Politics

Fact-Checking the Fact-Checkers: Here‘s a Break Down of the Claims Bashing Paul Ryan’s Speech

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Paul Ryan’s speech accepting his nomination for the vice presidency of the United States last night has already been widely hailed as a home run national debut by many sources. So it’s no surprise that the Left, which views Ryan’s ideas as the political equivalent of Typhoid Mary, has already pounced on the speech for its alleged inaccuracies, while simultaneously bringing up every conceivable nitpick they can.

Dave Weigel at Slate huffed, “So I was in the cheap seats, not on carpet, when Ryan plowed through one of the more impressive strings of whoppers we’ve seen at this level. Ryan’s been doling out chunks of this speech for weeks, which made the fibs sound even stranger.”

ThinkProgress, meanwhile, attacked the speech practically every minute in their liveblog, seizing on every rhetorical flourish of Ryan’s, no matter how inconsequential, to blast him with some figure or quote that would make him seem to be a hypocrite or a liar. The piece de resistance has to be their final response to Ryan, in which they managed no less than two shots in response to an unfalsifiable bit of feel-good rhetoric:

Ryan reminds the convention of the need to protect the weakest among us. It’s too bad that his budget would drastically cut the programs they rely on. Religious leaders have described Ryan’s budget as a “immoral disaster” that “robs the poor.” At the same time, it gives the rich and corporations $3 trillion in tax breaks.

In short, according to the Left, Ryan’s speech was a fundamentally, inescapably dishonest argument – a “string of whoppers” and disingenuous statements – made in bad faith for the sake of masking his allegedly plutocratic agenda.

But is this rather unflattering assessment accurate, those who are understandably reluctant to take their ideological opponents’ word on anything must be asking. The answer is no – at least, not entirely. Avik Roy at Forbes, as well as Republican consultant Liz Mair, have already exploded some of the attacks on Ryan’s speech, and we will turn to them for help in taking on some of the charges. You can find their full takes here and here.

The ThinkProgress list of charges is probably the most extensive, comprising no less than 12 different charges. Here is our assessment of each:

Charge #1: Ryan voted to add $6.8 trillion to the deficit, which means he’s not a fiscal hawk.

Explanation: In a blog post written by a ThinkProgress intern, Ryan is accused of voting for bills that increase the budget deficit by $6.8 trillion. How do they get this number? By adding up the cumulative cost of all tax cuts that Paul Ryan voted for ($2.5 trillion), as well as “every bill that increased defense spending,” which has supposedly increased the deficit by $1.9 trillion. This only comes to $4.4 trillion, but ThinkProgress explains the rest using this table:

ThinkProgress and Slate Attack Paul Ryans Speech, And We Fact Check The Evidence

So is it true? Barely. Yes, Ryan has voted to spend a lot of money. Outside of Dr. Ron Paul, so has practically every member of Congress. It’s easy to quibble with the numbers here, but we’re going to point out two things instead. Firstly, this chart is of total cost for these bills, not total cost minus revenue. In other words, this isn’t what Ryan voted to add to the deficit. It’s what Ryan voted to spend. So their statement that he added $6.8 trillion to the deficit is flat-out wrong. Secondly, this estimate covers 10 years. Ryan voted to spend $6.8 trillion over ten years. That comes out to roughly $680 billion per year.

Compare this with President Obama’s proposed budget for fiscal year 2013, which would spend $47 trillion over the next ten years, or $4.7 trillion/year, according to Forbes. Ryan’s proposed budget shrinks that number to $40 trillion, or $4 trillion/year. Yes, that’s right, even the supposedly draconian, nasty Ryan budget spends many times more money over ten years than Ryan has personally voted to spend.

So this charge is deceitfully worded and quite arguably irrelevant.

Charge #2: Paul Ryan talked about a General Motors plant that closed in his hometown, blaming President Obama even though that plant closed under Bush.

Explanation: Near the beginning of his speech, Ryan told this story:

A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.”  That’s what he said in 2008.

Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year.  It is locked up and empty to this day.  And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.

The Left wing of the blogosphere pounced, claiming the plant closed in December of 2008, when Bush was still President, so it‘s not Obama’s fault and Ryan is lying.

So is it true? The Milwaukee-Wisconsin Journal Sentinel describes the plant as having completely shut down in 2009. The decision to close it was made in 2008, but the plant itself didn’t shutter until the next year, by which time the GM bailout had already passed. MRCTV’s Stephen Gutowski pinpoints its moment of failure at April 23, 2009.

National Review’s Henry Payne twists the knife further:

His liberal media allies were quick to pounce on Ryan’s comments. “GM stopped production at its Janesville, Wisconsin production facility in 2008, when George W. Bush was still president,” barked the Daily Kos, filling in Ryan’s obvious blank (true enough, unfriendly-to-Detroit-truck mpg laws are also the legacy of George “We’re Addicted to Oil” Bush).

But the Left misses the point. Under Obamanomics, the government picks winners and losers. Obama promised Janesville would be a winner even as his economic policies guaranteed it would always be a loser. Indeed, Obama’s whole 2008 Janesville speech is a sobering road map for the job-killing policies he has put in place as president.

As a final note – plants have almost certainly closed while President Obama has been in office. Ryan just happened to pick one he had a personal connection to as a symbol. Romney adviser Eric Fernstrohm said precisely this when questioned about the GM Plant issue by John Berman of CNN:

And notice the Ryan said “candidate” Obama. That’s because the president was campaigning in 2008 on saving the plant. He didn’t, and it closed for good in 2009.

Charge #3: Ryan is wrong about the stimulus, which actually “created or saved 3.3 million jobs.”

Explanation: From Ryan’s speech: “What did the taxpayers get out of the Obama stimulus?  More debt.  That money wasn’t just spent and wasted – it was borrowed, spent, and wasted.”

In response, ThinkProgress cites a study by the CBO saying that the stimulus “created or saved” 3.3 million jobs.

So is it true? Not unless you think the highest possible estimate is always the right one. The CBO estimated that the stimulus could have saved up to 3.3 million jobs. In other words, “creating or saving” 3.3 million jobs is the absolute upper limit on what the stimulus could have done. The lowest estimate is 500,000 jobs created or saved. Both numbers are probably inaccurate, but to accept the 3.3 million jobs number requires an extreme degree of optimism.

Charge #4: Paul Ryan supported the stimulus in 2002!

Explanation: ThinkProgress links to a video from the Chris Hayes show showing Paul Ryan speaking on behalf of a 2002 stimulus bill that President Bush signed into law. This is supposed to prove that Ryan is a hypocrite when it comes to stimulus spending.

So is it true? To begin with, it’s irrelevant. Ryan was speaking against the Obama stimulus specifically in his speech. He didn’t rail against the concept of stimulus spending, period. Moreover, there is a lot of daylight between supporting a $42 billion stimulus measure – most of which is in tax relief – and supporting an $831 billion bill that is loaded with giveaways for favored groups/industries. It’s true that Ryan supports the idea of stimulus in principle, but when it comes to stimuli as big as the one Obama wrote? Not a chance.

Charge #5: Ryan’s attacks on Obamacare also hit Romneycare.

Explanation: Ryan said in his speech, “Obamacare comes to more than two thousand pages of rules, mandates, taxes, fees, and fines that have no place in a free country.” ThinkProgress asks, “What about Massachusetts? The two laws are very similar.”

So is it true?  Yes, what about Massachusetts? And more to the point, what about what Ryan actually said? Romneycare isn’t 2,000 pages. It doesn’t include any new taxes. It doesn’t include the infamous Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB). Romney vetoed large chunks of regulation that were originally in the bill. Yes, it has a mandate, but that mandate is a lot less expansive. In other words, Romneycare comes to less than two thousand pages, with very few rules, one mandate, no taxes, some fees and some fines. What about Massachusetts? ThinkProgress probably doesn’t want an answer to that question.

Charge #6: Repealing Obamacare would increase the deficit by $109 billion from 2013 to 2022 and take away coverage from more than 30 million Americans.

Explanation: This is a response to Ryan’s promise to repeal Obamacare. Presumably, the idea is to claim that Obamacare is fiscally conservative and Ryan isn’t.

So is it true? The claim that Obamacare will guarantee coverage for “more than 30 million Americans” is nonsense. In fact, the Congressional Budget Office actually says that Obamacare itself will leave 30 million people uninsured. This means that, at most, Obamacare will grant  coverage to 23 million of the more than 50 million people who are presently uninsured, according to the CBO. There’s quite a bit of daylight between that figure and “more than 30 million.” Moreover, these estimates are historically unreliable. The CBO has revised its projects on the fiscal impact of Obamacare multiple times. Not to mention, $109 billion over ten years is a comparatively small number, and should be more than offset by other cuts proposed by Romney and Ryan.

Charge #7: Paul Ryan is a hypocrite on Medicare.

Explanation: This is actually three separate charges in one. ThinkProgress alleges, firstly, that Ryan supported the $716 billion in Medicare cuts that he slams Obama for in the speech; secondly, that Ryan bragged about cutting Medicare spending more than Obama, and thirdly, that under Romney and Ryan, Medicare would actually become insolvent by 2016, instead of 2024, precisely because Romney wouldn’t cut $716 from Medicare.

So is it true? Avik Roy takes apart the “Ryan supported cutting $716 billion from Medicare,” too, talking point this way:

Here are the facts. It’s true that Ryan’s budgets in 2011 and 2012 preserved Obamacare’s cuts to Medicare. However, there is a huge difference between cutting Medicare by $716 billion to fund $1.9 trillion in new health spending, as Obamacare did, and cutting Medicare by $716 billion to shore up the solvency of the Medicare program itself, as the Ryan budget sought to do.

