Evolution or Creationism? Find Out Where Protestant Pastors Stand
- Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:59pm by
Billy Hallowell
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American pastors overwhelmingly believe that Adam and Eve were very literal people and that evolution was not the tool that God used to create mankind. This notion — that Protestant leaders take the bible’s creation story literally — was reinforced in a recent study by LifeWay Research.
When asked to agree or disagree with the statement, “I believe Adam and Eve were literal people,” the results were strong to say the least. The vast majority — 74 percent — strongly agreed that Adam and Eve existed, with an additional 8 percent selecting that they “somewhat agree” with the statement. Overall, only 17 percent disagreed; one percent was unsure.
On the evolution indicator, which explored whether God used evolution to create humans, 73 percent of the Christian leaders polled indicated that they do not believe he did, with only 12 percent agreeing that it was God’s chosen creation method. Four percent of respondents indicated that they aren’t sure where they stand on the matter.
Image Credit: LifeWay Research
The Blaze previously reported on the doubts that some have had regarding whether Adam and Eve existed. These questions have caused some Christians to embrace evolution, while viewing the biblical creation story as something more rooted in literature than reality.
But for pastors, this stance is rare, according to the survey. ”…Protestant pastors are overwhelmingly Creationists and believe in a literal Adam and Eve,” explained Ed Stetzer, president of LifeWay Research.
In 2010, Gallup data showed that 40 percent of the nation embraces the notion that God created man in his current form, with only 16 percent claiming that God played no part in the process of creation. So, regardless of the growing levels of doubt, even among believers, more people — especially Protestant leaders — embrace Creationism than they do evolutionary theory.
When it comes to the earth’s age, though, there is some disagreement among pastors. When presented with the statement, ”I believe the earth is approximately 6,000 years old,” the results were evenly divided. While 34 percent of pastors strongly disagree with this notion, an additional 30 percent strongly agreed; nine percent fell into the “somewhat disagree” category, while 16 percent “somewhat agrees.”
You can read the rest of the results on the LifeWay web site.
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Comments (561)
WilkowonGBTV
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:46pmI can‘t believe that many pastors don’t believe the Bible. Romans 5:12-21 tells us that sin entered the world by Adam, and death by sin. This means that nothing died before Adam sinned. Not even dragons (dinosaurs).
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:01pmHeck.
Read up on the EPISCOPAL ‘leaders’!
Will make your head spin!
Report Post »cariboodragon
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 6:59pmthe bible was created by a group of smarter humans to control the vast majority of stupid humans.
Report Post »Marine25
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 10:15pm@cariboodragon
Report Post »And boy does it ever work. And the genius of religion is that it not only controls the stupid people it keeps them stupid.
Every god in human history has been eventually rendered a fraud just as soon as intelligent, rationale people answered the questions that god was created to answer. (Thor wasn’t of much use to anyone once thunder and lightning were proven to be a meteorologic collision of hot and cold air). Now christians and muslims alike are unified in condemning science and academia as evil. Keeps the flock stupid.
Qoheleth
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:43pmThere are a number of problems with the simplicity of this survey, basically falling into the “What do you mean by ____?” category. For instance, when you say “Creationism,” do you mean simply that God is the responsible and active force behind the existence of life or do you mean that God literally created human beings on a literal sixth day of the existence of all things? Even Church leaders who believe that evolution was the mechanism of creation still almost all hold that God was the motive force behind it.
Report Post »Likewise “Evolution” can mean anything from pure statistical random selection as the origin of species to something far more directed and purposeful.
In the end, I’m less concerned with the “how” than I am with the “why.” Whether, as Darwin posited, human beings and monkeys had some common ancestor or whether Adam was literally formed from dust and Eve from a rib has far less importance that what God has intended for humanity and me specifically. I’ll spend my time on sussing out the later.
Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:42pm@Blackhawk
“So if we evolved from apes, why didn’t all apes evolve?”
We didn’t evolve from apes, and no one who understands even the basics of the theory of evolution would claim such. So which is it: do you not understand evolution, or are you purposely trying to misrepresent it?
