Faith

Religious Clergy & Employees Involved in ‘Worship’ & ‘Proselytizing’ Cut Out of Fed Student Loan Forgiveness

Fed Loan Forgiveness for Public Service Employee Excludes Religious WorkersAs education costs continue to rise, many Americans find themselves in a great deal of student-loan debt upon receiving their degrees.

It is this dynamic that led to specific provisions in the College Cost Reduction and Access Act of 2007, a bill intended to help students grapple with the high cost of modern-day education. But as the government continues to clarify the details of its federal loan forgiveness program for public service workers, it seems there’s one cohort that the government won’t be helping — those engaged in “religious instruction, worship services, or any form of proselytizing.”

Before getting into the religious exemption, let’s explore the intended impact of the law, which President George W. Bush signed back Sept. 2007. Tucked within the pages of the act is a “Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program,” which was essentially created to assist those individuals who work in non-profit and community-assistance positions.

The notion governing the policy is that public service workers may not take in substantial salaries. And because they work to help the community, this law seeks to offset the cost of their education. The government explains the terms of the agreement:

Under this program, you may qualify for forgiveness of the remaining balance due on your eligible federal student loans after you have made 120 payments on those loans under certain repayment plans while employed full time by certain public service employers. Since you must make 120 monthly payments on your eligible federal student loans after October 1, 2007 before you qualify for the loan forgiveness, the first cancellations of loan balances will not be granted until October 2017.

So, the program is relatively simple. If a responsible individual makes his or her payments in a timely manner (and for at least a decade), he or she is entitled to forgiveness of federal student loans. At this point in the individual’s career, he or she has likely paid a substantial amount toward the sum owed and, in the government’s eyes, deserves to be “forgiven” accordingly.

Fed Loan Forgiveness for Public Service Employee Excludes Religious WorkersNow, let’s look at the professions covered under this regulation. The forgiveness applies to any individual working for a government organization (federal, state, local or tribal), or any non-profit worker who is employed at a 501(c)(3) organization (this includes colleges and universities). In the end, this encompasses virtually all community service workers, however there are a few exceptions.

The law does not cover labor unions or partisan political organizations. Considering that these groups are explicitly political, this exemption is self-explanatory. Additionally, under the list of viable careers covered by the loan law, a specific line explains the government’s stance on loan forgiveness for religious employees: “Your employment at a non-profit organization does not qualify if your job duties are related to religious instruction, worship services, or any form of proselytizing.”

Another line reads:

Generally, the type or nature of employment with the organization does not matter for PSLF purposes. However, if you work for a non-profit organization, your employment will not qualify for PSLF if your job duties are related to religious instruction, worship services, or any form of proselytizing.

Here’s a screen shot that showcases the regulations and exceptions:

Fed Loan Forgiveness for Public Service Employee Excludes Religious Workers

This means that faith leaders and other church and non-profit employees — individuals who are often the first to respond and assist members of local communities in need — are excluded.

The Huffington Post has more:

When the Department of Education released regulations in 2008 and 2009, it explained that employees of 501(c)(3) nonprofits were eligible for loan forgiveness but that workers at nonprofits or private organizations who “engaged in religious activities” would not qualify. Many seminarians and financial consultants…interpreted this to mean employees of religious 501(c)(3) groups would still qualify. [...]

Daren Briscoe, a Department of Education spokesman, stated via email that the latest document “did not change existing Federal policy, but clarified that individuals working at religiously-affiliated non-profit organizations who perform at least 30 hours of non-religious activities are eligible for PSLF, and that, consistent with similar long-standing programs, the federal government does not subsidize explicitly religious activity.”

It seems some seminaries had assumed, though, that clergy would still be able to benefit from this public service program. To their surprise, this clearly isn’t the case.

“If you think of Protestant clergy, they come out with four years of college and three years of seminary,” proclaimed Rev. Emily C. Heath, the pastor at West Dover Congregational Church in Vermont. “Those can be some pretty high-debt six-figure loans. The majority of young pastors I know have loans,” he continued.

Considering the cost of education for religious leaders and the often meager pay they receive upon entering the “workforce,” this is one portion of the population that could truly benefit from the provision. Opponents of such a notion, though, would claim that churches already benefit profoundly from the 501(c)(3) tax-exempt status and that the government shouldn’t be subsidizing religions.

