Father Furious After Army Son Hit in the Chest With a Mallet, Suffers Seizure During Hazing
- Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:29am by
Madeleine Morgenstern
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A still image from video shows Sgt. Phillip Roach getting hit with a wooden mallet during an Army initiation ceremony. Roach's father is furious about the injuries his son sustained and is demanding punishment. (Image source: WWMT-TV)
Disturbing video of a solider being struck in the chest with a wooden mallet at Fort Bragg, N.C. and then collapsing on the ground has his father furious and demanding punishment for those involved, WOOD-TV reported.
Ken Roach of Michigan said his son, 22-year-old Sgt. Phillip Roach, suffered a seizure and required stitches after knocking his head on the ground when he fell. He said the Army later acknowledged the April incident was a “hazing” event to mark his son’s promotion to sergeant.
“I never thought in my wildest dreams I’d be contacted by anybody that my son had a seizure and was hit in the chest during a hazing incident,” Ken Roach told the Associated Press.
Video of the incident first obtained by WWMT-TV shows Phillip Roach receiving the blow after another solider first takes several practice swings. Phillip Roach stumbles backward, then shakes the other soldier’s hand before collapsing.
Ken Roach, an Army veteran himself, told WOOD both the soldier wielding the mallet and the one filming it were his son’s superiors.
“He needs punishment. That was assault with a deadly weapon,” he told the station. “He could’ve killed my son and he should pay for it.”
Ken Roach said that because of the seizure, his son has been unable to get medical clearance to fly a plane and do other duties he trained for. He said he received a letter from the Army calling it an “unauthorized ceremony,“ and a ”clear incident of hazing that caused injury to a great soldier.” The letter also said the soldier who did the hitting had been reprimanded, but Roach said that wasn’t good enough, telling WOOD it was a “slap on the wrist”
“I’m not mad at the Army,” Ken Roach said. “I‘m mad at the individuals who done it and who’s trying to give a little slap on the wrist and say, ‘It’s good to go. Let’s just sweep it under the rug. Send him somewhere else and be done with it.’”
He said his son’s fiance, who was also a soldier but has since been honorably discharged, was also present during the incident. He told the AP neither she nor his son want to comment publicly for fear of retribution.
Sen. Carl Levin (D-Mich.), chairman of the Armed Services Committee, told WWMT in a statement he was “very concerned about this hazing incident” and was asking the Army to review it.
Roach said he’s just looking out for the welfare of his son, who decided he wanted to join the Army as a high school junior “so he could serve under the flag and fight for the freedom of the United States,” according to the AP.
“There’s a possibility that he may never be able to clear medically and be able to do his job and they could medically discharge him just because of this stupid hazing,” he told WOOD.
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Comments (160)
floridareader
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:07amThose brainless liberals that have infiltrated the Military should stick the mallet in their own heads so they discover a brain was mandatory to be an American.
Report Post »banjarmon
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:44pmWhat does the son say about this….the son is a Man and a Solider and knows what he is doing. Dad Let your boy GROW UP!
Report Post »vetswife
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:11pmIf you read the article, his son and girlfriend are afraid of retribution from the army, that’s why his father is speaking out.
Report Post »Crus8r
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:22pmAre you people kidding me? Let the Son grow up? I‘ve been in the Military since the early ’80s and have experienced many different types of “Hazing” and I would agree with you if it was a simple case of “pinning on rank”, but who the hell uses a mallet and hits hard enough to knock him down. Then when he passes out and slams his head on the ground, you want to let that slide? WTF!?! Look, you want to be part of this tradition, fine, but you have to take some kind or responsibility for your actions. If you hurt the kid doing this kind os stupidity, then you pay the price and in this case, it should be an Article 15 with a reduction in rank and pay loss to the perp. If he is the Kids superior, then he should know better than to be part of something like this. You give the kid a smack on the should and a hand shake, not a mallot to the chest and medical chapter for failure to do his job.
Report Post »muffythetuffy
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:42pmThe Commanding Officer is responsible for what happen and must stand Court Marshal. Ask any officer in any armed force and they will agree. The Commanding Officer must pay the price, they cannot delegate responsibility. This is a terrible act against our troops, not only must they fear bodily injury or death from the enemy but also from their own NCOs and Officers. What has happen to our once honorable US Armed Forces. What kind of people do our Military Academies turn out today. Maybe its time to end the volunteer military and return to the conscripted Armed Forces.
Report Post »gibbye
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:50pm…not to mention he hit him over the heart and he could have ruptured the aorta, caused rib fractures, sternum fractures and bruising of the heart and lungs, pneumonia and a heart attack. That soldier should be given some kind of punishment so that this type of thing would not happen again. What’s up with hazing anyway??
