Mormon family and friends any more?
You know, the ones that have no problem with you, and you have no problems with them?
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:35pm@Billy
Is this what you do when I throw tons and tons of evidence and ideas at you?
“Why don’t you talk about your friends anymore?” I always said that me talking about my friends was a response to the assumption that I have no religious friends and hate all of religion. Plus, what does this have to do with anything that is being discussed right now?
If you would like me to talk about my friends I will.
I was just recently a groomsmen in one of my friends weddings. He is an evangelical. It was a fun time and I was respectful during the entire process. I even bowed my head during the prayer portion as to not mess up any potential photos. Granted I didn‘t close my eyes and didn’t mumble any wishful thoughts to an invisible friend, but I was respectful.
I suggest you go and read “SLEAZYHIPPOS ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING” second response to me, and then my response to him.
Unlike you(and many others on here), that person seems to comprehend what I type and can also make coherent remarks and ideas.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 4:35pmWrong again lab partner. I explained the error in so called atheistic logic that’s states morality is a constant decided upon by society. I showed how a “morality” that can be manipulated by every whim of “science” is no morality at all. you then came back with some non-contextual argument that has no bearing on whether or not 100 million people were murdered in the last century because of atheist psycho babel. So I submit, where is your example of that enlightened atheistic regime that upheld a moral code we could recognize? Were is the atheist that doesn’t need to be spoon fed and can think for himself?
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:02pm@moderation, your inane response needed to be read over a few times . A: you responded to a post i made about atheism and a lack of moral certitude. You then tried to negate my post by pointing out what you seemed to see as an error in my history without adressing the real issue which is mass murder under a moveable morality. B: since a refusal to address this point has become evident, I can only assume you are trying to change the subject by only giving a cursory explanation while ridiculing what you don’t understand. I would call that changing the subject. Now go find a ball to play with, that seems more your speed.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:16pmThe whole point is
There is mass murdering possible under every type of system
Crusades
Inquisition
Radical Islam now
Were a few systems under “unmovable” moral codes. In fact, their moral code dictated murder of non-believers.
Atheism is simply the rejection of claims of a God based on lack of evidence. I”m not sure an Atheistic society could ever exist.
Atheism isn’t Communism, Socialism, Capitalism or anything else. It is simply a rejection of claims of a God.
You can have Atheists who are Capitalists,
Atheists who are Socialists
Atheists who are Marxists, Communists
The closest you can have to an atheistic society would be one like the United States(granted they weren’t the first societies to think up this type). A secular one(no the US isn’t a Christian nation). One where everyone is afforded equal protection under the law. That law was created by a group of men that consisted of Christians, Deists and Atheists who despite their difference came together and created a rule of law, not based on the Bible but based on a concensus of what they thought was best at the time. Again they made errors(writing about freedom, liberty and pursuit of happiness while owning slaves) and it’s not perfect, but it’s pretty good. Our founders realized you can’t have a rule of law based on the Bible, because the Bible is read differently by different people.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 5:39pmMod says:
“I always said that me talking about my friends was a response to the assumption that I have no religious friends and hate all of religion. Plus, what does this have to do with anything that is being discussed right now?”
Wrong again Mod,
You were not responding to anyone with your claims of having friends and family members of all different faiths.
You posted those words over and over in a lame attempt to prove to us how “moderate” and “tolerant” you supposedly were of religious folk. Then you would turn right around and post a totally vile and unprovoked attack on Christians.
Like Happystretchedthin has stated here already………we see right through you.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:29pmThe problem for you Orwellianly named MODERATION is that we’ve already tried it you way champ.
Report Post »Stalin’s Russia, Hitler’s Germany, Khmer Rouge, Maoist China…ad nauseum. Responsible for hundreds of millions of deaths and incarcerations. Heck..China still has gulags. All of them staunchly humanist/secular twentieth century creations that souight to remove religion from society and replace religion with humanist/statist ideals instead.
Please don’t insult me by trying to invoke the crusades or the inquisitions. The numbers pale next to the wholesale slaughter your humanists brought on their peoples.
ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:34pm@THERIGHTSOFBILLY
See, I don’t deal in realms of “tolerance” like you religious folks.
