Faith

Christian Fined & Sentenced to 60 Days in Jail Over AZ Home Bible Studies

We’ve told you before about government regulations hampering home Bible studies, but this story is even more pervasive, perplexing and complicated than the others. Michael Salman, who lives in Phoenix, Ariz., has been sentenced to a startling 60 days in jail, given a $12,180 fine and granted three years probation for refusing to stop hosting Bible studies at his home. Why, you ask? He‘s apparently in violation of the city’s building code laws.

(Related: Calif. City Changes Zoning Code to Allow Home Bible Study After Couple Was Fined)

City officials claim that he’s running an operation that is reminiscent of a home church — but without the required permits. And according to Fox’s Todd Starnes, Phoenix court documents show that he violated 67 codes. Unless the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals grants an emergency injunction, he will be jailed as early as next week.

Naturally, Salman believes the court’s findings amount to a crackdown on faith and religion. The city maintains that the penalties are legitimate based on the zoning laws he and his family have violated. However, Starnes was apparently unable to reach the Phoenix prosecutor’s office, the mayor’s office or code enforcement to obtain further comment.

“They’re cracking down on religious activities and religious use. They’re attacking what I, as a Christian, do in the privacy of my home,” he said in an interview with Starnes. “If I had people coming to my home on a regular basis for poker night or Monday Night Football, it would be permitted. But when someone says to us we are not allowed to gather because of religious purposes, that is when you have discrimination.”

Michael Salman Sentenced to 60 Days in Jail Over Home Bible Studies

The building in question

Starnes goes on to provide an overview that recaps how the dispute first started between Salman and the city:

The long-running feud between Salman and the City of Phoenix culminated in the summer of 2009 when nearly a dozen police along with city inspectors raided their home. Armed with a search warrant, police confined the Salman family to the living room as they combed the property looking for violations.

Salman is the owner of Mighty Mike’s Burgers — and he is also an ordained pastor. He and his wife have been hosting Bible studies on their 4.6-acre property since 2005. The gatherings were originally attended by as many as 15 people.

In 2007, they received a letter from the city informing them that the Bible studies were not permitted in their living room because it was in violation of the construction code.

A few months later, members of the Phoenix Fire Dept. broke up the family’s Good Friday fellowship. As many as 20 people were in their backyard eating a meal when firefighters threatened to call the police – unless their guests left the premises.

Watch Salman and his wife discuss their legal battle, below:

And this was only the beginning. In 2008, the fire department came back again, and Salman ordered officials off of his property. The town then decided to ignore him — that is until he and his family built a structure in their backyard. The family, having secured the proper building permits, then moved the Bible studies to this new building.

It was then that the real drama unfolded. Officials came in and found 67 code violations. From a failure to post exit signs to a lack of handicap signs, Phoenix officials left no stone unturned. Now, the Christian Bible-study leader could spend some time behind bars — unless federal judges intervene.

Read more about his struggle on Fox News Radio.

Comments (614)

1 2 3 ... 17
  • Too_Far_Gone
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:55pm

    Keep taking it and they’re going to keep giving it.

    Too_Far_Gone  
    • HKS
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:56pm

      If he had been hosting orgies would the same thing have happened? How about a basket weaving party? Maybe a summer barbque ? Where would it end?

      Report Post » HKS  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:07pm

      It ends when the local Government realizes that their is an Limit to their Power.

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • RANGER1965
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:13pm

      I‘ve always admired Glenn Beck’s belief that a liberty based revolution could occur here in America without violence, without bloodshed. A sort of quiet, dignified evolution in thinking.

      But I fear that Jefferson was correct when he said, “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.”

      But this rational revolution would require a rational population. It would require men and women that could be convinced. I no longer believe that is possible.

      RANGER1965  
    • Lee_in_PA
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:24pm

      Only one way to shoe them their limits.. Same way George III learned it. 1776 .. again.

      Report Post » Lee_in_PA  
    • Ari Ben TZion
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:36pm

      Not to worry – I’m sure the Bolshevik, A.C.L.A.SS-H&%$’s will run to his defense.

      Report Post » Ari Ben TZion  
    • dgktowntx
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:40pm

      No constitution tells you that you cant have 20 people in your home..fed or state…its a private home…doesnt have to have exit signs…or wheel chair ramps..its my right not to invite the hadicapped to my home..do we no longer have the right to say who can be in our homes and who cant…dont care if you invite 100 people….this is crap….Im sure the law making communist aszzhooosss have parties and fund raisers at their homes…they dont get raided they dont have signs..ramps..yip must be an attack on christians…I bet if you go up the chain high enough to see is putting the force behind this treatment…I bet you will find they probably dont go to church at all…

      Report Post » dgktowntx  
    • Treaty
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:57pm

      Need the ACLJ to get involved here.

      Report Post » Treaty  
    • Thomas
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:01pm

      Gonna have to break out the guillotines I guess?

      Report Post » Thomas  
    • I support God's Israel!
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:07pm

      I will NOT comply, government.

      WE, THE PEOPLE, WILL NOT COMPLY. Where can I contribute to their attorney fees?

      Report Post » I support God's Israel!  
    • boomboom
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:27pm

      Keep giving it
      and He’s gonna make a fortune
      of a $ettlement.

      $ue — not just another proper noun!

      Report Post » boomboom  
    • Anadara
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:38pm

      This is clearly un-warranted presecution and a violation of his 1st Amendment Rights. Those bureaucrats in Phoenix should be sued individually for tyanny under the colorof law.

      Report Post » Anadara  
    • Prosecute_Constitutional_Treason_In_Washington
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:38pm

      Many churches today have closed down Sunday school in favor of Life Groups which are weekly home based Bible study meetings of couples. Is this any different.

      I want to point out Christians are at fault for not affecting this world as salt and light. Christians have failed their God in voting only for moral leaders. Moral leaders enact moral laws and use reasonable interpretations without twisting the definitions of the laws. This is the fault of Christians as evil has always been present but the difference is Christians in the past stood up for God’s moral code and His teachings. Christian just keep hiding and you and your family is headed to a FEMA camp in time.

      Report Post » Prosecute_Constitutional_Treason_In_Washington  
    • BJC
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:40pm

      Where can we send money to help this man? We are going to have to support freedom lovers like him if we are to survive. He needs to use the argument stated in story. What’s the difference if someone has a a group of people over for cards every Saturday?

      Report Post »  
    • kaydeebeau
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:46pm

      One of the saddest thing is that it is before the 9th Circus. Do we want to start a pool or take wagers as to how this “court” will rule?

      Report Post » kaydeebeau  
    • nightlight
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:49pm

      I know these people personally. It is true that cities need zoning laws- but one should be able to have 20 or even 30 people over to your house for a meal (or Superbowl party) without the threat of search warrants, fines, and jail. If we continue to give up our freedoms, now evermore tenuous, we will have none left. If we do not stand with those under fire- we do not deserve to use their water hose to put our own fires out.

