Retired California Teachers Make More Than Working Teachers of Most States
- Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:17pm by
Emily Esfahani Smith
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Over at Interceptions, a blog that describes itself as “a listening post monitoring public education and teachers unions,” Mike Antonucci writes:
I came across the most recent summary report for the California State Teachers’ Retirement System (CalSTRS) and I thought its pared-down tables and graphs nicely encapsulated the pension situation in the state.
First note that the average annual salary in 2010 for active working educators enrolled in the system was $64,156. The next table states that the average retirement benefit paid out in 2010 was $4,256 per month. That’s $51,072 annually. In other words, the average retired teacher in California made more than the average working teacher in 28 states, according to the salary rankings published by NEA.
The final graph in the report provides the big picture. While the value of the pension system’s assets has increased fairly steadily over the past nine years, the accrued liabilities have grown non-stop during the same period, leaving the fund at 78% of full coverage. What’s more, CalSTRS operated on an assumed annual return of 8 percent. Last year, the pension board lowered that expectation to 7.75 percent, which means projections for the future will show even more of a gap.
Last year, the CalSTRS CEO warned that returns of 20 percent annually would be needed to fund all pensions. Without further increases in revenue or cuts in benefits, the system could be completely broke in 35 years.
The NEA figures can be found here on page 19.
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Comments (122)
mikenleeds
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:45pmwell they deserve to make the big bucks since they have done such a great job at educating the kids in Cali…. he he
Report Post »WHITE LOTUS2x
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:41pmiI would not like to live in Calif. but I have to say I love to visit. There is nothing better than sitting on the grass, yes there are some places you can sit on the grass, and watch and listen to the ocean. Many fun and relaxing and beautiful places to go. Two days and I`m ready to get the hell out of there. Those people are crazy out there. But, I love the ocean. Dont like thinking about the bad parts at all. Lotus.
Report Post »AmericanStrega
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:31pmjzs
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:04pm
Deceptive statistics Blaze. Every job pays more in California than most other states, and California cost of living is higher than most of states as well. If you want to live in the great state of Lousiana – and it is a great state – you’re make less and your cost of living is going to be less. You get a job in New York? You’re going to make more, and pay more to live there. This kind of selective statistics adds nothing to the dialogue so skip it please. This is apples and oranges.
As a service to those conservatives here. It’s not smart to go after teachers and claim they are “priviledged” when corporate profits are at an all time high in this country, and the rich are becoming richer and the poor, poorer. Same with firefighters, policeman etc. Rich people in this country are making money hand over fist (and not hiring, have you noticed?). Going after working men and women, and saying they make too much, while corporate and Wall street profits soar.
People at some point are going to stop buying the idea that what’s good for the richest, the 400 families in the US that control 50% of the wealth, is good for American. Those guys who making record profits, those families, Wall Street, are living “off the fat of the land” as Lenny said. But they are not “creating jobs.” And that’s going to happen before 2012.
Report Post »????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I live in rural Northeast Kansas. The major employer here is a “rich” man. He employees over 700 of the 10,000 souls that live in this county. Yes, there are only 10,000 people living in this county. This evil “rich” man, who by the way, has created 100′s of more jobs by diversifying his business, just gave all his employees a 3% cost of living wage increase. OH MY LORD, he IS an evil “rich” man, making his ill-gained money of the backs of us poor employees (sarcasm). The “rich” man provides jobs for the working-class. When the “rich” man sees only government intrusion on his business, he gets worried and thinks twice before expanding his business that would allow for more hiring. The “rich” men are not the boogies you want us all to believe in. They’re actually the ones that produce the jobs that we working-class Americans have to further our futures. Stop blaming the “rich”. If it wasn’t for them there would be no jobs for the working-class.
Anamah
Posted on June 3, 2012 at 12:38amWho sent you here?…or have you been drinking too much lately… or are you a simply moron, honey? You should know what is the matter: public teachers are great (sometimes) but their salary is paid of tax payers money. And business or corporations make private investments, working and risking their own money. Well, excepted of course the big donors and lobbying billionaires and corporations flirting with this government to receive subsidies. Now you can go to take a nap, and tell your boss what have you learned.
