‘Inside the Mormon Empire’: Bloomberg Businessweek Releases Controversial Mormon Cover
- Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:09pm by
Christopher Santarelli
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Some controversy is likely to ensue with the upcoming cover story from Bloomberg Businessweek, titled, “Latter-day Lucre: How the Mormon Church Makes Its Billions:”
POLITICO’s Dylan Byers reports that this explanation came the with the mockup of the cover:
Here’s the context…: Image is from an 1898 lithograph of “The Youthful Prophet, Joseph Smith, Jr., and Oliver Cowdery, Receiving the Aaronic Priesthood Under the Hands of John the Baptist, May 15, 1829. Recording a pivotal moment in the birth of Mormonism.
Of course added on to the historic image is editorial commentary from Businessweek referencing the many business ventures of notable Mormons. The story unceremoniously delves into the spirit of enterprise common in the ethos of modern-day Mormonism, while raising questions regarding the Church’s fiscal transparency.
It’s perhaps unsurprising that Mormonism, an indigenous American religion, would also adopt the country’s secular faith in money. What is remarkable is how varied the church’s business interests are and that so little is known about its financial interests. Although a former Mormon bishop is about to receive the Republican Party’s presidential nomination, and despite a recent public-relations campaign aimed at combating the perception that it is “secretive,” the LDS Church remains tight-lipped about its holdings. It offers little financial transparency even to its members, who are required to tithe 10 percent of their income to gain access to Mormon temples.
The article notes that the Mormon Church is hardly the only religious institution to be less than forthcoming about its wealth, but with the cover-art and highly tense current public discussion surrounding the religion (with a former bishop running for president and the hottest act on Broadway is a satire titled, “The Book of Mormon”), it seems imminent that the report will cause a stir.
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Comments (648)
Helpful
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:42pmGiving 10% tithe is also in other church’s to, not just Morman. If we all truly gave the 10% tithe that God ask us to do this country would be in better shape.What is Caesar’s give to Caesar, what is God’s give unto God………….
Report Post »pdw
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:44pmIt is a commandment that God his people that they might learn how to help others. At the same time how to learn the value of thrift, not wants but needs. The richer many get the farther they move away from their God and the love of their families. Thank you for your Comment!
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:17pmHere is the church’s response to the article: http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/church-financial-independence
Report Post »brother_ed
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:22pm@HELPFUL & PDW
Correct on both points.
I have never heard we charge a 10% tithe to go to the Temple, but I guess that is another way of looking at it. We must be full tithe payers to be Temple worthy.
Tithing settlement requires no W-2′s or bank statements.
The bishop asks: “Are you a full tithe payer?”
You answer either “Yes”, or “No”.
It is as easy as that.
We are also asked to fast once a month and to give the amount of money we would’ve spent on the meals to feed the poor in your area. That is above and beyond tithing.
False doctrine? Maybe. Helpful? If you’re hungry it is.
I have worked in the Bishop’s Storehouse here in the Dallas area.
It is where members who are struggling go to get food (usually for the next week or so).
It is like a little grocery store. Everything from light bulbs to tampons, cereal to turkeys. A lot of the food is grown on church farms.
We do not think the government should be involved in feeding the poor. The worst way to help someone is to give them an EBT card to spend on whatever. If you are hungry, we’ll give you food.
We also have a Perpetual Education fund that is used to give disadvantaged folks money for education. They pay it back as they are able.
These two programs have lifted the living standards of countless people.
Both are taken from collections separate from tithing.
Again – False doctrine? Maybe. Evil? Absolutely not.
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:33pmIf everyone in the world tithed 10% to whatever church they were part of, there would be no such thing as hunger. There would be no end to the love of one to another. That is what charity does, and that is why it is so important in my church.
As I have loved you, love one another.
Report Post »AdrianRuehl
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:54pmAt no time were first century Christians commanded to pay tithes. The primary purpose of the tithing arrangement under the Law had been to support Israel’s temple and priesthood; consequently the obligation to pay tithes would cease when that Mosaic Law covenant came to an end as fulfilled, through Christ’s death. (Eph 2:15; Col 2:13, 14) It is true that Levitical priests continued serving at the temple in Jerusalem until it was destroyed in 70 C.E., but Christians from and after 33 C.E. became part of a new spiritual priesthood that was not supported by tithes. (Ro 6:14; Heb 7:12; 1Pe 2:9.) As Christians, they were encouraged to give support to the Christian ministry both by their own ministerial activity and by material contributions. Instead of giving fixed, specified amounts to defray congregational expenses, they were to contribute “according to what a person has,” giving “as he has resolved in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.” -2Co 8:12; 9:7
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 8:36pmHey KANKO
Why not make it 30%? Or 70%? Yeah!
I mean, if some is good, more has got to be better. Right?
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 9:33pmConservativeCankles:
The scriptures teach to impart a tenth of our substance to the Lord. Now, I know that you don’t believe in all this religious malarkey, but I do. I tithe, and it has a very powerful beneficial effect on my life. If you refuse to see any metaphysical benefit, fine. But for me and my family, we give this tenth freely and without complaint, because I know the blessings I will receive in my life – should they be from God, or some chemical benefit to my own body (a.k.a. the warm fuzzies). We are not asked to impart to the church more than a tenth, but we are encouraged to directly and charitably give as much as we can to whoever we can, be it money, time, food, support, love, etc.
You should find a better way to convince others of your own beliefs than outright insult. you may get better results.
Report Post »Boo Bear
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:13pmI am a mormon and proud to be. When members of the church need food, they go to the church’s food bank, when they need a job, they go to the church’s unemployment office, if they need help to pay their bills, they go to the Bishop for financial assistance, if they need clothes, they go to the warehouse full of nice, donated clothes, instead of the alternative, government money. If a person needs a babysitter to go to work, the relief society is more than willing to help. It takes a village, we are a village.
Report Post »lynskinners
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 11:33pmFor those mormons who believe many posting here are attacking them by pointing out their false doctrine; it’s not those posting you need to worry about, it’s the God of Abraham who will exact his just vengeance upon all those who follow false doctrine. Fear not those mortals who witness the truth of God – fear the God who is able to both create and destroy. “But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them —bringing swift destruction on themselves.” 2 Peter 2:1
Report Post »brother_ed
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 11:55pm@ LYNSKINNERS
Well said!
I take particular comfort in the fact that ‘false prophets’ will come among us – it implies that there will be a ‘true prophet’ among us. If this were not so, we would be told to beware of ‘any prophet’.
It’s also comforting to know that the church will be persecuted. Many here believe that asking a school, which is an agent of the state, to remove the 10 commandments is tantamount to persecution.
That’s nothing compared to rapes, mobbing, murder and property destruction – which is what the early LDS church had to tolerate – not to mention the out and out hostility of those who claim to be followers of Christ.
Christ allowed people the freedom to worship as they pleased; He did not call them names (except the leaders that were supposed to be guarding the faith).
I fear God. I love God. I do my best to follow the teachings of His Son. As Christ himself said to His Apostles: “If they are not against us, they are for us”.
Report Post »Gorp
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:08amI guess I just don’t understand some people.
I know some Atheists who have better manners than some of these posters who claim to be Christians. I really don’t care what religion anyone is as long as they are not doing harm to anybody. People are given a free will to do as they please.
Let’s just say, for argument’s sake, that there is only ONE true religion. Let‘s also say that anybody who isn’t a member of that faith is going to Hell. I remember reading somewhere that God will give us all a choice on Judgement Day to follow Him or not. If we are stupid enough, on that day, to say NO I won’t follow You, then we will get our “just rewards”.
And what about those who live in the most remote regions of the world who have never been taught about the God we believe in? They are the ones who believe in the Sun God or the God of Mud and Slop or whatever God they believe in. Are they condemned or do they get a second chance on Judgement Day? If God is really a loving and forgiving God I believe they get a second chance.
I can honestly say that I have no proof that God exists except for my faith that He exists and loves me. And isn’t belief in God faith in God? I also believe that I’ve had prayers answered. Not my lottery prayer, just the real ones.
Who really cares how much anybody tithes or how much they don’t? It’s really up to them and them alone. If someone doesn’t earn enough to tithe 10%, big deal. Do 10% in other ways like helping your neighbors wh
Report Post »lovenfl3
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:25amBut remember liberals…….there is no media bias…….right? Oh, and there is also no war on religion by the left…..right? This has all gotten so pathetic and childish. Obama’s religion is off limits. Obama’s wife is off limits, Obama’s personal records are off limits. Now as for Romney……what’s he hiding! Show us everything Mitt! The liberal mindset is an amazing thing to behold.
Report Post »http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JODQoMEveds
Juniemoon
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 9:00amI’d like to know where we are told to give 10% of our earnings to a church. I‘ve read the bible and I’ve read where tbe 1st fruits were wheat, oil, grapes, 1st born flocks for the temple sacrifices, and other for shewbread, oil for the lamps, food for the needy and priests. This was for the Temple for as long as it stood and for the land of Israel. Not everyone was required, only land owners, shop owners and those of wealth.
Report Post »Yeshu told us the feed the poor, take care of the orphaned and the widow. No where is if written or required of us to give 10% to a church. You can give it, but is not required.
brother_ed
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 10:39am@JUNIEMOON
Try Genisis 28:20-22, also Malachi 3:8-12. There are others, but these two are a good start.
It may be there is a difference between tithes (one tenth) and offerings.
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 10:54amJunie: That would be Malachi 3:10, Deuteronomy 14:24, etc. Also, the definition of “tithe” is “tenth”. The concept of tithing a tenth of our substance has been practiced by Judaism since the time of Moses, and the practice was carried on into the advent of Christianity.
Here is a great deal of information on the subject: http://bible.cc/malachi/3-10.htm
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:00am@Nucklehead
Report Post »First off, I apologize for calling you a name. When someone insults something I hold dear, I can get emotional. So, because you got burned by a supposed Mormon, it has become your life’s mission to scorn and ridicule an entire religion? Guess what, many of us have been burned by Mormons, Catholics, Jews, Protestants, Aethists, Muslims, Buddhists, Satanists, Gothics, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Baptists (tell me when to stop), Hindus, Confucianists, Secularists, Mennonites, Presbyterians, Amish, Tree-hugging hippies, non-denominational Christians, Lutherans, and even non-committal people like you. That tells me that there are lots of people within eeach of the “religions” that does not live the principles that their churches preach. I am sorry that you lost that money at the hands of a Mormon. I can understand you being moe than upset. Please know that we are not taught from the pulpit to take advantage of our brothers and sisters…in fact quite the opposite. Whoever did that to you is a fool and sinner and will receive his “reward” when he stands before God. That will not put money back in your pocket, but it is NOT the Mormon church that has wronged you. And it is NOT the Mormon people, as a whole, that have wronged you. It is one idiot that is not living his religion at all! I assume you have never done a dishonest thing in your life? You have never lied, cheated, or stolen anything?
LDSGuy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:12amTithing is not just part of the Mosaic Law. Tithing existed before Moses, and therefore can be considered independent of the Mosaic Law, which is named for the man by which it came. Abraham, we are told in the book of Hebrews, paid tithes to Melchezidek. These two men lived far before the time of Moses. Hence, they were not under the Mosaic law which means that tithing as a principle can exist independently from the law of Moses.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:54amJust a quick observation…has anyone else observed that when any story related to Mormons shows up on The Blaze, it draws some of the highest number of comments of any story? Hmmm? With all the other world-changing news taking place each day, we always have bigoted, hateful, Mormophobes on the left and right, who are most concerned with spewing lies about doctrine they know nothing about. Food for thought…
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:03pmLDSGUY: I stand corrected. I forgot about the King Melchizadek thing. I guess, in a sense, tithing has been around since God first made himself known to Adam.
Report Post »brother_ed
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:34pm@THE_ZAZZY
The anti speak is from a few who consistently try to ‘save the Mormons’. Most folks are reading and not commenting.
It is our job to explain our doctrines, not to contend.
Some doctrine is difficult for a lot of folks to digest. It is often like explaining algebra to a 1st grader. That is not meant to be insulting, it is meant to illustrate the fact that we learn “line by line, precept upon precept.”
Jesus learned the same way. The scriptures tell us that “He grew in stature and favor before God.”
We invite all men to read the Book of Mormon for themselves and to pray to their Father in heaven to see if it is true. He will answer the prayers of those who have a contrite heart and sincere desire to know.
If they receive an answer that it is true, then Joseph Smith was a prophet and the Church is what it claims to be. If they do not receive this answer, then we can part as friends.
A simple, humble testimony of the fact that Jesus is the Christ, He died for us that we may be forgiven of our sins so we can return to live with our a heavenly Father. That Jesus lives, He cares about us and invites all men to come unto Him, that we may find peace and comfort. The Gospel of Jesus Christ makes bad men good and good men better. That His is the only name under heaven whereby men are saved. That the authority to preform the saving ordinances of the Gospel has been restored to the Earth.
Jesus did not convert everyone he spoke to, why should we
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:51pmHi ZAZZY
Report Post »No worries on the name-calling. I forgive you :-)
But you’re mistake … I do not scorn and ridicule an entire religion because I got burned by a supposed Mormon. I thot I had been very clear on that point.
I scorn and ridicule the religion because it is ridiculous. And scorn-worthy.
Please remember, I wasn’t the one who brought up the matter of personal experiences with Mormons. Two other LDS apologists did that; one asked us to think of the Mormons we know and recognize how highly we think of them; the other asked rhetorically, “What have Mormons ever done to you?”, assuming the answer could only be … “Nothing”. I was merely being polite and answering THEIR question.
Seriously, I had actually never put the things together in my mind before. At their suggestion I considered what little experience I’ve had with Mormons and, as it turns, it is uniformly baaaad. But that is definitely NOT why I ridicule Joseph Smith, the golden tablets, the temple ceremonies, the salamander spirit, the exclusion of blacks from the priesthood until 1978, the seeing stones, the … well, you get the idea. And you really must know the long list of nonsense as well as I do.
rx4nv
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:02pmThe Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints has a stunning welfare program that puts government welfare to shame. For 50 cents spent on welfare within the church, the recipient receives $1 worth of goods. All of the good the church does, it is done with 10% DONATIONS (not forced) and volunteers and in the end the church is debt free. But wait, the government takes 20-30% of our income before we get it (forced) and still spends more than it gets, but is nowhere close to having the success the church does. Mitt Romney understands all this having been a bishop and in charge of using church donations to give welfare to his parishioners. If anyone can overhaul the government welfare system, a Mormon can.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:31pm@Nucklehead
Report Post »No sarcasm here (which is admittedly unusual for me!), I am truly sorry your experiences with Mormons have been so negative. Hopefully one day, that will change and you will allow it to. I am completely OK if you find the doctrines of the church to be ridiculous. On that, we’ll have to agree to disagree, and do it as gentlemen! It has been an interesting exchange with you, but I harbor no resentment towards you, and hope that I have not offended you.
mcsledge
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 2:03pmAdrianRuehl – The Law of Tithing was not part of the Mosaic Law. Abraham paid tithes to Melchezidek well before Moses came around and the Mosaic Law was established.