      Report Post » nightlight  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:59pm

      @Prosecute – No – we haven’t failed as Christians. We haven’t hidden. When I was a child Christianity was in EVERYBODY’s every day life. It was in the home, in the school, on TV and in the church.

      The left are driven by satan. Satan is not stupid. Where do you thing they got the idea to flood towns cities and states across the country (remember, it’s taken them 100 years to do this) and then vote like minded people into office to sloooooowly strip us of our traditions and rights. Once they’ve destroyed an area and have their people entrenched they move on to the next town and the next.

      Meanwhile, they’ve gotten all their people into positions of power in the schools and universities to brainwash our children – to steal them from the faith. They’ve even corrupted the practice of law to use as a weapon against us. ALL of this is to promote the ungodly – the devilish worship that has pretty much destroyed our country.

      Add to that affirmative action and we now have a standing army (the police) that do not protect the public or keep the peace. They enforce tyranny.

      Report Post »  
    • Truthbeliever2
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:38pm

      If George Washington were alive today he would say: “this isn’t the United States of America.” He would also say: “It obviously no longer exists; so you might as well change the name of this God forsaken country.” He might also say: “How dare you slander the name of a once great nation by using it to identify this place.”

      I agree with what he would say…

      Report Post » Truthbeliever2  
    • hpyagl
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 7:02pm

      I started reading this article with sympathy toward this guy, then I did a little more research on this Salman guy and I started taking sympathy for “the other side”. I can forgive the fact that Salman was once convicted for participation in a drive by shooting as well as a more recent bit of impersonating a police officer but I get the idea this is another case of a type A “I am Christian” load mouth that thinks everybody should think like him or else “you’re not a good Christian”. I would be upset with loud “contemporary Christian music” blasted over amps in my neighborhood and carloads(not 15 to 20) of people rolling into the neighborhood to whoop it up for Christ. Freedom to worship is one thing, but stepping on others to do it is another thing completely. This kind of stuff makes Christians look like arrogant load mouths!

       
    • NLN
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 7:07pm

      Whatever people do in their own homes is not any ones business besides the homeowner. Just when is this government telling every move we can make BS going to stop.

      Report Post »  
    • Dr Vel
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:03pm

      From Virginia “The left are driven by satan. Satan is not stupid. Where do you thing they got the idea to flood towns cities and states across the country (remember, it’s taken them 100 years to do this) and then vote like minded people into office to sloooooowly strip us of our traditions and rights. Once they’ve destroyed an area and have their people entrenched they move on to the next town and the next.”

      Carry this thought to the logical conclusion and you have described the locust army spoken of in the Word. Just add the muslim and south of the border invasion forces. What you described is exactly what locusts do, consume everything until there is nothing left but them. Yet another prophecy of the end of days shouting to all with wisdom where in the timeline of Revelations we really are. I left Phoenix 4 years ago after living there for 30 years. I had had enough of the daily increasing level of violence and crime. Why work all day to come home and find your hard earned treasures stolen by those to sell at pawnshops on their way to get their welfare and after their drug deals go out and party. Said party ending when gunfire forces them to scurry back to their government housing.

      I loved my desert and really miss it but until the Lord returns and restores His system of government I see no other way out. When you see a tornado coming your way only an arrogant fool would stand there in defiance of forces beyond the abilities of a mere mortal to control.

      Report Post »  
    • acovenantinblood
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:08pm

      What if he were Muslim?

      Report Post » acovenantinblood  
    • HappyStretchedThin
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:18pm

      @Hpyagl
      I had to hunt a while to get the other side of the story you were talking about. The sources are all suspect (personal testimony from biased people with an ax to grind against a neighbor that could be making it all up, nothing backed up with a source), but it’s here for the reading: http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/Opinion/052216-2009-06-22-prayer-police-strike-again-the-rest-of-the-story.htm
      From my own reading, I think neighbors need to chill out, I think judges need to back all the way off, and I think Salman needs to make sure he’s being a true Christian and being honest about his intentions (is it a quiet home bible study with people seated around a table, or is it a full service party with loud music and dancing?), and rendering to Caesar what is Caesar’s (in other words, if there are laws on the books about the number of people you can have on private property without disturbing anyone, just comply and if the law’s unjust, make your case and ask the people to change it).
      Christians should have no reason to be rowdy and provocative, but govt should have no right to limit peaceable association and religious speech. Be examples of the believers while boldly opening your mouth. That’s what the scriptures condone, imho.

      Report Post » HappyStretchedThin  
    • TreeTrimmerJim
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:03pm

      To the neighbors…

      First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out–
           because I was not a communist; (red shirts)
      Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out–
           because I was not a socialist; (brown shirts… night of the long knives)
      Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out–
           because I was not a trade unionist;
      Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out–
           because I was not a Jew;
      Then they came for me–
           and there was no one left to speak out for me. –Martin Niemöller, WWII era German

      Report Post » TreeTrimmerJim  
    • drclyde7
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:05pm

      This head line looks like something out of a tabloid. These are not home Bible studies. This is a building constructed in the back yard to hold Bible studies.

      Report Post »  
    • GodNcountry1776
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:14pm

      All Christians everywhere better stand up for this pastor, because persecution only starts with one individual’s rights.
      My wife and I pray in our home are we going to jail as well, because apparently where 2 or more gather for worship under building codes is illegal.
      Governor Brewer better ride in on her White Horse and put the city officials in place along with the Judge that made this call! I can assure you that if these elected officials do nothing they will not be re-elected!
      God bless America and Pastor Salman God Bless you sir you are in my prayers. I pray that all the other churches in Phoenix and in the United States step up to the plate to defend your rights and their rights as we know Christians are being persecuted more and more today in a country that was founded on Christianity and religious freedoms.

      Report Post » GodNcountry1776  
    • ohnomrbill
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:25pm

      I thought Arizona was the land of the free, isn’t there law makers mustly Republican?

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:28pm

      This is how they started it in Europe and Canada. They framed it under hate crimes against gays and if a preacher read from the bible they actually jailed them. For about 6 months. That shut them up. Now it’s a free for all zone (muslims exempt) and Christians have been totally driven underground.

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:35pm

      @Dr Vel – I left California (my birth place) for the same reason. I thought I was a flaming liberal, until I moved east and discovered people with common sense. I liked that and reaslized I had been looking for the Mayberry of my youth. Back in the 60‘sw Mayberry wasn’t a foreign country – we had in the Bay Area in California. I just didn’t realize it was being destroyed before my eyes as a child.

      I live in Virginia now and will hopefully never leave it – they have common sense. And Yes – I’m a Christian and see the Signs.

