McCain: ‘Some Element of Anti-Mormonism‘ in Romney’s South Carolina Loss
- Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:50am by
Billy Hallowell
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Whoever said that old rivals can’t eventually become friends? In 2008, Arizona Sen. John McCain and former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney attacked one another incessantly, as each sought out the GOP presidential ticket. Now, just four years later, the former foes are working together. Interestingly, while in Florida attempting to help Romney win Tuesday’s primary, McCain offered his theory about one of the elements that impacted the former governor in the South Carolina primary — his membership in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.
In an interview with Real Clear Politics, McCain said there was little Romney could do to stem some of the bias he saw as a result of the candidate’s faith. Although McCain admitted that the campaign hadn’t yet done hard-hitting analysis, he maintained that Mormonism did, indeed, play a roll in Romney’s South Carolina loss.
“We haven’t had time to do a real analysis of the Romney race in South Carolina, but once we break that down, there was some element of anti-Mormonism in that vote,” McCain said. “I’m not saying all of it, but there were elements there.”
This was a bold claim, as was the senator’s statement following it that, “There was nothing that Mitt Romney could have done.” The conversation didn’t end here though. The former 2008 GOP frontrunner was asked if this potential anti-Mormon bias could extend to other states as well.
“I’m not sure [but] I don’t think so,” McCain said, as he went on to point to Georgia as one example of a state where he doesn‘t believe Romney’s faith will count against him.
The Huffington Post highlighted South Carolina exit polls earlier this month that did show some intriguing statistics about voters who care strongly about candidates’ beliefs:
Exit polls show that 43 percent of voters who said that the candidates’ religious beliefs mattered “a great deal” went for Gingrich. Only 9 percent went for Romney — a lower percentage than he netted overall, where he is running in second. In contrast, of voters who said the religious beliefs of candidates didn’t matter to them at all, Romney won 42 percent.
As you may recall, following Romney’s South Carolina loss, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee reiterated his belief that Mormonism shouldn’t be an issue for voters. That being said, he went on to say that Romney should address his faith in “a very calm and thoughtful way.”
In assessing the alleged anti-Mormonism in South Carolina, though, HotAir’s Allah Pundit has some interesting counter points and poll numbers that may cast doubt on McCain’s theory:
On January 16, just five days before the primary, Rasmussen had Romney up by 14 points. The Fox News debate with the exchange between Newt and Juan Williams was held that night; two days later, Politico’s new poll found Romney’s lead cut in half. That was the last poll in which Gingrich trailed. Other polls taken on the 18th showed him leading Romney narrowly and then, after the CNN debate on the 19th in which he unloaded on John King, his numbers took off and he ended up winning by 13 points. Was anti-Mormonism a major contributing factor to a 27-point swing in five days even though no one of any significance was talking about Romney’s faith? Seriously?
In the end, the jury may be out still regarding how important Romney’s faith is to voters, but as we’ve noted in an extensive review of polls and current standings, Mormonism is not expected to impact the candidate much in the general election.
(H/T: Real Clear Politics)
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Comments (314)
garyM
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:38amThe truth live here on THE BLAZE MY BUTT!
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:40amnothing but a propganda tool for Beck’s cult!
Report Post »Stuck_in_CA
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:44amRomney in Panama City Beach: Will Cut Waste in DOD “to Pay For ObamaCare”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PipWtwfUkQY
No kidding!!! Listen @ 1:10
Report Post »bolsen00
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:45amThis story is certainly true! They announced it just before calling the election for Gingrich!
Report Post »Patrick Henry II
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:14amLOL…. McCain made fun of Mormonism right before IA in 08. McCain used that weapon himself. McCain has no leg to stand on.
Report Post »Detroit paperboy
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:16amMcCain is as large a douche bag as they come… Hey John, go the hell away, and take your DingBat daughter with you…. Good bye !!!
Report Post »Detroit paperboy
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:20amMcLames endorsement of Romney, is reason enough for me to not vote for him…..
Report Post »P8riot
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:27amyou’ve named your butt “the blaze” and the truth lives on it? lol
Report Post »lillymckim
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:00amAnother simplified lie … I’m frankly appalled Mr. McCain.
Report Post »Sleazy Hippo
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:38amIs this the same South Carolina that had a whisper campaign regarding John McCain’s “black daughter out of wedlock?”
Report Post »Hobbs57
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:59amWell, what a surprise, the number one bigot leads the way in commenting, Gary. Should I be surprised ? At least you admit it though, I can respect that Gary, seriously. The ones that bother me are the bigots who pretend they have other reasons they hate a person. I mean, it is pretty easy to tell, even though part of my studies concern social psychology, I believe most people can tell when a person just makes single line hate comments with nothing to back their claim, are typically the bigots. However, with that being said, envy, jealousy, and other fear based insecurities also produce similar demonstrations of emotional reflex of baseless hate and anger. Ironically, people who practice these behaviors actually are angry with and hate themselves. This is what Obama is hoping to work with, as Hitler used Germany’s legitimate feelings hopelessness due to the consequences of WWI and the known hate and bigotry towards outsiders and specifically Jews, to formulate one of the most horrific demonstrations of just how evil and unreasonable man can be when instinctual fears are played upon through propaganda and demonetization. What I find sickening is this is exactly what Newt Gingrich is doing. Like the push grandma off a cliff used by the Liberals, Newt campaign is trying to scare people playing on the Evangelicals fears while undermining capitalism as an unfair and evil practice that men like Romney used to take advantage of people. The bloodmoney video,perfect example.
Report Post »Polwatcher
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 3:17pmNot only is McCain a loser but he is a sore loser.
Report Post »smithclar3nc3
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 4:21pmWell obvious anyone who voted against Romney is anti-mormon just like anyone who votes against Obama is racist
Report Post »beckwasfox
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 4:45pmMcCain has a point. There was definitely and anti shameless whore element that cost McCain the presidency in 2008.
Report Post »Hobbs57
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 6:40pmYeah detrroit paperboy, good of reason as any. Not that sitting with Nancy Pelosi on a couch speaking about global warming is reason or anything.
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 7:07pmStuck_in_CA, you missed the word “NOT”. Someone was shouting when he said it but Mitt said he is NOT going to use the waste to pay for Obamacare. He said he is going to use it to modernize the military and take care of the veterans.
Report Post »RJL
Posted on January 31, 2012 at 1:17pmDid anyone tell McBlame he lost?
Report Post »BubbaCoop
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:38amIt‘s a shame Arizona voters didn’t retire him when they had the chance
Report Post »doomytram
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:21amThere is a large element of Anti-McCainism in these United States of America! The Goyter Faced Troll – John McCain and The Wrinkled up Rancorous Shrew in Harry Reid are right behind President Oblamer in the list of people that need to hush and go home.
Harry Reid helps push the notion of Anybody but Oblamer and John McCain helps push the notion of Anybody but Romney.
The above mentioned Senators and the president are the worst people in the United States of America 1,2,3 in any order they must go.
Report Post »FROTHYDISCHARGE
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:46pm@JROOK. The silence was golden probably because they didn‘t know what the hell you were talking about since you’re referencing the doctrine of the Jehovah’s Witnesses. But you keep bashing you’ll get the right religion soon enough. I’m sure you got it all together and pass judgement so Rock on.