Report Post »the old plumber
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:56pmThey should be made to pay the country back for all the problems they have caused, Cali. is where most of this crap came from.
Report Post »TJexcite
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:50pmLets all go to a happy place and in this place California has a Republican Governor and Republican Senator. Not Governor moonbeam and Senator mama.
Report Post »daisymay
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:40pmWhat’s the big deal – just raise the taxes…
Report Post »parlayer
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:38pmMy mom is a teacher, Disgusting that that’s the way it is. Do nothing and get paid, NOT in my company. can’t respect anyone with a pension. Why?? Cause they don’t earn the money.
Report Post »miles from nowhere
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:29pmThere are way to many ignorant people in Caifornia that do not understand how big there problem is and what it will take to solve them. 15 years ago I wrote an editorial on California being our first third world state, the fools in california have proven me correct. They need to kick out all illegals, get rid of pot and all other illegal drugs, tell the liberal dead beats that there is nothing for free and clean up there state. Now you know why California is a lost cause, this will never happen.
Report Post »tierrah
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:46pm@Miles: Do you think the illegals welcomed into California stay in California? I resent the fact they are NOT made to stay in that stupid state. We need to build a Wall at the Border and Around California!!
Report Post »backward
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:18pmAnother thing people don’t know is this pension is at 50 or 55 not sure on that one and at 62 or 65 they will get more when they get their Social Security
Report Post »psst
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:38pmI had read an article awhile back that stated many teachers who can retire at a fairly early age does so. Then they get hired back, sometimes at the same schools.
Report Post »They draw their retirement checks plus their regular checks.
The article did not state whether they were rehired w/ tenure
workinghard
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:15pmI worked for an accounting firm up until a few years ago. I did a return for a retired Minnesota teacher, her pensions was $60,000 a year then. A friend said this year her income was $75,000. Even the retired teacher admitted it was a little ridiculous. More than she ever made working. Granted she has been retired for a about 15 years, but HOLY COW, what were they thinking?
Report Post »Ellbee
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:46amMy mom retired in 1985 after 30+ years teaching. She makes less than 18K. Mostly taught in VA, unless she was overseas teaching on a military base.
Report Post »WhatWasIThinking?
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:06pmhey, maybe all those retired teachers will die in an earthquake. just sayin :)
Report Post »RightPolitically
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:04pmObama loves it. When California goes broke because of the greed of public service unions, the rest of US will have the distinct honor of BAILING THEM OUT. But who is going to bail the rest of US out, China?
Report Post »riseandshine
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:57pmcorrupt leftist good for nothing, harmful to everything politics as usual
Report Post »kentuckypatriot
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:56pmthank the Lord I don’t live in Kalifornia
Report Post »Showtime
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:52pmWhat gets me is that our children are NOT getting a good education any longer. The unions have fixed things so teachers cannot be fired. And, then the nation is up in arms because we have sorry teachers who do not educate, and the unions get all ugly in our faces.
Whose damned tax money is paying these teachers? OURS!
Report Post »dmforman
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:24pmTrue and few good young teachers stay in the profession, as they see that they are spinning their wheels trying to educate the children and those with power could care less.
Another problem along with the unions, are teachers who get on line degrees that are worthless, but the course work/college credit increases their salary. This is also how many teachers/administrators get ahead. The degrees are worthless and you know when you hear someone say that they worked so hard for a degree from an on-line school with most of the work done during teaching time, that you a stupid person on your hands.
Makes me sick that I have to pay school taxes to a failing system.
