GM Cancels OnStar Policy That Tracks You Even After Cancellation
- Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:01pm by
Jonathon M. Seidl
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Last week, we noted that OnStar would continue tracking and logging your travel data even after you cancelled the service. Today, GM — which runs the service — announced it is reversing that policy.
“We realize that our proposed amendments did not satisfy our subscribers,” OnStar President Linda Marshall said in a press release. “This is why we are leaving the decision in our customers’ hands. We listened, we responded and we hope to maintain the trust of our more than 6 million customers.”
The release continued:
If OnStar ever offers the option of a data connection after cancellation, it would only be when a customer opted-in, Marshall said. And then OnStar would honor customers’ preferences about how data from that connection is treated.
The release also said that allowing tracking even after cancellation would have “allowed OnStar to provide former customers with urgent information about natural disasters and recalls affecting their vehicles” and “would have helped in planning future services.”
But privacy advocates questioned the wisdom of making it a policy to allow a car company to track owners’ moves even after cancellation. Jalopnik reports “at least three U.S. senators accusing the service of invading privacy,” and that the U.S. Federal Trade Commission was even asked to probe whether OnStar was violating federal privacy rules.
“We regret any confusion or concern we may have caused,” Marshall added at the end of the release.
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Comments (112)
Jake in Denver
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:58pmEasy solution; don’t buy a Government Motors vehicle.
If you are already stuck with a GM vehicle, but the OnStar wires. I wouldn’t trust them to turn it off. They will just tell you that they did and still track you.
Report Post »PoliticalJunkieToo
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:35pmThe FEDS
http://matthewnoyes.typepad.com/attorney_matthew_noyes_bl/2010/03/using-an-automobiles-black-box-after-a-serious-car-accident.html
EDR information belongs to the owner of the vehicle. That’s why insurance companies and manufacturers will sometimes offer to buy what appears to be a complete wreck after a bad accident.
This information can also be helpful in the prosecution of bad drivers. For example, recently a Florida appellate court threw out a claim made by the defendant in a vehicular manslaughter case that he should have been able to block police from examining his vehicle’s EDR data. The vehicle’s information was helpful in convicting him after the serious car accident.
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:20pmDon’t CUT the wires …they can simply be un-plugged!!. … when the car is sold or traded in you can just plug it back in and the next person can make the choice for themselves (some people DO want the service)
Report Post »CatB
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:26pmOkay so they say they won’t track after you cancel .. WHAT ABOUT IF YOU WANT THE SERVICE YOU PAID FOR .. I pay for emeregency services only .. not turn by turn .. if I am in an accident and can’t speak if the airbag is deployed they are sent a signal and my location is sent to emergency services .. I often drive LONG distances with only a little dog in the car .. this is something that I feel is a good service .. I DO NOT HOWEVER WANT TO BE “TRACKED” they do NOT need to collect data .. they can provide this service without TRACKING me .. and believe me I have contacted them on Facebook and let them know about my anger at this CR*P going on.
My next vehicle will NOT be a GM and it will not have “tracking’ of any kind if I can help it .. believe me I will GRILL the salesman .. and perhaps take it somewhere to have it swept for bugs.
TEA!
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 6:06pmHow do you think they can find you if they can’t track you? only send a signal if you hit a tree HARD enough?. What about getting stuck in snow? stalled ? out of gas? Heart attack? car stolen? keys locked in car? lost in a bad neighborhood?
Having a parachute that will only open on impact isn’t of much use.
Report Post »jb.kibs
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 6:34pm50$ says they still track you and they are just saying they aren’t…
Report Post »Islesfordian
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 7:14pmAxel, they can find you by locating your signal on the GPS. To “track” you they are logging where you are at every moment, not just when you need them to know. It’s not like they have an eye in the sky that can only know where you are if it follows you. That’s why it will still work again even after you have had it disconnected for some time and then reconnected. Their computer always knows where you are but they don’t have to know or record what the computer knows.
Report Post »poverty.sucks
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 7:40pmIf buyers who choose to finance cars they can’t afford, GM wouldn’t have the need to track and locate deadbeats with GM cars.
