Crime

Colorado Hit & Run Sparks Debate Over ‘Personhood’

A pregnant Colorado woman is recovering this week after suffering injuries in a brutal hit-and-run accident last week. But physical wounds will not be the only reminders of the incident — the mother-to-be’s unborn baby was delivered stillborn following the trauma. And though the mother, Laurie Gorham, is now resting in fair condition and resting in a Denver hospital, the emotional scars from the tragic accident won’t soon fade away.

The hit-and-run driver is reportedly nowhere to be found and even though the baby’s life was lost, the driver would unlikely be charged with vehicular homicide, says University of Denver law professor and former prosecutor Karen Steinhauser. According to Steinhauser, the law in Colorado defines a “person” as a “child or a human being who was born alive at the time of the homicidal act.”

According to CBS Denver, Colorado voters turned down a ballot referendum that would have assigned a new definition of “personhood,” making it from the time of conception. But because the initiative was turned down, Gorham’s unborn baby will not receive justice.

The likely charges that would apply in this Gorham’s case are vehicular assault and hit-and-run, and the baby lost could only be taken into account during sentencing.  “The court could consider the fact that she was pregnant at the time and lost the baby in terms of imposing a higher sentence on the vehicular assault or hit-and-run,” Steinhauser says.

Comments (80)

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  • ALL4114ALL
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:51pm

    Since all the facts are not in, let’s also speculate that the abortion-by-auto perhaps could’ve been intentional; that the hit-and-runner could be a pro-abortion left-winger executing his agenda.
    Should they be caught, will their politics be relevant?

    Perhaps narrow down the search to dark-colored SUVs/Pick-ups…. with an Obama bumper sticker.
    Just sayin.

    Report Post »  
  • Hope1620
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:29pm

    Irregardless of laws or opinion, God’s definition of personhood still stands.
    http://revelationrainbow.com/Pro_Choice.asp

    Just curious about the pregnant woman at Fort Hood that was shot by Hasan – is that being considered one or two victims in court? We know what it SHOULD be.

    Report Post »  
    • wilted6orchid
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:12pm

      The pregnant victim in the Ft. Hood slayings does count as two people. Thank God for Texas!!

      Report Post »  
  • stage9
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:15pm

    To a liberal person hood doesn‘t exist until you’re actually fully grown.

    Liberals are idiots.

    Report Post » stage9  
  • Beachplum
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 12:56pm

    so your telling me that if she had the baby the day before and was pushing the baby in a carriage (making him/her only one day old) then and only then could the driver be charged with murder? this world is upside down!

    A PERSON IS A PERSON NO MATTER HOW SMALL!.. and a person who has a small brain (pro abortion people) are still considered persons…go figure?

    Report Post » Beachplum  
  • Bill Wallace
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 12:52pm

    I agree with the definition as is. There should be one universal definition.

    If you define personhood as of conception, abortion then becomes illegal. I am not advocating for abortion though.

    What I disagree with is a situation where there is gray area. Where a mother could be on the way to get an abortion (legal) and get into an accident and lose the baby, but then sue for the loss of her child. She didn’t want the child, was about to terminate, so why should any person then be liable for causing the death of an infant that wasn’t going to be born?

    That results in a flexible definition that becomes dependent on the decision of a woman, which is not right. Nobody should be allowed to switch laws back and forth out of convenience.

    Report Post »  
  • ALL4114ALL
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:31am

    I see where the term “Rocky Mountain High” came from because those Coloradians are whacked out on something.

    How many of them have ever celebrated a pregnancy? Well what are they pregnant with? How many would say: A Baby? Dictionary.com defines a baby as “an unborn child; fetus.”
    Oh yeah, then you’ve got those pesky beating hearts and sonograms clearing showing human life-form.

    Arguing with idiots?

    Report Post »  
  • eisenman0311
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:28am

    How come a person that is responsible for the death of an unborn child can be charged with manslaughter but a woman that has an abortion is not? How come the law says the unborn child is a person of rights when killed by someone else but the unborn child is not a person of rights when the mother has an abortion?