I actually like and love those people, I don’t merely “tolerate” them because I have to. I actively seek out spending time with them.
The way that you could say that I “tolerate” them is when they post pro Christian stuff, or anti non Christian stuff, I don’t feel the need to comment back on it. Unfortunately for you people, you don’t get that tolerance. Your view on moderation is incorrect. Moderation isn’t always being within the equal “middle” all of the time every time.
For instance, I can post something like, “Christianity is a cult of human sacrifice(truth)” and you might say, “Wow, that’s pretty extremely mean.” I could then say I feel genuinely sad when a Christian dies, and wish the best for their family. Or donate to one of my friends Christian charities, or do volunteer work with and for Christians. You might then say, “wow, that’s pretty nice.” My nice deeds doesn’t wipe out my bad deed and vice versa, they level out each other out. I am not interested in wiping out any deeds. I don’t need a scapegoat. I don’t care if the volunteer work I do ends up getting credited to Christianity.
If your God exists and can look at all of the good work that people have done, and can then rebuke that work because they didn’t believe in Jesus, I have no interest in being with that God for an eternity.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:45pmYour church history is really quite terrible Orwellianly named MODERATION. I suggest you do some serious study.
Report Post »You bleated earlier that the Catholic church exists because it supposedly purged the gnostics?
Let me help you champ…The Latin Church (that’s the catholic church for idiots like you MODDY) came into being after the schizm between Rome and Constantinople. Constantine and the Byzantine Church came before the Latin Church.
To educate you further, no credible scholar will put the gnostic texts with the four gospels. The gnostic texts are different in style and purpose and come after the four canonical gospels. The four gospels are from the lifetimes of the people described in them and their historicity is quite excellent. This cannot be said of the gnostic texts. And yes MODDY..I know that the four gospels are technically anonymous. By all means give me a credible competitor for the writers and I’ll review it. Good luck with that.
So MODDY..the Nicean council got it right nearly two thousand years ago..what’s holding you up champ?
ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:56pm@AVENGERK
“The four gospels are from the lifetimes of the people described in them and their historicity is quite excellent.”
This is so false I can’t take the rest of your argument seriously.
The fact that of the four gospels, only two contain the virgin birth are downright hilarious. Let’s hear some rationalizations for it though, this will be hilarious.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:02pm@Aveng
The fact that you bring up “numbers” proves how immoral you are.
Even one death for the wrong idea is wrong.
You also underestimate how many people were tortured and died.
You also seem incapable of realizing that the times were more primitive, so it was more difficult on a mass scale. As I say, “Christianity was just as brutal as Islam, they just didn’t have 21st century weapons to prove how peaceful they were.”
And I think it’s hilarious you say that secular societies were the result of that because America is a secular society. You also prove my point. They had CRAZY ideals, where most of those leaders saw themselves as more then men. The state was the church. Does that sound like rational people to you? Not at all?
Just because those people weren’t rational, doesn’t mean leaders of countries who are religious are rational.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:02pmOrwellianly named MODERATION…like I said…we‘ve already tried your cult’s way. The twientieth century’s strictly humanist regimes are responsible for the deaths of countless hundreds of millions.
Report Post »You want to talk about cults of human sacrifice? Your cult have sacrificed millions at the altar of humanism.
And you think that’s changed? You’ve just repackaged it under things like population control.
A quote from Obama’s Czar of Science John Holdren from his book “Ecoscience”.
“All the children who are born, beyond what would be required to keep up the population to a desired level, must necessarily perish, unless room be made for them by the death of grown persons.”
Boy there’s some fine humanist morals on display from Holdren.
Please..don’t insult me with your puerile scribblings and your poor knowledge of history, there’s nothing “moderate” about you MODDY. You’re as partisan and filled with contempt as they come.
AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:24pmSpare me your juvenile brush offs MODDY. You don’t get to control the discussion particularly in light of your deplorably poor grasp of history. When you bleated earlier that the catholic church exists because you believe it got rid of the gnostics did you forget the the Latin church actually exists because of the sch8zm between Rome and Constantinople? I‘ll wager you weren’t even aware of it.
