Faith

‘Jesus Saves’: Group Threatens Lawsuit Over Church’s 26-Foot Cross Placed on Public Land in Indiana

Crosses on public property have a way of creating angst among secularists. In Rhode Island, atheists are fighting a World War I and II memorial that includes the religious symbol. Then, there’s the Mt. Soledad War Memorial in San Diego — yet another target for those embracing non-belief. The latest dispute, though, is taking place in Dugger, Indiana, where a 26-foot cross that has the message “Jesus Saves” on it has become ground zero in the debate surrounding the First Amendment.

Americans United Threatens to Sue Over Cross in Dugger, Indiana

Photo Credit: WLFI

Americans United for Separation of Church and State, an organization that consistently advocates against religion in the public square, is threatening to sue over the cross’ presence, as it is currently on a public plot of land (you can read the complaint here). Here’s a portion of the group’s threatening letter that was sent to the town:

We have received a complaint that since 2010, the Town of Dugger has displayed a large cross—bearing the phrase “Jesus Saves”—on Town land. Although the cross was built by a local church, then-Town Council President Bill Pirtle acknowledged that “the town of Dugger owns the property, and it’s just like putting it in our yard.” … We also understand that the Town plans to install a sign for the Town’s schools next to the cross and that the Town is considering supplying electricity to both the cross and the sign. See id. Because the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution prohibits the government from promoting religion on public land or financing efforts to do the same, we request that the Town promptly transfer the cross to a private entity for display on private property and cancel any plans to provide electricity or other financial support to the display or maintenance of the cross.

The cross was placed on the land by Faith Community Church, a local house of worship in the small 955-person town. Following local government approval, it was erected two years ago near a high school baseball field.

“It‘s a pretty flagrant display of the government saying ’this is a Christian town,’” Gregory Lipper, senior counsel of the AUSCS, told Fox News. “Everyone gets freedom of religion…just because Christianity is this country‘s religious majority doesn’t mean that they get to put their thumb on the scale and use taxpayer dollars.”

With the church-state separatist group calling the continued placement of the cross “unconstitutional,” the town is faced with a difficult decision. The land that the symbol is on costs only $3,000 and residents cannot afford a lengthy and costly court battle to defend it. So, according to Dugger Town Board President Dwight Nielsen, the land may be sold to a group of churches in an effort to ease tensions.

Shawn Farris, pastor of Faith Community Church, rejects the notion that the town was endorsing Christianity by allowing the church to erect the cross.

“We wanted people to be able to see what the message of the cross represents and get it out to the world in need,” Farris told Fox. ”We knew it was okay because when you look at the separation between church and state, it‘s just a fact that the government couldn’t tell people how to worship…it would be the same if they allowed a crescent moon to be put up.”

The town board’s decision to remove the cross may be rectified if churches purchase the land. In this instance, the symbol wouldn‘t need to be moved and the government’s involvement with the land would no longer be of issue.

(H/T: Fox News)

Comments (139)

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  • Bamabelle
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:19am

    Atheists and their like will not be happy until we all are worshipping under their religion…of non religion. That way we can do and say anything immoral without consequenses. Gays can marry or not and drug addicts can do drugs, drink, gamble, without fear of someone telling them that an almighty God will be there to judge them in the end or that others who fear him and do right will judge them. This is surely what this is all about. I don’t judge, that is for God to do but I do not approve either. They will have to live with their sins, not me.

    Report Post » Bamabelle  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:28am

      No,I could care less about your religion, just do not pollute PUBLIC LAND with your myths. Place the cross on land owned by the preacher or the church, PRIVATE LAND. This is a clear violation of the Constitution’s Establishment Clause. Keep your religion private.

      Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:15am

      John Adams in a speech to the military in 1798 warned his fellow countrymen stating, “We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion . . . Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams is a signer of the Declaration of Independence, the Bill of Rights and our second President.

      Founder and fellow creator of this nation. All else is irrelevant. This IS what this nation was founded upon.

      Report Post »  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:31am

      Adams wasn’t especially fond of religion, particularly Christianity. he has but ONE quote where he is even remotely kind to religion, and you posted it. go look for some other grenades he tossed directly at the Church. you’ll find plenty.

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:43am

      Well, you have something to say against everything in spite of the light that shines. The Judeo-Christians were not arguing over whether to include religious laws, but WHICH ones. They couldn’t pick from just Jewish, Protestant, Catholic, Angelican.. They chose the common from all, and could not narrow down the wisdom to a particular sect.
      Keep trying deviant. Your outlines are showing.

      Report Post »  
    • Gold Coin & Economic News
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:53am

      @encinom Please don’t pollute public land with your anti-god myths by walking anywhere on state owned property. You are offensive.

      Report Post » Gold Coin & Economic News  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 1:55pm

      On Feb. 22, 1756, J. Adams made the entry in his diary: “Suppose a nation in some distant Region should take the Bible for their only law Book, and every member should regulate his conduct by the precepts there exhibited! Every member would be obliged in conscience, to temperance, frugality, and industry; to justice, kindness, and charity towards his fellow men; and to piety, love, and reverence toward Almighty God…What a Eutopia, what a Paradise would this region be.”

      In 1756, Adams made this diary entry, “The great and Almighty author of nature, who at first established those rules which regulate the world, can as easily suspend those laws whenever his providence sees sufficient reason for such suspension. This can be no objection, then, to the miracles of Jesus Christ. Although some very thoughtful and contemplative men among the heathen attained a strong persuasion of the great principles of religion, yet the far greater number, having little time for speculation, gradually sunk into the grossest opinions and the grossest practices. These…could not be made to embrace the true religion till their attention was roused by some astonishing and miraculous appearances. The reasoning of philosophers…could not overcome the force of prejudice, custom, passion, and bigotry. But when wise and virtuous men commissioned from heaven, by miracles awakened men’s attention to their reasonings, the force of truth made its way with ease to their minds.”