      Report Post »  
    • Dr Vel
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 9:41pm

      While the issue is complex and in part I side with him, not liking big bro intervention nor the typical swat response to jaywalking becoming the police norm today. However he is supposed to be an ambassador for Christ and he is being a very crappy one to say the least. This is a high end neighborhood meaning people spent very large sums of money for their home each with their own dreams of living peacefully in their own castle. Agreed this need to respect your neighbors is money independent, I point it out to enhance the perspective of how much others invested in their own dream of a home as a further aggravation on this guy’s part. Christ spoke clearly about matters such as this and clearly the large crowds within earshot of others with rights in their private homes can only be construed to mean this guy is indeed ‘in the way’ for the purpose of the scriptures below. This man is not behaving in a Christ like manner to his neighbors.

      Matt 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.

      26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
      KJV

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 10:04pm

      @Tree – What a fallacy! It’s been the Socialists and the Communists that have been coming after the Christians the whole time. You can’t destroy a country until you destroy their link to their past and their God first. That‘s what they did in Russia and what they’ve done in Europe.

      Better still is saying somthing like: They came for the smokers first and I said nothing nothing because I did not smoke. Them they came for the sugar eaters and I said nothing because I did not eat sugar. Then they came for the fat eaters and I said nothing because I did not eat fat. Then they came for the soda drinkers and I said nothing because I didn’t drink soda. Then they came for those who put salt in their food and I said nothing because I thought, why not? Then they came for the Jews because they are the problem with the whole world and I said nothing because, well, sure, Jews are real successful so they probably did something wrong. Then they came for the bankers and I said nothing because they must be Jews. Then they came for the car dealers and I said nothing because I didn’t care. Then they came for the white people and I said nothing because, well, I‘m bored and I’m busy with by ipad. Then they came for the middle class and even though I‘m part of the middle class I just don’t really care to engage anymore. Then they came for the Christians and I’m really part of those who are coming for them at this point – so what is your point?

      That is how it really goes…..Goodby

      Report Post »  
    • justangry
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 10:04pm

      Jury nullification. You all do what you need to do to serve whoever you believe in, as long as it doesn’t deprive anyone else their freedoms. I‘ll hang any jury I’m on that strips any of you of your constitutional rights. We all should look out for one another this way.

      Report Post » justangry  
    • Grey Eagle
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 10:28pm

      Many churches have small group ministries in various homes. I believe they have plenty of land not to be a problem. Obviously the City is going way too far and it is harassment of the worst kind. Glad I don’t live there.

      Report Post »  
    • Jimbo65
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 10:42pm

      HKS, only gay orgies would be permissible.

      Report Post »  
    • SLWilliams44
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 12:29am

      What is next? Taking our Bibles? The Christians need to band together and stand up for our freedoms that has been fought for by many including my father who fought in the Army through three wars to give us the right to have Bible studies in our homes or worship freely. How dare the government try to silence the Christians or dictate to us about the privacy of our homes when it comes to Bible studies! I much rather have Bible studies going on instead of a bunch of drunks throwing parties and getting out of hand causing harm to others around them. I wonder if the White House has to have permits to throw their so called charity events with alcohol being served and music blaring out loudly? Wake up Christians! We are in the end times when government thinks they can silence the Word of God going forth!!!

      Report Post »  
    • Mikeyyy
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 12:51am

      All I can say is this is really sick. An attack on religious freedoms. If this guy had been a drug dealer, he would have stood a better chance of being overlooked. I‘m surprised in a Red State that the Governor and Senators aren’t coming to his aid more. Where’s the governor?

      Report Post »  
    • jcvillar
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 1:47am

      We have been taking it and they have kept giving it. Hop in your time machine and go back 50 or 100 years and hand a copy of this article to the first American you meet. What do you think their reaction might be?

      Report Post »  
    • ISRAELISOURFRIEND
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 2:28am

      IF YOUR A MUSLIM AND BLOW UP AIRLINERS AND KILL AMERICANS THEN IT’S OKAY. CHRISTIANITY IS A CRIME IN AMERICA THANKS TO C.A.I.R.

      OUR ELECTED LEADERS HAVE JOINED THE OCCULT OF THE BOHEMIAN GROVE

      ACCEPTED THE SATANIC NEW WORLD ORDER

      ACCEPT A MUSLIM PRESIDENT

      CHRISTIANS AND AMERICA NEEDS TO WAKE UP

      THERE IS NO STOPPING THE COMING OF THE BEHEADING OF PATRIOTIC CHRISTIAN AMERICANS. JUST KNOW WE SHOULD BE AT PEACE THAT THE BEHEADING OF THE BELIEVERS IS THE SEED THAT COMMANDS CHRISTS RETURN.

      APOLLYON 2012.

      a must read!

      Report Post » ISRAELISOURFRIEND  
    • jdickiso
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 3:47am

      I think my favorite response to this whole situation is comparing it to the recent immigration issue and ruling. So….someone who entered the country illegally, evades taxes for years, uses a stolen identity, drives a car illegally with no “real” license or issuance, uses public service (trash pickup, school, etc.) illegally, steals entitlements from ACTUAL taxpayers, funnels loads of money out of the country and knowingly hides others from the law and encourages friends and family to also come here illegally (that’s aiding and abetting criminals folks)……they’re fine….don’t enforce any laws against them….but let’s punish a legal tax payer for not upholding zoning laws when he invites friends over.

      ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?! How much time and energy, and tax payer money have been used against this guy? How many times did law enforcement come over? How much time was spent accruing warrants in court? How much time was spent before a judge? How much state paperwork had to be filed and processed. I guarantee the city has spent over $15,000 of taxpayer money to enforce stupid zoning laws on this one guy. But illegal aliens…nope, they’re all just hard working, decent, sweet people trying to better their lives and their children’s lives. It obviously compares in no way to a legal taxpayer who get’s together with friends to teach about love and compassion.

      MAN WE ARE MESSED UP…..and we are in so much trouble.

      Report Post » jdickiso  
    • TomSawyer
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 4:44am

      I don’t remember ever giving the government the right ignore the “or prohibiting the free exercise thereof” part of the 1st Amendment.

      Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances

      Report Post »  
    • MacGuyver
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 6:07am

      A little short on details. It’s not a simple bible study. This guy has a church sign out front with a religious message on it. I don‘t mind that but it’s not appropriate in a residential neighborhood. As an ordained pastor of some religious organization holding gatherings 3 times per week is more than just poker night. It’s more than Monday night football, more like Monday, Wednesday and Saturday. Is this pastor operating as a non profit religious organization for tax purposes and is he collecting any donations at any time. If so then he is a religious organization and needs to follow proper protocol as such. He has set himself up for more than a ‘freedom of assembly’ issue. You can’t set up a casino for poker or bingo night at your home either.

      Report Post » MacGuyver  
    • historyguy48
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 7:06am

      Comrades he made one little mistake, it wasn’t a Mosque!