Report Post »poverty.sucks
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 7:48pmDue to the Success of On-Star, GM was pleased with the rate of recovery of those assets.
Report Post »One of the strong
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 7:54pmEGGZACTLY, don’t trust government motors. If it’s there, they can access it….and they will.
Report Post »decendentof56
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 9:03pmI turned off my desire to have another Gov. car when they took the money, and would hope others do the same. The UAW is another good reason to not buy one.
Report Post »banjarmon
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 9:49pmON STAR….Maybe ON…Maybe OFF….I wonder which????
Report Post »Cat
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 10:10pm…
OT
Heads up folks …
North Caroline Governor, Democrat Beverly Perdue, suggested the postponement of all state and federal elections for two years.
Report Post »Ruler4You
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 3:34amOh, yeah. I believe them ‘now’, alright. Sure.
While I don’t agree with the “black box” technology going into all new vehicles either, if you have to buy a ‘new’ car (and I assume you’d buy American) I’d buy a FORD, these days.
Sooner or later it will be impossible to avoid being tracked by the government every moment of your life. (Probably with a shock collar on, too). But for the time being, I’d avoid it at all costs.
Right now, I’m working in Europe and the news last night showed a woman whose purse was snatched while she was in a restaurant in London. And despite London having 32 Million, +/-, CCTV cameras to surveil (is that a word?) the entire population they couldn’t catch the crook. Why? The official London Police answer was: “There is just too much data to comb through, it would take hours and a room full of men.”
So, there you have it. While the inevitability of a total surveillance society is where government wants to end up, it won’t be able to cope with the data once it has it. Unless it’s for their own purposes. And you get to pay for it. What a sweet deal, eh?
Report Post »gulph
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 12:08pmIn 2008 GM vehicles you can unplug the VCOM and disable the Onstar but is a complicated process that involves 4 plugs and a antenna lead that uses the cars chasis/ body as the array. All this provided you can find the VCOM as they are placed in different locations depending on the model car. I was told GM was being influenced by the GOV to make disconnecting the module impossible because it is the goal of the GOV to track every new vehicle made. Dodge is also guilty of this privacy violation so the message is don’t by GM or Dodge if you care about your privacy.
Report Post »Susan Harkins
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 1:38pmYou see, guys?
They HAVE to play the game, when we descend on them like a million wasps.
My question to them is this: “Who’s wagging it now — the tail or the dog?”
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 3:41pmIslesfordian…and others,
I can’t believe how ignorant** people are concerning how modern tech actually works….GPS only uses sats to transmit info TO the unit in the car they DO NOT RECIEVE INFO FROM THE CAR. The GPS unit in the car uses the sat info to locate itself. The transmitting of your location is performed via a cell phone signal emitted by the car. The cell phone unit is located in the box in the car. It‘s like if you’re out for a walk and call home on your cell phone to be picked up and… give the person at home your location according to visible landmarks and they know where to come get you….the problem isn‘t the landmarks it’s the call home
In other words;
You (the GPS) see the landmarks (sats) and then You (using your cell phone) call home (OnStar).
The only unfortunate thing about de-powering the “box” is, if you have a built in navigation screen it may no longer work. the best solution to that would be buying a Garmin, or TomTom unit (they only recieve the sat info and use their own on-board maps to locate your position then stick it over the now useless screen in the dash in your car. These independent units can’t call someone if you are unconsious in a flaming wreck, but they can be taken with you and used anywhere… and no, they can’t track you (unless you call someone and report your position).
** ignorant doesn’t mean stupid..just lacking knowlege of something. But, unlike most Dems or Progs, we (Conservatives) know that ignor
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 3:45pmance HAS a cure…and we’re willing to take it.
Report Post »FEMALL
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:57pmRight. Your data is safe with us.
O=1 in 6 in poverty
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:44pmAll Auto manufacturers have devices similar to On-Star…Ford, Toyota, BMW, Volvo…all of them.