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 1:57pm

      In 1765, Adams published his “Essay on the Canon and Feudal Law.” It informed colonists of how their ancestors escaped persecution but retained their rights and privileges. In conclusion, He exclaims, “let the pulpit resound with the doctrines and sentiments of religious liberty. Let us hear the danger of thralldom to our consciences, from ignorance, extreme poverty and dependence, in short, from civil and political slavery. Let us see delineated before us, the true map of man – let us hear the dignity of his nature, and the noble rank he holds among the works of God! that consenting to slavery is a sacrilegious breach of trust, as offensive in the sight of God, as it is derogatory from our own honour, or interest, of happiness; and that God Almighty has promulgated from heaven, liberty, peace, and good will to man.”

      Adams wrote to his wife regarding the opening session of the First Congress: “When the Congress met, Mr. Cushing made a motion that it should be opened with Prayer. It was opposed by Mr. Jay of New York, and Mr. Rutledge of South Carolina because we were so divided in religious sentiments…that we could not join in the same act of worship. Mr. Samuel Adams arose and said that he was no bigot, and could hear a Prayer from any gentleman of Piety and virtue, who was at the same time a friend to his Country. …Accordingly, next morning \[Reverend Mr. Duche'\] …read several prayers…and read…the thirty-fifth Psalm.”

      Report Post »  
    • whatswrongwithyou
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 1:59pm

      What’s wrong with the Cross?
      prothink.tv/?p=3001

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:00pm

      On June 21, 1776, John Adams wrote: “Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free Constitution is pure Virtue, and if this cannot be inspired into our People in a greater Measure, than they have it now, they may change their Rulers and the forms of Government, but they will not obtain a lasting liberty.”

      In 1777, Dr. Benjamin Rush wrote his comments regarding John Adams: “He was a stranger to dissimulation, and appeared to be more jealous of his reputation for integrity than for talents or knowledge. He was strictly moral, and at all times respectful to religion. In speaking of the probable issue of the war he said to me in Baltimore in the winter of 1777, ‘We shall succeed in our struggle, provided we repent of our sins, and forsake them,’ and then he added, ‘I will see it out, or go to heaven in its ruins.’

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:02pm

      In a letter to Judge F.A. Van der Kemp on Jan. 13, 1815, Adams stated: “I have searched after truth by every means and by every opportunity in my power, and with a sincerity and impartiality, for which I can appeal to God, my adored Maker. My religion is founded on the love of God and my neighbor; in the hope of pardon for my offenses; upon contrition; upon the duty as well as the necessity of supporting with patience the inevitable evils of life; in the duty of doing no wrong, but all the good I can, to the creation, of which I am but an infinitesimal part. I believe, too, in a future state of rewards and punishments…”

      In a letter to Jefferson on June 28, 1813, Adams wrote: “The general principles, on which the Fathers achieved independence, were the only Principles in which that beautiful Assembly of young Gentlemen could Unite. …And what were these general Principles? I answer, the general Principles of Christianity, in which all these Sects were United: And the general Principles of English and American Liberty, in which all those young Men United, and which had United all Parties in America, in Majorities sufficient to assert and maintain her Independence. Now I will avow, that I then believe, and now believe, that those general Principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the Existence and Attributes of God; and that those Principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human Nature and our terrestrial, mundane System.”

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:03pm

      While discussing the Barbary conflict with Jefferson, President Adams declared: “The policy of Christendom has made cowards of all their sailors before the standard of Mahomet. It would be heroical and glorious in us to restore courage to ours.” President Adams, along with Congress, ratified the Treaty of Tripoli in 1797. The treaty of Tripoli remained on the books for eight years, at which time the treaty was renegotiated, and Article 11 was dropped.

      In Adams’ inaugural address, he stated: “…the representatives of this nation…not only broke to pieces the chains which were forging and the rod of iron that was lifted up, but frankly cut asunder the ties which had bound them… With humble reverence, I feel it to be my duty to add, if a veneration for the religion of a people who profess and call themselves Christians, and a fixed resolution to consider a decent respect for Christianity among the best recommendations for the public service, can enable me in any degree to comply with your wishes, it shall be my strenuous endeavor that this sagacious injunction of the two Houses shall not be without effect. …And may that Being who is supreme over all, the Patron of Order, the Fountain of Justice, and the Protector in all ages of the world of virtuous liberty, continue His blessings upon this nation and its Government and give it all possible success and duration consistent with the ends of His Providence.”

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:17pm

      J. Adams was Vice-President under Washington from 1789 to 1797. On August 14, 1796, he made this diary entry: “One great advantage of the Christian religion is that it brings the great principle of the law of nature and nations — Love your neighbor as yourself and do to others as you would that others should do to you, — to the knowledge, belief, and veneration of the whole people. …No other institution for education, no kind of political discipline, could diffuse this kind of necessary information, so universally among all ranks and descriptions of citizens. The duties and rights of the man and the citizen are thus taught from early infancy to every creature. The sanctions of a future life are thus added to the observance of civil and political, as well as domestic and private duties. Prudence, justice, temperance, and fortitude, are thus taught to be the means and conditions of future as well as present happiness.”

      Admas said of our Independence, “The second day of July, 1776, will be the most memorable epocha in the history of America. I am apt to believe that it will be celebrated by succeeding generations as the great anniversary festival. It ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance, by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty. It ought to be solemnized with pomp and parade, with shows, games, sports, guns, bells, bonfires, and illuminations, from one end of this continent to the other, from this time forward forevermore.”