      Report Post » historyguy48  
    • HowardSternIsABigot
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 7:14am

      wake up christians, its already too late, you let them brainwash your children. Stand for what you believe. For Gods sake if nothing else tyeach them what FREEDOM really means.

      Report Post »  
    • EJ1979
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 9:34am

      There comes a time when voting will no longer get the job done.

      Report Post » EJ1979  
    • Secret Squirrel
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 10:12am

      .
      I keep saying this:
      When will Americans learn to fight back?
      Do you want to wait until there’s a boot on your neck?

      Report Post » Secret Squirrel  
    • little big man
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 10:17am

      sounds like a witch hunt to me. if the guy had the proper building permits where was the city building inspector while the structure was going up????? the code enforcement guy should have told him you need to do this here or that their.
      Sorry the city dropped the ball and sounds like a vendeta agains this guy.

      Report Post » little big man  
    • sinsay7
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 10:30am

      libs actually believe the government helps people.

      Report Post »  
    • old white guy
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 10:33am

      i’m pretty sure Christ said to sell your cloak to buy a sword if you did not have one. talk will not secure freedom without action.

      Report Post »  
    • teapartybellringer
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 11:15am

      First they came for the catholics…..—now where have I heard something like that before. The world has gone mad. Those of us with faith, would be wise to now cleave to our Saviour–you know the One secularists mock us for. I pray for them.
      The republic is dead–LONG LIVE THE REPUBLIC, but as a nation we have turned away from God. God listens. As a nation we asked God to get out of our lives–NOT a wise decision
      Not sure who said it, but one if the best tricks the devil ever pulled was to get people to believe he doesn’t exist. Secularists relish sitting in judgment of others, but sadly that’s why they have such a problem with God, they want to be the authority. Repentance for sins is foreign to them
      They don’t know, or have never been taught that humility is not weakness, but restrained strength in the face of evil.
      I pray for this man & his family–and for us all.
      IN GOD WE TRUST!!
      Let freedom ring!
      Faith–which happens to be my real first name. But the greatest of these is LOVE.

      Report Post »  
    • .338-06
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 11:18am

      Come on folks, get a grip on reality. The guy is a crappy neighbor and an annoyance to the folks who have to live next to him. Seriously, would you want to live next door to that? The guy is not a hero and this is not a giant left wing conspiracy. Do a little research.

      By the way Blaze, I am a big fan of you and Glenn but I am getting a little annoyed how you seem to tease a story like this and write it in a way that makes it appear to be an all out attack on our constitutional freedom. And how about you stop with the stupid pop ups?

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 11:32am

      12,180?

      What a weird fine.

      Report Post »  
    • The Giver
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 1:11pm

      They should contact Jay Sekulow ( ACLJ) and see how quickly these incompetent atheists change their tune. They need a better lawyer. Worship of God has to be made unlawful in order for government to grow. No mystery here. All communist countries are atheists. Nothing against people who choose not to believe and respect others’ rights to believe.

      Report Post » The Giver  
    • teaisstronger
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 1:37pm

      If he applies for permits the town will say NO because his home would then be tax exempt. Communist America is attacking religion.

      Report Post »  
    • teaisstronger
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 1:39pm

      If he invites 500 people every week to his house for Bible Study then we could under stand why the town is upset. Oh, its not 500 how many people is it?

      Report Post »  
    • rickc34
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 2:08pm

      It is time to stand with GOD or lye with the Devil. I choose GOD.

      Report Post »  
    • antiprogressive
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 5:20pm

      HYPAGL –
      I KNEW there was another side to this.
      I suspected the obvious – although ommitted – things like no building permits.
      That alone can get you 10 violations in a hurry.
      No running water.
      Incorrect foundation.
      No conduit around wiring.
      Etc.

      Add to that the fact that he has a LOT of people there that COULD get hurt if this thing catches fire
      or falls in and you have MORE problems.
      Businesses must have businesss licenses and insurance, handicap accessibility (mentioned) and other things that a residence does not.
      If he has taken this above private residence status to the point he has parking problems then his neighbors have become pissed off.
      Add loud music, noisy religious rants and I ask – how many of US would want him next door?

      I‘m sure I can’t have 30 illegal mexicans building PRODUCTS in my backyard – even if it were strictly for CHARITY – and the neighbors would be pissed if I tried.

      This story is NOT about religion or the crackdown thereof.
      It is written with sufficient LACK of information on the details and harps on “BIBLE STUDIES” as the Keyword to get people pissed off –
      and it DID do that.

      It amazes ME how many people will blindly believe anything they read and assume the worst.

      Don’t get me wrong – I BELIEVE in God – but don’t attend.
      I LOVE America but hate lawyers and politicians and what they have done to us.

      Thank You HYPAGL for doing your OWN research before “shooting off” at the mouth and believing the FIRST si

      Report Post »  
    • MetalPatriot
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 5:22pm

      Building codes in order to have a gathering? What about all the pinata parties around the country that violate zoning & noise regulations?

      Neither one should be “regulated”.

      He needs to kick the butts of the idiot neighbors & city officials. Lot’s of dessert to help things naturally decompose.

      Report Post » MetalPatriot  
    • PubliusPencilman
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 6:06pm

      Hahahahaa.

      One guy in Arizona (clearly not a bastion of Godless socialism) gets dinged by the law when he refuses to abide by local authorities and insists on throwing raucous gatherings that impact their neighbors’ quality of life, and suddenly lots of you Blazers are crying TYRANNY!

      It would be funny, if it weren’t so disrespectful to those throughout history who have actually been the victims of persecution and state-sponsored violence.

      Give it a rest goofballs. Christians are just fine in this country. They are NOT persecuted by the government. Plain and simple.

      Report Post »  
    • Brooke Lorren
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 6:17pm

      If I lived in the city of Phoenix (I live close, but not under their jurisdiction), the next time I invited friends over, I’d record a video of us reading a Bible verse and send it in to the mayor.

      They can’t stop us all.

      Report Post »  
    • antiprogressive
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 8:04pm

      METALPATRIOT

      I agree that none of it SHOULD be regulated but it IS regulated.
      Knowing I can’t add 6 rooms to my house without a permit is important here.
      IF he built a rackety shack in the back yard – I don’t know what it looks like – and then puts 30 people in it, it could fall or catch fire or whatever. Happens all the time.
      People die, relatives sue.
      They sue the owner of the shack and the CITY for NOT requiring it be built to code.
      The city doesn‘t want to be sued over and over for stupid people’s inability to
      build a worthwhile structure so they inevitably make laws and codes etc.
      Those are the FACTS.

      The STUPID people of the world are the CAUSE for all the laws and codes,
      followed by the greedy who SUE everyone they can because THEY were too stupid
      to KNOW the shack was a fire hazard.