But on the flip side, if all faith leaders were included in the mix, the benefit would be applied across the board and would not, in practice, favor one religion over another. Plus, there is ample evidence that churches’ worth to local communities is profound. Consider a Christianity Today report from April 2011 that assess the value of a church:

Does a congregation’s tax-exempt status outweigh the economic value it adds to its community? The University of Pennsylvania’s Ram Cnaan has long been searching for a specific answer. In a 1997 study, he found that urban congregations provide, on average, $140,000 worth of services annually. In 2009, Cnaan (who describes himself as nonreligious) revised his estimate to $476,663.24. Now he’s about to release an even more detailed pilot study focusing on 12 historic Philadelphia congregations, including First Baptist Church, whose annual value to the local economy Cnaan’s team places conservatively at $6,090,032 (nearly ten times its annual budget).

Fed Loan Forgiveness for Public Service Employee Excludes Religious Workers

The value of a church (Image Credit: Christianity Today)

Some clergy members are working fervently against the regulation in hopes that they, too, can benefit from the government’s loan forgiveness policies. Considering the recent contraceptive mandate on church-affiliated organizations, this is yet another issue with the potential to gain greater attention during an election year.

Comments (114)

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  • vaman
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:25pm

    There is nothing wrong with this at all. Just do other work that gives you dept relief under the program. Do your religious stuff on the side. You should want to do gods work at no cost anyway. This is not another attack on christians, since all religions are banned from the program. Who would spend 7 years in higher education to become a protestant clergy member anyway? It’s a job making no money, meaning you can’t pay back the loans you incurred by choice. Find a new line of work and preach in your free time.

    Report Post »  
    • dumbgrunt33
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:46pm

      wow dude, you gotta realize what this is…. it’s about what this government is doing…. don’t worry, everyone except for Christians and Jews will somehow still qualify.

      Report Post »  
    • Jaycen
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:58pm

      It makes sense. No philosophical organizations are forgiven.

      Of course, public service employees shouldn’t be forgiven, either. Tax payers are yet again bailing out losers.

      These people can’t afford their life choices and we fi.d ourselves on the hook for it.

      Report Post » Jaycen  
    • Hollywood
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 3:21pm

      ALL they need to do is convert to islam, and THEN their whole loan will be forgiven. Seems pretty simple to me!

      Report Post » Hollywood  
    • leslymill
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 6:23pm

      It is a bit discriminatory. Most charities are religious based. Some have signed on to the great commission that the Lord instructed. It feels like feeding the poor is okay, but feeding the poor in the name of Jesus so you will follow him and never hunger again may not be acceptable and you get disqualified. for educational assistance.Participating in malaria net drives with Louis Farrakhan may be covered, but if you also stand at the intersection passing out pamphlets about the Mosques works and beliefs, it might disqualify you…They may have to have tuition drives if the prices of education go higher.

      Report Post »  
  • bjornskis
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:09pm

    I see it here at our local collage the kids get loans for 4 years which include their living expenses

    some thing that did not happen when I was in collage in the late 70′s of course I got no loans or grants or anything because I was just a B average student and white male errrrrrrrrr so I had to get
    a job to pay for everything.

    back to the subject

    these kids go to school for years and never work one freaking day

    then at the end they cant get a job and have no skills and then want us to pay

    Report Post »  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 5:08pm

      I went to Pacific Lutheran University from 1966 through 1970. The good old days of the draft. Get your BA/BS in 4 years no exceptions. I worked 3 jobs to pay my way. When I graduated PLU and I were even. I owed no money to anyone for anything. Even then students were defaulting on loans.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
    • rafa2design
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 5:29pm

      I also don‘t agree with us having to pay for someone else’s expenses, but take to account that college tuition in the 1970s was roughly $400. Today it’s closer to $5,000. Students today are given an incredible weight of debt on their shoulders. It is with everything. Their parents and grandparents were able to buy homes, vehicles, and start businesses at a fraction of what it cost today to do any of those things, while salaries have not really kept up. I really feel for this generation. They may never know what it is to be free from debt or to own something of their own.

