China’s State-Controlled Catholic Church Defies Vatican, Says it Will Self-Appoint Bishops
- Posted on June 23, 2011 at 8:59pm by
Billy Hallowell
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BEIJING (The Blaze/AP) — China often marches to the beat of its own drum. Now, the nation’s state-controlled Catholic church says it will move swiftly to appoint new bishops in dioceses where there are none, in a step that is certain to worsen frictions with the Vatican.
Filling the more than 40 empty bishop’s seats is an urgent task because the vacancies are causing serious problems in the handling of church affairs, the official Xinhua News Agency quoted a spokesman for the Chinese Patriotic Catholic Association as saying on Thursdsay.
Bishops must be selected and ordained in an “active and prudent” way, based on national conditions and pastoral and evangelizing work, Yang was quoted as saying.
China doesn’t have any diplomatic ties with the Vatican, and the authoritarian government claims the right to appoint bishops in defiance of the Holy See’s insistence that only it has the authority to do so.
The next ordination of an bishop not endorsed by Rome could come within a week. The Catholic news service Ucanews.com, citing church sources it did not name, said the Patriotic Association plans on Wednesday to ordain one of its own vice chairmen as bishop in the southwestern diocese of Leshan in Sichuan province.
Back in May, the Pope issued a declaration for universal prayer across the globe for Chinese Catholics:
Populous Sichuan province is home to five of China’s 97 dioceses, but has only one serving bishop, 94-year-old John Chen Shizhong of Yibin, according to Ucanews.com.
China forced its Roman Catholics to cut ties with the Vatican in 1951. Worship is allowed only in state-backed churches, although millions of Chinese belong to unofficial congregations loyal to Rome.
The selection of bishops is by far the most contentious issue dividing Beijing and Rome. Relations nose-dived in November after the Chinese church ordained another bishop without the pope’s approval, ending an unspoken agreement under which Rome was offered an opportunity to first give its tacit approval.
That hard line was reinforced by Yang’s comments, which followed a national meeting last weekend of the Patriotic Association and its sister body, the Bishops Conference of the Catholic Church of China.
Earlier this month, the ordination of a new bishop not approved by the Vatican was postponed for reasons that were not announced. Joseph Shen Guo’an, who was to have become bishop of the central city of Wuhan, was quoted by Ucanews.com as saying he was informed of the decision but not told why. Prior to the decision, NTD Television aired a brief newscast explaining the controversy surrounding Shen Guo‘an’s selection:
However, other church sources said Beijing had been unable to convince local priests and lay people to show their approval by attending the ordination ceremony, forcing them to call it off.
Beijing places tremendous pressure on priests and lay people to go along with its choice of bishops, often spurring a backlash amid calls from Rome to resist.
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Comments (95)
bruce_baker
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:49amLOL! Do they pray to the Virgin Mao for mercy?!
Report Post »fitsgibbons
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:45amI’m sure the true Catholics have to meet somewhere in private to worship God. The chinese have NO respect. They will have to answer to the “Almighty God” for their actions. Pray for all religions and churches, not just the Catholic church. I’m Catholic and pray for us all.
Report Post »ying
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 5:32pmThey do!
Report Post »Sugabee
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 6:14pmIn a way, this would definitely separate the chaff from the wheat, so to speak. If you don’t truly believe, you won’t risk your life to receive the glorified Christ in Holy Communion.
Report Post »capitalismrocks
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:24amFirst the hypocrisy called the Church of England, now the Church of China?!?!?!? I hope those in China secretively work behind the govt to devout themselves to following the Roman Catholic Church and not to follow the China “Mao Regime Farce”…..
Report Post »capitalismrocks
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:24amFirst the hypocrisy called the Church of England, now the Church of China?!?!?!? I hope those in China secretively work behind the govt to devout themselves to following the Roman Catholic Church and the Mao Farce…..
Report Post »conservativewoman
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:21am@WOEMCAT
Report Post »The name “Peter” come from the Greek word “petros” which means ROCK!
“Upon this Rock” Hello! Did your Pastor not tell you this part?
And by the way, when talking about following scripture. Protestants do
not have all scripture. Your bibles omit seven original books of the bible
because there is too much reference to Catholic beliefs.
Please stop attacking the Catholic Church. If Christians of ALL FAITHS do not stop fighting
we will LOSE! Fighting among ourselves is the work of Satan!
woemcat
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 4:12pmi’m not going to argue. it’s not getting anywhere. good grief. i didn’t intend to pick a fight. the foundation of the church is the words of “you are the Christ, the son of the living God,” not peter himself. good grief. i‘m exiting this discussion because i can see it’s going nowhere.