Report Post »ProbIemSoIver
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 1:34pmThis POS better be glad the Country is not full of ProbiemSoivers.
Report Post »This clown would shut his pie-hole, and never show his face again.
jado1981
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 2:28pmMCSLEDGE
Did Christ have it wrong when he spoke to the other thief on the cross, when he said, “I say to you, Today, you WILL be in paradise”?
Baptism is nothing more than a symbolic representation of us dying to our old sinful selves and the new birth of the Holy Spirit within us. It is not imperative, as to suggest there is a list of works that must be done to “earn” heaven, but it is suggested as an act of obedience. Sure all believers should be baptized, but I honestly doubt that Jesus was up at the gates when the thief came to enter, and said, “well, what I meant was…”
OHSundevil
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 2:52pmThe whole time I lived in AZ I tried to get McCain out, that included voting for Dems…no luck, the sheep follow the herd. Leave it to McCain to play the religious “race” card if you will.
Report Post »TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:37amMy concern with Ronmney is that he is a flip-flopping flip-flopper. He is not conservative. If we’re stuck with him, well, I will vote GOP nonetheless. By the way, how do mormons attain salvation? Anyone?
Report Post »TerryDo
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:51amThe same way that you can, by the grace of God.
Report Post »BODYBAG
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:00ammagic underwear on the planet kolub…no joke:
http://1857massacre.com/MMM/mormon_underwear.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob
TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:00amTrue enough, Terry. Though, I was looking for specifics that the mormon faith teaches.
Report Post »PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:06amLet me try to explain the Mormon view of Salvation.
Report Post »1. Eligibility
2. Qualification
3. Power
We believe all God’s children are eligible at birth to be saved. Nothing is required, nothing is earned, we are eligible because we are children of a loving Father. This is why we do not baptize little children before they are accountable.
We also believe, as do most Evangelicals, that one must qualify oneself to be saved. For the Evangelical the qualification is simple, just accept Christ as your Savior and you are qualified. Mormons believe that one must be baptized by proper authority and one must endure to the end to qualify for Salvation. (James 2:14-20, “Faith without works is dead,” and Matt 7:21 “Not everyone that sayeth unto me Lord, Lord shall enter into the kingdom of Heaven, but he that doeth the will of my Father.” Qualification is a lifelong pursuit of righteousness.
Now for the important part, Power. The power of Salvation comes only in and through the blood of Christ. Only Christ has the power to save. Being eligible is not enough, being qualified is not enough. Without the atoning blood and power of the Savior Jesus Christ all are fallen and lost. Thus the scriptures that talk about salvation coming from “Grace…. not of works, lest any man boast.”
Mormons do not believe that we are saved by our works. We do believe that our good works can qualify us and our evil works can disqualify us for Salvation. A very scripturally based belief.
brickroad
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:07amFollow Christ. Repent of my sins. Be my Brothers Keeper. Forgive. Serve Others. Keep the Commandments. Be Humble.
Report Post »Alastair
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:08am@troninthemorning
http://mormon.org/plan-of-happiness/
Scroll to the bottom, but I would also recommend reading the entire page for a clearer picture
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:16amthe only problem is that your “jesus” you put your faith in is the make believe jesus of Smith..NOT the Jesus of the Bible..sorry..but you have bought into the lies of hell
Report Post »PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:26am@WHKELL,
Report Post »All of the scriptures I quoted come from the Bible. I quote scripture yet in most of your posts you have simple repteated anti Mormon rantings. The Book of Mormon says, “The spirit of contention is of the devil.” Most of the Mormons posting here do so in a respectful, calm, loving way. Most Mormon haters spew vile, mean spritited, hate filled stuff. Take an honest look at the posts and see who is spreading contention and who is not.
TRONINTHEMORNING
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:27amThanks for the input, folks. I am one of those evangelicals that believes trusting Christ; Christ alone, settles the sin question and the salvation question. Works come after individual salvation has been attained.
Report Post »martinez012577
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:33amIf Romney gets the nomination this is what you have voted for.
A guy that believes he can become a god.
A guy that believes that God was once a man on another planet.
A guy that believes Jesus and Satan are brothers.
A guy that believes that almost everyone goes to part of Heaven. Muslims, Hindu, and Scientologists are all on lower tiers of Heaven with the mean old evangelicals.
A guy that believes his founding prophet received the Mormon gospel from the angel Moroni. Even though it clear says in the Bible
Galatians 1:8
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!
A guy that like his faith sways politically just like his religion does. Mormons believe their living prophet gets revelations from God. This allows them to make changes to the gospel. I guess God changes his mind on things alot. For example polygamy and blacks in the church.
Romney will not get the evangelical vote from people who know anything about Mormons. The Mormons have tried to become accepted by other Christian faiths, the problem is they are worshiping a different God and Jesus Christ. They will hammer you with Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, but they believe they can become just like him. No one can become like Jesus. If you think you can, you arent worshiping the same Jesus as I am.
Oh and we are adopted children of God. Not biological. Mormons believe God with his many wives made us “s
Report Post »martinez012577
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:36amcontinued…
“spirit babies”.
Report Post »PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:37am@Tron
Report Post »You are welcome. To learn more of what we believe you can always go to LDS.org. Or you can always read WHKELL, he seems to think he knows all about us.
There is a very common misconception about Mormons. Many people think that we think we are saved by works, that is simply not true. We know that salvation comes only through the Atonement of Christ. Have a nice day.
PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:59am@martinez
Report Post »I have an honest question for you. I am not looking to have a fight or an argument, I have always wondered what evangelicals believe on this point. Who created Satan? Where did he come from? Mormons believe that Satan was a son of God, the Bible describes him as a son of the morning, (Isaiah 14:12) and yes, that would make him a brother to Jesus, and that he rebelled against God and was thrust out with a third of the hosts of Heaven and now he fights against God. What do evangelicals beleive and what scriptures can you give me to describe what you believe?
Alastair
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:33am@ Martinez
Quote:
A guy that like his faith sways politically just like his religion does. Mormons believe their living prophet gets revelations from God. This allows them to make changes to the gospel. I guess God changes his mind on things alot. For example polygamy and blacks in the church.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I guess when Abraham was commanded to kill his son he should have done it and ignored being told to stop.
Is it so hard for you to believe that God LEADS man? He doesn’t put out a playbook (ie bible) and say “Have fun, suckers!”. His is the coach and can make adjustments as the game progresses. One of the best things about having God as your coach in life is that he knows what’s up ahead way before you do! haha
So maybe our Heavenly Father knew that the only way to keep the Latter Day Saints alive was for them to reproduce AND TAKE CARE OF THE WIDOWS OF THE CHURCH. Did you know that less than 10% of LDS members had another wife, and less than 10% of that 10% had more than two? Many of these “wives” were simply old widows who could not take care of themselves! There was nothing sexual with these widowed women, and it was only the most pure form of Christ-like charity and love for them that they were married. And WHY were there so many widows in the LDS church? It could have something to do with the men being killed by people with views like yours… And I thought we lived in the United States of America, where we were free to exerc
Report Post »JRook
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:47am@PGMike Perhaps you can clear something up for me. Back in the 1990′s the Church of Ladder Day Saints used to have in their welcome brochure that 144,000 people would be saved. When I asked the individuals, who had disturbed my privacy by coming to my door in the first place, how many members their were in the church they proudly indicated that they had well over 1,000,000 members. So of course I asked them which of the 1,000,000 would be saved if, as their literature stated on 144,000 would be. The silence was golden. The referenced statement has since been removed from their literature.