      Report Post » rafa2design  
  • dadsrootbeer
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:08pm

    So a bailout for students also!!! I guess you don’t have to be a responsible home owner or even a student. Way to go Bush, Obammy and Congress.

    Report Post » dadsrootbeer  
    • girlnurse
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:27pm

      Do you still think you live in a “Free” country? Did anyone ask you if you wanted to give your tax dollars to bail out banks, students, and foreign countries whose budget is more balanced than ours?
      Do you think you really have a “say” in any of these matters?

      There are none more hopelessly enslaved, than those
      who falsely believe they are free.
      Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

      Report Post » girlnurse  
  • mcsledge
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:07pm

    Some of us are responsible enough to pay off our debts without seeking government handouts.

    Report Post » mcsledge  
    • grman
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:52pm

      I agree. I will graduate in May with an ADN. I plan to pursuit my bachelors, but first I will get a job and pay off the student loans that I have now. I don’t want a bailout.

      Report Post »  
  • ldaopines
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:54pm

    This forgiveness of loans to public workers is yet another bene to big government elitists who already are paid far more in benefits and pay than their counterparts in the private sector. There is no such thing as public “service” or public “servant”. Secular Progressives use those terms to sanitize their own greed as they steal taxpayer money while ignoring “fairness” to all college students.

    Report Post »  
  • okredstate
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:52pm

    More picking of winners and losers. Why the surprise? He has done this since day one. It’s only your money that he is giving away for more liberal votes. He does not even try to hide it, and never has.

    Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:18pm

      OKREDSTATE…you must mean George W. Bush.

      Report Post »  
    • girlnurse
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:57pm

      Okay heres how it works: They pass these laws under cover of darkness and 2000 page bills which wont go into effect until the culprets are long gone. Like the ObamCare bill which will go into effect when he’s long gone—then the Repubes will say; “Well Obumma did it and there’s nothing we can do about it”….oh theyll have this big courtroom show to make us think their trying but nothing will ever get changed and that my friend is the dog and pony show which I have come to know as slavery, Marxism, Socialism….call it what you want….but I am awake!

      Report Post » girlnurse  
    • Just in time
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 4:39pm

      Ok, that is what this is about. Picking who gets the govt. hand-out of the tax payers money. It seems to me. That they should be allowed to fail or prosper based on their own merit

      Report Post »  
  • Kitkarr
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:44pm

    …and no, muslims shouldn’t get a break just for praying.

    Report Post » Kitkarr  
  • Kitkarr
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:42pm

    Al and Lumbar are right.

    If people don’t want to pay back a loan, they shouldn’t take it out. Wanting loan “forgiveness” is just another way to create more “the world owes me something” mentalities. Its spoiling our nation.

    I know obama is inept, but W. signed this into law. I liked W. for the 1st term and half of the 2nd, but he did some pretty dumb things.

    Lets not get blinded by our own agends and ignore the real enemy here, and everywhere else for that matter…stupidity. Aka, foolishness.

    Report Post » Kitkarr  
  • Elena2010
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:42pm

    If we had public education thru high school that actually educated the children, many folks could forego college. Not everyone needs a college education to be an active contributor to his/her community’s life and well-being.

    I do not care if my plumber can quote Shakespeare. I care that he/she can make the problem right and keep it that way for longer than 90 days! I care that carpenters can read, write, and think for themselves so that they can make informed electoral decisions. I do not care if they have degrees in art or philosophy.

    Report Post » Elena2010  
  • ZeldaZick
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:22pm

    After World War One, our buddies the Communists had a world wide meeting in Vienna to discuss why the whole world had not thrown off “The old world order” and adopted Marxism. What they found out was that it was The Christian Faith and The Family, which can from Christian teachings, which had stopped Europe from going Red.
    Thus the continued attacks on both, thru the “Culture War”, Gay movement and now King Barry’s rules and regulations.

    Report Post »  
  • girlnurse
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:15pm

    You guys are missing the main point…which is that this is a way to once again have everyone seek employment with the state or federal government!!! We have too many of those now! The socialists in the whitehouse would LOVE for everyone to work for the government because it is their goal to end most private sector jobs….and theyre doing a pretty good job of it! Grow government….Grow GOVERNMENT…we need to slash it by 50% FOR STARTERS!

