Faith

Judge: Praying for God to Hurt Someone Isn’t Illegal

Judge: Praying for God to Hurt Someone Isnt Illegal | Mikey WeinsteinHere’s an offbeat story you might have missed. Earlier this month, District Court Judge Martin Hoffman ruled that praying for God to injure someone is perfectly legal — so long as the person isn’t physically injured by the individual offering up the prayer (or by anyone else for that matter).

Religion News Service has more about the intriguing case:

District Court Judge Martin Hoffman on Monday (April 2) dismissed a lawsuit brought by Mikey Weinstein against a former Navy chaplain who he said used “curse” prayers like those in Psalm 109 to incite others to harm the Jewish agnostic and founder of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation and his family.

Hoffman said there was no evidence that the prayers by Gordon Klingenschmitt, who had been endorsed for the Navy chaplaincy by the Dallas-based Chaplaincy of Full Gospel Churches, were connected to threats made against Weinstein and his family or damage done to his property.

According to the lawsuit, Klingenschmitt posted a prayer on his website urging followers to pray for the downfall of MRFF.

Judge: Praying for God to Hurt Someone Isnt Illegal | Mikey Weinstein

MRFF's Mikey Weinstein

At question was whether Klingenschmitt incited threats against Weinstein when he published the prayer. Weinstein, of course, maintains that the published plea to the Lord was damaging and it‘s likely that he will respond to the judge’s ruling with an appeal.

“We are disappointed in the ruling because we believe the judge made a mistake in not understanding that imprecatory prayers are code words for trolling for assassins for the Weinstein family,” he said. “I don’t think the judge understood that these are not regular prayers.”

But Klingenschmitt had a different view, entirely, on his court victory. He cited Psalm 109 as the basis for his religious rights and for the victory.

“I praise God for religious freedom because the judge declared it’s okay to pray imprecatory prayers and quote Psalm 109.”

Read more about the case here.

(H/T: Religion News Service)

Comments (67)

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  • burnbabylon
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:26pm

    On “The Simpsons” Bart prays for God to kill Sideshow Bob. Marge tells him he shouldn’t do that and Homer says,”Yeah, do your own dirty work!”

    Report Post »  
    • Servant Of YHVH
      Posted on April 10, 2012 at 12:01am

      It really doesn‘t mean nothing on the judge’s ruling. His ruling does not make it right or wrong, only God decides that.

      Report Post » Servant Of YHVH  
    • SpankDaMonkey
      Posted on April 10, 2012 at 7:51am

      .
      Judge: Praying for God to Hurt Someone Isn’t Illegal……

      Well in that case “Lord Please hit the Obama with lighting, and make his whiteside come out”…..

      Report Post » SpankDaMonkey  
  • Joker50
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:14pm

    I would think that would fall under the category of harassment because it was made public. IN this case I disagree with the Judge. If the Klingerhoffer or what ever his name is, prayed in privacy,,,then it would be a non crime. It would be a thought. Can one be arrested for a thought that is related to something illegal????

    Report Post »  
    • kaydeebeau
      Posted on April 10, 2012 at 11:37am

      so what exactly is speech other than spoken thoughts? That is why speech (all speech – even that which we do not like) is protected because the next avenue after infringing upon free speech is thought crimes which by the way is exactly what the so called hate crime laws are all about.

      When, by the way, did quoting the Bible publicly (or any other book for that matter) become something to be done only in private? Isn’t that infringing upon free speech. All speech is free or it isn’t free at all. There is no “except for” clause in the 1st Amendment.

      I personally detest desecrating the American flag, however, I understand that is a free speech thing so I defend your right to do just that which I find offensive. That my friend is tolerance.

      Report Post » kaydeebeau  
  • lukerw
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:11pm

    Christ only gave one Prayer to Pray… and said do not pray alike the Heathens. So, this is not Prayer to Christians… but wishfullness… and a Freedom of Speech issue.

    Report Post » lukerw  
  • woodcellar
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:54pm

    I never ask God for any thing. I thank him when everythig works out well. I am always amazed at how often thing work out better than I thought they would. God take care of his own even when their not paying attention.

    Report Post »  
    • kar1025
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:18pm

      I dont think praying is our own personal Aladdins lamp. Prayer is usual asking for guidance or strength in times of trouble. We can pray for loved one,etc… theres alot of people who have done me wrong in the past and I dont think I ever prayed to God for vengenace. The evil will hopefully get what they deserve that is my belief. I just got of Facebook with a family member who refuses to belief in God and I spoke from the heart. They deleted their comment. When the **** hits the fan where all going to need someone or something to cling too for strength. Family, and or Religion.

