Christian Group Will Reconstruct Noah’s Ark as Part of Massive Religious Theme Park
- Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:24am by
Billy Hallowell
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HEBRON, Ky. (The Blaze/AP) — Tucked away in a nondescript office park in northern Kentucky, Noah’s followers are rebuilding his ark. The epic undertaking will be part of an exciting Christian theme park experience.
The biblical wooden ship built to weather a worldwide flood was 500 feet long and about 80 feet high, according to Answers in Genesis, a Christian ministry devoted to a literal telling of the Old Testament.
This modern ark, to be nestled on a plot of 800 acres of rolling Kentucky farmland, isn‘t designed to rescue the world’s creatures from a coming deluge. It‘s to tell the world that the Bible’s legendary flood story was not a fable, but a part of human history.
“The message here is, God’s word is true,” said Mike Zovath, project manager of the ark. “There’s a lot of doubt: `Could Noah have built a boat this big, could he have put all the animals on the boat?’ Those are questions people all over the country ask.”
The ark will be the centerpiece of a proposed $155 million religious theme park, called the Ark Encounter, and will include other biblical icons like the Tower of Babel and an old world-style village.
It‘s an expansion of the ministry’s first major public attraction, the controversial Creation Museum. It opened in 2007 and attracted worldwide attention for presenting stories from the Bible as historical fact, challenging evolution and asserting that the earth was created about 6,000 years ago.
“The ark is really a different approach” than the museum, Zovath said. “It’s really not about creation-evolution, it’s about the authority of the Bible starting with the ark account in Genesis.”
Inside the ark’s headquarters in Hebron, a small team of artists and designers are working on the visuals at the new park, but once the project begins early next year, there will be hundreds at the creation, including a team of Amish builders from Indiana who will erect the giant ark. Many of the same people who helped design the museum are on board for the ark project, including Patrick Marsh, who helped build some of the attractions at Universal Studios in Florida.
Zovath said the ark will have old-world details, like wooden pegs instead of nails, straight-sawed timbers and plenty of animals – some alive, some robotic like The Creation Museum’s dinosaurs. He said it has not yet been determined how many live animals will be in the boat during visiting hours, but the majority will be stuffed or animatronic. At their count, Noah had anywhere from 2,000 to 4,000 on board.
There are a handful of replica arks around the world, but Zovath said this one will be authentic inside and out.
“When you get to walk through the boat and see how big this thing really was, and how many cages were there, and how much room there was for food and water … our hope is people start seeing that this is plausible, that the account could be believed,” Zovath said.
A longtime critic of the Answers in Genesis ministry argues the attraction will bring in converts to creationism by challenging scientific findings about the world’s history.
“Many think that since creationism is so irrational and so unscientific that nobody really could believe it, but that’s not so,” said Edwin Kagin, a lawyer in northern Kentucky who is president of a nationwide atheist group. The new park will be “so slick and so well done, you can get people to believe in anything. Creationism, when you’re ready to believe anything.”
The Ark Encounter won‘t be the nation’s first theme park inspired by the Bible, or the first with Noah’s big boat. A park in tourism-rich Orlando, Fla., features a portrayal of the crucifixion by actors six days a week, along with Jesus’ resurrection and gospel concerts. The Holy Land Experience opened in 2001, but the nonprofit park struggled with debt before it was taken over by Trinity Broadcasting Network in 2007.
Other replicas of Noah’s famous ship have been built around the world.
A huge fiberglass ark sits at the center of a Hong Kong Noah’s Ark attraction, and another floating ark in the Netherlands is being built by a Dutch man, who wants to sail it to London for the 2012 Olympic games. Closer to home, a church in Frostburg, Md., is building a to-scale ark supported by a steel frame.
But attractions with religious themes can be a risky venture, according to an amusement park expert.
“In some ways it’s a two-edged sword: If you go for the religious market, you already have something that is somewhat unique in the market, and that particular market is known to be willing to make a special effort, to drive an extra distance, to get the church groups to go out and make a special outing,” said John Gerner, managing director of Leisure Business Advisors of Richmond, Va.
“The problem with that approach is you always risk bordering on being disrespectful if not sacrilegious,” Gerner said. “There is a line as far as what you can do in this approach.”
Some in the state hope it will be a major attraction. A feasibility study on the Ark Encounter declared that the park would attract 1.6 million visitors in its first year, Zovath said. The smaller Creation Museum has attracted well over a million people since it opened four years ago.
State officials are banking on the park’s success and the 900 jobs it is expected to create, by making the project eligible for more than $40 million in sales tax rebates if the Ark Encounter hits its attendance marks.
Tying state incentives to a religious theme park has also attracted some criticism, though notably less than The Creation Museum, which received no state support. That facility was built on private donations.
Americans United for Separation of Church and State, a Washington-based group, has said the park would run afoul of constitutional law.
“Noah didn’t get government help when he built the first ark, and the fundamentalist ministry behind the Kentucky replica shouldn’t either,” the group said in a statement. But so far they have taken no legal action.
Kagin said challenging the project in court would likely be a losing battle because of the way the tax incentives are structured.
“The legislation is so drafted that they will give this incentive to any organization that is going to increase tourism in Kentucky,” Kagin said. “And there’s no question whatsoever that this group will.”
Zovath said construction on the ark is expected to begin in the spring.
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Comments (429)
I Love both Jesus and Israel
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:53amI have been to the Creation Museum and it is sooo awesome! I hope that this is equally as awesome! Can’t wait to get back down to that area of Kentucky and see it! Hopefully soon!
Report Post »Blight14
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:49pm@I Love both Jesus and Israel, by chance are you interested is some dandy property-I have a lovely tower that is currently in Paris but I would be open to making you a great deal, $3.23 but you have to cover the moving costs….I also have a real piece of green cheese that came from the moon the last time I was there….I’ll throw that in on the tower deal………let me know…….Regards, PT Barnum…..
Kippop222
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:36pmThey are a wonderful, faith-driven group of people who have a humble appreciation for their undertaking…and, a deep appreciation for science and its limits. They get my prayers, my ardent defense and even my money. Go Ken!
Report Post »taskmaster78
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:58pmTake the money and feed the poor and the needy not build so idiotic boat. The church is focused on what? The parking lots, edifice and simple public image not souls and the cross of Christ. WTF
Report Post »I Love both Jesus and Israel
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:58pm@ BLIGHT14…. What in the world?! Why are you offering me a place in Paris? You make no sense with out an explanation to this statement you make!
Report Post »I Love both Jesus and Israel
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:03pm@ BLIGHT14…. Why in the world are you offering me a place in Paris?! You make no sense without an explanation to this statement you make.!
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:33pmBlessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness’ sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Mathew 5:10 Thanks to the trolls for coming by to persecute followers of Christ. God bless you back.
Report Post »I Love both Jesus and Israel
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:46pm@ BECKWASFOX A-freaking-men!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Report Post »TOMSERVO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:02pm@Beckwasfox, agreed, some people who post on these type of topics are just intentionally bashing Christians, and I wish they would show some respect. However, amongst adults, there is nothing disrespectful about a reasonable discussion about the appropriateness, impact, and justification for building this park. In fact, I imagine that is the goal of this article.
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:59pmThis is what I love: reason and sanity
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ik3F4TdXF8U&feature=related
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:05pmThis park is a disgusting waste of money. A monument to ignorance, superstition and gullibility. It’s shameful that people are this far from reality in this country. It’s almost as bad as the Muslims who believe salt water and fresh water will not mix together because it says so in the Koran. Rubbish and nonsense, all of it.
Report Post »TripleG
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:36pm@taskmaster78 …. use the money to feed the hungry and you have a finite number of mouths you can feed. Build a park and you have potential to feed an infinite number of children from the revenues…and at the same time you educate people. It’s the power of the free market!
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:38pmbrokenuts, It makes more sense then the tripe about evolution we were brainwashed with as kids.
Report Post »veruca salt
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:49pmIt’s just horrible to imagine all the species that were lost when the lions, wolves, crocodiles, hyenas, cougars, shrews, boa constrictors, leopards, grizzly bears, monitor lizards, praying mantids, tigers, wild dogs, tiger beetles, etc got off that ark and decided they were hungry before the pairs of prey species had a chance to repopulate themselves.
Report Post »4truth2all
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:37pmYo veruca salt:
Report Post »Have you ever considered that there might be a logical answer to you logical question?
Hungry_i
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:53pmLOL @ VERUCA SALT.
Sorry, but you can’t think critically about the Bible stories here.
Report Post »kimber1959
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:54pmAnd the Protestants complain, “YOU CATHOLICS SHOULD SELL THE VATICAN TO FEED THE POOR!!! What a joke.
Report Post »Wes Hardin
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:19pmIdol worshiper.
Report Post »Liberal Basher
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:32pmI’m sorry to insult, but the Creation Museum is an affront to science, logic and reason. You’re a child if you believe in any of that nonsense. Just incredible.
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:07pmBasher, I don’t know…whom would you consider less mature? Someone who professes their faith or someone who can’t accept that profession of faith and feels the need to insult others with whom they disagree? Maybe you should give a second thought as to who needs to grow up. Obviously, you like to bash Christians. I thank you for that it blesses us. God bless you too!
Report Post »dquay
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:19pm@Blight14
Report Post »your screen name should be Punk14. That’s all people like you are!
777phase
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 7:36pmLet’s see if Mickey gets you into Heaven………..
Report Post »palmettopalflorida
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:51amSpeaking as a father of three grown children who always just barely tolerated taking my darlings to a theme park I’m thinking, “Well, now there‘s a theme park I’ll take myself to some day.” God willing, if any of us survive the “obamanation” of our Nation.
Report Post »corbecket
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:22amYeah, but if you’re going to have a real theme park, you need to incorporate the theme rides as well. My favorite would be the Pente Coaster, but I’m sure there are other “possibilities”. The problem is, that if you get too clever, you end up sounding blasphemous.
Didn’t Dolly Parton do a religious theme park? Perhaps it was just planned.
Report Post »LibertarianForLife
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:57amAre you people joking? Did i seriously just read someone say this is based upon… science and reason..? If you want to see some logical reasoning (and your imaginary friends get ripped to shreads), go here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQorzOS-F6w
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:37amtell me do you really think your racist atheist fairy tale is science? hmmm? i
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 12:00pmThe Episco-puller (a slingshot ride)!
Report Post »Crawdawg
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 12:17pm@LibertarianForLife — as someone who went through the indoctrination of public schools and was surrounded with crazy liberal theories from university biology and philosophy departments, I can honestly say that the Creation Museum and AIG present a more solid foundation for Truth than any public biology, physics, or philosophy class or textbook has ever presented. I encourage you and everyone else to research the organization a little bit and do your own comparitive analysis on history and the claims that each side makes.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:21pm@ joe.. replied to you in last thread (albeit hastily as I’m in middle of western blots)… there you go again on your racism mission. ridiculous and preposterous. last I heard a particular rock wasn’t just used by people to grind grain but to murder people as well…yet this type of rock still exists despite what you think about its discovery or how people used it for evil. face the facts not the myths
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:12pmLibertarianForLife, using Hitchens is not fair. Next you’ll be posting Harris and Dennett.
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:06pmCesium, aren’t you tired of losing debates yet? Joe cleaned your clock the last time. I suppose you are going to throw us some wrong historical facts again.
Report Post »4truth2all
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:42pmYo forlife:
Report Post »How about… foreternity. When you understand the bible/God his arguements are childish. I have watched complete debates with him, he always argues the same points. I don’t think he ever wins (and I try to give a man credit when due), but he keeps argueing the same points. Which to me means he does not learn. Not a point on which to boast. Always hearing but never perceiving!
briten821
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:47amThe earth is not 6000 years old. Genesis says God created the heavens and the earth in the beginning and THEN the creative days began. So even if the creative days were short (I think they were not literal days but periods of thousands of years) it still leaves room for the earth to be millions, even billions of years old.