Liberal scholars offer that Mark was written around 70 AD. Matthew and Luke were written around 80 AD . John was written around 90 AD . Conservative scholars suggest some were written even earlier. Christ was crucified around 33AD. Do the math champ.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:36pmYou devolved into a shrillness pretty easily there Orwellianly named MODERATION.
America a secular society MODDY?
“When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary…Laws of Nature and of Nature’s GOD entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights….”
You tell me champ..what “secular” nation invokes God and the Creator in it’s declaration of independence?
Like I said MODDY…you‘ve demonstrated a pathetically poor grasp of the subjects you’re trying to argue. You have a laughable grasp of history and you seem to either brush off anything that you feel disagrees with you or just get shrill and bleat anything that comes into your muddled head.
I’m wasting my time arguing with a cretin like you.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:42pmAnd humanist regimes have been even more brutal than Islam MODDY. And far more efficient in their brutality.
Report Post »You miss an important dynamic MODDY..because you’re too busy trying to spin rather than think. You yourself bleated about “primitive” times. Yet all the humanist regimes and their killings I offered you were from the twentieth century. You humanists like to offer that society has “evolved” and that your ideas are the “enlightened” ones to take us out of the dark ages and religion. Yet…here you have numerous modern, “enlightened” HUMANIST twentieth century regimes who made it a point to excise religion from their societies and who’s barbarism dwarfs anything you can offer from religion.
Thanks for playing champ.
ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:57pm@Aveng
The fact that you can’t address me with the words “orwellian named” shows you have NO argument.
You are only interested in propaganda to paint me in a negative light to try to make my arguments less valid to others.
It would be very similar to me saying after everyone of your posts, “ah, Aveng, your use of propaganda through repetition would make Joseph Goebbels proud.” My goal there would be to minimize your views in the eyes of other by associating you and your actions with negative figure/idea in history.
To say that it was written “in their lifetime” is a clever way to get around the fact that they
1. Weren’t written by the alleged authors
2. Weren’t written in the time that the alleged events happened.
3. Weren’t written by the direct followers of the alleged authors.
I think the Bible only mentions the death of two of the 12 apostles. I may be wrong but I think the other deaths are unknown and only “guessed” by other Christian writings.
The fact that you could know when the books were written and still believe that they’re true from front to back is laughable at best.
When talking to people about the bible, specifically things like Genesis, I get the strong feeling that they think it’s a step by step account of what actually happened and not just some random guy spouting off what he believes God is saying.
It‘s so man made it’s hilarious. Please stop talking to me about history when you accept nonsense.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:07pm@Aveng
Look up the word secular.
Our constitution is secular and doesn’t mention a God. We are bound by secular law, hence we are a secular nation. God, the Bible or Jesus aren’t mentioned in our Constitution, which makes our laws
To say “creator” means God is laughable. It’s so hilariously vague. I am created by my parents. You are created by your parents.
Our founding fathers said we are born with life liberty and pursuit of happiness regardless of how we think/believe we were born.
Regardless of how I came into this world, I am born with those things. Nobody can take them away from me.
You‘re so eager to prove that we’re a Christian nation, you twist anything to try to fit that agenda.
I actually at least admit that Christians played a big role in the founding of our nation, as did deists and atheists. To say that we’re a Christian nation is dishonest and ignorant of history.
Report Post »Therightsofbilly
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:08pmHey Mod,
You’re kind of over using the word “laughable” lately.
You don’t seem like the kind of person that laughs much. But I am sure that you will correct me on that point.
Yes Mod, I know people of many different faiths, but truth be told, we really don’t get in to discussing each others religions that much. Why do think that is?
Really, the only people I will not hang around with is atheists, because every one I have ever met in person is pretty much like you. I have seen a select few on here that seem to be very decent and respectful folks, but I would not put you in that category.
Now tell us again exactly why you come here, and what you hope to gain by alienating just about everyone except the rest of your cadre.
