Dramatic Surveillance Footage Shows Police Fatally Shooting Empire State Building Shooter (Graphic)
- Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:15pm by
Jason Howerton
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New York Police mark bullet casings beside the body of 58-year-old Jeffrey Johnson near the Empire State Building August 24, 2012 in New York City. (Credit: Getty Images)
NEW YORK (TheBlaze/AP) — Jeffrey Johnson hid behind a car in his business suit and tie near the Empire State Building, waiting for the man he blamed for costing him his job. He put a gun to the executive’s head and fired five times, then walked off with his briefcase into the morning rush of midtown Manhattan.
Minutes later, Johnson was dead in front of the landmark skyscraper, killed by police Friday in a chaotic confrontation that sent bullets ricocheting, wounded nine other people and left sidewalks near one of the world’s best-known landmarks spattered with blood.
Police released dramatic surveillance video that showed the confrontation lasted only a few seconds. Johnson was walking rapidly down the street trailed by two police officers when he stopped, wheeled around and pulled out a gun.
About a dozen people ran for their lives, including two small children who were just feet away from Johnson. He pointed the gun at the officers, who quickly fired at him.
Johnson dropped his briefcase, fell to his knees and then collapsed on the ground.
This surveillance video, released by police Friday, shows the shooter’s last moments (WARNING! GRAPHIC IMAGES):
The bystanders likely were hit by police officers’ stray gunfire, some of it bullets that rebounded off planters in front of the skyscraper and grazed pedestrians. The two officers fired 16 shots. The surveillance video shows Johnson pointing his weapon at police, but it’s likely he did not get a chance to fire, investigators said.
Startled New Yorkers looked up from their morning routines in the crowded business district to see people sprawled in the streets bleeding and a tarp covering the body in front of the tourist landmark.
“I was on the bus and people were yelling ‘get down, get down,’” said accountant Marc Engel. “I was thinking, ‘You people are crazy, no one is shooting in the middle of midtown Manhattan at 9 o’clock in the morning.’”
It was over in seconds, he said – “a lot of pop, pop, pop, pop, one shot after the other.” Afterwards he saw sidewalks littered with the wounded, including one man “dripping enough blood to leave a stream.”
Johnson, who neighbors had seen leave his apartment in a suit every day since he was laid off a year ago, had worked for six years for Hazan Imports and was let go when the company downsized, police Commissioner Ray Kelly said.
Police were looking into his relationship with the victim, Steven Ercolino, the company’s vice president of sales, who had traded accusations of harassment with Johnson when he worked there. Johnson, 58, also blamed Ercolino for his layoff, saying that he hadn‘t aggressively marketed Johnson’s new T-shirt line, police spokesman Paul Browne said.
After waiting for Ercolino, 41, to come to work, Johnson walked up to him, pulled out a .45-caliber pistol and fired at his head, Kelly said. After he fell to the ground, Johnson stood over him and shot four more times, a witness told investigators.
“Jeffrey just came from behind two cars, pulled out his gun, put it up to Steve’s head and shot him,” said Carol Timan, whose daughter, Irene, was walking to Hazan Imports at the time with Ercolino.
New York City police officers investigate near the covered body of Jeffrey Johnson outside the Empire State Building on August 24, 2012 in New York City. (Credit: Getty Images)
A construction worker who saw the shooting followed Johnson and alerted two police officers, a detail regularly assigned to patrol city landmarks such as the 1,454-foot skyscraper since the Sept. 11 terror attacks, officials said.
Kelly said the officers who caught up to Johnson had “a gun right in their face” and “responded quickly, and they responded appropriately.”
“These officers, having looked at the tape myself, had absolutely no choice,” Kelly said.
The Shooter
A witness had told police that Johnson fired at the officers, but authorities say ballistics evidence doesn’t support that. Johnson’s weapon held seven rounds, they said. He fired five times at Ercolino, one round was still in the gun and one was ejected when officers secured it, authorities said.
Another loaded magazine was found in Johnson’s briefcase.
Johnson legally bought the gun in Sarasota, Fla., in 1991, but he didn’t have a required permit to possess the weapon in New York City, police said.
“New York City, as you know, is the safest big city in the country, and we are on pace to have a record low number of murders this year,” Mayor Michael Bloomberg said. “But we are not immune to the national problem of gun violence,” he said of the shooting, following mass shootings a Colorado movie theater and a Sikh temple in Wisconsin.
Robert Asika, who was shot in the right arm, said he was “100 percent positive” that a police officer had shot him. Asika, 23, sells tickets for the Empire State Building’s observatory.
“When I woke up this morning, I didn’t even want to go to work,” he said. “Something told me not to go to work.”
The wounded victims were five women and four men, authorities said. All were from New York City, except a woman from Chapel Hill, N.C. They suffered graze wounds or other minor injuries.
Ercolino’s profile on the business networking site LinkedIn identified him as a vice president of sales at Hazan Import. It said he was a graduate of the State University of New York at Oneonta.
He had recently moved to New Jersey after living for a time in Warwick, just north of New York City, said his eldest brother, Paul Ercolino. He grew up in Nanuet.
He never mentioned to the family that he had any problems with a co-worker, Paul Ercolino said.