Malachi gave fair warning to those who choose to ignore God’s law. But, you are free to choose and then be subject to the consequences (whether good or bad) that follow.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:01pmCheers ZAZZY.
Report Post »Just remember, you can always change your mind about the Mormonism thing. That’s all it takes.
Or, if you wanna go further down the crazy rabbit hole … check yourself into Scientology.
Best to you!
SonOfThunder
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:17pmSorry to bust your bubble but Jesus words on giving is simply be a “cheerful giver”. The tithe is old testament and for the Jews and is the old covenant which is not for Christians. Jesus spoke on giving and it is clear “ be a cheerful giver”. You can give more or less to the church. Anyway God does not need our money just those prosperity preacher like Osteen, TD Jake, creflo Dollar, John Hagee etc do.
Report Post »Repent and trust in Jesus alone.
4XGrace
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:42pmThe morons … opps sorry … Mormons … could never get anything right … from theft of an unpublished manuscript of a fictional work that suddenly becomes … OMG!!!! the Book of Mormon … to all their corrections in doctrine and refinements to conform to political correctness … Blacks could not at one time belong to the moronic church … oh, that’s another thing … they seem to have a problem with spelling … always using an extra m in their name and they could really never get LSD right! … maybe that‘s because you’d have to be on LSD in order to believe the phantasmagorical crap they pedal as doctrine which borders on mason-ism. But I guess they’re in good company with the Catholic church … never a lack of cults in this present world … Work for your salvation ye wicked because soon the night is coming when man’s work is over!
The_Jerk
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:48pmYou have become that which you criticize.
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:50pmAnd you’re saying this as a so-called “Christian”?
Report Post »pdw
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:57pmFear seems to be with you a lot. Try sometime in your life to read before you talk. You seem to be fed by others and fail to find out for yourself if they lies your are told are true. When you learn to love as Christ Loves you then you will find the right answers not the hate messages you post here.
Report Post »The_Jerk
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:57pmSince this is fair game by the Jewish ‘Bloomberg’ media, I think it would be time for a little payback.
Someone should print an ad featuring a long-nosed, yarmulke wearing man, dressed in black, going crazy when someone throws a quarter into a round room shouting, “it’s in the corner!” Good for the goose is good for the gander. Non-Jews call this fairness.
Report Post »THX-1138
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:58pmHate is never pretty. I feel bad for you. Seek help.
Report Post »loneindividual
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:00pmOK! This guy iz easily debunked as a LIAR & A MURDERER in his heart.
Anybody this WRONG must know they are wrong and simply want to GET GAIN.
4XGRACE doesn’t care about the truth.
4XGRACE
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:42pm
The morons … opps sorry … Mormons … could never get anything right … from theft of an unpublished manuscript of a fictional work that suddenly becomes … OMG!!!! the Book of Mormon
Then why hasn’t the original author come out to claim it? There is absolutely no evidence to back up that claim.
“… to all their corrections in doctrine and refinements to conform to political correctness”
The Bible
… Blacks could not at one time belong to the moronic church
You obviously are just peddling propaganda. Mormons have always allowed Blacks into their church. In fact, every man (blacks included) could hold the priesthood until Brigham Young (2nd President of the Church) instituted the ban of the priesthood respecting the Sons of Ham….HAM (Son of Noah) WAS WHITE. His wife Egyptus was a cannanite (Black). So the Curse of Cain has nothing to do with the Curse of Ham
” maybe that‘s because you’d have to be on LSD in order to believe the phantasmagorical crap they pedal as doctrine which borders on mason-ism.”
It does border…but Mormons and Masons obviously have their differences…cuz Masons tried to annihilate the Mormons…cuz they were a threat to THEIR ORGANIZED RELIGION.
” But I guess they’re in goo
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:01pmone.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:50pm
And you’re saying this as a so-called “Christian”?
———————————————————————-
Naw…He only thinks he is a Christian…But his fruit is rotten to the core…
Report Post »JPDevuyst
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:02pmReally? I’m surprised one so obviously uneducated presumes to make spelling jokes. Didn’t Jesus teach something about “Love Thy Neighbour?”
Report Post »If your faith teaches you to spew out such hate-filled drivel, then it cannot be Jesus Christ, the God of Love, whom you worship. And, FYI, people of African decent have always been granted membership in the Mormon church.
AvengerK
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:06pmOh I see how this works…Jerry Wright is off limits and we won’t discuss him..but Romney’s a mormon so Mormonism is fair game?
Report Post »Filthy leftist media…
Dismayed Veteran
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:12pmWow. You may end up at the head of the line. I am sure God will find a place for you. Your’e from the fire and brimestone side of Protestantism, I bet.
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:13pm@aveng
I agree that for most of the media Wright has been off limits but for the right media he has been attacked for his beliefs. If we are willing to look at a Obama’s religion and beliefs why shouldnt we for Romney? Seems like a double standard to me.
Report Post »Lord_Frostwind
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:14pmYou know Grace, I’ve learned something from my faith over a lifetime of twits like you, your kind aren’t even worth my breath. You spew forth all the same garbage without any sense of intellect of knowledge about anything, so I’ll let you wallow in your own idiocy. The only thing you’ll get from me, is laughter, remember that, this Mormon is laughing at you.
Report Post »Karron
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:21pm4xgrace, or whoever you may be, do you always expose your ignorance so blatantly? It is clear to me that you have no understanding of the LDS tenants, let alone Christianity. Sad person that you are, it is clear your life is filled with anger and hatred. Tsk . . .
Report Post »BellaMia7
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:37pmLearn to think for yourself. You’d be surprised how often over-the-top hysterical anti-mormon propaganda brings people want to learn more about the LDS Church from the right sources.
Report Post »ozchambers
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:37pmIt’s not even a question of whether a religion is right or wrong. It’s a question of respecting liberty. I am a Christian who does not believe in many of the teachings of Mormonism. I also happen to not follow or believe in all or many aspects of Hinduism, Taoism, Islam, Judaism, Catholicism, Rastafarianism, Satanism or any other religion or cult. But I DO believe that every individual should have the right to worship according to their own spiritual beliefs as long as it respects and does not infringe on the rights of any other individual. In case you werent aware, The United States of America was designed by our framers to protect each citizens right to worship freely. Based on your irrational hatred of your fellow citizens who belong to LDS, you apparently disagree with our founding father’s vision of freedom. It is people like you who have helped facilitate the erosion of freedom and liberty and respect that was championed by our Constitution. A Constitution that was shaped by the precepts and values of Judeo-Christian values and beliefs. That was shaped by God, Himself. Your behavior and attitude reflects a contempt for His handiwork.
Report Post »ThePeteSantilliShow
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:41pmHere’s the best info you will hear about the secret, cultic rituals that Mitt Romney and his wife practice. In this compelling interview, this former Mormon Bishop’s daughter reveals the truth; that Mitt Romney will have less power as President than his Mormon leaders. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJYJSjCyBMs&list=UUYr9ruxjGbBB1MOpuU6tpAQ&index=3&feature=plcp
Report Post »RedNeckMormon
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:50pmDon’t be hating yourself so much…take the Investigator lessons ans you will learn that you are saved by the Grace of Jesus Christ “after all you can do”…. repent and be baptized and take upon yourself the name of Christ…..
Report Post »Contention is of the Devil, drive him from your life and you will find happiness in Jesus Christ.
walkandtalk
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:51pmfor the jerk You are a hypocrite.(Look up the definition it applys) You are such a coward. According to you everything that has ever happened that is wrong is the fault of the Jews. You use this site to spew your hatred and your inability to be anything in life but a loser. I onced asked you why you hate so much and you didn’t even have the backbone to answer.
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:54pmI feel sorry for you, Grace. You must be a miserable person with all that hatred welled up in you. If your church is what planted this hatred in you, I suggest finding a new one. And as it so happens, I have the perfect one for you ;-)
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:55pmMormon doctrine is fully up for debate, and as with all debates should be accomplished with accurate facts.
Report Post »Mormon practice is fully up for judgment, and as with all judgement should be accomplished with fairness.
Bloomberg wants to say the LDS central hierarchy is secretive about finances? They comply with all laws on transparency of private institutions (and when they engage in public dealings, they comply with all laws regarding public disclosures as well).
They have also NOT had a SINGLE major financial scandal in their long history. However these guys are running their finances, they’re doing it well…
From a neutral source (or at least one where biases from all sides get to hash it out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finances_of_The_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter-day_Saints
nealb4zodd
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:58pm@4xGrace – - and anyone who has issues with Mormons being Christians. STOP IT. . JUST STOP IT! . .WOW. just stop it. – - -you’re embarrassing yourselves with how uninformed and educated you are. – -sorry . .but its true. – - Mormons ARE Christians. They are as a whole, good ,decent, law abiding, respectable, good Christian people who strive to be good people. . to others and love God. Im sorry if all these extras have you distarcted . .ie. the history of hte church, gold plates, polygamy, visions,- – - – i love how for the Bible you’re quick to embrace openly the power of God. . but suddenly God reveals more to his children , ,and you say . .ooohh.. .wow.. wait, . .no . .God’s not powerful enough to give us more writings. – -really? – nothing absolutely nothing about the Book of Mormon takes anything away from God or your love for God . .it enhances it. – its like listening to the radio in stereo. . .whereas before you’re got your mono headphone hooked up to Am radio. THAT”S IT!. . so this idiocracy you have for Mormons . .JUST STOP IT!. .. you’re wrong. flat out ..wrong. -stop it. leave it alone. – - -here’ try this . .find a Mormon . .im sure its not hard to find a Mormon. . do you like and admire that person? of course you do. – he ir she is a good person, arent they? they help otehrs, they’re kind. they’re friendly. – They’re good christian people. “By their fruits, ye shall know them.” – so get over it.
Report Post »JRook
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:58pmI remember in the early 1990′s being interrupted by Mormons who had come to save the neighborhood. In their brochure was a reference to their belief regarding 144,000 people enjoying the New Covenant during the rapture. There was little if no reference to the second group they now talk about and when I questions the enlightened at my door they could not answer why only 144,000 would be fully saved. For those who want to understand this and other wacky notions within the Church of LDA read the following. Always good to actually read before commenting in either direction.
http://4witness.org/jwquestions/qjw-144000.php
Report Post »mcsledge
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:59pmStraight is the gate and narrow is the way that leadeth to life [eternal] and few there be that find it.
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:03pmUh, Jrook, I think you got your religions mixed up. You‘re describing the Jehovah’s Witnesses. We Mormons preach that you must eat 50 gallons of Jello per year to be saved. Sheesh, bone up on your religions, man!
Report Post »JRook
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:09pm@AvengerK Have to tell you that even the conservative members of the finance committee got a good laugh out of your logic regarding the reduction from 39 to 5 in the number of Democrats that voted against the Affordable Care Act and those that voted for repeal. One of the members injected and I quote, “One usually has to rely on GB or Rush to come up with such logic” Well said. And of course as usual you ignored my point regarding how the blaze was touting the number of democrats that were going to vote for repeal. All in all another waste of time and money by the Congress.
Report Post »LonestarFree
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:10pmWhen you seek to tear down another persons religion by the insult and name calling of its members and demening what they believe you remove ANY credibility you might have had, but in your case you really didn’t start with any so I doubt it will be missed. Where did you learn to hate the members of a religion you know so little about? and why? I mean it as a legitimate question why would you say these things? Why do you care what they believe? How does any of this affect you in such a way that you feel the need to insult and disparage others?
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:14pm@Kankokage,
Report Post »Stop it with your false doctrine, man! It has to be GREEN jello…
At least that what my REAL mormon friends tell me…
;-)
abbygirl1994
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:16pmI am a Mormon.. I feel very sad for you that you have to villify our religion, our faith!! Its so obvious that some of you are not Christian at all.. if you wish to jump on me and call me a liar then look up this scripture Matthew 7:2.. and then tell me again of your Christianity. I have a question for you though.. I am almost certain that you in fact were a Mormon and probably were excommunicated for some indescretion, your anger shows it.. you speak of things that Mormon’s would know. And as far as blacks.. they are members now and we have hundreds of thousands of them as members. Their faith a testament of their love of the gospel! It sad that you are a unbelieving brother or sister.. I have heard that when Jesus comes and he will come and sooner than you think.. you and those of you who have turned their backs and spouted off your hatred and unbelief of Jesus wll be shocked to see Him and when that happens there will be no turning back. It will be to late! I feel sorry for you that your life is all about hatred and not love.. Jesus said, “As I have loved you, love one another”! Its hard to say to a bully.. to someone who writes things so venomous and filled with hate. But I love you brother. I pray you will stop and look at the good things the LDS church has done.. the far outweigh any of the negative you spout off! I hope God will forgive you! I am a Mormon and I am proud of it!
Report Post »jungle J
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:18pmnot a mormon but the progressive inyou hates and exposes you as a fraud.
Report Post »loneindividual
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:19pmyou are an idiot who is spreading lies
Report Post »ashestoashes
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:26pmWOW….Agreed..we are not to bash others..but some will not join faiths made by man..even if the Bible is mixed into it.. Our faith should rest on the one true God alone and not on any man..I would never go to the Catholic Church for instruction..just as I would never go to a Mormon. even though I respect them. .Everyone has the right to believe what they believe..But I would choose to receive my instruction from the Bible by revelation of the Holy Spirit..He said.”.let no man teach you..but I will teach you.” Jesus said to pray to the Father in Jesus’s name..not to anyone else..and the rock upon which the church was founded was Jesus Christ Himself..not Peter..Jesus didn’t come to build his church upon Peter..lol.. I heard a priest say that idolatry is just the love of self while conveniently ignoring the first 2 commandments..like do not have any other gods before me..2 do not make for yourselves any graven images..and yet..churches are filled with them and are bowed to…Listen for the Holy Spirit..do not be fooled by man..
Report Post »jeff1158
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:28pmMormons are some of the most moral, ethical, upright people you will ever meet. They take care of their families. They are way more charitable than the majority of the population in the US (especially people like Joe Biden and Obama). I will vote for Mitt Romney. I believe he will do what is best for the United States.
Report Post »However, of all the people I have seen respond to 4XGRACE, I have yet to see anyone with legitimate research of the Morman Church. The best book I have ever read on the history and teachings of the Mormans is The Kingdom of the Cults by Walter R. Martin. I challenge any Morman to read the chapter on Mormonism. Especially Glenn Beck. Research the history, the court cases, the doctrine in an open manner. Does the Truth really live here? Will you follow the truth even if it leads to something you don’t want to find?
I am a Christian and I care deeply about the salvation of all people. I care enough to confront them in a kind and loving way. I do not wish any to perish. Forgive me if I have offended anyone.