Report Post »Many of the cable boxes,(TiVo, etc), as well WiFi enabled TV’s etc
The10thAmendment
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:57pmGM should cancel their entire crappy company.
Report Post »M 4 Colt
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:21pmThe unit your talking about is a data logger it keeps track of how fast you drive when you push on the brakes how long the engine was on how many miles you went and so on. Just an FYI you insurance company can and will use this data against you to stop your insurance if you are in a crash if they find from reviewing the data that you were braking the law, say by going over the speed limit and causing a crash and you were at fault.
.It has happened before a guy driving a Corvette was in a crash and killed the guy in the other car and the insurance company used the info from the data logger to find out he was speeding before the crash so the insurance said since he was braking the law by speeding they dropped him and did not cover the cost of the crash. The corvette owner took the insurance company to court but lost the court said it was legal for the insurance company to use the data logger to decide if they were going to cover him or not because he was speeding and the was a violation of his policy . So please be careful out there because big brother is watching you.
Report Post »PoliticalJunkieToo
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:25pmM 4 Colt
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:21pm
The unit your talking about is a data logger it keeps track of how fast you drive
_________
M-Colt
Report Post »Can consumers remove the Data Logger from their vehicles?
Servant Of YHVH
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:32pmUhoh, government motors has been caught. Now the problem is “disappearing’ like all of the other illegal garbage the government has been attempting. Now the question is, will they actually end it or will it just be kept secret, not let anyone know about it and use it only for monitoring and tracking for obama’s cronies.
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:16pmNo,,,I’m talking about services with the same abilities as OnStar. Any car that you buy that has an onboard ability to get directions and cell service…Ford calls theirs “Sync” and also offers accident assistance, and operator assisted directions, just like OnStar
If you don’t want to be “tracked” just go into your trunk and unplug the power to the unit.. or get your dealer to do it.
Report Post »M 4 Colt
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:19pmPolitical. I am not sure if you can remove the data logger in your car or not it all depends if it is part of the cars CPU or if it’s a stand alone unit. If it‘s part of the CPU then the answer is no if it’s a stand alone unit then yes you can remove it. The best way to find out were its located in your car is to get a copy of the service manual for your car, that manual lists where every item in your car is located also in the manual you will be able to read to find out if the data logger in your car part of the CPU or not.
One more nice thing about having a copy of the service manual for your car is if its a GM model that has On Star it will tell you where the On Star unit is located and you can disconnect it just to make sure that On Star doesn’t go back on their word and start recording all that information about you and to be extra sure you can disconnect the antenna to the On Star unit using the information listed in the service manual too.
To find a copy of the service manual for your car you can go to the library, they may have a copy or you can look in the back of your owners manual that came with your car, if you look in the back of the owners manual it should have a order form, you can use that form to order you a copy but i warn you it will more than likely cost you over 100 bucks for a copy. One other place you can try is on line sometimes you can find someone who has a copy that will email you the info you need for your year, make and model.
Report Post »GrannyATL
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 7:09pmI heard that the GPS devices do the same thing. They can keep track of your mileage, your speed and your routes. Even the portable ones!
Does anyone else have information that confirms this?
Report Post »The10thAmendment
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 8:24pmThe answer to the question of whether or not they can still access the data if they choose to is yes. They can do it with any gps (good to 10 – 15 meters accuracy 2D) system or waas (accurate to 3 meters 3D.
Can it be disconnected? Sure it can but you better have an experienced tech take it out because, at least with on-star, it’s connected to all electronic aspects of your vehicle.
Disconnecting on-star at their office doesn’t change anything. Anytime they want they can track you.
Even hand held gps devises can be tracked. Super processors translate data faster than you can drive.
Report Post »fancydancy
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:43pmCustomer Service 1-888-466-7827
Report Post »fancydancy
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:12pmJust called them and they said they had reversed their policy but then I only had to give the model
Report Post »of my vehicle and year and name and she had the info immediately. She said it had been reversed in hopes of restoring consumer confidence. I said, “How will I know you did it as I trusted you the first time?” She just repeated that that Onstar had reversed their policy in hopes of restoring consumer confidence. Sigh.