Hazan Import Corp. imports women’s clothing and accessories, according to public records. Calls to its executives weren’t immediately returned
Even after he was laid off, Johnson would leave his Upper East Side apartment building each morning in a suit, and often returned about a half hour later after going to get breakfast at McDonald’s, his neighbors said.
“He was always alone,” said Gisela Casella, who lived a few floors above him. “I always felt bad. I said, `Doesn’t he have a girlfriend?’ I never saw him with anybody.”
Internet records list him as administrator of the website for a business called St. Jolly’s Art, which sold iron-on art for T-shirts, including stylized drawings of fighter planes, muscle cars and ships.
Metal detectors and bag searchers have been standard at the 102-story skyscraper since 1997, when a gunman opened fire on the 86th floor observation deck of the Empire State Building, killing one tourist and wounding six others before fatally shooting himself.
The skyscraper remained open Friday throughout the mayhem, although the tourist attraction’s workers became witnesses.
“We were just working here and we just heard bang, bang, bang!” said Mohammed Bachchu, a worker at a nearby souvenir shop.
He said he rushed from the building and saw seven people lying on the ground, covered in blood.
Queens resident Rebecca Fox said she saw people running down the street and initially thought it was a celebrity sighting but then saw a woman shot in the foot and a man dead on the ground.
“I was scared and shocked and literally shaking,” she said.
She said police seemed to appear in seconds.
“It was like ‘CSI,’” she said, “but it was real.”
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Comments (153)
marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:02amWell it is now 12;00am MDT
But remember it’s 5;00 somewhere,
so go and have a beer on me.
nite-t-nite all
Report Post »and dont’t let them there bed bugs bite.
Y’ALL hear.
strewth_cobber
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:50amG’day, MARINE249!
Occasionally I say from Downunder to my friends in the west of the northern hemisphere, “Don’t worry, the world is not going to end tomorrow, because it’s already tomorrow here (in Australia)!” (although, not sure for how much longer that can be said).
East Coast of Australia, and New Zealand even a few more hours ahead of us on the West Coast of the Great South Land of the Holy Cross!
Have a Bonza arvo/evening/morning/weekend wherever you may be!
God bless :-)
Report Post »its_time_to_arrest_our_government
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 8:09amwhat a couple of barney fifes you dont fire 16 shots on a crowded street are they that bad of shot that they cant hit what they are aiming at? laws of physics your gun is not on target when you pump rounds that fast they are lucky more people were not killed. i hope they all sew the pants off the city
Report Post »Roberto G. Vasquez
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 8:59amBad guy one, cops eight! And mayor Dumberg blames not enough gun control even though NYC has had strict gun control for decades! What a moron! Mayor, all this shooting situation proves is gun control doesn’t work, which is why NYC and Chicago have so much gun control and so many murders.
Report Post »turkey13
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 9:51amBloomie forgot to mention that his body guards are armed, He would like for the world to know that only the police and all the gangs are the only ones with guns. For almost $1200.00 the guy could have bought a temp permit.
Report Post »John 1776
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:21pmWatch, now the “Gun Grabbers” will want the cops to give up their guns as well (like England.) That will work out real well… The ONLY people with guns will be the criminals.
Report Post »crackerone
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:00pmReporter – Chief, How could your men shot 9 innocent by-standers?
Police Chief – They ran out of bullets!
Report Post »Rights come from God
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:06pmBloomberg reminds me of the Mayor from Jaws when he was trying to convince everyone how wonderful the town of Amity was; “as you know, Amity means friendship”. Aren’t you just sick of self promoting politicians?
Report Post »SeenItAll
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:51amListen up you genius armairs. Cops don’t tell you how to flip burgers, so don’t you go telling them how to handle a firefight. If you REALLY had guts, you would put that bon bon down and take the civil service test. Otherwise, thank the guys/gals in blue for being out there as targets so you can walk the streets without being accosted every other block. This incident was a terrible reminder that sometimes “SHI_ HAPPENS,” and there is just nothing you can do about it. The “zero tolerance” for mistakes that some of you believe police departments can attain is simply juvenile and childish thinking. Police go through more training than at any time in history, but don’t let facts get in the way of your mind fart comments…
Report Post »502_eagle
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 5:46amCops need to be held to the same standard that average citizens are. If that standard is to damn high then maybe it should be changed. A civilian with a conceal-carry permit who hit nine innnocent bystanders would be in jail in NYC. So should the cops. Don’t like? To bad, Cops aren’t Gods.Two sets of rules are BS! One for goverment, one for the rst of us. Make the standard the same.
Report Post »Dirty Harry
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 7:47amSeenitall, you don‘t even have to tell me you’re a cop; I can see it in your crappy attitude. You want to demand that people have more respect for cops than they do. A start, would be for you to stop making dumb comments like the one you made here.
Cops protect themselves, at the peril of the general public. That‘s what they do because they’re cowards. That’s what happened in this instance – cops were willing to risk dozens of bystanders because they were afraid themselves might get shot.
Cowards.
Report Post »L0WRYDER
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:12amOk genius you tell all us people that dont undersand why so many shot to bring one guy down why could it be that the cops were just BAD shots and over weight out of shape or just DAM lucky thay found him. I know more than one MARINE that could have took Him down with out fireing one shot and NO one would have been hurt NO ONE!!!!!