AUsername
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:29pmThe_Jerk is acting like many mormons and just imagine what Mitt Romney would do as president knowing how they act. he also represents the views in the book of how they view jews.
Report Post »mmckell
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:29pmwhat did the mormons ever do to you?? Probably nothing, so just keep your mouth shut
Report Post »Blazebanned
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:43pmOnce again encinom (4xgrace) shows not only his stupidity, but his fear,poor little coward, you will get yours someday.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:48pmSure MUTINY..who’s “we” in this case? “We” is a leftist publication out to do a hit job on Romney. Where was Bloomberg in the 2008 campaign about Black Liberation Theology and Obama‘s twenty years asleep in the pews at Jerry Wright’s “I hate white y” church? I’ll tell where Bloomberg was…getting thrills up it’s leg from Obama like Chrissie Tingles Matthews and stone silent.
Report Post »The left relies on conservatives being conservatives. The left wants us to say “oh yeah..thorough vetting of the candidate”..but they won’t vet their own. I would welcome a piece on the Mormon church in a conservative publication and if it softballed Mormonism I’d condemn them for it.
But seriously..when’s the last time a Mormon said ” G#d D#mn America” and blamed the US. for 9/11 with its’ “chickens coming home to roost” like Obama’s “sounding board for his conscience” Jerry Wright said?
AvengerK
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:51pmReally JROOK?
Report Post »Not nearly as hearty a laugh as they got when 63 Democrat House members were ousted in 2010 giving the GOP the biggest house victory in 70 years.
Get better material idiot.
stopspendingourmoney
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:08pm4XGrace, I see nothing evil here you may want to check out there site, looks to be like a true Christan faith, most likely better than some others I have seen out there, and very orginized. check it out for yourself… http://www.lds.org/?lang=eng
Report Post »single stack
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:29pmLone,
You’re as ignorant as 4xgrace.
I’m not a Mormon but I have studied it.
Blacks were not allowed in the LDS church until 1975. This was because they were considered to be descendents of the Lamanites, who were “cursed with skin of blackness” because of their “wickedness and corruption”, but were later redeemed.
I’m also a Freemason. I’m a Past Master of my lodge and a Scottish Rite Mason (what profanes refer to as a 32nd degree Mason).
Freemasonry is not a religion. It makes no claim of ultimate knowledge and it does not offer a path to salvation.
Before becoming a Mason a man must express a belief in Deity. Masonry leaves it to the individual to define his deity and how he practices his worship of that deity. Masonry by design is consciously and emphatically non sectarian. Freedom of religion is one of the fraternity’s central tenets and it was Masons who placed freedom of religion in our Bill of Rights.
It is a fraternal organization that encourages “the brotherhood of man under the fatherhood of God”.
It is the purpose of Masonry to inculcate the practice of morality and virtue, and the duty of every Mason to assist his brethren in maintaining high standards of personal conduct.
There is no conflict between Freemasonry and Mormonism; the claim that Masons ever attempted to annihilate the Mormons is false.
Report Post »Momonism is no obstacle to membership in the fraternity, and in fact Joseph Smith was himself a Mason. The Mormon temple ritual is based on
MathiasLucas
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:30pmWhy the need to hate any religion? As an LDS member myself I often ask what is it about the Mormon religion that causes one to literally hate and sometimes loath us just because we believe differently? Mormons do nothing to hurt Christianity, we ourselves are followers of Christ– hum which I believe is the definition of Christianity. We are productive members of our society (14 million members with more outside of the US than in the US), we are extremely patriotic and are more inclined to give the shirts off our backs to those in need. For a religion that does so much good what is it that we do that causes one to outwardly vilify and hate us so much just because we believe differently? In the end, aren’t we all children of God regardless of what religion you believe in? Peace, see you in the afterlife…
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:33pm@4XGrace
Report Post »There’s a awful lot of venom behind your post! While not everyone agrees with the Mormon religion, not everyone is so hateful, either. In my experience, someone with this much rage is usually an ex-Mo, who has left the church because they cannot abide by its teachings, and makes it their lifelong mission to disprove it. Whatever your case, hopefully you can find it in your “4 x grace” ful heart to forgive those evil Mormons, and direct your rage somewhere else.
Amica
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:34pmWow! Congratulations, 4x, that’s a new one!!
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:37pm@aveng
The media will not do its job and has proven it over and over again. On the other hand the GOP knows their candidate will be cut to pieces by the left. Crying over what is fair and isnt will not win the election. So I say again, if its ok for Fox and talk radio to attack Obama’s faith. Why is not ok for people to question Romney’s faith?
Report Post »single stack
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:40pmPart of my previous post got cut off.
There is no conflict between Freemasonry and Mormonism; the claim that Masons ever attempted to annihilate the Mormons is false.
Report Post »Momonism is no obstacle to membership in the fraternity, and in fact Joseph Smith was himself a Mason. The Mormon temple ritual is based on Masonic degree ritual.
the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:42pm@JROOK
Report Post »“Always good to actually read before commenting in either direction.” Taking your own advice, it might actually be good to know which religion you are talking about before slandering it. You must have meant the Jehovah’s Witnesses, silly! It’s OK, we forgive you.
Marine 1
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:52pmFor Kankokage…The Jell-O bit is great! Right on! You forgot, however, that you have to have your horns cut and polished a couple times of year as well or you end up having interviews with your Bishop and Stake President.
As for those of you that are not LDS then I guess you got a 10% raise and Sundays off. Cool!
I’m a convert to the LDS Church from the Church of Christ. Being LDS is wonderful. I’m far from perfect and I do have my moments when it comes to issues regarding this country and freedom. Know this, however, this Gospel has brought me more joy than I ever got from years in the Church of Christ. The LDS faith is true as far as I’m concerned. It really works for me and my family.
By the way, our “secret ceremonies” are not secret but SACRED. We are only following what Jesus Christ has commanded us to do. So leave us alone if you disagree with our pracitces. We have done nothing to you. We are simply living our religion everyday.
Having a living Prophet is pretty cool too.
I am not ashamed to be a Chrisitian and a member of the LDS faith. I will never be ashamed to stand up for Christ. How can I ever be ashamed of the ONE who atoned for our sins? When I report to HIM at least I will be able to say that I never backed down from testifying of HIM.
GOD lives and JESUS is the CHRIST!
Semper Fidelis
Report Post »walkandtalk
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:53pm@ Auserman Please explain what you meant about how they view jews
Report Post »dastardlyfilms
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:54pmhe’s trolling guys. If he isn‘t then that’s too bad. Love and Tolerate, yo!
Report Post »mils
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:55pmyeah same ole crap from you. troll 4x
Report Post ».i certainly hope you are not a christian…because that would be a disgrace that could never be washed away.
Chuck Stein
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:56pm@ Bellamia7
Report Post »You are totally correct — 4xgrace’s post is practically (and certainly unintentionally) an invitation for fair-minded people to look into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
And, as John Milton said back in the 1600′s: “Let Truth and Error grapple in the field of ideas! Who ever knew Truth to be defeated in a fair and open encounter?”
Perspective
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:58pmI can tell from your context that you use the term “mason-ism” as derogatory.Why? What do you know of Masons? I daresay we take better care of our fellow man than you know or care. You just need another boogy man to blame all your problems on.Sad.
Report Post »Kerri g
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:58pmYour rant tells me you know absolutly nothing about Mormonism. I would educate you but as Jesus said, don’t put peals befor swine. Pearls meaning truth and knowledge, Swine meaning those who have a closed heart and will not listen. I don’t expect you to join the church, just educate yourself on the things you publicaly critisize.
Report Post »Joey Ray
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:59pmComparing someones religious doctrine or religion is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do but it does not get you anywhere. The details of one religion are as hard to believe as the other. Even atheists can’t prove or give evidence to the existence or lack of a god. I try to stay out of such discussions and maybe you should too. You just come out looking angry and unhappy.
Report Post »Dr Vel
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:02pm4XGrace: Claiming to have what the grace of 4 persons? I don’t see any at all. I do not believe the Mormon tenets in their added words but they do something all true Christians must do. They uphold moral values in the land. So all Christians whether agreeing with them or not should leave them be because they uphold moral values. Christ said if they are not against Me they are for Me. I guess you never read that. If in the end Christ has something to say in differing with them this is His business not yours. Second how much money I have is none of your business, you have no right to know nor even ask. Likewise what they own fairly and honestly is none of anyone’s business either. It is called freedom, the right to privacy in your own affairs. I guess you never read that either.
Report Post »kapu
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:43pmcareful there, my friend. i STRONGLY urge you to be very, very careful in what you said here. true, i do not know you from Adam’s housecat, BUT one should really not speak of things–anything, that they may not know anything about, or have any fact. there is a bunch of things you have compleatly wrong, and simply relying on others that ‘know’, or simply looking/reading anti-Mormon literature, or whatever the so-called ‘experts’ in media say/write/intimate are NOT well informed/have facts/truth, or unbiased in every way, shape or form.
Report Post »4XGrace
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:44pmWell gee whiz, who would have thunk it … so many religionists out there. Glad you all have an opinion. Though when truth is precious every one seems to be eager and anxious to bury it. Especially when the truth says that it is NOT by works that you are saved but by faith (and that faith is given to you by God). So what, in the end, becomes the easiest work through which religionists try to save themselves? Why, money of course. The richer the religious head quarters the more desperate and unsure their flock. Why is momonism so rich? Because they have no sure foundation of salvation as they have added to God‘s word and taken away the really nasty bits that they don’t like. The morons are just like the catholics that have their traditions and stuff that they hold higher than the Bible. Sure you get some really sincere people inside of those death and hell dealing institutions that really believe by faith. But by and large people are lazy so they hire experts to tell them what is so easy to grasp if they would but apply themselves to the task (though not salvation here). People cling to the catholic church because their doctrines have been examined closely and debated for hundreds of years; so they feel comfortable in their laziness. But all that study doesn’t make their propositions right. Read Romans from the Authorized Version. I read it and am convicted. Are you? Or can you even read the Bible? Are you allowed to? truly and without damnation?
Report Post »Nasado
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:46pm@single stack
Report Post »Actually, you are the one who is incorrect. Throughout the entire history of the LDS chruch, blacks were able to join. Waht you are thinking of is that they were unable to hold the priesthood. Trust me, I have read and studied far more into it than you ever will. Also, you are correct that there was no Mason movement to destory the LDS faith. Now, there were individuals who were Masons who attacked and killed Mormons but those were individuals actions, not that of the Mason movement.
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:55pmNicely done 4X
Report Post »Pushed a lotta groovy buttons there.
Personally, I always go with the two-m spelling, you know … Moronism.
Though I would point out that black men were always accepted as members, they just weren’t accepted as equals with the white and delightsome Morons who could receive the priesthood. So the LDS church was only a little racist I guess.
Oh, and it was a touch touch mentioning the Masonic rituals that the church stole too. Love those secret ceremonies!
As I’ve said before, Moronism and Scientology are the two made-in-America cults that give us sooooo many reasons to simply point and laugh.
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:58pmAVENGER
Report Post »Why in the world should “Jerry Wright” be off limits?
eltreo
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:59pm@4XGrace
I always find people who believe in a God defined by a political committee put together by the Roman tyrant Constantine (who was using that issue to try and unify his kingdom by attempting to define God) nauseating.
The “Christian” clergy of the time all had different descriptions of God. It created dissension in his kingdom so he was just responding to that problem by trying to unify it politically. Constantine at Nice gathered the differing views and came up with such a convoluted concoction describing God just to appease monotheistic Christians and polytheistic Greeks and Romans. They settled on “Three in one, but one.” If you were polytheistic it satisfied you. If you were monotheistic it satisfied you. Everybody’s happy. Problem solved, POLITICALLY!
But 4XGrace wants to criticize other religions when Christ in Gethsemane specifically said there were two “wills”, his own and God’s. What was He doing lying to us or trying to just confuse us? “4X’s” kind of logic will get you into the loony bin.
Report Post »Gkwahlberg
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:00pmJROOK, In your reference to “I remember in the early 1990′s being interrupted by Mormons who had come to save the neighborhood. In their brochure was a reference to their belief regarding 144,000 people enjoying the New Covenant during the rapture.” I think you have the LDS Church mixed up with the Jehovah’s witnesses. LDS Church doctrine does not teach about 144,000 people enjoying the New Covenant during the rapture. The LDS Church does not believe in or teach about the rapture.
Report Post »MyAgendaIsTruth
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:10pmYou should like Charlie Brown’s teachers….
Report Post »MyAgendaIsTruth
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:11pmI dare you to spew that atheist gay hate mongering vile about Islam. Bet you won’t.
Report Post »amtsoundsmith
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:17pmDon’t you have some poison snakes to go handle?
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:27pmNEALB4ZODD
Actually, every Mormon I’ve known (approximately 10) has been freaky. Superficially they’re fine, but once I really got to know them … WEIRD!
Most are ego-maniacs, perhaps stemming from the God-hood mentality(?). Most were extremely selfish, ruthless, cold and aloof. They seem to lack empathy.
I hadn’t given my personal experience with Morons much thought, but since you brought it up I can see a real consistency: they’ve all been peculiar and untrustworthy. Thanks for helping me recognize that.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:28pm@Randy
Report Post »Heck, if it’s written in an article meant to disprove the Mormon church, then it must be true, right???. You’re probably right though, I have heard that the way to get really rich is to serve full-time in the Mormon church. Thanks for the insight!! Your approach to learning about the Mormon church could also be used in politics…if I want to know about Romney, I’ll just ask Obama!! Just a tip, not everything you get from Googling a topic, means it’s true.
Gates
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:34pm“Mormons ARE Christians”
That is the most absurd statement I have ever heard! They aren’t even close to being Christians. The fact they say they are is laughable. I have no problem with them believing anything they want BUT please don’t insult the Christian faith by trying to say you are one. Man is NOT god nor will he ever be. Jesus was God incarnate not some spirit child who had a brother named Lucifer. Mormon beliefs simply show how easily some of the lost can be deceived.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:34pmRight on ABBY! You go GIRL!
Report Post »You’re a Moron and proud of it.
Just remember to keep sweet and do as your master-husband tells you. You’ll serve him with all his other celestial wives when he gets his own planet one day.
Hallelujah and pass me a decaffeinated beverage!
w.brent
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:35pmI‘ve often thought about why blacks couldn’t hold the priesthood for a time. I don’t know the answer. I also don’t know why God restricted the priesthood and the right to officiate in sacrifices and temple ordinances to the Levites when all the Israelites were heirs of the Abrahamic covenant.