      And once a law / code is in place, it must be followed or fines will be levied.

      Again. I don’t LIKE laws and codes, as I am not the suing TYPE.
      But I am smart enough to know that these very laws and codes must be followed –
      no matter WHAT you use the structure for.

      Report Post »  
    • NeneGuapo
      Posted on July 8, 2012 at 9:38am

      I‘ll bet you if it was the mafia they’ll be scared out of their pants and NEVER report it

      Report Post » NeneGuapo  
    • truthteacher1
      Posted on July 8, 2012 at 7:51pm

      This pastor and business owner should know better. He is in violation of a variety of codes-building, fire and LIfe Safety, he‘s in violation of zoning ordinances and he’s being persecuted for being a Christian and having a home Bible study? Give me a break. This appears to be an ongoing situation with him being of the opinion that churches and their pastors are not required to comply with building codes, fire codes or anything else they choose to ignore under the guise of separation of church and state. The Constitution says that Congress shall make no law establishing a state/national religion. It does Not say that churches and their pastors are exempt from meeting building and fire codes as well as complying with zoning requirements. Get real. He’s not been singled out for being a Christian. He’s being forced to pay for failure to comply with what others must comply in terms of codes and requirements.
      Disclaimer: I am a Fire Inspector, Insurance Inspector, a member of the National Fire Protection Association and a Licensed Master Electrician as well as being a pastor of a church. I have no sympathy for those who think they should be exempt from complying with codes that exist for the safety of all.

      Report Post »  
    • kohog
      Posted on July 8, 2012 at 10:30pm

      Knee jerk reaction is usually always to be on the defensive in these types of situations, however, first course of action should ALWAYS be to seek the LORD. He just may have something else in mind – like – witnessing Christ to a person or persons who will be in that jail only during those 60 days. His ways are not ours. Also, our fight is not about physical liberty, a Christian’s freedom is inside, of the heart, in Christ we are always free so if someone chucks us in jail we can be free while in jail! While on the subject, let’s just emphasize that despite what might APPEAR to be losses of Christian freedoms to tyranny may not be. God is always on the throne and His plan is working perfectly – evil must wax worse – but He has His people and when the time is right He will move (through them.)

      Report Post »  
    • fireoasis
      Posted on July 9, 2012 at 5:20pm

      We, the people, have created this problem with building laws, and rules and requirements. We have asked that buildings be safe, that homeowners/business owners be responsible for those who enter their home. We have asked that our neighbors be held accountable for things they do that disturb us. That is what is happening here. It has NOTHING to do with hindering this mans religion. His neighbors have reported him for noise on many occasions. The parking on his street is not adequate to hold the number of people he invites into his home. This overflows into his neighbors and makes it unpleasant for them. They have just as much right to a peaceful home as he does to practice his religion. If he wishes to keep his bible study groups to 4-6 cars worth of people and keep the noise down I am sure the city would not care. However this man refuses to do this. The building he put up, while he got a permit does not meet the building code requirements for what he is using it for. As an example you can’t use a shed as a home, especially in AZ without proper air conditioning you could kill people. (I don’t know if that is his violation I am only giving an example) We are only given HIS version of the story and only the parts he wants to share. So before everyone jumps on the religion is being crushed band wagon, why not wait to see what he is truly being accused of doing. Other stories in AZ have made it clear his meetings are far from quiet gatherings.

      Report Post »  
    • catspaw41
      Posted on July 11, 2012 at 4:30pm

      “Give unto Ceasar, what is caesar’s. Give unto God what is Gods” They should have educated themselves before taking on a venture like that.

      Report Post »  
    • TCRipley
      Posted on July 15, 2012 at 2:21pm

      There is something important missing in this story: I would like to know exactly what the violations are and how hard it would be to upgrade his property. I do not like government interferring in peoples lives and freedom of conscience. This should be resolved without such an overkill punishment. Talk of such a simple solution is ominously absent. Typical of the radical left media and government.
      God bless America!

      Report Post »  
  • RugDog
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:53pm

    Our government now…..OFFICIALLY SUCKS!

    Report Post » RugDog  
    • HKS
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:18pm

      I must say I’m a little disappointed in Arizona for this kind of behavior, I thought they were above that but obviously not. They deserve what they get.

      Report Post » HKS  
    • Cavallo
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:46pm

      It’s Phoenix. There are areas that are different inside Arizona. Even parts that keep petitioning to break off and create their own little socialist utopia.

      Report Post » Cavallo  
    • Cesium
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:26pm

      I think If they were Jews, buddhists, or even satanists they would have been left alone. Christians out west are crazy! They’re libel to start a cult, kidnap 14 year olds, then burn it all down with a huge stand off involving SWAT and ATF teams. Nip it in the bud!

      Report Post »  
    • Oldbutnotsenile
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:39pm

      In response to hypagl, he lives on 4.6 acres, so I think he would have to have some pretty powerful amps to blast music over his neighborhood. It’s not like most houses in the city where you are so close, you can watch your neighbor’s TV. Think about it. Wait until all the facts are in.

      Report Post »  
    • lukerw
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:58pm

      Fascists, now… restrict… how many people that you can Invite over to your House!

      Report Post » lukerw  
    • MCDAVE
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 10:20am

      Does he charge money for this service?..If he does he’s running a business and must comply with building codes..If not than,bible studies in his home is his right.Its a private residence.

      Report Post »  
    • oneshiner
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 12:45pm

      Yep, make allowances for the muslims to have their 5x a day prayer group and that’s ok. Let a Christian have a bible study in their home and all HELL breaks loose.

      Are they going to go after the little old ladies who have their bridge parties each week?
      What about a mom having a cub scout meeting in her home? (I did this and didn’t get picked up for a cat & dog show of power)
      Guess I‘m going to have to tell my friends they can’t come see me or talk about GOD

      Report Post »  
  • paperpushermj
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:52pm

    I find it uncomfortable that he needs permission from the city in the form of Permits to exercise his 1st Amendment Rights. Now if the parking situation around the Home is getting out of hand he should be a good neighbor and respond with a work around.

    Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • NJBarFly
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:00pm

      Respond with a work around? You mean like holding his meetings in a more appropriate place, like a church, hall, restaurant, school, etc…?

      Report Post » NJBarFly  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:03pm

      OMG he lives on almost 5 acres of Land. No I thought more like car pooling

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:30pm

      njbarfly
      you seem to be of the opinion something illegal was going on at this house. Irrespective of subject do you think a modest number of people getting together on a regular legal basis is against the law. If it’s not a business being run out of the home, if it’s not a gambling or pot house or drug lab, if it’s doing nothing illegal …..what’s Your Beef? State why you are against it.

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • Cavallo
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:40pm

      There are no such thing as 1st amendment rights. You live in a benevolent autocracy. You must learn to accept the actions of your masters.