You have been grinding your ax for so long now that there is nothing left of both it, and the grinding wheel.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:30pm@moderation… Firstly, the Crusades is a canard used by atheists every time there back is up against the wall. The Crusades has its origin in the Muslim conquest of Spain, southern Italy and the island of Sicily. It was a response to Muslim incursion and the excesses had little to do with religious fervor: see sacking of Constantinople by the crusaders in 1204 on the 4th crusade. This had nothing to do with a belief in God and was rejected and ridiculed by the pope at the time. The inquisition, also a little background is needed. The bloody portions of it were in a response to what was seen as subversive Muslim elements within Catholic Spain. This I would suggest had more to do with polotics than religion. At any rate, a sunday school picnic compared with horrors realized in the 20th century. Now onto Atheism. The point is that Atheists don’t all want to mass murder “idiots”. However it is that slippery slope where “science” and “knowledge” combine to rationalize any sort of behavior. Was Stalin an Atheist, by his actions and what he insisted to be taught in the classroom, YES. By his own words, YES. Stalin said “You know, they are fooling us, there is no God…all this talk about God is sheer nonsense” in E. Yaroslavsky, Landmarks in the Life of Stalin, Foreign Languages Publishing House, Moscow 1940 Now many Atheists resist this, “Why it’s not atheism that made him murder all of those people.” Yes, sure, but it was Atheism that told him there was no higher powe
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:36pm@moderation… So slick, this is the problem. Your examples of atrocity by the so called religious pale in comparison to those who believed in no God. A true atheist regime is the one currently in China. Science is the order of the day. In fact go and try and start a religion there… ok, I disagree with you but I don’t hate you, don’t try and start one, they imprison and kill those who do. In Soviet Russia the Bible was taught in schools, as a ridiculous example of the fairy tale of religion. I spoke with a Bulgarian woman on a flight once who had interesting stories about this. I find it funny how you point to the US as an example of an Atheist government, pointing to the fact that it allows us to think and worship (or not) as we please. Yet it is the Atheists who shrivel at the sight of a cross like the wicked witch of the west.
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:45pm@moderation… Ok it wouldn’t let me post in the other thread: you were right, not in the Origin of Species, hard to keep your bibles straight. It is found in Darwins the Descent of Man:Charles Darwin, The Descent of Man (London: John Murray, 1901), pp. 241-242.At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilized races of man will almost certainly exterminate, and replace, the savage races throughout the world. At the same time, the anthropomorphous apes . . . will no doubt be exterminated. The break between man and his nearest allies will then be wider, for it will intervene between man in a more civilized state, as we may hope, even than the Caucasian, and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as now between the ***** [sic] or Australian and the gorilla.
Report Post »Try also reading Mein Kampf Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf (Boston: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1943), pp. 286, 295, 325, 402, 403, 285, 289 I would think it might enlighten you on how the theories of evolution shaped his mind. Now I’ve done my part… did you study up on the whole Adolf killed catholics and other christians who tried to push back against the Holocost… No… well I was sure you probably wouldn’t. I can’t do all the work you know, now run along, the adults are going to talk.
Pray for USA
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:39amOne more comment from me: Read the lives of the saints like St. Maximillian Kolbe.
Report Post »HiJenx
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:29amPublicity stunt? Just wondering.
Report Post »HiJenx
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:28amUh OH, Kiddo… you just pissed off the anti-Christian atheist organizations like the “Freedom From Religion Foundation.” Get under cover of your faith community, quickly.
Report Post »BlazeGlory
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:27amLuke 19:40. New International Version (NIV). 40 “I tell you,” he replied, “if they keep quiet, the stones will cry out.”
Report Post »lqtm
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:47amI’ve met bread that was smarter than you are.
Report Post »BlazeGlory
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:01amLQTM There can be nothing in the universe that is as stupid as you.
Report Post »scdave
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:21am“Just as I am” is one of my favorite hymns. I am happy for her and will pray for her on her journey. She will need them to fight the attacks that are coming.
Report Post »22AUTOMATIC
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 3:05pmShe’s not alone. Currently 8% of the world’s population is converting to Christianity from other religions and atheism. That‘s the highest it’s been in the past 2000 years and the highest of any religion (most others are in the negative). See the link to what Reinhart Bonnke is doing overseas below; it’s amazing.
http://jocelyns-coffeecorner.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
Also, one of the hundreds of educational tools below disproving Evolution once again. Well worth a watch when you have time.
http://youtu.be/yBkXBlZld-Q
Report Post »Diane TX
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:16amGood for her.