Report Post »TXMD
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 2:23pmI have retired after 35 years in the Army – 15 as an Infantry Officer (Special Warfare), and 20 as a surgeon, and now serve in emergency medicine in a civilian hospital. I’ve seen (and been) “hazed” at conclusion of Airborne (Prop Blast party), Ranger, and goodness knows where else. Never heard of deadly force being used as part of a “hazing.” AND. . . using a two hand mallet to strike a person in is beyond belief.
Report Post »Hunter Nole
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 2:35pmThe measure of man or woman takes place between his ears and the heartfelt actions he or she displays. Hitting a soldier with a mallet to prove his worth or to congratulate him is pointless. The mind is where real warfare takes place. Don’t believe me, ask Marcus Luttrell (Navy Seal and author of Lone Survivor).
USAF, Retired
Report Post »American Soldier (Separated)
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 3:15pmThe mallet is a bit much, but it’s standard to get hit in the chest when you get promoted. It was a rite of passage. Everyone went through it, it was always a proud moment to get your rank. Not to mention getting your blood wings, it’s part of tradition. Infantrymen are suppose to be hard. We‘ll go through much harder problems when we’re sent to war.
You’re worried about a mallet hitting your sons chest? How about a 7.62 round hitting your sons chest? It’ll hit harder than any mallet will. Yet was this father more than proud to support the troops and sending them to war?
Unless this father was opposed to war and wanted, no DEMANDED that the troops come home and end the war, he has NO say in whether his son was hit with a mallet. Being hit by an RPG round will do far worse damage!
I am against the war. I want the war to end and all my brothers and sisters in arms to come home. I’ve been to war, two combat tours with the 101st Airborne Division. I’ve been hit in the chest when I got my rank, by everyone of equal rank or greater.
Report Post »FormerLEAcademyInstructor
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 3:26pmThis isn’t political, its neaderthalian thinking that blunt force trauma to the heart won’t have some adverse effect “because we’ve done this a thousand times before and no one ever complained.” Back in the day a ‘precordial thump’ was commonly used to restore a heart to sinus rhythm; so you can imagine the effects a ‘thump’ with a mallet might do to a normally beating heart.
You only need a 30 on the ASVAB to enlist into the Army. Here it shows.
Report Post »bjorn-free
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 5:12pmWhat does the son say about this….the son is a Man and a Solider and knows what he is doing. Dad Let your boy GROW UP!
—————————————————————————————————————————————
You sir WIN the Darwin award for being able to breath and log on to a computer! This has nothing to do with being a man and growing up……This is POOR leadership at its PC finest and they need to be court marshaled or be Article 15′d at the minimum. This type of behavior would never be tolerated in my platoon. Those that have died from college hazings have faced stiff penalties and so should these Cretans.
I suggest you volunteer and make a you tube video of being the recipient of such hazing and then tell us how your sucking it up and growing up…..
This soldier was trained to be a pilot. As one that was medically disqualified (poor eyesight) I can tell you that most all military aviators fly because of a passion you will never be able to grasp nor comprehend. This will be a devastating blow to his career and life long pursuit on many levels.
Your lack of human compassion is appalling and should qualify you for top spot at the DNC witches convention this coming week.
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:40pmHazing? Looks more like assault with a deadly weapon to me. Let the UCMJ take over (Uniform Code of Military Justice, for those of you who never served and still act like you did). That is totally outside the acceptable in military terms. Prosecute.
Report Post »Skrewedretiree
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:47pm@American Soldier-Separated: Good thing you are separated from the military. But: are you separated from common sense too? So, a soldier needs to be able to stand up to a slam in the chest with a large wooden mallet when he makes Sargeant? Why not just go ahead with the 7.62?
Please- tell us why you are separated if you are such a tough combat soldier.
I served as well, and was in the Navy. When we made ‘grade’ and got our Crows, we didn’t beat the crap out of each other to show each other how tough we were. We were taught to fight using combat training tactics and martial arts and our brains.
Maybe that is why I chose the Navy. Being an Army of One does not refer to the IQ level!
Before you start that Army/Navy schoolyard thing, remember: In the Navy, you stand your ground no matter what. There is no where else to go. Think about it.
Report Post »Halloween
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:06pm@BANJARMON —> You’re an idiot. Why don’t you read up on some medical information before you kill somebody. Look up “Precardial Thump”. You’re about as stupid as the people wielding the mallet.
Report Post »FREEDOMoverFEAR
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 4:34amThat picture just makes me laugh it looks like a cartoon. I bet he didn’t really think the guy easing going to hit him that hard. That picture is a total fail for that sgt.
Report Post »flyingpeters
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 6:58amThe Army strong….wham!…..back to the Army of one!…lol
Report Post »rangerp
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 7:46amI grew up in a unit where hazing and initiations were just part of life for the new solider. When the real leadership went home in the evening, the Spec 4 mafia ruled the barracks. The descriminator was those who had the ranger tab.