    Report Post »  
  • Akira Gomi
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:51am

    What no speed trap footage, as many lame intersections as that state has? Run a stop light there you will get your name in lights, a photo, as well as a fine.. I feel bad for this young lady, the state of gag me Colorado SUCKS! Dont spend your money in this stinky liberal rape your wallet state. The gays, abortionist and lying fake medical pot BS users have ruined a once beautiful conservative state..

    Report Post » Akira Gomi  
  • STG3_Navy_Vet
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:37am

    I’d put money on the perp being an ILLEGAL ALIEN! Colorado is infested with this vermin, and they’re destroying this once great state. Thanks to Gov. Ritter, and soon to be Gov. Hickenlooper.

    Report Post »  
  • Buck_Ofama
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:14am

    It’s amazing to me that a question that I thought would never be asked (Is a baby in the womb a person?)
    was put to the people of Colorado to decide. They answered no.

    The next question to be put to the people will be “Is a child of age less than,say,2 years a person?”
    I’m not sure what the answer will be. Therein lies the problem.

    Report Post » Buck_Ofama  
  • TwoMinuteMan
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:51am

    [the law in Colorado defines a “person” as a “child or a human being who was born alive at the time of the homicidal act.”]

    This wording is only to protect abortion providers. The mother did not activley seek out an abortion and i am betting she didnt WANT to be hit by a car. So as far as i can see it was murder.

    Report Post » TwoMinuteMan  
  • EqualJustice
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 8:31am

    THERE is never an excuse for a “hit and run.” You idiots blaming the MOM need to get some perpective here. Why would ANYONE leave an injured person to die on the street? NO EXCUSES and stop blaming the VICTIM….. and change your name to LOON while you’re at it! geez What’s wrong with you?

    Report Post » EqualJustice  
  • BurntHills
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 8:00am

    plain ol’ “BABY” or BABY IN UTERO” should be enough for anyone with half a mind to make it be a homicide. the child didn’t have to be BORN to be a person, it WAS a person.

    Report Post » BurntHills  
  • Uncle Sambo
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:18am

    @Dustyluv

    “Yep, almost all the hit and runs in our small town are illegals when they do catch them.”

    If that turns out to be true in this case then Obama and Holder should be charged as an accessory to the crime. If America wasn’t such as big as a whore the people would demand it.

    Report Post »  
  • dbaileyway7b
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:32am

    Illegal’s strike again!

    Report Post »  
    • Dustyluv
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:36am

      Yep, almost all the hit and runs in our small town are illegals when they do catch them.

      Report Post »  
    • RepubliCorp
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 8:51am

      That is why we need the dream act so they can legally kill people & vote for Obama

      Report Post » RepubliCorp  
  • Michael Schmidtman
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:19am

    The voters of Colorado should be proud. I moved out of the state when my parents had to move due to a job transfer, and I don’t recognize the state anymore. It is such a tragedy to watch what used to be a beautiful state, full of good people, being dragged down by liberal politics and mindless political correctness.

    Report Post »  
    • STG3_Navy_Vet
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 10:50am

      I agree. I’m a Colorado native, but my small farm in Kansas is looking better and better by the day. If I didn’t work in high-tech, I’d have left when Tancredo and Buck lost. This state has gone to hell in a hand basket. Referendum C an D voted in, and backed by key Republicans, yet the roads are still crumbling. Laws passed to impound cars of illegal aliens, yet Hickenstupid tells the cops not to enforce it. Ritter and the gang illegally accessing the NCIC to vilify Cory Voorhis, who exposed Ritter’s dirty dealings with illegal aliens. The whole state is upside down, and nothing makes any sense anymore. It’s 1984. Love is war, etc.

      Report Post »  
  • bobodu
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:04am

    It is God’s will that the baby not be born.

    Report Post »  
    • Creestof
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 8:06am

      You’re an idiot. There really isn’t “God’s will”…there is only the “free will” he gave us all. We are all balls in a pinball game…caroming off all the sides as we interact with each other. The “test” is in how we as individuals handle the time we have here. Will we stay true in our faith? Or will we throw away our eternity because a few things in the short time we are here did not go as we wanted.