CatB
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:27pmYou can also post comments and get responses on Facebook .. and then others can also comment .. I have been doing it since this came to light and it has gotten a LOT of negative comments!
Report Post »geo01
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:39pm.
Report Post »You don’t suppose this was implemented under the Obama Administration . . . do you? Perhaps there was an internal agreement between the administration and the former General Motors execs.
.
Or perhaps Government Motors new contacts in China suggested this form of unlawful search and seizure.
.
RepubliCorp
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 1:03amYes…I was told by a GM employee (management) that the government was looking into a mileage tax and using a on star type system to enforce. True? I don’t know maybe someone here will have something to add.
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:39pmGreat news…now you can all remove your tin-foil hats and the soup cans duct taped over your on-star antennae. You’ll still need the metal box to carry your cell phones in though.
Report Post »Just don’t get too complacent … you’ll still need to stalk your favorite celebrities without a GPS, use a pay phone to call in your bomb threats, never use a credit/debit card, register your car or get medical care. You may want to quit your job (taxes, SSN’s etc) too.
It’s getting almost impossible to stay off the grid. It would be simpler to make it illegal to use any info gathered by passive tracking as evidence (treat it like wiretaps or an illegal search).
Unbelievable
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:35pmSo you‘re saying because Big Brother is getting TOO BIG and the American people don’t like it that we all wear tin-foil hats? Well I don‘t like it so I guess I’ll wear my tin-foil hat..
Sure bet when Bush signed the Patriot Act you were up in arms about it… but bet you don’t give a rats azz now that Obama extended it…
Report Post »axel@25
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:54pmI can only assume that the handle “Unbelievable” refers to the amount of intelligence you lack.
Don‘t assume that just because someone says something you don’t understand, that they aren’t deeply opposed to Obama and all he stands for. I thought the Pat. Act was neccessary,..then
what you apparently can‘t grasp is the point that We’re being tracked almost every minute of every day, and unless you go to extreme measures you can’t avoid it…so keep you eyes open to all the intrusions. And rather than run around like one of the stereotypical “foil hatters” simply unplug the device if you have one and don’t want it.
They’re still going to track you through bar codes, credit card purchases, medical records, etc….
Oh and by the way…where does the OnStar unit get the info it sends to GM?…from the onboard computer and it’s built-in EDM system…that‘s what the insurance co’s might try to use to deny coverage and all new cars have them and can’t run without them.
By the way, auto insurance will still cover you even if you do something stupid or illegal…they can only refuse to continue your coverage…drunk and drive into a tree?-you’re covered, car stolen because you left the keys in it?-you’re covered, . They will use whatever info they have to determine fault and they will refuse to continue coverage. Also, it should be noted, the other driver who is lying about his culpability will also have his EDM scrutinized and it could save your financial
Report Post »mad_hatter
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:39pmGM HANDS OVER US TECHNOLOGY TO GET STIMULUS… FROM CHINA
Did you see that Government Motors and Government Electric are revealing to China US technology on Electrical Cars. ( http://url2it.com/hsfb ) They are doing this to claim Chinese stimulus money. That is US technology and China will steal that as well.
Report Post »AmericanLass
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:38pmEasy solution, don’t buy GM or any other product with SpyStar.
Report Post »tharpdevenport
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:37pm“We realize that our proposed amendments did not satisfy our subscribers,” OnStar President Linda Marshall.
Aren’t they just digging the hole DEEPER? Since when did ANY subscriber complaing feeling they weren’t satisfied with the lack of secret tracking in their OnStar device? Beck warned them about this, and they refused to listen. They didn’t “regret” the concern after Beck gave it to them. They seemed “confused” he would even drop them as advertizers over it.
And how do you even know they are NOT still doing it? I‘m reminded of that banking chain that was caught not shreading people’s personal information, just dumping it in the trash, even though they were supposed to be. They got caught, paid a fine, said they’d never do it again. A few years later, they were caught doing it again. I predict a few years from now some hacker will discover OnStar lied and was STILL tracking people.