Secondly, the Romney Medicare plan fully repeals Obamacare, including the $716 billion in Medicare cuts.

We will deal with Ryan’s bragging about cutting Medicare spending faster than Obama in a moment. For now, consider the final attack – that Ryan and Romney’s plan will make the program run out of money faster. Why? Well, because they restore the $716 in cuts. Or to be more specific, they would repeal cost-saving provisions in Obamacare that will make the budget of the program shrink naturally. In other words, they implicitly concede that reducing the Medicare budget by eliminating inefficiency is a good thing.

And that is precisely what Ryan was trying to do with the Path to Prosperity. As established above, Ryan’s original budget cut $716 billion now in order to shore up Medicare for the future. According to his own budget, the other cuts would have also been directed toward establishing Medicare’s long term solvency. ThinkProgress is free to dispute whether his method would work, but if you follow the internal logic of these charges, they end up attacking Romney for being too friendly to Medicare, relative to Obama and Ryan. That’s a talking point the Romney campaign would probably love, with some adjustments.

Charge #8: Ryan’s Medicare plan only cuts Medicare spending because it makes seniors pay more.

Explanation: ThinkProgress links to one of their own studies showing that the Romney-Ryan plan on Medicare would force seniors to pay more out of pocket, making up for the savings to the government.

But is it true? The ThinkProgress study isn’t talking about current seniors, but about people who will be seniors in 2023. Which is strange, because they also think Medicare will end in 2016 under Romney-Ryan. So which is it? Will the Romney-Ryan plan end Medicare in four years, or will it keep it solvent while making people who are currently under 55 pay more down the line? Moreover, the actual study relies entirely on estimates of what would happen after Romney and Ryan repeal Obamacare to make its case that seniors would be hurt, suggesting that when Romney and Ryan replace Obamacare, they could easily put in other cost control mechanisms that keep their promise true. In fact, even the left-leaning Politifact agrees this is a possibility.

Charge #9: The credit downgrade is Republicans’ fault.

Explanation: ThinkProgress says this: “Ryan just brought up a ‘downgraded America.’ It was his party that held the debt ceiling hostage, causing America’s creditors to lose faith and downgrade the country. In fact, the ratings agency repeatedly blamed Republicans for refusing to raise taxes.”

But is it true? From Liz Mair (Warning! Language):

If we go back to S&P’s original statement explaining its decision to downgrade, we see that it says this:

We lowered our long-term rating on the U.S. because we believe that the prolonged controversy over raising the statutory debt ceiling and the related fiscal policy debate indicate that further near-term progress containing the  growth in public spending, especially on entitlements, or on reaching an agreement on raising revenues is less likely than we previously assumed and will remain a contentious and fitful process. We also believe that the fiscal consolidation plan that Congress and the Administration agreed to this week falls short of the amount that we believe is necessary to stabilize the general government debt burden by the middle of the decade. 

Our lowering of the rating was prompted by our view on the rising public debt burden and our perception of greater policymaking uncertainty, consistent with our criteria…

This is S&P essentially saying the downgrade occurred because of four things:

1) It wasn’t clear until the last possible minute that the debt ceiling would definitely be raised (OK, blame the Tea Party on this one, though I’d also note Obama voted against raising the debt ceiling as a senator and if we give him a pass on that, he ONLY gets a pass because his position was so minority then as to not matter– so he was fringe AND irrelevant);

2) Washington– constituted by two relatively intransigent political parties– can‘t and won’t get its s**t together to a) cut spending– and especially entitlements and/or b) raise revenue at an adequate level for S&P’s tastes (Democrats and Republicans get equal blame here, as Democrats won’t accept significant cuts to entitlement spending, which S&P calls out by name, and many Republicans won’t accept any tax increases);

3) The deal cut in order to allow the debt ceiling to be raised sucked and didn’t do enough (again, both parties get blame here); and

4) Our debt burden is getting too big and setting aside that Democrats and Republicans in Washington haven’t been able to get their shit together to deal with it, S&P thinks they won’t, in the near future, get their s**t together, either (again, both parties get blame here).

In short, no, this isn‘t all the Republicans’ fault.

Claim #10: Ryan is wrong that Obama has racked up more debt than all previous presidents combined.

Explanation: Ryan claimed, “President Obama has added more debt than any other president before him, and more than all the troubled governments of Europe combined.  One president, one term, $5 trillion in new debt.” ThinkProgress responds, “Obama hasn’t amassed more debt than all past presidents combined, as Ryan claimed. The New York Times beaks down the math: ‘The national debt stood at $10.626 trillion on the day that President Obama took office. It now stands slightly above $15 trillion.’”

But is it true? Only if you assume Ryan said something he didn’t say. Ryan‘s numbers match up with ThinkProgress’ numbers. He simply said that President Obama has added more debt than any other single president before him – not the more expansive line that President Obama added more than all of them combined, which they are correct to call deceitful. However, President Obama did add more debt than every President from Washington up until Reagan combined, according to CNSNews.

Claim #11: Paul Ryan supports austerity, which has pushed European countries into second recessions.

Explanation: Unlike the United States, which has spent a large amount of money to try and offset the recession, European countries have embraced a more fiscally conservative route by trying to get their budgets to balance. This approach hasn’t gone well in some countries. Ryan is a fiscal conservative, therefore ThinkProgress concludes that he supports the same approach.

But is it true? Not remotely. To begin with, the word “austerity” appears nowhere in Ryan’s speech. Secondly, European austerity is loathed among American conservative economic thinkers for a very simple reason – it doesn’t actually cut spending. It just raises taxes:

In France, for example, the so-called austerity largely consisted of raising taxes. There was a 3 percent surtax on incomes above €500,000, an increase of one percentage point in the top marginal tax rate (from 40 to 41 percent), and an end to the automatic indexation of tax brackets for inheritance, wealth, and income taxes. There was also a 5 percent hike in the corporate income tax on businesses with revenue of more than €250 million, as well as a hike in the capital-gains tax, and closure of several corporate tax breaks. And even though most of these tax hikes were aimed at the wealthy, the middle class did not get off free. There was an increase in the Value Added Tax (VAT) and the excise taxes on tobacco and alcohol.

That’s an agenda that should gladden the heart of any tax-increase zealot — or even Paul Krugman.

There is a candidate in this election with that agenda, and it’s not Paul Ryan.

Claim #12: Paul Ryan claims to support protecting the weak, but his budget attacks them.

Explanation: Ryan said, “And the greatest of all responsibilities, is that of the strong to protect the weak.  The truest measure of any society is how it treats those who cannot defend or care for themselves.”

ThinkProgress responds to this by citing “religious leaders” who called Ryan’s budget an “immoral disaster” and claiming he wants to cut the government benefits that help the weak.

But is it true? ThinkProgress’ idea of quoting religious leaders is quoting a group that includes Jim Wallis – in other words, the religious Left doesn‘t like Ryan’s budget. They also quote one priest who‘s a constituent of Ryan’s (hardly a religious leader), and one single Catholic bishop. This is a far cry from the entire Vatican rising up in arms against Ryan’s budget plan. However, the idea that Ryan’s budget ideas rob the poor is unfalsifiable, since it doesn’t attack specific policies. Another ThinkProgress post (mercifully shorter) references Ryan‘s support for tax cuts as evidence that he doesn’t care about the weak. It’s probably news to John F. Kennedy that Catholics can’t support tax cuts in good conscience. Isn’t there a Deadly Sin like this someplace…?

Bonus: Even Fox News is attacking Ryan’s speech?

Explanation: Fox News published an article today describing Ryan’s speech as “deceitful.” The Left has jumped on it as evidence that Ryan’s gone too far even for the supposedly right-leaning Fox.

But is it true? Not at all. The author of the article is one of Fox News’ token liberal contributors. And it gets things wrong. It regurgitates three of the arguments covered here, as well as a thoroughly unfalsifiable semantic claim about President Obama’s “You Didn’t Build That” gaffe. Not to mention, every article published by a Fox News contributor does not represent the entire voice of the company.

 

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Comments (203)

1 2 3
  • Sunny10
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:30pm

    A promise is a promise! President Obama did not keep his promise to Jonesville after election; was his promise broken for political reasons?

    Report Post »  
    • Get off your butt and join the Marines
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:53pm

      @SUNNY – His promise was not broken. Can’t you comprehend what happened? What is in the article here or on other news sources? That Jonesville GM facility was slated to close its doors in late 2008 while Bush was president. Obama could not do a damn thing about it since he wasn’t officially president until January 20th, of 2009! By that time all of the workers were given their ‘pink-slips’ and roughly 90% of the workers were gone by December 2008, again, before Obama was inaugurated so he could not do anything about it! Just because about 10% of the original workforce stayed at the facility to complete previous, old contracts, and they stayed until roughly mid 2009, and Obama was president by this time, this does not mean that Obama could have halted the shutdown. By this time, the wheels had turned much too much in order to reverse the closing that was contracted in 2008.

      Report Post » Get off your butt and join the Marines  
    • termyt
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:06pm

      So when the US Government took over control of GM and Obama’s team hand picked the new CEO, they could not say “let’s keep Janesville open?” Even if Obama had allowed GM to shutter a different plant in its place, he would have at least kept a campaign promise.