Hazing could be everything from a smoke session (where for fun, the new soldiers were pushed to exhaustion doing pushups, flutter kicks, mountain climbers..). It also involved forcing people to consume alcohol, shaving heads, hanging people out of windows, physical abuse…
None of it was lawful, and none of it resulted in creating a team or more cohesive unit. It was all just a power trip.
My first trip to Ranger school, I broke my foot, did not graduate, and was sent back to my unit. Ranger school had lost it mystique, and I lost patience for stupidity. A group of young NCOs in my platoon came back drunk from the Fort Benning Main NCO Club, and decided to do a 0200 hazing session in the upstairs day room. All of the privates were rousted out of their bed, and while doing the push-up and other exercises, had to listen to the three drunk idiots ramble on about how hard Ranger Battalion used to be.
One solider ended up getting choked, and that is when I decided I had enough hazing. Me and two privates who we called the barbarian brothers, put a stop to it. One of the drunks got body slammed on the concrete. I never got hazed again, and was always proud that once i earned my tab and E4, I never did this crap to any new soldier
Report Post »rangerp
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 7:58am@American Soldier
“Everyone went through it, it was always a proud moment to get your rank. Not to mention getting your blood wings, it’s part of tradition. Infantrymen are suppose to be hard. We‘ll go through much harder problems when we’re sent to war”
I have been doing this for 25 years now, and am amazed how stupid this sometimes becomes. I have been there, where when the guy gets his promotion, the dude pinning on the rank, stick it into the uniform, and then without a whole lot of power, hammer fists the little prongs into his flesh. No real damage, everyone laughs, shakes his hand, and goes about their business. the problem is, someone always wants to one up everything. Next thing you know, you have a line of people that get to hit him and drive the rank in. and you have the one moron that has to hit the hardest, and breaks the guys collar bone.
A number of years ago, a young marine earned his jump wings. He went back to his unit, and they had a pinning ceremony to put on his blood wings on him. Everyone with wings lined up to get a shot. When they were done, they had hit him so hard and so many times that when he went to his room he collapsed and died of heart failure.
Now with many years in and at the rank of LTC, I would just as soon pin on the rank (now it is Velcro anyway), shake his hand, shake his wife’s hand (if he has one), and give the young soldier five minutes to speak to those watching. It is just not worth the risk or the ma
Report Post »osgeek
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 9:03amfloridareader, banjarmon, American Soldier (Separated): You are an idiots…
Report Post »Hitting a person on the chest over the sternum with a hammerfist delivers about 2-5 joules(some say 50 joules) of energy. It is called a Precordial thump and it is dangerous. It is why some athletes drop dead after being hit, especially common in Lacrosse players. If a fist can alter a heart rhythm imagine what a mallet swung like this one did. This is insane and is an assault, a lethal one. I am surprised that this went one any time at all, the commander and all above the victim in his chain of command should have to answer for this one. This has to be one of the most lame brained hazing rituals I have ever heard of, these soldiers are idiots and should be separated. Morons.
thop1960
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 12:28pm@ muffy,
This kind of stuff has been around since the beginning of mortal combat. If it doesn’t hurt, what’s the point. Having said that, one must use common sense. A mallet to the sternum is asking for serious trouble. Don’t they realize the heart is nearby. Hitting that hard on the sternum is like a defibrillator going off to jump start the heart. It can just as easy put the heart into an abnormal or deadly rhythm. That is probably why he fell in the first place, he went into an arrhythmia. Regardless, some serious thought needs to go into what we do and not just haphazardly slamming a mallet into a chest. Tradition is one thing, ruining your buddies Army career is another. Common sense people.
Report Post »BurntHills
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:03amdemocrats have called for a boycott of Clint Eastwood’s new film, Army is striking their VOLUNTEERS who excel in the heart with mallets, what next….
Report Post »Exrepublisheep
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 5:05pmI haven’t seen any mention anywhere of boycotting Clint. Besides, tha‘s’ a rebub thing to do.
Report Post »grayling646
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 5:00amLOL repub. What an obvious bait.
Report Post »cranberry
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:59amWhy in the heck would you want to HURT a fellow soldier? stupid.
Report Post »LordJack
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:09pmIt’s an act of brotherhood. If you want to move up you have to prove your willing to sacrifice for the team. After he got hit in the chest he shook his hand.
Report Post »Chuck Stein
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:22pmHazing is nuts
Report Post »WATER-THE-TREE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:26pmThe guy is a fool for letting them hit him in the chest.
Report Post »ThoreauHD
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 2:15pmHazing is part of training. The Army Rangers beat the living snot out of eat other and are lucky if they only walk away with a broken bone.
There is a reason for this. When you are captured by an enemy, they will do this to you and then some. Or have your forgotten Fallujah.
Now a mallot to the chest.. I don’t know what the point of this is. Nobody uses a mallot unless you want to simulate a airplane or car crash.