    Report Post » girlnurse  
    • ZeldaZick
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:36pm

      The goal of Marxism is the enslavement of the “working class”, the destruction of the “assest class” plus the Christian Faith and a Dictatorship by an “Enlightened Few”. Yes, everybody working for the Gov.

      Report Post »  
    • rienheart
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:39pm

      This is only for Good Comrads, and Full Party Memberships in the Communist Movement. Most Unions and other Obama tied businesses have aleady been exempted from Obama Care. Until their Rude Awakening in 2014 when their exemptions are up. Then all bets are off and everyone better toe the Line or face your fate.

      Report Post »  
  • LibertyAtStake
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:46pm

    Will the loan be forgiven if the borrower has a job handing out contraceptives for a religious institution?

    d(^_^)b
    http://libertyatstake.blogspot.com/
    “Because the Only Good Progressive is a Failed Progressive”

    Report Post » LibertyAtStake  
    • GhostOfJefferson
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:52pm

      I’m curious. If the government is somehow forbidden to “subsidze” anything to do with religion, then how is it that religious people are compelled to “subsidize” the government via forced taxation? If there is, as they say, a “clear and deliniating line” between church and state, then why does that line only appear clear and delineating regarding making the government give back stolen money to the people it stole it from?

      Report Post » GhostOfJefferson  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:57pm

      JEFFERSON…churches are tax exempt.

      Report Post »  
    • GhostOfJefferson
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:04pm

      @Lumbar

      The question isn’t about the FedGov forgiving the loans of churches though. It’s saying individuals who are religious are SOL. If we now extend “the clear and delineating line” that doesn’t exist, technically, to individuals, then individuals who are religious are necessarily prohibited, even if they wanted to, from paying into the government. You see, to keep them seperated by that “clear and delineating line” that doesn’t, technically, exist.

      Report Post » GhostOfJefferson  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:11pm

      The fact of the matter is that clergy and other church employees do qualify for student loan forgiveness for performing 30 hours of qualified community service every week…such as working with the poor. That’s the same standard applied to any other (non-religious) person with a student loan. You just don’t get a free pass on your student loan for preaching and praying…

      Report Post »  
    • GhostOfJefferson
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:29pm

      No Lumbar, you don’t. You do get a free pass for anything else though. Which is the same as ignoring the technically non existent “clear, delineating line”. And if you get to exclude individual Christian citizens from government programs, then why should they have to pay for government under the same principle?

      Let me be right up front here, there shold be no government involvement in student loans, and further, there should be no debt forgiveness. If you chose a career that doesn’t pay more than you can make flipping burgers, that’s your own damned choice, and nobody else is responsible for the debt you incur to get to your magical and wonderful career. Can’t make the payment? Tough, forfeit assets or get a more realistic line of work, it’s not our place to cover your poor decision making abilities.

      If there is debt forgiveness for low paying careers (for college loans) then it should cover all, or none. Singling out the religious for exclusion in facts creates a violation of seperation of church and state (which doesn’t, technically, exist), since the state is making a point to prevent religious from entering an offer anybody else is “entitled” to.

      Report Post » GhostOfJefferson  
    • Locked
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:33pm

      @Ghost

      “Let me be right up front here, there shold be no government involvement in student loans, and further, there should be no debt forgiveness. If you chose a career that doesn’t pay more than you can make flipping burgers, that’s your own damned choice, and nobody else is responsible for the debt you incur to get to your magical and wonderful career. Can’t make the payment? Tough, forfeit assets or get a more realistic line of work, it’s not our place to cover your poor decision making abilities.”

      Completely agreed. People who don’t live within their means should be prepared for the consequences. It was bad legislation from the moment Bush signed it.

      I‘m kinda curious why it’s just becoming an issue now though. Did religious organizations not care for the last 4-5 years?

      Report Post »  
    • GhostOfJefferson
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:40pm

      Fair question Locked.

      I was also 100% against Bush’s “faith based initiative” crap as well.

      It‘s shocking to me how every day I wake up I discover that somebody else has comitted more of my life and resources to people I don’t know and don’t approve of, without even bothering to pretend to ask me about whether I consent.