Report Post »NWWADD
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:54amFirst thing you can do is START following the 10 COMMANDMENTS not the (10 SUGGESTIONS).
Report Post »2nd, stop being self-righteous.
Alastair
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:56am@ JRook
I‘m pretty sure you are thinking of Jehovah’s Witnesses, NOT Mormon missionaries.
Report Post »P8riot
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:10pmI think we’re all going to have to agree to disagree :)
Report Post »kozski
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:34pmBy works, not by grace.
Report Post »cindysplowboy
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:49pmThis is a great question and could be misunderstood. You need to understand the the difference between salvation and exaltation. Salvation is a free gift through the grace of Christ and exaltation must be earned through works. The word salvation means saving, of course with the same Latin root that Savior has. All men (and women) will be saved. So, what are they saved from? They are saved from death. Christ rose from the grave and became the first fruits of them that slept. A Book of Mormon verse states: As in Adam all men die, even so in Christ, shall all be made alive. This may not be verbatim but point is that the gift of life after death is granted unto all men, not just some men or those who repent, but all men. Meaning that all men, through all generations will live forever and ever in a immortal state of eternal bliss. However, exaltation is a much higher more privileged blessing of eternal glory which must be earned.
Report Post »FROTHYDISCHARGE
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:58pm@JROOK. The silence was golden probably because they didn‘t know what the hell you were talking about since you’re referencing the doctrine of the Jehovah’s Witnesses. But you keep bashing you’ll get the right religion soon enough. I’m sure you got it all together and pass judgement so Rock on.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 1:27pmJrook;
“Back in the 1990′s the Church of Ladder Day Saints used to have in their welcome brochure that 144,000 people would be saved.”
As has been pointed out to you by alastair and PGMike, this is Jehovah‘s Witness’ doctrine, not Latter-Day Saint.
Report Post »martinez012577
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 1:36pm@pgmike
I posted a response to you, but it put it on another page.
@alastair
I believe God does lead men. You trying to compare the story of Abraham to the Mormon change in believing in polygamy and black people is laughable. Abraham’s story is one of faith. It is there to teach us something. The false teachings of Joseph Smith are there to deceive.
You are saying that the Latter day saints were trying to take care of widows, that is why polygamy was accepted? REALLY? Was the 14yr girl Joseph Smith married a widow? How about the other 32 he married? Were they all widows? No, he is a proven false prophet and his teaching lead people to believe they are worshiping Jesus Christ of the Bible, but if you truely believe the teachings of the Mormons you cannot be worshiping the same Jesus Christ and God of the Bible.
Look as far as making a connection with me and Mormons being killed is just lame. The only problem I have with Mormons is they lead Christians away from Jesus Christ and God of the Bible.
As far as Romney goes, I dont want a guy that thinks he can become a god to be president.
Report Post »mcsledge
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 1:45pmGood question:
First, it comes by faith in the Lord, Jesus Christ.
Second, it’s followed by sincere repentance.
Third, faith and repentence lead to the baptism of water by immersion (symbolic of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ – Paul) by one with authority.
Fourth, the newly baptized is given the gift of the Holy Ghost (Spirit), thereby completing Christ’s commandment that one must be born of the water and the Spirit in order to enter into the Kingdom of God.
Fifth, the individual must obey God’s commandments, perform the necessary covenants and endure to the end.
It is a straight gate and narrow way, but a few of God’s sons and daughters have found it.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 3:25pmMartinez;
Still spewing the same lines I see.
So, if we voted for Martinez we’d be voting for:
1) Someone who is already a god and stand to be a joint-heir with Christ in the eternities. (That’s an infinite inheritence)
2) Bares false wtness against his Mormon neighbors by saying that they believe that God was a man from anther planet.
3) Disagrees with the idea that the Father created all things and all others. The Father is the “one true God”. He is El Elyon (“God Most High”) and beholds himself to a man-made philosophy of the Holy Trinity.
4) Believes that the vast majority of God’s children / created beings will go to Hell. This mostl ikely includes small children and curretly more than half the world’s population who never even heard of Jesus Christ let alone was taught His divine truths.
5) Rejects the visitation of angels for even if they preach the *same* gospel of old, they are something inherently evil.
Good luck voting for Obama or not voting at all after Romney wins the nomination.
Report Post »Alastair
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 3:41pm@ martinez012577
The Abraham analogy fits perfectly, I don‘t know why you can’t see it, besides your clouded pre-conceived notions. How about God leading Moses and the children of Isriel to be lost for 40 years? I bet that was something Moses did wrong, correct? Had nothing to do with the people, but everything to do with Moses (this is sarcasm)
You mis-read my sentence about polygamy, so the onus is on you to re-read and not for me to re-explain.
It’s kindof funny to read your arguments about “not being the Jesus of the Bible”. I guess I read a different King James version of the Bible!!!
Maybe this is why South Carolina went for Newt, they’re as steadfast in hard-headedness as martinez012577!!
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 3:56pmMartinez;
“You trying to compare the story of Abraham to the Mormon change in believing in polygamy and black people is laughable. ”
First and foremost Abraham wasa polygamist and so he’d be the perfect comparison as to how God allowed polygamy and then not. As for the Blacks not having the Preisthood, the explaination is a bit more complicated. first and foremost, Mromons never thought or taught in any official capacity that Blacks will not recieve all the blessings of the Father. As forthe Preisthood the only conclusion one can make concretely is that there was confusion among the leaders ofthe LDS church whether or not Joseph Smith rescinded the ordination of blacks tothe Priesthood and to leadership positions in the LDS Church. There was nothing from God on the matter. Brigham Young stopped ordaining blacks to the Priesthood. That pains me but it did happen. Nobody knows exactly. For the best take on the development of blacks and the Priesthood, read through blacklds.org.
http://www.blacklds.org/
I strongly encourage you to read the sublink from the site. It’ll summarize the history of blaks LDS and the Preisthood:
http://www.blacklds.org/history
For the revelation itself to extend the Preithood to all worthy male members, please read the following link:
http://www.blacklds.org/declare2
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 6:04pmMartinez;
Click on page three and read two replies I made to you.
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 7:48pmDarren, I‘m sure Martinez will be entertained with a little disagreement among fellow Mormons but I’ve got to take you to task a little. When you say “There was nothing from God on the matter. Brigham Young stopped ordaining blacks to the Priesthood.” you not only implicate Brigham Young but all the prophets down to Spencer Kimball and maybe even him as he never said it was not God’s will but that now was the time to extend the priesthood responsibilities.
Yes there was something from God on the matter. God said (as revealed to Joseph Smith)
Report Post »Abraham 1
26 Pharaoh, being a righteous man, established his kingdom and judged his people wisely and justly all his days, seeking earnestly to imitate that order established by the fathers in the first generations, in the days of the first patriarchal reign, even in the reign of Adam, and also of Noah, his father, who blessed him with the blessings of the earth, and with the blessings of wisdom, but cursed him as pertaining to the Priesthood.
27 Now, Pharaoh being of that lineage by which he could not have the right of Priesthood, notwithstanding the Pharaohs would fain claim it from Noah, through Ham, therefore my father was led away by their idolatry;
cont.
joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 7:49pmNotice that being unable to hold the priesthood did not imply unworthiness as Pharaoh was called a righteous man and a wise man.