And there is a great deal of flood evidence, the scientists just look in the wrong place. You see, they find lots of flood deposits, but they date them to a much earlier time and so they don’t see them as what they are. The problem is a very flawed dating system was developed based on the fragmentary (and long since lost) work of Egyptian priest Manetho. All ancient chronology is based off Egyptian chronology, and Egyptian chronology is full of errors amounting to many hundreds, perhaps as much as a thousand years. This means when they see flood deposits in a layer that has been dated to about 3500 BC because it corresponds to the layers of the Egyptian kings that they think ruled then, they are really looking at flood deposits that date to a thousand years more recent- the time of the flood according to biblical chronology.
If Egyptian chronology was corrected to match reality, then a whole slew of chronological problems in Babylon, Assyria, Greece- all ancient civilizations and even the bible record would all match right up. But whenever anyone hears that those corrections may favor the bible record, they reject them!
Report Post »walkwithme1966
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:57amNow this is an excellent project – prove that the story of Noah is true and provide jobs for people who are unemployed – thats a 2 for 1 project that I could go for. But – they need to also put 2 of every species of animal in the ark in order to really prove anything! http://wp.me/pYLB7-1rQ
Report Post »skwiggy21
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:01amActually, the Bible says there were two of every “kind” of animal….not “species”. A huge difference!
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 12:39pm@skwiggy21
Report Post »Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:01am
‘Actually, the Bible says there were two of every “kind” of animal….not “species”. A huge difference!’
*****************
But since you guys claim that species do not evolve from other species, then it had to have been ‘species,’ right? Otherwise, how did the various species not on the arc appear here, unless they evolved?
ConservDadASD
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:13pmBriten… looks like you’re trying to accomodate a flawed dating system that has been way off target on a good number of samples, and has depended on estimates of those who really want the world to be old enough to possibly allow for evolution to occur.
Baikonur… you still can have variation occur within the family or genus levels of classification, and evolution is not required for this.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:41pmSee Jericho. Oldest extant city with settlements dating back to 9,000 BC. Interesting fact – no water problems…at least no catastrophic water problems.
Now, what does that do to the nut job insistence of a global flood occurring in the 3rd millennium BC?
More buffoonery from young earth creationists.
Report Post »JustMeInAZ
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:59pmBriton, just food for thought; Death came into the world only after Adam had sinned. That includes animals as well. So to say that the dinosaurs died millions of years before man is pretty much disagreeing with what the Bible says. Also, If you read Genesis, you’ll see that God made day and night. One morning and one evening constituted a single day, not allowing for millions of years.
Report Post »http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/2010/03/02/satan-the-fall-good-evil-could-death-exist-before-sin
WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:10pm@JUSTMEINAZ, Genesis 2 also says, “…in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,…”
Notice the use of the word “day” in this verse. Notice it does not say, “…in the 6 days that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens…”
Notice how even the biblical author uses “day” in different ways!
Report Post »AmericanPatriot01
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:16pmI am a Christian, I have done years of personal research into the creation of humankind and have found that the logic of a timeline can be found in the astronimical cycles. The last time the earth experienced a geologically proven pole shift and catistrophic flood was approxiamtely 25-26,000 years ago. when last it transited the universal gravitational event horizen. Geological evidence exists to show that this is a cycle over millions of years.
I believe that man was created by God (yaway, yahwey, The Highest etc.) but we are talking comparitive reality without the interpretation of the passage of time by man and flawed records. The stars and the geological records are the true keepers of time. The earliest of man made records are thousands of years older than the alottment given by these creationist. I believe the stories are true but happened a lot earlier than they suggest given the passage of time in the geological record. There are whole cities now found under the oceans off the coast of india, asia and in the atlantic that predate the great flood. the sedementary record shows that these cities existed as much as 20-26,000 years ago. They exist near the equatorial regions which would be consistant with the earths ice coverage during that time period allowing for the lower oceanic levels. The problems with the creationist theory is that they do not take into account that even in the earliest of records that the great flood was a legend that happend long before that
Report Post »briten821
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:16pmCONSERVDADASV- what?
WSGAC- Give me a break… Jerico has been the site of a number of floods. The early settlers there even built massive flood walls. Do your research before you call others dumb- because guess what you look like?
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:36pm@BRITEN821, maybe I wasn’t clear enough. There is no evidence of a global catastrophic flood hitting Jericho. Yes, many ancient cities of the mid east and Mesopotamia experienced flooding, but the supposed global flood that Young Earthers insist came upon the world in the 3rd Millenium BC is found nowhere in the archeological data. If the miles of sedimentation that supposedly covered the earth after the flood was deposited on Jericho, or any city of the Ancient Near East, we would know about it. Indeed, the cities would no longer exist. But hey hey, ho ho, Jericho dates back 11,000 years with no wipeout!
Sorry to rain on your global flood, but the archeological evidence ain’t there!
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:51pmWSGAC,
You are continually arguing a moot point. Your dating methods are simply screwed up, you assume Jericho is the age you claim it is. But it is not. There is no archeological evidence of the flood because Jericho was NOT THERE before the flood. Your only argument is the dating method, and that can be shown to be flawed. I could show you a rock and tell you it is 1,000 years old or 1,000,000,000. All dating methods depend on 3 assumptions, and any one of the three will wildly skew the results. Unless you can prove Jericho is 9,000 years old your argument is meaningless.
Report Post »JustMeInAZ
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:55pmWSGAC, Back in my day…. Does that mean I only lived for a day? Not hardly. I would hope you could see the difference.
Report Post »scarebear83
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:49pm@briten821- “…leaves room for the earth to be millions, even billions of years old.”
How can you explain death then? Death did not come into the world until man sinned. The animals were created before man therefore they would have died over those periods of millions of years thus making the word of God a liar. Why is it impossible to think God couldn’t have made all we see in 6 literal 24 hr. days? And that these “layers” are actually part of one single event? The smartest man in the world is still dumb compared to God. Therefore we should trust what God has said over man’s word.
As for saying God created the heaven’s and the earth THEN the creative days begin is to go against what scripture says: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good; and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day. There’s no indication that He stopped in verse 1 then picked up later. We read this took place in 1 literal day.
Report Post »Jack of Hearts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 6:25pm@SKWIGGY21
Report Post »No it doesn’t – it says 7 of every clean animal and 2 of unclean animals, 7 birds of the air etc – read Genesis 7. It was never meant to be taken literally, few early sagas were, but it’s still a beautiful story for kids. If you can have Disney world, why not Noah world, doesn’t hurt anyone.
trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:23pmJack of Hearts,
How do you feel about John chapter 20? Was that meant to be taken literally or is that also just a beautiful story for kids?
How do you distinguish what should be taken literally or not? I guess if it does not fit into what you believe is possible it is just a story. So what about Christ’s resurrection? How about His miracles? How about Paul’s conversion? The Second Advent? The Millennial Kingdom?
Where do you stop? I know literary critics that do not stop…The saddest part is they still consider themselves “Christians” even though they do not believe anything in the Bible except that Jesus was this groovy hippie teacher walking around the land in his robe and Brikenstocks saying these groovy things…
No thanks. Genesis is written as history and history it is.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:11pm@TROLLTRAINER – If Jericho did not exist before the Flood, then let’s have a date for the Flood. When was Noah’s Flood?
Report Post »loriann12
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:26pmThey have proven that objects that have been under water for long periods, say a year or close to it, show a much older carbon dating than they actually are. Almost every primitive culture has a story about a great flood. And dating something on the fact that dinosaur fossils were in it is flawed. It’s circular reasoning. How old is the rock? 100 million years. How do you know? There were dinosaur fossils in it. How old is this dinosaur bone? It’s 100, million years. How do you know? The rock is at the 100 Million year mark.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:29pm@BRITEN821 – You said,
“…This means when they see flood deposits in a layer that has been dated to about 3500 BC because it corresponds to the layers of the Egyptian kings that they think ruled then, they are really looking at flood deposits that date to a thousand years more recent- the time of the flood according to biblical chronology.”
Then give us your best shot. When was Noah’s Flood, according to biblical chronology? Tell ya’ what, I’ll spot you a thousand years (plus or minus) and you still won’t be able to place a global flood that washed over Mesopotamia or Egypt in the last 5,000 years. The archeological evidence just ain’t there.
Sorry to rain on your global flood!
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:35pmWSGAC,
No one knows exactly when the flood was, and that is the point. The only evidence you have for your dates is C14 and the record of assumption that has been built around archaeology. It is not like you have a fragment with a date, not dating back before 2,000 BC anyway. Just assumptions.
But to answer your question, it is common belief that the flood was around 2302 BC. Here is a timeline that may help you out:
http://www.chelper.net/btl/BibleTimeLine.htm
Again, we see what you are driving at, but as I said, it is a moot point. You cannot prove your dates. They are merely assumptions.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:50pmTROLLTRAINER SAID:
“No one knows exactly when the flood was, and that is the point. The only evidence you have for your dates is C14 and the record of assumption that has been built around archaeology. It is not like you have a fragment with a date, not dating back before 2,000 BC anyway. Just assumptions.
But to answer your question, it is common belief that the flood was around 2302 BC.”
Sorry, but no cigar. We do have quite a chronology of Sumerian kings. Yes, there are no dates, but we can date them quite readily. In fact, our chronologies are much better than the misinterpreted genealogies you young earthers so love to rely on.
And as for the 2302 BC date for the flood, are you aware of the Akkadian Dynasty? Maybe you should study some ancient history. If a global flood hit the world in 2302 BC, we would have no records of the Akkadian, nor the Gutians who supplanted them.
It would be kind of like saying the Grand Canyon was formed when a large North American flood hit the continent in AD 1785. Not only would this be a misinterpretation of the geologic evidence of the Grand Canyon, but it fails to consider the unbroken history of the time. Had such a flood occurred we would have no record of something called the Declaration of Independence, or any other records for that matter.
This is the problem with you young earthers, you posit your nonsense even when the history shows your dating to be nonsense!
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:56pm“Sorry, but no cigar. We do have quite a chronology of Sumerian kings. Yes, there are no dates, but we can date them quite readily. In fact, our chronologies are much better than the misinterpreted genealogies you young earthers so love to rely on. ”
That is not an honest response. You are still relying on assumption. You can date nothing. If you could, even reliably, then this would not be in debate. It would shut creationists up. But you cannot. You might believe the assumptions, but they are still only that.
Report Post »4truth2all
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:57pmYo WSGAC:
Report Post »I believe the biblical timeline is 1650yrs.
WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:39pmIt most definitely is an honest response! You always play the “proof” card, as if that makes your case. Then you rely on your misinterpreted genealogies in Genesis to construct your idiotic version of history.
If a global flood occurred in 2302 BC, we would know it! Egypt and Mesopotamia were thriving civilizations at that time, as well as before and after that time. If such a catastrophe wiped out all human beings from the planet in 2302 BC, we would see it in the records as one giant blank on history’s pages. We don’t, because it’s not there.
Now, come back with some facts to support your claim instead of questioning my honesty.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:58pm“It most definitely is an honest response! You always play the “proof” card, as if that makes your case. Then you rely on your misinterpreted genealogies in Genesis to construct your idiotic version of history.”
Heh! You getting mad? I am playing no proof card, I am not trying to prove a thing! It is you who needs to prove these dates.
“If a global flood occurred in 2302 BC, we would know it! Egypt and Mesopotamia were thriving civilizations at that time, as well as before and after that time.”
Prove it! They did not EXIST before the flood!
“If such a catastrophe wiped out all human beings from the planet in 2302 BC, we would see it in the records as one giant blank on history’s pages. We don’t, because it’s not there.”
Sure it is, recorded history starts after the flood. You may try to date it a thousand years earlier…prove it!
“Now, come back with some facts to support your claim instead of questioning my honesty.”