Report Post »nightjc
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:45pmJust a little perspective from someone who is currently an educator. I graduated Salutatorian of my high school class, I went to college for three years remaining on Phi Theta Kappa the entire time. I finished the last two years of my B.A. in interdisciplinary studies K-8 online through WGU. Oh those terrible online schools that require you to be self-motivated, and show performance assessment work samples for credit rather than accumulating credit hours by showing up and sitting in a seat. I had plenty of scholarships, and I could have chosen any profession but I chose to be a teacher. I knew it would be difficult, but I also knew it would be rewarding. I’m now three years into the profession, and I’m ready to quit. It is so demoralizing what is occuring in the education field. For whatever reason the general public has this perception that educators are under-worked and over-paid. I went to school for five years, and I am required by law to continue receiving credits and degrees if I want to continue in the profession. Let me tell you how much this greedy teacher makes: $30,000 a year–oh, and if I want benefits those get deducted out of my pay check. Oh, my students need art supplies–guess who buys that–certainly not community tax dollars.
Report Post »What about my student’s progress? I live in a rural community with a poverty rate at 60%. 90% of my students score at or above benchmark for the state standardized tests. I’ve made it a point that along with reading and math that my students know American heroes from the revolutionary war. This month it’s Haym Solomon. Do you know him? Teachers sacrifice with low pay and long hours (I work 7:30a.m. – 5:30p.m. every night, and every other weekend—this does not include all the required evenings I give up for items such as parent teacher conferences) in order to have a little bit of a cushion when they retire. The teacher’s are just the latest victims in a bankrupt government, I won‘t be surprised if all state pensions aren’t eventually seized in order to “bail-out” America. God Bless America’s Teachers. I certainly won’t be one much longer.
ocdon
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 3:03pmNightJC
Thanks for doing the work you do where you do it. I am sure it is a very thankless profession, especially these days when many people are hating the unions, school systems, and teachers in general.
They fail to take responsibility for what they may or may not have done as parents and it is much easier to blame others.
It doesn‘t sound as if you’re happy teaching and it also sounds as if you care so stay if you can because the children need you. I, not events, have the power to make me happy today or not.
Good luck whatever your choice.
Report Post »right
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:47pmWOW!! How many folks get that high of a % of their salary as a pension?
Report Post »poppop13
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:46pmIf we don’t bail them out these teachers will sell there retirement policies for 35 cents on the dollar. I read in Hot Rod magazine about a year ago of a race engine builder that moved fron los angeles to El Paso and reduced the price from $9900 to $8500.00. This was because of all the taxes they had added. The final straw was a extra 10% on profits because the city was going under. An added benifit to move to Texas was no state income taxes and a right to work state.Here in Ada Oklahoma we have 4 new business that fled california in the last 6 months.These teachers can’t realize that with all those benefits and no paycheck their famlies will starve to death.
Report Post »Psychosis
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:44pminteresting read in the bottom link of article………………can anyone else notice what is missing from the whole report?
i will give you a clue in a little bit
Report Post »Psychosis
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:34pmok, since noone seems to know
there are no charts , graphs or any information that relates to any success rates
no graduation rates
no reading writing or math goals reached or missed
no drop out rates
no grade percentages
nowhere in the whole report
Report Post »Theleftisda
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 11:14pmThat’s because you have to click on it (PDF) form
Report Post »Psychosis
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 11:40pm@theleftisda
actually that is my point……………..click on the link and read the pdf
there is absolutely nothing in the pdf that talks about the topics i listed none nada zilch
Report Post »TKPedersen
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 8:57amWhy would you expect any Teachers’ Organization to submit anything that smacks of accountability? Once the teachers decided to Unionize, it became all about them, not about productions or the kids. And the leaders of their union brag about the fact that that their purpose is to benefit and protect teachers. I would never expect the kind of information you cited to be in one of their reports for two reasons: first…it would be embarrassing; and second, they don’t care.
Report Post »leftcoastslut
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:44pmif it has to do with a school district, especially in California, we do have the dumbest kids and the highest paid teachers.
Report Post »Showtime
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:49pmBy leftist design, my dear.
Report Post »Theleftisda
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 11:10pmyes we do,remember 25% of the children are illegal
Report Post »Valerius Poplicola
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:31pmTotally unrelated to the story but I want to get the word out – vote for Glenn Beck in Time 100 most influential people. Here is the link to vote for him:
http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2058044_2060338_2059895,00.html
Report Post »Showtime
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:49pmThanks. I voted.
