Italy on the Brink of Collapse…And These Are the Two Options for Saving It
- Posted on November 28, 2011 at 6:57am by
Becket Adams
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It seems that with each new story from the eurozone, things are becoming more and more serious.
The latest worry is that the financial situation in Italy, which apparently caught many by surprise, will lead to complete catastrophe for the 17-nation union. Currently, there are two solutions being considered by EU leaders:
- The European Central Bank (ECB) intervenes and underwrite the debt with Euro bonds.
- The International Monetary Fund (IMF) simply bails Italy out with cash.
“How could we be so close to the brink?” writes Bruce Krasting.
He continues:
At this point there is zero possibility that Italy can refinance any portion of its $300b of 2012 maturing debt. If there is anyone at the table who [still] thinks that Italy can pull off a miracle, they are wrong. I’m certain that the finance guys at the ECB and Italian CB understand this. I repeat, there is a zero chance for a market solution for Italy.
He then goes on to make the sad but astute observation: “Either the ECB (aka Germany) steps in and underwrites the debt with some form of Euro bonds or the IMF (a.k.a the USA [the U.S. supplies about 20 percent of the IMF's funding]) steps in with some very serious money.”
And he is right about Germany stepping in to underwrite the debt. As they are currently the most stable and economically resourceful of the eurozone, much of the pressure has fallen on them to “fix” things.
In fact, it is being reported that Germany faces mounting pressure to let the ECB save the euro.
“With bond market vultures circling even gold-plated economies and Italy’s La Stampa daily citing IMF officials on a rescue plan worth up to 600 billion euros, another of Germany’s closest allies broke ranks, leaving Berlin isolated,” the Associated Press reports.
Amid predictions that the common currency faces its death throes within weeks without radical intervention, Austria joined Finland in backing ECB action to stem the financial market contagion threatening Italy, Spain and even France.
The pressure has intensified since Germany itself struggled to raise public finance on commercial money markets last week.
“The European Central Bank could perform a more powerful role, as in the United States,” Austrian Prime Minister Werner Faymann said, also giving his support to the creation of commonly-issued eurobonds.
“It could itself buy states’ bonds,” he said on the sidelines of a congress of European Socialist parties in Brussels.
Clearly, the race is on to prevent interest rates for Italy or Spain from skyrocketing to the levels that forced Greece, Ireland and Portugal to accept multi-billion bailout EU-IMF loans.
But there is a catch to this. If Italy accepted a multi-billion bailout, it wouldn’t end there. As the economist Milton Friedman once wrote, “There’s no such thing as a free lunch.”
“In the real world of global finance the reality is that any country that is forced to accept an IMF bailout is also blocked from issuing debt in the public markets,” Krasting writes.
“IMF (or other supranational debt) is ALWAYS senior to other indebtedness of the country. That’s just the way it works. When Italy borrows money from the IMF it automatically subordinates the existing creditors. Lenders hate this. They will vote with their feet and take a pass at Italian new debt issuance for a long time to come. Once the process starts, it will not end. There will be a snow ball of other creditors.”
The scope for direct ECB action at primary level, as long sought by U.S., British and other G7 partners among the world’s most powerful economies, will be the unspoken nub of euro finance ministers’ talks night in Brussels.
“I think we have seen that if there is nothing else left then we can think about strengthening the role of the ECB,” Finland’s finance minister Jutta Urpilainen said.
In Strasbourg last week for a mini-summit with France and Italy, German Chancellor Angela Merkel held out against the idea, saying “politicians should not intervene in ECB decision-making.”
“The French president has just underlined that the European Central Bank is independent,” she said.
“All three of us said that with respect for the independence of this institution, one should refrain from positive or negative demands of the ECB,” French President Nicolas Sarkozy interjected.
The Financial Times Deutschland interpreted that exchange as proof that France, the most vociferous eurozone backer of a turbo-charged ECB role at the heart of the continent’s politics, was winning the day.