To imply that Brigham Young and all the following Prophets were wrong is no different than implying that Jesus was wrong to not only withhold the priesthood but also withhold the gospel from the gentiles.
The principle of continuing revelation let Peter know when the time was right just as that same principle let Spencer Kimball know when the time was right. And don’t forget that for centuries both the gospel and the priesthood was withheld from the entire world.
Report Post »PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:16pm@JRook,
Report Post »Sorry, I have been at work all day. Somebody has to pay taxes right? the 144,000 is definetly JW doctrine and not Latter Day Saint. People get us confused because we both go door to door but our doctrines are very different.
@Martinez,
Thanks for responding but I do not know where to look. Can you cut and past it back here? I will check Tuesday AM. Thanks again I have always been curious.
Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:19pmJoel228;
“When you say “There was nothing from God on the matter. Brigham Young stopped ordaining blacks to the Priesthood.” you not only implicate Brigham Young but all the prophets down to Spencer Kimball and maybe even him as he never said it was not God’s will but that now was the time to extend the priesthood responsibilities.”
What you’re citing is a *possible* reason for blacks not having the Priesthood. Truth be told we do not know for sure wy Brigham Young stopped ordaining the Preisthood to blacks. And if the Book of Abraham is the source of God saying that blacks should not have the Preisthood, then why did Joseph Smith, who translated the Book of Abraham ordain blacks to the Preisthood?
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:57pmI believe Joseph Smith did ordain at least a couple of blacks to the priesthood. I think he also told him or them not to use it. I don’t have a reference to that at the moment.
What I do have is Spencer Kimball saying this was the position from “the prophet of the restoration”. That would be Joseph Smith. See pg 448 below
Spencer W. Kimball, The Teachings of Spencer W. Kimball, edited by Edward L. Kimball, p.237
Report Post »A special problem exists with respect to blacks because they may not now [1972] receive the priesthood. Some members of the Church would justify their own un-Christian discrimination against blacks because of that rule with respect to the priesthood, but while this restriction has been imposed by the Lord, it is not for us to add burdens upon the shoulders of our black brethren. They who have received Christ in faith through authoritative baptism are heirs to the celestial kingdom along with men of all other races.
cont,
joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:58pmp 448
Report Post »The prophets for 133 years of the existence of the Church have maintained the position of the prophet of the Restoration that the ***** could not hold the priesthood nor have the temple ordinances which are preparatory for exaltation. I believe in the living prophets as much or almost more than the dead ones. They are here to clarify and reaffirm. I have served with and under three of them. The doctrine or policy has not varied in my memory. I know it could. I know the Lord could change his policy and release the ban and forgive the possible error which brought about the deprivation. If the time comes, that he will do, I am sure. These smart members who would force the issue, and there are many of them, cheapen the issue and certainly bring into contempt the sacred principle of revelation and divine authority. (6/15/63)
joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:03pmOh, and even more importantly notice that President Kimball said “this restriction has been imposed by the Lord”
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:18pmJoel228;
‘I believe Joseph Smith did ordain at least a couple of blacks to the priesthood. I think he also told him or them not to use it. I don’t have a reference to that at the moment.”
That would be incorrect.
“1836: In March, Elijah Abel, a black man, is ordained to the office of Elder.
1836: In December, Elijah Abel, is ordained to the office of Seventy.
1844: Walker Lewis, a black man, is ordained to the office of Elder.
1846: William McCary, a black man, is ordained to the office of Elder.
1900: Enoch Abel, the son of Elijah Abel, is ordained to the office of Elder.
1935: Elijah Abel, grandson of Elijah Abel, is ordained to the office of Elder.”
http://www.blacklds.org/priesthood
There’s no way one can be ordained to the office of Seventy if you cannot use the Preisthood. firthermore, there’s this:
“1838: Sister Eunice Kinney Taught and Baptized by Elijah Abel”
http://www.blacklds.org/history
As for Kimball, he reflects precisely what I said earlier: that there was confusion among church leaders if Joseph smith had rescinded te Priesthood among blacks he had ordained. Joseph F. Smith wreflects both these sides. Usingthe same second link you’ll read, “1895…Joseph F. Smith is a strong advocate that Joseph meant for blacks to received the priesthood.”, then “1908: Joseph F. Smith Changes His Position Relative to Blacks”. There is no known reason as to the change of mind.
(con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:23pm(con’t)
“Oh, and even more importantly notice that President Kimball said “this restriction has been imposed by the Lord””
Yeah, I caught tha the first time. ;>)
If by “imposed” you mean theat god revealed the imposition then whom wasthe revelation given and what did the Lord reveal? My view is that when the brethenen referred to the Priesthood ban as some sort of God’s will they were referring otthe fact that the Lord allowed it to happen and said nothing regarding that status changing. As to why, I don’t think anyone knows. Reason of Cain and the Curse of Ham are only suppositions; not official doctrine. in fact they are far from beng official doctrine. What is official doctrine is the blessed revelation lifting the ban.
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:24pmFound references. They were Elijah Abel and Walker Lewis but it’s not as clear cut as you imply.
Harold B. Lee April 19, 1961, BYU Speeches of the Year, 1961, p.7
Report Post »Some are heralding the fact that there was one of colored blood, Elijah Abel, who was ordained a Seventy in the early days. They go to the Church chronology and find the date of this ordination, and hold that up as saying that we departed from what was started way back, but they forget that also in Church history is another interesting observation. President Joseph F. Smith is quoted in a statement under date of August 26, 1908, when he referred to Elijah Abel who was ordained a Seventy in the days of the Prophet and to whom was issued a Seventy’s certificate. This ordination, when found out, was declared null and void by the Prophet himself and so likewise by the next three presidents who succeeded the Prophet Joseph. Somehow because of a little lapse, or a little failure to do research properly, some people reach a conclusion that they had wanted to reach and to make it appear as though something had been done way back from which we had departed and which now ought to be set in order. The Prophet Joseph Smith said, “That person who rises up to condemn the Church, saying that the Church is out of the way while he himself is righteous, then know surely that the man is on the road to apostasy, and unless he will repent he will apostatize as surely as God lives.”
joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:29pmAnd you should not use blacklds.org for your references to in any way suggest official church position. I don’t fault them and they do have a well written disclaimer at the bottom of the site but they can be as wrong as others have been about the matter.
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:39pmI don’t want to offend but I will add that your position that the church / prophets made a mistake and departed from what was first instituted is no different than those who try to apologize for the practice of polygamy for 50 years. Both doctrines can be easily defended biblically and an apology or suggestion that one is needed lessens all your other arguments about the truth of the church and the restoration of the gospel. Harold B Lee was absolutely correct. In fact I get more irritated when I have to defend the truth from members of my own faith in front of those that already hate us.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:03pmBrother Joel;
No worries about my practicing polygamy. First, it’s abominable before the eyes of God. Second, I really do not want another wife. Third, if I did, Mrs. Darren would shoot me. (Dang, I love that woman).