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:25pm

      “I have thought proper to recommend, and I do hereby recommend accordingly, that Thursday, the 25th day of April next, be observed throughout the United States of America as a day of solemn humiliation, fasting, and prayer; that the citizens on that day abstain as far as may be from their secular occupations, devote the time to the sacred duties of religion in public and in private; that they call to mind our numerous offenses against the Most High God, confess them before Him with the sincerest penitence, implore His pardoning mercy, through the Great Mediator and Redeemer, for our past transgressions, and that through the grace of His Holy Spirit we may be disposed and enabled to yield a more suitable obedience to His righteous requisitions in time to come…that He would smile on our colleges, academies, schools, and seminaries of learning, and make them nurseries of sound science, morals, and religion; that He would bless all magistrates, from the highest to the lowest, give them the true spirit of their station, make them a terror to evil doers and a praise to them that do well; that He would preside over the councils of the nation at this critical period, enlighten them to a just discernment of the public interest, and save them from mistake, division, and discord…that he would extend the blessings of knowledge, of true liberty, and of pure and undefiled religion throughout the world.” Presidential Proclamation by Adams, March 6, 1789.

      Report Post »  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:42pm

      @Encinom

      I still need to find where this loose logic (of, if it gets gov funding, it’s an endorsement) separation between church & state came in…but it most certainly is not in violation of what our founding fathers intended when writing in the establishment clause.

      It says that CONGRESS shall make no LAW establishing a religion, and will not prevent the free exercise thereof.

      The intent of this was so that the US did not fall into the same state that England did, by creating an OFFICIAL religion of England. That’s why they left in the first place. Putting a cross on a piece of land that is owned by the city DOES NOT equal local, state, or federal officials creating law that endorses Christianity as the official religion of the US.

      Where separation of church & state come in was in an letter penned by Jefferson, explaining his take on the establishment clause. In it, he said there should be a separation of church & state affairs. Rightly so….being as familiar as Jefferson was of the downfall of what happens in societies where church law IS state law….like in the Middle East.

      Again, putting a cross on a piece of city own property does not establish church law to be state law.

      If the citizens of the city have a problem with the cross (eye-sore), then they should have a say in it. Instead, you have out of state FFR groups using this lose precedent to white wash any and all references to religion. NOT what the FF had in mind.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:17pm

      @RajCaj

      Yes when the Constitution was first ratified the First Amendment only applied to the Federal Government, the States were free to violate free speech and religious freedom. After the passage of the 14th Amendment the Bill of Rights was applied to the States and Agents of the States.

      The jurisprudence surrounding the Establishment Clause disproves your assumption. The Court cases are clear, that when a State or Agent of the State shows preference towards anyone religion it is in violation of the Establishment Clause. The cross on public lands with the message “Jesus Save” shows that the City government has held up Christianity above all other religions. This is Public Land, land, in theory held in trust for all citizens or all creeds, the city is disregarding its duty to all citizens with this flagrant violation of the Constitution. The officials that approved the putting the cross on public lands should be billed for its removal.

      Report Post »  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:59pm

      @Encinom

      So the passage of the 14th Amendment made it so that the establishment clause saying “Congress” shall create no law now means that State Congresses shall create no law. All it did was extend the language to include the State.

      I’m still failing to see where any government official (federal or state) has created any laws that publicly endorse Christianity as the established religion of the US by erecting a cross on public land.

      Which court cases are clear? I’m specifically interested in the first one that set this precedent.

      When you say that the cross on city land shows that the city government has held up Christianity; how so, considering no laws have been made?

      To take your reasoning, is the US in violation for sending federal dollars to middle eastern countries…that make no bones about following Islamic law as state law? The feds can give billions of dollars to REAL religious oppression in Egypt (totally cool w/ FFR) but allowing a cross on a $3k piece of land is a flagrant violation? lol

      Also, why does it stop at religion? Does the government giving money to special interest groups mean that the government ONLY endorses that specific special interest group?

      The point I’m driving at is, just because the government gives money to something (or allows the use of it’s land for something) doesn’t mean that it is the ONLY position they hold. Doesn’t take a whole lot of reasoning to understand that concept.

      Report Post »  
    • sparky239
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 5:35pm

      Encinom you know nothing of the constitution or the separation of church and state…you may not like it but,it is there to stay …you and you kind have nothing to stand on….your ACLU clowns might try and tie up the courts with the law suite but,guess what in the end we will prevail while you and your kind of ilk will perish….Get a life loser….

      Report Post » sparky239  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 6:13pm

      “the States were free to violate free speech and religious freedom”

      BS. All the States had their own Bill of Rights that protected free speech and religious liberty during the time of our founding. And, even if we were to believe your ingnorant, far-fetched statement, the common law enforced at that time in every State would absolutely protect the right of every citizen to speak and worship freely. Howbeit, you go back to the HuffPo or g watch Madcow some mre. Or, better yet, learn some real history.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 7:39pm

      @RajCaj
      So either you are stupid or just dishonest, any action by a government official, rulings, decisions, etc. are covered by the blanket term “laws.” Lets be clear, this is settled law, the Supreme Court cases defining the limits of what a local government can and can not do with regards to religion are clear. Your failure to understand basic civics is only evidence of how little Becker’s sheep know their Constitution. Strawman arguments about foreign aide only demonstrates the vast dishonest or ignorance in which you approach this debate.

      You can not claim to be a defender of the Constitution if you willing turn a blind eye to violations of it. Giving special consideration to one religion over all others, is a violations of the Establishment clause the case law is clear. Other special interest groups are not governed by a Constitutional Amendment.

      @Colt Barton is a fraud and you spewing his BS theories shows how much a fool you are. Real history isn’t taught by Conservative Christians, they only preach bible based lies.

      Report Post »  
  • joolie
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:12am

    Will atheist demand that the US Capitol be demolished too??
    http://stg.do/Iwpc

    Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:25am

      Benjamin Franklin, Signer of the Declaration of Independence “[O]nly a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters.”

      “Whereas true religion and good morals are the only solid foundations of public liberty and happiness . . . it is hereby earnestly recommended to the several States to take the most effectual measures for the encouragement thereof.” Continental Congress, 1778

      Note that the above quotes are but a small sample of hundreds of quotes the Founding Fathers made in regards to the importance of a religious and moral people in a successful Republican Democracy.