“By committing to silence, Merkel and Sarkozy are freeing the ECB to make a more forceful intervention in the crisis,” it said.
The Associated Press contributed to this story.
(h/t Business Insider)
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Comments (126)
jakartaman
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:26amAll these machinations are just postponing the inevitable world economic collapse.
Report Post »1850 here we come!
Unix
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:36amyep, not going to end well for anyone. between gov’t corruption and corp greed, what do we have left?
Report Post »Stoic one
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:16amforgive my ignorance, what happened in 1850?
Report Post »Stoic one
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:23amjust read the compromise of 1850.
Report Post »JRook
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 11:16amThe non-stop crisis in Europe is being manufactured for the sole purpose of undermining both the sovereignty and policies in the targeted countries. Primarily as they relate to unions and social programs. The guise is the EU, but as always it is the wealthy and large corporations in the background pulling the strings.
Report Post »JMorcan
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 11:18amWe’re headed for a global depression. Only emerging Asian countries like China will survive.
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 11:54amOh please JROOK.
A corporation cannot pull a single lever to make something law. Stop blaming people with no governmental power, because your idols of government are too corrupt to say “no” to power and money. End of the day, Microsoft cannot pass a single law in Congress, only Congress can pass laws.
The leftist canard that “it’s them there eeeebil corporations” is idiocy. It absolves the corrupt sinners and blames the temptation.
Report Post »Mr Sanders
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 2:12pmI agree… Everyone…. get prepared. How many bond offerings and debt extensions have to be discussed or debated before the rest of Europe catches up with the topic; It would be best for them to make a final fix, draw a line in the sand, say when, tell the people to prepare, and let the chips fall where they may. The Debt Monster will more than likely come after US next… since we are such class acts and dumped $BILLIONS into the IMF to help push the beast back.
In the end, there will be no amount of money, or even enough duct tape to hinder the beast’s escape.
Better to accept the facts…. than believe the lies an spin of,”… we’ll strike a deal” Germany can’t take much more, if not, beyond their real breaking point.
Report Post »bhohater
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 2:14pmIt‘s gonna be more like Orwell’s 1984. Friedman was right; there’s no such thing as a free lunch. Predictably, all the socialist nations are falling like dominoes. Who will save us—China?
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 6:10pmVery simply the EU will change. It will either disolve or reduce itself to fewer member states. The UK is telling it’s embassies to have plans for a change from the Euro and for civil unrest. Financial institutions are now testing the old plumbing to see how it will handle a return to former European currencies. The only way for the EU to survive is for Brussels to control the member states’ economies..essentially…giving up their sovereignty. Germany has to assure bondholders of their investments. These are highly unlikely to take place. Up until now EU member have simply thrown money at the problem while not acknowledging serious infrastructure and governmental issues with member states. There is no where else for the EU to go.
Report Post »AvengerK
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 6:14pmJROOK…it’s very difficult to accept your “it‘s the rich guy’s fault” buffoonery knowing that the EU is run by an aristocracy of socialists. Quite simply, member states have tried to live off Germany and France but contributing next to nothing to the EU while maintaining unsustainable cradle-to-the-grave entitlement programmes. Very simply, their socialism‘s bill has come due and they can’t pay for it. Please…stop insulting these boards with your adolescent interjections.
Report Post »Ookspay
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 6:55pmChina is a house of cards. They need the West waaaayyyy more than we need them. If(when) world markets collpase and Chinese exports stop, China will have 1 billion angry trinket makers to deal with.
The sooner the collapse the better. The US can survive better than any nation on Earth. We have natural resources and the worlds best farm lands. Soon it will come down to food, water and the basics. There will be a lot of pain as the new reality takes hold.
Report Post »Unix
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:37pmWhat has FED MORE PEOPLE – Greed or Charity?
Ask yourself that question…the answer…
Greed, for without “self interest’, there would not be charity.
Just think about that for a minute. Not all are greedy, not all are charitable, but overal, man has a good nature, execpt when poisoned by ideology.