      Report Post » GhostOfJefferson  
  • kapu
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:26pm

    hmmmmmmmmmmmmm…..seems to me that this is a ‘softsoap’ kind of front. i strongly feel that if people REALLY take a couple steps back, take a good, hard look at this, then dovetail this with the full-frontal attack on the Catholics this past weekend, it is simply another method of the same, pathetic, albeit interesting assault. Hitler said, ‘give me your children and i will rule the world.’
    call it what you will, but this is a classic chess strategy–knock your apponent off balance, and keep him there scrambling to upright themselves, and keep attacking. brillant…..
    the part that those dolts seem to, ummmmmm, ‘forget’ is that THEIR competion is numerous steps ahead of them……….or in the words of Admiral Yamamoto in WWII, ‘ i am afraid that we have only awakened a sleeping giant.’ this sleeping giant is very, very wide awake.

    Report Post » kapu  
    • Locked
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:23pm

      “in the words of Admiral Yamamoto in WWII, ‘ i am afraid that we have only awakened a sleeping giant.’ this sleeping giant is very, very wide awake.”

      FYI, there is no historical evidence that Yamamoto ever said this. It was a line created for the movie “Tora! Tora! Tora!”

      Report Post »  
    • Elena2010
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:45pm

      It was Yamamoto who cautioned the powers at the top of Imperial Japan’s military not to awaken the sleeping giant America because he had lived here and knew us well enough to caution ag messing us over.

      Report Post » Elena2010  
    • Locked
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:24pm

      @Elena

      Yamamoto was indeed against action against the US; however, the quote itself has no historical backing. He likely had similar views, but there’s no record he ever said it (as said, it was a line made for a movie).

      Report Post »  
  • DD313
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:24pm

    How can the forgiveness of student loans for individuals in the field of public education be reconciled with the prohibition against forgiving loans for someone involved in proselytizing?

    Report Post » DD313  
  • mrmikejohnson
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:23pm

    This is how communist dictatorships work. People that are allies of the dictator get one set of laws. people that are opposed to the dictator get a different set of laws.

    Report Post »  
    • dealer@678
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:47pm

      Man, this crap keeps getting weirder and weirder. When will churches be ordered to take down the cross and install a picture of Obama

      Report Post »  
    • girlnurse
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 3:12pm

      That is absolutely right!

      Report Post » girlnurse  
  • MarsBarsTru7
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:16pm

    … Counting the seconds before the idiotic atheists that hover like vultures around here descend and attempt to refute the contributions churches make to society.

    Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:23pm

      Are you aware that church employees who perform 30 hours of non-religious public service per week qualify for loan forgiveness under the plan? The Federal Government is not, and should not be, in the business of subsidizing proselytizing on behalf of any religion.

      Report Post »  
    • 13th Imam
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:27pm

      Yet these TAXPAYERS have to fund this DEMOCRAT scam??In AMERICA we are either All equal or not. This is NOT Equality.

      Report Post » 13th Imam  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:36pm

      13thIMAM…so you would be okay with a Muslim clergy member’s student loan being forgiven because he conducts Muslim prayer sessions?

      Report Post »  
    • 13th Imam
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:50pm

      We are either All equal before the Law or not. I am not a person who pits groups against each other. Those are the DEMOCRATS Alinsky tactics. You know, Saul’s rules for Radicals?? Redistribution Theft is what it is.
      But truthfully DEMOCRATS either hide behind the Law, or ignore it if it doesn’t suit them. Barry is the Prime example.

      Report Post » 13th Imam  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:59pm

      13TH IMAM…then let’s start taxing churches instead of giving them a free ride. Let’s treat them like any other business…

      Report Post »  
    • 13th Imam
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:05pm

      Barry . like you , is restricted by a little piece of paper, the United States Constitution. Ever hear of it?No, didn’t think so. Another of the terminally stupid

      Report Post » 13th Imam  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:16pm

      13TH IMAM…Gee whiz…I didn’t know granting churches tax exempt status was in the Constitution. I’ll have to read it. In the meantime, why do I get the impression that many people who post here simply read only the headlines and not the articles?