Report Post »jbcheesehead
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:41pmOne of the best books I’ve ever read on the subject of creation vs. evolution is still in print and available for e readers. It’s “What Darwin Didn’t Know“ written by a medical scholar he points out hundreds of flaws in Darwin”s theory that have definitely been disproven by what people in modern medicine now know. He feels in this day and age with the knowledge now available to us, Darwin would have never even printed his theory because it would not have made it past the people critiquing it. I think everyone on both sides of the issue should read this book instead of finding a few years from now that believing in popular theory is no way to be a scholar.
Report Post »akairey
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:49pmHere’s another great read that science has proven evolution to be………..wrong!
http://evolutionfacts.com/Handbook%20TOC.htm
Report Post »saranda
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:04pmAklairey – whose site is that. Cannot take a site seriously if they don’t publish who is behind the site, publishers, writers, info sources. Your site has none of that, so easily dismissed as fluff to be ignored.
Report Post »Lotus4115
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:35pmbULL cRAP!!!
Report Post »CCS
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 12:22amThat is some sorry excuse for “science”, akairey. I‘ll admit that it’s quite a creative piece of work. As others have noted, no one seems willing to take credit for that page. The flood caused everything that serious scientists view as evidence of evolution? The whole section on plate tectonics has been omitted because there would not be room for more important topics? The “Young Earth” dribble presented a list of unsubstantiated conjecture presented as fact. I couldn’t read any more without tearing my eyes out. Closed-minded and narrow-minded pseudoscience propaganda with a clear agenda. Garbage.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:40pm@BLACKHAWK1
We evolved from a common ancestor that was neither fully monkey nor fully man.
Look at the appendix, or wisdom teeth or how the human eye is actually backwards and upsides down and has a blind spot? What is intelligent about this “design?”
Report Post »Shrugged
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:40pmThis IS a shock. I wonder if we asked the same quetion to scientists if we would get the opposite trend?
Report Post »InversionTheory
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 9:46pmYou would. Several such studies have been done on the subject over the years with both the National Academy of Sciences and the Royal Society in Great Britain.
Report Post »DogTags
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:39pmJesus affimred there was a literal Adam and Eve. In Matthew 19:4 when discussing marriage Jesus said “Have you not read that he who made them at the beginning made them male and female?”
Jesus stated that “from the beginning,” not millions of years after the beginning, God made the male and female; distinct entities; distinct creatures; not ones that ‘evolved.”
I am surprised over 25% of “pastors” have not read their Bibles. Or, should I not be surprised? The 25% probably believe in a “living, breathing” interpretation of scripture, making “truth” relative and therefore, unknowable. They do this so they can fall for the lie the literal serpent literally told a literal Eve in literal Garden of Eden: “Did God really say…?”
Report Post »DogTags
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:50pmJesus affirmed there was a literal Adam and Eve. In Matthew 19:4 when discussing marriage Jesus said “Have you not read that he who made them at the beginning made them male and female?”
Jesus stated that “from the beginning,” not millions of years after the beginning, God made them male and female; distinct entities; distinct creatures that were to be united as one flesh; not ones that ‘evolved….”
I am surprised over 25% of “pastors” have not read their Bibles. Or, should I not be surprised? The 25% probably believe in a “living, breathing” interpretation of scripture, making “truth” relative and therefore, unknowable. They do this so they can fall for the lie the literal serpent literally told a literal Eve in literal Garden of Eden: “Did God really say….?” Because if God did not really say [...] then we can be our own gods (like Mormonism teaches) and live our lives how we want to.
Report Post »The10thAmendment
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:38pmLook at the scars on the back of Odumbo’s head. He didn’t evolve, he was a created thing that became manipulated because of a deadly head wound.
pwatkins
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:37pmI believe in both, but believe God is behind all..even evolution. I think God brought the light through His creativity, along with man, bc there was nothing but darkness upon the earth, even though there may have already been some animals or life below man. The serpent was there and may have evolved from a rejected spirit from Heaven. I think God created man in a likeness to Himself, but man fell short when it came to upholding his end of the likeness, so God had the Plan to make it right again. We can only speculate, bc no one but the Creator knows and will reveal it to us Only if He chooses.
Report Post »John 3:16..
altops
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:43pmhttp://www.creationtoday.org/category/type/video/creation-minute/
Report Post »akairey
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:48pmjust read this and you’ll know that science has proven evolution to be………..wrong!
http://evolutionfacts.com/Handbook%20TOC.htm
Report Post »RationalMan
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 10:32pmI believe in both, but believe God is behind all..even evolution…..