      God willing that a baby die? You should be ashamed of yourself!

      Report Post »  
    • Libertyluvnmomma
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 2:58pm

      You’re right about “free will’ but you discredit yourself with name calling.
      Many people can’t handle the type of freedom that free will provides. Even “Conservatives”. Ironic. listen to them condemn wikkileak’s Assange.
      God gave us the whole Earth. Without brakes,seat belts or healthcare. Not even a guarantee! That is Love! I am not being sarcastic I really mean that that is true Love!

      Report Post » Libertyluvnmomma  
  • Creestof
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:41am

    Praying for the speedy recovery of her body, mind and spirit. I hope the Lord blesses her with another child as she looks like she’d be a great mother.

    I am also praying that the driver turns himself in…and soon.

    Report Post »  
  • benrush
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:38am

    It is very clear that life doesn’t come from inert material. Life doesn’t begin at conception; it continues. At no point is the fetus not living.

    Report Post »  
    • tower7femacamp
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:40am

      sorry Ben but I must disagree we you, are you saying even in the
      last trimester there is no life ? What are your views on Partial birth abortion ?
      http://aggreen.net/pro-life/par_abor.html

      Report Post » tower7femacamp  
    • @leftfighter
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:19am

      @ tower7femacamp

      No, you dope. Benrush is saying life doesn’t come from inert material, meaning the material that makes life is alive as well.

      Benrush is making the case that there‘s no phase of life which isn’t alive. Mens’ swimmers are alive. Womens’ eggs are alive. Either the swimmers meet the egg and life continues, or they don’t and both die, but either way they’re alive.

      The problem with this argument is when do the living materials become a person, and I‘d say that’s when the rubber meets the road, so to speak.

      I was always taught that the hallmark of life is cell division. Once that cell divides, it’s alive. Here’s the rub: it’s very common for a fertilized egg to pass without implanting itself. As far as I’m concerned, a fertilized, implanted egg is a human life. Is it viable? Does it matter? It has human DNA and its cells are dividing.

      Report Post » @leftfighter  
  • Fina Biscotti
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:31am

    Do pray for this family.

    Report Post »  
  • dubs-a-loom
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:18am

    I’m so sorry for your loss Laurie. I am praying for you.

    Report Post »  
  • jake_hm
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 4:55am

    What a tragedy, and it’s shameful that anyone(lunar) would hold the mother responsable for being ‘careless’ in a ‘hit and run’. I doubt the mother was being careless when chosing to go through with a pregnency, or while walking down a street(even if she was pregnant).

    Report Post »  
    • Psychosis
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:18am

      and you are using conjecture just as he was trying to point out.

      there isnt any FACTS one way or the other provided.

      Report Post » Psychosis  
    • TulsaYeeHaw
      Posted on December 15, 2010 at 11:49pm

      We don’t know if she or the driver was being careless or not. Maybe she was tired and having a bad day. Maybe the driver was tired and having a bad day too and got scared, freaked, and took off. Maybe the driver swiped hit her in such a way it wasn’t felt in the vehicle. I hit a dumpster one time (and wouldn’t have known except for the loud bang). Plus, we don’t know if the driver knew the person hit was a pregnant wome.Maybe they were both on a cell phone. Maybe we just don’t know. You don’t just try the driver for murder because of tragic outcome, all the facts must be known in the maximum amount possible.
      Having said that, hitting a person is entirely different, and unless the driver really didn’t know (which is possible but highly unlikely) leaving the scene of accident is going to need one hell of a good reason.

      Report Post »  
  • Joseph28
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:14am

    Stupidity pure and simple, These people are so freaking scared of doing anything that might set a pro-life precident, that they go out of their way to devalue infant life.

    “Just consider it a free abortion. Whats that? You didn’t want one? Tough.”

    Report Post » Joseph28  
    • GeauxAlready
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:42am

      I believe that life begins at that first spark.
      Some believe that baby did not have the spark of life.
      Then how did she loose something she never had if there was no life?
      Them how did it die if there was no life?