If you want to have an honest debate then you need to be honest. You cannot show dates. I am not making any claim, it is you who is trying to claim that the flood is impossible because it is not recorded. It actually is recorded, by many cultures around the world. It is you who misinterprets facts, I do not deny the Sumerians, or any other early culture. You just try to place them too far back, you cannot prove civilization before 2,000 BC. You can speculate, but you have no evidence. Only assumption.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:33pmTROLLTRAINER – “If you want to have an honest debate then you need to be honest. You cannot show dates. I am not making any claim,”
Now it is you who is not being honest. I refer you again to your claim of a universal flood occurring ~ 2302 BC. Can you tell us how you arrived at such a date, even if it’s an aproximate date? In addition, can you tell us why it’s impossible to date with any reliability the existence of any human civilization prior to this date? And then tell us what we should do with all the historical data we’ve been digging up for the past 200 years showing a very long chain of human civilization (the lists of kings and their dynasties, for one) existence that simply cannot be crunched into 2300 years of the human record?
Indeed, if we’re going to have an honest debate, you’re going to have to show yourself as well-read. You obviously are not. Maybe some reading on the Sumerians would be a good starting point.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:15pm“Now it is you who is not being honest. I refer you again to your claim of a universal flood occurring ~ 2302 BC. Can you tell us how you arrived at such a date, even if it’s an aproximate date? In addition, can you tell us why it’s impossible to date with any reliability the existence of any human civilization prior to this date?”
Let me quote myself, words which you also quoted:
No one knows exactly when the flood was, and that is the point. The only evidence you have for your dates is C14 and the record of assumption that has been built around archaeology. It is not like you have a fragment with a date, not dating back before 2,000 BC anyway. Just assumptions.
————————————
“And then tell us what we should do with all the historical data we’ve been digging up for the past 200 years showing a very long chain of human civilization (the lists of kings and their dynasties, for one) existence that simply cannot be crunched into 2300 years of the human record?”
Why not? Actual archaeologists have no problem doing this. The very long chain you point to started somewhere around 2300 BC. The lists of kings and dynasties you refer to start around this time even in the secular chronologies anyway, it is the beginning of recorded history. It apparently is you who needs to study secular history a little better, you are making a claim here that is false.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:22pm“Indeed, if we’re going to have an honest debate, you’re going to have to show yourself as well-read. You obviously are not. Maybe some reading on the Sumerians would be a good starting point.”
Do you really want to go here? I did the same to you in my previous post, only in response to this. You make an assumption about my intelligence? You know how well read I am? I guess you do not have any facts to argue, you keep going around in circles then throw in some personal attacks for good measure.
I am going to bed, I will not waste my time with you any further. We are both set in our positions and nothing is going to move either of us. You are simply a nobody, as am I. Two idiots in a forum trying to prove history. To paraphrase Shakespeare, it signifies nothing. When you can definitely prove that a civilization dates before 2300 BC you let someone know.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 7:26amTROLLTRAINER – “Why not? Actual archaeologists have no problem doing this. The very long chain you point to started somewhere around 2300 BC.”
LOL! You have just confirmed my assumption; you don‘t know what you’re talking about. You haven’t done any reading on the suject. Unless of course you believe those silly cheat sheets from AnswersinGenesis inform you. Either way, you are a troll.
Report Post »skwiggy21
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 4:14pm@ Jack of Hearts
Actually, Genesis 7 DOES say “according to its kind”. Read Genesis 7 verse 14.
@ Baikonur
Report Post »I think MANY Christians DO believe in evolution…micro-evolution that is. Once animals came off the ark (which was NOT only 40 days/40 nights) then micro-evolution happened. Variation of the different “kinds” of animals…which is why we have over…what…200 types of dogs? They all came from a common ancestor….a dog…but they have gone through changes over time. But a dog has always been and will always be…a dog.
Cat
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:33amWasn’t the Biblical account of the ark really about the flooding of the Mediterranean basin?
Report Post »The area used to be a vast forest and agricultural valley, suddenly flooded by a break in the western mountains near Gibraltar, which allowed the water of the Atlantic to fill the basin.
Haven’t read the scientific theories about this historic incident in years.
There’s also several photos of what is supposed to be the remains of the ark lodged in the side of a mountain in Turkey, which makes sense if you know a little about hydraulics during flooding.
Guessing this park is all about a different aspect of two-by-two.
KickinBack
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:50amCivilizations around the world all have similar tales of a great flood, so it’s not just the Mediterranean.
Report Post »Cat
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:31am@JJCOOLAY
Yes, there have been many floods, probably even before written history. However, the Biblical account of this flood uses an ark to explain how life kept on going after the disaster, with the help of God, of course.
There are numerous stories as well as scientific analysis, theories and evidence explaining this event. Which leads those of us living now, to understand this event must have been extraordinary and affected many lives at the time, thus throughout the periods following the event.
Report Post »PatrioticTechnogeek
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:48amThe Flood of Noah’s day could not have been merely a flood of the Mediterranean basin for two reasons:
1: According to the Bible, all of the mountains on the earth were covered. Thus, it could not logically have been merely a local flood.
2: All of the people living on the earth were killed by the Flood of the Bible. If it were local, couldn’t Noah and others have simply migrated to a different area?
Those are just 2 of the reasons why the Biblical Flood couldn’t have been just a flood of the Mediterranean basin. In addition, according to the current theories, the Mediterranean basin would not have existed yet, as the land on the earth would still have been part of Pangea, the supercontinent that existed before the continents shifted to where they are today.
Report Post »encinom
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:58am@PatrioticTechnogeek
Report Post »Lie most myths, the bible story of the flood is not true, but based on true events only the details got fuzzy.
jkendal
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:50am“Lie most myths, the bible story of the flood is not true, but based on true events only the details got fuzzy.”
And you know this because…..?
The TRUTH is there hasn’t been a single piece of physical archeological evidence that disproves anything that the Bible says happened. This is something you can look up on your own. But there is plenty of physical evidence all over the world that suggests it actually did happen. There’s even evidence on Mt. Ararat (not sure what it’s called today) of a great wooden vessel that existed around the time the flood happened. But those who refuse to believe will always disregard the evidence, hardening their hearts even further.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:44pmSee Jericho. No catastrophic water problems as far back as 9,000 BC.
Report Post »scarebear83
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:57pm@ PatrioticTechnogeek 3: If it were indeed a local flood then God lied when He said He would never flood the whole earth again because since then there have been large localized floods in all parts of the world.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:19amI get why creationism appeals. It is really pretty simple. Biology, astronomy, physics, chemistry, anthropology, etc, all offer powerful proof complex explanations about our origins, but to understand these explanations one must study, read serious books, write papers, think. Learning is hard!
It is so much less complicated to hide behind a self-righteous religious stance while accepting a child’s story that is patently false, but very easy to understand, even for a 5 year old. It’s all just a cop out for choosing to remain ignorant and refusing to study.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:24amDo you really believe people that believe in biblical creation are simply ignorant? Think that through! You do realize that you are talking about many people who hold multiple doctorate degrees, who, in the real world, are professionals in their fields. Do you really believe creation theories are baseless, just fairy tales that someone made up? For real?
Do you realize how silly and arrogant your post is? You try to argue from a position of knowledge to a bunch of stupid rubes. In the process you only show your own ignorance! Maybe you should first understand what creationists believe before you judge their theories?
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:27amcomplext stories of our origins? you mean like that racist atheist fairy tale of evolution?
please…we had this big explosion…ok, where did the matter the come from..and what caused the explosion?? things just usually don‘t explode if you haven’t noticed….I eagerly await your complex explanation…….
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:32am@trolltrainer
Report Post »Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:24am
‘Do you really believe people that believe in biblical creation are simply ignorant?’
********************
Science does not necessarily contradict religion. As I mentioned before, this creation literalism is not shared by all Christians. I definitely believe that Young Earth creationists are ignorant. These are people who believe that dinosaurs and people co-existed and that the Earth is 6,000 years old. It’s lunacy.
GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:38amI’ve followed your comments on this thread. They have been rife with constant mocking, derision and sneering. Why is that?
It’s fine to not believe in a given religion, or in religion as a concept. I can respect that, it’s a perfectly reasonable viewpoint that one can come to. But if somebody needs to make it a point to constantly deride and insult others because they do not believe as you do, well, that speaks to me of a high amount of insecurity in your own beliefs.
It’s a big world, and religion is not the evil that you think that it is. There are evil religious people, just like there are evil atheists/agnostics. Religion, like any other widely accepted belief system, brings stability and order to a society at the moral level, which is really not a bad thing at all. There are extremes which should be avoided, but then there are extremes of atheism (Soviet Union anybody) that should be avoided as well.
Become more comfortable with your beliefs and you will not feel the need to constantly call people names and belittle them.
Slainte friend.
Report Post »ConservDadASD
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:53amLet the athiests design their own evolution based theme park. One ride can be the asteroid drop in which the passengers drop at a 65 degree angle toward the ground and a bunch of dinosaur shaped objects are engineered to fall on their sides. Another one can be called Spark of Life, based on Stanley Miller’s experiment that created life in lab… wait a minute… correction… tried to create life… it didn’t actually happen… sure were chemical reactions, but not the ones intended by the scientists. Forget this ride…. Let me think of another…… how about some exhibits as well. There’s the piltdown man and the Nebraska Man…. no wait… ooops again. How about games for kids… like Search For The Missing Link where young minds are put to the desparate task of finding all the missing links like the real scientists are still trying to find.
Dang it, this thing is going to take some time to design… get back to me later.
Report Post »greensteam
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:55amlets start this argument. i can go on all day about it. what are the odds of life not existing at some point and a single celled organism forming all by itself to start the evolution process. it has no help from birds, earthworms, bees and so on because they dont exist yet. what are the odds? 1 in 10 to the 340,000,000 power. thats 10 times 10 340 million times. you times 10 by itself on a calclulator just a few times and you will bury the calculator screen. the most simple organisms require something like 300 to 500 proteins and they need to take them in the correct order. each one being taken without outside help like earthworms, requires odds equivelant to winning the lottery. but then you have to do it at least 300 times in a row and in the correct order. any failure and the process starts over. this is evolutions biggest problem. because at 4.5 billion years to 6 billion years the earth would not be old enough to allow this to happen just once.
Report Post »TomFerrari
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:56amSo, Mr. Know-It-All,
Tell us the origin of all matter in the universe.
Report Post »Crawdawg
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:02amYou should visit the Creation Museum or at least http://www.AnswersInGenesis.org sometime. Their approach is really quite scientific and based upon sound reason. The organization (AIG) and the movement – is about Apologetics which offers explanations and reason to the questions and fallacies that science and “history” have presented but cannot answer. Evidence of God is all around us; just lift the veil of deception to see it. Science has been handed to us by man which is fallible, but the Bible has been handed to us by The Authority of God. Maybe science should be questioned and not the Bible?
Report Post »greensteam
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:06amin the theory of evolution humans evolved in the last 2 million years and mostly in the last 200,000 years. so why havnt so many beetles and insects fossilized litterally 50 million years ago to 100 million years ago evolve a scale or wing. they look exactly the same, a large number of them survived the death of the dinosaurs. the Wollemi Pine tree lived alongside the dinosaurs and was recently found again not having evolved a new dimple or leaf. how can evolution answer all their questionable science when they can explain how some things evolve in thousands of years and somethings evolve not a hitch. there are fish that went extinct that have been found in modern day oceans 70 million years later. they were considered extinct and now they are found alive and well. and not evolved a day. evolutionists have some explaining to do!!!
Report Post »ConservDadASD
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:10amBaikonur: “Science does not necessarily contradict religion. As I mentioned before, this creation literalism is not shared by all Christians. I definitely believe that Young Earth creationists are ignorant. These are people who believe that dinosaurs and people co-existed and that the Earth is 6,000 years old. It’s lunacy.”
Sorry to say, there are even scientists with multiple degrees who believe in Young Earth creationism, and who are using their training and expertise to research this scientific field, who write articles in journals, and lecture at universities.