Report Post »****************************************************************************
Well, then who made God????
Doconicus
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 12:23pmThe ‘Untended Garden’ I think was the world prior to the coming of men. Once the ‘garden’ was made, the time of man began and everything was set.
the REVEREND Charls Darwin was trying to legitimate this in his book ‘Origin of the Species’. (which was deemed as gods creation, as the Origin) Once the world was set, the ability of creatures and plants to slightly change or be ‘nudged’ into being a surviving life.
Report Post »DogTags
Posted on January 17, 2012 at 3:52pmPWatkins,
That is a ridiculous position “I believe in both.” It is not biblically supported nor logically supported. Before man there was no sin, before sin there was no death….SO before man there could be no death. YET, evolution is a process of living and dying and the most beneficial mutations surviving and the bad ones dying off, until you get to man. How then can death and dying occur well before the fall of man?
If you accept evolution you have to logically accept the absence of sin, and if there is no sin, then God is a liar and therefore he is not God. PWatkins, take some time to actually think about it before believing in foolishness.
Report Post »Kaoscontrol
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:35pmMany here are asking “Why can’t Creation and Evolution co-exist?”
Here’s why the difference matters:
The Creationist view (or Intelligent Design): God has a purpose and intent for our existence. We are therefore accountable to a higher authority.
The Evolutionist view: We are just another link in the evolutionary chain…Just bundle of cells. Even if ‘God’ wound up the clock and set it in motion (then stepped aside) he doesn’t care about us and therefore we are morally accountable to no-one. Party ON!
You can’t have it both ways. you gotta choose….
Report Post »The10thAmendment
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:39pmThat’s all a part of the Marxist deception.
Report Post »Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:46pmCreationism is not Intelligent Design. Intelligent Design takes creationism ideas and attempts to ground them in selective scientific fact, but it is very different from creationism itself. ID, for example, will say that evolution might occur, but there’s a single force behind the original creation and guiding the evolution. Creationism, on the other hand, says the Earth is 6000 years old and Adam and Eve were the progenitors of the entire species. Evolution is bunk, and dinosaurs are the leviathans mentioned in the Old Testament.
I made the same mistake as you in equating the two before going to some creationist society meetings. There’s a world of difference between the two.
Report Post »qpwillie
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:46pm@Kaoscontrol
Your argument works as long as you get to make your own little straw man and present him as the only two possible scenarios.
Report Post »Kaoscontrol
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:49pmIn that case, “COMMUNIST PARTY ON!”
Report Post »Kaoscontrol
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:03pmLOCKED- You’re right. I.D. and Creationists aren’t one in the same… But to try to boil the concept down for the post, I lumped ‘em together. I still say we need to choose a world view and be guided by it’s inherent structure.
QPWILLIE – You want to add another straw man or two to make it more interesting? Jump on in…
Report Post »rocketwrangler
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:13pmThere are actually 6 types of evolution: 1. Cosmic (Origin of all time, space, and matter from nothing), 2. Chemical (origin of all elements from nothing), 3. Stallar (origin of stars and plantets from nothing), 4. Organic (origin of life from nothing), 5. Macro (origin of major kinds of animals from different kinds of animals), 6. Micro (variation within kinds of animals). The ONLY one with evidence is the last one. Yet, evolutionists would have our children taught ALL of them as fact and have tax payers pay for it.
Report Post »Kaoscontrol
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:51pmAmen ROCKETWRANGLER. Thanks.
Report Post »KickinBack
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:33pmQpwille
They have thumbs, not opposable thumbs. Meaning they cannot touch their thumbs to their fingers, as they are straight and designed for climbing trees.
Moderationisbest
You have a better argument?
Report Post »Blackhawk1
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:30pmqpwillie
So if we evolved from apes, why didn’t all apes evolve?
Report Post »MrButcher
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:29pmThere is a great deal of irony in watching creationists figuratively poop in their hands and throw it at those who suggest and demonstrate that they evolved from a common ancestor with chimps.
If chimps had religion they would defend it in the same manner.