BlackLDS has this full post regarding Joseph F. Smith:
“1908: Joseph F. Smith Changes His Position Relative to Blacks
Joseph F. Smith abandons his former position on Elijah Abel’s status and now claims that Joseph Smith declared Abel’s ordination “null and void.” (Council Minutes, 26 August, as quoted in Neither White nor Black, Signature Books, pg. 140) Historians today don’t understand this reversal, as Smith had Abel’s ordination certificates which supported his earlier (strongly held) position and don’t support his new views”
I think that was what Lee was referring to. Though admitedly Hardol B. Lee is a much more reliable source for official Church positions, he did not proclaim any official church position; nor are BYU speeches official Church positions. If “Council minutes, 26 August, as quoted from Neither White nor Black” was what Lee referred to then I‘m in no worry as to saying what I’m saying regarding the Preisthood ban.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:16pmBrother Joel;
If Joseph Smith did indeed nulify the Priesthood ordained to Elijah Abel then why did Abel’s descendenyts recieve the Priesthood? Also, BlakcLDS points out something important which relates to your citation of Harold B. Lee’s 1961 seech:
“1978: Bruce R. McConkie Comments on Black Issue
Elder McConkie states that “we should forget everything that has been said in the past on this topic.“”
Here’s a direct link to that source: http://www.blacklds.org/quotes#mcconkie
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:43pm@ darren
1. When have I ever said I could become a god? When have I implied I am one? I haven’t, you sir are a liar for even typing that.
2. So Darren you are going to say, your faith doesn’t believe they you can become a god? Last time I checked, your faith believed with a sacred marriage and works Mormons can become exalted and progress to become like their father in Heaven. This is backed by the idea that God procreated with many goddess wives and made spirit babies to populate earth.
Problem with that theory like I posted in response I believe on page three that the Bible clearly says we arent his children until we accept him in to our hearts. We are adopted children and like adopted children here on earth, they do not inherit the genes from the adopted parent.
3. I do believe God created everything. I dont believe we are his biological children. Just as I dont believe Satan is his son.
4. Kind of goes back to number 2 and 3. I believe he created all, but we are not his children to begin with. I believe if you do not accept the Jesus Christ of the Bible into your heart you will go to hell. So yes, Muslims, Hindu, Mormons, and Scientologists are going to hell. I am trying to lead you to the Jesus Christ of the Bible not insult you. Are you insulting someone when you do your missionary and tell them to believe in what you believe in? No you are trying to save them. Only problem is you are leading them the wrong way.
continued..
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:02pmContinued..
@ darren
5. I reject “new testaments” from an angel when the Bible was so very clear to not accept any new gospel from an angel. I mean Mormons, does that not bother you one slight bit that you might actually be on the wrong side of this?
He is there Bible verse.
gal 1-6
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
gal 1-7
Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
gal 1-8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
It almost looks like those verses were talking about the Mormon church. What is sad is there are so many strikes against the Mormon church proving it false, but they way the church makes it so hard to question or leave the church is why most wont resist. I have a Mormon friend that would never leave because he wouldnt want to leave his family. He said his family would disown him.
Romney will not win, because he will not get the support from the evangelicals that know what he believes.
I am voting for Ron Paul.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:07pmMutiny;
Are you Martinez? Sweet. you’re, like, the Unholy Dinity: two false witnessing religious persons in one poster.
“1. When have I ever said I could become a god? When have I implied I am one? I haven’t, you sir are a liar for even typing that.”
I’m no liar; just a scriptorian (OK, with a lot of help from Bing and other search engines). i never said you said you were a god. But Jesus did.
“your faith doesn’t believe they you can become a god? Last time I checked, your faith believed with a sacred marriage and works Mormons can become exalted and progress to become like their father in Heaven.”
What in the world did you check? Exalted? Yes. Celectial marriage necessary? Yes. Works needed? Yes. But you’re missing a vastly important ingredient. Grace. All is null and void without the grace fo Christ. That’s what the Book of Mormon teaches as well as all official LDS doctrines. And Whose “Father in heaven” are you referring to? You reapeat this line but to nobody’s surprise, it’s not true. Mormons do not believe that they’ll become a Father in heaven to any being. It‘s an idea and I’m fine with it but just an idea. No bearing upon the LDS faith or worship. I thought representing the truth was important to you. Forgive my ignorance.
And I already replied to your page three posts.
(con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:16pm(con’t)
“This is backed by the idea that God procreated with many goddess wives and made spirit babies to populate earth.”
No official LDS doctrine says any such thing about “goddesses”. And the exact mechanics which God created “spirit babies” is not known to man as far as I can tell.
“Just as I dont believe Satan is his son.”
” 6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.(Job 1). While I will say that there is perfect reason to interpret thisp assage as meaning “in addition to the sons of God woh came to presente htemselves, Satan was among them…” but what’s unbiblical about interpreting this passage as the sons / children of God coming to present themselves to God and one of the sons was Satan”?
“we arent his children until we accept him in to our hearts. We are adopted children and like adopted children here on earth”
That’s part of our divinization; not the nature of our creation (see my page three reply).
“they do not inherit the genes from the adopted parent.”
Oh, I think the righteous will experience quite a bit of corporal changes whe deified.
(con’t)
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:29pm(con’t)
“I believe if you do not accept the Jesus Christ of the Bible into your heart you will go to hell. So yes, Muslims, Hindu, Mormons, and Scientologists are going to hell.”
See you there then. Be thankful that Mormons are going to Hell. They’ll make the place a lot more pretty and orderly by the time you arrive.
It’s good to know that saints like you know who have accepted Jesus in their hearts or not. Even young children and billions of God’s children who were never taught of Jesus Christ. In the LDS perspective, God has provded a way for all His children (that’s every human man, woman, and child) can learn of Christ and choose to come unto Him. When the LDS read the words of Jesus that He is the way, truth and light and that all must be born of wtater andof spirit, we take it seriously and our doctrines focus precisely on coming unto Him.
“Are you insulting someone when you do your missionary and tell them to believe in what you believe in? No you are trying to save them.”
¡Correctomundo!
This page has been pushed off the front page of The Blaze. That’s about time I move on.
It’s been nice. I‘m totally stoked that you’re Martinez. Sweet!
Report Post »Mutiny
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:30pm@ darren
Just because Satan was with them doesnt mean he is one. God created Satan, I agree, but Satan isnt his son. Its a pretty far stretch to take that verse and come up with Satan and Jesus are brothers.
Havent gotten to page three, yet. Reading other posts and facebooking.
Report Post »Darren
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:36pmMutiny;
Ha, I refreshed and caught your continuation posts.
“5. I reject “new testaments” from an angel when the Bible was so very clear to not accept any new gospel from an angel.”
There was no “new” as in “different” gospel preached by Moroni or any angel of God. So, no, this doesn’t bother me. Were not wrong on this. I know by the Spirit ofthe Lord that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints in God’s true church restored to the earth. you can know this too.
“What is sad is there are so many strikes against the Mormon church proving it false, but they way the church makes it so hard to question or leave the church is why most wont resist.”
Huh? Aren’t we questioning it now? And it’s no secret to leave the LDS Church. Send a request ot your bishop to have your records removed. That’s it.
“Romney will not win, because he will not get the support from the evangelicals that know what he believes. ”
Here’s a recommendation for you: Why Evangelicals Should Support Mitt Romney (And Feel Good About It!)
http://www.patheos.com/Books/Patheos-Press/Why-Evangelicals-Should-Support-Mitt-Romney.html
“I am voting for Ron Paul.”