      In our young nation, the Bible was used as a text book for the purpose of teaching children moral principles to live by. As time went on, the Bible was gradually replaced by other text books such as Noah Webster’s Primer. Webster’s Primer taught children to spell but was also filled with moral Bible verses. In the front of his Primer was his picture with the inscription, “Who taught millions to read but not one to sin.”

      This is the exact opposite of the school curriculum today. The courts in this country have revised the First Amendment, thus erecting a wall of atheism around every public school in America, where in God is not allowed to be mentioned. This is not the same wall that Thomas Jefferson envisioned.

      Report Post »  
    • BloodSweatandTears
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:36am

      @JOOLIE Don’t get them started. Except that last year Richard Dawkins, avowed atheist, in a conference called his adherents to go militant for the cause. And that is why you are witnessing this upsurge. However, anyone with a fifth grade education can read the First Amendment stating:

      Congress shall MAKE NO LAW respecting an establishment of religion, OR PROHIBITING THE FREE EXERCISE THEREOF; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

      Putting up a cross is not establishing ANY LAW. However, demanding that it not be put up, is
      prohibiting the FREE exercise of it……

      Thanks for link.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:19pm

      But, putting the cross on Public Lands violate the Constitution, the court cases are clear on that. The cross shows that the City favors one religion over all others, it steals land held in trust for all citizens of all creeds and gives it to the exclusive use of one religion.

      Report Post »  
  • Voice of Reason
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:05am

    I know exactly where this cross is as I fish near there from time to time. I wonder how these groups even have standing to sue when I doubt anyone for the area logged a protest. It truly is a VERY VERY VERY small community basically in the middle of nowhere.

    Coming to Indiana from California, it was one of the few areas I saw billboards and signs against abortion.

    I would certainly tred lightly here God haters. These people may not exclusively see this as “court battle” and “fight” means something different to these folks than the metrosexual meely mouths you are used to dealing with.

    Don’t forget the thing the President stated these folks cling to besides their Bibles…….

    Report Post »  
    • let us prey
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:23pm

      Soros, who leads the League of Cities, in cooperation with the atheists are behind all these acts. They troll from town to town auditing cities. When they find the weak prey, they pounce. The cities have no money to fight back, and this is the newest method of attacks.

      Report Post » let us prey  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 2:54pm

      What court decision established this precedent they keep using as the basis for a law suit?

      The only thing that keeps getting quoted by atheists is “Separation of Church & State”. Great….but that’s not in the constitution….nor does the Constitution say anything about not allowing any symbol of religion (regardless of the context) to be present on any piece of land, or by any organization that receives public funding.

      The origin I find for Separation of Church & State is some letter Jefferson wrote trying to explain the establishment clause….where he states that there should be a separation between church & state. But even that doesn‘t mean how it’s being interpreted in these threats to municipalities.

      Report Post »  
  • Azalea
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:03am

    The cross has been up for 2 years – with the local government’s approval. Why did no one get angry about it then? There is no separation of church and state. Never has been. The state cannot tell the people WHAT religion they must worship, but it doesn’t say that the people who run that state must give up their religious beliefs. THAT is the difference. And, the reason why? Stated in The Declaration of Independence. Everything our founding Fathers wrote in the Constitution of the United States of America, had a direct reason for WHY they wrote something in it. The Founding Fathers recognized a “Creator”, that being God. Therefore, our principles and justice system was also taken directly from the Bible. You cannot separate God from government. It’s that simple. But, this cross was there for 2 years. They took their sweet time about it. Therefore, it isn’t that big of a deal to them, except they just want to wield power over the majority of the people – as usual. Noting more. They drool in anticipation of their power. But, only WE can give it to them.

    Report Post » Azalea  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:10am

      “You cannot separate God from government. ”

      yes, you really can. it’s not even that hard actually. do you want our political leaders to legislate based on scripture? if so, which ones? all of them, or just ones you like? or just one’s your denomination of Christianity likes?

      you see, it’s a lot trickier to insert religion into government. that‘s why it’s best checked at the door. which is PRECISELY what our founders intended.

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • Voice of Reason
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:13am

      It’s called “tyranny of the minority” and it sux.

      But the lefties are starting to see the pratfalls of cobbling together these disparate groups of 2-3% of the population in an effort to screw with the rest.

      While Black people will likely vote for the President in numbers north of 90% his stand on gay marriage has him at odds with a lot of Black men of God.

      Support for OWS types hits them in the pocketbook when they court the Goldman-Sux crowd.

      The “other” parts of their coalition of grievance mongers are looking arouind and realizing that some of the folks they are sitting with are not people they want to be associated with at all.

      This problem isn‘t going away and it isn’t getting better for them either.

      Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:19am

      Robert Winthrop, Speaker of the U. S. House, “Men, in a word, must necessarily be controlled either by a power within them or by a power without them; either by the Word of God or by the strong arm of man; either by the Bible or by the bayonet.”

      Prophetic words from a Founder of this Nation. This country was founded upon Christianity as the power of force was left (originally) to the people. End of argument.

      Report Post »  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:33am

      ” End of argument.”

      really? b/c of one man’s words? it also happens to be a person who history has largely ignored. i don’t think that “ends” any argument, unless you’re completely stupid.

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:43am

      ” End of argument.”

      really? b/c of one man’s words? it also happens to be a person who history has largely ignored. i don’t think that “ends” any argument, unless you’re completely stupid.
      ____________________
      Yes it the End of the Argument, they have no other argument than a bunch of out of context, cherry picked quotes.

      No one is prevent these Christians from practicing their faith, their rights are not being infringed. The Christians are demand that the Constitution not apply to them and that they have greater access and right to lands owned by all citizens.

      Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:48am

      ‘Completely stupid.’ Interesting… This nation became- A SuperPower, a beacon of hope, the flowing source of freedom, and the desired solution of oppressed peoples across the planet -IN THE HISTORICAL BLINK OF AN EYE under these morals. Pray tell where are we heading now under YOUR management.. Idiot. No, foolish idiot.