Y’all – the union people are stacking the cards against him. Need to click on the link and vote “Yes.” A window will open so you can type in the character string. That’s all there is to it.
Report Post »Psychosis
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:52pmdid you look at the current results? it explains why we are in the condition as a country
Report Post »texanpatriot
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:07pmAs of 7:07 pm mst Glenn is running way behind. Haters at work…
Report Post »Marylou7
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:20pmI voted for Glenn but that is one stupid poll. Never heard of most of these people and they are scoring super high. They can’t be very influencial if we have never heard of them, can they!
Report Post »chickenlittle
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:48pmI voted too, thanks. What’s sick is liberals think “influencial” means that they agree with THEM to be considered influencial. I think Obama is influencial… it just doesn’t say much for those he is influencing! What a stupid question, and a stupid audience Time has. In the blurb at the right of the poll on beck they start out with how his ratings are dropping, based on a false story of market outlets… sheesh.
Report Post »Stoic one
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 11:32pmme too… voted
Report Post »AzCowboy
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 7:08amI voted.
Report Post »jH…
sodacrackers2
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 10:40amTime Magazine is a rag, can’t imagine them having too many readers anymore.
Report Post »Progessives=Fail
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:25pmI voted, but geez, what a liberal rag that is. Look at the top 11 so far.
The 2011 TIME 100 Poll ResultsBACKNEXT204 of 204
.CommentPrintEmailDigg FacebookTwitterMORE
Add to my:del.icio.usTechnoratiredditGoogle BookmarksMixxStumbleUponBlog this on:TypePadLiveJournalBloggerWordPressMySpace..See how your picks for the most influential people in the world rated among TIME readers. The winner will be included in the TIME 100. Voting closes on April 14.
The 2011 TIME 100 Poll This table lists the poll results as voted on by Time.com users. To sort the data, click on any of the column headers.
Rank Name Influential Not Influential Total Votes
1 Rain 36034 3802 39836
2 Chris Colfer 14865 2135 17000
3 Julian Assange 12118 569 12687
4 Lady Gaga 13389 2551 15940
5 Jay Chou 12248 1980 14228
6 Beyoncé 10511 1786 12297
7 Ron Paul 8757 764 9521
8 Fukushima Power Plant Workers 10155 2819 12974
9 Rihanna 7586 1350 8936
10 Mohamed Bouazizi 5852 259 6111
11 Wisconsin‘s ’Fab 14′ State Senators
The FAB 14 senators???? you have got to be kidding me!
Report Post »Revere1
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:28pmThe liberal wasteland of California is the future of the rest of the states unless people draw a line in the sand. The teachers unions are rapacious. They will not stop until they’ve bankrupted every state. http://www.battlefield315.com/2011/02/teachers-unions-explained.html How can they claim they’re “for the middle class” if they’re so busy destroying it? When will people wake up?
Report Post »psycodad36
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:27pmSo?
Report Post »Showtime
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:45pmSo, California is BROKE!
Report Post »Mister_Bill
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:00pmHey Psyco, ever heard about a fool and his money? Well they are soon separated. I had friends that moved out to California. They moved back pretty soon. They now are buying their home for less money that what they paid to rent in California just a space above their garage.
Report Post »calamari12
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:26pmTrue. They want us to pay for them to sit on their butts and do nothing while we have to work hard and send our kids to third rate schools that don’t even teach them how to read.
Report Post »REDwhiteBLUEcommrade
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:25pmAnd everyone wonders why California is broke
Report Post »AKMIIKEUS
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:40pmTexas is just as broke as California and it’s been led by Republican governors, congressmen and senator’s for over 15 years.
leftcoastslut
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:47pmreply to akmikeus …. really doesn’t have to do with who was in office, the union is the union, sways like a willow, has invasive roots and is hard to get rid of when the roots have already formed…
Report Post »AKMIIKEUS
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:17pmWell in Texas it does matter who’s been in office, there are no unions here except in the private sector.