      Charge whoever with murder……I’m just saying

      Report Post » SpankDaMonkey  
    • StonyBurk
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:57am

      Difference between this case -and the one in Mesa County was here the driver was a DUI and running
      from a cop when he slammed into the pregnant mothers car. The baby was alive when the meatwagon
      got there but died on scene.Still the Judge ruled that there was no evidence the baby was a person.
      Not to sound mean –or wish Ill of any mother or child –but I hope these cases keep being introduced
      until the people WAKE UP and insist the principles of the Declaration of Independence (which our State Constitution supposedly supports) is applied equally to all-even in the womb.

      Report Post »  
  • traderdan
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:12am

    social justice does not require the government

    Report Post »  
    • dwh320
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:11am

      I disagree… Socialist Justice requires the strong hand of a repressive government.

      Report Post » dwh320  
    • Wiz001
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:40am

      True social justice comes from the people who are beimg governed not by the govt. governing….. Want to find the guy that did it ask the politicians in colorado who want the illegals there where he is… if honset they will say“ look in Mexico for him”… Colarado will soon understand how we feel here in Az…. Just looking at the paper and news I would guess that 90% of the hit and runs in az are illegals… Go figure????

      Report Post »  
    • TwoMinuteMan
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:58am

      Social justice is a lie and can not ever replace the rule of LAW.

      Social justice can only be enforced by the judiciary to steal something from one person and give it to another.

      Common laws can be enforce by citizens through Citizens arrests.

      Report Post » TwoMinuteMan  
  • cheezwhiz
    Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:02am

    Who was the hit and run driver ? Find him first .
    Charges can come later

    Report Post » cheezwhiz  
    • C.ChristieJ.Bolton2012
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:36am

      I wonder if that child would have one day grown up and found a cure for cancer or AIDS. I wonder if the helpless child that was left in the closet to die after a botched abortion was the next Washington. I guess I will continue to wonder.

      Report Post »  
    • Lunar
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:51am

      I had to go to other sites to find any more information on this. The corner where she was hit is very dark. There is no info at all where was mom coming from. She was walking and apparently was hit by a person who ran a stop sign. However there are no witnesses of the actual act.

      I’m not talking down to a dead baby here. I‘m saying mom didn’t look both ways before she crossed. Simple caution by mom would have saved at least one life. Perhaps she was distracted by a phone or other device or was intoxicated. Like I said there is no evidence to be found. Other than a case being made about some stupid law. Even a speeding truck(unlikely to stop) looks like a speeding truck from a distance and while pedestrians have the right of way they don’t have newtonian physics on their side.

      A new law or changes aren’t what is required here, personal responsibility especially from a soon to be mom was needed.

      Report Post » Lunar  
    • Marylou7
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:23am

      God takes this very seriously. Exodus 21 22-25 “If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

      Report Post » Marylou7  
    • Fina Biscotti
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:29am

      hey cheeze…maybe lunar…..needs to think about the perpetrator……as a hit and run coward…..instead of blaming the victim….for being in the wrong place at the wrong time…..that a hit and run driver, who may have been intoxicated, distracted texting, cell phone action, and not paying attention to the road…road signs, or an illegal alien driving an illegal car, etc……but yet any person left in the street….after being hit by a vehicle…..is an absolute disgrace to humankind. The fact that this poor woman might have been going to work, coming home from work, or going to or coming from visiting her family….or grocery shopping……should not be the issue……the woman was pregnant, the victim of a hit and run, losing her baby in the process….in which there is no law on the books on Colorado that determines personhood……for this innocent child.

      If the state can declare the woman’s baby had died……then it Is a person.

      Hospitals have to file with the state, when any death of a person occurs. States issue death certificates……on people.

      Any time a pregnant person is victimized….there are two victims.

      Colorado should find a way to protect the unborn…..and this poor hitandrun victim, losing her baby….should be cause.

      Joseph28 has a strong analogy.