Report Post »hidden_lion
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:17amFlipping burgers and slinging lead are vastly different enterprises. How many bystanders are injured or killed by improperly flipped burgers? Cops carry firearms professionally, so they should be able to fire them professionally and hit what they aim at. Spray and pray on crowded streets doesn’t cut the mustard.
Report Post »Dustoff
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:27amExcuse me bud, but most officers have NO-idea what a real fire fight looks like.
Report Post »You’re comment alone proves that one.
canadianlady
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:37amYou’re wrong! Shooting nine innocent civilians to kill one perp is just plain reckless. I hope every victim sues the pants off the city. These cops need to be given desk jobs.
Report Post »TheLeftMadeMeRight
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:56pm“Police go through more training than at any time in history, but…”
“The two officers fired 16 shots.”
Even with all that training they still managed to spray bullets allover and SHOT 9 INNOCENTS!
Report Post »4Stars
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:33pm@SEEITALL…unfortunately it is clear that you have no actual law enforcement experience to draw from. This was a chaotic scene, a cops worst nightmare. Subject with gun wearing a suit and carrying a briefcase in Manhattan during rush hour. How many people matched that description at that moment? Tactical horror story. Watch the CCTV video. The first officer is not looking at the right suspect. he’s looking left. The second officer, behind officer 1, sees the correct suspect and draws. #1 is also out of the holster but still facing the wrong direction. #2 engages the suspect when he draws his pistol from the case. It looks like #1 also starts firing but he’s firing perpendicular to #2. He’s shooting at the wrong person and likely started shooting instinctively when he heard the gunshots come from his left from his partner shooting at the correct suspect. And don;t even get me started on officer #2 shooting one handed while still in motion. These cops were definitely brave in running towards the threat. But tactically this is a major eff-up. Cops have to show unbelievable deadly force restraint when they consider what’s beyond their intended target. This is why the job is so damn difficult. I feel for these guys as this isn’t over. The NYPD needs to implement some advanced close quarters firearms training for dealing with threats in high density pedestrian areas just like this.
Report Post »tommyr
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:57pmSure, take a look at the film again and notice how one cop was retreating and shooting from a sideways position. Freaking *****. Bet he stands still when eating a donut. No problem with that.
Report Post »FREEDOMoverFEAR
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:13pmThe murderer got his job done without hitting anyone other than his target…
Report Post »Ltldog2
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:41pm@SEENITALL-
Totally agree with you. From what I’m hearing, these police officers were new to the force. I can’t imagine a worse scenario (other, than, of course, the WTC disaster) other than a shooting during the 9:00 a.m. hour in NYC! Lots of people. Supposedly following a construction worker who has seen the guy. Guy in suit w/briefcase. Is this the guy? Then the guy turns around and points a gun at them? They have to think quickly. WE see the guy has fallen. They don’t know that until a few seconds later.
It’s easy to be a front seat driver during rush hour traffic. Not so easy to be driving.
As for the people insured – my condolences for your injuries. Hopefully, none are so severe as to place a handicap on you for the rest of your lives.
Everyone else – you hear gunshots and someone tells you it’s gunfire – drop to the ground.
One thing I‘ve learned is it’s not easy to shoot a gun, even with lots of practice. To actually hit the perp the way these officers did in the situation they were in – I think they did a great job.
Anyone who wants to second guess them needs to do what they did in the few short seconds they had to do it.
D
Report Post »hpyagl
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 8:02pmMy question is why are law enforcment people not using frangible or fragmentation rounds in highly populated areas? There is better, high tech ammo available that is marketed to home defense users and designed to reduce ricochet for close quarter situations. Instead of blaming the cops, maybe the police management and city officials should be blamed for not using their brains and budgets properly.
Report Post »stringcheese
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:26amAh yes,
Report Post »The Beckie keyboard warriors are out in force, glad to see that so many of you were there……….oh wait you weren’t. Media reports are normally very accurate and never sensationalized. Nice to see so many typing in their basements have so much tactical savvy and nerves of steel.
Perfect response, nope, critical incidents seldom are. Had officers held fire and this guy went off further and shot more people, the same typing commandos would still be calling them cowards and other things, even though these same people would be very hesitant to run toward danger as opposed to run away. Wounded civilians are bad, don’t get me wrong, but these reports also said many were hurt from flying debris from cement pots. That could tend to prove the officers were aware of their backstop, very plausible.
Okay, flame away……………………..
Dirty Harry
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 7:53amStringchees, you’re a total moron. You’re going to try to tell me that the cops intentionally missed their target because they were aiming for the pots so as to protect citizens??? BS!!!
I shoot 10 times more than the average cop does and even I know what every gun shooter knows, and that is that even in a perfectly controlled situation, you never know where the slug will go after it hit anything, including the bad guy.
The cops, typical for cops, were scared and ripping off shots in the general direction of hte bad guy – they probably had their eyes closed.
To suggest that more citizens would have been at risk by the bad guiy, than with 2 cops shooting 16 rounds, is to not understand basic math.