Secondly, there have been accounts of pterosaurs (and their attacks on humans) from early native american tribes, and from the aboriginies of Austrailia who gave a pretty good description of what we call a Hadrosaur. Consider also the legends of dragons from many cultures from Great Britain & Europe to the Orient, which look very close to what we could call dinosaurs. Finally, even in the Book of Job (comes before Psalms) it speaks of giant land animals… one which has a tail like a Cedar. Elephants and Rhinos don’t have tales you can think of in this way. With these in mind, i don’t think we can say for sure that humans and dinosaurs never coexisted..
Report Post »llotus
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:21ambaklonur……..ye,ye,ye…….you are superior…….and yet you can not resist coming to a conservative site. Seems your time would be better spent on a progressive site. You could…maybe reign in some of those lost sheep that are running from the progressive camps and may even be turning toward God instead of turning their backs to Him. You are still the belittler you were, the peple I know that belittle others are the most miserable people I know. They are unhappy with life its self and wish to share their unhappiness with every one they are around. I hope GBTV has no trolls. Someone please say there are not trolls on it. Lotus.
Report Post »jkendal
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 12:04pm“It is so much less complicated to hide behind a self-righteous religious stance while accepting a child’s story that is patently false, but very easy to understand, even for a 5 year old. It’s all just a cop out for choosing to remain ignorant and refusing to study.”
You belie your own ignorance about those at whom you throw stones. We’ve heard it so many times before – Christians are idiots, bigots, homophobes, yada yada yada. And yet some of the most intelligent people in their fields are Christians.
“The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.” ~ Psalms 14:1
It’s still not too late for you, though. Read the Third Chapter of John.
Report Post »jkendal
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 12:15pmAlso, it’s been my experience that those who claim to be enlightened (usually by science – which is nothing more than human observation) and who disregard Christianity and Christians with a generality like you just did are the ones who are ignorant. And arrogant (the two seem to go hand in hand). And every single one of them haven’t really even given it much thought; they just do it out of hand. Talk about self righteous…..
Report Post »MAProg
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:43pmIt’s pretty easy to debate when 5 of you pile on a guy, isn’t it?
Report Post »JustMeInAZ
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:43pmOk, so there was this fish, that wanted to climb up onto land (who knows the reason) he concentrated really, really hard, maybe tried to take a mouthful of air as well, just to try and create a couple of lungs. He tried doing this in his lifetime, because the next generation would have to start all over again, trying to grow lungs. So anyway, he succeeds (don’t know how, ask an evolutionist) and he also forced himself to grow a few legs. Yay, success. But because he needed a mate that did the exact same thing, at the same time his new species died out.
Report Post »4truth2all
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:19pmYo baikonur:
Report Post »One can study real hard and learn many things, but just because one LEARNS does not make it true. There is a verse in the bible that says God will make the intelligence of men as foolishness. Alot of intelligence…. misguided, misplaced and mislead. At some point it comes to faith. God says you are either for or against. Each side requires faith.
Also the story of creation is very simple. It is on purpose: for the very reason that a five year old CAN understand. Jesus said let the little children come to me. He meant this in more ways then one!
If you want to stick with the flawed theories of men… your choice. Good luck; I don‘t think I’ll chance my eternal soul
with a roll
of the dice.
MAProg
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 12:41am@Justme: read about lung fish and mudskippers. Pretty amazing little fish that happen to spend a good deal of time out of the water.
Report Post »JustMeInAZ
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 3:43pmMAPROG, Yes they are amazing. God created many amazing creatures. Those little mudskippers and lungfish didn’t decide one day to grow those lungs, they had them when God created them.
Report Post »LoisLane1951
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:18amHey, all you naysayers. When was the last time YOU created 900 jobs? Huh? I’m waiting. Still waiting. (sound of crickets chirping)
Report Post »Raymond Koepsell
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 1:04pmHA! Excellent point
Report Post »AmericablessGod
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:54amThank God for people of faith who are not afraid to display the truths of their beliefs. The atheists will come out of the woodwork to attack anything of God. May the Lord bless you all abundantly!
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:07am“Display the truths of their beliefs” That is a dangerous statement and ignorant beyond belief. Do any of you people of faith read?
http://godisimaginary.com/
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:18amThis nonsense is a monument to gullibility, superstition and ignorance. The earth is more than 6000 years old and that fact is irrefutable. These people are a menace.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:26ambeckisnuts,
if it is irrefutable, then prove it!
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:28amoh good nuttyfascist is here!! still waiting for your answer to the question I posed earlier to you..
please list the lower races your god and savior refers to…
“The more civilized so-called Caucasian races have beaten the Turkish hollow in the struggle for existence. Looking to the world at no very distant date, what an endless number of the lower races will have been eliminated by the higher civilised races throughout the world.” (Darwin, Charles R. [English naturalist and founder of the modern theory of evolution], “The Life of Charles Darwin”, [1902], Senate: London, 1995, reprint, p.64).
Report Post »Hungry_i
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:43amThe story of the Flood is symbolic, not literal, and it’s real meaning is spiritual. Those who followed Noah’s call to righteousness weathered the storm of trials while the deniers drown in their own corruption.
Report Post »joei234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:33amJesus would look at this stupid theme park in disgust. He would say that all the money that was wasted on it should have gone to help the needy. That’s a fact no one can dispute. You idiots that think the earth is only 6K years old are fools. For crissakes, look at the Grand Canyon and even a total fool can see that it took longer than 6k years for the Colorado river to cut through all that rock! Get real you meat heads!
Report Post »joei234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:40amWhat about the Neanderthal people that died out 30K years ago? How do they fit into the little story these nutters try to sell about the earth being only 6k years old?? That doesn’t fit their little narrative too well does it? lolololol
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:42amer…if the story of the flood is spiritual then why would Noah himself not be spiritual? How about Adam and Eve? Real or allegory? What about the creation account itself? Of course you say that is allegory, but then was Abraham also allegory? How about Joseph’s life? What distinguishes between truth and story? Is there any truth at all in Genesis? Jesus seemed to think so, He mentions Abraham and Noah as real people. He endorses OT Scripture multiple times. So is it up to our faulty exegesis to sift fact from fiction in the Bible? Boy…Just think of the different religions you could come up with by doing this! Not hard to imagine, just look around you!
No thanks. I will take Scripture literally. There IS allegory, parables, and stories in the Bible. Also figures of speech. But these are easily recognized when given. I follow the Chicago Statement on Bible Inerrancy. You should check it out:
http://65.175.91.69/Reformation_net/COR_Docs/01_Inerrancy_Christian_Worldview.pdf
Scripture must be taken in full context and it must be interpreted as the Word of God. Nothing in Genesis would lead me to believe that it is anything but history. Whether you believe that history or not is another matter, but you cannot just pluck out the parts you do not wish to accept as fact.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:47am@joei234 LOL you know imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!!! loser BWAHAHAHAHAH
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:52amJoe1234,
The Grand Canyon actually PROVES the flood! You can look to the eruption of Mt. St. Helens for evidence of how fast canyons can be cut. Further, study the Kaibab Upwarp. That is only scratching the surface of the flood geology of the Grand Canyon, there have been books written about this.
Likewise, how do they date neanderthals? The argument is the dating process itself, but let me ask this; if neanderthal is this old then how is it we have viable DNA for them to test? Organic matter cannot last 40,000years.
There are answers to your objections. Very good answers in fact, answers that make more sense than current secular theories. It is up to you to research it though. I once thought a young earth was the most ridiculous, ludicrous thing I ever heard. I understand, it was hard for me to believe it. But the evidence does not lie, you just have to get past the BS you have been taught is fact. It is NOT fact.
Hint: Look into Helium diffusion and radio halos, that is very compelling evidence for a young earth.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:59amtrolltrainer you mean joei234…I have my own personal troll…in other words I’ve been very effective and its really pissed off the atheist morons who troll this site…they’ve imitated my name in order to fool people….their childish antics are so predictable…..
Report Post »joei234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:59amYes joel234, thanks for copying me, you flipping thick-skulled cretin. How do you type with your fingers all soaked in drool anyway goober? lolololololol
Report Post »joei234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:07amTroll trainer, you go ahead and believe your fairy tales all you want. They still aren’t true and anyone with any intelligence knows it. Have a blast nutso.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:08am@joei234 oh wow that was such a clever rejoinder…I can see why you atheists are such LOSERS LOL I do feel sorry for you, you must be in a great deal of pain, such great stupidity must hurt….
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:21am@ joei234
User Profile: joei234
Member Since: August 12, 2011
and I’ve been here since march….more lies from atheists…my what a surprise..I’m shocked…LOL loser…tell me are you as fat as you are stupid?
Report Post »Hungry_i
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:28amNoah was a real person, and the efficacy of His dispensation was recorded allegorically. This view does not diminish the truth of the Bible, nor does it deny that it is the Word of God given unto man for guidance and instruction. Rather, it acknowledges that the stories recorded in the OT were given to men whose spiritual understanding can be likened to that of a child’s. It’s no wonder that those who cling to outworn dogmatic shibboleths are laughed at for building such a ridiculous theme park.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:30amForgive me joe1234, I was simply responding to the post no matter the name attached. I see you are two different people. I am guessing that joei234 is probably encinom playing his usual games. If not then it is just another idiot loser. Either way, I do not understand why they would wish to be taken seriously when they are nothing but cute little trolls. And if I cannot take them seriously, then why would I care about what they think anyway?
I take people at face value, and your clone has not only lost credibility, but also relevance.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:40am@trolltrainer thats ok, these atheist clowns can only mock, they don’t have the intelligence to make an argument…whats funny is they keep telling themselves and everyone else how smart they are, but you sure can’t prove it from their idotic rants….get they drool as they type…
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:43pmKind of a funny thread. I would add to the defense of scripture but Trolltrainer and Joe1234 handled it beautifully with truth.
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:56pmOne of the many problems with a young earth creationist perspective is the global flood, upon which YECs base all their pseudo science. They place the global flood somewhere in the 3rd millennium BC. The only problem with this is that we have an unbroken chain of human civilization existing in Mesopotamia throughout the entire millennium.
Sorry folks, but you cannot place a global flood at any point in the 3rd Millenium BC…or 4th…or 5th. Sorry to rain on your flood folks. There is NO archeological evidence for a global flood.
See Jericho.
Report Post »4truth2all
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:29pmI was lost there for a moment with the 1234 and I234 stuff. I was beginning to think somebody has some mental issues they might want to see a doctor about. I will have to be careful of this in the future.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:52amKen Ham is as about as dumb as it gets. Please be enlightened not a dim wit. Think outsite of the pages of the bible.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JcD78LGrGA
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:10amIt is easy to attack. Ken Ham actually makes a lot of sense. You should try listening to him sometime.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:21amtrolltrainer,
Report Post »If Mr. Ham makes sense to you I have to feel that you’re a little out of touch. Have you read a science book? Ham is wrong about everything.
joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:30amlotus, why don’t you prove him wrong…show us all the evolution in the fossil record…whats that you can’t? you mean thats why gould and eldridge came up with punctuated equilibrium?? ok then how about the lab….no luck there huh? ok, then just list the mutations that led to the eye, in order…should be a piece of cake….
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:30amHave I read a science book? Why would you ask me that? You make basic statements like Ken Ham is dumb and wrong about anything. First off, Ken Ham speaks just fine, he is not dumb. He is actually a great orator. Also, it would be hard for anyone to be wrong about everything. Is Ken Ham wrong about some things? I am sure he is.
But never mind, I can tell when I am wasting my time. You just go back to youtube and expand your worldview. I wonder what your education level is? Do you even have a GED?
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:33amYes. It is easy to attack such stupidity. How difficult is it to understand that the world was a mystery to those ancient people that had no science and their explanations for things beyond their knowledge are simply stories they imagined because they were ignorant of the facts? To buy into their ignorance is pure folly. Shame on you for being so gullible.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:38amfascistisnuts…the ancients weren’t fools…antikythera mechanism anyone? how would you like to try to build the pyramid today? think we could?
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:25amJoel1235, if the story of Jesus is true, then name the man who built the cross. And what was the name of the person who did the nailing when Jesus was attached to it? You can’t name them? Then by your reasoning, you‘re admitting it’s all an old fable.