      Then Senator Obama (let’s not pretend US Senators have no power or say, shall we?) was stumping for the auto bailout saying that it would save Janesville. It passed, Janesville closed anyways. I’m not saying Obama lied, just that he didn‘t understand the facts and didn’t really care at all about Janesville specifically. OK, that’s enough truth stretching from Obama. I am saying he lied.

      Report Post »  
    • jzs
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:13pm

      http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2012/aug/29/paul-ryan/did-barack-obama-break-promise-keep-gm-plant-open/

      Report Post » jzs  
    • West Coast Patriot
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:24pm

      Blazers, I bet that most on here will pass right on by this and not give it a second thought: “So is it true? Barely. Yes, Ryan has voted to spend a lot of money. Outside of Dr. Ron Paul, so has practically every member of Congress.”
      I know, Dr, Paul is out, pushed out by the establishment without giving any voters their due. If you people would only wake up. Now that Paul does not have a chance, you should start looking at what is really going on. The establishment has put in place rules that will not allow dissent in any manner. Now you may think that is OK, but really think about it for a minute. What if a grassroots candidate comes forth that you actually believe in? He will not have a chance, your vote for them will not count. Do you really like that scenario? The establishment now has the power to disenfranchise all voters in every state, which means that our vote means NOTHING. Fixed elections, Russia style politics.
      \The anger on the floor was about these rule changes, not about Ron Paul or his supporters. The ayes have it really did not have it, it was all scripted, here is the proof: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77W5OKStO5s&feature=youtu.be It was all scripted ahead of time, it did not matter that the nays had it. The nays came from more than Paul supporters. Now that you do not have to worry about Paul, start waking up!! Oh and my posts are now taking hours to post as The Blaze must have mine being looked at by a live person!

      Report Post » West Coast Patriot  
    • West Coast Patriot
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:35pm

      To be fair here, why don’t we look at a news article from Oct of 2008? http://www.manufacturing.net/news/2008/10/gm-closing-janesville-plant-in-december

      Let us put dues where they belong and quit playing the establishment game? The GOP is as dishonest as the Democrat Party. Our vote matters not anymore with the adoption of the new rules. “We the People” have no more say in our elections going forward. People are still not waking up and our country is becoming Europe, Russia and is heading toward being China!

      This post should be on here in a few hours since The Blaze is scrutinizing everything I say now. I am saving all my posts in Word.

      Report Post » West Coast Patriot  
    • Coyote1953
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:53pm

      Sunny10 is right! A promise is a promise.

      I agree that Obama couldn’t do anything to protect the plant from closure. The plant was closed because Unions crippled the auto industry and consumers refused to buy cars that were marked-up to pay union thugs.

      The point is, Obama made hundreds of promises that he knew he couldn’t fulfill – just to be elected.

      Obama’s philosophy has always been “lie to them enough and they will believe anything”

      Report Post » Coyote1953  
    • I_KNEW_Youd_Say_That
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:21pm

      I KNEW You’d Say That!

      You want the TRUTH? Can you handle the TRUTH?

      “We have Obama pegged. We know who he is. We know what his ideology is. We know what he’s doing to the nation. We know what he’s using the government to do. We know what he’s doing to the Constitution. We know all these things now.”

      “Now, I have this article in front of me from the Chicago Tribune where Romney calls Santorum an economic lightweight. Has Romney ever called Obama an economic lightweight? Obama, I just spent [time] at the beginning of the program how Obama is destroying our country. Destroying our institutions. Romney won’t even call him a socialist. This reminds me of McCane. McCane attacking conservatives all the time, but when it cam to Obama he held back. He pulled back. Something’s not right here.”

      Mark Levin 3/15

      Report Post » I_KNEW_Youd_Say_That  
    • IsThereADifference
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:37pm

      WestCoast

      You are a true patriot. I applaud your resolve in continuing to preach the truths of Liberty, and Freedom. I truthfully don’t see how you do it. After reading the majority of the posts here; I am ready to pull my hair out from the absolute ignorance of the writers. When I don’t see you around I try to pick up the slack, but sometimes I truthfully can’t handle it. By the time I get home from work I’m so mad the rest of my day is ruined. Thank you for all the hard work you put forth for EVERYONE here.

      I was a major Glenn B. fan from the beginning of his career at Fox (watched every episode) up until about 6 month after GBTV went live. The main reason I post here is because Glenn let me down in such a big way by toeing the progressive line. After all he was the main person who brought the “progressivism” (what? did I misspell that??? :) argument to the table. I never thought he would turn into the very cancer that is killing our freedoms and liberties. Before Glenn came along nobody spoke of progressivism, and now he is one.

      Thanks again WestCoast. Have a wonderful day sir.

      Report Post » IsThereADifference  
    • SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:46pm

      JZS

      I lost count of the number of times I have asked you to answer the following question so I will officially start at two, since you didn’t answer it yesterday.

      JZS – Request #2: Please answer the following question.

      How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?

      Report Post » SpeckChaser  
    • West Coast Patriot
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:52pm

      IsThereADifference, Thank you for the support, and to tell you, sometimes I want the ability to come through the screen and slap people, but of course I am not a wizard. One thing that helps me is I am a salesman, a good one. The power of the positive mind is incredible. “What your mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve.” Just keep positive, spread the word of liberty and continue to point out every Constitutional crime all government representatives do. That is all we can do and hope and pray that more will have that light bulb go off in their head.

      Report Post » West Coast Patriot  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:57pm

      SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:46pm

      JZS

      I lost count of the number of times I have asked you to answer the following question so I will officially start at two, since you didn’t answer it yesterday.

      JZS – Request #2: Please answer the following question.

      How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?
      ______________________
      How will giving Romney and the rest of the 1% additional tax breaks and tax loop holes to exploit bring the national debt under control? The debt exploded with the W. tax cuts, passed at a time the nation was paying for two wars.

      Report Post »  
    • Amarilloan
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:58pm

      In Obama’s speech naming the plant in question, he promised to retool it and keep it open. It has not been retooled and was finally closed several months into Obama’s term.

      Report Post »  
    • Get off your butt and join the Marines
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:01pm

      @TERMYT — All I know is what I’ve gathered from various people, a couple of Detroit newspapers, websites, etc, I don’t know any of the financial details of that facility like profits/losses; or supply/demand; etc. The CEO and/or the CFO might have thought the company would be more profitable if it was shut down and some manufacturing and administrative work was incorporated into another facility. There are a lot of other variables that likely went into the decision to close that facility that we don’t know about. And, come on, realistically how much ‘power’ does one senator have, especially given the extreme divisiveness of the past couple of Houses?

      Some would say that Obama lied. It is also possible that Obama thought that that facility could be saved and in this crappy economy, we will take any jobs possible to keep people working, but when it came time for ‘bottom-line’ decision making, maybe everything just didn’t line up properly? Also, with this crappy economy and unemployment, don’t you think that Obama would have really wanted that facility to remain open and producing?

      Report Post » Get off your butt and join the Marines  
    • West Coast Patriot
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:05pm

      SpeckChaser, “How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?” I agree with you on this, but if you want someone who will actually do something to grow the economy, without promising that government will create jobs, look here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=227YyBf7-KQ&feature=autoplay&list=PL3FDD94C206E59352&index=3&playnext=2
      Do NOT count on Romney, he is only telling you what the establishment tells him you want to hear.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDSUoIVMze8&feature=relmfu

      Report Post » West Coast Patriot  
    • Fide1is
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:43pm

      Sunny has it right. A promise is a promise. Mr o controlled the bankruptcy case and the GM bail out. He controlled the GM mangment. The bankruptcy kludge broke many years of precedent dare i say it robbi GM bond holders. And mr o could not keep a promise to one small GM plant?

      Typical, the little guy gets hurt but the dem ‘s crononies make out like bandits. Hey it’s the Chicago way.

      Report Post »  
    • paratroop
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 7:22pm

      @ Get off your butt – The date the plant closed is irrelevant. The fact that someone panders on people’s woes for political gain is the point. Obama’s words, not Ryan’s. The President needs to learn to write checks he can cash, oh wait, he’ll just borrow more and drive my kids and grand-kids into Grecian style servitude.

      Report Post » paratroop  
    • Xyskalla
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 7:43pm

      The Janesville plant laid off workers and stopped production on full-size SUVs in December 2008, but it did not close entirely. It kept about 100 workers and continued to produce medium-duty trucks until April 23, 2009 as reported by the Janesville Gazette http://gazettextra.com/news/2009/feb/19/gm-plant-last-day-finalized/ (Notice the date in the article–February 19, 2009, after this plant has supposedly been closed).

      The fact-checkers are either wrong or lying.

      Report Post »  
    • Redfor
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 7:57pm

      Why dont we just take Obama‘s speech and see what promises he didn’t follow through on.. fair is fair right? Obama flat out lied and believes.. or think he DESERVES to be re-elected.. Oh yeah.. forgot.. we reward people for failure now..

      Report Post »  
    • SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:03pm

      Encimon

      I’m confident you’re nothing more than a conservative trying to make liberals look foolish but will respond anyway. I noticed you didn’t answer the question. Why not?

      You’re missing an elementary level point. Despite what side you fall on in the debate of the positives/negatives of tax cuts there is at least a debate.

      Where is the debate over tax increases? Why aren’t liberals explaining “the benefits of tax increases are A. B. and C? Can you make a logical case for this? The lack of this case being made makes me think that even liberals know better.

      ENCIMON says, “How will giving Romney and the rest of the 1% additional tax breaks and tax loop holes to exploit bring the national debt under control?”

      Are you claiming it’s the citizen who should be held responsible for Government spending more that they make? What?