Report Post »Chuck Stein
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 2:33am@ Thoreauhd
Report Post »“Hazing is part of training.” No — by definition hazing is outside of official training. As such, hazing very often gets out of control. It can even go to homosexual assaults. If a military force wants to actually train, then they can do it in an official manner.
rangerp
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 8:16amThoreauHD
My first five years (of my current 25) was spent in the 75th Ranger Regiment.
Hazing is stupid, and provides nothing. I believe for the most part that is has been weeded out.
The Ranger Indoctrination Program (RIP) is controlled, tough, and it weeds out the week. They now call it RASP, and it also weeds out the week.
High PT standards, long ruck marches, high standards for conduct, marksmanship, combatives….. these make for tough soldiers, discipline, and high morale.
Hazing is done as part of a power trip for a junior leader, who is not mature, and lacks self confidence. It is a form of bullying, done for the pleasure of the one doing the hazing, and is not to the benefit of the one being hazed.
This is not to say that a young leader can not do corrective training on a subordinate. I was a young team leader back in the 80s, and I remember taking soldiers that were deficient, and going on a run with them in the evening to help improve their 2 mile run time. I remember doing push up workouts on the weekend to get a young soldier ready for Ranger School, or to raise his PT score. the difference, is that you do it with the soldier. This is much different than a groupd of drunk E4 and E5s unleashing the hell on some new soldiers.
Read leadership stuff from some of the top military leaders in history. Napoleon, Clausewitz, Sun tzu, Robert E Lee, George Marshall, Patton….. You will never see them call for hazing to improve a unit.
Report Post »schroeder123
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:56amA guy is going to be in hurt doing his job, why would you kill him before he has a chance to do it.
are an idiot ? A man develops his own strength.
Bashing him with a hammer does not make a stronger man. Moron !
Report Post »Chuck Stein
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:26pmAmong the real “winners” of quotations by Nietzsche:
Report Post »“God is dead” and “That which does not kill me makes me stronger.” Sure, tell that to the family of a brain-damaged drug abuser.
RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:39amI remember when I graduated Airborne School, you had a choice of getting “Blood Wings” which was really just getting the airborne wings badge slammed into your chest rather than pinned on.
Most of my class did it because we were all so damned proud at that moment. We wanted it to live forever. (In the army you don’t develop a brain, and still have romantic illusions until you’ve been in at least 3 years.)
It looks to me like this is the same type of thing, done with some humor. A big cartoon mallet instead of having the badge slammed into your chest with a fist. This is not hazing in the traditional sense, but a proud graduation ceremony with a little humor.
It obviously went terribly wrong. He got hit just right in the chest and it caused his heart to beat erraticaly. I am sure that the practice will be discontinued.
It looks to me like this is a similar situation but they are “humorously” doing it with a hammer. I doubt this is traditional hazing
Report Post »canadianlady
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:58amAre you defending what you just saw??? My God, don‘t you realize that that could have stopped the man’s heart? Don’t you realize the damage that could have caused to it? Unbelieveable!
Report Post »TIME_2_END_THE_PAUL_CAMPAIGN_IN_12
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:12amDITTO your comment. Was about to post regarding “Blood Wings” and the pride I felt at graduation. I’ll admit that I was more worried about graduation and the rumor of getting “Blood Wings” than I was performing my first jump. I wasn’t Ranger Qualified but I knew some Cadre that talked about “breaking ice” at the slide for life during the colder months… rumor or fact?
Report Post »RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:40amI’ve never broken the ice, but I did go through Ranger School in the winter. I remember freezing my balls off. After doing a whole bunch of watery activities includiing the slide for life you had to low crawl through pools of mud and red clay to finally arrive in front of a RI, where you had to stand at attention, shivering on the edge of hypothermia, and recite the Ranger Creed. That was so miserable.
I know it can get pretty cold in Georgia sometimes, so I suppose if you’re really unlucky…
Report Post »TIME_2_END_THE_PAUL_CAMPAIGN_IN_12
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:12pmBenning (Georgia) could get down right cold… and unbelievably HOT/HUMID… and I experienced both extremes during my training there (not to mention the infamous “chiggers” during the heat which made for a miserable experience all by their little selves (clear fingernail polish was the remedy of choice, lol).
ALL THE WAY….
Report Post »IrishRican
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:14pmWhen I got promoted to Corporal my squad leader hit me with the rank but it hit my collarbone and didn’t go in. When I was promoted to E-5, my wife and CO pinned my rank on, so there was no “blood rank”. Millions of troops have gone through this when getting promoted or graduating airborne or air assault school, EIB, EFMB, etc. This was an accident. One thing I think though, is that with the new uniforms the rank is in the middle of the chest and not on the collar, or on the “meaty” part of the chest like badges are, maybe “blood rank” should be done away with just because of the placement.