      Report Post »  
    • 13th Imam
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:40pm

      Geez I could write about a million LAWS that weren’t in the Constitution. Like ABORTION, Redistribution of Wealth, . …………

      Report Post » 13th Imam  
  • Al J Zira
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:14pm

    Why is this an issue? There shouldn‘t be any loan forgiveness programs unless they’re granted by the school itself. The government shouldn’t be paying tuition for anyone. When school loans are taken out by potential students they’re aware of the cost of the loan. If there‘s a problem with the amount or the cost of education go after the school or go to another school or don’t go to college. No one is forcing you to take a school loan.

    Report Post » Al J Zira  
    • DaveOregon
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:17pm

      Here, Here! We have the G.I. Bill – taht is enough Federally funded college education I think. Local community action should be paid for by the community – not the Fedsw. the Feds desires do not allows – seldom – match those of the community or State. fed’s should not be providing FEDERAL student loans period.

      Report Post »  
    • Mtroom
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:33pm

      Nice job AL….I too, don’t get it…Fighting to not pay your bills?..None of them should get relief from any of their bills, period….People fight over this on everything, makes me sick….I hear “Oh, prices are to high because Illegals aren’t paying for hospital visits.”.B’tch about the banks being bailed out..Complain that Chrysler and GM haven’t paid the loan back full..At the same time that they want a relief for a loan they took out for school…All prices are too high because people don’t pay their debts..No more bail outs for anyone, I can’t afford it….Pay your bills, fools

      Report Post » Mtroom  
  • AmericanStrega
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:13pm

    These people chose the field they wanted to be educated in. Why on God‘s green earth should they be forgiven the balance of their loan because they don’t make enough money? Because of the profession they CHOSE doesn’t pay well enough? Why the scrap should the American taxpayer have to foot the bill? This is total and complete bullspit! The religious part is even deeper total and complete bullspit! The democrat held congress passed this bullspit bill and GWB signed it. Wow! Just frigging WOW! Now if this same bill came up today, Obama would most likely demand that any religious persons NOT be able to get a college education. I voterd for GWB twice and did not and will NEVER vote for Obama, but scrap! GWB and Obama are sure sounding like one and the same!

    Report Post »  
  • acovenantinblood
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:13pm

    I don’t get this whole student loan crap. I dropped out of high school have only 15 college credits that I got while in high school and still got a job making $22 an hour. I have remained out of debt and I don’t have a credit card. I just don’t get it. I see friends of mine who went to college and they are bagging groceries or stocking shelves. I told my daughter that I would rather she were a powerful Godly woman rather than successful in life (although that does not negate her trying her hardest). I told her this because of the way that colleges are destroying the faith of Christian students. Yet I stll see parents in churches proudly sendign their kids off to become “successful”. None of them are even prepared for it.

    Report Post » acovenantinblood  
    • copatriots
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:18pm

      Congrats! Sounds like you had your priorities right then and now! It is sad to see parents continuing to send their children off to be indoctrinated by liberal universities while paying for the indoctrination.

      Report Post »  
    • girlnurse
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 3:20pm

      “I told my daughter that I would rather she were a powerful Godly woman rather than successful in life”
      Here Here! I told my girls the same thing! Christians are to be in the world NOT “of the world”….This WORLD has a pwerful hold on people today. They are calling “good bad and bad good”. I would rather my kids be poor as a church mouse and have God than walk away with their head hangin like the rich young ruler…Christians need to wake up. “For what does it profit a man if he gains the whole world and loses his soul?” God Bless

      Report Post » girlnurse  
  • Lumbar Spine
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:06pm

    And it was signed into law by President George W. Bush…

    Report Post »  
    • mils
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:17pm

      at this point it doesn’t matter who signed it, it is broken..and …it needs to be fixed.

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:25pm

      MILS…some here are already blaiming President Obama for the law. It was signed into law by Bush in 2007. The Labor Department has simply clarified the application of the law. Obama hasn’t changed anything…

      Report Post »  
  • 13th Imam
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:05pm

    If anyone Pays Federal Income Taxes , they should be eligible. If they are excluded from participating in this DEMOCRAT SCAM, they should be excluded from having to support the scam. Screw OBAMMY and screw the Socialist DEMOCRATS

    Report Post » 13th Imam  
    • Locked
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:14pm

      “Screw OBAMMY and screw the Socialist DEMOCRATS”

      This was passed in 2007 by the Bush administration.