LOL, figures. And he won‘t win because he can’t get the support of, well, anyone.
Good night Mutiny Martinez.
Take care and God bless.
Report Post »garyM
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:35amA citizen is allowed to vote for the candidate of their choice upon their convictions alone, it is not required to make those convictions public, as a matter of fact it is a constitutional right not to, that’s why they have voter privacy booths at the polls. The Blaze is playing the Mormon card as Obama plays the race card. Romney and Obama have several things in common, one being that both have a slobbering love affair with the press. They are not both liberal, Obama is a socialist and Romney is a liberal. Yet another attempt on the eve of the Florida primary for the Blaze to lead the dumb sheep to vote for Romney in an effort to show their non-religious discrimination. You’d be surprised at the people that felt it necessary to vote for Obama to keep from looking like a racist even though they did not want to vote for him based solely on his inexperience but they did just so they could prove their non-racism. It is my hunch that many Christians vote for someone closest to their theological beliefs. I can see why many Christians would not vote for Romney anywhere based on his confession of Mormonism. Mormonism is not based upon the Bible alone. In my opinion there are man made doctrines added to the Mormon beliefs just as there are man made doctrines added to a Mason’s beliefs and others. Last time I checked a person could vote for whom they choose without disclosing why!.Whether I or anyone else uses that opinion in their decision to vote for anyone is no ones business!
Report Post »hjbones
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:12amIs it their right? Yeah. Is it the right thing to do? probably not. I’m a Mormon, and (obviously) have a strong belief in God, but would have no problem voting for an atheist if I thought he was the right man for the job. Honestly, Romney wouldn’t be my first choice for president.
Report Post »Alastair
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:08pm@ garyM
LOL at “the Blaze is playing the mormon card”. Maybe they’re simply reporting the news instead of sweeping it under the rug like the main-stream-media.
I’m a mormon and I will not vote for Mitt Romney. The fact that we go to the same church does not make us any more intertwined than the guy that keeps stealing my lunch from the fridge at work.
If she was alive today and had any political aspirations (which I highly doubt she would), I would vote for Ayn Rand, who is very well known as an atheist.
Report Post »chicago76
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 1:26pmWell said, and I suppose there will be those who proclaim loudly you are wrong, but that same person who says that will vote for Romney because he is a Mormon. etc. I think that is just as wrong, but in our society it is his right.
Report Post »Chuck Stein
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 3:00pm@ GaryM
Report Post »“man made doctrines”? The most popular man made doctrine in Christianity is the doctrine of the “Trinity” which comes into Christianity through the Gnostics who looked to Greek philosophers (Plato and Aristotle, in particular). Mormons do not follow that man made doctrine. Mormons believed in God the Father, His Son — Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. Mormons do not, however, adopt the Nicean Creed (which accepted a type of “Hellenized” Christianity) and its formulation of a “Trinity” — which formulation runs counter to many Biblical passages.
DrFrost
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 5:08pm@HJBONES
It is not wrong to vote for people with similar beliefs to your own, whether those beliefs are religious or otherwise. So yeah… to those people to whom religion is very important I expect them to vote for the candidate whose religious beliefs most closely resembles their own. Again, nothing wrong with that.
Of course it could also be because Newt is the only candidate who has a plan to deal with the anti-religious crusade our government has been going on lately. Correlation does not prove causality. I’m a christian and I would gladly vote for a mormon if I thought they were the right person for the job.
In this race I’m really torn. What bothers me most about Romney is that he says he‘s against a big federal government but according to his record and statements he doesn’t seem to be opposed to a big state government. I’d rather have someone opposed to big government on principal.
Newt carries a lot of baggage, personal and otherwise. He was at the forefront of a lot of change… a republican majority, balanced budgets, etc…. And no one likes change. Simply put, he made a lot of enemies. That could really hurt him during a general election. If he could get elected I think he’d be a great president.
Dr. Paul has a domestic policy I love and a foreign policy that, unfortunately, disqualifies him.
I like Santorum but I don‘t believe he’s executed a winning strategy in this race. Given his lack of money and national exposure 201
Report Post »hjbones
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 5:58pm@DRFROST,
All I meant by my above statement was that you shouldn‘t vote for an evangelical christian just because they’re an evangelical christian, just as you shouldn‘t vote for a mormon just becase they’re a mormon. It‘s the same as voting for Obama just because he’s black, and could end up being just as disastrous. But that’s just my opinion.
Also, thank you for being civil and polite in presenting your argument. That concept seems to be beyond a lot of people on this site.
Report Post »Alastair
Posted on January 31, 2012 at 5:02pm@ DRFROST
Quote:
Dr. Paul has a domestic policy I love and a foreign policy that, unfortunately, disqualifies him.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I’ll fix your post:
Dr. Paul has a domestic policy that I love (among which is cutting a trillion dollars) and a foreign policy that is strictly constitutional and LEGAL, opposed to the ILLEGAL actions taken by the federal government today.
Much better ^_~
Report Post »Lonescrapper
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:27amI believe it. What is the difference between Newt and Mitt except ethics violations, adultery and throwing your kids in front of the media to protect himself? Could it be …. MORMON?
Report Post »lillymckim
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:34amA loss is a loss is a loss Demint also said whoever wins SC wins the race…
The polls also had Romney winning SC remember?
Remember “Reagan” was not the choice of the establishment either .. FORD was…. and HE lost to the second worst President Carter!… McCain was one and the same.
Report Post »katiefrankie
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 4:07pmBWA HA HA!! Lonescrapper, that was beautiful.
I cast my ballot for McCain in 2008, but with sadness – I wanted someone else in the Republican slot. I wasn’t fooled for a MINUTE by Obama (and I wasn’t even close to age 30 yet, but even though I’m young, I’m not stupid!!!). I just didn’t think anyone running as a Republican could defeat the Democratic machine, especially not the powerhouse black candidate/female candidate. Either way, it was a chance for voters to assuage their own guilt for who knows what.
Report Post »GETLIFE
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:25amThe media needs no more than to plant a bit of reasonable doubt– religious, personal values, decisions… concerning Romney’s conservatism. Whatever’s left over– well he can be shown to have much in common with Obama. Why should the undecided vote for him over the incumbent?
Report Post »Babeuf
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:42pmWhy will Romney carry Nevada? Just curious…. according to what I have heard, it is because the majority of its residents are Mormon, please explain the difference to me? South Carolina is full mostly of Evangelicals. Why is there a problem here?
Report Post »joel228
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:06pmBabeuf, Gingrich took SC and last I heard his latest religion (of three so far) was Catholicism. The evangelicals of South Carolina in general showed preference to a long time adulterous, currently catholic, over a moral mormon. Yes I think that shows a bit of hypocritical bigotry. If they know Newt it certainly wasn’t that he is more conservative. But to give them the benefit of the doubt, perhaps they are just easily persuaded by the one with the glib tongue. They are gullible at best.
Newt Gingrich: A Crime Against Conservatism
Report Post »http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyeB36ctO5I&feature=youtu.be
http://www.newtexposed.com/
jujubeebee
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:24amMcCain gave away the 2008 election so who wants to listen to his input? He could not articulate or fight for anything and basically did nothing to win. So now he is getting on talk shows and giving his opinion. His opinion is insignificant. It is no better than Joe on the street. In fact I give Joe the plumber more credit for taking a stand than McCain. Bye bye old man McCain!