Consider Isiah 55:8-9
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways bhigher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Also Matthew 20:1-16 and Romans 8:16-18…Anyone who has faith in the Lord and follows Him and manifests that faith by laboring in his vineyard will become an heir and receive all that He has. “So the last shall be first, and the first last” may have a greater meaning than we currently understand.
http://www.lds.org/study/prophets-speak-today/unto-all-the-world/emerging-with-faith-in-africa?lang=eng
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:45pmMMCKELL
As NEAL helped me figure out, every Mormon I’ve ever known has been seriously freaky. Superficially they’re fine, but most are absolute ego-maniacs. Maybe cuz they reckon their gonna be Gods one day. Most were without the ability to empathize, they were extremely selfish, ruthless, cold and aloof.
In two different instances — separated by 12 years — I got involved with Morons who literally ripped people off … me and members of my family. They ripped off folks in their own wards too.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:46pm@Nucklehead
Report Post »What an ignorant jack@$$ you are. As a lifelong member of this “evil cult,” I must tell you that women are held in such high regard in our church, that sometimes I, as a male, feel unequal to them. Nothing is going to change your mind, though, you know exactly what you’re talking about. Continue on spewing your hate-filled rage and hopefully it makes you feel all better inside.
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:50pmMATHIAS
Report Post »I don’t actually see hatred towards Morons in these comments. I do see ridicule and intellectual scorn, but that’s pretty reasonable given the crazy shite that Morons say they believe.
Wildape
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:59pm@Ozchaimbers Bravo! Woot! Three circles and a snap!
Report Post »timbitts
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:11pmi see you defending jews in some of your other comments……..so maybe you can explain why a magazine owned by a race of financial parasites would throw stones in their own glass house
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:35pmMARINE
Report Post »I’m sure being a Mormon is wonderful. After all, if you can make yourself believe the utter nonsense of Joseph Smith and the Book of Moron, heck you can make believe just about any dam thing.
(My 4-year old thinks Santa is wonderful too.)
brother_ed
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:42pmThanks to all of those who came to our defense!
It is very kind.
We need not agree on doctrine; we need only to recognize each other’s right to worship as they please.
I am deeply humbled.
Thanks, again!
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:42pmWBRENT
Report Post »I guess that’s a pretty comforting little bit of nonsense to hide behind. You know, the LORD werks in mysterious ways, my thoughts are not HIS thoughts, and all that good krapp. Any excuse to stop the ol‘ brain from thinkin about stuff that just don’t make sense to non-delusional folks older than 12.
Ralphbp
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:50pmI really love the fundamentalists/evangelicals, they are all about loving their fellow men. If you spent as much time worrying about helping your fellow men as you did in finding fault in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, there would be no poverty and no homelessness.
Report Post »I guess that it is hard to be so perfect. God bless everyone!
pi2r2
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:55pm4Xgrace! Hah! 40Xstupid is more like it. Congratulations! You are the biggest stupidest most bigoted ignorant ******* on the blog! Live that down **** for brains!
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 8:08pmYo ZAZZY (accidentally posted elsewhere)
Report Post »So, women are held in such high regard in your church that you “sometimes feel unequal” to them. That’s great. Cuz most of them feel “unequal” ALL THE TIME.
Seriously, tell me where I’m wrong brother. Are the ladies not to “abide by the righteous counsel of her husband”? Was McConkie lying about that, or just plain wrong?
Heck, once a 12-year old boy gets his first taste of the priesthood he becomes a right-proper spiritual advisor to his own Momma. Grandma too!
I won’t bother detailing too much here, cuz the Mormons all know about it anyway. Plus, the list of Mormon nonsense just goes on and on and on and on and …
AdrianRuehl
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 8:09pm@ Kankokage: You said “Jrook, I think you got your religions mixed up. You‘re describing the Jehovah’s Witnesses….”
Jehovah‘s Witnesses don’t believe that only 144,000 will be saved. They believe that billions will live on restored earth-what God originally inteded it to be. They also don’t believe in the rapture. Just puttin it out there. ;)
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 8:15pmOne more thing ZAZZY
Report Post »I am NOT spewing “hate” or “rage” here. No sirreee. This is pure scorn and ridicule. (Jeez, how many times have I got to say that?)
kevinbogard
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 9:59pm4XGrace………..
You‘re so full of sht it’s incredible
Report Post »SHailey
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:10pmIf one objectively studies the Early Church Fathers, the Christian Church’s leading commentators from the early 2nd century (as early as Ignatius in the year 107) to 6th century, you will see Catholicism. All the Catholic doctrine you see now can found explicitly in their writings and in seed form, or explicitly, in the Scriptures, which were canonized, by the way, by the Catholic Church in the years 383, 387, and 303…at the Councils of Carthage and Hippo. All modern-day Protestants, and quasi-Christian groups such as the Mormons and JWs, owe their very heritage and the New Testament to God (through the Catholic Church). Run from the biases you’ve been taught and study church history yourself. As the famous convert, John Henry Newman once said, “He who studies history, ceases to be Protestant.” By the way, I share this all in love–because I actually love the fervor of Evangelical Christians and their devotion to the Lord and Scriptures. To learn more, visit http://www.Catholic.com
Report Post »Brigham1
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:47pmIf anyone has offended you and caused you to have such a deep dislike of the church, I would like to apologize. We are taught to not offend anyone but to be a respector of persons and other religons. I am not worthy to judge you, and I would hope you feel the same. President Uchdorf, a member of the First Presidency, in a talk he gave at the last General Conference said to those who would be judgemental of others two very important words — Stop it. Such wise words and so simple. I hope your heart will be softened toward the church and its members. Those of us who are members love the church, and we love God and Jesus.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:57pmSHAILEY
As Bishop Broadmoor said, “He who studies the Holy Bible, ceases to believe it”.
By the way, I share this all in love – because I actually love the delusional religionists despite their silly superstitions. To learn more, visit
Report Post »http://www.thethinkingatheist.com
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 11:02pmYeah BRIGHAM, see an apology is fine and all … but nothin says your “sorry” quite like getting my money back. $72,400.00 to be exact.
Report Post »Let me know when your church — which I’m sure is very sorry — wants to apologize in the only way that really matters.
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:09am@Canuck
Report Post »I condemn anyone who cheats, lies, and steals, and especially LDS members who, if guilty of what you accuse, have committed such crimes against you IN SPITE of what the Church teaches and what they claim to believe themselves, NOT BECAUSE of their beliefs.
But despite YOUR claims to “scorn, not hate”, your words demonstrate a personal vendetta borne of a contempt rooted in something very similar to hatred, even if that strong word should be avoided.
@More serious critics,
LDS response enlightening: http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/church-financial-independence
The upshot is that tithing is NOT used for the for-profit entities involved in the church, which are only maintained as for-profit anyways because they need to stay in service in case of a disaster. If it’s all about the money, why not automate the Welfare Factory, for example? It’s SPECIFICALLY kept labor-intensive so PEOPLE could benefit from it in case of need/emergency. Same with the welfare farms.
As to amounts of giving, since giving is administered LOCALLY, and funds disbursed at the local level don’t get reported in the same way to HQ, the numbers some articles have run with are TOTALLY skewed.
For anyone wanting to get a straight look at it, the doctrine is simple: be charitable, privately and generously. That’s the conservative model too, btw.
AdrianRuehl
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:45am@ SHailey
PART 1
You said “If one objectively studies the Early Church Fathers, the Christian Church’s leading commentators from the early 2nd century (as early as Ignatius in the year 107) to 6th century, you will see Catholicism.”
With all due respect, if you look earlier, you will see true Christianity founded by Christ and held in check and correct teaching by the Apostles. Paul said: “I know that after my going away oppressive wolves will enter in among you and will not treat the flock with tenderness, and from among you yourselves men will rise and speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.” -Acts 20:29
“Let no one seduce you in any manner, because it [the End] will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction…And so now you know the thing that acts as a restraint, with a view to his being revealed in his own due time. True, the mystery of this lawlessness >>is already at work;<< but only till he who is right now acting as a restraint gets to be out of the way." -2 Thess.2:6-12
The Apostles and "older men" were what acted as a restraint to the apostate ideas of pagan religion and philosophy that were attempting to corrupt the true faith. When the apostles all died off, paganism began to flourish as early as the 2nd century in the ideas of the so called "church fathers". Indeed, it was already happening when John, the last of the apostles was alive at the end
Report Post »bees
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:45amWow. There is NO excuse for being ignorant in this day and age. LDS.org or Mormon.org, should set you straight.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:56amSure BEES. And if you wanna find out the real, honest truth about Islam … be sure to only consult the Islamic Society of North America website (http://www.isna.net). ANY other sources will only be poisoning your mid with lies, filthy lies, and damnable lies. Allah be praised!
Isn’t that right BEES?
Report Post »Sonia Francisco
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:06am@4XGRACE Hmmm…harsh criticism, even ridicule and not even one claim about Mormon beliefs correct. Sigh. I get so weary of lazy bigots who rehash sensational anti-Mormon nonsense over and over again. If you are going to condemn me to Hell, at least have the courtesy to do some honest research on my faith first!
Report Post »AdrianRuehl
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:11amPART 3
Because during the long ages of the Churches countless heresies, persecutions, wars, Inquisitions and Crusades, some did try to find the true faith and make it known. They were almost always persecuted by the Church. However, if the weeds had beeen uprooted at that time, then those truth seekers might have been uprooted with them because they still held on to a plethora of false Catholic dogma and therefore could have been judged adversly. So Jesus said to wait until the “…conclusion of a system of things.” -Matt. 13:36-42
This seeming identity of some that were both weeds and wheat also applied to the early Church Fathers. (This is why I brought out that whole parabale and explanation) You said that there teachings were Catholic. Yes-in many ways they were-and in many ways they were still teaching pure unadulterated Christian truth from the 1st century, so Catholics like to point to them and say ‘See-look! Catholic teaching’. But this is only because the early Church Fathers were the vanguard of the apostasy that was to come. The Church Fathers may have taught -some- of what was to BECOME Catholoscism, but they were not teaching on a pure foundation. They were aiming to please men and to tickle ears to make Christianity more palatable to the pagan world.
Report Post »ZBP
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:20amAshestoashes
“not join faiths made by man.”
All LDS doctrine was received by revelation. Thus not by man.
“Our faith should rest on the one true God alone and not on any man.”
I rest my faith alone on JC. Joseph Smith was a prophet. By your interpretation all revelation received since death of JC is also false.
“let no man teach you..but I will teach you”
Refer to above. We also are taught only by the spirit of god.
do not have any other gods before me..2 do not make for yourselves any graven images..and yet..churches are filled with them and are bowed to
We have no other gods or graven images.
4x faith without works is dead.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:31amCanukhead;
Good grief, leave your personal business outside these posts. Whom here can confirm you’ve been ripped off? Whom here can cofirm you even had business dealings with mormons in the first place? I’m sure if I examined my life thoroughly I could tract down an instance where I got ripped off and that the person who ripped me off was an atheist. Should I then start blogging that atheists are out to rip people off? What level of honesty would you place that?
You pride yourself with scorn and interpret that as some sort of intellect. I guess you even think that your witty cleverness has some sort of power to pursuade. The only pursuasion you’ll achieve is emotional. There’s nothing intellectually worthy in your comments. You may rile a person or two up and say “yeah, Mormons are creepy and they seek to rip me off” but what verifiable facts will they base it upon if they follow your lead? None for you have offered none regarding the character of Mormons. Your stories are meaningless and vain. They hold up nothing and promote foundless doubt and concern for anyone who will actually take them at face value.
Now the following is verifiable:
“…So I sold 40% of my business to a man by the name of Emerson camp and he was chairman and CEO of Great Lakes Chemical, one of the great chemical companies in America, 1986. Emerson said I’ll pay you $54 million. I’ve had this business appraised and the 40% I’m buying, I’ll pay you $54 million.” (con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:33am(con’t);
“I said, Emerson, that’s fine. I was excited to move on, I needed the money, I needed it for payroll and for expansion and for the other purposes of a growing business, and he took quite a bit of time to get around to having his attorneys look into the deal and to give me the papers, the contract and all the other negotiating instruments that we had to have in a deal that size.
Finally by the time he did it, six months had elapsed and in the meantime our markets had turned around. The chemical markets are similar to most other commodity products, whether it be metals of different kinds or gold or silver or oil, and we know what the oil markets have done. Well, the same thing happened back in ’86 in the chemical market. The prices of chemicals had gone up dramatically. Margins had improved, profits had improved. And after six months when he came back with a contract, that price was worth not $54 million but for 40% of the business it was then appraised at $225 million, a rather handsome difference. And so he came back with his lawyers and said, Jon, I know I’ve delayed, I know I’ve waited, I know I haven’t moved fast, but the business is now worth approximately $200 million. And I said, no, Emerson, it’s worth about $225 million if we take our latest appraisal. ”
(con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:36am(con’t)
“…I shook your hand at $54 million six months ago and that’s exactly what you’re going to pay for this business. And he was arguing that he should pay more and I was arguing that a handshake’s a contract. I don’t care about the lawyers. When you shake a man’s hand, it’s a contract. It’s your bond. It tells a little bit about your integrity. And even though I may have lost money on that deal, Glenn, I didn’t lose money in life. It was an important aspect for my children, my grandchildren and our corporation to see that when you make a deal, a deal is consummated with the shaking of another man’s hand. And forgive me again for sounding self-serving, Glenn, but thank you for asking. ”
John Huntsman Sr., a Mormon, took a loss of a bout $160 million in order to honor a hanshake deal. If anything reflects Mormon standards in business dealing, it’s that.
http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/196/5322/
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:43am4XGrace;
Since I’m a moron and think moronically believing that Jesus is the Son of God as well as “the God of Israel, and the God of the whole earth, and [has] been slain for the sins of the world.” (3 Nephi 11:14), could you help me with the biblical passage you base calling Mormons “morons” and how doing such edifies you in Christ.? Since I’m utterly incapable of thinking for myself and dare not search Christian scriptures like in the Bible lest I end up wallowing in my own stupidity, I would appreciate your help in this matter. Maybe I’ll becaome a Christian like you someday. Your help will open up that door for me.
Thanks in advance.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 2:28amHowdy DARREN
You conveniently neglected the fact that I did not raise the issue of business or personal dealings with Mormons. It was NEAL who asked us to think of our experiences with them, and it was MMCKELL who asked rhetorically, “What did Mormons ever do to you?” I merely followed their lead, complied with their requests, answered their questions.
I would also like to thank you for noting my “witty cleverness”. I really do appreciate the compliment. Very generous of you.
Not sure what the point of the Huntsman story is, except he got exactly what he bargained for. I mean,
Report Post »had the value of the business gone down in the interim he would have expected to complete on the original understanding too. Surely you don‘t think it’s especially praiseworthy that Huntsman merely did the right thing? (I’ll do as Huntsman asked and forgive him for sounding so obviously “self-serving”.)
Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 3:06amcanuckhead;
@7/12/12 – 6:27 pm- “I hadn’t given my personal experience with Morons much thought, but since you brought it up I can see a real consistency: they’ve all been peculiar and untrustworthy. Thanks for helping me recognize that.”