Report Post »Texas is a right to work state.
sWampy
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:54pmBut Texas ISN’T BROKE. Very Happy
1) It has a $10 billion reserve fund.
2) The biggest drain on the Texas budget is coming from $8 billion bill for Medicaid, a Federal program, and Obamacare will only increase that.
Read the whole article here.
http://www.nationalreview.com/exchequer/256614/no-paul-krugman-texas-not-broke
Report Post »angelcat
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:55pmTexas in in no way in the financial trouble California is. It does have a financial shortfall, but it also has an rainy day fund from which it can choose to withdraw funds. It is also not taxed as heavily as California and, though most of us Texans see taxes only as a dispicable last resort, if Texas really had to raise taxes, it could do so without taxing residents to death as California does.
Report Post »Robert-CA
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:02pm@ AKMIIKEUS
CA is not broke , CA still has a surplus from Bill Clinton .
Report Post »Did I say surplus ? oops !!! I meant to say “ Borrowing from the future ”
butler180
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:42pmTaxpayers who do not vote in school elections get what they deserve. Higher tax to pay a teachers salary and health care cost.
Report Post »Lesson to anyone willing to learn – vote on school budgets and do not back teachers on strike for more pay (you don’t get it) and make teachers and all other public employees pay more towards their pensions and health care.
Melvin Spittle
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 4:08pm@leftcoastslut well put.
Report Post »Psychosis
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 8:25pmWhat’s more, CalSTRS operated on an assumed annual return of 8 percent. Last year, the pension board lowered that expectation to 7.75 percent, which means projections for the future will show even more of a gap
assumed annual return of 8% and they lowered it to 7.75%
interesting note, the average annual return is under 3% and that is only at the end of the rainbow, most returns are actually closer to 1% or less
how , in all honesty can they project an 8% return when the current return is no where near that number, and has never been near that number……………it is noteworthy they have been projecting 8% returns for yrs, never to materialize
Report Post »texanpatriot
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:03pmProjecting 8% is their way of using smoke and mirrors. Who signed off on this? Did the teachers believe this number? Now it is 1-3% and they are using 7.75???
Report Post »A house of cards for sure. Wisconsin and Ohio have it right if the Americans who live there will only stick to their guns – oops, sorry for using such as unfriendly term.
BetterDays
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:11pmGood catch, additionally we should note that charter schools and private schools aren’t listed in comparisons of student performance, that would be letting the cat out of the bag I guess.
Report Post »texanpatriot
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:15pmIf you think Cali has used smoke and mirrors, take a look at what the Feds are doing:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/march-madness-feds-spent-more-eight-time
Report Post »Creestof
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 9:30pmHey now…it is obvious they earned those big bucks by the high standard of education they bestowed on those classy kids in Kalifornia!
Hehe…I made a funny!
Report Post »jzs
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:04pmDeceptive statistics Blaze. Every job pays more in California than most other states, and California cost of living is higher than most of states as well. If you want to live in the great state of Lousiana – and it is a great state – you’re make less and your cost of living is going to be less. You get a job in New York? You’re going to make more, and pay more to live there. This kind of selective statistics adds nothing to the dialogue so skip it please. This is apples and oranges.
As a service to those conservatives here. It’s not smart to go after teachers and claim they are “priviledged” when corporate profits are at an all time high in this country, and the rich are becoming richer and the poor, poorer. Same with firefighters, policeman etc. Rich people in this country are making money hand over fist (and not hiring, have you noticed?). Going after working men and women, and saying they make too much, while corporate and Wall street profits soar.
People at some point are going to stop buying the idea that what’s good for the richest, the 400 families in the US that control 50% of the wealth, is good for American. Those guys who making record profits, those families, Wall Street, are living “off the fat of the land” as Lenny said. But they are not “creating jobs.” And that’s going to happen before 2012.
Report Post »Gold Coin & Economic News
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:17pmWhy can‘t the union thugs figure out we don’t have unlimited money, it doesn‘t grown on trees and you can’t take from the system forever.