Report Post »binge_thinker
Posted on January 14, 2012 at 12:16amThe Philosophical Impossibility of Darwinian Naturalistic Evolution
http://www.godandscience.org/evolution/philosophy_darwinian_evolution.pdf
Report Post »TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:27pmIt’s so easy. The Bible is completely genuine from Genesis to Revelation; or it is completely bunk. Every person who is introduced to the 66 books and 40 authors; gets to make their decision. I don‘t know how old the earth is and I don’t know what means God used to create, but He did. I believe every book in the cannon of scripture is genuine. I will have eternity to ask all those questions we can’t answer now.
Report Post »Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:41pm“The Bible is completely genuine from Genesis to Revelation; or it is completely bunk.”
This is a logical fallacy in multiple ways.
-First, how does one define “genuine”? From God? Accurately translated? Objective fact?
-Second, why must it be one or the other; why not a mixture of both? If Genesis is not genuine, why does that invalidate Revelation? Answer: it doesn’t.
-Third, assuming we use genuine as a synonym for “literal” in this case, does that not negate the parables told by Jesus Himself, as they are not literal stories but examples? Why can some not be metaphor, allegories, or parables, but we accept others as such… and who is the authority to decide which is which?
-Finally, even if the Bible is “completely bunk,“ by which we mean ”not literal fact,” can there not still be worth found in the morals, lessons, and values contained within?
Just some food for thought. My own experience is that most people who interpret the Bible literally are usually using the terribly translated King James Version (KJV). If the Bible is literal, why would you use a version that demonstrably mistranslated the original text? It’s a pet peeve of mine.
Report Post »TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:52pmI appreciate your take on the Bible. I’m convinced there are no errors in it. If there were, the way of Salvation may be in question; and that would be tragic.
Report Post »rocketwrangler
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:45pmGod promised to preserve His word. He did not promise to preserve the English language; or any other for that matter. Therefore, one must use any translation carefully in context and research the original text if there is any question. God’s word is perfect. Although LOCKED would have you believe it is relative. Hmmm… Who am I going to believe? God or LOCKED?
Report Post »Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:32pm“Therefore, one must use any translation carefully in context and research the original text if there is any question. God’s word is perfect.”
Saying “God’s word is perfect” must be a convenient excuse if you’re confronted with the flaws in your version of the Bible, I guess? Let me ask: how many times does your version mention Hell? The KJV, for example, would have you believe that Hell is a consistent theme throughout the Bible; in reality, it is never mentioned in the Old Testament, and the Jews had no such concept. It wasn’t until centuries after the death of Christ that Hell went from being a place for those awaiting judgment to a realm of torture.
It’s disingenuous to say “The word is always right” when you refuse to read the correct words!
Report Post »maccow
Posted on January 12, 2012 at 4:24amLocked
Report Post »Not anywhere close to you on this one, though you still make well thought out and polite responses.
By “literal’ it assumes that the reader is taking the Bible “seriously” with a proper application of some reasonable hermeneutics.
Your later arguments speaks of the greater richness, depth and precision of Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic over the more simple english. But understanding the original text and how it was translated has never been easier then with todays technology, at least for the diligent student.
The Word translated Hell in the Old Testament is אול shĕ’owl; Designation for the abode of the dead. Occurs 19 times. You have another definition for this word? For the meaning of the word go look at how its used in context.
Hell has two Greek equivalents in the New Testament; γέεννα geenna and ταρταρόω tartaroō
As far as church and cultural traditions about hell being a place of torment. I chock that up to bad renaissance art based on the works of dante. I hold most church traditions suspect if not directly supported by scripture, i.e three wise men, current site of Mt. Sinai, the site of the Church of the Holy Sepulcher, etc. I have read some, but not enough of Jewish Rabbinical writings to say what their views on Hell might be. There are so many schools of Jewish thought, much of it changed post Diaspora that I would be surprised if “no concept of hell” ever existed in the Jewish community. It wouldn’t surprise me if that is the
ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:25pmYour argument lacks reasoning, logic and common sense.
Report Post »qpwillie
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:24pmAll the apes and all the old world monkeys have opposable thumbs. New world monkeys don’t have thumbs but have prehensile tails.
Report Post »momrules
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:21pmThis survey makes me believe that there are some Preachers that should get out of the pulpit.
How can one teach and preach about the Bible if they think any part of it is a myth?
Report Post »garyM
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:18pmWhat a question and a survey, no real Pastor believes in evolution period!
Report Post »brother_ed
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:25pmI agree with you, however, apparently some do…
That could be what prompted Huckabee to comment that we are not a Christian nation.