Sgt Unix Crust
Report Post »God Bless America
chicago76
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:25amGermany is pressuring the rest of Europe to take over the financial problems of Europe thru the European Union. Germany will bail out the other countries if Germany is allowed to basically take over their governments. He who controls the wallet controls the country. That is what is going on in simplest terms right now in Europe. The politicians in the countries of Europe are becoming so desperate that they may be will to jump at the German gold ring. If they do, Germany will enact measures to control Euro spending that will cut deeply into their budgets. There will be even more rioting in the streets and then who will be the savior of the countries of Europe? Who will have to send in their troops to quell the rioting, any guesses, Germany of course. German troops controlling the various countries of Europe. Hmmm. Bet it is not called an invasion by Germany. Probably will just call it a police action.
Report Post »angelonquest2000
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 4:14pmit not germany that wants control. it is the world banks and IMF that want control. germany has had enough. read http://www.telegraph.co.uk/
Report Post »Mikev5
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 6:03pmI agree [Germany that wants control ] that is not what they want that’s like saying yo all you dead beats send me your bills I will be happy to pay them. NOT… and ridiculous to say
Report Post »GTH
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:22am@Decendent: I don’t think for one minute that man has done/could do enough to affect Earth’s atmosphere.
Report Post »These “environmentalists”, as they call themselves, are lunatic fanatics. They are akin to radical muslims.
You’re kidding, right?
When I was a kid I could kneel down next to any stream around my house and take a long cool drink.
Last time I tried that about 4-5 years ago I was sick for 3 days, in between the bed and the bathroom.
How about fishing? Have you been fishing lately? There are posters at every lake pond and river not to eat more than one fresh water fish per week because of heavy metal pollutants.
What! Was you born and raised in a cave, or are you so used to drinking chlorine and breathing smog that it has effected your brain?
jnobfan
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:49amIts called over-population. When you were growing up there were 50% less people living in the U.S and 65% less people in the world. The only way to feed them is the use of massive amounts of fertilizer and pestisides. The truth is we are heading for wars and suffering of biblical proportions in your lifetime because of overpopulation. It will be blamed on political and religious differences but the cause is really too many people. We can blog and vote and blog and vote but nothing can stop what is coming down due to too many people. Be prepared or don’t. The less people the better off those of us who are preparing to be self-sufficient will be.
Report Post »Jaycen
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 2:56pmThis is the nutiest thing I’ve seen in a long time. Who told you it was a good idea to drink from a stream or pond? Those usually full of micro-organisms that will give you the squirts.
Where do you live that has so much polution? I live in Missouri, and there are no such notices on our lakes and rivers.
And to the twit who subscribes to Mathus’ view of the world, there’s no such thing as “over-population”. That’s a bogeyman concocted to frighten children. Please point out the scarcity of resources that’s led to wide-spread starvation in the US or any Western country for that matter. Please, I’m dying to see the link.
Report Post »StrangernFiction
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:20amSo much for the ‘rats employing the “it works in Europe” meme. Bwahahahah!
Report Post »starman70
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:15amTo Becket Adams, A well written and insightful article.
American politicians, along with politicians in European countries will not face the reality of what is happening. Basically, the problem is they don’t care as long as the sheep keep reelecting them. When it all comes crashing down, those politicians will be sitting pretty while the general populace will be broke, hungry and living on the streets. The leadership of every union in America don’t care as long as their nests are feathered. To hell with the rank and file, It‘s all about the leadership’s well being. The union members just can’t see it. Neither could the union members in the eurozone see what their leadership was doing to to them.
In America, the debt problem is an 80/40 proposition. 80% Democrat and 40% Republican (RINO) who have voted for ever increasing government spending and welfare schemes and more and more debt to fund their excesses. Same as Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, France, Iceland and to a lesser degree Britain and the Scandavanian countries have and are doing.