      Report Post » Cavallo  
    • I support God's Israel!
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:09pm

      I hold a study in my home weekly for about 42 people. I live in Ohio. TOO BAD.

      Come and get me. It is worth it to NOT COMPLY.

      Report Post » I support God's Israel!  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:06pm

      He has a 5 acre lot – this isn’t a parking or zoning issue. This is pure thuggary. Both the fire and police dept’s are enforcing tyranny. They are protecting no one. If this had been a family BBQ or a superbowl party serving LOTS of alcohol there would not have been any problem.

      Report Post »  
    • oneshiner
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 4:58pm

      What a piz-ant Fire Dept. in Phoenix. They came out and chased away about 20 people in the back yard having a BBQ. I’m sure they were following orders, but that goes way beyond the pale.

      So, as I get it, if we have a party with a bunch of people, we have to put up EXIT signs, etc? Somebody in that town is out to get that family. Can we help?

      Report Post »  
  • Best_Patriot
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:51pm

    Religious organizations may be exempt from paying taxes, but they’re not exempt from the law.

    Deal with it.

    Report Post » Best_Patriot  
    • Too_Far_Gone
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:53pm

      putz

      Report Post » Too_Far_Gone  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:58pm

      Just how do your words square with the Constitution?
      FYI his actions are of an individual not as an Organization as you claim.

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • progressiveslayer
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:59pm

      Hey horses A** the constitution trumps any rinky **** zoning law anywhere in this once free country.

      Report Post » progressiveslayer  
    • TEIN
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:06pm

      Illegal immigrants don’t pay taxes and are exempt from the law….

      Report Post »  
    • txjb
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:07pm

      best , it is a home bible study ! It’s all about shutting down the word of God . When it hits the fan you will be the first to cave .

      Report Post »  
    • Buddynoel
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:11pm

      In this case, Patriot is correct. Unless it is part of the Arizona Constitution, the national Constitution only says Congress shall make no law, not the City of Phoenix.

      Report Post » Buddynoel  
    • Soundstorm
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:19pm

      And we all remember what Mr. Bumble said about the law.

      Report Post » Soundstorm  
    • marcus_arealius
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:23pm

      Ever hear of BAD LAW? Apparently you are dumb enough to not give a damn.

      Report Post »  
    • Cavallo
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:43pm

      @Buddy, The First Amendment was incorporated to the States. It applies even to local governments, which is why schools cannot have mandatory prayer. Although since now there is no real constitution anymore that point is actually moot. Get used to your government deciding what you can and cannot do when where and how, what to think and what to believe and say.

      Report Post » Cavallo  
    • SquidVetOhio
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:58pm

      @BUDDYNOEL,
      Your forgetting about the freedom of assembly, unreasonable search and seizure, privacy rights, private property rights. Equal protection under the law. There’s way more than just freedom of religion at stake here. It‘s all fun and games until they don’t like what you‘re doing isn’t it?

      Report Post » SquidVetOhio  
    • kaydeebeau
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:45pm

      So how does this work then horses a**? If he had 15 people over to his house for ANY other activity, would the persecution be the same? If so, why? Do we no longer have the right to peaceablly assemble?

      Report Post » kaydeebeau  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:32pm

      He’s not a religious organization. He is an idividual who holds bible study at his home. He built an addition onto his property that is multi-purpose (rec room, etc) and one of those purposes is to allow people to come over and have bible study. This is not illegal. His building WAS to code. It only failed code if it was ruled an organized church – it wasn‘t but that’s how they chose to trap him. This is reaching and should bankrupt this dept if this guy chooses to sue.

      This is religious persecution and you should fear this because if they can go after this man for bible study then they can go after YOU for a BBQ.

      Report Post »  
    • Buddynoel
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 7:31pm

      You folk are missing the point. The City of Phoenix has a right to stop a worship service if it deems the service is violating safety and building codes. The Supreme Court has upheld the right for cities to enforce such laws in opposition to the religious interests of certain groups. Phoenix isn’t saying this couple has no right to their religion. It is up to locals to negotiate proper zoning and permits, which they apparently failed to do in this case.

      Report Post » Buddynoel  
    • Dr Vel
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:05pm

      What a liar you are with that name. You are not a patriot.

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 10:09pm

      @Buddy – No – the SC has not upheld any law that I know Of where you can’t practice your religion in our own home. This is a blatant violation of the Ist Amendment.

      Report Post »  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:46pm

      No one has asked but something got the hackles up in Phoenix. Just asking because I didn‘t see it in the story but does anyone know if their’s something strange about the Church and Bible Study that was the point of the story? Just asking!

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • trueamerican40
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 1:19am

      You‘re the type of person who believes that I shouldn’t own guns because guns kill people. Private property means private…why am I even arguing with Best_Patriot? He is clearly the Worst imaginable. Go to move to Russia!

      Report Post » trueamerican40  
    • smitty1007
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 11:47am

      Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

      Report Post »  
  • Talmid of Yeshua
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:50pm

    Even local governments can’t over-ride the U.S. Constitution or the First Amendment. This precedent has already been set.

    “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

    Report Post » Talmid of Yeshua  
    • Cavallo
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:49pm

      You forget we live in a nation of men, and not laws. It all depends on if the court wants to hear it. With the 9th circuit you’re unlikley to. Not only that, you cannot even count on the SCOTUS to defend you. Get used to living in a benevolent autocracy.

      Report Post » Cavallo  
    • nakedape
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:50pm

      No one is saying he can’t assemble, or practice, they are saying when you build a 4,200 sq ft building that you respect the freakin laws. How god damned stupid are you people to just read what the hack who wrote the story wants you to believe and just fall in line with your blind hate. Tools.

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:13pm

      @Naked – His building DID meet code. What the fire dept did was treat it not as an additional building on his private property, but as a commerical church. This is not legal. They were out of line. This man is not an organized church. He is an individual who holds bible study in his home. He added an additional building that could be considered a rec room for multi purposes. One of those purposes is to seat his bible study group comfortibly. That is not illegal.

      This man’s civil rights have been grossly violated.

      Report Post »  
    • DLV
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:43pm

      You do realize the first amendment involves states too right? If the states were exempt from all the amendments there would have been A LOT more violations of amendment rights by the states over the years. These were incorporated to government as a whole and not just on a federal level otherwise these would only be a half useful.

      You FAAAAAIILLLEDDD!

      Report Post » DLV  
  • mikedy
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:50pm

    I truly hope there is more to it than is written here. If this is the case, this a scary and illegal action by the city. Since when is it illegal to have people over and eat in your back yard? there has to be more than this…

    Report Post »  
    • Dougsopinion
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 6:11pm

      I e-mailed Jay Sekelow,and the ACLJ about this matter. If there is wrongdoing against this man and his family, he will be all over it. If there is foul play the other way, he won’t have anything to do with it. Soon we’ll know one way or the other. In the meantime read Acts 5:29 “ We must obey God rather than men”. Thats who I stand with. The GREAT I AM!!