Report Post »WATER-THE-TREE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:32pmCartoon mallet, a little humor, you are an idiot! The man almost died!
Report Post »causticwit
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:37pmI’ll defend Ranger. It was an accident. Things like this have been around for a very long, long, time. And, it is rare that anyone gets seriously hurt in the process. If you as a soldier do not want any part of a hazing, then you don’t have to do it. Evidently this young Sgt. and his wife had no problem with it at the time. Our country is weak and in my humble opinion it is because our military has gotten weak by allowing the public to throw their two cents in. Back in the day, a drill could knock the crap out of you if you had it coming, now a days, they cannot even curse at you.
I understand why the father would be upset. No one wants to see their son hurt. However, this fight if for his son to take on, not his father. If the son is soooo afraid of retribution, then maybe it is time for him to hang up the military career. A true leader would have not let it happen to him if he did not want to do it, or after the fact if he did not agree with how it went down, he would stand up and fight his own battle and not have his father do it for him.
Just saying.
Report Post »RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:51pm@ Candian Lady: No I’m not defending their actions. It was my hope to explain to non-military people what you were seeing, and why.
Forceful blows to the chest are experienced Army-wide, in the hand-to-hand pit, in boxing, and in the martial arts. In many rank, badge or tabbing ceremonies especially in elite units they are applied with a hard fist, and they are done so with the consent of the awardee. Call it macho posturing, military tradition, esprit-de-corp, or whatever, it’s been part of the military for alot longer than any of us have been around.
I’ve never seen it applied with a gigantic mallet before, but I‘m sure it’s a really stupid attempt at humor. The reasoning is somthing like this: “Airborne Rangers use a fist to pin their wings, but here at (insert Award/School or Rank) we really mean business and put our stuff on with a 20 pound hammer!! Hooah!! etc….
Was it stupid and should the practice of using a hammer for this, be immediately and forever discontinued? Hell yes.
Will it?
Theres likely 10,000 Pentagon clerks drafting the new regs as we speak.
Will blood badges and other warrior traditions be stopped because they are seen as hazing, and occasionly someone gets hurt?
Not a chance.
Report Post »RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:02pm@Water-the-Tree
I know you’re indignant, and the whole hammer thing really was stupid. If I was the father I would be pissed off too.
…But I doubt any of what you saw involved malice or evil intent. I am also sure that this practice (with the hammer) will be put to a permanent end, knowing the military’s fear of negative public perception.
As for me being an idiot…well let’s just say I have my moments. *grin*
Report Post »American Soldier (Separated)
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 3:39pmI agree with ranger that this is just tradition. The huge mallet part was stupid, but as you can see, the soldier was willing to do it, smiled and laughed about it and even shook the mans hand. He was proud of earning his stripes and welcomed the rite of passage.
My whole issue with the argument is, you’re worried about him almost being killed with a mallet that he willing allowed to happen to him, but are you fine with sending him to war? Fine with him being shot by a 7.62 round in the same place that mallet hit? You are sending these boys to war, where they die, where they get hit by 7.62 rounds. They get hit by RPG rounds. Yet your worried about a mallet during a ranking ceremony?
You have no place to talk about this if you are still willing to send this man to war.
PS. What Specialist/SGT flies aircraft? That‘s an officer’s position, not enlisted. What could he possibly be flying, other than maybe a drone?
Report Post »rangerp
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 8:40amRANGER1965
Blood wings is a thing of the past. Airborne school strictly prohibits it, and it is not allowed as part of the graduation ceremony.
To be honest, a paratrooper that falls out of an airplane five times, and lives to tell about it, and go on and serves in an airborne unit, is as much as a paratrooper as ones from when I went through, and got the blood rank.
When I look over my career, and think about the things that really gave me a leg up, blood rank and blood wings mean nothing.
In 1988, I got stuck being the Staff Duty Runner, where you answer phones all day, and then in the evening, you monitor phones, sweep and mop floors, and generally, the staff duty sits around, and works you like a slave for 24 hours.
This time, I worked for a guy named SGT Lang. I was a little confused when he sent me out to a dumpster, to collect up pieces of cardboard. In the evening, when the officers went home, instead of doing hazing like most Staff Duty NCOs, this guy gave me classes on giving a tactical operation order. The cardboard was for course of action sketches, action on the objective sketches, time line….. When the sun came up, I knew how to plan and brief a squad operation order, was better prepared for when I would go to ranger school, and was better prepared to one day be a leader.
I have hundreds and hundreds of stores about leaders that helped me over the years. I have no stories about how getting hazed ever helped me.
Report Post »Codyrock67a
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:32amAs a Sargent he flies in an aircraft, he does not fly it. The pc crap has to stop. Hazing has been around since mankind, it build character and esprit de’corps.
Report Post »Bum thrower
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:39amYes! but not to the point of injury or even death! Opps; sorry your (fill in the blank) exopired unexpectedly while we were on a ‘building esprit’ episode’!!