      Report Post »  
    • DrunkGOP_Hack
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:53pm

      Cast away all you want that is all you have.
      I battle for christ, children and good people.
      God said love thy neighbor. He didn’t say let them walk all over you.
      fr!ggn R3TARD!

      Report Post » DrunkGOP_Hack  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 3:08pm

      @Azalea

      This isn’t the worst offense. There have been cities under attack from the FFR group that were forced to take down religious references that have been there for over 50 years….not just 2. Not a single complaint…..until one of the FFR’s operatives roll in.

      @PhillyAthiest

      Nope, i don’t want any politician making laws based on a bias towards any particular religion. That is EXACTLY why the establishment clause was written.

      HOWEVER, taking issue with a cross that sits on public land (and in some cases has context outside of religion) is not equivalent to a senator in Washington creating a Pro-Christian law.

      The logic that is being used to white wash all displays of religion has come under the guise that “if a piece of land is owned by the government, or an organization receives money from the government….then they cannot talk about religion or display any symbols thereof.” That’s a FAR cry from the establishment clause. Sorry.

      Secondly, EVEN if that logic was what the FF intended…..can you see the slippery slope that presents? Given the recent argument made by the likes of Elizabeth Warren & Obama….people aren’t successful without the aid of the government (whether that means roads, police protection, or tax breaks & incentives).

      Therefore….ALL public & private organizations receive benefit from the government….and therefore cannot talk about or display religious symbols. If that is your aim, be honest about it. Otherwise,

      Report Post »  
  • DrunkGOP_Hack
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:03am

    Atheist are EMOTIONAL FÅCKING CRIPPLES. THEIR SOULS ARE DOG SH!ET, EVERY SINGLE THING ABOUT THEM IS UGLY!

    Report Post » DrunkGOP_Hack  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:19am

      my Mother doesn’t seem to think so. goodness, if you do indeed have a soul (you don’t) it’s pitch black.

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:29am

      Sorry, it is the Christians that need to violate the Constitution with their myths to feel special. Keep your religion on Private Lands.

      Report Post »  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:30am

      Agreed, Philly. If there is “ugly” here, it is in the comments of Drunkgop.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:23am

      From a MUCH greater man than any of us:

      George Washington, General of the Revolutionary Army, president of the Constitutional Convention, First President of the United States of America, Father of our nation, ” Religion and morality are the essential pillars of civil society.”

      Atheists, Humanists, proggie-commies are all are about destruction, confusion, doubt, division, deviancy. The answers are simple. This nation WAS founded upon the Judeo-Christian model – end of reasoning, point of fact.. But the warped will continue arguing.

      Report Post »  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:36am

      DESIGN – Washington was indeed a much greater man than us. he also said:

      “Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be deprecated. I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society.”

      - George Washington

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:53am

      Absolutely Philly. He wanted the religions to form a whole and not be so divisive, to be at the peace with each other they pray for. Absolutely.

      Report Post »  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:17pm

      “He wanted the religions to form a whole and not be so divisive, to be at the peace with each other they pray for. ”

      how’s that working out? is Islam a religion?

      also, note some of his wording – “I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age…”

      ENLIGHTENED and LIBERAL! George Washington was a commie!!!

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • DrunkGOP_Hack
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:20pm

      I sure your mother wishes to GOD that she didn’t have you.

      Report Post » DrunkGOP_Hack  
    • DrunkGOP_Hack
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:27pm

      Funny, we [christians] are the one’s insecure with our society and the mere presence of religious signs or notations that cause utter fear and grief with your ilk.

      Your pathetic and WARPED perspective is lonely, empty, and [black] as you call me.

      I have a power greater then me and a light that shines beyond your inability to think beyond your own eyelids, that allows a person like me to have to deal with a person like yourself.

      Besides, we the majority. Religions [all] out number your kind far beyond anything you all think you can stop, change or manipulate.

      Report Post » DrunkGOP_Hack  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:41pm

      @Drunk

      Hahaha, the light that shines sure has a dark side when you can say, “I sure your mother wishes to GOD that she didn’t have you.”

      Report Post »  
    • phillyatheist
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 1:39pm

      careful, your “majority” is slipping. the “nones” are up to 19%, which is more than all the Protestant denominations COMBINED!

      Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:08pm

      @Phillyatheist

      Interesting quote from GW…..and interesting the straw man you can reference is Islam. The Establishment Clause (as its worded in the constitution…not the more modern interpretation) prevents the kind of situation you have in most Islamic states…where religious law IS state law.

      As such, we don’t have Protestants killing Catholics here. Priests & Nuns aren’t strapping C4 and blowing up weddings. There are a hand full of religious zealots (like Westboro Baptist Church) that say some pretty despicable stuff….but I don’t think we are in a place that George Washington alludes to in that quote. Actually quite the opposite. Look at Beck’s Restoring Love event to see what people of different faiths are capable of doing. If you’re not familiar with the community service the event turned out, I suggest you look to that as a more accurate representation of what good people of faith are.

      Secondly, the idea of religious freedom in the 1700s was pretty liberal thinking. Don’t confuse classic liberalism (which advocates liberty) with modern progressivisim. Progressives, like many communists, don’t much care for personal liberties if they conflict with the prescribed way of doing things determined by the central planners (who know best!)

      But nice try…

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:27pm

      RajCaj:
      The Establishment Clause (as its worded in the constitution…not the more modern interpretation)
      ______________________________________

      The truth is you rely on the lies taught by Barton, Beck and others that seek to turn the nation into a theocracy. Men with a religious agenda have taught lies, have cherry picked quotes and offered statements and fact removed from their context to sell books and fools the conservative sheep.