      Report Post »  
    • Lunar
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:41am

      Marylou in both the bible quote and the media coverage I just realized something. Whats saying this was a man ? Statistically speaking this is just as likely to be a Woman driver. It also goes without saying someone has until the end of their life to repent or face all of pesky eternity in hell.

      Report Post » Lunar  
    • Dstarr55
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:42am

      Lunar, are you serious? To put the blame on the mother without evidence is rather pathetic. I walk at night in a residential area on a winding road where I can not always see cars going faster than the speed limit of 25 mph because of the curves and turns in the road. They have occasionally caused me to pull my dog back onto the curve or to quickly run across the street (for the most part people in my neightbor are responsible drivers). To suggest she was distracted by a phone or intoxicated (even when you state no evidence) is appalling. How about the personal responsibility of the driver who is the cause of the death of this unborn child – obviously they felt at fault because they ran the scene. You are basically blaming a woman with no evidence, implying she did something wrong when on the surface it just appears she went for a stroll – obviously you never were pregnant. There are times you need to walk because you can’t find comfort sitting or laying down – if she felt the area was safe than who are you to say it wasn’t.

      Report Post »  
    • Lunar
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:56am

      Dstarr55, do you understand what actually happened when this occurred ? Mom at the last minute turned to face the vehicle as it was an SUV or truck it hit her in the midsection, if she survives its because her baby literally saved her life. Her child took the force of the impact for her.

      We have evidence after the fact, the area wasn’t safe, it’s still very dark on the street corner where you can see in the news feeds the candles burning for the child and the mother.

      I’m Not Blaming the Mother. I want to know more this story has been eclipsed by the political debate, I can’t find any story showing the corner in detail no various angles to show what happened. Maybe someone saw this vehicle at another intersection nearby, but again no news stories to help, just politics.

      Lunar  
    • havenfarmroad
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:09am

      Lunar – you obviously have no understanding of Scripture. The pronoun “he” is not always gender specific in the Bible. More often than not, it means both male and female. This was the vernacular used during the time of the translation of the King James Bible. Whether the pronoun is gender-specific or applicable to both men and women must be derived from the context.
      At any rate, you missed Marylou7′s point. Life begins at conception according to the Bible, so anyone who takes an unborn life – whether by accident or intentionally – should be held lable for its death. So much for today’s Bible lesson.

      Report Post »  
    • Moocephus
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:20am

      Lunar your a freaking idiot!

      Moocephus  
    • Dustyluv
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:33am

      Yep Lunar, you are looney. To make such a statement shows you have no respect for human life. Are you an abortion doctor by any chance? You have the same kind of useless mindset…

      Vehicular Homicide if they find the person who did this. If they had stopped to render aid it should be dowbgraded to possiby manslughter.

      Report Post »  
    • Lunar
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 6:44am

      Havenfarmroad, I’m well aware of the correct use of the english language. In which terms like men apply to all mankind. Marylou believes in eternal salvation it seems, as do I. I also believe “It also goes without saying someone has until the end of their life to repent or face all of pesky eternity in hell.” So no, I didn’t miss her lesson.
      Moocephus, go google. Find for yourself how this is being used and you will know actual anger. What a child’s death is being used for is horrific.

      Report Post » Lunar  
    • 79USMC83
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:08am

      Laurie I am so sorry for your loss. The main thing that always happens is that the story turns into “The Criminal” and not the victim. It turns into the”“ Law” and not the Victim. Hit and runs are hard for most of us to understand. How could someone NOT stop?

      The loss of life, and now the debate about the LAW an unborn baby. The “What is Life” debate that is the Rallying cry for the abortion issue on both sides. “Is becoming ”THE Story” I am a man and will never have the bond a mother has with a child because mother carries the child from conception to birth, I envy you ladies for that. Most young people now of days that are excited about having a child cannot what to have an ultra-sound to see the fetus and find out what sex the baby is!!! How can a fetus that we know what sex it is NOT be a person!!!! How can a fetus that is hooked up to an unbilical cord and is eating from day one NOT be a LIFE!!!!!