Report Post »sasquatch08
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:02amNo wonder they hit 9 other people, firing down the length-wise axis of the sidewalk.
This is indefensible. One of the cardinal rules of gun safety is “Know your target AND WHAT’S BEHIND IT”.
Obviously arm-chair quarterbacking this is stupid, but hey, NYPD: for future reference if you know he’s got a gun then maybe you should approach him at as close of a 90 degree angle to the sidewalk as you can?
I don’t want to hear any whining defending these moron cops. Legally speaking, every round I fire is an “individual choice” and hitting unarmed civilians in the background is a crime in all states that I know of. Cops should be held to the same standard as the rest of us.
Not to mention that cops can‘t shoot for crap in my experience so it’s doubtful all those rounds passed through him and then struck other people.
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:15am@SASQUATCH08
Report Post »You hit it on the head.
QUARTEBACKING IS STUPID!!!
That all you need to say.
sasquatch08
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 3:05amHence my “for future reference” statement.
Learn from your mistakes. Don’t repeat them.
That said, while not strictly speaking condemning current officers (I still think these guys should be fired as a show of good faith to the public) I will say the following:
Clearly training for police needs to be improved. In shooting situations you fall back on your training. If your training is crap, your response is crap.
While this case may be a “case in point” it falls into a broader narrative nation-wide and especially in NYC of police shootings involving a massive number of rounds fired by the cops. In many cases against unarmed people. This clearly demonstrates that they need better training.
Further, while I was in college I would go to the range 2x a week . In doing so I was approached by at least a dozen different police officers who always had the same thing to say “Clearly, from your shooting, you’re ex-military. Can you teach us to shoot like you do?”
My answer was always a question: how much practice do you do? The answer was always the same “The Department gives us 200 rounds a year for target practice”.
These guys are almost universally poorly trained and given almost no practice time. Never mind real world senarios. Sure SWAT guys run tactical drills, but beat cops have never seen one.
Report Post »Wilbur D Pig
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 5:28amI thought a sasquatch was a bigfoot not a big mouth. First you say no armchair quarter backing then you do, just that. The little “future use” disclaimer is a pathetic attempt to say, “Hey, I would have done this/that better.” Well, Mr. Know-it-all, this began and ended in seconds. You say you are ex-military, but don’t understand that collateral damage is a possibilty? Every incident has a debrief and you ask what could we do in the future, but you can’t call these guys morons and think others might not say the same about you (moron). Everything about you SCREAMS K-mart security guard.
Report Post »FREEDOMoverFEAR
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:17pmMarine249 aren’t you armchair quaterbacking just on a different subject…LOL think before you type.
Report Post »blazingaway
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:16amtrained shooters know tap, tap … two shots and the target is down.
Report Post »These cops just start firing in blind panic and fear.
Even the way the came up on the man was stupid.
Just follow him or tackle him or take him out.
But they seem to rush him, he pulls his gun out and they back off, off balance, panic, fear pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. These guys need some training and either need to be prepared to die or get off the force
FormerLEAcademyInstructor
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:05amNothing to see here, folks. Move along. This alledged shoot-out never occurred because NYC has very strict gun control laws. Therefore, there is no way on God’s green earth this shooting happened. Same situation in west and south Chicago where 19 shootings alledgedly occurred within 30 minutes; strict gun control laws in IL makes it impossible for guns to be anyone’s possession, especially criminals. Oh, and the Washington, DC shooting? Didn’t happen. Tight gun control there, too. And just because James Holmes began telling people in Colorado about how he was going to kill people, and threatened his professor, and was being treated by the university psychiatrist enough that she reported his behavior to university cops, 4 months before he actually carried out the massacre…well, it’s guns and bullets that make angry psychotics kill people…but never in states that have strict gun control laws and who blame neighboring states for their problem citizens acting out.
Report Post »American Soldier (Separated)
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:07amWhen’s the last time you were in a fire fight?
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:07am@BLAZINGAWAY
Yes– A trainded shooter with a long gun and TIME could go tap tap
two shots and the target is down.
Firing in blind panic and fear –What else is there?
Tackle him — They knew he had just shot someone, therefor
they knew he had a gun. — GET REAL!
But they seemed to rush him —- oh he!! Iam just glad I
Report Post »didn’t have a partner like you. Bet those two cops are too.
stringcheese
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:31amTap Tap the target is down?
Report Post »You should prolly put down your game controller or remote control, that statementg just shows your ignorance rather than your (perceived) expertise…………………
lukerw
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:44amSuperHero Movie Freaks… live in a Unique Reality!
Report Post »nzkiwi
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:58am@ Blazingaway
I used to be a target shooter (rifle) so I am not a complete fool.
A cop friend of mine invited me to the range (in NZ) to pistol shoot with a Glock and .357. At ten metres (paces) I had to carefully aim and squeeze to hit a man-sized target. I did reasonably well, but the “man” might have survived.
For the fun of it, I tried shooting like Dirty Harry. Six shots in rapid succession while aiming instinctively. Not one shot hit the target. Then I aimed properly and fired in rapid succession. One shot only hit the target and was nowhere near the bull.
Even after practising for that afternoon, the results for rapid fire got no better, while controlled fire did improve.