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:26pm

      LOCKED…don’t confuse them with facts. ;>)

      Report Post »  
    • 13th Imam
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 3:41pm

      In 2007, Who was in charge of both houses of congress?? Where legislation is created??

      Report Post » 13th Imam  
    • Locked
      Posted on February 9, 2012 at 9:50am

      @13th imam

      Who needs to sign laws to make them binding, and the ability to veto them?

      Report Post »  
  • Beckett
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:01pm

    When are the Christians of this country going to put down their Lattes and take up the Armour?

    Report Post »  
  • copatriots
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:00pm

    Sad reality but certainly not surprising with our anti-religious government. Glad to know a social worker at Planned Parenthood‘s debt will be forgiven while a teacher at a Christian school’s debt won’t. Gotta love progs. The agenda marches on…..

    As an aside, there aren’t many professions for which one should go into 10+ year debt. In most cases, the potential earnings don’t reconcile with the debt for the profession. This is yet another example of encouraging a debt-laden, unaccountable youth. Of course, that’s want libs want.

    Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:47pm

      COPATRIOTS…so it‘s a bad thing that a Muslim cleric doesn’t get his student loan forgiven because all he does is conduct Muslim prayer sessions?

      Report Post »  
    • copatriots
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:23pm

      Have an agenda much, LUM?

      Personally, I don’t think any student loan debt should forgiven by the government. Nor do I think one should rack up debt for a degree in any religious degree or most other professions. Having hired many people one thing I’ve learned, today‘s university degree isn’t worth very much and most of their graduates are the worst employees (go look in the mirror, LUM).

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:34pm

      COPATRIOTS…you specifically accused the government of being anti-religious and indicated that what was contained in the article was consistent with that. Obviously you are the one with agenda because the article does not support any conclusion of religious bias. And, the law was passed under George W. Bush…is he anti-religion, too?

      Report Post »  
    • copatriots
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:40pm

      You‘re deluded if you don’t see anti-religion agenda in both the government and this article. You flooded the thread with your agenda.

      Moving on…….

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 1:49pm

      COPATRIOT…all I see are a bunch of people who obviously either didn’t even bother reading the article and.or just want to ventilate about President Obama. Admit it…if Obama found a cure for cancer you people would criticize him. The fact of the matter is that this law, passed under Bush, is good, sound and fair.

      Report Post »  
    • copatriots
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:06pm

      I originally read the article and stand by my statement. I said nothing about Obama……I said progs and libs…both of which you appear to be. The movement certainly pre-dates Obama but his Alinsky-style tactics have certainly advanced the cause.

      Your comments have done nothing but affirmed the fact that you have an agenda. Your master will not be pleased with your results here.

      P.S. I promise to publicly commend your hero when he cures cancer. You might doubt that claim if it arises as he isn’t actually a doctor. Then again, did you know that Al Gore invented the internet?

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 2:16pm

      So, in other words, George W. Bush was advancing his progressive agenda by signing this law? I see…

      And, BTW, Al Gore never said he invented the internet. Apparently you get your news from FOX.

      Report Post »  
    • copatriots
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 10:12pm

      So do you lose points or prizes when you don’t have the last word, LUM? ROFL!!!!!

      Report Post »  
  • lukerw
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 11:51am

    Ah… Enemies of the ObamaSocialist Government!

    Report Post » lukerw  
  • Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}
    Posted on February 8, 2012 at 11:51am

    Of course the Feds will elimiate any forgiveness of loans when religion comes about; just watch though, those organizations that do support Obama will have their students loans eliminated. Political points is all this is about, to Obama the state and himself are god.

    Report Post » Snowleopard {gallery of cat folks}  
    • 65Mustang
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:10pm

      You are right, just another assault on this country’s freedoms by the Obama administration.

      Report Post »  
    • Lumbar Spine
      Posted on February 8, 2012 at 12:27pm

      65MUSTANG…explain, please, how this law, signed by George W. Bush in 2007 is Obama’s fault. The present Labor Department has simply explained the law but did not change it one iota…

      Report Post »  
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