When the house of cards collapses world wide and every country is in total meltdown both financially and millions are rioting worldwide, a “Savior” will appear. he will present a solution to the crisis and the world will follow him into the abyss of the “One World Government”. It’s coming! All of us over 60 may not live to see it but our children, grand children and great-grandchildren will.
Report Post »hugecatfish
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:22amAs fast as these politicians are working to collapse the system, you may just get to see it. Don’t be fooled, they already have their shadow goverment in place.
Report Post »suzy000
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:10amThe article said that “IMF is ALWAYS senior to the indebtedness of the country”. Can someone PLEASE tell that to Obama and Secretary Chu?
Report Post »Watchingtheweasels
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:24amSo the options are: other european countries underwrite Italy, or they get America to. Wonder which option they will choose.
Report Post »Southernsoul
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:09amThis is what I just don’t understand about people. Obviously what you‘re doing is wrong and still you don’t change what you’re doing, you just make it possible to keep doing it. Either let Italy collapse, and Europe suffers the consequences, or print so much more money that everyone suffers. What’s wrong with changing what you are doing?
Report Post »hugecatfish
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:27amYou’re assuming that they want something else. Why would they change it when they are so close to achieving what they’ve been working for over the past 70 years.
Report Post »GhostOfJefferson
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 11:02amThe progressives are dogmatic. As with all dogmatic people, the faith is never wrong, and if there is a perceived failure with the faith, that simply points to a failure in others, as the faith is perfect, infallible and correct at all times. They simply cannot admit failure and will do even *more* of what’s causing the issue, since the problem obviously (to them) lay elsewhere and not with them and their dogma.
The more real life progressives/leftists I meet, the more this observation is confirmed to me. Admitting doctrinal failure is not an option and not even conceivable to them.
Report Post »Southernsoul
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 1:21pmYou guys are right. People locked into any mind-set often can’t see that it is their beliefs that are in error, not the rest of the world. And that just goes to show how stupid they are. One test of intelligence is how well you process facts and derive an appropriate response. It doesn’t matter how hard you press on the red crayon, its not going to color blue.
Report Post »hempstead1944
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:59amGet ready America ! Socialism is coming !
Report Post »762x51
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 1:19pmNot while I can still hold a weapon in my hands. If I can breathe, I can fight.
Sic Semper Tyrannis.
Report Post »chicago76
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 1:49pmTotal poverty and depression is coming. The elites will take control of all the property and call it wealth redistribution, then there will be poverty like America and the world has never seen before.
Report Post »wbalzley
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 5:37pmToo late…Socialism is already here…
Report Post »opnsrcsurvival
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:58amWhen are Joe Sixpack and friends going to wake up and realize whats going on and what is about to happen?
I’ll tell you when, when they and their children are living in a panel van like the kids in the other story . Wonder if their false Idols like Paterno and Tressel will help them out?
Oh nevermind the game will be on at the shelter so life is ok.
Spend two hours learning to do something for yourself rather than watching a bunch of thugs throw a ball around, cause when this economic storm hits, watching tv is not going to feed your kids .
http://www.opensourcesurvival.com
Report Post »hugecatfish
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:58amWhat is happening is all part of the master plan. The IMF/World Bank was designed to launder money from the industrialized nations to any one else. These organizations were created by Fabian Socialist for goodness sakes. The ultimate goal is one world gov’t/monetary system. With Europe falling, the US will soon be asked for way more than 20% of the IMF funds, which will further accelerate the dollars decline. We need to stop funding the IMF, get out of the UN, and abolish the Federal Reserve – NOW. The rest of the world will accuse of being hate-mongers, not wanting to feed the hungry, blah blah blah. It’s past time for some self-preservation. That sound like a good third option to me.
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:20amYeah isn’t it great, doesn’t it make you feel good? How ’bout this one: nations use the Reserve Currency “$” to buy things they need from other nations. Poor nations have been over 40 years able to buy less and less which starves their people, meanwhile idiotic people and nations send ships, airplanes full of food to those nations so they can have more children to starve, all while the dollar loses more value. Isn’t it an awesome system? You all must be proud Americans.