Report Post »Sugabee
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 6:12pmWoemcat: What the heck did you expect, coming in with your guns blazing? A nice high tea with gloved hands? Please. Don’t bash what you know nothing about.
Report Post »santramir
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 9:26amdis-idiotize yourself, see: http://www.realzionistnews.com/?p=257
Report Post »Thun
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 8:23amThe Apostles and the Bible reflect a great concern for those who would oppose their authority and teach doctrine other than the Church. Galatians 1:7-9 states, “But there are some who are disturbing you and wish to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel other than the one that we preached to you, let that one be accursed! As we have said before, and now I say again, if anyone preaches to you a gospel other than the one you received, let that one be accursed!”
In 2 Peter 3:16, Peter warns, “Speaking of these (referring to Paul‘s letters), in them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and the unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.”
St. Peter, the first Pope, also states, “Know this first of all that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the Holy Spirit who spoke under the influence of God (2 Peter 20, 21).” This is a warning to those who would attempt to change things, which they do to their own ruin.
Today, there are more than 33,000 denominations of the Protestant faith. I don’t have all the answers but I will do my best to DEFEND my faith.
Report Post »conservativewoman
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 11:31am@THUN
Report Post »Thank you and God bless you.
Sugabee
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 3:52pmThank you, Thun. Since Jews did not each own their own copy of their “Bible”, or what is the first 5 books of our Old Testament, how do you all think they knew the scriptures? That’s right – from oral and cultural TRADITION. Just as along with Moses being the 3rd pillar of truth for the Jews (Moses = teaching authority, Torah= scripture, and oral/cultural tradition), so the Catholic Church has its teaching authority = the Magesterium, oral/cultural tradition, and the scriptures = the Bible. No Jew had their own copy of the Torah, and hardly anyone could read anyway. Do you think the early Christians walked around with copies of the Torah to tell them how to live out their faith? No- they relied upon the Apostles, chief among whom was Peter, as conferred in Matt. 16:18. Jesus says, literally, “You are Kepha (Rock), and on this kepha (rock) I will build my Church”. They were standing at Caesara Phillipa, which was a huge ROCK. Jesus gave Peter the keys to His kingdom. In those days, whoever had the keys was the STEWARD of the kingdom, and could pass (confer) those keys on to another for safekeeping and administration. Thus, we have apostolic succession handed down from from JESUS to Peter, down to Benedict XVI. Popes are human, just as all stewards are human – they are not divine or infallible as themselves, but their OFFICE is. From an early Church father, Tertullian:
“Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called ‘the rock on which
Report Post »Sugabee
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 3:53pm“Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called ‘the rock on which the Church would be built’ [Matt. 16:18] with the power of ‘loosing and binding in heaven and on earth’ [Matt. 16:19]?” (Demurrer Against the Heretics 22 [A.D. 200]).
“[T]he Lord said to Peter, ‘On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven [and] whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven’ [Matt. 16:18–19]. . . . What kind of man are you, subverting and changing what was the manifest intent of the Lord when he conferred this personally upon Peter? Upon you, he says, I will build my Church; and I will give to you the keys” (Modesty 21:9–10 [A.D. 220]).
(Sorry, ran out of characters!)
Report Post »Sugabee
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 3:55pm“Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called ‘the rock on which the Church would be built’ [Matt. 16:18] with the power of ‘loosing and binding in heaven and on earth’ [Matt. 16:19]?” (Demurrer Against the Heretics 22 [A.D. 200]).
“[T]he Lord said to Peter, ‘On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven [and] whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven’ [Matt. 16:18–19]. . . . What kind of man are you, subverting and changing what was the manifest intent of the Lord when he conferred this personally upon Peter? Upon you, he says, I will build my Church; and I will give to you the keys” (Modesty 21:9–10 [A.D. 220]).
Report Post »PelositheGreat
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 8:20amYa’ll spook to easily. What could possibly go wrong with state appointed bishops?
Report Post »randi3927
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 5:24amIt always amazes me how the Chinese, who are always telling others to stay out of their internal affairs, are so arrogant to meddle in everyone else s internal affairs.
Report Post »ying
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 5:30pmThe people themselves aren’t bad people; it’s the people who took over their country who are bad, and those people are not 100% Chinese.
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:42amCommunism, is “religion”, don’t believe me check your premises!!!