      Since the founding the Courts have shaped the interpreted what the meaning of the various Clauses of the Constitution mean. The 1st Amendment is not read in a vacuum, new amendments, history and Stare decisis have evolved the meaning of the Amendment. The Constitution is not in a glass chance unchanged by the world around it. The Founders are not the final word on laws 200 year since their actions.

      Report Post »  
    • colt1860
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 7:06pm

      “The Founders are not the final word on laws 200 year since their actions.”

      LMAO! Another double standard, hypocritcal statment by Encinom. I’m pretty sure that famous Jefferson letter used by closet Marxist judges was written by a founder 200 years ago! You guys are pathetic. The only substantiated research you guys have is the research of other liberal, atheist, commie idiots that site other like minded individuals like themseves. You guys don’t use primary sources, and actaully make an effort to avoid them! You guys are radicals, plain and simple.

      Report Post »  
  • phillyatheist
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:53am

    Christian Persecution Syndrome. watch the video. in it, a man is screaming that Christians are a minority in America. why am i not surprised that this zealot doesn’t understand the most basic of mathematical ideas. 80% is not a minority. not even close. his home school teacher should have been fired.

    Report Post » phillyatheist  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:04am

      The Christians can’t argue the facts or the law so they learned from Rush and Beck to whine being the victim.

      Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:29am

      Fact: Look at the Founders words. (all of them) They believed the laws that barely formed this nation and the morals of the religious were enough to create the finest/ freest nation on the planet. They were right. YOU athiests are ruining it at an alarming pace. Moral Destruction is no match for laws, as the immoral don’t even know laws exist. You guys are proof.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:46am

      The founders also created a secular republic, the Founders when writing the Constitution only mentions religion to place limits on the ability of religion to influence the Government and vis-a-versa. Cherry pick quotes are what scam artists like Barton do in an attempt to rewrite history to sell books to the foolish.

      Report Post »  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:55am

      And yet your liberal anti-God policies are a historical fact of destruction to anything they touch. Argue that, will ya?

      Report Post »  
  • abwehragent
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:44am

    “The fool has said in his heart: ‘There is no god’.” I pray they have a change of heart. Otherwise at the judgment they will have condemned themselves to eternity without end and without recourse in the lake of fire. Persecution is expected for those who faithfully follow the LORD, but woe to the one by whom it comes. Not a pretty future.

    Report Post » abwehragent  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:51am

      Prove it.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:15pm

      Wait, what? I can’t force my religion on others? I’m being persecuted!!!!!!

      I can’t help but laugh when I hear Christians say, “80% of America says they are a Christian.” as some kind of proof of how influential Christianity is on our society. They also then say that 93% of people say they believe in a God.

      They then say how depraved the United States is and how immoral the people are.

      News Flash
      If you want to use the number of Christians as some kind of proof of how strong your religion is, then you must take the blame for the so called intellectual and moral decline of America.

      Report Post »  
  • thegreatcarnac
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:42am

    The gays and the atheists are over-stepping. The liberals are also. A backlash is coming and when it does these groups mentioned above will suffer. The worse things get the more harsh the backlash. It is coming.

    Report Post »  
  • bigbear_awake
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:40am

    wonder they dont want electrical pole down because they look like crosses

    Report Post » bigbear_awake  
  • bigbear_awake
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:35am

    wonder they dont want all the electrical poles down they look like crosses

    Report Post » bigbear_awake  
  • randy
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:56am

    Every christian needs to start placing their own crosses in their front yard.
    I made and placed my cross last weekend.
    I’d love to see a sea of crosses across our great country.
    Anyone remember the yellow ribbons across America during the Iranian Hostage crisis?

    Report Post » randy  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:33am

      You are free to do that. I have no problem with you expressing your freedom, on your own private property, a device of torture and death.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:32pm

      I agree.

      I would love for each individual person to put up a cross on their own property.

      Hell, put a nativity scene on your front yard, I don’t care.

      What‘s funny is that personally expressing their religion isn’t enough for a lot of people.

      They need to have a government endorsement of it with Christian symbols being put on public property.

      Report Post »  
    • RajCaj
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 4:40pm

      Don’t you know….you wouldn‘t have your house if it weren’t for the government. You wouldn‘t have been approved for your mortgage if it weren’t for Fannie Mae’s reduced lending standards. And how about that nice tax exemption you take for paying interest on that loan….yup, government too.

      And since the government subsidizes your house & yard, placing any religious symbol in public view is a violation of the separation of church & state.

      Sounds silly right?

      It’s the exact same line of logic being used to remove highway crosses, banning prayer before a public school football game, and WWII memorials.

      Report Post »  
  • barber2
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:50am

    The new norm: the majority does not rule. The Discrimination Card does.

    Report Post »  
    • SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:06am

      “A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”
      Marcus Tullius Cicero (106-43 B.C.) Roman Statesman, Philosopher and Orator

      “It does not take a majority to prevail … but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men.”
      Samuel Adams “The Father of the American Revolution”

      Report Post » SLEAZYHIPPOs ILLEGITIMATE OFFSPRING  
  • NewLife56
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:49am

    Wow, that cross and words are threatning, how could this ever be allowed, it strikes fear into anyone who sees or hears it. (Sarcasum)

    The height of stupidity is sure showing it’s ugly head.

    Report Post » NewLife56  
    • RWCT
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:05am

      We are now in the end days, and the end type of churches as described in Revelation Chapter 3.
      These are the times described byJesus in Ch 23/24 of Matthew, so not surprising. These poor fools are destined to spend ETERNITY, in the Lake of Fire, orginally created for satan and his demons.
      A Christian should take no comfort, or satisfaction,in this, as we too, were once destined for it, but we have been saved by Gods’ GRACE, through FAITH, and NOTHING else, not by WORKS, It is the GIFT of our loving God to those who REPENT and Believe.
      Maranatha

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 12:34pm

      The only thing funnier then seeing a Christian in America saying they’re being persecuted is a Christian running around saying, “this is surely the end times.”