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:22amMeanwhile you are helping to feed the misery of those nations, your tax dollars are also going to fund abortions in those nations. Doesn’t all that make you feel great? And you say, “I’m proud to be an American.”
Report Post »hugecatfish
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:16amIn case there was any question. I do love my country and will fight for her if necessary. What I do not love, is the lies, manipulation, and pure deceit our politicians have been shoveling on the American people for decades. You sound as if you are also aware of this. If so, then use that knowledge to help educate instead of insult. Stand for Liberty and Freedom – or stand opposed.
Report Post »chicago76
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 1:43pmThese world banks,by controlling currency, are creating the hunger and depression of the third world. They are doing the same things to Europe and the US now.
Report Post »chicago76
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 1:46pmWe can buy more from them. They can buy less from us and themselves. By devaluing the dollars we give them, we impoverish the poor countries of the world while we enrich ourselves.
Report Post »angelonquest2000
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 4:21pmaccording to what i read in the telegragh.co.uk/ merkel is over here with oblamea and they are discussing setting up the one world government. the IMF is headquarters in DC…convient???
Report Post »hi
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:57amNo problem Italy, the USA will borrow some money and bail you out.
Report Post »Or we could tax the rich, which is stealing, but libs think is being fiscally conservative.
Berbel73
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:23amSo their solution is to either monetize the debt, or just throw more money at it. Take a good look people this is our future that we’re getting a glimpse of.
Report Post »Delta D-5-3
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:35amLook at the news today. EVERYTHING is right with the world, and the markets are to open higher, WAY higher today! What??????
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:54amYep, and meanwhile they are building a slave society in America, because all that money they are throwing at it, all that money they are monetizing, will have to come out of someone’s Liberty.
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:58amMoney has always only really translated from one thing getting taken away from Liberty – work, work, and or slavery. Do you think the elitists are planning on working in a field 12 hours per day?
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:01amAh, do you feel the unsettling fire coming down from the high regions of your mind? Saying, “Oh that‘s why the Founding Father’s of America only wanted Gold and silver to be used.”
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:03amOh that’s right you arrogant people, the Founding Fathers of America were hundreds of years ahead of you in thought and logic. And you think you are so smart.
Report Post »100 Million Patriots Standing
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:07amAs we attempt to make plans to get rid of the Democratic Socialist in our government in 2012….the Blaze is helping them to stay in power.
See the ad interwoven in the article and elsewhere on here.
Americans Elect’ is an internet voting scheme to have direct representation of the primary process by throwing a third candidate into the mix. Internet voters would choose a candidate and then that candidate would have his name on all ballots in the US. right beside the traditional republican or democrat. To add insult to injury this bazaar scheme requires the winner to choose a vice president of an opposing party. So as to weaken the ticket even though they present it in more glowing terms.
The plan is obviously legal and I believe already in place in most states.
I sent a note to the Blaze to see if they would report on it, or if they already did, but no response.
Since Obamas team and supporters are clearly in place for the re-election battle, a third candidate would pull much more from the Republican side of the ballot.
A third candidate, which would more than likely be a conservative or a libertarian would hand Obama the win without much of a fight at all….as if we did not have a struggle to save our nation from Socialist ruin, it makes me sick to see ‘our side’ allowing ad space for the opposition whose only intention is to divide and conquer….what people won’t do for a buck….and we all know that with voter fraud expected to be rampant how easy
Report Post »Eliasim
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:13am100 Million Patriots Standing,
Report Post »Oh will you stuff it already! You among many just don’t get it yet, no matter who gets in they will probably move to preserve Fiat Power, and money derived from Fiat. Are you ignoramuses seeing yet how much more intelligent the Founding Fathers were than you even yet? Gadgets and the easiness of life doesn’t make someone intelligent.
Unix
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:24amThe markets have gone insane, the EU is finished, kaput, and all they are doing now is trying to avoid complete collapse, but trying to kick the can down the road, problem is they’ve kicked this can so much, there is little left to kick. Our markets see this a as good thing? Yes, this will happen to us, no stopping it now, just a matter of time.