It is no wonder the sheep have wandered if the shepherd isn’t sure of the direction.
Report Post »Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:17pm“On the evolution indicator, which explored whether God used evolution to create humans, 73 percent of Christian leaders indicated that they do not believe he did, with only 12 percent agreeing that it was God’s chosen creation method.”
There’s an error with this statement; the people polled were Protestant pastors, not “Christian leaders” as a whole. Protestantism encompasses many sects, and it also leaves out Catholicism; by far the majority when it comes to Christians worldwide.
I’m more interested in seeing where the denominations break when it comes to these questions. Evangelical and fundamentalist sects (like the Southern Baptists for example) likely have different views than progressive sects (like the United Church of Christ). Blanketing them all together as “Protestants” could cause fights half a century ago; many views can differ between the groups.
Report Post »Phoneguy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:15pmGood thing I KNOW where I came from, I find it sad that some are not willing to investigate it.
Report Post »democritusoilder267
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:15pmHow do any of you view evolution and creationism? I believe evolution and creationism can hand and hand to say.
Report Post »Kaoscontrol
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:37pm“Why can’t Creation and Evolution co-exist?”
Here’s why the difference matters:
The Creationist view (or Intelligent Design): God has a purpose and intent for our existence. We are therefore accountable to a higher authority.
The Evolutionist view: We are just another link in the evolutionary chain…Just bundle of cells. Even if ‘God’ wound up the clock and set it in motion (then stepped aside) he doesn’t care about us and therefore we are morally accountable to no-one. Party ON!
You can’t have it both ways. you gotta choose….
Report Post »democritusoilder267
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:47pmWell I see evolutionary differently then you do. I just see my faith (Islam) working with evolution some how.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:54pm@KAOSCONTROL
I am morally accountable to everyone because it is my thinking that I don’t have the right to impose my will on someone else.
My morals come from rationality, logic and reason as is everyone else’s.
There was a time when the Christian God said “Eating shellfish is an abomination.” So either God isn’t absolute in what he thinks is right and wrong, or Christians thought that calling eating shellfish an abomination wasn’t rational(NEWS FLASH : It’s not rational).
Either way, God‘s law CAN change and you aren’t showing your morality, you are showing your obedience. There’s a difference.
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:09pm@Moderation
You continue to make silly and nonsensical Comments here grounded in a lack of understanding.
I’ll not do your homework for you, but will point you in the right direction: Study the New Testament. All of the Old Testament prohibitions regarding diet, apparel, etc., were revisited there by Jesus.
Of course, if you immerse yourself in “IH8teGod” newsletters and support groups, you will only continue to hear the silly arguments like the one you just made. And that, friend, simply makes you appear foolish, ill-educated, irrational, and unintelligent.
Cheers!
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:35pm@VOTERIGHTDAMMIT
I attended an Evangelical church for six years and studied the Bible deeply and followed those beliefs. I prayed nightly and believed it was only through God’s grace did he send Jesus to die for our sins It was only until I actually read the Bible with the mind of a skeptic did I pull away from the church and those beliefs.
Jesus IS God according to Christians(while also being the Son of God, lol)
God is therefore not unchanging and at numerous times in the Old Testament ordained murder, theft and rape. Apparently what made this murder, theft and rape moral is because it was ordained by God(I know, makes no sense.) Since Jesus IS God, he IS responsible for it.
Let’s not get into the immoral act of sending Jesus to die for sins, when he could simply forgive sin. Let’s also not get into you needing Jesus to die for your “sins” and using him as a scapegoat.
Let’s also not get into all knowing, loving God, sending people to eternal torture for something as little as “disbelief.”
There is a difference between obedience and morals. You are obeying your God, you are not exhibiting morals.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:00pm@FLORIDACRACKER
Calling something an “abomination” is not “advice” that you may or may not follow. That again is intellectually dishonest and illogical.
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:49pm@Moderation
It’s a constant surprise when I hear people exclaim, “I attended an Evangelical church xxx years …” as if that implied they were either saved, able to hear, or knowledgeable. PLEASE – drop that as some sort of badge. It ain’t.
I’m neither offended nor impressed you laugh (‘lol’) at Jesus, The Word, or God. You see, it bears no relationship to me, my faith, nor my present life or future. That’s only gonna affect YOU. Knock yourself out if that makes you feel all powerful, or clever, or whatever of your boats that floats.