      So you’re saying, if husband A makes 50K a year and wife B spends 60K a year, Husband A is at fault for not supplying more money to wife B to spend? Do you know the definition of deficit? Hint, it has nothing to do with tax rates.

      You phrased your argument for letting small business owners keep more of what they earn as a negative. Mind explaining that? Where did you get the idea that government is entitled to every dollar small business owners can make it on without? While you’re at it…

      ENCIMON – Request #1: Please answer the following question.

      How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?

      Report Post » SpeckChaser  
    • Patriot Z
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:23pm

      get off your butt – Sunny is correct. Obama has made every single promise he could think of from eliminating poverty, to raising the dead. if he could do it or not is beside the point. the promise/implication WAS there. He made very promise he could think of, followed by feel good plattitudes and empty slogans. the media backed up fully and it was all done to hide his true agenda. Obama is not incompotent, nor is he a ‘politician’. he IS a far left narccisisstic ideolouge and always has been. everything in the past 4 yrs and his life can be used to back up my claim. He never wanted to save america but reform it according to his leftist beliefs about right and wrong. Heck he said so himself. even if not obama is not fit for office. Obama is not capapble of fixing the economy nor is he willing to take responsibillity for it or his own actions. Therefore WHY is he in office?

      Report Post » Patriot Z  
    • daxawyes
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:35pm

      If Obama couldn‘t have done anything he shouldn’t have promised that government would save that specific plant. Why is everyone turning it around on Ryan?
      The same with the deficit commission. Obama asked for that commission, NOT Ryan. Ryan cannot sign a bill into law. Obama was the supposed leader at the time and wasn’t willing to do anything. So what if Ryan walked away. The commission wasn‘t his idea and it wasn’t a good idea anyway now was it?

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 10:03pm

      @SpeckChaser

      A dishonest question from a Beckerhead, what a surprise. Closing corporate tax loop holes allow for fairness within the tax system, instead of placing more and more burden on the middle class. Your question is akin to why doesn‘t orange tree don’t produce apples. I am assume, you believe the lies about Reagan. We have 30 years of history to prove that Reagan’s voodoo economics fails to create jobs, it shifts wealth to the top. Even Reagan understood the need for a progressive tax system and raised taxes to help balance budgets.

      the proper question is why should the working and middle class be asked to subsidize Romney’s corporate jets and private yachts.

      Report Post »  
    • SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 10:21pm

      ENCIMON – Request #2: Please answer the following question.

      How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?

      Report Post » SpeckChaser  
    • sillyfreshness
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 10:51pm

      “Fact checking” doesn’t that sound like a Marxist term? When I hear ABC or NBC “fact check” it’s just a way for those Marxists to twist some fact around to make the right look like they are conservative. Anytime someone starts talking about “fact checking” I get my fists ready, because it’s probably a progressive commie liberal saying it. Fact check and “holding people accountable” are two commie sounding terms. I can picture Joseph Stalin or Mao saying “we will hold these people accountable” for not supporting communism. We need to make communism/Bolshevism a thing of the past once and for all.

      Report Post » sillyfreshness  
    • SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 10:54pm

      ENCIMON

      I didn’t pay attention to your post the first time I read it. I was only looking to see if you answered a simple question. You did not.

      It was not until the second time I read it that I grasped the extent of what you said. You said me questioning why you believe what you do, and I’m quoting, was “akin to why doesn‘t orange tree don’t produce apples.”

      Just so we are on the same page, assuming an “asking” and one less “don’t” was supposed to be in your post, raising taxes on small business owners is what you are currently proposing, right?

      I’m not asking you to defend something you don’t support. You say we should raise taxes on small businesses, correct? Just tell us how that will grow business. It is that simple.

      Asking one why they believe what they believe is “akin to why doesn‘t orange tree don’t produce apples?” I really don’t know what to say to that.

      I can think of no reason one would propose an idea and then say it’s a dishonest question to be asked why. That is unless they were posing as someone who they were not with the intention of making them look foolish.

      Report Post » SpeckChaser  
    • endthemindlessspending
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 1:58am

      GOYBAJTM

      Please take your lips off obama arse and go read the book, Throw Them All Out, rather than spending your life commenting here. It will fill you in on Obloma’s great stimulus spending going to all his donors and friends. Each Job Obama “SAVED” Cost tax payers thousands, and the only people who will see that money are the fat cats of UAW.Tired of watching you put the same Liberal talking point to each comment to cover for your great savior. All that stimulus was meant for was so obama could load up his donors. At times giving them 400% profit on their donations and bundling. The amount Obama spend on the bailout could have made every citizen in this country millionaires, But it went in a few of his buddies pockets.

      That’s not to mention his other friends, pastor and his goal to make us a third world country. Read the book “Roots of Obama’s Rage”, you will learn a lot about this destroyer and Chief.

      Report Post »  
    • endthemindlessspending
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 2:04am

      ENCINDOPE,

      You really want to talk about hand outs to the wealthy? Where the heck do you think pretty much all of the over $800 billion dollar stimulus went? Into the hands of the tax payers? Not a chance, that lined the pocket of every corporation, bundler and donor to Obama’s campaign. He gave over $500 billion to Solyndra got their donations to his campaign, then they went bankrupt a short time after and paid non of it back. In June 78% of chevy’s sales in cars came from the government alone. So he bailed them out and not is their top customer. Thats equates for all lost tax payers dollars. This is just 2 of the hundreds of Crony deals that were made for green energy and stimulus. Next time do some homework before you look like dullard again.

      Report Post »  
    • bigdaddyt46
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 6:41am

      LOL you kill me. you were proven wrong by me and a few other posters. so you quickly changed it from it did close under Bush, to it was slanted to close under Bush. you then go on to state that it closed down in mid 2009. plenty of time for owebama to keep his campaign promise of “making sure this plant is around for another hundred years.” his words not mine.

      The Milwaukee-Wisconsin Journal Sentinel describes the plant as having completely shut down in 2009. The decision to close it was made in 2008, but the plant itself didn’t shutter until the next year, by which time the GM bailout had already passed. MRCTV’s Stephen Gutowski pinpoints its moment of failure at April 23, 2009.

      on the other thread you said i refused to acknowledge that the plant was closed in October 2008. you’re right i did refuse to acknowledge that, because i don’t acknowlege lies.
      you proved to me beyond a shadow of a doubt you have no clue what you are talking about. i would continue to debate you, but i am against having a battle of wits with unarmed people.

      Report Post » bigdaddyt46  
    • Apple Bite
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 7:18am

      http://gazettextra.com/news/2009/feb/19/gm-plant-last-day-finalized/

      That plant was slated to close by GM on Executive decision, not because of Bush, but because they could no longer continue paying the workers there. This lays at the feet of Unions, not Bush or Obama. Not to mention, Isuzu didn’t sell very well in the U.S. The rest of the blame goes to GM for poor management decisions and mishandling too many makes at one time. Remember, they let go of SAAB and Pontiac as well. And rumors during that time mentioned Buick as a lost marquee in GM’s downsizing..

      Report Post » Apple Bite  
    • keep456ty
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 12:12pm

      Enicnom, unscrambled:

      Meconin
      Mec”o*nin\, n. [Cf. F. m['e]conine.] (Chem.) A substance regarded as an anhydride of meconinic acid, existing in opium and extracted as a white crystalline substance. Also erroneously called meconina, meconia, etc., as though it were an alkaloid.

      Report Post »  
    • Drifterbill
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 1:47pm

      Ahhh …… Mr. Marine you miss the point. National Review’s Henry Payne wrote.. Under Obamanomics, the government picks winners and losers. Obama promised Janesville would be a winner even as his economic policies guaranteed it would always be a loser. Indeed, Obama’s whole 2008 Janesville speech is a sobering road map for the job-killing policies he has put in place as president.. What you don’t trust Mr Payne.. How about Obama’s own words “I know that General Motors received some bad news yesterday, and I know how hard your Governor has fought to keep jobs in this plant. But I also know how much progress you’ve made – how many hybrids and fuel-efficient vehicles you’re churning out. And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, it’s where it will thrive. I want it to thrive right here in the United States of America; right here in Wisconsin; and that’s the future I’ll fight for as your President. SO!!! If a presidential candidate comes to your plant and tells you the execution of his policies will keep it open for another hundred years that’s a promise or a guarantee or whatever you want.

      Report Post »  
    • jzs
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 4:30pm

      Speckchaser, encinom is right of course.

      Now for probably the tenth time I’ll ask you: why would you vote for a guy who is promising to double down on the exact economic policies Bush followed? What is it about economic collapse and huge deficits that appeals to you?

      Report Post » jzs  
    • SpeckChaser
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 5:21pm

      JZS – Request #3: Please answer the following question. The time is now. Divert no longer.

      How will raising taxes on businesses grow the economy?

      Report Post » SpeckChaser  
  • Paul Revere
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:29pm

    Man we have made a grave mistake

    Report Post »  
  • Just_Us2
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:29pm

    The strategy is to dispute every assertion and call it a lie then hope something sticks, if it doesn’t stick at least people will be talking about a speech and not the economy. Let‘s suppose the left’s premise is right and it is all a lie. Obama has no problem getting up in front of people and lying his ars off….so why do his followers have a problem if someone else does it? It comes down to a horrible economy brought to you by Obama. He didn’t fix it, find someone who can, Romney or a sock puppet, I don’t care, I am all about firing the current guy. Politicians and diapers should be changed often and for the same reason.

    Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:35pm

      paul ryan was in congress voting to create this bad economy. I can’t help but notice how hypocritical republicans are when it comes to running on records. The sheeple who are falling for this crap we’re being fed are extremely gullible(to be nice) or extremely ignorant(to be honest).

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:02pm

      Romney/Ryan plan is the lie through their teeth and hope the sheep don’t listen to the fact checkers.

      Report Post »  
    • Belwraith
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:09pm

      Here! Here!

      Report Post »  
    • DarkJello
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 8:07pm

      The facts are on Romney’s side, and thus team Owebama must lie 24/7.

      Will America be better off with R&R? It is sure tough to imagine them doing worse…

      Report Post » DarkJello  
    • mtncrusr
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 8:11pm

      Well it’s just not fair to BHO if the other side lies too. How will the people believe BHO’s lies if he has to spend time accusing the other sides truth as being lies.

      Report Post »  
    • k2weaver
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 12:51am

      @jadams1214 it is far easier to believe propaganda if you don’t care to know the difference. ask any Russian.

      Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 8:02am

      @K2WEAVER Only a republican schill would call a voting record propaganda. The record is the record no matter how much you try to hide it.

      Report Post »  
  • love1another
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:23pm

    One thing I hope and pray for is that we get a change from this administration. Their actions in forcing through Obamacare and other legislation while holding both chambers of Congress leave me thoroughly distrustful of the current administration. I hope and pray for a new administration that will be honest and will truly work for the good of the American people. I hope and pray. They need our prayers.

    Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:39pm

      Don’t forget Romney worked WITH A DEMOCRATIC CONGRESS in mass. to force ROMNEYCARE down the throats of mass. residents. What makes you think he wouldn’t do the same to the citizens of America.

      Report Post »  
    • pdw
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 2:54am

      You are right about government insurance but we all know that Obama-care is not the same, over 2,000 pages calls that “fact” a lie. Romney at least knows how to run businesses, just maybe he will not start throwing our tax dollars out to his supporter? Nothing can be as bad as this bunch of ???? what ever. At we least we know if they try to get away with the same crap they will be run out of office. As they have already said if he was white they would be storming the White House. I like what Truman once said, that if they come out of office richer than they went in they are corrupt.

      Report Post »  
  • Canada_Goose
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:18pm

    It’s not just the left wing blogs and publications panning mr. Ryans dishonesty, this from Foxnews.com

    Paul Ryan’s speech in 3 words….Dazzling, Deceiving, & Distracting

    “….to anyone paying the slightest bit of attention to facts, Ryan’s speech was an apparent attempt to set the world record for the greatest number of blatant lies and misrepresentations slipped into a single political speech. On this measure, while it was Romney who ran the Olympics, Ryan earned the gold.

    http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

    Report Post » Canada_Goose  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:30pm

      the Blaze is working over time to lie to cover for Romney/Ryan’s campaign of dishonesty.

      Report Post »  
    • Just_Us2
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:35pm

      So what you are saying is Fox News is Fair and Balanced, right? The piece was written by a Lefty, so nice try. Sally Kohn is a community organizer turned political commentator. Currently, Sally is a Fox News Contributor, having previously appeared on CNN and MSNBC. A contributing writer to the American Prospect, Sally’s op-eds and essays have appeared in the Washington Post, USA Today, Time Magazine, US News and World Report, Politico, Reuters and the Guardian among other outlets. Sally also works as a grassroots strategist, actively engaged in movement building for equality and justice.

      Report Post »  
    • cbrown
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:09pm

      Congressman Paul Ryan lied and there no ifs and buts about it. It is a real stretch when you start to question the factcheckers.

      Report Post » cbrown  
    • Claytontemplar
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:29pm

      Why don’t you two get a room? Padded would be best

      Report Post »  
    • inxy
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:02pm

      The opinion on FOX was written by Sally Kohn who very left leaning. She along with Juan Williams are FOX’s token liberals. Try reading the rest of the opinions on FOX.

      Report Post »  
    • BR333
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:36pm

      Hmmm I guess this means you did not accept the articals explanation of the speech. My guess is that it did not matter what he said we would have gotten the exact same comments.

      Report Post »  
    • Contrarian51
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:10pm

      Sally Kohn makes Juan Williams look like Barry Goldwater. It didn’t matter who the Republican nominees were, she was destined to call them liars. It’s all she knows. Fox News has several liberal commentators and contributors, not just Kohn and Williams. They have free rein to voice their opinions. It doesn’t mean that anything they say is true. These people still claim the stimulus worked, for crying out loud.

      To the idiot who questioned the questioning of fact checkers: Are you kidding? The Washington Post fact checkers have been caught numerous times fact checking opinions, and guess what? If they disagree with the opinion, it gets a “pants on fire” or other negative rating, even though there’s not a single fact to check. My God, of course you fact check and question the fact checkers. Anything else is completely irresponsible.

      Report Post »  
  • sy212
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:15pm

    The back and forth is rediculous. Simply put. Do you want to trust a failed president that has increased spending in almost all forms of government including entitlements, or do you want to take a chance on a businessman, who has the Midas touch with all things economic and knows how to organize a business into something successful and profitable? Pick one.

    Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:35pm

      Being a good business man where his own money is on the line did not make him a great governor of Mass. where the taxpayers money was being used. Check the facts.

      Report Post »  
    • louie louie
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:09pm

      Romney balanced the budget in MA and ended his term in office with a surplus. That’s a great accomplishment considering that he was surrounded by Democrats who love to spend OPM.

      Report Post »  
    • louie louie
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 9:27pm

      Can anyone name a president who balanced the budget when surrounded by Democrats in the House and Senate? Pres. Clinton did sign a balanced budget but not until he was surrounded by Newt and a Republican Congress.

      Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 7:59am

      @LOUIE LOUIE He balanced the budget by increasing spending alot and increasing taxes even more than spending. That may impress you but it doesn’t impress me.

      Report Post »  
  • progressiveslayer
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:13pm

    Quibbling over every word,he said this no he said that,we can thank our one party system for our current situation.Yes yes I know you think we have two parties that’s just to make you feel like you have a choice in choosing a candidate. The R‘s and D’s are spending us into oblivion and nobody’s talking about eliminating whole departments,they’re talking about a balanced budget years from now,anybody think we have years before this charade is exposed and the house of cards collapses?

    Our total debt is 200 + trillion dollars,we are not getting out of this and all the hogs in DC know it,they’re just buying time,delaying the inevitable.

    Report Post » progressiveslayer  
  • Diane TX
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:13pm

    Here is what Obama said on the campaign trail. You can decide for yourself if Ryan was “lying”.

    On February 13, 2008, Democratic Presidential Candidate Barack Obama stated, “This can be America’s future. I know that General Motors received some bad news yesterday, and I know how hard your Governor has fought to keep jobs in this plant. But I also know how much progress you’ve made – how many hybrids and fuel-efficient vehicles you’re churning out. And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, it’s where it will thrive. I want it to thrive right here in the United States of America; right here in Wisconsin; and that’s the future I’ll fight for as your President.”

    Report Post »  
    • Get off your butt and join the Marines
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:01pm

      @ DIANETX — What is so hard to understand about this GM facility? Closing a plant that size takes a little more than packing up a lemonaide stand and renting a U-Haul! The Jonesville GM facility was closed for all intensive purposes in October 2008. Obama was not inaugurated until January 20th, 2009, so obviously Obama could not officially do anything until at least January 20th, 2009, and by that time, most of the GM’s facility “lemonaide stand” was already contracted to close and all packed up. Just because a skeleton crew remained working there until 2009 means absolutely nothing regarding when the plant “officially closed”.

      Report Post » Get off your butt and join the Marines  
    • termyt
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:14pm

      Then he should have been smart enough not to say that if the bailout passes then Janesville would stay open “for another 100 years.” He was there, he said it, he knew Janesville was on GM’s shutdown list as it tried to avoid the bankruptcy without a taxpayer bailout. Instead, GM got the bailout, the American people put up 50 billion, half of which we will never get back, GM went bankrupt anyways and Janesville closed anyways.

      Best case, this is a “don‘t make promises you can’t keep” example. Worst case, it is political pandering when you have no intention of helping people once they have voted for you. Obama told Janesville folks to vote for him so they could keep their factory and then left them high and dry. And the factory is still there, people. It could have been easily reopened once Obama seized control of GM.

      Report Post »  
    • endthemindlessspending
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 1:44am

      GOYBAJTM

      Please take your lips off obama arse and go read the book, Throw Them All Out, rather than spending your life commenting here. It will fill you in on Obloma’s great stimulus spending going to all his donors and friends. Each Job Obama “SAVED” Cost tax payers thousands, and the only people who will see that money are the fat cats of UAW.Tired of watching you put the same Liberal talking point to each comment to cover for your great savior. All that stimulus was meant for was so obama could load up his donors. At times giving them 400% profit on their donations and bundling. The amount Obama spend on the bailout could have made every citizen in this country millionaires, But it went in a few of his buddies pockets.

      That’s not to mention his other friends, pastor and his goal to make us a third world country. Read the book “Roots of Obama’s Rage”, you will learn a lot about this destroyer and Chief.

      Report Post »  
  • MALICIOUSDISORDER
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:07pm

    Chris Matthews looked and sounded sauced…That black eye from the Washington Post is just crazy hate.What’s his name again Ed Rollins ?

    Report Post » MALICIOUSDISORDER  
  • TLS
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:04pm

    You have a choice ! I pick the real America

    Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:24pm

      What is “Real America.”