My mate was amused by my surprise and pointed out that it’s not as easy as in the movies.
I mention this as it simply isn’t as easy as you might think. On top of that, my targets weren’t preparing to kill me.
It’s easy to watch a video clip and criticise those cops, but I doubt that any of us could do better – and some of us, if we are honest, would likely do a lot worse.
As for “tackling” someone who is preparing to shoot you at close range, well let’s just say that that sort of thing is best left to Mel Gibson, shall we?
Report Post »Sgt_Rock
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 6:15pmNot quite…training is tap, tap, reassess, tap, tap..repeat…until the target is no longer a threat. Reality is not so cut and dry. I’ve stood between two targets on the live fire range with my operators shooting at “hostile” targets on either side. I had the utmost confidence they could repeat it in the field. But the sterile training environment can never completely account for all of the variables when the bullets are flying and people are dying. You try to train for EVERY variable, but occasionally you get a curve ball, Adaptability is what saves you from disaster. So to all you Modern Warfare commandos, be as critical as you like, but unless you have some real up close and personal “down range” time I would submit to you (and if the shoe fits…) that you have no ******* idea what you are talking about. I’m not saying these guys did everything right, far from it, but if you read the story the rounds that hit the “victims” in this shooting were primarily skips and ricochets. Given the number of folks on the street, this could have been much worse…If NYPD gets sued so-be-it. Had theses cops done nothing, all the detractors and cop haters on here would have been up in arms calling them cowards as well…so you’re damned if you do, damned if you don’t. RLTW
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:10amWhenever I hear stories like this, it reminds me of my own police and military training. I was going to go into Law Enforcement, but didn’t. I found most of the officers who were passed and assigned as officers to be, shall I say, selected more for political and “insider” reasons than competency.
We carried 6-shot revolvers in those days. Semi-autos were just coming in. Then comes the bang-ban-shootem-up mindset where each cop seems to feel justified to empty the magazine everytime he is forced to use deadly force. Downside: There are two- First, there is an increase in “collateral damage” (meaning: Cops shoot innocent by-standers); Second: These shootings seem to always get lumped into the statistics showing that guns are bad and look at the number of people shot by guns each year and see how we need to pass more Gun Control!
Well, Get the cops to excercise some restraint or marksmanship, and these numbers will go down.
As for me, if I see a “police activity” anywhere around me, I get the hell out of Dodge, because I know I have a better chance of getting shot by the cops as collateral damage than I do of any nut with a gun.
Report Post »jungle J
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:18amso glad they didn’t accept you.
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:20amsee my post for answer.
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:28am@junglejay
I was accepted, actually. I got out because I met people like you.
Report Post »blazingaway
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:08amStupid New York cops can’t shoot worth a crap, now there will be law suits.
Report Post »Stupid Bloomberg and his craping his pants over guns and his stupid cops who can’t shoot straight shoot people.
When are cops going to learn to have a cool head, and stop chasing people like a pack of dogs and learn to hunt them like a panther and pounce on them when they least expect it.
Fear, fear, fear is what cops are full of, no courage, no cool heads, no sense of balance
marine249
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:41pmHEY alll you dead-eye dick’s
Report Post »I know if you had been in that shoot out,
y’all would have been Mr. cool dude, you
woulh have taken 1 shot right between the eyes.
When you take out a perk, you shoot till
he hits the ground. Untill you have stood in those
officers shoes, I think I would let the grown-up
handle this. Remember if you have not been there
done that keep the lips sipped.
marine249
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:50pmthats would
in the grown-ups little mikee bloomberg does not fit
Report Post »woodyee
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:51pmBASIC rules of marksmanship were not applied here; been there and done that. And you? Toilet Lid on the range?
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:00am@WOODYEL
Report Post »Right you shot Jesse James
woodyee
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:10amWRONG!
I ALMOST shot Jesse, but there were innocent civilians in the way…
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:30amOk, Marine- so you condone shooting up the whole neighborhood, and you disagree with me. Now we know why so many innocent people die in combat zones. Too bad you think the same tactic is ok on American streets.
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:48am@SKREWEDRETIREE
Report Post »No where did I say it was o.k. to shoot up the
neighborhood. Iam just saying that when you
shoot at a paper target, you have time to aim
and squeeze off a round. When you are dealing
with a life target, all kinds of **** hit the fan.
You don’t know if the perk is going to kill you,
before you blow his a$$ away.So like I said if
you have not walk in his boots, you realy don’t
know what you are talking about.
American Soldier (Separated)
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:14amThe first time you fire at a living, breathing human being, most people will shoot until they‘re empty of the target isn’t moving. Many cops have never shot at anyone, some make it an entire career without actually shooting at someone. When I took contact for the first time, I unloaded my entire magazine before I realized it. After that first cherry pop, there was more control.
While a war zone, this is negligible, I can understand people’s concerns when this happens in a US city.