Report Post »Zorro6821
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:31amTook her a while but at least she figured it out…Moral Law is Not created by mortals nor can it be destroyed. Just like matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Good For Her!!!
Report Post »Tractorboy
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:09amI say to her Welcome Sister, glad to have you, I know I started out as something of a atheist, Does anybody crawl out of the womb with faith?
Report Post »Darren
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:22pmAgeed!!! May she embrace God and progres towards him. May she be instrumental in spreading God’s good word and works.
Report Post »Meyvn
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:13amTetelestai
Report Post »koyettsu
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:12amOnce you feel the presence of God, it is impossible to deny him. Good for her, I hope we see more of this from these people who are perpetually angry and hateful.
Report Post »lqtm
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:50amNot true, how then do you explain all the believers who declare themselves to be atheist? They just didn’t feel the presence? Sounds like total BS. Once you feel the presence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster… That’s equally BS, and that’s the point of the Church of the FSM. Seriously do you know how stupid you people sound?
Report Post »jettson
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:05amLQTM Shut up you stupid jerk Who cares what you think. Ass hole
Report Post »BlazeGlory
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:17amLQTM Any “believers” who declare themselves to be atheists were never true believers. We only “sound” stupid to you because your “ears” are trained to hear only Satan.
Report Post »puravida56
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:24am@koyettsu- I am a former born again christian who felt that presence. I cried as I said the salvation prayer and led many others to say the same prayer.
Since I have awaken form my brainwashing, I have met many others who have the same experience. So- I guess I am saying it is possible to feel ‘the holy spirit’ and then later deny that it was the holy spirit.
Report Post »Gonzo
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:11pmLQTM, you sound pretty stupid to us.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 1:17pm@ puravida56
Accepting and then refusing–the “unforgivable” sin without true repentence! May you not “wake up” the next time in the eternity of “the damned! “Feelings” have little to do with the Gift of Grace into Salvation!
Report Post »Pray for USA
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:08amOne good book I’ve read recently is “What We Can’t Not Know” by J Budziszewski. Listen to / read Jeff Cavins, Scott Hahn, Raymond Arroyo, etc. Father Robert Barron’s Word on Fire website is wonderful. His sermons are available for download. And remember, God is truth. Congrats to you, Leah.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:08amFrom a fellow Catholic who reconciled to the Church almost 40 years go from Evangelical Christianity (the best of both worlds!), WELCOME TO THE FAMILY! Welcome to the family of God.
Inviting all to learn and trust God, and come Home. . .
Report Post »kickagrandma
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:15amLike your post. AMEN!
Report Post »bigdaddyt46
Posted on June 20, 2012 at 5:17amto my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ:
this makes the second story where in the comment sections Christians are ripping other Christians, and is very disheartening. we are one in Christ Jesus, so let us stop tearing apart another person’s faith. if your religion of choice teaches the Triune God then that is what is important whether you be catholic, Lutheran(as i am),or baptist. i am unsure if mormons teach the trinity therefore i can or cannot say as i will not try to speak of which i don’t know here. to my Catholic brothers and sisters i do not believe in tearing down another religion i am asking for the same respect. for you to consider is that Luther did not set out to form his own religion, mearly to point out several things he read in an original bible that was against the belief of that time(IE the selling of forgiveness is one example). i am not trying to disparage catholics, i am only saying this for you to consider. my point is we need to embrace each other through faith in Christ putting aside alot of the minor differences and ralley together with what we do share in common. this is my prayer.
Yours in Christ Jesus the living Lord,
Report Post »Thomas A. Hellman
infidelsaplenty
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:05amThe human heart eventually has to come to grips with the fact that there is no moral compass in unbelief.
Report Post »Jenny Lind
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:20amPerfectly put.
Report Post »Tulsa-time
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:05amThe Holy Spirit is shaking the trees praise God!