      The choice is between the Romney/Ryan plan to lie in to office and once in office to give hand outs to the wealthy, while destroying the safety nets for the elderly, the poor, the students, the workers and middle class.

      Or vote for a team that is attempting reverse the damage of 8 years of a dry drunk running the economy into the ground, while dealing with a Congress that is more concerned with party politics than doing their jobs.

      Report Post »  
    • barber2
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:48pm

      ENCIN: cut the “ safety net ” baloney about the elderly. Obama and the Democrats are doing the Big Lie again: by raiding the coffers of Welfare recipients today, they have taken away that so-called safety net in order to pander to the youth vote. The elderly will be in free fall. With NO doctors willing to take them at the reduced rates that the Democrat’s Welfare Raid will bring about. The Left has declared War on the Elderly . What is even worse is that they lie about what they are doing by accusing the Republicans of doing exactly what the Democrats are actually doing. So typically sleazy and Alinsky. These lying, deceiving Democrat Character Assassination Squad tactics must be called out. Easy to see why the Chinese and the Iranian rulers love the Obama Democrats who share their desire to punish the majority of the American people . Nobama 2012 NO DEMOCRATS 2012

      Report Post »  
    • Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:52pm

      Oh good Lord, even you don’t believe that drivel. Who’s paying you to type that junk?

      Report Post » Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve  
    • amtsoundsmith
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:02pm

      To ENCINOM- Do you blame Bush for all of your failures in life? You obviously don’t get enough attention. Is that why you visit the Blaze everyday and leave comments hoping people will lash out at you. Who in there right mind, has enough time to visit a website that they obviously disdain, multiple times a day, and leave comments. Then again, maybe your just a flunky for the left and they pay you to come on here and leave comments. In any case, it’s pretty pathetic.

      Report Post » amtsoundsmith  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:01pm

      Sorry Barber, it has been Ryan caught telling the big lie, how his budget cut 700 billion from medicare to fund tax cuts. Ryan has no understanding of what the truth actually is.

      Report Post »  
    • endthemindlessspending
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 1:57am

      ENCINDOPE,

      You really want to talk about hand outs to the wealthy? Where the heck do you think pretty much all of the over $800 billion dollar stimulus went? Into the hands of the tax payers? Not a chance, that lined the pocket of every corporation, bundler and donor to Obama’s campaign. He gave over $500 billion to Solyndra got their donations to his campaign, then they went bankrupt a short time after and paid non of it back. In June 78% of chevy’s sales in cars came from the government alone. So he bailed them out and not is their top customer. Thats equates for all lost tax payers dollars. This is just 2 of the hundreds of Crony deals that were made for green energy and stimulus. Next time do some homework before you look like dullard again.

      Report Post »  
  • Canada_Goose
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:04pm

    Mr. Holt doesn’t actually debunk any of the lies Mr. Ryan uttered in his speech, he is just trying to explain them away – in effect carrying water for Mr. Ryan. You’d expect a bit more intellectual honesty from a reporter even at the Blaze.

    For example, the plant Wisconsin auto plant cloning was announced in 2008 this is not in dispute by anyone, this is when the workers were given notice. It doesn’t really matter when the doors actually closed, this is moot, it takes time to wind down a huge auto plant. Another example is Mr. Ryan voting to add trillions to the deficit. When the government is already running, or is projected to be in a deficit, as it was very early in Mr. Bush’s term, any new spending like for wars or a prescription drug benefit automatically adds to the deficit it’s just common sense.

    For what it was, a series of dishonest jabs at Mr. Obama, it was a very good speech, just devoid of any substance or truth.

    Report Post » Canada_Goose  
    • thibx
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:12pm

      how dumb can you be

      Report Post »  
    • Plainview
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:32pm

      Where’s your head at. The GM Plant was closed after president Obama was in office. Obama was sworn into office of the president on Jan 20, 2009. The GM plant in question was closed in April 2009. This gave Obama plenty of time to take action to save the plant. Three months!

      Report Post »  
    • amtsoundsmith
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:32pm

      When will we receive intellectual honesty from so called journalists when reporting on obama? The deceit and pollyannish reporting on obama is deafening on the left.Obama has been a failure of a president and yet if you listen to the major networks you’d think he walks on water.

      Report Post » amtsoundsmith  
    • HI_Don
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:38pm

      talk about carrying water for someone…“Talk to me Goose”.

      If a candidate stands inside a factory that is scheduled to close and says vote for me and my policies will save this plant and keep it open – and then he does nothing of the sort and the factory closes its doors permanently while the GM cronies roll in government cash, well gee, I think I can fully stand with Ryan on this one. He spoke the truth and in typical style Obama and his supporters want it both ways. Free them from blame and give them all the credit. Well sorry Goose – Gander logic applies and Ryan is not being dishonest and certainly not “stretching the truth” any more than his dishonest opponent does to try to say he is.

      Report Post »  
    • Canada_Goose
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:00pm

      Dudes, you should really get your facts straight. First of all ho can Mr. Obama have kept the plant open if the decision was made to close it in June 2008, seven months before his inauguration. dly Mr. Obama never actually promised to keep the plant open in the first place he made a statement of belief that with government assistance the plant could be kept open.

      From an article in the Detroit News…

      Republican vice presidential candidate Paul Ryan inaccurately said Thursday that President Barack Obama “broke his promise” by failing to keep a General Motors plant open that closed in 2008 — before the Democrat took office.

      Ryan, the House Budget committee chairman, recounted the decision by GM to shutter the Janesville Assembly plant in his hometown in June 2008. The last SUV rolled off the line in December 2008.

      “I remember President Obama visiting it when he was first running, saying he’ll keep that plant open,” Ryan said at a campaign stop in Ohio Thursday, recounting the fact that his high school friends worked at the GM assembly plant. “One more broken promise. We used to build Tahoes and Suburbans. One of the reasons that plant got shut down was $4 gasoline. You see, this costs jobs. The president’s terrible energy policies are costing us jobs.”

      In fact, Obama made no such promise and the plant halted production in December 2008, when President George W. Bush was in office. [Detroit News, 8/16/12]

      Report Post » Canada_Goose  
    • Claytontemplar
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:28pm

      @THIBX
      He’s a communist who believes in their fairy tales. He’s dumb enough.

      Report Post »  
    • finky555
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:54pm

      @Thibx

      Sad to say that here in Canada there are geese that are too stupid to fly south. The attacks on Ryan were expected and are turning out really weak. Libs have nothing to stand on except personal attack here or there.

      Report Post » finky555  
    • Canada_Goose
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 9:38am

      When you cannot refute the facts and how Mr. Ryan seemed to completely disregard reality in his speech your only recourse is ad hominem attacks on those pointing out the obvious, and by then you’ve lost the argument.

      Report Post » Canada_Goose  
  • Christian_33
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:37pm

    So Fox News is the “left” now? Outright lies. And you are supporting them. Unreal.
    This is the best you can do to defend his lies?
    Pathetic. Where are the real conservatives?

    Report Post »  
    • thibx
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:08pm

      it was probably zuan williams

      Report Post »  
    • barber2
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:51pm

      The Left is out to destroy conservative Murdoch and all of his conservative media outlets. Expect the usual Alinsky, Lefty Dirty Tricks of their trade. The Left won’t be happy until they have COMPLETELY “ Goebbeled ” the media propaganda .

      Report Post »  
  • WithOutGodWePerishAsARepublic
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:35pm

    Can’t wait for the VP debate !!! Ryan is going to crush Biden…that is if Biden shows up…of if for some reason the VP debates is cancelled ..you never know with these “ impostors of freedom and patriotism”..??!! You very well know that BO is very very worried…no not worried..petrified at the thought…!!! He said he did not listen to Ryan’s speech…that is as believable as me saying that China will have free elections next year …LOL !

    Report Post »  
  • paperpushermj
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:33pm

    ThinkProgress cites a study by the CBO saying that the stimulus “created or saved” 3.3 million jobs.
    ____________________________________________________.
    “Saved Jobs” is as bogus a term as there is. It is impossible to flesh out the term “Saved Jobs” and anyone one caught using it ….should be called out on it.

    Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • bumfuzeled
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:52pm

      Your correct. I can say I saved 4.4 million jobs…..prove me wrong

      Report Post » bumfuzeled  
    • TheBurningTruth
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:52pm

      It also assumes that there would be NO (absolutely ZERO) jobs created had the Spendulus never happened which is absurd. Just another case of taking credit where it isn’t due.

      Report Post » TheBurningTruth  
  • Locked
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:28pm

    … why does it seem like every answer was some variation of saying “Well, it’s true, but…”

    For example:
    “Yes, it has a mandate, but that mandate is a lot less expansive. In other words, Romneycare comes to less than two thousand pages, with very few rules, one mandate, no taxes, some fees and some fines. What about Massachusetts? ”

    The author just came out and said “Ok, so it’s pretty much the same, but it has fewer pages!… you know, as someone might expect a single state’s plan might have less than a plan that affects 49 others as well?”

    If this article was supposed to reassure me, it didn’t.
    1. “Yes, Ryan has voted to spend a lot of money.”
    2. “plants have almost certainly closed while President Obama has been in office. Ryan just happened to pick one he had a personal connection to as a symbol.”
    3. “The CBO estimated that the stimulus could have saved up to 3.3 million jobs. ”
    4. ” Ryan was speaking against the Obama stimulus specifically in his speech. He didn’t rail against the concept of stimulus spending, period.”
    6. “$109 billion over ten years is a comparatively small number”
    7. “It’s true that Ryan’s budgets in 2011 and 2012 preserved Obamacare’s cuts to Medicare.”
    8. “The ThinkProgress study isn’t talking about current seniors, but about people who will be seniors in 2023.” … so we will be paying more?
    9. “In short, no, this isn‘t ALL the Republicans’ fault.”