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 1:12amSeriously, I have a mind, why I cannot “Think” on my own???? Ask yourself, this question?????
Report Post »ChristianLayman
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:09am@woemcat
It‘s news because a country’s secular government has no right to step into matters outside it’s jurisdiction. The selection of a bishop to head up a diocese is the prerogative of the Church, not the State. This is stuff that happened in Europe ever since a rivalry between the Pope and Holy Roman Emperor began, as well as with other rulers.
You also don’t seem to understand that the Catholic Church IS the Church founded by God. What, are you operating under the malarchy that Constantine “founded” the Catholic Church?
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 2:25amno, i’m operating under the correct truth that the catholic church was NOT founded by God, but by men, not necessarily Constantine. Get your facts straight. Please, read your scripture. there’s nothing in there that says peter was a pope. that “on this rock, i will build my church,” was on Peter’s confession that Jesus is the Christ, NOT that peter is a “pope.” that erroneous interpretation unheard of until later. cannon law has no basis in christianity. i am very familiar w/ catholicism, and understand that it has little to do w/ christianity. sooo, i go back to my point of why the hell are stories about the catholic church always in the news? they’re not newsworthy!!!! you don’t see news stories about the baptist church constantly in the news. so, why, except the catholic church has strongarmed the media, is the catholic church always in the news? i’m really sick of it. i do see dangers in state run churches, but if china wants state-run churches, then so be it. if the chinese people don’t want state run churches, they should rise up, like they tried to in 1989. yes, WWII germany shows the dangers of state run churches too. i get that. that part is not lost on me. still……
Report Post »hannahh
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 7:56amCatholic Church IS the Church founded by God…here we go again. You obviously believe what a “man” tells you. The vatican & China are both made up by men. I agree with Woeman open the bible and follow what GOD tells you.
Report Post »hannahh
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 7:58amI agree with woemcat sorry!
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 4:15pmThank you, HANNAHH! at least some people get it. and yeah, i suppose i’m just going to have to deal w/ some crap in the world even though i hate it. :0(
Report Post »ChristianLayman
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 6:00pm@woemcat
Okay, you claim that the Catholic Church was founded by men. From who specifically and what year and give me your sources. Also, if the Catholic Church supposedly was founded later, what happened to the Church you claim has nothing to do with Catholicism.
With regards to Peter’s confession of Faith, Catholics believe that in conjunction with the papacy and as far as Holy Scripture is concerned, I seriously doubt you use a complete set of books. You do realize that Luther tried to eliminate several New Testament books along with the seven Old Testament Deuterocanonicals right?
Canon Law has no basis in Christianity…. and your sources for this is because…… what exactly? Do you even know what Canon Law is?
Partly the reason why the Church is in the news is because the majority of Christians around the world profess Catholicism. A whopping 1.1 billion or so compared to the COMBINED numbers of Protestants which is closer to 600 million. The Baptist Ecclesial Communitry is split along lines that entail no central governing authority to which I’m aware of and is no where near the numbers and influence of the Catholic Church. There are probably other reasons that I’ve neglected to mention as well, but there you go.
Report Post »ChristianLayman
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 6:30pmhannahh
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 7:56am
Catholic Church IS the Church founded by God…here we go again. You obviously believe what a “man” tells you. The vatican & China are both made up by men. I agree with Woeman open the bible and follow what GOD tells you.
———————————————————————————————————————————————–
Which Bible would that be? I’m reading Genesis (NIV Archaeological Study Bible), Exodus (KJV), Isaiah (NIV), Wisdom of Solomon, Gospel of Mark (RSVCE).
I’ve also read the entire JPS Tanakh (Jewish OT as of 90AD) and 1981 NAB Catholic Ed.
I also have a Septuagint (Greek OT), NKJV, Crossway ESV Study Bible, Navarre New Testament, and Clementine Vulgate / Dhouay Rheims Bible.
I believe what a “man” tells me to believe? You do realize before Holy Scripture was ever written, the Israelites were following what a “man” (Moses) told them and the he was under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. The OT prophets were all men whom God The Holy Spirit spoke through. You have no problem believing them. The Apostles all preached the Gospel which before committing to paper would’ve only been possible via oral transmission. You believe them (and consequently the first Pope, St. Peter).
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 25, 2011 at 4:17pmsugabee, sigh! i do know about the catholic church. do i have to rehash this again? all i said is why is this news? this shouldn’t be news. good grief. and okay. let me explain rock. peter is rock–petros. and the “upon this rock…” is petras. that’s two different forms of Greek, so peter is NOT the rock to which Jesus was referring. i’m not trying to pick a fight. all i said is WHY IS THIS NEWS? you guys picked the fight w/ your erroneous statements. good grief.