Report Post »kessi7
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:28amIf Romney Wins
Report Post »http://fathersmind.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2012-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2013-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=4
riseandshine
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:05amI doubt any Republican could’ve won in 2008, after 8 years of Bush.
Report Post »Lonescrapper
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:21amIf you guys can’t acknowledge the truth, even when it comes from the mouth of your enemies, you are as lost as they are.
Report Post »SheriS
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:31amEvangelicals don’t consider Mormonism is a religion—they consider it a “cult” as we have seen from some here on the blog! Frankly, I would rather be a friend to a Mormon then many evangelicals! I had the joy of getting to know some amazing Mormon families when my husband’s company hired several. They were some of the finest, most caring people I have ever known and it makes me angry whey I hear the attacks on Mormons! They are far better then a lot of Christians I have known! As soon as “posts” started showing up on some of the blogs, I knew what was happening! I have little respect for the people of South Carolina people as they showed their bigotry!
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:39amthis isn’t about bieng “nice”..this is about SOULS..since everyone will die..and according to the Bible..those who buy the lies of “another gospel”..will be forever lost..why can’t Beck and those in his cult simply tell the Truth about what they believe and quit LYING…telling the truth about those who serve satan is NOT bigotry..it is BRAVERY..since most don’t have the guts to do it..
Report Post »UBETHECHANGE
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:00amExactly! Can’t stand McCain, but I fully agree with him on this. Wake up dopes of the world!
Report Post »reform
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:00amIt’s quite ironict that there is a good Dr. by the name of Rima she also talks about that 10% but on the different spectrum that the 90% need to be done away with. Glenn lost me with this observation a couple of months ago that the 10% need to arise question is what happened to the 90% that was there! And least I say reports from my family members in Nevada stating Mr. Romney has been running negative ads against Newt Gingrich for the last two weeks. The same false ads about being dispelled from Congress the cost. Not only that they are putting down the Jewish community because the voting takes place on a Sabbath whether you believe the Jewish community has a right to vote or not is up to you but this is coming from wait a minute the Mormon community that has a very strong standing in the stated Nevada. So in reference I guess religion does matter does it not?
Report Post »NeoFan
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:28amI can show you sermons from the religion of WHKELL where the preacher says that a father can rape his daughters repeatedly everyday and then when he is done say one prayer, one work, one ordinance, called the alter call and go to heaven without repentance.
Report Post »qpwillie
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:21amI‘m sure you could find someone who wouldn’t vote for him because they don‘t like the way he combs his hair but there’s not enough of them to call it a factor in the outcome. This sounds more like McCain has a problem with Romney‘s religion and doesn’t want to think he’s the only one.
Yes, I know he endorsed Romney but that doesn‘t mean he doesn’t wish he wasn’t a Mormon.
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:21amIt is perfectly legitimate to tell the TRUTH about what Romney and those in his cult like Beck believe..but lie about…
..theologically..a Mormon is no more a Christian than a Muslim is..since the Mormon “god” and “jesus” are NOT the God and Jesus of the Bible..a book they believe is a flawed and incomplete book…..yet..Romney..Beck..LIE to be accepted they are “Christians”…and they believe in “god” and “jesus”..sorry..but the true God of the Bible was never a man..nor will any man become god..and the Jesus of the Bible is GOD…not a product of the sexual union of the Mormon god/man and Mary…not the brother of Lucifer..and certinaly was never in the US..as Mormons believe..
..I could CARE LESS what fantasies Romney and Beck choose to believe in..just quit LYING AND TELL THE TRUTH..
..it is legit for people to know Romney believes he will die and be a god..he can pray dead souls out of hell…he wears magic underwear….his family practiced and accepts polygamy..though to be mainstream they have to wait until their “afterlife”…and that he believes he is the fulfillment of Smith’s “White Horse” prophecy…why shouldn’t people know what Romney really believes????
..ok..all of the Mormon apoligsts..and Christians who drink Beck’s Kool-Aid can now chime in that to say such things is bigoted..and Mormons can now cut and paste their lies how that is not what they believe…….
Report Post »Lonescrapper
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:27amThere you go. No anti Mormonism here at all…
Report Post »booger71
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:31amWhy was Mitt’s dad born in Mexico? Because his grandpa ran from Utah to Mexico so he could keep his 4 wives, and he even married a 5th while he lived there.
Report Post »Icnivad
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:43amYou are such a good example of a loving, understanding Christian! I love how you are POLITE, RESPECTFUL, CONSTRUCTIVE, and UNHATEFUL in your comments. Don’t you think you are acting as Jesus would? Think about it. ;)
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:58amsorry the TRUTH offends you..but this is about the eternal souls of men..and why a tool of satan is so dangerous..since the better % of 2 full generations have never been to church..and most who do are Biblically illiterate..only eternity will show the number of souls who fell into Beck’s cult and will burn in hell for all eternity..oh..and sorry..but nobody is going to pray you out of hell either as Beck thinks..
Report Post »hjbones
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:20am@WHKell,
Report Post »You clearly don’t know a whole lot about the Mormon faith. I would know, I am one. Sorry if the truth offends you, but my religion is no more a cult than yours. Just because we might believe in God a little differently than you does not make us bad people. In fact, if you would be a little more logical in your arguments and actually talk to some Mormons and try to learn, you might find you agree with us on more than you thought.
NeoFan
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:49amDo evangelicals support the constitution? Not the freedom of religion part. Given the power they would ban all faiths but theirs. Do they care about the morals of their candidate? Well he can be engaged in whoredoms as long as he can beat the morman then he can be a pedophile for all they care. Oh thats right a church that has legions of pedophiles is ok as long as they are not a cult like the mormans. Its clear to them just look at Salt Lake City. The highest murder rate in the world. on average 800 million murders a year. I know it is true cause I heard it from a highly paid preacher. Nobody gets paid more money for preaching Jesus’s gospel than the evangelicals. They must be right.
Report Post »dlmldm
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:43amMormon beliefs are in fact biblical and profoundly Christian, at thoughts.com I prove it, yes “prove it,” dont believe me, put aside some of your hateful rhetoric for a minute and see for yourself.
http://www.thoughts.com/dlmlds/actual-mormon-beliefs-are-biblical-and-profoundly-christian
Report Post »FROTHYDISCHARGE
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:37pmWHKELL. WAKE UP!!!!! WAKE UP!!!!! WAKE UP!!!!!! are you awake? Good. You sound like a fun loving, forgiving, Christlike, happy go lucky guy. Which branch of the Westboro Baptist church to you go to?
Report Post »kozski
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 12:47pmThank you for speaking the truth! You are very brave in the face of such ignorance. Don’t stop telling it like it is.
Report Post »mcsledge
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 2:07pmRevelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
John wrote this statement about 90 AD. As such, it was not referring to Christ’s time. That angel has brought forth “the everlasting gospel”, which was contained on plates of gold covering the dealings of God to a segment of the House of Israel led by prophets. These writings were translated into The Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.
A symbol of this same angel resides on over 100 temples (Houses of the Lord) around the world.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is led by Christ, Himself, through living Prophets and Apostles. This is true today and it will be true at the time of judgment.
Truth does not need your acceptance or approval.
Report Post »SpankDaMonkey
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:18am.