      Report Post »  
  • TwilightWarrior
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:50pm

    Somehow, this song came to mind.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vFSG59xqqU

    Report Post » TwilightWarrior  
  • hugo65hsv
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:25pm

    Who is anyone on earth to decide what a righteous prayer is.. A prayer is a petition to God, he in his ultimate knowledge and wisdom decides.. If it‘s his will it’s done “whatever the petition was” if it‘s not his will it’s not done.. God allows both good and evil in this world for his own purpose and plan.. End of story..

    Report Post »  
    • Gourdy
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:33pm

      Hugo, I’d counter that a true prayer is an expression of praise and love of God and not some, “Lord, could you please give me this or that.” I understand if, for example, a child is dying where people would pray for intercession, but I have to think God is well aware of what’s going on without someone asking. I’m not criticizing you, but this is my opinion.

      Report Post » Gourdy  
    • Uranium Wedge
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:40pm

      What the hell is a regular prayer?
      Or, what the hell makes it irregular?

      Report Post » Uranium Wedge  
    • Wolf
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:04pm

      God will decide what is a ‘righteous prayer’, and He will decide which to answer. However, there’s nothing like giving the devil an opportunity, and praying for injury to another is opening that door. Besides: you can bet that any person who prays for another to be injured has prayers that go no higher than the ceiling above them.

      Report Post »  
    • decendentof56
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:06pm

      Of course….this is made a moot point by the fact that people do not have to act out anyone else’s wishes. You have the ability to think for yourself, and we have laws to deal with someone who does harm to someone else.

      Report Post »  
  • VanceUppercut
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:24pm

    No illegal, but stupid, immoral, and missing the point.

    Report Post »  
    • grimmy
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:42pm

      @vanceuppercut aka encinom.
      Once again your stupidity shines through,now go back to playing WoW, idiot.

      Drago.

      Report Post »  
  • Gourdy
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:23pm

    Not illegal but also not very Christian. I think that the Full Gospel Church needs to rethink their support for this messed up chaplain. He clearly needs some additional Bible schooling…or another profession. He could work for Miss Cleo and produce curses via call in numbers.

    Report Post » Gourdy  
    • wraith67
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:59pm

      Whatever. Try reading what happens when you shake the dust off your feet when you leave a place (Luke 9:5), which is very Christian. The atheist was up (still up to) to evil and certainly asking God to get him off the pastor’s back is appropriate. Using a biblical template is even better. Weak “Christians” who can’t tell good from evil are why the church and this country are so screwed up.

      Report Post » wraith67  
    • Elena2010
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 11:55pm

      I know CFGC Chaplains, Incl the founders. Gordon is not representative of them.

      To Gordon, a better prayer is one of redemption not destruction. Paul tells us to pray for those who oppose us in order that the Holy Spirit might redeem them thru repentance.

      Report Post » Elena2010  
  • Baikonur
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:19pm

    But of course what Klingenschmitt is doing is incitement to hatred and eventual violence.

    Report Post » Baikonur  
  • ChildofJesus
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:18pm

    God doesn‘t believe in pc and he says himself that it’s wrong and if anyone is gonna repay with vengeance it’ll be himself alone. Not ours.

    Report Post »  
  • Baikonur
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:12pm

    If it was illegal, most of the Blazers would be in jail already.

    Report Post » Baikonur  
  • Rev. Billy Mayes
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:08pm

    Why should praying for harm be illegal?

    Paying to jesus to burn down the school will have just as much effect; i.e. none. Praying to the holy ghost to heal the sick will be equally effective; i.e., not at all.

    Report Post » Rev. Billy Mayes  
  • SouthernVoice1
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:07pm

    The case was heard so “separation of Church and state” doesn’t exit. ( The State will always usurp authority from God.) If the prayer is “answered” will the almighty court hold God in contempt for not responding to a subpoena???

    Report Post »  
  • The_Almighty_Creestof
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:07pm

    http://www.bartleby.com/108/19/109.html

    Report Post »  
  • Blazesurfer
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:05pm

    I was bullied everyday in 8th grade in gym class by one particular person, I didn’t pray death for this person. But I sure wished it enough times.. One day on the way to school he was struck by a car and died. Kinda freaked me out..Careful what you wish and pray for.

    Report Post » Blazesurfer  
  • pwatkins
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:02pm

    I hate to say it, but in so ways I am guilty. I have never prayed for death but have to admit I have prayed for Obama’s impeachment. I would think it was one way God could continue to Bless America, but also realize God has a better plan than I do and will prevail. It really doesn’t matter what we pray for when we bow our heads to the Lord bc He knows all of our thoughts anyway and I am sure many have some of the same thoughts I do. God Bless America.

    Report Post »  
    • Cagey1
      Posted on April 13, 2012 at 2:25pm

      GOD knows the motive of every prayer, that gives me peace. If I pray wrong I know that HE will answer right. The GOD of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob is Wonderful an so is HIS heir apparent my LORD and SAVIOR JESUS.