Report Post »Not_A_Useful_Idiot
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:15amCalm down boot! There was NO SHOOT OUT! This isn’t Iraq or the Stan. As a police officer, you have to have situation awareness when US citizens would possible be collateral damage. The police can’t have this “us vs them” mentality and damn the innocents because I’m going home to my family nonsense. Read the article. If it is correct, then officers fired with no immediate threat. Meaning the suspect didn’t fire or point his weapon. If it is proper NYPD procedure to use deadly force in that situation, because a weapon is present, then a shot from behind cover was possible and should have been the done. You may get away with spraying rounds like that some where else, but not here. the fact that you have no concern about the citizens who were shot is alarming. We won’t know exactly where they were standing in relation to the perp when they were hit, but that apparently is no interest to you. If you have a concealed carry permit, please keep your weapon holster. The public will be safer.
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:42am@ NOT_A_USEFUL_IDIOT
Read it. Kelly said, The officers who caught up to Johnson
had “ a gun right in their face” and Responded quicky, and
they responded appropriatley.”
” These officers, having looked at the tape myself, had
absolutely no choice” Kelly said.
Kelly is one of the grown-ups in NYC.
Report Post »Like I said in other post, I wae going home safe each
night and so is my partner. For this reason I am sure glad
you were never my partner.
bjjmadmonkey
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 8:48amMarine you seem to be taking this very personally? I presume you’re either LE or have been overseas engaged in a combat situation that also involved collateral damage? While I agree a scenario like this is hard to predict an exact outcome, I suggest many of the comments of those concerned reflect genuine concern for the public’s safety. 9 bystanders shot?
That level of detriment at the hands of LE in a crowded area of downtown N.Y. during rush hour brings into question the total incompetence of LE in this case. Stance, AIM, FIRE-NOT “FIRE”! Despite the degree of difficulty this was a tactical nightmare. Remember, once those blues come off and that clock is punched that LE officer becomes nothing more than a civilian themselves. They are no more above the law than your average person.
If LE want to P&S then they better damn well make certain they are more than equipped to handle tactical situations as this by acquiring more than adequate time at the range as well as other tactical training to be squared away to deal with these scenarios when they punch back in without killing or injuring bystanders! AT EASE!
Report Post »hidden_lion
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 10:31amDon’t have to be a dead-eye to keep your shots in a group less than 5 inch at 10 feet. When cops carried revolvers, there were less instances of bystander casualties. Emptying their clips against one guy is bad tactics, what if he wasn’t alone? those cops would have been dead and more citizens they were supposed to protect would be injured or killed as well. This is purely a training issue.
Report Post »FREEDOMoverFEAR
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:23pmHey smart guy one cop isn’t even pointing his pistol at the right person when the shooting begins the other is running and firing his with one hand so ya some people are concerned with their training.
Report Post »FREEDOMoverFEAR
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 2:30pmExactly Marine249 if someone‘s not their they can’t judge. Unless you’re a citizen then yes your actions can and will be judged by 12 other citizens. But Marine249 is still right if a cop does it than he can’t be judged by anyone other than cops because cops are smarter and far better trained than citizens. Cop’s lifes are far more important than citizens. Cops put their lifes on the line and they should be able to shoot a few bystanders to protect it because those citizens signed up for danger when they walked down the street. It’s not like cops knew they might die before they took the job. Shoot first, remember most of those citizens don‘t pay union dues so let’s let them get hurt before a card holder is.
Report Post »woodyee
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:29pmDid I read that right?
The dirtbag shot one, and the police shot nine?!? And Nanny Bloomberg wants to disarm WHO?!?!?!?
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:33amBe careful…there are many bloggers here who think we are wrong and shooting up the place is good police work. Check out the attacks on my comments. Tee-Hee! And I came out in the top 10 in my police training class as well as my DOD Security training.
Oh, well, I guess they all want Rambo and Dirty Harry on the force.
Report Post »Hillbillybone
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:38amYou read it right……………….
Report Post »marine249
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:47am@SKREWEDRETIREE
Report Post »See my post to NOT_A_USEFUL_IDIOT above.
strewth_cobber
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:25pmH’mmm… News agencies release street camera surveillance footage of the police shooting the gunman in New York (the same day). However, no surveillance film released to the public of James Holmes (with orange-coloured hair – or whatever colour) entering or exiting the Colorado cinema complex. Interesting.
Ps… I don’t mean footage of James Holmes carrying out the carnage inside the cinema. Though, I am sure there are some who, for whatever reasons, would be interested in viewing film of that.
Report Post »nobama2012yeswecan
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:48pmIf it would of been Texas ,they would still be pulling bullets out of the corpse…did you see those city folk scurrying like ants?? I thought the cops were going to shoot each other and I’m sure one of them poo-pood his panties..
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:12amThe cops do not appear to have shot one another, but is sure as hell looks like they shot some of the citizens in their “body count”.
Report Post »NOT A CRAZY
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:43pmI love the wide open air and FREEDOM. I only have one request for all of the city slickers. Please stay in the city. Thanks.