Injuries in training are ‘career enders’ for the trainers. Should be no different here.
Report Post »floridareader
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:11amYou cannot build character when you kill the soldier or injure him/her in a way that might risk his o her life and health. You build character with discipline not with stupidity.
Report Post »Just imagine if your boss demands that you jump out from the top floor of the building you work at, so he will know he can trust you.
COFemale
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:30amHazing is wrong, wrong, wrong. What the F is wrong with you men? You are a bunch of dumb asses trying to prove whose D is bigger. I know women haze too and I will chastise them also. This is nothing but assault. It does not build character so get that crap out of your pea brains. This soldier could have died; a blow to the chest can send the heart into cardiac arrest.
The perps of this hazing should be dishonorable discharges and sent to Ft Leavenworth, KS for two years. This practice has to be drummed out of all branches of the service and those who conduct themselves in this practice go straight to Ft. Leavenworth. This is nothing but Neanderthal behavior. Grow up
Report Post »Hiswill
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:41amWhy haze these guys. They have gotten through boot camp and proved themselves to be worthwhile soldiers. Stop the hazing before death is the result.
Report Post »LordJack
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:09pmHe’s most likely an UAV pilot. You can be enlisted and fly UAVs in the Army.
Report Post »WATER-THE-TREE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:42pmPeople tried to haze me, I told them to go to hell…. If you want to build character, try being the only one with enough balls to to tell everyone else to bite it!
Report Post »Scaredfuzz
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:34pmMost likely a Helicopter gunner or engineer, not a UAV operator, his unit patches are 82nd Airborne; so he’s probably a blackhawk crewmember, definitely not a pilot though.
As for the hammer, definitely does not fall under hazing, but idiocy? yes. A tap to the chest with the hammer vs punching on the rank is one half dozen the other, but this idiot with the mallet reared back and swung for the fences.
Report Post »bjorn-free
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 5:25pmCrew chief or flight engineer either way it’s a passion we love and we love to fly….blood rank yep ok on the pectoral muscles you knuckleheads not the breastbone where heart arrhythmia is a high possibility.
Good grief! comparing a hazing to a 7.62 really yeah we get it combat and death bad it’s what we signed up for…..to die in combat is not the same is getting your life deranged by a knucklehead and pounding your heart.
Report Post »The Ranger training tough, Airborne tough yep I was there at Benning and watched them go through it and our medics cared for the Rangers at the Dahlonaga camp in the mountains and the mental toughness preparing for what’s to come is not the same as assaulting your troop as a tradition with a mallet on the heart.. When I made WO-1 the LTC and wife pinned those on me thank God! Those buck sgt. stripe hurt but hey we are young and lived forever at that time! lol…..
rangerp
Posted on September 3, 2012 at 8:52amCodyrock67
“Hazing has been around since mankind, it build character and esprit de’corps.”
Hazing is a form of bullying. It is done by those with weak minds, and is for their pleasure, not for the benefit of the one being hazed.
Find me one of the top leaders from world history, that will claim that hazing is good for a unit. Read Napoleon, clauswitz, Washington, Lee, Marshall…..
Hazing is done by junior leaders who lack maturity, experience, confidence. Battalion Command Sergeant majors are the most experienced NCOs in a battalion. They do not haze people. There is a reason for this.
Report Post »thekuligs
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:30amMy husband is in the Air Force, they just pnch your arm when you add stripes >.< A mallet, seriously? What is sad is they had probably done it in that unit like that for YEARS; and the people doing it now are doing it because they have always done it and no one wants to say anything about it less THEY start a problem.
Report Post »Walkabout
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:56amI think hazing incidents like this are like potlaches that get out of hand. Potlatches got out of hand where people use to give away or burn everything. You want to be as good or better than the old breed or those from before so people tend to “one up” the ceremonies over time.
It is a hazing spiral. Sooner or later someone dies.
Report Post »OKC08GT500
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:29amHey granny – we don’t need sodomites in the military. Being opposed to perversion is not being a bigot – it is standing up to the gay lobby and protecting the military.
Report Post »bjorn-free
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 6:06pm+1 Thank you SIR!
See folks call us names bigot racist to some of us it don’t mattah…the truth is what it is…. hide behind your own perverted religion and modern 501(c)3 pulpit pimp but it’s me and my AKJV and 223 …..
Report Post »CPLGEORGE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:26amIf we did that to one of those guys at GITMO, we’d be kissing ass all over the Middle East, with Obama leading the parade, right after crucifying the guy that did it as well as the watchers on.
Report Post »Mapache
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:15amWhat is wrong with you people in the Army? Very UNSAT. Get your act together or get out. Where the hell is Army leadership in this stuff. Guys urinating on corpses, Abu Garib…..there is something seriously wrong….the first thing is this idea that EVERYONE who puts on a uniform is a hero, it gives people swelled heads. Heroism is a result of actions, not getting dressed up.