1. You seem to think that, cause God & Jesus are one, that makes God not unchanging. Curious how you got to THAT little conclusion! You think Jesus came into existence ONLY at his mortal birth? You are not aware of the numerous times Jesus – in pre-mortal form – appeared in Old Testament times? You confound me, Sir.
2. You seem to believe God should adhere to your, or our, notions of right/wrong. That is, you ascribe “murder” to God destroying humans. Seems just a wee bit arrogant to me. How many Universes have YOU created? Oh, heck, lets make it easy: How many solar systems? Planets? NONE??? And yet you feel yourself to be well positioned to pass judgment on One who HAS done these things??? You confound me, Sir.
(ran out of room – TBD)
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 8:31pm@Moderation (con’t)
3. You seem to feel yourself well positioned to pass judgment on God for his strategy and action of sending Jesus to be crucified (you totally forgot the part about God TURNING HIS BACK TO JESUS WHILE HE SUFFERED!). See Item #2, above. You really, really confound me, Sir!
4. You seem to feel yourself well positioned to pass judgment on God for not accepting the rebellion of men, and for His decision to send them to eternal damnation for such sins (providing they are not saved — a VERY BIG boo hoo (seriously, not in sarcasm) to you, my friend!). See Item #2 above.
Being a Christian means, at it’s foundation, accepting God as creator of the universe, accepting this is a tad bit above anything you (or I) can do; accepting God could, in an instant, as easily erase all of us as did He create us (and that we ALL deserve just that by our actions); and, humbling ourselves before the Creator for his love, grace and forgiveness for not only NOT waving His pinky and erasing us one and all, but for going so far out of His way to provide a vehicle for our salvation.
You seem to have missed the boat on that one, Sir.
Again – doesn’t change my life ~~ here and now or later ~~~ in the least. Knock yourself out.
And good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 1:12am@VOTERIGHTDAMMIT
You make me laugh with your horrible arguments.
You claim that I make claims about your God, well so do you! You also judge your God, because you judge him as good, when he obviously isn’t.
Not only that, but your main defense for “God is good” is because “God says he’s good!” Irrational
You claim your God is all knowing and all loving, yet is mysterious and “works in strange ways.”
This has created a win-win scenario of
1. if something good happens, then it must be because God is good
2. If something bad happens, God works in mysterious ways and how are we to understand God’s will?
Give me a break.
It reminds me of
1. If I pray and my prayer gets answered, God is great and answered my prayer!
2. If I prayer and my prayer goes unanswered, it‘s God’s will and who am I to question it?
Your God is the biggest murderer of all time and the biggest abortionists of all time. If he is all knowing, then he gives babies to women he knows will get an abortion. That’s love right there!
Honestly, how people can continue to believe such nonsense is beyond me.
Report Post »Seriously, this is stuff for children to believe and follow.
ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 1:22am@FLORIDACRACKER
Yes, but people still use the word “abomination” to describe homosexuality. You can’t have it both ways.
I appreciate your concern and you seem somewhat rational unlike a lot of other posters on here.
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 2:04amYou ARE a silly person!
1. Judging. I accept; you judge and reject – based on your infinite (sic) mental prowess. Wow. Autograph please?
2. Logic. Curious you simply swiveled and turned your back on pretty much everything and simply spewed. I wonder why?
3. Creating a win-win scenario. First, I most certainly do NOT ascribe good/bad events as you ass-u-med. That’s YOUR unique failing. Second, I’m not in the business of creating a win-win, win-lose, win-lose, or lose-lose argument; I’ll continue to leave to YOU the notion that You, armed with your infinite wisdom and mental prowess, can both define God, evaluate his worthiness, and judge the acceptability of His behavior. Again, your autograph is simply craved. You see, I accept on faith.
By the way, your entire notion of no-God is faith based as well, since you have no facts to prop up any argument either way. Yet you reject faith based beliefs. Curious.
4. “God the murderer”. I suppose since you were too busy or elevated to actually read what I wrote, I’ll have to repeat it here. Maybe by accident it will catch your eye and make it past your quite impressive filters: KIND OF PRESUMPTUOUS, DON’T YA THINK, TO ASCRIBE HUMAN VALUES TO THE CREATOR, AND THEN PRESUME A POSITION TO JUDGE HIS GOODNESS OR BADNESS ~~~~~~~~~~~~ DON’T YA THINK ??????????????????