      Report Post »  
    • Uncle Sambo
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:10am

      It is obvious to most of us that government is inept, corrupt and useless. Although government is very good at stealing money from its victims to provide a phony system of justice. If sincerely hope and pray that if the hit and run texting and drunk driver is ever found; that the poor woman takes the law in her own hands. It is the only way she’ll ever receive justice.

      And for you folks that don’t like my sentiments all I have to say is this: That thing you called a government stole a lot of money from its citizens and all it has to do to provide a fair and honest system of justice. That woman was was victimized twice. Once by the hit and run driver and once by mafia known as the State.

      Report Post »  
    • bolec slodkie
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:12am

      This is probably an illegal. Hickenlooper who did many shady deals from getting over 100 acres of real estate reapprased as farmland so he could reduce his tax payments to $75 a year to reducing illegal felons charges from heroin distribution to agricultrual tresspass is culpable. (What’s with the farm stuff?) He, along with the curent govorner did this. they are as culpable as the driver.
      Many people who usually vote republican voted for HIckenlooper. Because Tom Tancredo didn’t point out these positons and many gulible people believed the Hickenloope shower comercials. The reason he took the showers wasn’t to stay clean. It is becaus he is guilty as sin.
      The reason Ritter didn‘t run for a second tearm and Stephanie Villafuerte’s nomination for US Attorney was removed is because Villafuerte illegally entered the Justice department’s database to find that it was ICE agent Cory Voorhis who leagally reported that an Illegal alien was pleaded down from heroin distribution to agricultrual tresspass (a non deprtable offense) and later went to Californial under an alias and was charged with sex crims against a CHILD.

      Report Post »  
    • tower7femacamp
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:35am

      Molech the God of abortion will not like it if CO deems life starts
      at conception
      “Thou shalt not give of thy seed to cause to pass through the fire for Moloch.” Leviticus 18:10

      Molech: “A detestable Semitic deity honored by the sacrifice of children, in which they were caused to pass through or into the fire. Palestinian excavations have uncovered evidences of infant skeletons in burial places around heathen shrines. Ammonites revered Molech as a protecting father. Worship of Molech was stringently prohibited by Hebrew law. (Lev. 18:21; 20:1-5) Solomon built an altar to Molech at Tophet in the Valley of Hinnon. Manasseh in his idolatrous orgy also honored this deity. Josiah desecrated the Hinnom Valley altar, but Jehoiakim revived the cult.” Unger’s Bible Dictionary by Merrill F. Unger (Chicago: Moody Press, 1957); page 416.
      http://www.crossroad.to/glossary/rpg/molech.htm

      Report Post » tower7femacamp  
    • StonyBurk
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 7:47am

      This same idea was tried here in Mesa County a while back–and the Court said a baby in the womb was not a person.And rejected that part of the case. The idiots here in Colorado continue to agree with the principles advanced but REFUSE to put their principles as their vote(or else they are telling lies about what they agree to in the first place)

      Report Post »  
    • Nutthuggers
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 8:22am

      Pro abortion women (and men) want it to be just a lump of cells if THEY want to kill it, and then they want it to be a baby when someone ELSE kills it at the same stage. Just sickening.

      Report Post »  
    • Infidels R Us
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:20am

      How much you want to bet the driver was an illegal immigrant!

      Report Post »  
    • GeeWhiz
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 9:35am

      I’m all for personal responsibility, but from what I’ve read on this case, the woman was just walking across the street and the guy blew through two stop signs (according to an eyewitness). Had a ‘double row’ of lights, so it’s not about not seeing her. Big fat pregnant women are not hard to see.

      It’s all about driving either merely recklessly or he was drunk because sane, sober people don’t drive like that.

      She was a victim, he was a criminal, and she lost her baby as a result. Terrible and tragic. Unless lunar is arguing that you shouldn’t ever walk across a street because there are cars there, which is ridiculous.