Report Post »abbygirl1994
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:53amOh sure ask America to help bail you out.. and your two options suck. How about instead you get rid of your leaders who have brought you to the brink.. Thats whats needs to be done here… Prison time is needed by all leaders who have brought us to our brink! God help us!
Report Post »Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:19amI choose option three — The US leaves the UN/IMF and lets the EU go under on its own; and at the same time impeach Obama for the crimes of economic terrorism he is commiting.
Report Post »Delta D-5-3
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:28amWait a minute!! In looking at CNBC and the other financial websites, the dow is to open 200+ points today!? WHY??? The EURO is about to collapse, and the markets are opening WAY HIGHER???? Am I the only one to see something VERY WRONG here????
Report Post »smithclar3nc3
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:09amExactly and not a fenced in dude ranch Prison some more along the line of Mexican or Turkish prison. Fact is our prison systems need to de-evolve when prisoners have more rights and privledges than our law abiding citizens something is wrong. The fact is when you commit crimes that require prison sentences your rights should be revoked. No rights to cables,hvac,libraries,privacy,gyms, or any other privledges. And if you murder someone you should be banished from the country if you come back you face a death sentence and anyone who caught helping you faces banishment. we need a civilized society with a moral compass if America is to be saved
Report Post »DaveOregon
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:53amOur stock market will rise as the EU fails because many companies/investors will see the US and the dollar as the “safer” bet – so a short rally – say 6-months worth will ensue as EU fails. However, it’s short lived rise. Because the US economy is not getting better -a nd china’s economy is starting to falter big time – because they’ve been artificially propping up their economy as well as the yuan. Once EU fails – China can’t keep that artificial uan going. So worldwide market collapse occurs within months of EU collapse.
Report Post »paulusmaximus
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:42amSocialists are stupid! That’s it.
Report Post »cemerius
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:39am“By committing to silence, Merkel and Sarkozy are freeing the ECB to make a more forceful intervention in the crisis,” it said.
Oh yes!! People laugh when there is mention of a “one world order” France and Germany seem to be subjugating themselves to the ECB (European Central Bank)!!
Report Post »heavywx
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:36amIt is a house of cards, and when it comes tumbling down ours is soon to follow.
Report Post »SpankDaMonkey
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:34am.
And These Are the Two Options for Saving It:
1. Flush
2. Don’t Flush
Report Post »cemerius
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:40amFlush three times to make sure! :)
Report Post »dsind
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 9:56amIts a double flusher.
Report Post »blue_sky
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:33amOption #3 – Default to private bankers without actually collapsing (study Iceland case.)
Back to more important stuff – the latest youtube clip exposing Gingrich goes viral on the Internet
Report Post »http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1RKPfMqGOg
(spread the message, expose this liar)
qpwillie
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:46amThat video wouldn’t be some sort of an ad for Ron Paul, would it? I don‘t even need to watch it because I know that’s what it is. You Paulies think you’re so clever. hahahahahahahah!!!!!!
Report Post »motocrossed
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:18amCall me crazy but I dont think this or any electoin in the near future is relevant at this point!
Report Post »Baddoggy
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:32amLet the whole thing collapse. Let’s take our medicine worldwide and get on with it…If you rescue it, it will need rescuing agaain later. I say burn baby burn.
Report Post »ronaldreaganthegreat
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:28amSocialism=bwhahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Report Post »decendentof56
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:21amYet, after all the problems in Europe caused by unsustainable Socialist forms of government, we still have the U.S. Democratic Socialists attempting to deamonize anyone who dare say we should cut ANY social-welfare programs.
Report Post »Problems are heading our way. OK, they are already here!
Gonzo
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:21amPretty amazing isn’t it? I think most Americans believe we’re just going to keep on trucking and everything will be fine.