@6:45pm – “In two different instances — separated by 12 years — I got involved with Morons who literally ripped people off … me and members of my family. They ripped off folks in their own wards too.”
@11:02 pm – “Yeah BRIGHAM, see an apology is fine and all … but nothin says your “sorry” quite like getting my money back. $72,400.00 to be exact.
Let me know when your church — which I’m sure is very sorry — wants to apologize in the only way that really matters.”
That’s great that you were answering Neal but this changes nothing I stated. These are not verifiable facts. I’ll reapply this to your most recent response. If I were to be asked “what hasan atheist ever done to you” and I respond that they are freaky and that they ripped me off over $72,000 and that they should apologize by repaying wha they stole…” is not intellectual, moral to apply to all atheists, nor verifiable. In fact I think you simply didn’t know what you were doing when you did business with mormons. That you got exactly what you agreed to do business with the Mormons (con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 3:16am(con’t);
Your “witty cleverness” was in conjunction with noting that you pride yourself in intellect by scorning the LDS. Like this “intellectual scorn” you purport to bless The blaze’s readers with, you having “witty cleverness” is entirely in your own perception. I can scorn just like you but when I passed middle school (and did so at the proper traditional and expected age), I didn’t do it so much anymore. I blog regularly with very intellectual peope who offer vast insights into many issues. These people would leave you drooling in your “intellect” were you to match yourself up with them.
As for Huntsman, the purpose of bringing him up was obvious though admittedly not explicitly stated: He’s Mormon and he was honest. You obviously did not read anything beyond my quoted remarks. Glenn Beck clearly prasied Huntsman for his honesty and integrity. If you think he was ‘self serving’ for doing business by honering his word based upon a handshake, than so be it. Looking at the billions he eventually amassed, I’ll take that as a further sign of your own lack of knowing how to conduct a business and thus it was you who got exactly what you signed up for with the certain Mormons you did business with.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:02amDARREN
Report Post »“If I were to be asked “what hasan atheist ever done to you” and I respond that they are freaky and that they ripped me off over $72,000 and that they should apologize by repaying wha they stole…”
+ That would be a perfectly reasonable response DARREN. In your scenario, you were asked about your personal, subjective experiences with Atheists. Of course I would have no way of verifying your assertion about the Atheist’s fraudulent business practices or the $72,000 loss you suffered, but I that going in. When I invite you to draw on YOUR personal experience I know (or should know) that WHATEVER you tell me, good or bad about Atheists, I’m not going to be able to verify or refute it. If verifiable data is needed then a very different type of question is required.
The bottom line … it’s foolish of you to blame me for the type of questions I was asked. You can see that, right?
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:12amDARREN
Ah, so you were only being sarcastic about my “witty cleverness”. That hurts me. Deeply.
“If you think he was ‘self serving’ for doing business by honering his word based upon a handshake, than so be it.”
+ You miss the point again DARREN. Hunstman himself apologized for sounding “self-serving” in telling that story. I merely agreed with him.
“Looking at the billions he eventually amassed, I’ll take that as a further sign of your own lack of knowing how to conduct a business and thus it was you who got exactly what you signed up for with the certain Mormons you did business with.”
Report Post »+ Yes, I‘m sure you’re right DARREN. I got exactly what I signed up for in doing business with Mormons. (I’ll know better next time.)
Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 10:17amCanuck;
Yes, when you share a personal experience to the public it is not likely to be verifiable without providing details of that experience. If you care to do so, feel free. But, as soon as you take your experience and apply the negative impact upon everyone of that. Group, despite the fact that your experience is limited to bt a specific few, that’s when it is perfectly fine to be called out for your post. There is no way your personal experience with about ten Mormons implicates The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to owe you anything. Even if you never mentioned the LDS Church as a whole, you clearly apply your negative experience of ten upon a group of millions. And the fact that Mormons are far smarter business folks than you does not mean you got ripped off. Have you sued to recover your losses? If so, what court? Where’s the record? I truly believe you’re making up this whole getting ripped off by Mormons.
Yes, Huntsman said he. Was being ‘self-serving’. He was being modest which is akin to being humble. Like honoring one’s word, being humble also reflects LDS standards.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:05am@Nucklehead
Report Post »First off, I apologize for calling you a name. When someone insults something I hold dear, I can get defensive. So, because you got burned by a supposed Mormon, it has become your life’s mission to scorn and ridicule an entire religion? Guess what, many of us have been burned by Mormons, Catholics, Jews, Protestants, Aethists, Muslims, Buddhists, Satanists, Gothics, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Baptists (tell me when to stop), Hindus, Confucianists, Secularists, Mennonites, Presbyterians, Amish, Tree-hugging hippies, non-denominational Christians, Lutherans, and even non-committal people like you. That tells me that there are lots of people within each of the “religions” that does not live the principles that their churches preach. I am sorry that you lost that money at the hands of a Mormon. I can understand you being more than upset. Please know that we are not taught from the pulpit to take advantage of our brothers and sisters…in fact quite the opposite. Whoever did that to you is a fool and sinner and will receive his “reward” when he stands before God. That will not put money back in your pocket, but it is NOT the Mormon church that has wronged you. And it is NOT the Mormon people, as a whole, that have wronged you. It is one idiot that is not living his religion at all! I assume you have never done a dishonest thing in your life? You have never lied, cheated, or stolen anything?
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:10am@Darren,
Report Post »Even imagining Canuck is being 100% fair and honest about a small group of Mormons screwing him over in a business deal and being generally unsavory characters with no redeeming qualities (which is a huge stretch given the tenor of his spiteful language–it’s more likely projection than anything else) Canuck still can‘t deal with the straight fact that they were doing so in direct violation of their own principles and the Church’s teachings. He won‘t engage that because to do so would be admitting there’s something good and right in the teachings and fundamentals of the LDS Church–something in their beliefs that causes them to behave well on the whole: to prosper while living within their means, to uphold liberties and values that encourage other liberties, high standards, and general good citizenship. The effects of such beliefs are obvious and put the lie to his meager and hateful (you may protest the word, Canuck, but it’s hard to spite, scorn and issue contempt without hate) protestations.
p.s. you mentioned a blog, would you care to share where I can find it?
the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:13am@Nucklehead
Report Post »As far as your proclamation about the Priesthood and women feeling inferior…I apologize, I had no idea you were a Mormon woman and were authorized to speak for “most Mormon women.” Perhaps being confused for an angry non-Mormon man is why you are bitter? You speaking for most Mormon women, is a little like Obama telling me that he understands the middle class and what we want/need. He has no idea and neither do you. In our scriptures (D&C), it clearly explains that if a man is using his priesthood with anything other than love & patience, “amen to the authority of that man?” Hmmm…a little different than what you are claiming, no? As I’ve said before, perhaps if you’d look into it by actually visiting a Mormon church, or listening to our semi-annual conference (April & October) on BYUTV, you’d see how dead wrong you are. Don’t worry, they won’t try to baptize you on your first visit…they wait until the second (sarcasm). Peace, my brother!
Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:37amHappystretched;
Your assesment of canucklehead is correct. And the blog I most frequent is hamous.org. Hamous was an administrator of a former blog known as Lone Star Times: a local Houston-based blog that was huge before the owner called it quits. Most of the regulars there moved over to hamous’ site. By all means, join in on the conversations there.
Report Post »rx4nv
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:43pmHave you ever noticed that when your kid is lying and trying to deceive you, they try to overwhelm you with information about everything else, in hopes that you will not pay attention to the lie itself? These kids will then start to call you names and spew hate when you challenge them on the truth, as if that will deter you from digging deeper. Thank you 4xgrace for showing us a stunning parallel in the realm of religion.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:07pmHi ZAZZY
Report Post »No worries on the name-calling. I forgive you :-)
But you’re mistake … I do not scorn and ridicule an entire religion because I got burned by a supposed Mormon. I thot I had been very clear on that point.
I scorn and ridicule the religion because it is ridiculous. And scorn-worthy.
Please remember, I wasn’t the one who brought up the matter of personal experiences with Mormons. Two other LDS apologists did that; one asked us to think of the Mormons we know and recognize how highly we think of them; the other asked rhetorically, “What have Mormons ever done to you?”, assuming the answer could only be … “Nothing”. I was merely being polite and answering THEIR question.
Seriously, I had actually never put the things together in my mind before. At their suggestion I considered what little experience I’ve had with Mormons and, as it turns, it is uniformly baaaad. But that is definitely NOT why I ridicule Joseph Smith, the golden tablets, the temple ceremonies, the salamander spirit, the exclusion of blacks from the priesthood until 1978, the seeing stones, the … well, you get the idea. And you really must know the long list of nonsense as well as I do. Right?
themdg
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:51pmSorry, that’s just not true.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 2:43pmIn light of the fact that atheism has produced a level of pain and suffering across the world exponentially greater than the collective amount of pain and suffering done in the name of Mormonism and Christianity in general, that we should resort to mockery and scorn upon Mormonism, Christianity. In general, and of of their respective dogmas and beliefs.
Sure, that makes sense.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 3:56pmHi HAPPY
I completely agree and acknowledge that my experience with a few Mormons cannot fairly be applied to Mormon teachings or to Mormons in general. (I think I’ve gone out of my way to make that clear in fact.)
Furthermore, the Mormons who cheated me (and other Mormons) were clearly NOT following the teachings of the LDS Church in doing so.
Are we FINALLY clear on that point?
With that established, I‘m sure you’ll want to acknowledge that you were … wrong. (”Canuck still can‘t deal with the straight fact that they were doing so in direct violation of their own principles and the Church’s teachings.”)
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:04pmZAZZY
Report Post »“As far as your proclamation about the Priesthood and women feeling inferior…I apologize, I had no idea you were a Mormon woman and were authorized to speak for “most Mormon women.” Perhaps being confused for an angry non-Mormon man is why you are bitter?”
+ Nice one! I like it.
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:07pmTHEMDG
“Sorry, that’s just not true.”
Hi THEM. We’ve got a thread with like a thousands posts and a billion words going here … can ya be more specific?
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:57pm@Canuck,
Report Post »This is wonderful! After several posts where you ignored your most substantial challenge, you finally admitted you have no leg to stand on accusing Mormon beliefs and doctrine for what ills have befallen you.
I tip my hat to your honesty on that point, and admit I didn’t think you would.
And now, as a dialog on Mormon beliefs has opened up, will you also have the decency of EITHER walking back your outrageous muddled list of things we either don’t believe but you claim we do, or things you can‘t represent accurately without demonstrating that they’re right and good, and produce wonderful results OR courageously debating them point for point?
If the malevolent behavior didn’t come from the beliefs themselves, and some good comes from them, you are left with your accusations that LDS doctrine is crazy, illogical, and therefore produces stupidity, failure, and evil results.
Connect the dots then: How does X belief lead to Y behavior? Can you adequately describe belief X in its context to demonstrate that you’ve even understood it before you mock? When you’ve studied it seriously without bias there are still things which require faith, but there’s nothing crazy or illogical or malevolent. I know because I’ve honestly done it.
Which leaves your accusations in their own dishonesty unless you are open to discussion.
I can start: claim is Smith=prophet, the pattern for testing is Biblical. 14M professing faith in Christ is a good fruit. Your turn.
Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 6:35pmCanucklehead;
“I completely agree and acknowledge that my experience with a few Mormons cannot fairly be applied to Mormon teachings or to Mormons in general. (I think I’ve gone out of my way to make that clear in fact.)”
My goodness that’s a pathetically bad denial of wha your position was. Nevertheless I am glad to see you backing off blaming all Mormons for the bad experiences you’ve had (which I still think you are making up) in the past.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 7:31pmHAPPY
Report Post »“… you finally admitted you have no leg to stand on accusing Mormon beliefs and doctrine for what ills have befallen you.”
+ Hmmm, I wonder why you keep misrepresenting me? I simply NEVER said that the Moron crooks who fleeced me and mine did so because of their kooky theology. Never. I merely noted the coincidence when asked to consider my experiences with Morons.
Are we clear on that point?
SpeckChaser
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 7:49pmHappy/Darren
I have become good friends with several Mormon’s over the years and they are some of the best people you will ever meet.
We have had discussions concerning the Mormon Faith in comparison to the Bible. I do not have a deep understanding of the Mormon Faith but a couple things they claim do not mesh with the Bible as I understand it.
One concern is the belief that hell does not exist. The Bible teaches if we confess that Jesus is Lord, and believe in our hearts God raised him from the dead we will be saved. If the Mormon faith teaches there is no hell, what was the purpose of Jesus’ sacrifice?
Another concern was the belief that if we are good enough, we can ourselves become gods and will be given a planet to rule over. Also was told that Jesus was normal man and a prophet who had achieved exalted man status, which is equal to being a God. The Bible teaches that Jesus is our savior and our hope of an eternal life in Heaven rest in his sacrifice alone.
I would like your opinions on the topic. Y’all can probably add insight and context I could have long forgot.
Report Post »ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:00pmHAPPY
Report Post »What exactly did you find “outrageous” on my “muddled list” of stuff you don’t actually believe?
I know I talked some about the fact that black men were excluded from the priesthood until 1978. Did I get that wrong?
Cuz ya see, I think even Mitt Romney acknowledges that fact. You know, the fact that black men (like the Socialist President we have now) were excluded from the rights that were available to white men in the LDS church … until 1978.
Wow. It always shocks me when I realize it was NINE-teen 78, not EIGHT-teen 78. But hey, racism can take a very looong time to overcome.
ConservativeCanucklehead
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:13pmDARREN
“My goodness that’s a pathetically bad denial of wha your position was.”
+ Yeah, it should be. Cuz it’s not a denial of what my position was. It’s yet another attempt to to help the cognitively-challenged understand what I’ve been saying all along.
“Nevertheless I am glad to see you backing off blaming all Mormons for the bad experiences you’ve had (which I still think you are making up) in the past.”
+ Wrong again D-man. I’m not backing off anything. There’s nothing to back off from. I simply NEVER blamed all Morons for the uniformly bad experiences I‘ve had with the few Morons I’ve encountered.
Are we clear now brother?
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:26pmSpcechaser;
I’ll be happy to give you some insight I do not, however, want to get too sidetracked on theology as this thread is about the LDS Church and all the money it makes.
Hell most definitely exists in Mormon theology though it is perceived in its theology than from tthe traditional Christian theology. In LDS theology Hell is a place for the “sons of predition”. These, in LDS theology are those who knew of God’s truth through the Holy Spirit and then denied the Holy Spirit. Here these sould willdwell in eternal tormaent with Satan and his angels. I do believe Joseph Smith described “sons of perdition” this as those who point directly to the sun and deny it’s there.