Report Post »wisehiney
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:33pmGot instructions on how to disconnect from the internet. Just pulled out my tools to disconnect. I am still gonna disconnect.
Report Post »BARN-KAT
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:33pmWhy are my comments being removed???
Report Post »ZAP
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:43pmYour ONSTAR is doing it
Report Post »teddrunk
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:32pmGM is in bed with the Democrats. Why would anyone believe them?
Report Post »buzdburd
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 4:26pmMy thoughts exactly, Teddy!
Report Post »Kinda like why would anyone believe AlGore about Man-made Global Warming!!
Never trust a politician, especially if they have a (D) behind their name!
rpp
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:32pmI do not care what they claim their policy is, I will not purchase a vehicle with OnStar or similar technology unless I can disable it by pulling the fuse.
Report Post »Mil-Dot
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 5:15pmPull the fuse my ass. They could have it powered by another circuit as backup and you will never know it. I will take it out and take a fricking hammer to it.
Report Post »JohnofOregon
Posted on September 28, 2011 at 1:00ampulling the fuse on the older unit can work. you can actually remove the unit. since gm became government moters this is not completely the case. IE if on of my jeeps have a air sensor go bad it signals the computer to reduce power so you have to service it. I believe since the government now owns onstar they have interlocked the systems…………..I think the NEW engineers call this the Owell-brand-brotherly-interface-device. the microphone works both ways for your protection……there will be operational problems if the administration finds mary on the dash
Report Post »BARN-KAT
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:31pmI never liked GM and have never bought one. Onstar was a weird thing to me. However I do have a Ford with a box that tells all they say and is used if you get into a wreck it can be viewed. I don’t like that either. I heard all cars now have tracking devices on them. Does any one know if that is true.
Report Post »Kris
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:40pmI love GM vehicles. They may be the spawn of Satan from a capitalist’s point of view, but they make great cars that last. I will still be unhooking the power from my Onstar box this weekend. I even thought about installing a power toggle switch so I can use it when it suits me!
Report Post »jabberwock
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:29pmDon‘t feel like you’ve missed your opportunity to join the collective. “Progressive” Insurance will be glad to place a monitor in your car in return for a marginally reduced rate. It’s apparently not good enough to have a clean record to get optimal rates. How long until no one will be able to insure, and thus drive legally, without one? Safety first, little sheep.
Report Post »randy
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:28pmNever, and I mean NEVER, will I purchase another GM vehicle!
Report Post »Johnnyp1958
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:19pmThis is just one more reason to NEVER buy a Govt. Motors junk car…..
Report Post »Countrygirl1362
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:17pmSo they say. Do you really trust that they won’t be tracking and not telling?
Report Post »justice
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:17pmWe own a GM. My father retired from there. But, they will NEVER recieve another Purchase from this home or my Father whom worked there. He said they have disgraced themselves, meaning the Product. And The Union is also A Fallen Disgrace in my Fathers View.
Report Post »sumguyinohio
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:15pmJust another reason to buy Ford.
Report Post »Meyvn
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 9:16pmBeen buying Ford all my life. And will continue… but even they must not be completely trusted.
Report Post »Anonymous T. Irrelevant
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:11pmOnly AFTER so many people complained. Is that what it takes GM?
Report Post »SavingtheRepublic.com
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:10pmSooo they just admitted they were in fact doing this for any doubters out there!!!
Report Post »vennoye
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:15pmNow people have to decide IF they believe them now…
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:09pmWhy any person would voluntarily have OnStar in his vehicle is beyond me. This is beyond the question of the wisdom of buying an inferior GM automobile, of course.
Report Post »BurntHills
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:06pmthank God we didn’t ever have the national socialist Government Motors vehicles near our family to begin with
Report Post »vennoye
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:13pmAmen!!
Report Post »BurntHills
Posted on September 27, 2011 at 3:05pmGB saying to his radio audience of millions to “CUT THE ONSTAR CABLES” must have really rattled those obamaite big-brother communists.
Report Post »