Report Post »StevenNarbonne
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:40pmReally? Nice, I suppose, but what significance does that have? Are you sure it is not just the wind?
Report Post »stockpicker
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:03amProblem is that she will still be mired in unbelief.
Report Post »Taquoshi
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:29amWe’re all mired in unbelief at some point or other. Nothing new to see there. I left the R.C. church long before I figured out which doctrines I disagreed with, but as I learned more about Reformed theology, I gained a better understanding of where I am today and where I was back then.
I wish her the best and pray that she has good support and solid teaching.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:59amDon’t let someone get you hung up on what appears to be cruelties in the Old Testament – the enemy was, and still is, very cruel and unmerciful – the enemy is satan, always is, always will be. Maintain the Good Fight. Don the armor. The Old Testament is a Pattern for What Is to Follow – Jesus.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:16amAnd, yes. There is Only One God.
Report Post »Jenny Lind
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:19amI have always believed the Old Testament was the severe way we make rules for children. Don’t touch, be carefull, look both ways, as well as history and morality stories to teach us. Then the real “collage” of life arrives with Christ. The very serious precious footsteps to follow home. I know it simplifies this, but it works for me. It’s all the roadmap home.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:28amThe Old Testament arrangement in the Temple tent was laid out like the Wounds of Christ.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:28amI realized as a very young (well churched and prayed for) child, that all (make that ALL) that is wrong, unkind, self-centered, nasty, mean, not-solved, etc., etc., etc., IS ONE THING–IT IS A FORM OF “SIN IN THE WORLD.”
If we as sons and daughters of God can understand that this is HIS WORLD, and that through His Word, the Messiah, who will ultimately rule a NEW HEAVEN and a NEW EARTH and that those who have chosen to be “part of the family” will live and rule with Him, forever, we will not be troubled by this world and what “others” say and do.
We need to understand that for now, Satan is allowed to be loose in the world, “Seeking whom he can devour.” (I Peter 5:8), while at the “The Son of Man came to SEEK and to SAVE that (those) who were lost.” (Luke 19:10). Get on the Barque (boat) of the Church’s teaching and come to your Heavenly Father, Abba (Daddy), and we will celebrate your decision when others “revile you” (as the Beatitudes tell us, “BLESSED ARE YOU WHEN MEN REVILE YOU AND PERSECUTE YOU FOR (HIS) SAKE, . . . your reward will be great in heaven.” (Matthew 5:11-12+).
Pray, pray, pray and smile for this new member of God’s Family whenever you think of her!
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:36am@ jennylind
SO TRUE! Read some of Scott Hahn‘s and Brant Petri’s work, and notice the constant connection between and among the Covenants of the Father! We humans are a loved and blessed people, so many of us just don’t know that! He has always guided and protected us. Now in the “age of the mind,“ we are trying to bring ourselves to the ”intelligence of God“ without the ”wisdom of God”!
Humanity moves IT‘S SELF to it’s own destruction, while “The Word who is The Son and The Messiah waits to bring His Kingdom into fullness. Holy Spirit, guide us as we witness to the world of the Father’s Love–miracle, Three-in-One!
Report Post »Dudley Do-Right
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:31amScott Hahn is amazing. A rabid anti-Catholic Protestant minister who converted to Catholicism.
Here’s his conversion story
http://www.katoliko.com/scotthahn.htm
Report Post »kickagrandma
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:56amGOD IS at work in this world. Praise HIM from WHOM ALL BLESSINGS flow.
GOD BLESS our new sister-in-Christ in all ways and protect her from the evil one who will seek to destroy her new commitment by any way possible. Hedge her in prayer, guys!
Report Post »ROCKETSMOM
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:32pmABSOLUTELY!!!!! THIS IS A HARD-WON SOUL…. To all the brothers and sisters in the room, we Really need to pray to God for the hedgerow of protection for her….
Report Post »barber2
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:53amBut, will she really have time for God in her ” me- focused ,” frenetic life ?