5. Nonsense/children. At every generation there are “Moderations” who really, really know. Really. And then we learn more an
Report Post »thegreatcarnac
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:14pmGod created heaven, earth, the waters, and mankind. The basic creation of everything was of God. Perhaps, because of surroundings and matters of survival some animals evolved some minor differences in a relative short period of time. To point to those evolutions as the pattern for everything is a total mistake. Creationism is the truth.
Report Post »palerider54
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:22pmI completely agree. God created the heavens and the earth, and then he rested.
Then God created man, and both rested.
Then God created woman, and no one has rested since.
Sorry, just could not help my self.
Yes dear, I’ll get right on that.
Report Post »TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:37pmLOVE it, PALERD…
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:14pmLol.
Report Post »VoteRightDammit
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:12pmTrust me —-
YOU may be laughing, but NO ONE here is laughing at or with you.
There may be many, many sighs of sadness for you ~~~~ some tears, perhaps ~~~~ but no one is crude or evil enough to laugh at your burdens.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:23pmWhat are you babbling about?
Report Post »binge_thinker
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:51pmMainly we’re just laughing at you.
Report Post »SychinLegacy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:04pmWhy can’t we believe in both? Perhaps evolution was designed by a creator.
Oh but then I guess that would mean we would all have to stop fighting over arbitrary things that don’t matter.
Report Post »Stuck_in_CA
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:10pmWould SOMEBODY please tell me where in The Bible it says Eve ate an apple? Got a verse?
Report Post »NoRoomForSocialismHere
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:11pmYou dont matter and your ignorant opinion does not rate a debate
Report Post »NoRoomForSocialismHere
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:14pmAzatlan is a fantasy land for sure, never exisited and never will
Report Post »V-MAN MACE
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:19pmThe earth is probably 6000 years old in God’s time, but time is relative. Black holes (such as the gigantic black hole we LIVE INSIDE OF) distort and warp spacetime.
Evolution and Creationism isn’t neccessarily mutually exclusive. I think God created man telepathically through the electromagnetic field and the black hole.
Report Post »NoRoomForSocialismHere
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:22pmThe begining of human life is ca 6000yrs ago and I dont know how long it took God to make earth but he did.
NOT ONE EVOLUTION GAG HAS PROVED TO BE TRUTHFUL, NO NOT ONE.
We do have proof that man walked on the foot prints of the Dinosaurs yes in the same creek bed right here in Texas. It is fossil history
Report Post »V-MAN MACE
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:23pmIn terms of biblical time, such as described in the Book of Genesis (and the evening and the morning was the ___ day…), we are still living in the evening (night) of the 7th day.
The morning of the 8th day has not yet dawned. That’s why outer space is so dark. When the darkness is vanquished, the entirety of outer space will become illuminated like daytime.
Report Post »louise
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 6:31pmStuck in CA: you asked,
Would SOMEBODY please tell me where in The Bible it says Eve ate an apple? Got a verse?
____________________________________________________________________________
Doesn’t say that does it. ;)
Report Post »Scripture also does not say “three” wise-men, either.
broker0101
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:03pmHow about this for a bit of Harsh Reality, Blazers? I have NO IDEA where Life, the Universe and Everything came from. AND NEITHER DO YOU. Deal with it. (Except for the book by that title. That came from Douglas Adams)
Report Post »Phoneguy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:13pmSorry that you don’t know where you came from, I find that sad, I know where I came from, and it ain’t from evolution, monkey boy. The truth is out there, but you must do your homework.
Report Post »Locked
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:20pm“ I know where I came from”
No one can know for sure. You can belief in a religious account; or you can belief in scientific theory; or you can believe in whatever you want. No mortal knows for sure.
You believe you know. As does anyone else; except, I suppose, the guy who you responded to, who comes up the the only true answer: “I don’t know.”
Report Post »Blackhawk1
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:29pmWell this should give Broker a clue. Or at least a direction to head in.
If we evolved from apes, then why didn’t all apes evolve?
If you are like every other human on earth, You came from your mother having sex with your father!
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 4:35pm@BLACKHAWK1
Take that curiosity and do some research.