In Greek “Hell” is “Hades” and “Hades” is not a place of pure torture but one of rest as well. In LDS theology the righteous, including all “good” souls will rest but those who never had the fulness of the gospel of Jesus Christ will be in darkness simply due to the fact that they do not have all of God’s truths. This is considered a temperal place where these sould will be released for the resurrection and final judgement. The righteous will be released first and the wicked last. This concept of “Hell” / “Hades” is similar tothe Hebrew concept of “Sheol”
http://www.lds.org/scriptures/bd/hell?lang=eng&letter=h
(con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 8:38pmSpeckchaser (con’t);
As for “becoming gods”, Jesus himself taught that we are “gods”. In response to Jews ready to stone Jesus for declaring Himself as one iwth the Father, He said, “…Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?” (John 10:34). This refers to Plams 82:6, “Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High”. My view that “if we’re good enough“ should be interpeted as ”by the grace of God” which is bestowed upon the faithful. Nobody knows the exact mechanics or eternal nature of “becoming gods” inthe eternities but it most definitely has deep roots in Christianity’s theological history and is most similar today as the Greek Orthodox teaching of “theosis”. The following is a link to an interview with Dr. Tom Roberts, Academic Dean, St Elias Seminary and Graduate School with whom the Greek Orthodox view of deification are shared.
http://www.fairblog.org/2012/06/13/mormon-fair-cast-93-deification-as-understood-by-the-greek-orthodox-church/
What should not be lost is the fact that the LDS worship the Father through the Son. That the Father is God Most High and His Son is exalted above all. Nothing will ever replace the Father as our God to whom we will always praise and worship.
You are also always welcome to visit an LDS congregation and worship with them. Feel free to continue your discussions with them and even with LDS missionaries.
God bless
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 9:20pmCanucklehead;
Yes, I’m clear, but, it’s just, I don‘t think you’re clear:
“Let me know when your church — which I’m sure is very sorry — wants to apologize in the only way that really matters.”
What does the LDS Church have to do with your (made up?) story about getting ripped off? Also, why refer to Mormons as “Morons”? Cuz 4X Grace did?
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 10:39pm“It always shocks me when I realize it was NINE-teen 78, not EIGHT-teen 78. But hey, racism can take a very looong time to overcome.”
Agreed. And it’ll be around 2178 when conservativecanucklehead gets over his bias against mormonism and religion in general.
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 14, 2012 at 5:10am@Speck
Report Post »Thanks for the refreshingly cordial honest inquiry on this thread.
From my understanding there is very much a hell in LDS theology. What you may be referring to is the concept that there are degrees of glory available for anyone who deserves even a shred of reward for acts in this life. This is quite biblical (1 Cor. 15 goes on and on about it, also “many mansions in my Father’s house”, etc.), and honors the power of Christ’s sacrifice to empower individuals to attain the highest degree of glory (= heaven, celestial kingdom).
Christ is NOT considered a normal man (He was born half god-half human, different in composition from any other human ever on the planet), but the Bible promises us that just as Christ inherited all power from His Father, so can we all become joint-heirs with Christ (Rom. 8 goes on and on about it).
In all cases, LDS doctrine teaches that although we should work out our own salvation with fear and trembling before the Lord (to avoid a lake of fire and brimstone), but that ultimately our efforts are useless without accepting the saving grace of Christ, who alone is the author and finisher of the faith.
All that integrates Biblical teachings 100% in my reading.
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 14, 2012 at 5:29amCanuck of Jul 13 7:31
-I simply NEVER said that the Moron crooks who fleeced me and mine did so because of their kooky theology.
Canuck of Jul 12 6:27
-Most are ego-maniacs, perhaps stemming from the God-hood mentality(?). Most were extremely selfish, ruthless, cold and aloof. They seem to lack empathy.
+To be fair, the “they” in your Jul 12 post CAN be read as exclusive to the specific group of 10 or so weird Mormons you met, but then why ask what mentality their traits stem from? Why use the generalizing term “most”? Why use the present tense instead of making sure with a past tense that you were ONLY talking about the ones you HAD DEALT with in the past? You’re fooling no one but yourself when you try to weasel out of your own opinions (which are actually not informed opinions, but summary and extremely biased judgments) that LDS doctrine leads inevitably to coldness, aloofness, lack of empathy, weirdness, and extreme selfishness. Have a little courage and own your own accusations.
If you want to make a charge of me misrepresenting you stick, you’ll have to do better than that.
Canuck of Jul 12 10:57
-I actually love the delusional religionists despite their silly superstitions.
+See: you suspect ALL religious people of moral failing (which is the inevitable consequence of being deluded and superstitious). Really you’re the blind one, refusing to see the good in what their beliefs produce.
But let’s talk substance: cont…
Report Post »HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 14, 2012 at 5:55am@Canuck
Report Post »OK, you want to skip over the basics and skip straight to blacks and the priesthood.
Without believing in a priesthood at all.
Without understanding what it is and why it’s needed.
Without believing in a just and merciful Father-God who loves all His children equally without regard for race, and who has prepared a plan for the eternal salvation of all who want it through the atonement of Christ, without whom the whole plan fails.
Without even believing in an eternal existence at all.
Without understanding the role of prophets as mortal mouthpieces for God to convey messages from Him inspiring faith in this Savior.
Without thinking through the consequences of an apostasy as prophesied, of the need for a restoration of authorities to perform the ordinances required by God to accept this Savior.
Without establishing a common ground that if Smith was a prophet then his claims to receipt of authorities follows a biblically attested pattern which implies nothing non-Biblical, but an insistence on Biblical interpretation not held as standard by many other Christian confessions.
Without even accepting the premise that the Bible is the Word of God, and that other Scripture might be.
You’re sure asking to argue from a position of EXTREME ignorance and EXTREME bias. I’m going to have to pose a lot of nested “if” statements as a ladder to bring you up past your lack of intellectual honesty.
So maybe let’s just examine your OWN logic first. Cont…
HappyStretchedThin
Posted on July 14, 2012 at 6:08am@Canuck
Report Post »IF it’s true that God chose a single nation out of all the nations on the planet (the Hebrews) and then in Mosaic times restricted certain priesthood functions to a single tribe out of 12 within that nation (the Levites), then by YOUR definition of RACISM, God has ALWAYS been a racist.
That’s NOT LDS logic or belief. They start with the premise that God is NOT and NEVER HAS BEEN a racist, couple it with a doctrine of posthumous vicarious ordination making it possible for any and ALL blacks who have ever lived to receive the priesthood and enjoy its FULL blessings, and come to the conclusion that if the opportunity to receive it during mortality was not extended to many throughout history, there will inevitably be a restitution of that manifest but temporary unfairness at some point because God is manifestly and ultimately fair.
But even your implied question totally misses the mark.
The question shouldn’t be “is it racist for X group not to hold the priesthood?“ It should be ”Who decides who gets it and who doesn’t?”
If the answer to the RIGHT question is “God decides” then your judgment as to what‘s racist and what’s not is irrelevant.
The truth of the matter is that LDS doctrine has ALWAYS maintained full equality for ALL of God’s children and the members rejoice when new groups are opened up to the blessings of the Gospel.
No LDS believe in using seeing stones, or in salamander spirits, and the rest of your list I’ll discuss in context only.
smorningstar
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:41pmAs a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, I would first like to say that our church does its best to NOT get involved in political matters. Members of the church do but the Church as an organization does not, therefore it has no obligation to had over its financial records.
Report Post »v15
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:21pmAnd I couldn’t help but notice that no death threats were received from members of the LDS church over this. I’m not super stoked about voting for Romney but I am glad he is running because it brings out all of the haters of Mormonism, which are many. Maybe the only good thing about Obama being elected was how much racism is still in this country and how black liberation theology has been indoctrinated into many, many people.
Report Post »BryanB
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:00pm@smorningstar
People don’t read the History of our Country.
It was a super huge deal when John F. Kennedy ran and won the Presidency. Never before in the history of our country had there been and Irish Catholic President.
The reason why it was such a big deal, is because the Irish where considered low lifes and second class citizens, and there had never been a Catholic President before Kennedy, people at the time feared he would take his orders from the Pope. And his rival Vice President Nixon tryed to use Kennedy’s Irish Catholic background against him………
Pray for Jett……………
Report Post »KyleD
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:02pmEither way the church doesn’t have paid clergy, nobody is getting rich off of this money as it all goes to church upkeep and charity.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:12pmWrong, the Mormon Prophet his Apostles and the 70′s all get paid a salary plus perks. Their Kids and Grandkids get to attend BYU for free.
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:49pm@Randycoo2
Report Post »Please provide evidence to your claim.
mils
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:05pmmitt is a business man…made a huge success of his life…is respectful of our country…i don’t care if he worships donkey poop…what difference would it make???? he does not attend churches that spew hatred of our country!!
Report Post »We elected a man that lies to us, built his life on lies..is for all intent and purposes a muslim, but denies it?, and goes to no church??? …remember the “call to prayer’ business???
all of this has been caused and encouraged by bho’s non action, the greatest racial divide we have seen since the early 60′s
There appears to be a snide snickering hatred for america from BHO.. and liberals lap it up..
.yeah, a lot of nasty things we could say about any religion, as the current president hasn’t chosen one yet. if he’s reelected..which mosque will he attend???hhmmm ch oices….hahaha
HOWEVER, MITT’s a good person..more than we can say about bho..
Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:42pmSalt Lake Tribune, Aug. 27, 1994, p. E1, the president of the LDS Church lives in a “downtown condominium, the official residence of church presidents.”
Report Post »In the Wall Street Journal, Nov. 9, 1983, the salary given to a Seventy (second tier of LDS General Authorities, lower than an Apostle) was reported to be $40,000.
And for a lot more info
Title: Mormon America: The Power and the Promise (2nd Edition)
Author: Richard N. Ostling and Joan K. Ostling
Publisher: HarperOne
v15
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 5:49pmRandy, are you an ex-Mormon?
Report Post »Kankokage
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:25pmPro-tip for you Randy: when spewing bile about the church, try to make it sound less like you’re a disgruntled ex-mormon and more like a reasonable person.
About the living wages thing, though, did you not know that every single general authority of the church receives exactly the same living wage compensation? From the prophet on down to the lowly seventy – all the same.
I read the article and, frankly, I found it to be quite disgusting. The entire premise of the article is built upon a notion that the church is obsessed with money. In fact, they even found some “mormon” who said that the church teaches that one cannot be spiritually strong if they are temporally impoverished. Not only have I never heard that once in my long life as a mormon, but I’m pretty sure that goes against everything the Book of Mormon and Bible teach. I found the entire expose to be dishonest and unthoughtful – written solely as a hit piece with no redeeming value.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:33pminstead of labeling something “Bile” why don’t you refute with facts. To label me disgruntled is a little dramatic. I was raised to believe that Joseph Smith was a certain man, when I studied and sought out actual unbiased information I came to the conclusion I wouldn’t contribute to the Mormon Church. I still give 10% out of habit, but I give to real charities that give more than 1% of their proceeds
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:35pm@Randy
Report Post »Heck, if it’s written in an article meant to disprove the Mormon church, then it must be true, right???. You’re probably right though, I have heard that the way to get really rich is to serve full-time in the Mormon church. Thanks for the insight!! Your approach to learning about the Mormon church could also be used in politics…if I want to know about Romney, I’ll just ask Obama!! Just a tip, not everything you get from Googling a topic, means it’s true.
Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:45pmGoogle has been responsible for a mass exodus from the Mormon Church. One can never be sure the veracity of a source. But if you look hard enough you can find the truth. FYI the answer is Joseph Smith made the whole thing up
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:54pmCorrection…if you look hard enough, you’ll find what you WANT to find. Let me reverse your logic and tell you that if you REALLY want to know the truth about the Mormon church, stop fighting it and looking for all the reasons to excuse it as false, have the discussions with the missionaries, and see for yourself. They don’t force anyone to join. Converts come from them finding answers for themselves. I know it sounds cliche, but it’s true. No hard feelings with you, though.
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:39pmWell, THIS conversation should go NO WHERE fast and just WAIT for the ATHEISTS to rear their ugly heads! Good times.
Report Post »eyestoseeearstohear
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:39pmIf trying to GET OUT OF A TERRIBLE STORM and a LIFE RAFT
floats by heading to SOLID GROUND, SAFE SHORES…..WILL YOU TAKE IT?
Our Country needs to get to some what FAMILIAR SHORES.
It WON’T get there with Obama.
P.S.
NOW they want to make religion an ISSUE? Hahaha
Yeah, the religion of the person IN the WH is important…
BUT, AT THIS PARTICULAR TIME….the ship has sailed AND IS
ON A BAD, WRONG COURSE.
If the Romney Raft is heading toward familiar ground, then
Report Post »welcome aboard…IF/WHEN it runs aground – we’ll find a better way
when that moment arrives…UNTIL THEN….LAND HO!
Machtyn
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:44pmNo, because that would be a WORK. And it is by faith that we are saved.
*Sigh* People only listen to the apostle Paul, but forget the apostle James. Particularly, his book, chapter 2 versus 18 – 26.
Report Post »brian8793
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:38pmThis was made by the Jewbags you Christians worship so much.
Report Post »amtsoundsmith
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:36pmHere…I‘ll comment and give you some needed attention that you didn’t get from mommy and daddy. It’s okay; someday you’ll get over your angry teenage angst.
Report Post »jackact
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:38pmSince Bloomberg is an ex-democrat and an ex-republican (and thank God, soon to be ex-mayor) it would make sense that his magazine is out to do a hatchet job on Mormonism in an attempt to slow the Romney surge and bolster the Obama free-fall.
Report Post »Bloomberg desperately wants a high level position in an Obama 2nd term.
An ambassadorship to a middle eastern country where he can complete his ongoing business plans already in the works perhaps?
There is nothing more pathetic than a four foot self hating billionaire consumed with ‘white guilt’.
Just ask any resident of NYC
PeterBucy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:35pmI am 100 times more scared of Obama‘s religious views than Romney’s at all.
Report Post »eyestoseeearstohear
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:47pm@ PETERBUCY
Absolutely!
Report Post »AUsername
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:45pmthere basically the same
Report Post »the_zazzy
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 12:07pm@Ausername
Report Post »Yer rite andd bast on yer uther postings, yu seem lyke a rilly smart guy!
Huguenot Descendant
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:34pmSo now the anti Mormon rhetoric keeps coming. Come on, what a church does with its own money is the Church’s decision. Even the Catholic Church has stock in companies and banks, but is that bad of the Catholic church to try and invest the money of their church members? NO!
However there is one eerie investment that the Catholic Church has made an investment in and that is the Rothschild Bank which has deep connections to the Federal Reserve. I urge those who don’t know what I am talking about watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-STV57S-bvs
http://www.dailypaul.com/107469/is-the-catholic-church-the-dominant-financial-force-in-the-world
Report Post »mazrim1978
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:34pmHow messed up as a society are we, when a women gets death threats for writing a letter that disagrees with gay marriage, ( brad portal mom) or any conservative that says anything against Islam, or disagrees with the prey, is called a racist and bigot from the left, but the msm and the left can say anything against mormans, or pretty much anything and It’s ok, how sad we have beco
Report Post »me
rpp
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:49pmA bigot is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal/progressive.