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:04pmagain, why is this news?!?!?! i don’t give a flying fig what the catholic church does. this is a war between two totalitarian states. this doesn’t belong on a news site.
Report Post »ChristianLayman
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:21pmIf you profess to be a follower of Christ, you darn well better be concerned with what goes on in the Catholic Church.
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:28pmummm, being a follower of Christ doesn’t mean I have to be concerned w/ the catholic church because the catholic church isn’t what saves me. Jesus saves me. so, again, why is this news? the catholic church is an institution of man, not of God. Christ founded the church. man founded catholicism.
Report Post »woemcat
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:31pmagain, i say, why is this news???? being a follower of Christ has NOTHING to do w/ the catholic church. Jesus is the one who saves me, NOT the catholic church. the catholic church is an institution of man, whereas the church is founded by God. soooo, what’s your point? i am a Christian and a true follower of Christ, but stay as far away from catholicism as i can. this story is not newsworthy.
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:31amYep, Communists are Religionists, they the “Government” are Gods! I’m wondering if “Buddha” has anything to do with this???? No matter, how you or I look at this “Religion” is involved!!!
Report Post »Ask yourself, why should I have to “Sacrifice to others”? Why????????
ying
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:59pmThe Catholic Church in China isn’t really a Catholic Church. It goes *against* all things Catholic. It‘s just like everything else there that’s plastic –a shell, a front. When the Chinese jews turned China into a communist state, they took Bibles from people and killed priests who were there doing missionary work.
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:21amYep, Communists are Religionists, they the “Government” are Gods! I’m wondering if “Buddha” has anything to do with this????
BTW, ying, why do you keep bringing up Chinese Jews??? (Just curious)
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 1:18amSo far at this time, I thought so!!!!
Report Post »ying
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 5:28pmRaionalman, you said, “BTW, ying, why do you keep bringing up Chinese Jews??? (Just curious)”
For the same reason you frequently bring up communists! Also, if I said only jews and left out the chinese part, ignorant people would see someone like George Soros in their minds, or white-looking people since it’s all they know. Jews have mixed with all peoples of the world in order to remain unseen. And in order to be specific about the people who turn countries into communist ones, then the jews must always be mentioned; there is no reason to fear them –speak the truth always, no matter what.
Report Post »NOBALONEY
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:52pmWorldover,EWTN,April 26, 2011. In an interview with Raymond Arroyo, Hong Gong’s Caddinal Zen Ze-Kuin said,” the Vatican has always given in to the government, and that such appeasements have hurt the Underground Church”. “Whether it be a statue of Confucius in Tiananmen Square. or its “gang of four” Cultural Revolution, the Communists will use any means to control its people.”
Report Post »last frontier
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:50pmSee, Steve Wynn, Jim rogers, Bill and Hillary, Wall Street, and all the other investors in China you were right they are just like US but a friendlier business environment. Wake up from your greedy little trance people.
Report Post »vennoye
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:12pmOh yes, they are absolutely wonderful……………just listen to people who HAVE to live under the regime…..just watch this video and learn how humane the country is for people who can’t leave. Their policies are great for families especially women. This may be the reason they want Bishops trained in country instead of approved by Rome. How DO you reconcile China’s 1 child policy with the teachings of the Catholic Church??????????
Report Post »http://www.womensrightswithoutfrontiers.org/blog/?p=219
ChristianLayman
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:25pm@vennoye
Yeah, I‘m not sure what the Chinese ’catholic’ church would be. Either they are schizmatics like the Anglicans started off under Henry VIII or they are treading into full-blown heresy.
Report Post »firemanfrank
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:42pmA soldier in Gods army does not need the permission of the govt. to speak to God .Many oppressed people find a way to worship our lord. Where there is darkness only light. ST. Francis
Report Post »independentvoteril
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:40pmANYONE surprised?? they aren’t called COMMUNIST CHINA because of FREEDOM now are they??