Your delusions are not the burden of the educated.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:38amfascistisnuts…even in the small things the bible is proven true….
Museum’s tablet lends new weight to Biblical truthDalya Alberge, Arts Correspondent
The British Museum yesterday hailed a discovery within a modest clay tablet in its collection as a breakthrough for biblical archaeology – dramatic proof of the accuracy of the Old Testament.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2056362.ece
ok, so I have given you some proof of the truth of the bible…now why don’t you post some facts about your racist theory of evolution? you’re snarky, and you’re not even very good at that…so lets see you post an argument, you know using reasoning and logic, to make the case for evolution…
I don’t think you can…you atheists tend to be brain-dead followers who are unable to go beyond talking points…..
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:55amoh and beck YOU nailed Jesus to the cross…as did I….too bad you’ll never understand that until its too late…
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:44amno reasoned argument…no surprise…you atheists aren’t nearly as clever as you think you are….
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:46amCongrats to Beckisnuts for the most irrational post of all time!!!
Check out this gem of reasoning:
“Joel1235, if the story of Jesus is true, then name the man who built the cross. And what was the name of the person who did the nailing when Jesus was attached to it? You can’t name them? Then by your reasoning, you‘re admitting it’s all an old fable.
Your delusions are not the burden of the educated.”
Wow! For real beckisnuts? Did this really come out of your head? I cannot even begin to imagine how you could even construct this as an argument let alone use it as proof and a conclusion?
For real?
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:50amOMG, I just can’t leave this one alone. I am still thinking about this misuse of logic…
Beckisnuts,
Tell me the name of the man that put the doors on your car? If you cannot then your car is just a myth?
Really?
Really?
Report Post »WSGAC
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:14pmThere is NO archeological evidence for a global flood!
And before anyone retorts with Grand Canyon examples, please know the difference and distinction between archeological and paleontological or geological evidence.
Again, there is NO archeological evidence for a global flood!
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:54pmNo archaeoligical evidence of a global flood in Arizona? Wow you evolutionists really do keep setting the bar high. There is now and always has been a huge population in Arizona…oops! Nevermind.
Report Post »Patricia Ward
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:12amYou can argue with Christians and call them stupid all you want but Jesus will not argue with you when you bow before Him at the judgment. He will simply say “Deaprt from me, ye workers of iniquity, I knew ye not”. And the next thing you know, you will be in Hell for all eternity. I have and will pray for you that you may come to the Truth before it is too late.
Report Post »notatoomah
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:48amIt never ceases to amaze me how many people consider themselves to be Christians, and yet they waste their money on stuff like this. People are either going to believe in Jesus, or they won’t. An amusement park will not change anything. Jesus said, go forth and tell all nations, not go forth and try to recreate something I made perfect the first time. You are wasting time, and that’s exactly what Satan wants you to do.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:59am@notatoomah
Report Post »Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:48am
‘People are either going to believe in Jesus, or they won’t. An amusement park will not change anything.’
***********************
The goal of this park is not to convert people, but to make money. That is the pupose of the whole AIG organization as well, from what I can tell on their website. On the surface, it is full of articles meant to teach and convince, but everything invariably turns to purchasing additional books, videos, etc. The ‘Young Earth’ religious angle is juts a marketing angle to sell product. Kind of like Glen’s operation. :)
trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:14amThere needs to be a reason for faith. Otherwise, why would you not believe in the tooth fairy? Or unicorns? Science is trying to prove the Bible is wrong. The reason for these “amusement parks” is to show that there are other, better, ways to look at the scientific evidence we have. Science actually BACKS UP what the Bible says. There is much evidence for what the Bible says. That is the reason why they are doing this.
Report Post »jb.kibs
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:52amwhy is it a waste of time? i will goto this park when it is done. i will take my children there… the only waste of time is doing nothing. idle hands are the devils playground.
Report Post »TOMSERVO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:19pm“The new park will be “so slick and so well done, you can get people to believe in anything. Creationism, when you’re ready to believe anything.”
“When you get to walk through the boat and see how big this thing really was, and how many cages were there, and how much room there was for food and water … our hope is people start seeing that this is plausible, that the account could be believed,” Zovath said.”
Yeah, they sure won’t be trying to convince you of anything. Sheesh. I really don’t get this. People who are interested in going to this theme park are true believers, right? And they already believe so strongly that they really don‘t need this physical representation of Noah’s boat in order to believe that it existed, right? So what the hell is the point besides $$$? This is nothing more than a disgusting display of profiteering off of helpless, easily exploited religious folks who would be much better off saving or investing their money.
Of course, the cherry on top is the government subsidation of this religious project. None of you tea partiers would ever see the hypocrisy there….
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:42pmThat is very noble of you tomservo, caring for all those poor, ignorant, easily exploitable, helpless, religious dummy-dumb-dumbs!
Report Post »TOMSERVO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:26pm@TrollTrainer, they can do and spend their money on whatever they want. It’s the fact that no one here sees (or at least, is willing to acknowledge, since there are plenty of intelligent folks here) the hypocrisy of this undertaking. Instead, all you get is cheerleading because these folks are on your “team.”
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:44pmI am not following your objection Tom? Of course the exhibit is designed to show that the ark is a realistic possibility and not just some fairy tale. I know many atheistic types object to that…Whatever…The fact is neither side will ever be proven. Why shouldn‘t Christians try and show believers that despite the secular world’s objection biblical creation and Genesis history is possible? They use science to do that and you are free to browse the exhibits and find objections yourself. I have been to the Creation Museum 3 times now and it is well put together and EVERYTHING it claims scientifically is fact. You might not agree with the theories or the conclusions, but you cannot fault them on misrepresenting facts. They show how the flood was possible and that the evidence we have today can support it.
If your objection is government funding then you did not read very closely. Allow me to quote:
““The legislation is so drafted that they will give this incentive to any organization that is going to increase tourism in Kentucky,” Kagin said. “And there’s no question whatsoever that this group will.”
There is nothing happening here that does not happen everywhere else. The Creation Museum has been a boon to KY and I am sure this will be also. I personally cannot wait to visit.
Report Post »TOMSERVO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:02pmHow can you fall back on that argument? You people are against that legislation, right? I mean, maybe not but that would sure fly in the face of the majority of arguments around here. So, you have no problem taking advantage of a piece of legislation that you are fundamentally against, as long as it benefits your cause directly, are you following me?
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:13pmI have no problem with a state offering tax breaks to a business that brings revenue into the state.
Report Post »TOMSERVO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:03pmNoted! I’m sure that jives beautifully with the rest of your political persuasions.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:26pmWhat are my political persuasions? Are you making an assumption here? Truthfully, I am not sure where I fall myself anymore. I would like to think I have a large libertarian bent in me…but libertarians are simply not realistic. I do believe in “some” government and we need a “social safety net” though it is terribly abused at this point. I am certainly a Christian fundamentalist and that sometimes conflicts with my libertarian views. For instance, I am pro-life and believe abortion should be outlawed as murder. But I also believe in a separation of church and state and all the Constitutional arguments about taking Christianity out of secular life do not much bother me. I no more want a theocracy any more than the most ardent atheist. I am strongly right/Republican/conservative but I would be willing to consider amnesty to illegals IF they locked down the border first…I could go on, but my point is I just do not fit neatly in a single box.
So…In this case I would prefer if the tax system could be restructured. maybe a flat or fair tax, maybe a combo…Whatever…I would like to see all loopholes closed and I would love to see taxes become more fair. So in principle I suppose I can agree with your objection, but if this is the way the system works then why shouldn’t everyone use it to their advantage? If I can get a tax break somewhere I jump on it, that is not abusing the system, it is using it to its full extent.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:47amSo a drunken moron from the Bronze Age was able to save all the species, millions of animals, for a worldwide flood. Grow up. The Ark story is just that a story could have never happened. Impossible, how did Noah get the marsupials from Australia to the Middle East and on the Ark? How could there be animals for the Arctic and Antarctic surviving in the desert on a boat? Think about it. Go to your local zoo and ask them how they care for the different kinds of animals from around the world.
Report Post »http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7ZIZ-Upalk&feature=relmfu
GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:57amQuite literal aren’t you?
Do you reserve criticism only for Christianity, or do you also equally condemn Islam and Judaism (and Hinduism and other religions)? Just curious.
Report Post »BOMUSTGO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:59amBefore the flood, there was just one big land mass called Pangia.After the tower of Babel incident, the Bible says the land divided.All peoples tell of a flood story around the globe.Look up the web site called “OOPARTS”. Out Of Place Artifacts. See who the real morons are!
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:11am@BOMUSTGO
Just started checking out OOPARTS and it sounds promising already. Wikipedia says that the use of this ‘is largely confined to cryptozoologists, proponents of ancient astronaut theories, Young Earth creationists, and paranormal enthusiasts.’. I love that kind of stuff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Out-of-place_artifact
However, this is hardly a point in favor of the the Young Earth theory being true. Puts it in the same category as Sasquatch and Loch Ness monster theories.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:29amGhostOfJefferson, Do you reserve criticism only for Christianity?
No, all the concocted ideas from the mind of ancient desert dwelling nomads. The books that we cherish from that time are riddled with real bad philosophy and downright falsehoods.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:33amok so explain the huge number of fossils in the world…fossils don’t usually happen…it takes something like a flood to create them….
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:10amThank you for your reply Lotus. Many “atheists” I encounter are dogmatic in their condemnation of Christianity but are silent and evasive regarding the other religions of the world. I suspect that deep down most atheists aren’t anti-religion, they’re anti-Christianity, which is another thing entirely in my mind.
I appreciate your honest answer to my question. Slainte.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:33amLotus, you don’t have the guts to criticize the muslims…and we all know it…the muslims are your allies…because fascists of a feather, flock together.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:58pmjoe1234:-() The Muslim faith is far more dangerous than the Christian faith. I have no trouble calling them out for their atrocities and the stupidity of their beliefs. Also, I vote republican more then democrat. The far left does ally themselves with the enemies of our country. I just don’t believe the unbelievable. No proof of god or gods. If religions were real we would be living in a Harry Potter novel. Look around, that doesn’t seem to be the case. Keepin it real.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:59pmno proof? israel and the jews…
Report Post »wiseworks
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:44amIt seems a good thing to bring awarenes of the Bible into the public eye. The sad thing is that with every attempt by well meaning people of little faith or knowledge, the waters of truth get muddied a little more.
Report Post »By building a “BOAT”, the facts of scripture are diluted and God’s word is nullified to fable status. The ARK of the covenant was not a “boat’ but it was an “ark”. Why is God’s Ark a “boat”? A barrel will float as will a bottle or even a “box”. People seem to loose sight (or never gain it) of the fact that the Ark was never supposed to go anywhere. So they build boats instead of BOXES. Look at the photos taken of the ark. It was neither fancy nor beautiful, it was a tar covered box that floated, that was it’s job. I applaud these people’s zeal but their zeal is not according to knowledge and God will hold them accountable for deception.
BOMUSTGO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:06amThe “ARK” of Noah was basically a huge barge and it did not have a rudder or anything like that…Remeber, Noah was an amateur, and the Titanic was built by professionals!
Report Post »BoyDawg
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:42amI don’t know how old the earth is, but when timelines becomes the stumbling block, I simply pose this question: If God could create the earth, don‘t you think He could decide how ’old’ it would be when He did? I mean, if He could create a living creature, why would I doubt His ability to also create some fossils and toss them around a mountain-top somewhere?
Report Post »BOMUSTGO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:11amScientists only guess as to how old the earth is. They try to base it on the strata, or layers of rock.There is a problem, they found a petrified tree standing vertically in the strata that they say was millions of years of layers.How could this tree be there? Answer, the FLOOD created the layers very quickly.
Report Post »HolyCrap
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:27pmYes, God tossed fossils over the mountain tops….I’m trying to remember what verse that is. LOL Funniest thing I’ve read today!