Report Post »jakartaman
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:34pmThis should be the clarion for people of all faiths to raise up against the liberal progressive secular atheist.
Report Post »We need to fight back -hard against these evil doers and take back our country.
Romney is a good moral family man.
Obama is a lying anti American piece of crap that needs to be expunged from our society along with his sick MSM cult.
MAMMY_NUNN
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:33pmIf I were to choose a religion I would choose to be Mormon as the ones I have known have been nice and pleasent to me while some of the so called Christians have been rather nasty and hateful.
Report Post »slordax
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:28pmhahaha – looks more like what a highschool newspaper would print.
i wonder when they start using women and children in their propaganda bits … lololol
gonna be a fun time waiting for the vote.
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:37pmThey already have.. war on women – Republicans want kids to starve? UGH.
Report Post »Detroit paperboy
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:25pmShow a cover with Obamas God, Allah……..I dare ya, you leftist cowards……
Report Post »PATTY HENRY
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:36pmATTA BOY!!! (DETROIT PAPERBOY) …. Bloomberg is a twerp, typical of short ugly guys. Bloomberg doesn’t have the guts to even try to stop the Islamic “SPIKED BALL” attempt on WTC site… he can’t refer to those thugs as Terrorists… he doesn‘t have the GUTS to try this on Obama’s Muslim ‘faith’…
Report Post »he’s pathetic.
Gonzo
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:00pmHave a cover and a story like that about Judaism and listen to Bloomerg squeal. The magazine would be labeled a “Nazi” propaganda rag. This is a case of the pot calling the kettle black.
Report Post »winin2012
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:45pmMy thoughts exactly. And hey 4XGrace I double dog dare you to openly use your real name and condemn Islam as you have the Mormons. Spell their name wrong and call Muhammad a few names. You have not got the guts. You know that Mormons are a religion of love, laws and forgiveness– an easy target for a bigot like you. Our retaliation will be to laugh at you and post a note saying you are ignorant and a coward. It won’t hurt you though because you are what you are. But those Muslims? Oh year. Post about them, in your real name and contact info and you will die. They are not so kind to “blasphemers” like yourself–and you know it.
Report Post »Oh well, I guess it is better to be an ignorant coward that a dead truth teller.
Portwine
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:25pmI was just waiting for the liberal media to unleash the anti-Mornon (LDS) tirade. Just a matter of time. I am not of that faith, but I do live in a state with a high population of that faith. They are good ppl who respect family values and work on that, and are patriots. They are great neighbors and protectors of the community regardless of faith. I remember when JFK ran, same issues raised then. Interesting the positions are now reversed.
Report Post »The_Jerk
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:36pmI don‘t know how many examples it’s going to take before we realize that the real enemy of Christianity are Jews. They’ve been eating away at Christianity for decades through their cultural changing media empires in print and the electronic media.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-stein19-2008dec19,0,4676183.column
They play a prominent role in the ACLU, as written about by Rabbi Daniel Lapin, “reminiscent of a temple board meeting.”
Report Post »http://www.wnd.com/2003/11/21910/
crazyrightwingmom
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:37pmYes, it is only going to get worse. What a silly ad!
Report Post »What church does release its finances???
Want our country back
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:05pmMitt Romney has lived an exemplary life of honor, kindness and generosity as does Glenn Beck, can these libs say the same…. just read the post that are attacking Brad Pitts mom, Joy Behar potty mouth and I could include hundreds of these hateful people.
Let’s unite and BRING HOME A GOP VICTORY 2012
Report Post »Gonzo
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:08pmJudge them each on an individual basis Jerk…God will, just like He will you and I.
Report Post »cykonas
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:02pm@WANT OUR COUNTRY BACK
Report Post »Let’s unite and BRING HOME A GOP VICTORY 2012
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A GOP victory will not give us our country back. A GOP victory may allow us to hang on to remnants of our country for a couple years longer than a Democrat victory will, but that is about all it will do. If you truly want America back you should be looking elsewhere. The R‘s and the D’s are almost the same thing. They are both for big government control of everything. As just one example, Gov. Romney is talking about repealing the ACA, but then what he’s going to REPLACE it with. How about replacing it with nothing? The R party and it’s ideologues are clueless. As usual. Peace.
pudssweetie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:26pm@Randy,
con·se·crate
[kon-si-kreyt] Show IPA verb, con·se·crat·ed, con·se·crat·ing, adjective
verb (used with object)
1.
to make or declare sacred; set apart or dedicate to the service of a deity: to consecrate a new church building.
2.
to make (something) an object of honor or veneration; hallow: a custom consecrated by time.
3.
to devote or dedicate to some purpose: a life consecrated to science.
4.
to admit or ordain to a sacred office, especially to the episcopate.
No where in the definition of consecrate does it say you have to give up your belongings? Before you say something that is not true, why don’t you look up things first before you make your self look like a fool.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 11:11pmLook up the law of consecration in the Mormon scrips and it means basically a form of socialism where all belongings are owned by the church and the church gives members what they need. Sounds like USSR
Report Post »Mapache
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:24pmIf it were a conservative Catholic the MSM would be doing the same thing. The MSM has no shame and will stoop very low. …..It is key to remember for the liberals, it is not important that something is true as long as you are making a greater point for a good cause…..Dan Rather and the Bush memo is a good example.
Report Post »If they can’t go after Romney as a person they are happy to attack anything touching him. Pitiful.
HKS
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:22pmIf religion is such a hot topic to be kept out of the public places, why is Bloomberg using the reverse to seek some kind of political advantage. If they want it private, it works both ways. Typical liberal, “whatever benefits me is the way I want it to be”. How about we get some exposure on Jeremiah Wright, Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton, or maybe some background on Obama’s mentor and foundation for which his thinking comes, Frank Marshall Davis. If your going this route, at least do it right.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:28pmumm have you no memory, Fox news played Jeremiah Wright non stop in 2008. I don’t think that was a bad thing, I am tired of the old notion that Religion should not be discussed. If Romney has made promises in his Temple to give everything to his religion then I think we should know about that
Report Post »crazyrightwingmom
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:39pmYou are funny…they don’t make promises in temples to give everything to their religion! Most active Mormons do tithe….10%….as do many other Christian denominations.
Report Post »HKS
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:40pmObviously you don’t know that religion. They pay nothing more than tithing like any other church.
Report Post »PATTY HENRY
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:41pmTHE DIFFERENCE? ROMNEY is an AMERICAN ! ROMNEY is a PATRIOT !! put that in your pipe and smoke it. Wright is anti-American and has no respect for America or for GOD. He uses GOD’S name as a swear word. I don’t care if ROMNEY is BUDDHIST. I know he’s an AMERICAN. I know he’s a PATRIOT. I know he’s a decent family man. I know he saved the Olympics. I know OBAMA is a COMMIE/MARXIST/DICTATOR WANNA-BE dope.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:43pmYes they do, I was one of them you have to promise to “consecrate” all of your possesions
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:47pm@patty
What makes Romney patriot? No I will not argue that Obama’s people are not anti American, but what makes Romney a patriot?
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:48pmRandy it’s unbelievable how ignorant you are. It‘s comical reading the comments you make because it literally sounds like you have an education of a four year old yet you think you’re intelligent enough to make some sort of argument.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:50pm@ Mutiny Romney’s sons served missions for their church instead of military service because bringing more people into the LDS church is just as patriotic as serving in the military…
Report Post »Dismayed Veteran
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:57pm@Randy
Could you explain what you mean by “giving everything to his religion”? If you mean money or faithful adherence to the tenents of the church, then it is none of our business. If you mean that he will put the LDS church ahead of the country, please give examples.
BTW, I am not a Mormon. I am a Catholic who remembers that many Protestants believed JFK put the Pope before the country.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:57pm@ one.dakine.howlie ok thank you for the criticism, tell me in what way am I ignorant
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:59pmRandy, you spew random anti-Mormon rhetoric and actually think you have some sort of argument that has anything to do with this article. It’s comical.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:07pm@ one.dakine.howlie, in that case your welcome for providing you with some sort of happiness.
Report Post »@ Dismayed Veteran Mormons are taught to “Follow the Prophet” from a very young age. When they go to the temple they make promises (before 1990 these promises were accompanied with symbolic death threats for revealing them. These promises entail giving everything time talent and energy to the church. It is a valid concern that Romney would have an obligation to listen to his prophet before his country. Google the MTC in Provo 9 story building controversy. This is different from JFK
winin2012
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:06pm@randyc002 These promises entail giving everything time talent and energy to the church.
Wrong again Randy. The Lord requires all that we have for all of it was given to us from Him. Remember the rich man who wanted to know what he must do to be saved? New Testament, not the Book of Mormon, answer for Jesus was to give all that you have to the poor and follow Him. Remember that it is easier for a man to go through the eye of a needle that to enter the gates of heaven? This is God telling us that we need to give our ALL to Him. Not just our money, but our talents our lives and what ever He asks of us. he NEVER said to give it over to the church–neither does the LDS church. It so happens that as a Baptist, I was taught these same principles. To give and live my ALL for Jesus–not my church. I am LDS now and believe the same and live the same. It is called commitment. You either are or you are not. If you are committed to Christ, you will live and give your all to the Lord–no matter what church you go to.
I hope that clears up your misunderstanding.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:05pm@ winin2012, You are misstating the evidence. The Mormon Church teaches that the Prophet speaks to God. When the Prophet speaks there is no questioning his decisions. Therefore when you promise in Mormon Temple that you will give your all to “build the Kingdom of God” that means if the Prophet tells you to do something, you will do it or you will not be serving God.
Report Post »flagkeeper
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 7:53pmAbout consecration-
Matthew 19:21
King James Version (KJV)
21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
…sounds like He was asking a lot.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 9:15pmDid Jesus say to give everything to the poor or to the mormon corporation…
Report Post »flagkeeper
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 4:21amOh, because you already knew the church is nothing but a greedy corporation and has nothing to do with Christ. Okay, now the rest can use their heads.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 11:15amWhether or not the Mormon Church is greedy is debatable by reasonable people with different viewpoints. Whether or not it is a corporation is indisputable. Based on the laws of the state where they are incorporated as “The Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints”. This corporation owns many subsidiaries. It is a corporation. Now when Jesus said to give all you have to the poor, which of the Mormon Corporation’s subsidiaries do you think he was referring to?
Report Post »Truthmonster
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:22pmAre they forgetting Harry Mason Reid, leader of the obstructionist Senate is a Mormon? Where is dirty Harry on this issue? Better an honest Mormon than a liar Muslim! Don’t cha think? Harry is rich he just made his millions from looting the Treasury along with Pelosi, Berkley, and more liberals than I can think of. Let’s drain the liberal swamp in November. The culture of corruption has to go.
Report Post »crazyrightwingmom
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:41pmSo true!!
Report Post »Git-R-Done
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 10:43pmI have no idea how some Mormon politicians can be so left wing when so many Mormons I’ve met are very conservative people.
Report Post »DrunkGOP_Hack
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:21pm…besides, who buys print? Who reads that RAG?
Report Post »HKS
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:29pmThe Blaze is probably their entire readership right now.
Report Post »DrunkGOP_Hack
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:20pmWhy is it that CONVENTIONAL religious believes are figured at scripture?
Look at the Islamic religion, accepted as normal in their minds. Killing and all.
But Since John Smith had HIS own take and got others to believe in GOD, that is ABSURD, STRANGE WIERD.
Hell us Catholics believe we EAT the BODY and DRINK the BLOOD of CHRIST.
I am a flipping cannibal/vampire!
Report Post »Individualism
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:19pmgreat nice to know they will raise our taxes and not let us know where they will spend it, o wait Romney did that in Massachusetts by lying and saying he didn’t raise taxes when he raised many fees. nice to know he plans to raise our taxes and i wonder if he will to fund his Iran and Syria war to.
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:28pmYou are so brainswashed by the left, you make no sense? What are you babbling about? Is that you again Jesse Lee? Syrian war? What about OBAMA’S wars? He just sends troops wherever he wants, WITHOUT telling Congress. Why are we in AFRICA, btw? Bet they wish they could take back that “PEACE PRIZE, since GITMO is still WIDE OPEN? You liberals love to IGNORE obama and all of his FAILING policies. WAKE UP!
Report Post »DrunkGOP_Hack
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:40pmDivvy is like the three monkey, see no, hear no, speak no.
Hasn’t a clue!
Report Post »Individualism
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:15pmhey i am not the one voting for his counterpart.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:18pmAnd the Lord commanded the Mormon Prophet that he should spend less then 1% on good works and build a 5 billion dollar mall in downtown Salt Lake City, Amen
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:27pmHuh?
Report Post »floridaborn
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:29pmI think you’ve got it wrong here, buddy. It was Joe Biden that only gave 1% of his income to charity.
Report Post »Mitt Romeny gave millions.
Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:32pmNot Romeny, the LDS church, they donate less then 1% to humanitarian aid and use the rest of their tax free tithing to build malls and theme parks. (BTW Romney gave 10% of his money to the LDS church, which I don’t consider charity)
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:32pmAnd OBAMA said, take from the CONSERVATIVE legal, hard working, tax payers and redistribute to anyone I feel deserves some of that “SOCIAL JUSTICE.”
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:39pmRegarding Obama, that is a seperate argument and you make a valid point. Now address how the LDS church takes 10% from their members to build malls in the name of God and then don’t have to pay taxes…
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:54pmIn Jan. 2006, from the Church PR department, (Deseret News Publishing Company): Edgley said, Òthat since 1984, the LDS Church has donated nearly $750 million in cash and goods to people in need in more than 150 countries.Ó That averages to 37.5 million per year or about $3-$4 per Mormon member went to the poor.
The total of $750 million in 22 years spent in cash in goods to people in need is less than HALF what the church is spending on these malls. Less than half!! The Mormon Church is spending less than 1% of its income to help the poor.
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:54pmWhat mall and theme parks are you blabbing about exactly??? Let’s see your facts their Mr. I-Lie-About-Being-An-Ex-Mormon-That-Possesses-All-Knowledge-of-the-LDS-Church
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:01pmIt takes 1 minute to google City Creek Mall, do some research don’t take my word for it
Report Post »Le Sellers
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:04pmNot one dime of the money used to improve the city center in Salt Lake came from tithing (or any other contribution).
This lie, the the LDS Church used tithing money to build the Mall is just that, a lie. It came from investment funds ultimately derived from the Church’s ownership of the land in and around the city (due to its being the first and only one to settle there — no one else wanted it).