    Good Lord, with “defenders” like thes

    Report Post »  
    • pondfrog
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:38pm

      Here is a great unbiased article about ACA (price control based) and Ryancare (price sharing) breakdown. It’s worth a read:

      http://www.intellectualtakeout.org/blog/impact-obamacare-and-ryancare-medicare

      Report Post » pondfrog  
    • StanO360
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:44pm

      He messed up on the spending issue, a cut in taxes does not equal spending in any fashion.

      Report Post »  
    • Clive
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:51pm

      right, the whole article could be summed up with “yeah, he lied, probably not as much as people say he lied, the end”. like i said, i don’t expect any politician to tell the truth anyway.

      they all lie so much, its a form of language to them. obama and biden will do the same thing next week. obama has a way of connecting with people, so his lies are more effective.

      Report Post »  
    • Locked
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:01pm

      Should have ended with “With defenders like these… who needs the Democrats?”

      I don’t mind Ryan overall; I honestly find him more palatable than Romney, and at least he’s focusing on fiscal issues (even if his record doesn’t match his words) while Romney and much of the GOP is trying to play Obama’s game and make the election about social issues. But if this article says anything, it‘s that he doesn’t have credibility even among his defenders.

      As said: if this was supposed to reassure me of the GOP’s candidate choices, it isn’t working.

      Report Post »  
    • Get off your butt and join the Marines
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:42pm

      @STAN (theman) — “He messed up on the spending issue, a cut in taxes does not equal spending in any fashion.”

      No, he didn’t mess up. You have obviously never reconciled a companies income (incoming $) versus spending (outgoing $); or even more simply, you must have a hard time reconciling your checking account!

      A cut in taxes DOES EQUAL SPENDING, unless the exact same amount of the tax cut somehow replaces the difference. Easy Peasy – If you cut taxes, you have less revenue in the coffer; if you spend $ on something, you have less revenue in the coffer. The bottom line is EXACTLY THE SAME, the only difference is in how you got there.

      Report Post » Get off your butt and join the Marines  
    • Veteran13
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 6:23pm

      Your logic is incredible. If someone votes on a 2 trillion dollar budget for the year – then your argument is that he voted for $2 trillion dollars – that would actually be a balanced budget. Obviously no one expects the government to go to zero. There is a difference of increasing the budget and voting for a balanced budget. Obviously Ryan supports the military, paying the for many services that everyone agrees with – the point is we have to stop spending on stuff where we don’t have the money.

      Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 7:48pm

      @VETERAN13 Your logic is incredible. You seem to think we should only spend money on things that you and your republican cronies think we can AFFORD, i think we should only spend money on things that the constitution says the government can.

      Report Post »  
    • Locked
      Posted on August 31, 2012 at 9:23am

      @Veteran
      “Your logic is incredible. If someone votes on a 2 trillion dollar budget for the year – then your argument is that he voted for $2 trillion dollars – that would actually be a balanced budget.”

      Try reading again, sir. He wasn’t voting for “balanced budgets.” As with all the points, the author essentially says “Well, he did vote to increase the deficit. But so did Obama!”

      “Ryan’s proposed budget shrinks that number to $40 trillion, or $4 trillion/year.”

      Report Post »  
  • RiverRat37
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:19pm

    Seems to me that the Factcheckers of the Factcheckers said, many times (and to their credit) “…that’s true…” and then went on to try and make the case that is wasn’t “technically” true. Good for you for the honesty. A lot of the complaints about Ryan’s speech WERE TRUE.

    I was esp. bothered by the comments on the Janesville GM plant closing charge. There was little to show the original Fact Check to be incorrect. You admit that the plant was set for closing during the administration PREVIOUS to the Obama admin. You point ou it ‘actually closed’ twice. Once for the SUV line in Dec 2008 and again in April of 2009 for the truck line.
    It would be ludicrous to think that 1) Obama policies/actions would be in place by April 23rd. For pities sake, he was still getting his cabinet together and fighting blocks by Republicans to his appointments. No president can make much headway at all in the first 6 months of an administration — ever! If Romney is elected, you’ll see. 2) When a big corp. like GM decides to close a plant, it takes many months to enact it. It’s not a simple process — not even close. The decision was made and fully in process BEFORE Obama took office. Period. It’s OK that you try to slip, squeeze and sneak past something that hurts (like the plant closing) but you did a lousy job of convincing me (and millions of others) that this secondary Fact Check made any sense. You seem like a little kid yelling “he started it.” It closed on

    Report Post »  
    • sWampy
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:28pm

      One thing you could bet your kids lives on is if a liberal says it, 100% of the time it’s a lie. Bottom line, he ran on the plant won’t close, it did.

      Report Post »  
    • EqualJustice
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:29pm

      The plant was NOT closed yet and Obama promised to SAVE it and others like it along with the JOBS. He gave those people false hope. He did not keep that promise. He wasted our hard earned tax dollars and now they have even stopped production of the VOLT, due to lack of interest and battery fire problems. Most of the money was totally wasted. Why could that plant not have been SAVED? We gave Obama enough money to do that? HE was picking and choosing the winners? Trial and error economics is NOT working. PERIOD. Obama lied and broke his promises. PERIOD. Knit picking facts to advance the narrative is NOT fact checking. Seems like they are DESPERATE to make Ryan look like a liar here. Proves he is a threat to them and they are very worried.

      Report Post » EqualJustice  
    • Escapee1
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:33pm

      Riverrat37, the Blamer-In-Chief said that the plant WOULD NOT close if GM had the Federal Government support…GM got support and they STILL closed the plant….Did you miss that part of the story….

      Report Post »  
    • Coralchristie
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:36pm

      You neglected to acknowledge that CANDIDATE Obama said, “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.’
      Certainly he could have done what he has done many times in the past 3 1/2 years and stopped the plants from closing through executive order. He didn’t have a lot of time but with the above quote…he could have done what he implied he’d do.

      Report Post »  
    • woodyb
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:39pm

      If what you say about te GM plant is true, what was Obama doing making such ludicrous statements about it being around for 100 years?????????

      Report Post »  
    • pondfrog
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:46pm

      This is a reply to your ‘response’ to another that, for some reason, I cannot reply to.

      GM plants are always on a stand by status..they could open the plant now if they wanted to. To Ryan credit he was not lying knowing it‘s ’standby’ status. To lib‘s credit it’s not up to Obama to reopen or keep open. It’s up to GM.

      Report Post » pondfrog  
    • paperpushermj
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:48pm

      Can we at least agree that there is a difference between saying this plant is to closed IF, and years later the doors being locked,power cut, gates too the plant closed forever and locked.
      It seems those of us the lateral thinkers amongst us think the term Closed means when the plant is “Closed”
      To some a target is shot when the trigger is pulled others say it’s when the target is actually struck.

      Report Post » paperpushermj  
    • MikaelScot
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:02pm

      Ryan said.
      Especially in Janesville where we were about to lose a major factory. A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that G.M. plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said, “I believe that if our government is there to support you, this plant will be here for another 100 years.”

      He DIDN‘T say it was Obama’s fault the plant was closing, nor when or why. It’s irrelevent if it was slated to close in 2008, 2009, or 1990. What he IS holding Obama accountable for is his promises that he made standing at that very factory. Here’s what Obama said “This can be America’s future. I know that General Motors received some bad news yesterday, and I know how hard your Governor has fought to keep jobs in this plant. But I also know how much progress you’ve made – how many hybrids and fuel-efficient vehicles you’re churning out. And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, it’s where it will thrive. I want it to thrive right here in the United States of America; right here in Wisconsin; and that’s the future I’ll fight for as your President.”

      So, which is this lie that’s bothering you?

      Report Post »  
    • pudssweetie
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:58pm

      @Pondfrog, actually the GM plant in Janesville could be open yes, but the Janesville plant is also specifically set up to build Trucks and SUV’s. To change the Janesville plant to build something else would cost a lot of money and would take a lot of time to make the changes, which GM does not have. Unless our economy gets better and our gas prices come way down and the demand for Trucks and SUV’s increase, I just don’t see the Janesville plant re-opening.

      Report Post »  
    • Plainview
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 4:13pm

      “It would be ludicrous to think that 1) Obama policies/actions would be in place by April 23rd. For pities sake, he was still getting his cabinet together and fighting blocks by Republicans to his appointments.”
      That statement by you is moronic and an outright lie! Talk about facts checks, you sure as hell need them. First, the Democrats took over the House of Representative and the senate with a super majority in 2009 with a Democrat President. The Minority Republicans in both chambers had no, zero power, to stop the democrats in making appointments or any other business in the congress. The democrat senate had 60 Senators, filibuster proof, and the house of reps a super majority. In 2010 the democrats house of reps had a super majority and the democrat controlled senate had 59.senator. The question I have is why do people like you think that you can distort the facts, with out right lies and get away with it.In this day and age, it is stupid on your part to try it. As for the GM plant closing in w
      i., it was closed in April 2009, three months after Obama took office. It doesn’t matter if a projection was made in 2008. Obama could have taken action to keep it open between his taken office in Jan. and the time it closed in April. The plant closed under Obama’s watch and he failed to keep his promise to keep it from closing. It’s as simple as that!