Report Post »christos
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:42am…….Wow great idea very creative definitely will plan to visit this theme park…
Report Post »AllAmericanGirl22
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:32amCool :)
Report Post »pengelke
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:25amAll the answers to all the rebutles about a literal creation and a 6000 year earth can be found here:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/get-answers
Happy reading
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:36amThis website is hilarious. I especially like the section where they explain how dinosaurs lived at the same time as humans.
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/what-happened-to-the-dinosaurs
Report Post »BOMUSTGO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:14amThere are many artifacts that have been found where it proves that man and dinosaurs co-existed.See the website “OOPARTS.”
Report Post »saranda
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:24amMy favorite part of answers in Genesis is the description of T Rex as a plant eater until sin entered the world. No dinosaurs, or in fact any animals, ate flesh until Adam and Eve. Lions, vultures, shark, killer whales, ant eaters, bats……all plant eaters until Adam and Eve.
Report Post »Conservative Queen
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:39pm@ Saranda – I’m glad you love that part, but let’s look at the reasoning behind this. Creationists (Christians, Jews & Muslims) believe God created a perfect world, without sin which
Report Post »meant without death. Sin entered the world b/c of Adam & Eve which then resulted in death – “For the wages of sin is death” Romans 6:23. So if death did not exist until sin, how could animals have died before that? Now, you have every right not to believe that but before you start making fun of us that do, can you please explain how the world magically exploded and formed from nothing? Doesn’t science prove unequivocally that you can not create something from nothing? Yet, people like you believe it without question and then ridicule those who dare to have faith in the Word of God. If you would just study evolutionary theory, you would see it goes COMPLETELY against science. Life just beginning out of nothing, creatures developing limbs and traits just because, taking millions of years for a river to change an area when it was proven last year in Japan that a tsunami can drastically alter an area in a moment. What you don’t realize is it takes just as much faith to believe in evolution as it does in creationism, especially when we find out some dinosaurs were a complete hoax i.e. Brontosaurus (look it up). Or Lucy, the “first person”, whose body parts they found across 50 MILES! Really? You might try really studying evolution before you tell creationists they just believe a
Conservative Queen
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 4:23pm…story. Also, did you know that Darwin actually believed that Asians came from orangutans, Africans from gorillas (because they were big, strong and not that bright) and Caucasians from chimpanzees (because he believed them to be the favored race). So not only was he a complete racist as we are all evolving to the perfect race – whitey – you also then have to believe that 3 completely different animals that cannot reproduce together had to all evolve at the same time into completely identical creatures (except for some non-crucial cosmetic traits) that are so identical they can reproduce together. Ok, science, prove it. I mean really prove it. Where are the 3 missing links?? I honestly believe that most people who argue evolution is science and that’s the end of the story actually have no real clue what evolution really and truly teaches. They learned in science class that we came from apes, that’s evolution, science “proves” it and that’s that. I believe that because if I ever ask an evolutionist to back up his beliefs they either call me names, give me a link to a site that if they ever read they would not send, or they just don’t respond at all. I’m a creationist but I have extensively studied both the Bible and Evolution. If everyone did that than maybe we could have more productive discussions with evolutionist instead of “It’s science, idiot, so you have to believe it true. I don’t have to prove it. Creationists are ignorant.” Yeah, thanks Einst
Report Post »johnnycarson
Posted on August 30, 2011 at 5:59pm@CONSERVATIVEQUEEN
Your story about Darwin isn’t true. Sorry. Who ever told you that, was doing so hoping you’d believe it and embarrass yourself.
Report Post »TEARS FOR AMERICA
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:07amKen Ham would debate Staiger’s vitriol into the can…sorry, sir, but your hatred toward Faith makes me sad for you…the Scripture, God’s Word (not the Holy Koran as Obama clearly loves) is validated by history and archeology every day. I will stand with Abba, my Father.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:14am‘Scripture, God’s Word (not the Holy Koran as Obama clearly loves) is validated by history and archeology every day’
********
This is simply not true. A literal interpretation of the Bible’s creation story, the flood, etc. is physically impossible. Never happened like that. We have scientific proof. That does not invalidate the Bible, it just changes the interpretation.
I don’t think the Catholic Church interprets the Bible literally, and they seem to have zero problems with evolution. This reminds me of something St. Augustin said about fools interpreting that ‘Jesus sits on the right hand of the Father’ to mean that God actually has hands.
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:19amEver notice how the Amish, the true old order Schwarzentrubber Amish (sp), don’t go around making idols to Christianity? They don’t even construct churches, heck, they don’t even put faces on dolls.
Ever wonder why?
A Jesus amusement or theme park seems to me to be one of the most anti-Christian things a person can do.
Report Post »SREGN
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:43amBaik – Nothing is physically impossible if you created and are in control of physics.
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:59am@Srgen
Are you suggesting then that God is putting things here to fool us then? Wouldn’t that be lying?
Report Post »SREGN
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:17amGhost – No, I‘m responding to Baik’s “A literal interpretation of the Bible’s creation story, the flood, etc. is physically impossible.” While six day creations and worldwide floods may be impossible for the three of us to accomplish, they are not impossible for the creator. There is absolutely no evidence for all life evolving from single cell animals, or the creation of single cell animals from inanimate primordial soups. The fossil record simply does not support evolution as it’s being taught. Even Darwin stated that. And consider this; if the flood account were true, you’d expect to see virtually all divergent cultures worldwide having a flood legend since we would all be decendents of Noah. And you know what? They do.
Report Post »BOMUSTGO
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:17amThe term sitting on the “right hand” is a metaphor meaning he is sitting on the right hand off power. Jesus (Yeshua) is GOD manifest in the flesh. ALL power is given unto him.
Report Post »ktowers
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:18amsregn,
The theory of evolution says nothing about life arising from nonlife. It only deals with life changing over time from one form to another, with no particular end result in mind.
Report Post »SREGN
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 1:23pmNote my qualifier “as it’s being taught”. I was taught, as my kids were, by biology teachers in the public schools, that lightning struck the primordial soup and single celled organisms developed from the compounds produced and those single celled organisms evolved over millions of years into the pinnacle of the evolutionary process, Joy Bahar and Barack Hussein Obama. Oh, and you better not question it, its settled science. One more word, young man, and you‘ll be sitting in the principal’s office.
Report Post »Ron Staiger
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:04amSilly flat-earthers!
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:36amyeah the only people dumber are those moron who believe in that racist atheist fairy tale known as evolution…
Report Post »Patricia Ward
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:33am@SREGN
Where did lightening come from? Where did single cell organisms come from.?
Report Post »Ron Staiger
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:03amNo apology forthcoming to an idiot!
Report Post »Mettag
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:19amSo I am an idiot becuase I believe something different from you. Yeah, that sounds about right. You mentioned fish in the alps as a “proof” that creation didnt occur and I propose a different opinion. Rather then saying “well, I disagree but I see you point” you name call. Makes me wonder who the idiot really is. God bless you Ron, people like you keep my faith God strong.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:40am@Mettag
Report Post »Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:19am
‘So I am an idiot becuase I believe something different from you.’
********
You believe that 2+2=5.
Mettag
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:25am@Baikonur. Nope not even close. 2+2=4. I had to learn that in college while getting my engineering degree. This just more exAmples of trilling to discredit and discourage rather then disapprove. Rather then attempt to prove me wrong you name call and attempt to call my intelligence in to question. Ask yourself “why?” why are you so threatened by someone with different beliefs then you? Why do you care if I choose to believe in the Bible rather then men? Why is it important to you to attempt to disparage someone whith different beliefs? I thought liberals were supposed to accepting and open and tolerant? Does tolerance not extend to religion?
Report Post »Ron Staiger
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:01amI find no conflict between creationism and evolution. I believe that the Earth, including all of its natural processes, are part of God’s gift to us. It is the evil, self-annointed, foaming-at-the-mouth theocratic charlatans who have coaxed every last nickel from the pockets of their poorest parishoners that have invented the creationism/evolution conflict to satiate their own gluttonous greed and force-fed putrid lies to their submissive flock. They are disgusting, vile agents of the devil who should be tarred and feathered before being run out of their blasphemous pulpits and shipped off to lands where a lie is presented in its purist form, without the base alloy of hypocrisy, like Russia, Syria or Iran.
Report Post »woodyl1011fl
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:19amOh, you forgot the White House, New York Times, Washington Post, DNC, US Senate majority party, Pelosi’s group. Your ignorance is only exceed by your self-righteous hateful arrogance.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:59amThe Holy Ark. Richly filled with the allusion to the Birth, Resurrection , and Return of Christ – and, politely depicts how the family can be ”saved.” ” Good ” decision Kentucky.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:56amFrom the article: ‘ A park in tourism-rich Orlando, Fla., features a portrayal of the crucifixion by actors six days a week’
That is sick! Why would anyone do that, or want to see it? Torture porn.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:08amLike the rest of your posts in this article this only shows your misconceptions and total lack of understanding.
2+2 does not equal 5, yet that is what evolution teaches, not biblical creation. You have no proof, you only misinterpret the evidence. You make it silly and impossible because that is what you want to see. The scientific evidence is strongly against evolution yet you continue to believe it. Because you wish to. There is much evidence for a world wide flood, the cultural legends alone should open your eyes. Polystrate fossiles are found around the world, as are marine fossils on mountaintops. As far as putting all life forms in the ark, this has been shown to be possible. Especially when you consider that many of the species we have today did come from a single pair, such as canines and equines…No, it only amounts to what you WANT to see.
I think you are authentic, I believe you are simply trying to help others see what you consider is truth and that you are not scoffing or ridiculing. I suggest you visit the Creation Museum in Kentucky. It is an awesome place. Just keep an open mind and see what they have to say. You might be surprised how neatly and cleanly, following 100% of the scientific evidence, these theories are laid out. You tell yourself it is impossible, but it is only a matter of interpretation. The difference is creationists have the Bible to show us what the completed puzzle is supposed to look like.
Report Post »beckisnuts
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:28amTroll train, the Bible is a collection of stories and myths written by ignorant, uneducated people. There is no scientific evidence that a supernatural entity created anything at all. None. It’s sad to see so many delusional people on earth clinging to false beliefs and superstition in the face of strong evidence to the contrary. You people are simply in stubborn denial of reality. Face it.
Report Post »trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:34amBeckisnuts,
It goes against my beliefs as a Christian to let anyone go…But even the Bible tells us that there comes a time to brush the dust off our sandals and move on.
Yes Beckisnuts, you are right! It is just a bunch of silly fairy tales and nonsense. It just makes us feel good, but we do not expect you to seriously believe it…You are MUCH too smart for that!
Have a good day my friend.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:35amfascistisnuts…why don’t you list all the evidence that your racist god darwin waved his holy hands and created everything then?
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:45amHow funny and ludicrous! But hey, if it increases Kentucky tourism, and of course it will, I am all for it. Probably 20-30% of their visitors will be there to laugh at it. I’d go if I was in the area.
Kentucky is a beautiful state. There are much better places to visit there as a tourist, like the Mammoth Caves.
Report Post »woodyl1011fl
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:13amThe true truth is the only reason you or anyone else is here today is because Noah built the ark as God instructed him to do. Perhaps you should actually exercise that brain of yours and do some serious study of history. Na, probably don’t want your worldview presuppositions revealed as false and possibly change how you desire to live your life.
Report Post »Baikonur
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:26am@woodyl1011fl
Report Post »Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:13am
‘The true truth is the only reason you or anyone else is here today is because Noah built the ark as God instructed him to do. ‘
**********
Woody, there was no Noah or a physical arc. It would have been physically impossible to stuff pairs of all the life forms on there. Nor was there a world wide flood. Regional events, like the Santorini eruption, or the overflow of the Black Sea may have been the basis for the flood stories, or the whole story may be an esoteric allegory for the development of life on earth at some stage. But there was no actual Noah, arc, etc. It’s just silly, come on.
wiseworks
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:02amBaikonur,
Report Post »I am surprised at your use of Satan’s trick with Eve (oldest in the book), but it doesn’t hold water. Just because you think that the limits of knowledge are contained within your head doesn’t make it so. There is photographic evidence of the ark in Turkey. There is global evidence of a contiguous deluge. There is the evidence of microevolution within species. There is the Bible that stated all of this before you (or people much more knowledgeable than you) ever knew it. The evidence is real and is more voluminous than you would need to get out of a murder charge or make one stick. Perhaps you might try reading the Bible some day before you find out permanetly that you are failing the test.
trolltrainer
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:20amCareful with that “ark evidence” in Turkey. I would not use that, it is undetermined what they have there. I do not think it is the ark, but it is possible…I wouldn’t hold my breath though.