Report Post »http://www.usgoldcoinauctions.com/gold-coin-blog/2011/04/we-will-all-work-for-the-government-soon/
Sparky101
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:26pmJZS, let’s unpack that a bit. This means if I live in the great state of Lousiana, and make a product and ship it to California and sell it cheaper than the same product made in California, and obviously out sell that California product in my own state, that California company must downsize, right size, left size, and lay people off as they spiral down to bankruptcy. And that’s smart? If you run a company, in a state where all your raw materials and your personnel cost more than every other state, So, in comes the unions and the government, to hire up all those people and expect all the others to pay for them. That’s smart? Like Margaret Thacher said, ultimately you lefies run out of other people’s money. Kind of like entropy isn’t it.
Report Post »UpstateNYConservative
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:35pm@jzs
Screw you. You’re just another liberal. YOU, and other liberals like YOU, do the same things by rote that my cat does in his litter box.
What YOU say, and what my cat does in his litter box, is the same thing.
Report Post »jzs
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 10:48pmSparky101, I don’t doubt your post is well-intentioned but I don’t follow it. I don’t follow your economic argument.
There are places not just in the US but all over the world that are considered desirable places to live (frankly, I’d rather live in Louisina that California, but that’s not my point). Companies pay more to live in those places, and the cost of living tends to be higher. That’s an oversimplification, but there is a balance.
If you’re saying that people, like teachers, like firefighters, like police, should be paid LESS in those places, I think you’re a Communist or something. Are you advocating that Americans earn less in a period where the rich are making record profits?
Report Post »24AheadDotCom
Posted on April 4, 2011 at 11:55pmSo, who do we blame? The Dems and the far-left are just doing what comes naturally for them. They can’t really be “blamed” because they’re just doing their jobs.
So, who isn’t doing their jobs? Who let this situation happen in the first place.
For the answer, look no further than the GOP and the teaparty “patriots” (or their predecessors). They helped this situation happen by allowing (in one way or another) mass immig.
The main reason there are so many retired teachers in the first place is due to mass immig. If we weren‘t basically educating millions of citizens of a foreign country we’d have fewer retired teachers, less spending on school building, and less spending overall.
Yet, the GOP allowed this situation to build to its current state. The teaparty “patriots” have barely said a word about illegal immig. or mass immig. in general, despite it being the topic where the Dems and the far-left are weakest.
It takes two to tango, and the GOP and the current or nascent teaparty “patriots” matched the Dems step for step.
If you’re smart and sane and want to oppose both the far-left and the self-described “patriots” in the teaparties, help promote this plan that would have a far greater and far better impact on the U.S. than anything Beck has ever said or done:
http://24ahead.com/s/question-authority
Report Post »seeker9
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:00am@JZS
Report Post »Are you a Michael Moore economic proponent? That there is a fixed amount of money out there, and 400 people are stealing it all? Why do you not start a business, hire as many employees as you can. Give them health care for life, and let them retire at age 55 and pay them retirement benefits for the rest of their lives. All will be utopia. You will have your revenge on those evil corporations and their profits.
seeker9
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:05am@JZS
Report Post »Do you hate George Soros for being too wealthy?
ME
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:17amseeker9
You tell him:) JZS can live it and bring the dream to all his fellow liberals. Let us all know how it works out in the real world.
Report Post »You will be here like me complaining how the pigs in government take the money faster then you can make it and expect you to keep doing it when there is so little incentive that treating your employees right is the only thing that still makes it worth wild.
tea bag patriot
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:19amThese commie teachers are living it up on our tax money.
Report Post »jzs
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:27am@SEEKER, I don’t hate people. I empathize with them though. And yeah, I think it’s a little weird that America is cutting taxes for the billionaires and those 400 wealth families who own half of the wealth of the United States while cutting the pay of teachers, police and firefighters.
The rich are getting richer (corporate profits are at an all time high), and the poor – that’s you more than me – are getting poorer. Yeah, like you’re going to get a big raise or land a that six figure job because of tax cuts for the rich. Get back to me in five years, and tell me about that big raise and promotion you got instead of your employeer buying another summer home in France.