Report Post »Abraham Young
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:13amThat’s assault and battery and should be treated as such. STUPID is as STUPID does.
Report Post »LordJack
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:13pmWell it’s not assault and battery. Assault and Battery has to be unwanted. As you can clearly see in the video he stepped up, and put his arms behind his back, proving he was willing to do so. The army rarely forces you to do this. It’s always on a volunteer basis.
Report Post »ModerationIsBest
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 7:12pm@LORDJACK
Hazing is hardly volunteering.
You‘re more voluntold to do it because if you don’t, you will likely be ostracized from the group.
Report Post »garbagecanlogic
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:12amI want to know what the reprimand was before I pass judgement. That said, the one with the mallet needs something serious as a reprimand as he certainly does not know anything about the human body. Trained killers know that a hit to this area can cause serious damage.
Praise Be To Obama. Psalm 109:8
The U.S. Out Of The U.N.
Report Post »The U.N. Out Of The U.S.
WithoutGuile
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:06amThere was once a hazing ritual that involved guns, bullets and blindfolds…and apples. But it never really took off. I can’t imagine why? Why do the stupid and insecure people run the world. At any moment one courageous intelligent person could have stopped this and said… “NO. I don’t think this is a good idea.”
Report Post »freeberty
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:03amJust another example of how much of a welfare jobs program the military has become.
The sad part is the american taxpayer will more then likely end up having to feed, cloth, house these 2 idiots and their families for the rest of their lives as they transfer from one government job to the next.
Report Post »chingachgook
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:47amThis is the kid of asinine thing that foolish people thinks proves something, It is just plain stupid.
Report Post »Walkabout
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:59amI bet that psychologists could show that hazing ceremony as a group initiation ceremony improves group cohesiveness to some small degree at least temporarily.
I bet they also could show that hazing may (oftentimes?) spiral out of control like potlatches have done in the past.
Report Post »WATER-THE-TREE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:00pmHow can it provide GROUP cohesiveness when there is no GROUP because you are alone because you killed everyone else with a mallet, DUH!
Report Post »Walkabout
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 7:21pmWATER-THE-TREE
Report Post »It never gets to that point. It does often times get to the point of taking casualties, where people die or are injured. It is stupid beyond belief if for no other reason than a group is attriting itself.
Mr.Fitnah
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:39amThey used to just punch the pins in with a fist. Yeah it cut and stung.A giant cartoon worthy hammer ?
Report Post »Nah . Thats just crazy.
glckgrl
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:18amI understand our military is the toughest in the world and that hazing is a rite to passage. However, extreme hazing that tramples a man’s career goals, his very liberty entitled to all Americans, due to excessive force is a distressing lack of discernment! I agree the assaulter should be sent to the brig and busted in rank. Let‘s all pray for this soldier’s full recovery so he can resume the career he desires–prayer is stronger than a mallet, especially when multiplied by many… and miracles DO happen.
Report Post »muffythetuffy
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:44amTHIS IS AN ASSAULT
When I was in the Army any NCO who strikes a subordinate would get Court Marshaled. What is in the minds of out military NCOs and Officers. What kind of military do we have? This is what you get when you create a Gay armed forces. The NCO should be held in a stockade awaiting trial.
Report Post »muffythetuffy
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:51amHazing? No, the Army never use to do this. The shock wave caused by the mallet is concentrated on the heart and can stop the heart. This a law suit against aluminum bat makers because kids are getting hit in the chest with balls and getting killed. What in Gods name have the Homosexuals done to our US Armed Forces. What kind of officers are the academies now graduating. This is the failure of the all volunteer army.
Report Post »TEXASGRANNY73
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:19am@MuffytheTuffyakaGlckgrl “Just a few good men”. This story gives you a chance to pray and at the same time in your wisdom place blame on gay people? Nowhere did I read gay in this story. Getting slammed in the chest with a mallet? Disgusting. Being a bigot? Disgusting.
Report Post »richmc
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:11amI retired from the Army after 20 years 5 months and 22 days. I have recieved countless “blood rank” ceremonies. My CIB an EIB and every other award of that type were pounded into my chest. It hurt like hell, but there was no permanent damage. That’s just how things went. However, NO ONE that I ever had any dealings with used a freakin mallet to smash someone in the chest! The supervisors of that freshly promoted NCO should be stripped of rank and all responsibilities that put them in charge of anyone or anything. That is just insane! I hate it for that kid and I hate it for his family aswell. People are stupid, there’s no way around that.
Report Post »repairsea
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 12:21pmWell said.