Further, the Mall is only one of a long list of places where the LDS Church has kept the center of downtown Salt Lake City clean and inviting, unlike many inner cities. There are a host of reasons for doing this, but one of the last in that list is financial incentive. It has more to do with being good civic neighbors and making the downtown area attractive to tourists.
Lies, such as the one Randycoo2 perpetuates are unbecoming a Christian (I assume he claims to be one, but I could be wrong o this count), unUSmerican (again, a rebuttable assumption on my part), and just not very nice (whether he is nice or not, I leave to his mother to decide).
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:11pm@one
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=19428181&title=a-look-inside-as-city-creek-centers-completion-nears&s_cid=featured-1
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:14pm@ Le Sellers are you one of the Apostles or the Prophet? Because the LDS church does not release its financial information. So how are you privvy to that info? In any case arguendo the literal dollars the church used to build the mall were from the sale of land. Did or did not the Lord tell the Church to use the money from the sale of land to build a mall? I think it is offensive to many christians the idea that the God is too busy to help the hungry and downtrodden because he is planning a mall to increase tourists in downtown SLC. btw I am a nice person
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:17pm@LE
Maybe so, but investment money spent on it is the same thing. The start up money for the investment money came from tithes. So to call it a lie is incorrect. Regardless, the amount of money spent on the mall(which I have seen from 2.5 to 5 billion) is a giant sum in comparison to the 750 million the church posted as charity over a 22 year span.
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:19pmMutiny. how dare you take a comment out of context of an entire report and present it as fact to support your hate-filled rhetoric. It’s also ridiculous that you think that no one else on here has read the same article. First of all that specific number is specifically aid given for emergency aid in foreign countries. That means it‘s aid that was given on top of the Church’s ongoing humanitarian effort, welfare program, third-world education programs, construction programs, micro-loan education and distribution programs, farming programs, etc, etc, etc.
From 1985 to 2011 the LDS Church has given $1.4 billion to Humanitarian Aid. Guess what, that’s 100% of the money that church members give specifically for Humanitarian Aid. See the first Sunday of every month the church as a whole Fasts (they skip two meals for the day and donate the money they would have spent on those meals to help those in need). They get to choose where that money goes by filling out a provided slip. They can give it to the Church’s welfare program, the local congregation’s food store house, a specific church member, missionary work, or the Church’s humanitarian aid program. That means that in 26 years members of the LDS Church have personally given $1.4 billion to humanitarian aid and 100% went straight to the people that needed. Heck of a lot more efficient than our incompetent government.
Report Post »Lord_Frostwind
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:20pmBuddy, you ever been to Salt Lake? Ever heard of a place called “welfare square?” Or how about the fact the LDS affiliates and charity organizations are almost always the first in to a disaster area to provide relief. Ever heard of Bishop’s Storehouses? Of course not, it probably isn’t talked about in whatever statistical manipulating pile of manure you take for news.
Report Post »Le Sellers
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:23pmSince the Prophet has stated unequivocally that the money did not come form tithing, there is no reason to assume it did.
You ask how I know, we might just as easily ask you how you claim to know, since, as you say, the Church has not released its finances. Just makin’ it up, like Wasserman-Schultz?
Oh, and by the way, the Mall did NOT cost anything like $5 billion, that was the cost of the whole city center improvement. Just taking numbers and trying to attack the LDS Church with them when you have no grounds at all to do so. But that’s par for the course with evangelicals (and others) attacking the Church: lie when you must, distort when you can, fabricate when you think you can get away with it — but the truth, never! It just won’t work.
Report Post »marchbanks7
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:30pmI love how you just make up random stats and try to pass them off as truth. The LDS church is one of the most giving organizations in the world.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:33pmThe “Fast offerings” donations are not the Mormon church, those are members who are very generous and give money to be used to help the poor. That is seperate from the 10% the church takes and all of the Church’s business holdings. Just like Jesus intended…
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:35pm@ Le so when the Prophet has spoken the thinking has been done, Right?
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:36pm@one
1.4 billion over 26 years isnt that great. What is that 53 million a year or so? The article I read by the Mormon propaganda wing that said the info, not me. The article in no way said it was from fast offerings. So how dare you, blah blah blah.
You also brought up the government giving aid. I dont believe government should give aid.
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:41pm@LE
Actually some countries require yearly statements from churches. That is how your church’s info is out there.
I said I have read it cost between 2.5 and 5 billion. There are many articles saying its over budget from its original price tag. Since I am a evangelical and just trying to make the LDS look bad, tell us how much it cost?
Remember, start up investment money came from tithes. Defending your church is fine, I am sure you will get a really special planet when you become a god.
Report Post »Le Sellers
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:49pmNo, coo2, “the thinking has NOT been done”. But you knew that this snide quotation from a repeatedly repudiated source makes it sound like we Saints are Zombies, so it fits your purposes, even though, essentially a lie (intentionally misleading people, no matter how “true” the statement may be is lying). William Blake said it well:
A truth that’s told with bad intent
Beats all the lies you can invent.
He was talking about you, doncha know.
As to the differences between “tithing” and “Fast Offerings”, I invite you to look carefully at the Old Testament. There were three tithes back then, and the LDS Church has a similar system.
The first tithe was not for the poor: it was for the maintenance of the Church (under the Law of Moses, rather than the Law of the Gospel, but it was still God’s Church). The second tithe was for the Jews so they could go to Jerusalem for the feasts. The third tithe (now the Fast Offering) was for the poor, but they did not give it to the church at all: the poor had to get it directly from the other person.
Trying to make how the Church spends tithing money an issue illustrates an abysmal understanding of the Lord’s Law of the Tithe.
So, even though you claim to be “nice”, your action speak much louder than your words.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:08pm@ Le and where in the Old Testament does it cover what to do with vast business holdings and developing commercial property?
Report Post »The quote perfectly describes the atmosphere in the Mormon church. It is heresy to say that the Prophet is wrong. The only option is to bow your head and say yes or leave the church. That is a fact and you are lying if you say otherwise.
jdog777
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:18pmCan you at least try to be honest, knowledgeable, and honorable when you post??
Report Post »amtsoundsmith
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:22pmWhy do you care so much about a mall? Its not your money. Do you get off by tearing down mormons? If so, you have a sad, boring life.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 6:29pmI am honest, pretty knowledgable and honorable. Doubting and questioning is not the charactaristic of a bad person. It is someone who can admit they don’t know everything and try and learn more.
Report Post »I paid tithing for many years to that church. I not only have standing to discuss this issue, I contend anyone should be allowed to discuss any topic they want (this is still America afterall)
Danish American
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 1:41pmYou are so full of crap your breath stinks. Truth of the matter is you have no way of knowing these figures. The business part of the Church operates as a business, pays taxes, etc. It takes no tithing funds or other funds donated by members of the Church. You are a liar plain and simple and truth isn’t in you. I don‘t know what your beef which the Church is but move on for heaven’s sake.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 2:17pmWhere do you think the money came from to start all of those businesses?!
Report Post »scubadogs
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:18pmI’ll take a American Mormon over a Socialist Muslim any day!!! They are getting pretty low reporting like this but when you have nothing to run on then you strike out at anything.
Report Post »grudgywoof
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:18pmAs a Southern Baptist I have been taught that Mormonism is a cult…..however the people who make up this faith seem to have good fruit (good kids, work ethic, ect.). I would rather have a Mormon in the white house than a deciple of Rev. Wright.
Report Post »DarthMims
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:35pmRaised in the Assemblies of God, I was taught that Mormonism was a cult, but I was also taught that the Baptists were going to hell because they believed in “once saved, always saved.” I completely agree with you that people should be viewed by the good works they do, not by what religion they are, and I have known a lot of good, upstanding, responsible Mormons. Oh, Baptists, too.
Report Post »Dismayed Veteran
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:35pmThis is a true story that reflects poorly on my church.
When my father-in-law turned 90, we intended to have a reception at the Knights of Columbus meeting room in the church basement. My father-in-law had been a Knight of Columbus for 62 years. The Altar Society was to provide coffee and soft drink service. My mother-in-law had been a member of the Alter Society for 40 years. Family from California, Michigan, Wyoming and Utah were coming. We were told that the hall rental was $500. We planned on brining the food.
My wife’s best friend is LDS. She arranged for the LDS Stakehouse for no charge. All we had to do was make sure it was clean when we were done and not to smoke on the church property. Many LDSmembers knew my father-in-law and mother-in-law.
I find it difficult to dislike Mormons. I also find it difficult to like the members of my in-laws Catholic parish. I had a long and one-sided conversation with the parish priest and the leadership of the Knights of Columbus. I am afraid I used language that I used in the Army.
As a Catholic, I was taught that the LDS church was a cult. I experienced what I would consider a Christian act on their part.
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:46pmI have never met a Mormon who isnt nice. I also have never met a Hindu that was bad either. Being nice people doesnt make your faith correct in my eyes.
Report Post »Psytoxic
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:15pmChristian bigotry in 3, 2, 1…
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:21pmOh come on. You know you Mormons only believe you are the real Christians. Us Baptists and Catholics are not much different from Muslims, Hindu, and Scientologists in your eyes.
Report Post »bluegrandma52
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 9:48pm@Mutiny. Mormons do not believe that we are the only Christians, nor do we believe that we are the only group that will be “saved”. We leave those definitions to God, who knows the heart of each of His children. A Hindu or atheist is just as likely to be saved as a member of the LDS, or other, church. The Light of Christ is given to all His children at birth; what they do with that light is between them and their Father. What happens on this earth, during our probation here, is only the beginning of our journey. If we have the opportunity to learn of Him and follow Him, great. We then have the responsibility to offer that blessing to others. If we do not have that opportunity, or are so blinded by men‘s philosophies that we can’t accept or understand His message, then we’ll have the opportunity in the next life. A just God could not be so arbitrary as to reject those of His children that didn’t have every chance in this life. There is no human being born on this earth who will not have a just and equal chance to accept Christ as their Savior. A loving Father could not do anything less. “For God is no respecter of persons.” He loves all His children, and wants what’s best for them. Our job is to love one another as He loves us, to be kind, forgiving, charitable, and always give the benefit of the doubt when faced with our brothers‘ and sisters’ awkward humanity. My membership in the LDS church over the past 45 years has taught me this. It is the base I try to work f
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:15pmWOW. That is disgusting! Try that with say… MUSLIMS? These progressives are SO desperate to keep comrade Obama, that they will try ANYTHING. Can we call this “MORMONAPHOBIA” now or just plain HATE for a Constitutional Captitalist?
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:22pm@Equal Justice, just because people are too afraid to report about Muslims doesn‘t mean they shouldn’t report about Mormons. You should be encouraging open debate about ALL religions
Report Post »BigDogRex
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:22pmI had the same thoughts. Let’s see Bloomberg do a cover with Mohammed and underage girls…
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:30pmDon’t Forget Joseph Smith and his underage wives (and yes he did have at least one, check the LDS family history website and type in Joseph Smith)
Report Post »EqualJustice
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:36pmRandy, I am SICK of Muslims and their LACK of open debate. How do you DEBATE such HATE? Please. CAIR IS THE ENEMY. This is just a way to attack an OBAMA opponent. PERIOD. They never cared before and the only people “encouraging” religious “debate” now are ATHEISTS because to succeed, the progressives KNOW they have to take religion out of EVERYTHING.
Report Post »one.dakine.howlie
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:42pmOh that makes total sense Randy. Especially since “Mormonism” (as the world calls it) believes in honor killings, oppresses women, has a goal of destroying every Jew on Earth, despises Christianity, objects to Christ’s divinity, encourages terrorism in the name of Jihad, justifies killing of its followers in the name of Jihad, uses its followers as human shields in war, encourages slavery of inferior races, condones prostitution… Oh wait, I got that backwards.
It absolutely disgusts me that Evangelical “Christians” in this country will not make a distinction between the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and Islam. They would rather lose their freedoms than tolerate a Christian religion that they’ve been taught to hate and know nothing about. We‘re no longer worthy of the Lord’s protection and mercy. Not just because there are many in this nation who have turned away from God but also because those who profess to follow Christ despise good people who have different Christian beliefs than their popular “mainstream” Christian beliefs.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:48pm@one.dakine.howlie I’m sorry I am not sure what you mean…
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 1:51pmwhen have evangelicals ever compared LDS to muslims? I think the evangelicals have been very accepting of Romney. That being said, how do you respond to Joseph Smith having underage wives?
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:26pm@one
“It absolutely disgusts me that Evangelical “Christians” in this country will not make a distinction between the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and Islam”
Well I can clear this up for you. Most of us Evangelicals believe there is one God. He is the God of the Bible. He has one real son, Jesus Christ of the Bible. That is one team. On the other team there is Satan. Satan created all the other religions. So if you are a Muslim, Hindu, Scientologist, Mormon, Branch Davidian, or atheist you are against God.
marchbanks7
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:41pmRandy how can you have an underage wife when in the 1800 their was no law for it, plus in those days in or out of the church people were married all the time in their teen years. Even in the early 1900′s this was common. Again you try to distort facts and create contention over twisted truths
Report Post »brknhrt
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:48pmHere is some info on the conduct of Mormons vs Islam
Report Post »http://www.mtn-meadows-assoc.com/st_louis_post-dispatch.htm#Sarah Baker Gladden
Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:52pmThe fact is Joseph Smith Married a 14 year old girl Helen Mar Kimball she stated afterwards “My father] asked me if I would be sealed to Joseph … [Smith] said to me, ‘If you will take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father’s household & all of your kindred.[‘] This promise was so great that I willingly gave myself to purchase so glorious a reward. … [After the marriage] I felt quite sore over it … and thought myself an abused child, and that it was pardonable if I did murmur”. Just because men married 14 year old children back then doesn’t make it right. If it is wrong today for a 35 year old to have sex with a 14 year old then why would God have told Smith to do it then?
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 2:53pm@march
Then I guess you think it ok that Muhammad had underage wives because there were no laws and it was common. Hell today in many countries underage girls are made into wives by older men because there is no laws and its common in their area. You are ok with that?
I mean look, Smith only had like 33 wives. He also received his command from the Mormon god to have many wives after he was already practicing polygamy but we will ignore that.
Report Post »winin2012
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:35pm@randycoo2
COWARD!
Report Post »AUsername
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 3:35pmthere pretty similar to each other.
Report Post »Randyco02
Posted on July 12, 2012 at 4:02pm@ winin2012 …ok…awkward…
Report Post »Darren
Posted on July 13, 2012 at 3:56pmMutiny;
“Well I can clear this up for you. Most of us Evangelicals believe there is one God. He is the God of the Bible.”
LOL, that’s exactly what Islam believes.
” He has one real son, Jesus Christ of the Bible. That is one team. On the other team there is Satan.”
LOL, that’s exactly what Mormons believe.
“I am the God of Israel, and the God of the whole earth, and have been slain for the sins of the world.”
(3 Nephi 11:14)
Does Islam believe that about Jesus Christ? Thanks for clearing things up.
Report Post »