      Report Post » Cagey1  
  • The_Almighty_Creestof
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:01pm

    For those of you unfamiliar with it, or just don’t have your bible handy:

    1

    Hold not thy peace, O God of my praise;

    2

    for the mouth of the wicked and the mouth of the deceitful are opened against me:

    they have spoken against me with a lying tongue.

    3

    They compassed me about also with words of hatred;

    and fought against me without a cause.

    4

    For my love they are my adversaries:

    but I give myself unto prayer.

    5

    And they have rewarded me evil for good,

    and hatred for my love.

    6

    Set thou a wicked man over him:

    and let Satan stand at his right hand.

    7

    When he shall be judged, let him be condemned:

    and let his prayer become sin.

    8

    Let his days be few;

    and let another take his office. Acts 1.20

    9

    Let his children be fatherless,

    and his wife a widow.

    10

    Let his children be continually vagabonds, and beg:

    let them seek their bread also out of their desolate places.

    11

    Let the extortioner catch all that he hath;

    and let the strangers spoil his labor.

    12

    Let there be none to extend mercy unto him:

    neither

    Report Post »  
    • Stoic one
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:12pm

      Or if you are as comfortable as I am – use your favorite search engine “psalm 109”

      Report Post » Stoic one  
  • Stoic one
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:01pm

    I thought atheists did not believe in God. If that is the case, then prayer of any kind should be childish make believe and therefore irrelevant.

    Report Post » Stoic one  
  • momrules
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:56pm

    Oh whine…..whine……….whine. I just went to their website……what a lot of sweeties these folks are.

    I wish they would just GO AWAY.

    Report Post »  
  • Ruler4You
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:53pm

    Actually, judges only swear an oath on a Bible, they don’t believe in God. That’s been proved repeatedly, historically.
    Secondly, I have ZERO confidence that our government has ANY reverence to God, in ANY way whatsoever, in any branch.
    Frankly, I’d wager that close to 30% of our government, ALL government, believes in voodoo over the provenance of God The Creator.

    Report Post » Ruler4You  
  • RamonPreston
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:51pm

    When King David was about to die, he did more than pray for the death of his enemies,. He arranged it. And he was the most righteous man (other than Christ) who ever lived.

    Report Post » RamonPreston  
    • RamonPreston
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:52pm

      I don’t recommend that you do.

      Report Post » RamonPreston  
    • RamonPreston
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:56pm

      I don’t recommend you do it.

      Report Post » RamonPreston  
    • tajloc
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 8:04pm

      David…was a righteous man??? He lusted and then killed to have her. Are you serious?

      God answers prayer three ways….Yes no later

      Don’t pray for justice…only mercy. You might get justice and it would not be good.

      It OK to pray “may the wrath of GOD fall on those who would not see his truth.”

      I have prayed that Obama be protected ‘cuz what a terrible tragedy that would be for all of us.

      The Tea party exists because of O

      and Rom 8:28

      Report Post »  
    • RamonPreston
      Posted on April 10, 2012 at 1:12pm

      Tajloc: read 1 Kings 15:5 The murder of Uriah the Hittite was the only sin that God held against David. David was not righteous because he was sinless, he was righteous because when he became aware of his sins he deeply repented of them ( something WE don”t do.)

      Report Post » RamonPreston  
    • Brooke Lorren
      Posted on April 10, 2012 at 4:26pm

      David was described as “a man after God’s own heart”, not that he was the second most righteous person after Christ. Daniel and Joseph were described overall more positively in the Bible.

      Report Post »  
    • Cagey1
      Posted on April 13, 2012 at 3:24pm

      King David was not the most righteous man (other than Christ). David was a man after GOD’s own heart. There is a difference. David would humble himself in front of all when his sin was revealed. He loved and believed GOD with all his heart. He always agreed with GOD and excepted GOD’s judgments, even if the judgments were on him. Now an old testament arch type of Christ would be Joesph the son of Jacob. He did nothing to deserve the treatment he got. He preserved through much wrong done to him. In the end GOD raise him to second most powerful in the land of Egypt.

      Report Post » Cagey1  
  • ShyLow
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:50pm

    What did you call me

    Report Post » ShyLow  
  • azghost
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:47pm

    I always pray for my enemies as God commands, and let My God deal with them as He says he will do.

    Report Post »  
    • RamonPreston
      Posted on April 9, 2012 at 7:02pm

      I find it interesting that you said “my”. Do you know Bea Arhur?

      Report Post » RamonPreston  
  • Kaoscontrol
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:47pm

    Asking God to “Damn” someone or something is no different.

    Report Post » Kaoscontrol  
  • copatriots
    Posted on April 9, 2012 at 6:45pm

    Good to know……..

    Report Post »  
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