      Report Post »  
    • biggreenboo
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:31am

      @lunar… Not sure why these people attacked your comment… you just asked a question and a good one at that.
      I have nothing nice to say to them so I’ll leave it be.
      As for the mother (not to be)… that really really sucks. I hope she can find some peace this Christmas… same for the father.

      Report Post »  
    • ChrisBalsz
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 11:36am

      @ Lunar, the pedestrian is not responsible to presume oncoming traffic will not stop at a stop sign.

      Report Post »  
    • judeslice
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 12:07pm

      Lunar, you say that there was no eye witnesses, but here you are saying “I‘m saying mom didn’t look both ways before she crossed.” So you were there? Or somebody else was? How do you know that she did not look both ways if nobody is their? And you should not assume things. “Simple caution by mom would have saved at least one life. Perhaps she was distracted by a phone or other device or was intoxicated.” Maybe the person behind the wheel was drunk, but I do not know, because the person is too afraid to come forward and I was not there. And unlike you, I will not condemn a person who just lost her child and who is lying in the Hospital. Nor will I condemn the driver, or say that it was his fault, the person did not do this or that if the person had the baby might still be alive. Even if she did not look the other way so what, a life was lost. And she does not need you to sit here and point out that she is really at fault for what happened.

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    • manicmann
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 1:59pm

      I love Denzel Washington!

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    • Libertyluvnmomma
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 2:43pm

      Mary Lou you are wrong about The “eye for an eye”.
      When people quote that scripture it is taken out of context 99.9% of the time. Jesus talks about that in the New Testament. I’d go back and reread both portions. I won‘t give you the answer because unlike our politicians we conservatives don’t need our hands held! Right?

      Report Post » Libertyluvnmomma  
    • Libertyluvnmomma
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 2:49pm

      Tower7FemaCamp
      We can add our “wonderful” President Regean and George Bush to those whose serve Molech.
      They are guilty by association.
      To those who are wondering what the heck I’m talking about, I am referring to those Owls Nest breakfasts and such with elite members of the Occult that is alive and well in the U.S.
      Ephesians 6. We know who our struggle is against. Our government slaps our face with it at every opportunity. Funny, most Christians just think the Devil keeps them from Bible study or tempts them to cheat on their spouse.] . Oh boy, has he been busy with real evil.

      Report Post » Libertyluvnmomma  
    • Independent Tess
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 3:25pm

      Lunar, by law the pedestrian has the right of way in most (if not all) circumstances. If the perp ran a stop sign or light there is no way you can blame it on the injured woman. All facts are not in, but why are you trying so hard to shift blame to the victim? Makes me wonder where you are coming from……..

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    • klindgren
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:14pm

      This is actually for Lunar, but can not figure out how to reply to that chain of comments… Your argument is somewhat logical, except, what about the driver? You seem to be concerned that blame is being cast without details, but to me the fact that a driver was going along, and all of a sudden hit someone, then decided to just keep going speaks volumes about the person. Your argument that it was not a well-lit area, and that the pedestrian may have been at fault, would hold water if the driver had called for help and stopped. That’s what we all would have/should have done if in the driver’s shoes. The fact that the incident caused loss of life, makes it even more tragic, but apparently Colorado’s laws on the books do not recognize life in that fashion. The “legal speak” in all of this is a sham! We are all about the courtroom deciding EVERYTHING today. The heck with ethics. It’s a joke. This will be yet another case of finding out what a lawyer and judge decide, while a victim has lost her baby in a horrible hit-and-run incident. I am sick of leaders, politicians, coaches, business execs, etc. hiding behind their legal shields, while throwing ethics in the dumpster.

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    • AmericanSoldier
      Posted on December 14, 2010 at 5:43pm

      @C.ChristieJ.Bolton2012 Or could have been the next Hitler or the Anti-Christ. Too much to speculate on. For the actual story, the way i look at it, as a pro-choicer, the mother didn’t make the decision to end the pregnancy. It was taken away from her in a violent and criminal act. You don’t need to change the definition of personhood. You have to look at it as Abortion is a willing act at the consent of the mother while this hit and run was a criminal act against the will of the mother. The perp committed a crime and must do the time.

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