      Report Post »  
  • jmcclena
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:48am

    Good, get it off public land. We are a secular nation. I should not have to pay tax dollars to allow a symbol of a religion I do not support to sit on public land. Kudos to the Americans United for Separation of Church and State for standing up for the rights of the minority!

    Report Post »  
    • kickagrandma
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:56am

      @JMCCLENA ~~~ Guess what? You are wrong on each and every level of your statement. Don’t like FREEDOM? Feel free to move to an existing communist country. There are many. You will never have to hear about GOD or JESUS again, and your life will be so much better. NOT!

      Report Post »  
    • sWampy
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:58am

      So idiot, they should spend more tax payer money so your panties don’t get in a wad? God you liberal twits are ignorant, I hope you enjoy your universal slavery when it gets to that point.

      Report Post »  
    • jmcclena
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:07am

      @KICKGRANDMA

      No, I like freedom just as much as the next guy. You are free to put up any sort of cross you wish… on your own, private church grounds, just like all other religions.

      Report Post »  
    • thetruthlives
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:50am

      if the cross offends, look the other way….loser

      Report Post »  
    • jmcclena
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:00am

      @THETRUTHLIVES

      I will not.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:32am

      the biggest offense is the violation of the Constitution, and I thought Beckerheads preached the Constitution. This is Public Land, land held for the use of all citizens, not just those that believe in a Bronze Age myth.

      Report Post »  
  • ComingUnglued
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:45am

    Have the churches buy the land. For now it stops the town from paying for a lengthy court battle. Next change the law to stop all of these frivolous lawsuits.

    Anyone notice that humanity and common sense are being lost with every court challenge. What else can we do with these attorneys that have nothing else to do? Can we help them somehow use their knowledge for good not evil?

    Report Post »  
  • ThankBabyJesus
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:45am

    “…it would be the same if they allowed a crescent moon to be put up.” except it’s not.

    Report Post » ThankBabyJesus  
    • designbyinspiration
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:35am

      Not at all. The first foreign enemies after the Revolution:
      Pirate ships and crews from the North African Berber states of Algiers, Tunis, Tripoli and the independent Sultanate of Morocco under the Alaouite Dynasty (the Barbary Coast) were the scourge of the Mediterranean. Capturing merchant ships and enslaving or ransoming their crews provided the Muslim rulers of these nations with wealth and naval power. The Roman Catholic Trinitarian Order or Order of “Mathurins” had operated from France for centuries with the special mission of collecting and disbursing funds for the relief and ransom of prisoners of Mediterranean pirates.

      Barbary pirates led attacks upon American merchant shipping in an attempt to extort ransom for the lives of captured sailors, and ultimately tribute from the United States to avoid further attacks, much like their standard operating procedure with the various European states.[1] Before the Treaty of Paris, which formalized America’s independence from Great Britain, American shipping was protected by France during the Revolutionary years under the Treaty of Alliance (1778–83). Although the treaty does not mention the Barbary States in name, it refers to common enemies between both the U.S. and France, which would include the Barbary States or pirates in general. As such, piracy against American shipping only began to occur after the end of the American Revolution, when the U.S. government lost its protection under the Treaty of Alliance. Wik

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:49am

      Unless the church now owns public land, the cross needs to be torn down.

      Report Post »  
  • DeavonReye
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:41am

    Who cares about the silly cross. I doubt most of the residents there are offended by it. Even though it IS on public land, . . . if it isn’t costing tax dollars to keep it up, then there’s no reason to take it down.

    On a more important note, . . . I think it is just tacky, personally. And the whole notion of “the need for a savior” is more valid than the symbol. It goes back to WHY “the need for a savior” to begin with, and the reason why it really should be absurd to anyone who really stops to think about the whole story, from OT to new. I once “begged for my life” when I was a kid and merely believed what adults told me “was true”. Later in life, when I actually took the time to actually study the bible and christian concepts, I recognized the folly in it.

    So, as for this cross, . . . sure, leave it up. It is a symbol of why this country is how it is. . . . . and the rest of the world, for that matter.

    Report Post » DeavonReye  
    • DIVINEPROVIDENCE1776
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:49am

      What next? Removing Moses and the ten commandments imagery from the Supreme Court building?!?

      Report Post » DIVINEPROVIDENCE1776  
    • RWCT
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:58am

      Then, I assume you have no problem with your name being removed from the fictitious BOOK OF LIFE? You have studied, but understood nothing. As the book of Daniel asserts: In the End time only the WISE will understand. I suggest you get a DVD called THE DANIEL PROJECT, which is a SECULAR DVD, that gives evidence of future events, and evidence of prediced events that have come to pass. There WERE over 1800 future predictions made in tne Bible. I say “WERE” because over half have been fufilled. I challenge you to watch it and then respond with any evidence you have that the predictions,past, were not fufliied in exact detail. I pray you will be one of the wise, rather than one of those not Harpazzod, as we are now in the days as Scripture states. As it was it the days of Noah, so shall it be, in the coming of the Son Of Man.
      Maranatha

      Report Post »  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:02am

      In case you didn’t see my post in its entirety, . . . I wasn’t for taking the cross down. It is a true look at this countries make up.

      As for the 10 commandments on the Supreme Court wall, . . . . whatever they want to do, . . . but it is stupid to have it up there when only a few of them are actual U.S. law. It is absurd to have them there. I said it and do not apologize for it.

      But actually READ the story surrounding the 10 commandments. See if you can pick out the issues. One part is even . . a bit paradoxical. You just have to read the story with “rose colored stained glass window” glasses on.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:21am

      RWCT . . . Of course. The “you didn’t read it the right way” part of the debate. Typical.

      What I am talking about has nothing to do with “understanding it the right way”. It is undeniable and right in your face, if you are open to see it. Regardless, . . . I can assure you that when I was discovering these things, I was following pastoral counseling by “reading the bible fully and taking journal notes”. What I found was enough for a book, which I wrote.