      Report Post »  
  • tomloy
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:49pm

    No worries now folks! Now that this news has hit the major news outlets, you can expect the cockroaches to go scurry back to the darkness from which they came.

    Report Post »  
  • mike_trivisonno
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:49pm

    Hmm. I wonder how many times a day devout muslims quietly gather in their private homes.

    I would bet they are left alone. But by whose request and for what purpose?

    Report Post » mike_trivisonno  
  • kickagrandma
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:49pm

    PRAY ON, AMERICA.
    GOD IS.
    We are HIS.
    PRAY ON, AMERICA.

    Report Post »  
  • momrules
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:48pm

    I don’t get it. Are you allowed to have only so many people in your home or on your property in Phoenix? Are the codes only applied when Christians are gathered?

    This IS religeous persecution. But the 9th will probably give him even more time in jail.

    Report Post »  
    • normalmom
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:01pm

      Good question considering some people have large families. If we have all of just my husbands family we have over 20 people counting kids. So would they go after us if we had a big family BBQ or something?

      Report Post »  
    • TEIN
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:09pm

      Only if it was bible study and BBQ….

      Report Post »  
    • normalmom
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:23pm

      tien… ha ha you never know these days do you, pathetic where things are going.

      Report Post »  
    • I support God's Israel!
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:23pm

      Get ready Americans. Time to lock ‘n’ load and prepare. IT IS COMING.

      Report Post » I support God's Israel!  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:28pm

      @Tein – Ok, so what if it was just a BBQ and this particular family said Grace before eating. Would they have to fear a SWAT team?

      Report Post »  
  • rpp
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:48pm

    I wonder how much this guy has spent in legal fees. Even if he is ultimately exonerated, and his rights restored, he will probably be broke.

    Report Post » rpp  
    • Tepeyac
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:17pm

      Keep us posted …we can help! Power to the people!

      Report Post »  
    • Lt_Scrounge
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 8:22pm

      He’ll be screwed for a total of about a week. At that point in time, the donations will hit and/or his case will be picked up by one of the conservative legal groups. Then the fireworks will really begin.

      Report Post »  
    • Verceofreason
      Posted on July 7, 2012 at 4:22pm

      HIS rights restored?
      He was breaking the law and was told to stop.
      He didn’t

      Report Post » Verceofreason  
  • HKS
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:48pm

    And this is hurting who? and violating who’s rights? Maybe we need to reconsider community law enforcement instead of a professional approach. I don’t think professionals are doing well in this country on any front.

    Report Post » HKS  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:44pm

      I can’t believe it was the fire dept that busted him.

      They (police and fire fighters) are all useless heathens. UnAmerican! All of them.

      Report Post »  
  • Lesbian Packing Hollow Points
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:47pm

    WTF?

    This is the epitome of jack-booted thuggery.

    Report Post » Lesbian Packing Hollow Points  
    • Cavallo
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:14pm

      What could you do about it? Go to the 9th circuit, that’s an unlikely crap shoot with how much they hate Christians. Then it would be on to the SCOTUS, and how long would it take for them to hear it? And even when they do, can you be so sure that they will rule in this man’s favor? Who would stand up for this man? And even if they did, would that do anything? You had better get used to your government telling you what you can and cannot do, believe, and not to believe, speak about and not speak about. The “laws” of this nation can be interpreted however the ruling masters wish to interpret them, up to even making new definitions of words to get the results that they want.

      Report Post » Cavallo  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:40pm

      @Cavallo – REally? Is that the world you want to live in? Is that the country you want to live in?

      Is this really your advice to people? Suck-it-up and get used to it? Really?

      I would really prefer to die than live in a country like the one you are so complacent about.

      Report Post »  
  • MittensKittens
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:47pm

    I think this is a legitimate gripe for the city. Churches are private property, and also tax exempt. However they still have to comply with building codes for people’s safety.

    Talk about getting up on a soapbox and preaching your sermon!

    Report Post » MittensKittens  
    • Lesbian Packing Hollow Points
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:54pm

      Since he’s not running a church, and he proclaims he’s not running a church, do you think he’s filed for tax exempt status? I don’t.

      Report Post » Lesbian Packing Hollow Points  
    • donaldchar
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:30pm

      Wasn’t the American Revolution fought primarily over religious freedom? King George sent his dragoons down the center aisle during the Sunday morning meeting, yanked the pastor from his pulpit, took him outside and flogged him to death. His crime? Just like this Phoenix bunch of thugs: “preaching without a license.” When we elect power-hungry people to office, it’s our fault when they do what comes naturally.

      Report Post »  
  • Abraham Young
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:47pm

    Technicalities of law are just the beginning. They (city officials) want to provoke unrest, agitation, and they want to seem “reasonable” and law conforming. Would not be surprised to find communists and socialists in positions of power in that city.

    Report Post »  
  • progressiveslayer
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:46pm

    See how free you are,all these permits required by government to worship how you want.Who gave the government the authority to trample his first amendment right?

    The answer is we allowed government to have too much power and this is the result and it’ll get much worse with the current occupier in the white house.As chief justice Roberts said if you don’t like your government then change it. Remember we allowed government to attain this power and we‘re surprised they’re abusing their own citizens?

    Look at all the permits you need from government to do anything in this country and tell me how free you are.I suggest you read the ten planks of the communist manifesto and you’ll get a clearer picture of what has become of modern day America.

    Report Post » progressiveslayer  
    • momrules
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:51pm

      You are correct……….67 code violations?!! Why are there even 67 codes to violate?

      Report Post »  
    • normalmom
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:05pm

      Momrules… We made an attic room into a bedroom we had to get three different permits and inspections to rebuild that room. So if you just want to change a storage room into a bedroom you have hoops to jump through.

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 6:56pm

      @Momrules – Actually, according to the article his building DID meet code. It failed when they decided to treat it as a public church instead of an indepentant private building – like a detached rec room. A public church would require all KINDS of things a homeowner wouldn’t be required to have on his property. That is how they decided to trap him.

      It’s illegal. It‘s persecution and it’s thuggery. We literally have jackboots running our country now.

      Report Post »  
  • DWilliams08
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:46pm

    Is he paying tax as a guy with a private clubhouse in his back yard or claiming tax-exemption as a guy with a church?

    Report Post » DWilliams08  
  • rpp
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:46pm

    And those of you who thought those nasty evil “whore of Babylon” Catholics deserved whatever they get from Obama are really inf for it now. After they clear out Christianity, they will clear out all dissent. YOU, yes even good little Obama robots, are next.