Report Post »jedi.kep
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:39amFantastic!
Report Post »Ron Staiger
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:36amI have studied geology, sedimentology and paleontology for many years. I would like one person who believes that the Earth is 6000 years old (their misinterpretation of the bible- not God’s) to produce one physicist that can explain the process of deposition and erosion which created the Grand Canyon or allows for marine fossils to be found high in the Alps. Do that and I will retract the statement that you are a bunch of friggin morons!
Mettag
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:56amRon – here is the thing. Christians have faith that the Bible is correct and that the Earth was created in exact ly the way He says. I don‘t have to prove or disprove scientifically that it could or couldn’t have happen for me to believe that. You can think what you want about us but it just fits in with what the Bible says about tests and trials and hate we will have to endure in order to have our belief. All the “evidence” in the world will not convince me that the Earth was created in any manner other then what the Bible says. I have faith in something, I am sorry that you don’t. And besides I know for a fact that there are scientists that theories about how some natural thing like the grand canyon could have occurred using Biblical reasoning. Also, as far as fish in Alps, if there was a world wide flood, couldn’t those fish in the Alps be consider proof of that flood. How else could they get up there? I await your apology.
Report Post »stormerwasright
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:59amHave you checked out the mini “canyon” carved out in just seconds by the blast of Mt. St. Helen ?
Report Post »When Mount St. Helens erupted, one side of the caldera was blown out, and the resulting rush of water from melted snow, plus the blast of hot ash, carved out 300 feet of recently laid loose ash and sediment. area.
pengelke
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:21amHere are the answers you seek my friend.
Report Post »http://www.answersingenesis.org/get-answers
These are highly educated geologists and astro-physicists among othe scientific disciplines.
woodyl1011fl
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:22amCheck out Mt,. Saint Helen and results of worldwide volcanic activtiy before continue to prattle about with such nonsense.
Report Post »wiseworks
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:31amSir, I have also studied. I studied Piltdown man, the brontosaurus, and many other “facts” of the evolutionist religion that have been changed with the stories over the years. I however, cannot ignore the photographic evidence of the Ark in Turkey, nor the fact that we can only trace the oldest living trees on earth back to some 9000 years, nor the fact that for carbon dating to be accurate, evolutionists MUST ASSUME that the atmosphere of the past is the same as it is now, when we know from the scriptures that it was not. The reason I left the religion of evolution is because when the facts were studied, I could no longer argue with what the Bible says. Oh and FYI it isn’t science unless you can reproduce results by experiment. You need more faith to believe macroevolution than I need to believe the Bible, and since the Bible doesn’t change and the evoluionist story does, I think I will stick with the Facts.
Report Post »SREGN
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 8:56amRon – Take a jar of different sands and gravels. Add water and shake it up. Let it settle, and it will settle into bands. The great flood was not a gentle event. Check out the photographs of the canyons produced in a day during the Mt St Helens eruption. Imagine a rapid erosion event like that in your jar of banded gravel. As far as mountain top marine fossils, consider the fact that in a worldwide flood, the tops of mountains would become a “sea floor”, if you will.
Report Post »Hermano
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:19amRon, can you explain why there is no evidence of secondary erosion in the Grand Canyon. By secondary I mean in between layers that were deposited over millions of years. Surely there should have been some streams, rivers or rain runoff that would carve out some notches or troughs in the layers. But we do not see any. All we see are straight deposition layers.
Report Post »Patricia Ward
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:41amRon, we do not need a physicist to prove anything to us. Because we know that God can create anything and just because small minded people do not believe it does not make their beliefs valid.
Report Post »Searchaddy
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:35amMay God continue to bless Ken Ham and his staff at AIG for the work they are doing.
Report Post »JJ Coolay
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:42amThere is no way this place will not come under some kind of scrutiny.
Report Post »Think —-Gay women wearing “marriage is gay” t shirts and then think about them walking around in this place. Somehow, someone will find a way to feel “disenfranchised” by this place.
joei234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:16amGod has never blessed those bozos in the first place. They’re a bunch of money-driven frauds and fools and are an embarrassment to God. He probably feels the same towards them as He does about the gays that got created when He was tired.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 11:31amyou’re an embarrasment to your god, satan…he doesn’t like morons…
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 2:30pm@joe ha ha satan:P christianity bastardized the character of satan for… Satan from the torah has nothing to do with what christianity made up about this character… Please enlighten me about when and where in the torah satan is this embodiment of evil acting outside the accords of god….let alone CEO of some kind of eternal hell that has fire and stuff. in judaism satan only instigates one to commit sin in servitude of god’s desire.. what does that say about god? petty
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 3:58pm@cesium….lets see you never did answer my question about isaiah 53…or explain these verses in psalm 45
6 Your throne, O God,[c] will last for ever and ever;
a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
7 You love righteousness and hate wickedness;
therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
by anointing you with the oil of joy.
you don’t know much about your god, do you? even he knows scripture…
Isaiah 14
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
13 You said in your heart,
“I will ascend to the heavens;
I will raise my throne
above the stars of God;
I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly,
on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon.[b]
I would say get a clue, but in your case, get an exorcism…
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:22pm@joe
As a proof text from the Tanach, Christianity uses Isaiah 14:12 to prove their stand regarding Satan.
Isaiah 14:12: How have you fallen from heaven, the morning star? You have been cut down to earth, You who cast lots on nations.[2]
Christianity argues “that Isaiah’s mention of the fallen ‘morning star’ refers to Satan’s ultimate demise at the end of time when Satan will finally be cast into a lake of fire as articulated in the twentieth chapter of the Book of Revelation.”[5]
However, if you read the fourteenth chapter of Isaiah it will quickly become apparent that the “morning star” is referring to Nebuchadnezzar.
Isaiah 14:4: And you shall bear this parable against the king of Babylon, and you shall say, “How has the dominator ceased, has ceased the haughty one![2]
In Isaiah 14:12 “Nebuchadnezzar is compared to the planet Venus whose light is still visible in the morning yet vanishes with the rise of the sun. … Like the light of Venus, Nebuchadnezzar’s reign shone brilliantly for a short time, yet, as the prophets foretold, was eventually overshadowed by the nation of Israel whose light endured and outlived this arrogant nation who tormented and exiled her.”[5]
Judaism firmly believes that HaSatan is nothing more than an accusing angel that resides in the heavenly court. HaSatan is not a fallen angel and is not evil incarnate.
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:32pmJoe1234, Don’t you ever get tired of outwitting Cesium? It’s not even close.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 5:33pm@joe you are stranding in your christian brainwashed mind trying to spew this BS at a Jew… FYI jews don’t do exorcisms. There is a very specific reason we do not practice such nonsense… we have replaced accusations of supernatural blame with what is called “personal responsibility.” When is the last time you’ve seen a jew commit a crime and blame it on the devil? That is what christians and muslims do. You will never understand jewish perspective… We don’t waste our time with heaven and hell, as we have life to live. ie.“Chai” However, you will waste your life obsessed with such dribble, and this type of thinking has led to severe neurosis in individuals. We do not fear out of sin… Jews acknowledge we sin, and we clear our sins every year at Rosh hashanna in hopes to do better next year and avoid sinning. We never expect “damnation.” That is a psychologically negative way to think and the antithesis of jewish thought. We don’t carry the garbage with us in fear… The most important aspect of being a jew is doing Mitzvah…. The jewish perspective on punishment is that which god delivers himself and no one talks of eternities of damnation… You will never ever get it… I have all of the jewish nation behind me on this perspective and it is not my opinion!
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 7:11pm@beck was fox… quite the contrary.. If you read the posting here. Your overzealous assertion that I am wrong in saying “hitler was a christian” certainly discredits you as well. Hitler was brought up as a roman catholic! That was his first problem and probably contributed to his neuroses and hatred for jews and there is a wealth of anti-Semitism in christianity.. This excuse of a new covenant is a BS way to get out of avoiding pork etc. Jesus never said stop being kosher and he never said stop keeping the passover, it is all a clever way to separate people from the jews. Jesus never would have wanted that! Hitler then totally rejected christianity out of his insane ideas but he was certainly not an atheist… Just because he became anti-christian did not mean that what he was doing was without his own ideas about divine providence which he spoke of frequently.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:48pmbeck, I actually feel sorry for him…he‘s another atheist who’s lost and doesn’t even know how lost he is…he defends a theory that DIRECTLY led to the holocaust, and attacks christians, especially conservative christians, who are the only friends the jews have left in this world. ironic no?
@cesium…it refers to both….as does ezekiel 28….
11 The word of the LORD came to me: 12 “Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says:
“‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden,
the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
carnelian, chrysolite and emerald,
topaz, onyx and jasper,
lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl.[b]
Your settings and mountings[c] were made of gold;
on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
just as daniel talks about the ‘prince of persia’ of course he refers to the ‘power behind the throne’ because no human prince could delay the angel gabriel from delivering the message to daniel
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:50pmoh and cesium..the NT, which was written by jews, does report that jews do exorcisms…
acts 19
13 Some Jews who went around driving out evil spirits tried to invoke the name of the Lord Jesus over those who were demon-possessed. They would say, “In the name of the Jesus whom Paul preaches, I command you to come out.” 14 Seven sons of Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, were doing this. 15 One day the evil spirit answered them, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know about, but who are you?” 16 Then the man who had the evil spirit jumped on them and overpowered them all. He gave them such a beating that they ran out of the house naked and bleeding.
I‘m sure you think its just a ’christian plot’ to discredit jews…LOL
…and yes demons exist…I know from terrifying experience they do….
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 9:57pm“I have all of the jewish nation behind me on this perspective and it is not my opinion”
uh huh, and are you sure thats a good thing? I don‘t know if you’ve noticed, but most of the OT talks about prophets and judges being sent to the disobedient children of israel…you do know He drove the jews out of the promised land…and He had good reason to do it…
given the majority of jewish nation has been CONSISTENTLY wrong…do you really want to bet your soul on that?? explain this to me…
Zechariah 12;10
“And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn.
take a guess at who you pierced….
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:01pm“Jesus never said stop being kosher ” sigh…really now…
Mark 7:19
New International Version (NIV)
19 For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)
Jesus fulfilled the law..He said so Himself….
Matthew 5 17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 17, 2011 at 10:04pm@cesium…I find the whole ‘hitler was a christian” BS offensive…so tell me this time, I noticed you didn’t have the guts to before, if hitler was such a christian why did he create the deutshen christen church to replace the christian church???
and why did hitler put so many christians in concentration camps then??? HMmmmm???
So this second Christmas of Hitler’s war finds Niemoller and upwards of 200,000 other Christians (some estimates run as high as 800,000) behind the barbed wire of the frozen Nazi concentration camps. Here men bear mute witness that the Christ—whose birth the outside world celebrates unthinkingly at Christmas—can still inspire a living faith for which men and women even now endure im prisonment, torture and death as bravely as in centuries past.
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,765103-1,00.html
I know you have no answer……
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 12:21amCESIUM said: @beck was fox… quite the contrary.. If you read the posting here. Your overzealous assertion that I am wrong in saying “hitler was a christian” certainly discredits you as well. Hitler was brought up as a roman catholic!