      As for the fictitious “book of life”,. . . “book of wrongs committed by people”, or any of the other analogies found in Revelations, . . . of course I don’t believe them. Why should I? You hold onto a doctrine from a guy who claimed a vision ~1,900 years ago!

      As for “bible prophesy fulfilled”, . . . I’ve seen the claims. Vague, misinterpretations of past stories, claims without OT backing, repeats of those same techniques. . . . in short, I found none of the claims to be anywhere near credible or extraordinary to make me believe that some “future magical being” was being spoken of in those passages. The most spoken of, . . . in fact, . . . is a perfect example. Vague similarities. . . and suddenly “dogs surround me” magically transform in to “Roman soldiers”. Were “all his bones out of joint”? NO! “Oh, but that just means that he _________.” Fill in the blank. I’ve seen it all before.

      A TRUE prophesy would not be vague.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
  • ZAP
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:39am

    Humanism,man becomes god unto himself or the worship of GOD.That is the choice in the end

    Report Post » ZAP  
  • randy
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:39am

    Americans United for Separation of Church and State Americans United (AU) a tax-exempt, non-profit organization and what they believe:
    Dated yesterday .
    http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/printgroupProfile.asp?grpid=7441
    AMERICANS UNITED (FOR SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE) (AU)
    518 C Street NE
    Washington, DC
    20002

    Phone :202-466-3234
    Email :AmericansUnited@au.org
    URL :http://www.au.org/site/PageServer

    Seeks to diminish and/or eliminate conservative religious organizations’ involvement in public policy and political life
    Views the U.S. as a nation in danger of being taken over by politically conservative theocrats
    Here is your

    Seeks to eliminate the presence of religious symbols and practices in public places
    Opposes school vouchers
    Opposes government funding for faith-based initiatives
    Urges the IRS to require that churches and church-affiliate nonprofits pay property taxes and/or income taxes
    Opposes the definition of marriage as a union between one man and one woman

    Report Post » randy  
  • Gonzo
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:39am

    I know it‘s hard to do and I usually don’t, but you have to feel pitty for a man who looks at the cross and feels ‘offended’.

    Report Post » Gonzo  
    • jasonnm1975
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:38am

      I agree 100%. These are the people that we need to pray for. Jesus wants us to share the gospel with these folks so that they may feel the love and grace that we feel each day. Time is running out. It’s time to fall on our knees and pray for the lost. God Bless!!

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:33am

      I am offended at the need of Christians to violate the Constitution and Beckerheads defending such violations. God has no place in the Government or on Public Lands, put the cross on private property.

      Report Post »  
    • Gonzo
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:39am

      I pitty you for many reasons.

      Report Post » Gonzo  
    • dblaess
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:20am

      @ encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:33am
      I am offended at the need of Christians to violate the Constitution and Beckerheads defending such violations. God has no place in the Government or on Public Lands, put the cross on private property.
      ————————————————————————————————————–
      God has a place in government, public land, private land. The constitution only talks about government not establishing a “state” religion or prohibiting religon. I do agree that it would be best if signs referring to religion were placed on private property. This is most likely why there are those in America who want to do away with private property so all property belongs to government.

      Report Post »  
    • encinom
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 11:54am

      @dblaess
      One conspiracy theory at a time (only paranoid Beckerheads honestly believe there is a movement to strip away private property).

      Our Constitution created a secular republic, despite the lies Barton and Beck preach. God has no role in it. Public land is owned as much by the atheist as it is by the Christian. The cross on Public Land is a violation of the Establishment Clause, it shows government favoring one religion over all others, when the role of government is to be neutral in these matters. You can not say you defend the Constitution when you turn a blind eye to a clear violation of it.

      Report Post »  
  • Wilma
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:38am

    Where can I send a donation to the defense fund?

    Report Post » Wilma  
  • Sharon Rose
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:38am

    What harm is this cross doing?

    Report Post »  
    • Gonzo
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:43am

      It makes sinners confront their sin…and unrepentant sinners hate that.

      Report Post » Gonzo  
    • Dde13
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:00am

      GONZO,,
      You nailed it!!!! (No pun)

      Report Post »  
    • dixie63
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:40am

      Exactly right GONZO.

      Report Post » dixie63  
  • HKS
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:37am

    Christians through out history have had to fight for their survival, no different now.

    Report Post » HKS  
  • Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:36am

    When will enough finally be enough and the madness of these anti-christian groups be called to task.

    Report Post » Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}  
    • lisa2994
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 10:26am

      Sadly Snow it will not stop until we get someone in office who also believes in GOD and until we finally as a nation start talking about GOD once again. I know we do on here and what I mean is our politicians. To them or so some are told it is a dirty word to say GOD even. Ronald Reagan did a speech where he told us to always seek divine guidance. To me that was the last president to ever truly invoke GOD in our nation and I pray he is not the last. This nation which wether the atheists want to admit it are not is FULL of Christians and we need to start standing up for things like this. The reason this is happening is simple this nation has stopped standing up for what it was founded on. Now with Chik Fil A that gives me some hope that people are truly ready to stand up and put a stop to this nonsense! Praise GOD in everything and GOD bless our nation and its citizens!

      Report Post » lisa2994  
  • grannyjojo
    Posted on August 7, 2012 at 8:36am

    Lord, come quickly. “Every knee will bow and every tongue confess”

    Report Post »  
    • dixie63
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:41am

      Amen.

      Report Post » dixie63  
    • DeavonReye
      Posted on August 7, 2012 at 9:57am

      That verse would be completely impossible to fulfill. AND if so, and someone recognizes “Jesus as Lord”, yet is still “sent to hell”, then they are sent there out of spite that they “didn’t understand this when alive”. The great folly of the doctrine is that “blind faith” is praised over personal understanding.. . . .as well as the “believe me or I’ll hurt you”. That isn’t an act of love.

      Report Post » DeavonReye  
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