Report Post »firemanfrank
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:35pmThe best is that our media groups such as CNN, MSNBC, and readable news Huffpo ,Wash post etc. outlets praise how things are done in China, they have no idea what it is like to have your whole world controlled by the Government. Ask any immigrant that has left these types of countries to live in America oh wait FOX has , and they will tell you how terrible it is to grow up in a stranglehold for your whole life.I truly believe that only the Blazers appreciate and cherish the freedoms we are afforded in this great Country of ours. Once that is gone our children will live in such misery,pray this never happens. I have older family members that grew up in Italy many years ago and they praise America and its opportunities everyday.Our rich career politicians have no idea what it is like to beg neighbors for a loaf of bread to feed their children like my grandparents had too. Pray that America remains the greatest Country in the world and that our leaders dont just throw it all away at our expense. Some of us peasants have worked too hard.
Report Post »Thun
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:33pmI’m reminded of one of my favorite priests, Cardinal Francis Xavier Nguyen Van Thuan who was arrested after the fall of Saigon by he Communists in Vietnam. He spent 13 years in prison, 9 in isolation and after writing home and asking for medication for his stomach, his family knew he meant wine for communion. They sent him a bottle marked medicine containing the wine and hid some hosts in a flashlight. Everyday this remarkable priest would have a Mass placing 3 drops of wine and 1 drop of water in the palm of his hand. Every day I pray for his beatification and canonization. Now I’ll pray for China too.
http://www.ad2000.com.au/articles/2003/may2003p10_1322.html
Report Post »freddyjoe
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:12amThank you for the story of Cardinal Francis Xavier Nguyen Van Thuan, makes you realise how presious our freedom is, but how great God’s love always is.
Report Post »pennswoods
Posted on June 25, 2011 at 4:45pmMy mother was Czech and I have a deep appreciation for the persecution the Catholic Chruch went through after the Communists took over Czechoslovakia in 1948. I appreciate your sharing this story about this saintly Viet Namese priest. Now I have another modern Catholic and victim of Communism to honor, respect, and for look to for inspiration. I wish Jane Fonda who claims to be “Christian” today would read this story. After all, she and her left wing ilk supported the Communist thugs who persecuted this man and the Catholic Church and other Christians churches as well as Buddhists in South Viet Nam before and after it’s fall to Communism. We must pray for our brother and sister Catholics in China and for all other Christians there too who are persecuted by their government which so many in the West are infatuated with these days..
Report Post »SpankDaMonkey
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:33pm.
Report Post »The People have Spoken……
Al J Zira
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:28pmSo there is no Catholic Church in China. You can;t have a Catholic Church and seperate yourself from the Holy See, that’s not how it works.
Report Post »beans bullets and bandaids
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 8:08amThat is only partially correct. While it is true that the “Official Chinese Catholic Church” being separated from Rome makes them not actually Catholic, there is a highly persecuted remnant of real Catholics who operate underground.
Report Post »NotFooled
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:47pm@beans bullets and bandaids this is true. There are an estimated 30 million underground Catholics in China. The Church survived multiple reigns of various Caesar’s in Europe by going underground. China is grasping at straws.
Report Post »Cold War Vet
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:27pmState-controlled economy. State controlled internet, State controlled media. State controlled Catholic church. Next up, Chinese government-approved state-appointed Pope. The Chinese (government at least) sure seems to like state control!
Unfortunately, there are many people over here in the Land of the Free and Home of the Brave who seem to be envious of that “state run” model. No thanks!
Report Post »Komponist-ZAH
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:58amThe correct term would be:
Report Post »http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-pope
frustratedwithgovt
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:16pmThis is precisely why Separation of Church and State is so important in the US. Not to keep the church out of the state but to keep the state out of the church. Church of England meet Church of China.
Report Post »NickDeringer
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:08pmJust got through reading “Bonhoeffer: Pastor, Martyr, Prophet, Spy”. Very good book. It chronicles how the Nazis set up their own church and used it to legitimize what they were doing to the Jews.
Sounds eerily familiar.
Report Post »Rayblue
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:17pmHadn’t heard of it.
Report Post »I’ll check it out.
TheGreyPiper
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:05pmThe Chinese Catholic Church, so-called, has been disconnected from Rome and a puppet of the Reds for a long time now. Hey, what did Holder just say about enforcing civil rights in all our churches?
And hey — just this once — could we keep this thread from turning into a Catholic-bashing party?
Report Post »TheCenturion
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:07pmCommunists are atheists anyway, so why bother having a government run church of any kind in China?
Report Post »banjarmon
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:20pmKEY WORD state Run
Report Post »Al J Zira
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:27pm@TheCenturion: Because the state wants it’s cut of the money the “church” brings in.
Report Post »Nobamazone
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:27pmExactly banjarmon
Report Post »ILUVAMERICA
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:28pm‘O’mam will try it here next
Report Post »White House Executive Order on Rural Council !!!