Report Post »Not_A_Useful_Idiot
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:34pmNo one should be puzzled at why NYPD officers fired so many times. I forget what year it was but there was a armed robbery in mid town Manhattan and responding officers chased the suspect down the street firing at the the suspect as the chase continued. The suspect entered a parking garage and the police kept firing. Later they found a dead body next to a Mercedes and first reports were that is was the robbery suspect. Well, not quite. It happened to be an innocent bystander but police claimed he was shot by the suspect. Well, not really. It was later learned that several of the 210 rounds fired by the NYPD were recovered from that body. IMHO, 95 percent of police officers have no business carrying a firearm let alone using it. I am certain that any CCW holder, acting in the defense of himself and the public’s safety, would be charged with at least 9 counts of reckless endangerment. NYPD? All in a days work. search for videos of police and crossfire. It will make you cringe! They say you can’t be trusted with a firearm. lol
Report Post »oldwhiteguy
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:29pmThey are not pulling the wool over my eyes as I know this didn’t happen in New York City. They have laws that have banned guns so it is impossible for this to have happened. The next thing you will report is that the shooter was drinking a 24oz soda while he lay in wait.
Report Post »1proudAmerican
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 11:38pmNow Bloomberg will ban bosses from firing employees to prevent this from happening again. NY is the safest big city in the country? Really? What a joke.
Report Post »thegreatcarnac
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:00pmThat is why the police shot Johnson….they saw that he had just thrown away a 32 ounce drink.
Report Post »avgconservative
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:27pmWhat you have here is a great example of what can be done IF you have a policeman at home, on guard, 24/7 packing a 9mm Glock. I’d feel very safe.
But, I don’t live in the Empire State Building. I would never live within 40 miles of Bloomberg. And it takes 10 minutes for a cop to get to where I do live.
But, Bloomberg doesn’t think I should have a gun.
Bloomberg is an idiot.
Report Post »hidden_lion
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:37pmWhy would you feel safe? They would likely shoot you while trying to hit the perp.
Report Post »ddg7
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:21pmDon’t rule out the possibillity that someone will file suit against these cops for shooting the *****.
Report Post »hidden_lion
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:28pmMore great police action, this time only 16 rounds to put down a perp. The cops are responsible for every round they fire. I guess they need more practice at the range.
Report Post »scout n ambush
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:20pmThe police chase in Miami that ended in police shooting a black man who was trying to out run them was broadcast live today on fox that will get the NBP out in force in Florida plus the white lib popo haters will join them.
Report Post »BlackCrow
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:17pmIt has been my experience (and I have a lot) most cops couldn’t hit the side of the barn from the inside of the barn! Had an ER nurse that would clean the cops clocks in a shooting league and the cops were so ashamed of themselves and embarrassed they wouldn’t come back.
Two rounds to the center of mass and if that doesn’t put the problem down one to the head. That is what needs to be drummed into the head of anyone who is going to carry a pistol. This spray bullets in the direction of the threat gets innocent bystanders killed as this is a witness. Stay the hell out of big cities!
Report Post »ZaphodsPlanet
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:59pmI can‘t believe the police didn’t kill anyone else with as many shots as they fired. Murderer they killed sounds like he was a real piece of work, I wonder if they’ll find notes in his apartment to the effect that Jeffrey Johnson was stalking and planning this whole murder from the day after he got laid off. What a waste of humanity. BTW…. graphic designer = huge liberal (in most cases). Do we know if this was Encinom? Has anyone seen Encinom post today?
Report Post »KangarooJack
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:56pmAgree with previous posters regarding “Why” the news coverage when Chicago and Lord help us…Detroit has Murders most EVERY NIGHT.
It was because it was near the Empire State Building.
The Planters….ahhhh, what a suck azz situation!! You betcha richote (sp?) shots off those caused other injuries. Just look at the video…those darn planters really provided a nightmare.
Report Post »Bloomberg oughta ban sugary drinks over 8 oz. + ANY means of defense…including sticks + a ban on plant planters…! !!
Talafofotom2
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:08pmThose planters may have caused richocets ,the cops fired 16rnds.If they were 9mm hardball then they’d have bounced off a lot if they were using the once common crap smith .40 cal it was lucky they hit anything.Police don’t seem to concentrate much on cqb as was evidenced in the Ft. Hood Terrorist shooting. .45 cals. do bounce but the killer only shot at his victim-I smell a big lawsuit
Report Post »Smokey_Bojangles
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:26pmLocation. 16 black people in the ghetto does not raise an eyebrow,One murder outside the Empire State Building where cops shoot bystanders causes a hanky stomping ruckus.
Report Post »KangarooJack
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:27pmI don‘t only ’smell’ I foresee a HUGE lawsuit….doesn’t that suck the big one?! Damned if they do and damned if they don’t!
Report Post »blackhawk56
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:42pmin an earlier story on Drudge, they showed a picture of a man (supposedly the dead man) and he was lying beside a bus stop on the sidewalk. in this video he’s definitely not by a bus stop. This kind of shoddy reporting only sets off peoples radars. And i agree i did not see any one else hurt by stray bullets?????????????????????
Report Post »Polarized America
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:55pmthere were two dead guys.. the one at the bus stop was killed by the bad guy
Report Post »this video shows the cops killing the bad guy ….. i think
Freedombeliever
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:55pmI’ve seen those pictures as well and they are apparently not the shooter but the other gunshot victims (not dead) The article says the bullets ricocheted off of planters etc but IMHO just going by the video – kinda shoddy police work – they were close enough to easily dispatch of the perp without causing what – Nine? – civilian injuries. Something is a bit strange I admit.