    Report Post » rpp  
    • kaydeebeau
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 5:59pm

      Give the assault on the Catholics a rest – I’ll take a practicing Catholic over a practicing muslim or democrat any day and twice on Sunday.

      “All people will know that you are my followers if you love each other.” John 13:35
      Stop and think about that verse for a minute. Could it be that unity is the key to reaching the world for Christ? . . .

      Nowhere, by the way, are we told to build unity. We are told simply to keep unity. From God’s perspective there is but “one flock and one shepherd” (John 10:16). Unity does not need to be created; it simply needs to be protected.

      If a body believes that Jesus Christ is the atoning sacrifice for the remission of sins, the living Son of God, sent as the fulfillment of God’s eternal plan, I am fine wth that. As for other doctrinal beliefs, if I happen to think about it when I get to heaven, I will ask God to tell us which of the minutia created by man was correct. I suspect that I will be too awe struck by His Glory to care to ask.

      In the meantime, if the Catholic church is “laying up treasures in Heaven” (souls) more power to ‘em

      Report Post » kaydeebeau  
  • Dumpster Baby
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:45pm

    Maybe he should obey the zoning laws. Typical conservative, breaking the law to suit his own needs.

    Report Post »  
    • TAILHOOK
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:50pm

      While I agree with your first sentence, your second just makes you sound like a douche…

      Report Post » TAILHOOK  
    • RJJinGadsden
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:57pm

      Hey DUMPSTER, tell us all of your zoning laws where you live. Bet that you don’t know them either. Have dealt with some here and there are some very obscure and hidden laws that even the Zoning Commission cannot make a clear explanation about.
      There are so many of these weird and obscure laws that I bet you are even violating a few while sitting in your Mom’s basement and eating Cheetos in your underwear.

      Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
    • Dumpster Baby
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:01pm

      I copied the second sentence from another thread, the principle w/the cameras. Only there it was stated…”While the intent was to do a good thing (I’m assuming, of course) like most liberals she broke the law to do it.”

      Just thought I’d point out the absurdity of that statement. Glad you were able to pick it up.

      Report Post »  
    • MeCpl13
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:01pm

      There shouldn’t even be an issue with zoning laws. If he was having his buddies over for poker night it’d be fine, but a Bible study is against the law and punishable with outrageous fines and jail time? Give me a break. P.S. Your conservative bash isn’t just wrong, it also makes you look like a complete tool.

      Report Post »  
    • TAILHOOK
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:04pm

      Well played…

      Report Post » TAILHOOK  
    • txjb
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:17pm

      dumpster , have you wondered why they have a zoning law for bible study ? and not a supper bowl party at home ? Standing on the street and looking at the said house in question ,could you tell what is going on inside ? so the law is all about shutting down God in this country . Do you know that muslims will use their corner stores to kneel towards mecca , but wow nothing is said about that !!!

      Report Post »  
    • From Virginia
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 7:07pm

      He broke no zoning laws. In fact, his additional building met all building codes (according to the article). His building only failed code when it was treated as an organized church building. It was NOT an organized church building. It was an additional building on his 5 acre property which met all building codes. Nor was parking an issue on his 5 acre lot. Nor did he apply for tax exempt status as a church. He was simply holding bible studies in his home.

      If you have a problem with that (in that he was bothering nobody) then perhaps you’ll be fine with a SWAT team showing up at your next superbowl party.

      Report Post »  
    • DLV
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 11:53pm

      Dumpster Baby you failed on so many fronts I’m laughing at the sheer stupidity.

      FAAAAAIIIIILLLLL!

      Report Post » DLV  
  • BurntHills
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:43pm

    this is obama and his mindless syncophants doing. it’s the very real beginning of the war obama said he would win… just recently he said in his 2nd term he ‘will win the war on Christmas’. it was NO joke, that filthy vile rabid animal never jokes.

    BUBBA EFFECT!!! do not let this good AMERICAN Christian couple go to JAIL over being CHRISTIANS in their own home.

    Report Post » BurntHills  
  • RJJinGadsden
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:42pm

    This poor guy is truly screwed. His next step is through the 9th Circus Court? Can’t expect them every makes sense, nor follow the U.S. Constitution. Also, don’t expect the SCOTUS to bother reading the Constitution, other than the three we can really trust, and even Kennedy might, but I wouldn’t trust him in this case. And, John Roberts is bathing in his newly found liberal limelight.
    I still can’t wee where these cities are going after what happens in a private home. From what I read above, although it is still vague, you couldn’t even sponsor a Tupperware Party in you home. Unless it is an actual attack upon the religious. Might be like that city in California where that particular department was found to be run two lesbian atheists.

    Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
    • RLTW
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 7:55pm

      Maybe if he brings bread for the circus the emperor will give him the thumbs up, but like you I believe they’ll screw him.

      Report Post »  
  • johnjamison
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:42pm

    sounds like someone is PROHIBITING THE FREE EXERCISE THERE OF

    Report Post »  
  • Dougral Supports Israel
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:42pm

    Surely the City of Phoenix can’t get away with discriminating against religious gatherings. Does the city have an ordinance stating how many people can visit a private home and how often? If not I can’t see how they can jail this guy for having religious friends visit his home.

    Report Post »  
    • Bloody Sam
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:45pm

      What is unclear about…

      “…nor the free execise thereof.”

      ??????

      The 9th Circus must grant an injunction and smack down the city on this one.
      But given their political leaning, I doubt they will.

      Report Post » Bloody Sam  
    • Shellback
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 4:50pm

      I sure hope they are rounding up the super bowl hosts and throwing them in jail.

      Report Post » Shellback  
  • Kenszen
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:40pm

    The Ninth Circus? Good luck on that one.

    Report Post »  
  • Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
    Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:39pm

    This matter has been going on for some time, and I have to wonder if the persecution is about more than just the bible studies being conducted. The fact of his owning the burger business is rumored to be involved, as a political and business rival has allegedly been seeking to buy them out for his own advantage.

    Needless to say, this is now become a case of persecution; for the Ninth Circut will affirm the sentence hands down due to his being a pastor alone.

    Report Post » Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}  
    • Uncurable wound
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:48pm

      Her leaders judge for a bribe, her priests teach for a price, and her prophets tell fortunes for money. Yet they lean upon the LORD and say, “Is not the LORD among us? No disaster will come upon us.”
      Micah 3:11

      Report Post »  
    • cessna152
      Posted on July 6, 2012 at 3:58pm

      Burger joint or not, this is how HUGE and CONTROLLING government has become. This is why businesses can’t start up and why people are forced to do things the “government’s way”. We need to pray for these people, pray for the authorities and everyone involved. My goodness, regardless if this a business thing mixed with a “Home Group”, it shows how much control government has. His property rights, freedom and business (moral/legal) are being taken from him. Folks, this is oppression and the takeover is in full swing.

      Report Post » cessna152  
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