Report Post »Mitt has John Edwards “Hair”………..
rotcarpenter
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:17amSo when is Glenn going to take Romney down on his Progressive stances? Still waiting on that.
Report Post »whkell
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:25amNEVER…he will keep supporting Santorum..who has as much chance as Paul of winning..knowing that it is taking votes from Newt..since in the end..Beck thinks he is the “John the Baptist” ushering in the Mormon President Smith prophesied about..for those who believe in the Jesus of the Bible….and are Biblical Christians..not members of Beck’s cult caling themselves Christians..WAKE UP!!..are you really that stupid..not to mention your support of Beck is only filling his pockets with the $$$ he brags about “tithing”..meaning you are simply helping his cult lead more souls to hell…WAKE UP!!
Report Post »NeoFan
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 6:25pmSo since you are supporting Newt as a “Christian” please enlighten us as to the Biblical basis for an “Open” marriage and for Adultery? I’m sure you have some great scripture for us to justify that?
Report Post »progressiveslayer
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:16amWhen is this fossil going to go away forever? Obama,brought to you by John McCain thanks for nothing you progressive POS. You should have been locked up back in the 80′s and still in prison.
Report Post »floridacockleburr
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:39amMcCain was nothing but a sacrificial lamb. You can thank your hero George W. Bush for Obama.
Report Post »progressiveslayer
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:57amBush isn‘t my hero so you don’t know what you’re talking about,step away from the bong.
Report Post »reform
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:11amAnd speaking of the Bushes what’s with the elder and Jeb meeting with Barack Obama recently? both whom I believe back Mitt Romney. Where is George Junior announcement? Can you say the establishment runs Mitt Romney’s campaign. I tell you these people are more afraid of Newt Gingrich then the devil himself!
Report Post »Anonymous T. Irrelevant
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:12amSame tactic Obama used on McCain, except it was racism. No anti-Mormon bias, people just didn’t like the poser.
Report Post »Lordchamp
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:10amI’m so sick of this garbage!! I LIVE IN SC and I have NEVER heard even one person mention Romney’s religion. Hey just won‘t accept the fact that WE DON’T LIKE HIM AND DON’T TRUST HIM!! ANY candidate that has all the liberal (he calls it “independent”) things in his past like Romney does, no matter how much he changes still has some of those things that will drive his decision making in the future. If you could EVER be pro-abortion, etc, that means your thought processes are to liberal for US and we’re not willing to take that chance.
McCain or Romney/ Romney or McCain. Same thing just in less wrinkled package. And we ALL know how McCain has worked out for us.
Report Post »AhLeahIris
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:17amThis is all crap. Of course, there was an element of Romney in McCain’s 2008: http://wp.me/p1HGwx-1UP
Report Post »ZeldaZick
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:10amI hate to admit it, but it is one of the many reason’s I would not vote for plastic Willard.
Report Post »PGMike
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:30amAt least you are honest. Thanks for that. May I suggest you go to LDS.org and learn what we really believe?
Report Post »BuggiOlleo
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:07amJMcCain,
Report Post »I love ya dude, but your strong suit for judgement sux..ie TKennedy..need I say more.
momrules
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:05amOne of the best reasons that I know of to not support Romney is because John McCain does.
Report Post »JL320
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:09amExactly, all of the Rinos, and establishment is behind Romney. All the true conservatives, Palin, Fred, Chuck, Cain, the tea party are backing Newt.
Report Post »WEBWITHDEB
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 4:44pmRight on, but just add all the negatives of Willard’s policies up also, and an independent thinker doesn’t need to resort to any of the personal negatives to have as a reason not to vote for him.
Report Post »ZABO
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:05amj. mcSHAME couldn’t beat a loser with a staple gun and a bull-horn.(blowbama) yet again this douchebag has to run his trap. john do us and yourself a favor and just resign and enjoy however many houses you got. and take your husky daughter with you sir. thanks for your service in the service. but no thank you is coming for your time in elected office. LOSER!! and please quit using the “MY FRIENDS” when you open your trap and address your fellow americans. cause johnny with friends like you, well you and we now the rest.
Report Post »grandmaof5
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:05amIsn‘t it wonderful that McCain has mental telepathy and knows why some people didn’t vote for Romney. His powers must not have worked in 2008 when he did so poorly in the debates – if they had, he would have talked about Rev. Wright, Obama’s non-qualifications, and the sort, instead of actiing like a lap dog, and possibly have changed the minds of some voters. It’s amazing to see McCain endorsing Obama by putting doubts in the minds of voters. Romney needs to get McCain as far away from his campaign as possible.
Report Post »constantreverie
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:19amYou look ignorant when you can’t even read the story.
Report Post »The people who said that religion was very important voted for Gingrich
The people who said that religion was not important voted for Romney
So let me get this straight, if religion is very important to me, if ethics and morality are important to me, then I supposed to go for the serial adulterer?
There is obviously bias whether you like to admit it or not.
AJAYW
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:48am@constantreverie
Who sharpened your tongue this morning
Report Post »Lucy Larue
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:11am@CONSTANT REVERIE,
It is you who appear the idiot. The ridiculous Huffpo exit poll article is moot. McCain made his comments all by his lonesome. It is YOU who need to read for comprehension.
BTW GRANDMAOF5…,great post and too true!
Report Post »reform
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 10:23amAfter reviewing the exit polls I see Mitt Romney won one class of people people making over 200,000 a year that was it. so going into Florida the way I see it a number of people that resided in the states of New York New Jersey Connecticut and the likes have moved to Florida, as well as many of my family and friends that could afford to do so went there. Why because they could they had the cash to do so nice golf courses retirement communities sailboats motorboats yachts you name it, if you have the cash it is a nice place to live and enjoy your life. The way I see it what they have in common is major investments in the stock market which sustains their wealth so why not vote for Mitt Romney he will not upset the applecart. As far as the working stiffs well you just have to keep working until you drop dead because they need the blood meaning your tax dollars to fund their lifestyles.
Report Post »JP4JOY
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:04amBirds of a feather flock together. Harry Reid is a Mormon too.
Report Post »constantreverie
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:16amSo is Glenn Beck….
See what I did there?
Report Post »Jenny Lind
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:22amHarry Reid is the most not-Mormon, Mormon I know. He does not live, or support the tenants of our faith as far as I can see. Mormons I know do not support or vote for Reid, not because of his church statis, but because of what he does as a liberal democrat.
Report Post »morerightrudder
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 11:48amSo is Orin Hatch, So is John Huntsman.
Report Post »TxSon
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:00amWhy do we care what this liberal looser has to say about anything? We get it. You served in the armed forces, were captured and tortured. Thank you for your service. It is now time to retire and STFU.
Report Post »hi
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:58amIt‘s not about religion or race just sexism since Bachman didn’t win.
We want to restore America. Romney’s health care program was the basis for Obamacare. So, we don’t want him.
Report Post »hi
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:02amAlthough, for the libs it is about religion and they will never vote for a Christian.
Report Post »HKS
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:58amCould that mean a M or M choice in the general election?
Report Post »AJAYW
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 8:55amWho cares what this looser says.
Report Post »Stuck_in_CA
Posted on January 30, 2012 at 9:03amWhat a sleez. They’re sounding like the dems. Religion-baiting/race-baiting RINOs. Yuck.
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