Report Post »blackhawk56
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:05pm@Polarized America, that’s a real possibility. I appreciate the clarity, thanks
Report Post »Elena2010
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:12pmThat photo was fm another shooting yesterday afternoon in the Bronx (I think). Some older man shot two people in a diner like place near where his own cart was set up. Was the man you say wearing a hat and laid right down for PD? If so, that is what you saw.
Report Post »FANGS
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:37pmYea, that‘s just another reason why us employers won’t hire anymore.
Report Post »CherokeeSmiles
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:09pmWe employers, not “us” employers. Practice good grammar.
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:18amThank you for jumping on someone for not practicing good grammar. I dislike the abuse of the English language as much as anyone, but I ask you to be lenient due to the fact that proper grammar is no longer taught in schools these days, and in my area the decision has been made to stop teaching cursive writing in the Public Schools. I noticed the trend started in the 1970s to erode English; one can easily see things in advertising that start with And. And is a conjunction.
And we all know what that means.
No, we don’t know what that means. A sentence never starts with a conjunction. Do you see what I mean?
One person’s display of illiteracy can easily be excused because it probably shows how poorly he was educated at Taxpayer expense.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 5:30am@SKREWEDRETIREE
A sentence never starts with a conjunction. Do you see what I mean?
——
No, I don’t. That “rule” serves its purpose when kids are learning to write, but said grammatical construction is common in informal writing, and extensively used in literature. Teachers will give you general guidelines, but language is perhaps humankind’s most complex and versatile ability, and the one natural trait that shows we are uniquely made in God’s image. Bottom line, it all depends on whether you are writing to Barack or the Queen of England. :)
The grammar police often go into overkill mode — kind of like what happened to these cops.
Report Post »DIgnified
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 4:36pmIm guessing its ‘US’ and not ‘us’. Given the auto correct apostrophes and no commas. Calm down and put that high horse back in the stable.
Report Post »SCREW-WINDOWS
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:34pmI think more of this type of graphic videos should be shown on the news maybe it could curb some of the Hollywood beliefs that the bad guy gets away with only a scratch.
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 12:27amPardon me, but I think these videos follow very closely what comes out of Hollywood and TV!
Perhaps what we would be better off seeing is the result of proper Police training in the use of deadly force and proper marksmanship!
If cops are to carry guns in an urban or metropolitan environment, they need constant and intensive firearms practice and training.
It is not uncommon for a cop to only have to use his weapon for duty purposes and deadly force once or twice in his career, as I have been taught, but the use of an entire magazine of 5-10 rounds on ONE person (target) shows a decisive lack of training and an extreme of poor judgement.
I wonder if there will be a CIVILIAN shooting review board?
Report Post »www.TopTheNews.com
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:31pmHow many people were shot in Chicago last night? The media is so consumed with all of these shootings, as sad as they are, and being made into political talking points for anti-gun activists.
Prohibition has never worked with anything, nor will ever work. In cities like Chicago or New York that have restrictive policies, it is just as dangerous as say Dallas…
Report Post »Freedombeliever
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:42pmI agree. It’s the same old tired drivel. If someone really wants to obtain a gun they will find a way by illegal means. Nanny Bloomberg can‘t keep guns out of everyone’s hands. He’s just made it so regular citizens cannot properly defend their property and family if someone breaks into their home.
Report Post »scout n ambush
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:13pm19 people were shot in Chicago last night story at ammoland.com
Report Post »thegreatcarnac
Posted on August 25, 2012 at 1:06pmYou mean to tell me that 19 obama voters bit the dust last night?????No wonder the Kenyan is for gun control…..his voters ‘be killin’ ‘ each other.
Report Post »Freedombeliever
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:28pmI‘m somewhat puzzled as to why so many people were injured by the cop’s bullets. Seems they pretty much had him at point blank range…Oh well, what is important is everyone is expected to survive and the gunman is dead. Bet every boss will think twice if for just a moment before they fire an employee!
Report Post »SCREW-WINDOWS
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 9:35pmHey it worked for the Post Office.
Report Post »scout n ambush
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:28pmBloominidiot probably refuses to let them practice he is so anti gun and they were probably afraid he would press charges on them for shooting the murderer & doing their job making their aim unsteady.
Report Post »Needing_To_Vent
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:31pmMost cops can’t hit a barn at 10- paces…
Both cops should be in big trouble… They both fired at the guy with civilians running away in the back ground… If you watch the video they actually turn toward the people putting him (the bad guy) between them and the folks on the street.
Most likely at that range the 9mm rounds went through the bad guy and continued into the other folks. Bad angles and poor shots by these to cops… In fairness the one cop tried to move to shooting toward the street but still… Tazers should have been out as they pursued him had they hit him with that he would be on the ground flopping like a fish and no one else gets hurt.
As a CHL holder we I would be held accountable for every bullet that left my gun and hit something other then what I was aiming. These guys should be as well and the city will pay big because of it.
Report Post »hidden_lion
Posted on August 24, 2012 at 10:36pmBecause the cops suck. They don’t train enough or properly with their firearms, see also the story of the cop blasting the lady in her own backyard in San Diego, or the 46 round the Detroit police needed to kill one homeless man with a knife, etc, etc….
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