Report Post »GTH
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:18amIt’s all being orchestrated by the elite and on purpose to slow energy consumption and control global warming and pollution. But they can‘t just say that because some people don’t believe that we are using up energy like a keg of gunpowder under a rocket launch. Or, global warming. Or, pollution.
Report Post »Some people are actually related to the Ostrich. Which we all know buries it’s head in the sand, but in this case it’s hot, dry, polluted sand.
decendentof56
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:29amIf the “elite” think they can control global-warming, then wait for the Sun’s next flare-up to reach our atmosphere. Idiots- using- idiots pretty much sums it up.
Report Post »Baddoggy
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:30amEnviromental midget above…
Report Post »decendentof56
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:43amYou’re such a baaaaaad-doggy! Correct, but baaaaad!
Report Post »Oh, and I hope you are speaking of GTH and not me! I don’t think for one minute that man has done/could do enough to affect Earth’s atmosphere.
These “environmentalists”, as they call themselves, are lunatic fanatics. They are akin to radical muslims.
lel2007
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:51amNo, not orchestrated, it’s just time to pay the bills. Italy, Greece, America, and others are living off a credit card. At some point payment must be made or backers of those credit cards (Bond holders) lose. It’s really not all that complicated.
Report Post »lel2007
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:59amSo the ‘elite’ are doing a good thing by trying to save the world from global warming and pollution by causing world economies to collapse ?
Report Post »decendentof56
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:04am*******…..
You are right about the various fronts that are attacking our Capitalistic form of government.
Of course, then there are the real-life consequences of those fronts. Businesses can’t even get to the point of start-up, due to “environmental concerns” and the resulting, never-ending “environmental” studies, and jobs are therefore not created.
It’s been part of the “overload the system” plan since Cloward and Piven. Yet, there are so many who will vote to put those who want to take down Capitalism for the much-superior Socialistic forms of government.
Report Post »Obama_Sham
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 8:43am“Some people are actually related to the Ostrich. Which we all know buries it’s head in the sand, but in this case it’s hot, dry, polluted sand.”
Or… Some people (read environmental lunatics) are so brainwashed that they have their heads buried so far up their own a$$e$, they can see their tonsils…
Report Post »Unix
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 10:10amWhat AFFECTS our climate the MOST, is that disc in the sky called the SUN! Next comes volcanos. Weather is cyclical, and believe me, man cannot touch what nature does.
Let me ask one question? Why is GREENLAND called GREENLAND? Because, when it was discovered by the Vikings, it was GREEN, covered by grasses, shrubs and snow free. Gee, I wonder how many SUVayyys were running back then, or how many coal fired plants were running? Zero, that is the truth. Man may contribute to the environment in a negative way, but in no way is it affecting our atmosphere in the ways these environmentalists say, they lie, cheat and cook the books to make their lie believable.
Report Post »I_can't_believe_this_stuff
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:13amThey can also gut the pensions, investments and retirement accounts of their senior citizens to continue funding the excesses of their socialist state. Why not; It works here …
Report Post »decendentof56
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:36amNo-No…..No union pensions are to be touched!
I had a talk with my late-sister’s husband yesterday. He is a retired school administrator. He firmly believes that teachers should pay a portion of their healthcare costs. He makes the obvious point that why, exactly, should they not pay, since they made excellent money in their working years.
My bro-in-law has made that exceedingly clear to his friends/former colleagues,. Some of those colleagues will not even speak to him! Can you believe it!
Report Post »NOTAMUSHROOM
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:08amSocialism is great until you run out of other people’s money.
Report Post »-Margaret Thatcher
grudgywoof
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:07amI don’t understand any of this crap. Is there money? Will they just electronically print money? What good is that because you can’t make nothing from nothing can you? It seems like a house of cards to me and they are just adding one more card, soon the whole thing comes down.
Report Post »louise
Posted on November 28, 2011 at 7:39amGrudgywolf,
It is never too late to start seeking the truth. Here is a good place to get you started.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0LRQhxy0Mc
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