Once you do, you will find out what you are describing isn’t how evolution works.
Report Post »Blackhawk1
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:00pmModerationIsBest
You are missing my point evidently. I do not believe in evolution, Global warming, or any other junk science that mindless/immoral liberals dream up to justify their atheist lifestyle.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 5:14pm@BLACKHAWK1
You are missing THE point.
If you’re going to reject science no matter what, don’t bother asking questions in an attempt to disprove legitimate arguments.
Don’t ask, “If we evolved from apes, then why didn’t all apes evolve?” if you don’t really care what the answer is.
Feel free to remain ignorant.
Are you a person that when you see a magic trick you can’t explain, then suddenly assume that it was legitimate magic and not some slight of hand or misapprehension?
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 6:22pm@FLORIDACRACKER
Your argument is so full of illogical thoughts I don’t know where to begin.
First off, I don‘t idolize anyone so I don’t know where you get that from.
Report Post »Second, I have tons of people I love from my family to my friends(who mostly consist of religious people)
Thirdly, you have just successfully diminished your faith down to insurance coverage when you talk about, “If I”m wrong, nothing changes, but if you’re wrong, you’re going to hell.”
Lastly, if you are a Christian and are wrong, you just spent your ENTIRE life believing something that is COMPLETELY false. Countless times rejecting reason, logic, common sense and rationality. You spent your whole life being a hypocrite telling other people “the truth” and quoting things as fact when it couldn’t be further from the truth. Telling people that they are born horrible people and only through belief in an imaginary being could they have eternal life.
ModerationIsBest
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 6:56pm@Florida
I can keep it cool no problem and have no problem with people having a belief. It is when those people call it factual, and then want to create legislation based around those beliefs that I start to get annoyed and argumentative. I’m not saying this is you, but there are quite a few people on here that feel that way.
I may be an atheist, but I don’t claim to know without a shadow of a doubt that there is no God. While I haven’t seen evidence to make me think there is a God, much less a specific God, I don‘t claim to know there isn’t one without a shadow of a doubt.
The problem is, believers will try diminish atheists by saying “oh, you’re so smart, you claim to be so sure” and other garbage when they themselves are the ones who claim the unknowable(belief in a specific God) as FACT. It’s very hypocritical and intellectually dishonest.
I will now discuss what you said.
“If Christians are wrong and there is nothing more than this life, then they go to the grave after a decent life, sharing love and caring for others. If atheists are wrong, after wasting their life here in selfish idolatry, when they die they will miss eternity with our loving Father, enjoying His company and blessings.
Now, tell me who are the fools.”
Those are your own words, therefore you are using the insurance coverage or “Pascal’s wager” argument. I also argue that your God is “loving.”
I accept your friendship if you are extending it but nothing more
Report Post »DeavonReye
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 9:46amPascal’s wager is highly erroneous. Those who use that faulty logic fail to account for “another god/dess being actually true, and not Yahweh”. If Allah is “the true god”, the christian is in just as much trouble as the atheist.
Now, for argument sake that the biblical god is true, . . . . . you said he “wants to have a relationship with me”. How so? In his silence? Through a generalized book written by bronze age mystics? Through the ability of my mind to “feel strongly about something”? Those mechanisms fail.
Report Post »sawbuck
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 10:04ammoderationisbest
First of all “they” didn’t “Create Legislation”..!
THEY.. “Our founding fathers” created a COUNTRY…!
The U.S.A. ..!
On these principles….! Judeo – Christians- Beliefs .
Or did you already forget that the “Ten Commandments” was on nearly every “Courthouse” in the land.
And it only took the un-godly/corrupted..
A ¼ of a millennia…To turn it into a shell of itself..
You gat it backwards ..!
Report Post »The un-godly / corrupt people , passed legislation that should never been allowed.
So much so…
A person cant hardly tell the difference from our country to any other un-godly country …
And the “Legislators” have slow but steady made this country …
CLOSER TO SATANS DESIRE…!
beckisnutsisnuts
Posted on January 11, 2012 at 2:46pmDEAVONREYE:
Report Post »It‘s called a ’conscience’. God speaks through it. Some choose to listen; others ignore, still others, outright rebel. His is a still, small voice. You must willingly, openely seek to hear it, my friend. And not be afraid of the consequences of following it!