Report Post »JimCS
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:53amIt’s a holdover from when we used to wear stripes on our sleeves. Everyone would punch your arm after you got promoted and sewed on your new stripes. But no one ever went into seizures from being slugged on the upper arm. This new rank insignia is worn dead-center on our chest. What was this idiot leader thinking? How poor is his judgement and logical reasoning that this seemed like a cool idea? He should be discharged for the good of the service. Don’t want that brainiac in charge of Soldiers.
Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:02amAgreed.
Report Post »richmc
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:12amYou are correct!
Report Post »TEXASGRANNY73
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 10:22am“Just a few good men”.
Report Post »phrogdriver
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:53amI got my wings pounded into me when I graduated from flight school. No big deal. This video, however, is disturbing. There’s a difference between causing a little pain and doing something that can clearly cause severe injury. This is the kind of stupidity that causes longstanding military traditions to get outlawed.
Report Post »RED PILL PATRIOT
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:16amConcur, my “winging” was one of the greatest days of my life. It’s a few rotten apples that screw it up for the rest of us.
Report Post »RJJinGadsden
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:51amIdiots. Have seen the results of a few of these hazings, but a mallet strike is a new one to me.
Report Post »I do recall a rather funny one though. I took a call at the Ft Bragg main MP station in the late ’70s and the retired CSM who ran the main post theater was furious and demanding a patrol to respond to an incident there. About fifteen minutes later the two man patrol walked in with a 19 year old kid who must have been 6′7″ or 6′8″ who could barely maintain his balance. The patrol was laughing uncontrollably. We eventually got the story as the 5 man desk crew cracked up as well. This kid was being initiated into his unit within the 82nd with a drinking game. No idea how he got clear across the post to the theater, but it was customary for troops in nearby barracks to step in and buy snacks without buying a ticket, then returning to their barracks. This guy got a drink and popcorn and went on into the theater anyway. Sat down in the dark and fell asleep. About 3/4 of the way through the movie he jumped out of his, not knowing where he was, and alcohol doing what it always does to you system, he pulled his gym shorts down and urinated where he stood…..urinated on a major, his wife, and their daughter. After I finally regained my demeanor, and was really wondering how much he had to drink, and since I was the state licensed breathalyzer operator. I got the patrol to bring him back to the guard mount room where the old S&W Series 200A Breathalyzer was. cont
RJJinGadsden
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:58amI explained to him that this would not be used against him in any way. We were just curious as to how much he had consumed. He blew a .36! That is the highest that I have personally witnessed. The patrol rushed him to Womac Army Hospital as the radio operator notified the MP at the emergency room what to expect. If those hazing him had gotten any more alcohol in him, they could have killed him.
Report Post »justangry
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:03amAll we did of this nature was tack on promotions and medals. One’s arm or chest would be a little swore for a day or two depending on how zealous the older salts were. My favorite gag was the “Mail bouy” You’d get the bootcamps in full battle gear, give them a hook and have them stand at the bow to retrieve the mail. LOL Someone would claim they missed it and that they had recovered it from the fantail. They were going to get in trouble by the skipper for missing it. Then send them looking stupid and scared up to the skipper’s cabin to deliver the mailbag.
Report Post »TIME_2_END_THE_PAUL_CAMPAIGN_IN_12
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:20amThe “Gas Chamber” exercise always provided a bit of fun…. or stress… depending upon how one looked at it.
Report Post »WATER-THE-TREE
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 1:23pmalcohol is just as deadly as a mallet, many people have died from over drinking, and some have died from over drinking water too.
Report Post »RJJinGadsden
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 2:03pmWATER-THE-TREE, Yeah, I am more than well aware of that. Have been licensed to operate a number of different breathalyzers in NC, NY, and Germany when they were finally allowed there in the ’90s, and Alabama. Have also been a trained Traffic Accident Investigator in NC, NY, and Germany. Have witnessed more than enough alcohol related fatalities.
Report Post »proliance
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:50amPeople should know by now that you never hit a person in the center of his chest. It seems every year you hear about a young baseball player dying from getting hit with a baseball.
I know when I was a deputy Sheriff we were trained to never strike a person in the chest just for that reason.
Report Post »RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:12amI’m sure there are a legion of military writers furiously drafting new regulations as we speak, on this very subject.
Report Post »ranger82
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:44amthis has been going on at bragg for years. When I was there you didnt get any promotion without some hazing. It was constant. welcome to ft bragg
Report Post »HOOT_OWL
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 9:41amHmm… Well then maybe we should draft the prisoners from Gitmo
Report Post »into the military, just long enough to ask them a few questions
during the hazing process..Then send the ones that live trough it back.
Lucky3000
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:41amI won’t watch it…And I don’t blame that father……….
Report Post »blackyb
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 8:39amIf this is the kind of leadership we have in service, we do not need enemies. The man who assaulted this soldier should be sent to the brig and busted in rank.
Report Post »RANGER1965
Posted on September 2, 2012 at 11:10amIt’s a foolish practice, but it looks to me like graduation ritual rather than hazing with some evil intent.
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