      Report Post »  
  • Caballosinnombre
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:12pm

    The claims made will only appeal to the moronic Obamarxist minions who are too lazy to research the facts for themselves. Obummer is counting on these types with the help of the media to get him reelected.

    Report Post »  
    • RiverRat37
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:29pm

      I take great exception to your name calling and put downs. I did go out and research the GM Plant closing claim (as have many others). It seems abundantly clear that the original Fact Check was correct in spirit and basic fact. The plant was fingered by GM to close in 2008. The SUV line did close in Dec 2008. It’s a mere technicality that the truck line ran until April 2009. It takes a long time to shutter a plant — it’s not easy and it is time consuming and they need to use up parts and fill existing orders. Fact remains it was set for closing in 2008 and a good part of it did. The die was cast then and it was but a few months before it fully operationally ended. It wasn‘t on Obama’s watch as Ryan implied. He was dead wrong and used up some political capital trying to “make it work”. He tried to slip past on a minor technical point and that was dumb. His bad. Now we’re paying for it. He shouldn’t have done it.

      Report Post »  
    • StanO360
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:47pm

      Rat, you’ve missed the point, Obama said he‘d save it and he didn’t. Obama shouldn’t have said that of course, people should have seen that as arrogant, grandstanding, and unconstitutional.

      Report Post »  
    • jadams1214
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 8:13pm

      @STANO360 Putting Paul Ryan or Obama in the same sentence as constitutional is complete hypocricy.

      Report Post »  
  • pondfrog
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:12pm

    I have been on huffpo debunking these claims since this morning because I actually did the google work!! Lib’s are up in arms thinking they have slam dunked the election due to lies lies and more lies. I have to say, I’m exhausted from trying to bring truth to light. At first I thought how damaging this is..but now I‘m thinking maybe it’s a good thing because it will cause people to do their own google work to see the truth or at the very least cause an in depth discussion? ha!

    Report Post » pondfrog  
    • sWampy
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:21pm

      They don’t give a damn, to them you show them that the “tax” cuts increased revenue to the government, either they explode in rage, or their eyes glass over, their mouths open, you get a dull smile and drool rolls out the corners of their mouths, liberals are incapable of higher levels of thinking than your average 3rd grader.

       
  • Clive
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:08pm

    So, a career politician lied a bunch, thats super shocking? who cares. the speech was alright. condi’s was probably better.

    I like this line from the article “True, Ryan has voted to spend a lot of money. Outside of Dr. Ron Paul, so has practically every member of Congress.”…

    I not a paulbot, but he technically came in second place, Why aren’t they letting him speak?

    Report Post »  
    • pondfrog
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:16pm

      he declined to speak, they did ask him

      Report Post » pondfrog  
    • RJJinGadsden
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:20pm

      Didn’t Ron Paul shift his speech to the USF campus because of the weather related time issues?

      Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
    • BCanook
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:34pm

      Dr. Paul & his supporters didn’t win and therefore want to take their toys and go home. Dr. Paul, over his many years as a member of the House has inserted his share of pork into bills, however, he votes no on all spending bills. Hypocritical? Maybe

      Report Post »  
    • Clive
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:54pm

      ahh… i just looked it up… it turns out that mitt would only let him speak, if he could review his remarks first. so paul said “no thanks”. tough luck ron paul, but hey, he’d rather do nothing than be censored i guess.

      mitt, its almost like you want everyone to hate you.

      http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/2012/08/ron-paul-declines-a-speaking-spot-at-gop-convention-after-romney-demands-to-review-remarks/

      Report Post »  
    • islandgal
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 5:07pm

      I’d look his speech over too especially with his comment about if he had been in office 9/11 would never have happened. Comments like that are polarizing and just plain weird. Hat’s off to Romney to decide to review what is being said at the convention regarding HIS acceptance as presidential candidate. You can’t have Ron Paul making comments that scare people away. Ron Paul has great ideas nevertheless End the Fed… Audit the Fed… sound ideas. Ron Paul has to man up and act mature and get on with things.

      Report Post »  
  • nobull14
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:07pm

    I was just listening To Rush Limbaugh and he came out and said that the liberal fact checker just got called for trying to change the fact and that even CNN came out and said Paul Ryan was 100 % correct

    Report Post »  
  • JohnLarson
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:04pm

    A lot of backtracking from the cons…

    The speech takes advantage of low information voters who don’t know better. This is a record for number of lies in one speech.

    Report Post »  
    • RJJinGadsden
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:22pm

      LOL, yeah right! Just wait until Biden’s upcoming speech. In that one you will get a twofer. You can count the lies in one column of a notebook, and his gaffes on the other side.

      Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
    • sWampy
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:32pm

      You liberals even lie about others telling the truth, to be expected from the morons that support universal slavery and consider it a good thing.

      Report Post »  
  • bikerdogred1
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:03pm

    I’ll take Ryan,over Biden or obama for some reason his lie‘s don’t hurt me as much has obama’s.

    Report Post »  
  • troymac20
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:03pm

    Good Job Mr. Holt

    Report Post » troymac20  
  • allyoucaneatbaby
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:02pm

    Wow, ****** defense of ryan in this article, maybe that’s why there are no comments…..theblaze didn’t specifically say, “ok yes the speech was ********,” but that’s what it seems like, right?

    Report Post »  
    • RJJinGadsden
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:17pm

      What is there to really defend from these shallow hacks? To me, most of this is as funny as BSNBC’s reporting from the convention. Not to worry, you’ll be back next week screaming about how Fox will be so unfair when reporting on the invited speaker, then Plugs‘ and eventually the Immaculated One’s speeches. Yes, it will be horrible, and naturally, everybody at Fox and all of the right wing radio commentators will be racists, right?

      Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
  • Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 1:58pm

    So a bunch of charges are bunk as expected. However, some have legs and the answer we‘re left with is that he doesn’t suck as bad as Owebama. Great.

    For example, the Ryan plan adds 18Tr to the national debt before the budget balances 28 years from now. He did vote for bigger government and more spending…just not as big as Owebama. I wouldn‘t exactly say it’s vindication nor providing contrast to Owebama.

    And for the record, his civil liberty voting record sucks.

    So he is what he is. He’s a progressive Republican who is better than Owebama but not conservative nor a defender of liberty. Obama Light. Which was actually George Bush Stout.

    Report Post » Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve  
    • E.Z. Las Vegas
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:42pm

      Yes, I’m sure we would all be much better off if we could live in a totalitarian libertarian dictatorship under Dear Leader Ron Paul.
      Unfortunately, our stupid and shortsighted Founding Fathers set us up in a very messy representative Republic, where legislation has to be crafted with an eye toward passing it through the Democrat controlled Senate in order to move it as far as possible downfield.
      Instead, you would much rather give high minded speeches, and feel really good about our moral superiority, while wondering how the progressives have totally dominated the legislative agenda by letting us self-destruct.
      If you REALLY want a less progressive Paul Ryan, then do everything in your power to give him a Conservative super-majority in the Senate, and the House, so that he has some people he can work with. Otherwise, you better try to figure out how to pass your agenda through a progressive Congress…because so far your legislative success rate is completely a-Pauling

      Report Post »  
    • booger71
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:55pm

      Your not a real Rothbardian are you?

      Report Post » booger71  
    • Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:07pm

      “totalitarian libertarian dictatorship” – LOL, that is classic.

      Report Post » Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve  
    • Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve
      Posted on August 30, 2012 at 3:18pm

      @Booger,

      Economically, very much so. In Man Economy and State, he developed the concept of praxeology very succinctly and with a greater burden of empirical rigor than prior Austrians. I share very similar views in minarchist economic theory as well as numismatics.

      Politically, I’d depart more readily. Specifically, Rothbard seemed to drift through movements due to what I can only think is an unsettled spirtit. I mean we all go through transition in thought of some sorts…at least I would hope we do. But as we age, I think the swings slow down and become more leanings and eventually inperceptable. The 1960‘s and 1970’s Rothbard was politically different than me. The 1950‘s and 1990’s Rothbard would be more closely politically like me.

      Why do you ask?

      Report Post » Rothbardian_in_the_Cleve  
  • PATTY HENRY
    Posted on August 30, 2012 at 2:27pm

    I don’t think ANY of us have realized how CLOSE we came to being SHUT DOWN. People afraid to display decals or bumper stickers, afraid to speak their minds. WITHOUT GLENN BECK ; his GBTV – (now THE BLAZE) and two things: His former FOX show which posted photos of many of the EXISTING FREEDOM-LOVING PATRIOTS was about our FIRST indication that “HEY, I’m NOT alone Out here!!! ” (In fact, it turned out that 75% of the American Population were PATRIOTS!!) The loudest voice at that time were the lousy Matthews-like Liberals and their MSM !! That was the beginning of the Tea Party; the 9/12rs …our fight to take back our country.
    This BLAZE gives us a chance to VOICE our opinions/objections!! Without it where would we be? We saw/heard yesterday that the criticisms of outlets like YAHOO being LIBERAL are true. FOX IS ??? – one or two of their TALKING HEADS are okay, most are like O’Reilly…just interested in protecting his job..or weirdo freaks like Sally Cohn, Bob Beckel…I mean they are not bastions of honor or truth either – once thought they were, but no longer. SO we came THAT close to being totally controlled by B@stards who are and have been Communists since the 60′s !!!
    FIGHT HARD PATRIOTS
    KNOW YOUR FACTS
    I keep a “DRAFT” in my mail box that is a copy of all current facts and comments to make it easy to
    copy/paste when you need facts. Keep it honest, keep it real and keep it coming!!

    Report Post » PATTY HENRY  
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