Report Post »This is your largest mistake. You irrationally assume that all who claim Christianity are followers of Christ. The Catholic Church abused many people not just Jews. They were as subject to corruption as Hitler because power corrupts. Most of the people in Europe could not read until the printing press. Is a Catholic that different from me or you? Probably not. Is the pope. Yes. He is a liar by claiming he can intercede between us and God. You have been taught the truth on this site.Read the Torah. Read the Bible. Don‘t take men’s word. Take God’s! Read some history! Hitler was heavily influenced by the occult. Was the foundation laid by a so called church? I don’t know. Was it laid by Satan? Yes.
Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:53am@joe I am not going to comment much on your claim about jews and exorcism.. and as a Jew myself, whatever the NT says is invalid to me and my people anyway… You’re going to use the Jews who were involved in the NT as your defense? really? What I find funny is that you emphatically say god drove the jews from israel as if that is what actually happened. You probably think moses’s staff turned into a snake… get real.. As far as anyone knows Jesus and Judas in cahoots with the romans, faked the crusifixion ran off with the money in the end, scamming everyone, and now all you nuts are here… great… any fantastical story from the past is just that A STORY. You could use Shakespeare’s stories as works of biblical dogma if you like.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 2:04am@floridacracker.. If you believe any of that stuff really happened and curses are real, you are craaazzzzyyyy Also Jesus is not the messiah if you are a Jew!!
The Messiah is born of two human parents, as we said.But Jesus, according to Christian theology, was born of a union between a Human woman and God, rather than two HUMAN parents, as was Hercules, and Dionysis, as well as many other pagan gods.
The Messiah can trace his lineage through his human biological father, back to King David (Isaiah 11:1,10; Jeremiah 23:5; Ezekiel 34:23-24; 37:21-28; Jeremiah 30:7-10; 33:14-16; and Hosea 3:4-5). But Jesus’s lineage cannot go through his human father, according to Christian theology, as Jesus’s father was not Joseph the husband of Mary. According to Christian theology, Jesus’s father was God.
http://www.jewfaq.org/mashiach.htm
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 9:03am@cesium…oh I knew you’d discount it, the NT is reliable as a history book, but you never let facts get in the way of your ideology.
“What I find funny is that you emphatically say god drove the jews from israel as if that is what actually happened. ”
yeah it did actually happen..whats funny is I’m more jewish than you are…in that I believe the scriptures….as Jesus said, God can raise up children of Abraham from stones…
so where is your PROOF none of these things happened? how do you know? you don’t…you’re an atheist, and you have no room for the supernatural. why do you call yourself jewish, siince you don’t believe your own scripture? hmmm??
thanks for not answering about the christians being int he concentration camps…that quote probably gave you a great deal of pleasure didn’t it? knowing that those you hate so, christians, were in concentration camps…
and no surprise you ignore those verses in psalms….its fun to watch you squirm, loser.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 9:38am@cesium..oh your story about Jesus avoid the crucifiction is just laughably stupid…I mean really is that the best you can do?? you atheists aren’t nearly as clever as you think you are..
yeah the apostles, who would have had to know about the scam, were all willing to die for lie…yeah it makes perfect sense…only in your deluded little mind….such stupidity has to hurt, you must be in a great deal of pain….
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:17pm@joe yea ok you’re more jewish than me.. I’m sure you can read hebrew just as well as I can. You certainly do not live with jewish perspective! I never discounted the absolute fact many christians were slaughtered in the holocaust as well.. You make a lot of stupid assumptions about me. You admit to believing the supernatural is true which completely delegitimizes your approach to science.. If you are a man of absolute truth like me you would acknowledge there are many things about existence that we do not know…that is being truthful! We do not know if there is a purpose or no purpose or an accident or a prime mover or if energy has always been. I admit to the truth.. I know for a fact I will die not knowing certainties about life, hence part of my desire to be a scientist. You claim to know but you don’t! If you have had discussions with god or jesus and they talk back you or you think they give you signs, you need to see a shrink and get on meds. You would have no conception of those things if other humans didn’t teach you language and concepts. If you were raised jewish you would not hold christ as your saviour as he don’t fit the bill of the god of abraham.. if jesus the human said he is god, it is a delusion and violates 2nd commandment!
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 1:38pm@floridacracker.. you are a perfect example of why christians live for their deaths..guess what, you are in the same boat as islam.. You are entirely clueless too “chai.” What you say is preposterous and you recite all this supernatural myth as it is a truth when it is (in fact) unlikely… regardless, Judaism was never about die-hard strict adherence to the word in the torah.. this is why we have midrash,.. Religion is all about producing the emotion of guilt anyway. However, in judaism guilt is far less a concern than mitzvote.. Being jewish has less concern with sin and major concern with helping others… sound familiar? his name was jesus and he wasn’t doing anything new other than being schizophrenic and surrounded by jews at the time who were quite superstitious and literal like many christians are today. Paul created christianity not christ!! Christ never said stop being jewish or keeping jewish law! The gospels said he said that!!!!! You trust men to tell the truth about jesus 40 years after his death? It‘s a fool’s assumption. They could say whatever they wanted to say about jesus.. for all you knows you are living a huge lie. And yet you judge me.
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 2:46pm@cesium…you’ve just admitted to being an atheist…which complete de-legitimizes your approach to science, and makes your ‘science’ a religion. thanks for finally admitting it!
you do know Pasteur, Newton, Farday, Keppler, von Braun, etc…all beleived in the supernatural, so do you not believe in calculus and pasteurization, since they’re illegimate?? I mean seriously you’re a caricature…are you masochistic? you seem to enjoy being made a fool out of…
“If you are a man of absolute truth like me you would acknowledge there are many things about existence that we do not know”
this statement is totally laughable, you discount the supernatural, and you think you‘re a man of ’absolute truth’??? how do you even know what truth is from a darwiniac perspective?? hmmm?? you don’t. get a clue, Jesus is the truth.
then you say…..”We do not know if there is a purpose or no purpose or an accident or a prime mover or if energy has always been.” uh yeah we do know…..because something does not come from nothing…how hard is this?
“You would have no conception of those things if other humans didn’t teach you language and concepts.” laughable,…human are MADE to learn language and concepts…you can’t explain our language and intelligence from a darwiniac perspective.
if I was raised jewish I would believe in Jesus, because I would believe the scripture…and the scripture speaks of Jesus, and He fulfilled all the prophecies
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 2:49pmoh and cesium, Jesus is God almighty, creator of heaven and earth….truth hurts, and I‘m afraid you’ll find out the HARD way, demons exist….
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 8:53pmYou nuts are insane! The bible says it therefore it’s so.? something can’t come from nothing..? WHY NOT?! who are you, the authority on matter and energy in the universe? see what I said about algorithm in the other thread… You want me to get hurt in this after life so bad.. I honestly never had a malicious thought for your fate or desire for you to suffer… haha!!!! I guess I’m more christ like you than you!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Report Post »I thought earlier, “well maybe there is an afterlife where we‘d both find out we were both right and wrong at the same time and not one thing about it is what you nor I expected and all the answers are there and it would be peace and we’d be friends…”But no, you’d prefer I get harmed… gee thanks…This must really get you goin for the lord. hoping for harm to other innocent people who don’t buy into it. I like my imagination of the afterlife better than your christian one. bible thumping fear monger!!!! Actually ya know what joe? I’M SATAN!!!! BOOGY BOOGY!!! I’m here to waste your time and tempt you to the dark side!!! BOOGY BOOGY!!!!
joe1234
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 9:37pmoh poor baby what are you so afraid of huh? thought you didn’t believe in hell?? LOL
I honestly never had a malicious thought for your fate or desire for you to suffer
really? did you forget you threatened me in that other thread?? hmmmm?? oh yeah you’re SO tough…then when I called you on it you punked out…no surprise there. people who threaten others over the internet are wimps.
how can anyone be friends with someone like you? you’re a vile, and disgusting human being, its rather obvious from your posts..
as far as the after life….well you’ll get what you deserve…and I’ll get mercy and grace….but don’t whine, you made the choice…play the game, pay the price….man up loser.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 18, 2011 at 10:33pmand I’m not scared of death at all!! You are, that‘s why you believe in you’re CGI religion.. Imagination is imagination… don’t make it true.. Tell me have you ever been under general anethesia? people under this don’t dream… I was out for 30 minutes but it felt like a split second and I had no dream.. so tell me Joe.. where was I? I did not find myself on another plain of existence, I didn’t have any thoughts or consciousness…I just didn’t exist for that period of time.. It was as if I was never born… one second i‘m awake and the next split second I’m awake.. yet 30 minutes had past! so Where was my conscious joe? Death is most likely like that! They coulda pumped me full of KCL and I wouldn’t know.. I just happened to wake up.. how do you explain that? How do explain people who get knocked out and next thing they know they’re in a hospital or just dead.. the ones who wake never talk about a dream or other plain of existence.. Theyzz is out!!!! only when the chemicals kick back in do you resume consciousness.. please tell me why death will be different!
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 9:44am@cesium…i’ve reported your post…hopefully you will be banned. you are vile, evil and disgusting.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 12:39pm@joe.. actually i’m not vile evil and disgusting… that is another figment of your imagination… you are a rotten vitriolic person far from a humble pious man.. that’s for sure… ha report me… for what?! you are sick and tormented by your christianity and a slave to it… You will never understand freedom or free thinking, as jefferson, madison, pain, and franklin did. you will live your whole life with hateful thoughts towards others who don’t expect to be tortured by silly ugly demons with horns..it is obvious you were indoctrinated by people close to you… you are a loyal dog
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 1:17pm@cesium…you’re an easily led uneducated brain-dead democrat…you follow the herd, its much easier than thinking for yourself. you wouldn’t have the integirty or guts to stand against the conventional wisdom.
you‘re just doing what you’re told. because you don’t have the intelligence to think for yourself, its painfully obvious. I’ve made you look so stupid so many times, you must be masochistic too.
Only Jesus sets you free…you’re a slave…you don’t have the intelligence to even know what freedom is….you’re a pathetic small man, and no matter how many times you tell yourself you’re intellligent, it won’t make it true. sucks to be you. now and especially in the future!!!
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 1:55pmactually i don‘t tell my self I’m intelligent at all.. If I can’t think for myself why is it that after being raised religious, hebrew school twice a week.. sunday school…having a bar mitzvah, going to friday night and sat morning services till i was 16 I choose a different set of ideas later in life on my own? I went against everything I was told fool!!!! and yes I am masochistic I love the burn of ultra spicy food, thus I am primed for the hellllllfiiireee!!! hell fiaaaa!!!!! I also played football, snowboard, skate, so yea im definitely masochistic..you’d never have the guts to drop into a vert ramp, you’d piss yourself like if you were forced to listen to a slayer album.
like people from the old world for so long… you would be one of those christian real life demons burning innocent people suspected of being witches and bringing the plague…
and you have it on the contrary.. you look ridiculous all the time.. every time you self satisfy your answers with god or the supernatural.. The fact you try to even ferociously insert religion into scientific inquiry makes you look as dumb as a witch hunter.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 2:08pmYou should make a script so everytime you hit reply to a “darwinist” it inserts “..your racist savior darwin..” … you are extraordinarily ridiculous… keep digging for your supernatural proof.. you can find anything you want to if you are looking for it and many psychologists can attest to that… If you want to see it you will.. you’re an anti-scientist and a slave to bible dogma… you will never have the GUTS to live in absolute truth because you’d have to admit to “not knowing.” I’ll take it all back when you show me a religious nut walking on water or defying some other law of physics… until then you are a fraud and so was everyone back in the day who claimed truth in lies.. you would be easy to trick.. you probably think chris angel or david blain is the messiah… a little lighting and smoke outside your window and you’d be on your knees pleasing jesus..
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 2:12pmand democrat my ass.. I’m a libertarian! the only type of America who gets it!! .. and quit a conservative one at that.. If I didn‘t think for myself I’d be either a republican or a democrat so your accusation falls flat you right wing extremest buthole. I’ll vote for a jesus loving, gay hating republican if they fix the budget and the station of our country in the world…
Report Post »joe1234
Posted on August 19, 2011 at 10:41pmflorida, its gotten to the point of casting pearls before swine.
Report Post »