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/37812
Okie from Muskogee
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:54pmOne of the last places on Earth the Vatican has not broken into yet to gain control.
Isn’t the Vatican a State too?
Just a power struggle between two states to tell a church how to operate. Glad we have the ability to worship how we please here, for now….
Report Post »Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:56pm@The Centurion:
The Chinese government indeed is Atheist and Communist; they allow a state controlled and state answering church to act as a safety valve for some of their people, and also to give the APPERANCE of religious tolerance to the world…even when they are just another extention of the government and party of China itself.
In China form and apperance are substance made into their view of reality and of control. This is of course a simplification of the matter, I know, research the rest out online or at the library.
Or if you have relations or friends (as I do) ask about the mainland if they are willing to do so.
Report Post »ying
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:04pmIt’s not really a Catholic church. When China turned communist, the Chinese jews killed the Catholic priests who did not comply with the evolution theory, which goes against Catholic and all other Christian beliefs!
Report Post »USAMEDIC3008
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:08pmwhats the problem , they appointed their own God. whats a Bishop??????????
Report Post »PATTY HENRY
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:11pmAs a CONVERT to Catholicism I find this sad. The Christians know what’s up. The silly governments can do anything they want, they die, GOD does not. He can deal with them. In the meantime, I’ll pray for all in this world who 1) don’t know GOD 2) Know Him but can’t worship Him the way they want to and 3) the poor souls who think they can control God.
Report Post »sooner12
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:16pm@ OKIE…..
You just couldn’t resist could you. Shame.
Report Post »Okie from Muskogee
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:31pm@Sooner12
what said is “shame”?
I simply stated truth, a fact. No shame, just living in reality. Both are States.
Report Post »docgreen
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:42pmHuge 7.4 Earthquake just hit Alaska!
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:48pmYep, Communists are Religionists, anyway. They hide behind other groups!
Report Post »ChristianLayman
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:52pm@USAMEDIC3008
whats the problem , they appointed their own God. whats a Bishop?
Oh for pity’s sake.
“To all the saints in Christ Jesus who are in Philippi, with the BISHOPS and DEACONS:” (Phil. 1:1, NKJV)
“A BISHOP then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach:” (1 Tim 3:2, NKJV)
“For a BISHOP must be blameless, as a steward of God, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money,” (Titus 1:7, NKJV)
This is from a Protestant translation, the New King James Version. I purposely stayed away from any Catholic translations to negate any nonsensical claims of “bias”.
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:01amying stated….
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 11:04pm
Where’s the proof????
Report Post »fastfacts
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:22amHow can a communist country organize a religion. Britain had a state church but they weren’t communists.
Glenn’s church actually has a good repore in China. Though they are not allowed to teach the chinese people they like the relationship with them.
While talking about communists, isn’t it great that we live in this great nation. Something that really makes this nation great is our constitution. The left is always attacking the constitution. First there was the CNN host that wanted to change it:http://tiny.cc/kemm9 . Now TIME magazine wants to shred it as on their cover: http://tiny.cc/0×10h
Report Post »USAMEDIC3008
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:24amCHRISTIANLAYMAN
Report Post »Sorry I thought we were talking about
CHINA
Old Truckers
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 12:35amWhen a church gets in bed with a government,,,,,,expect the worst.
Report Post »clarkm
Posted on June 24, 2011 at 9:11amInteresting discussion. You should post your viewpoints about this on http://www.whitehousevoice.com!
Report Post »RJO
Posted on June 25, 2011 at 1:57pmResponse to:
Okie from Muskogee
Posted on June 23, 2011 at 10:54pm
One of the last places on Earth the Vatican has not broken into yet to gain control.
Isn’t the Vatican a State too?
Just a power struggle between two states to tell a church how to operate. Glad we have the ability to worship how we please here, for now….
Sorry…through previous posts and in the latest post….this troller from Oklahoma is giving Oklahoma an image that it does not deserve. At every opportunity – good old Okie displays his blatant anti-Catholic bigotry.
Save it for the trash publications that exist solely for that purpose and stop wasting Blaze space. You disagree with something…fine – stop reinforcing the stereotype you routinely present on this site. Funny how the protesters of faith have thousands of protests within the protest movement…its a cycle of fracture and your difficulties do not lie at the doorstep of the Catholic Church.
Report Post »Buttercup
Posted on June 25, 2011 at 1:54pmYou mean “Bolsheviks?” Just trying to get this right.
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