Report Post »welloddyfriggindah
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:46am“It happens. Far less frequently than the other way around, but it happens.” – This fellow was pretty objective and fair by wishing Leah well, but the fact that it’s more popular to choose a belief that has a questionable or at least mobile moral compass should not be a surprise. Most of us will normally seek the easier softer way because it’s easier – and build a defense around the presupposition.
Report Post »minnievike
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:44amWelcome Home!
Report Post »Bryan B
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:43amGood for Her……
Pray for Jett…………..
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:43amAsk God for the understanding ! That’s what I had to do when I was eight.
Report Post »TROLLMONGER
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:42amNo one cares.
Report Post »barber2
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:51amYou “cared” enough to write a nasty comment, Anger Boy.
Report Post »lketchum
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:57ameveryone should.
Report Post »HumbleCitizen
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:16am@ Trollmonger
Report Post »You sir, are incorrect that “no one” cares.
Angels rejoice over the salvation of each lost sinner. Luke 15:10: “In the same way, I tell you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”
Fellow Christians care (as evidenced by the responses).
lukerw
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:41amAmazing… I thought an Atheist… would become a Deist (GOD is OutSide the Universe)… before becoming a GOD is involved in your Life disciple.
Great…
Report Post »lketchum
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:03amGod “is” the universe…
As death approached him, Einstein was asked by his nurse what he thought of God, after saying it did not matter to God what he thought of him, or anything else, the good Doktor is reported to have said: “For years I though of the universe as a garden and God as being the gardener. I’ve since come to understand that God “is” the garden and from time to time he allows me glimpses of his work.”
As a boy, seeking to understand things, Einstein’s perspective proved useful and finding God in science became a life-long passion. There are millions of Christians that study similarly.
Report Post »bpodlesnik
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:15amI truly hope she is sincere about this, and this isn’t some kind of joke to make fun of Christians. Remember the article on the guy who converted from Atheism to Christianity and only lasted a week. I just hope this isn’t the case for her.
Report Post »lukerw
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:27am@LK…
GOD is given the Attributes of Being… Infinite & Eternal. The Universe is defined as… Finite (Measured), Oval, and set in Time (having a Beginning called the Big Bang). GOD does not Fit into the Universe… and Heaven is Not in the Universe.
Please recompute!
Report Post »THX-1138
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 2:33pmYou are the Light.
Report Post »You are the Refuge.
There is no place to take shelter but Yourself.
TryThought
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:05pmBe careful. Physically speaking, consensus is that the universe is infinite and indefinite and that there is no such thing as ‘before’ or ‘after’ the universe. Think of time not as a river flowing one way. Think of time as a globe. When one stands on the North Pole, every where that person looks is south. As such, there is no “more north” or “before north,” it’s just south.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 7:40amI would suggest pick up a copy of the King James – follow the direction clearly laid out by the Apostles in the New Testament – then decide on the doctrine to follow – will you let me say that ?
Report Post »Tulsa-time
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:10amWell said!
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 9:18amThe Disciples had the Teacher with them to discipline them ; after the Teacher is gone, the Disciples make a decision to do what they were taught and become an Apostle.
Report Post »hillbillyinny
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 10:51am@ searching for the truth
And the Holy Spirit will be with His Church until the end of the age. . . Thank you blessed Lord!
Report Post »edmundburk
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 6:12pmall I know is god led me away from my godlessness and changed my heart, and helped me find true happiness in the catholic church. may God bless her!
Report Post »snooop1e
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 8:37pmThere is only one TRUE KING and His name is not James it’s JESUS CHRIST ; )
Report Post »RepentYe
Posted on June 19, 2012 at 11:16pm@Moderation… you got me, not in Origin of Species. I know I try to study the Atheist bible as often as I can but you know it’s hard to keep it all straight. It however appears in the Descent of Man:Charles Darwin, The Descent of Man (London: John Murray, 1901), pp. 241-242. Try also page 291-292. And you might want to recheck your thinking on Hitler if you read Mein Kampf, not exactly one to bend and do hail marries. Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf (Boston: Houghton Mifflin Co., 1943), pp. 286, 295, 325, 402, 403, 285, 289. your idea that Hitler was a devout catholic is laughable. So I guess you can be done with me now… or do I have to go and explain why the Crusades are not what you think.
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