Report Post »jackrorabbit
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 12:47amMost mutual funds average 10% if they are lucky. I doubt that this money was invested in the stock market. Perhaps it is in the housing market.
Report Post »seeker9
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 1:15am@JZS
Report Post »First of all, I am on my own, thank you, and have no intention of having it any other way. More likely than not, it will be me shopping for a chateau in France. I discovered long ago that an employer cannot make all employees wealthy no more than the government can redistribute wealth and make all citizens prosperous. No one is going to get prosperous sitting on their hands waiting for some one to give them something. My #1 law: If you want prosperity, YOU will have to make it happen. No one can or will give you prosperity before they themselves become prosperous.
JGP
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 1:20amJZS, I assume the tax breaks for the rich your talking about is the extension of the Bush tax rate, or cut depending on how it’s spun.
I think we can agree on some of this. These rich people you talk about are a bunch of “lefties” as well as “righties”. They have loop holes and tax laws written specifically for them by their politician that they have genrously donated to. Raising their tax rates or eliminating their tax breaks won’t bring in all the money people estimate that it will. They will simply find a way around it through new tax laws introduced by their favorite politician and or pass any extra cost to do business (taxes) on to the consumer, me and you.
We need a fair tax or consumption tax. I know there are pro‘s and con’s to that but this current 60,000 page tax code will NEVER be fair to the people that can’t afford that politician or tax accountant. NEVER.
And the problem isn’t so much a lack of taxes, it’s too much federal spending (waste and corruption). You’ll have better control and oversight locally. The way it was meant to be.
Report Post »Maxx Powers
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 3:11am@JZS original post.
O.K. maybe the cost of living is higher in Cali, yet the story states “the average retired teacher” pay in CA (i.e. not currently working, RETIRED) is higher than WORKING teachers in 28 states!
I love California, but that’s why I got the heck out.
Report Post »RRC
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 11:47amJZS you seem to have presented some reasoned and thoughtful opinions so l let me give you a few more data points.
Your analysis where cost of living drives wages, while it may meet conventional wisdom it is not reality. I was part of a very large US IT corporation that endeavored to pay competitive or better wages for talented individuals. What we found is that wages could be the same or higher in lower cost of living areas. In one specific we thought we would find higher wages in the north east corridor where cost of living is high. We found just the opposite. There was an abundance of people with the skills we were looking for. The normal free market effect of supply and demand kept those wages lower since more people were competing for those jobs. BTW those folks had the freedom to move to the lower cost states in effect ending up with a better quality of life for their families.
Another analysis I took on out of curiosity was to look at state to state population migration impacts. California’s crisis, as well as many other high cost of living and high tax states, can only continue and get worse based on what I found. California has been experiencing a year over year net loss of population. What should be more disturbing is the trends underlying this year over year net loss. The income of people leaving the state is significantly higher than that of those moving to the state which compounds the impact of the population and tax base loss.
As to taking in teachers and fire fighters you miss the point. Most conservatives are taking on the corruption of a system that allows public union bosses to buy and own politicians. In the private sector there are market forces that mitigate bargaining. It does no good to bargain for higher benefits if it closes your company and puts you out of work. In the private sector where the union bosses own the politicians you end up with bankrupt state and local governments since there are no market forces or people representing the tax payer on the other side of the negotiations. The market will eventually take control either through politicians waking up or state and local defaults which will bring more heart ache than you can imagine.
As to tax breaks for the rich and corporations. This is not the providence of those entities alone. One just needs to look at the largess built into the health care and bailout legislation provided to union and other groups.
Anyway I thought I would provide some more insights.
Report Post »Kalish
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 2:40pm24AheadDotCom
This country has NEVER given the republicans a fair chance, (I’m not a republican, I am an independent) because it has never given them a super majority in the house and senate, let alone with a republican president, maybe then wouldn’t do what they said they would, but this country has never given them a chance, unlike the democrats who had super majorities with carter and johnson, (that went real well didn’t it !) and other times they had a super majority, but with a republican in office, here is a list :
Report Post »http://uspolitics.about.com/od/usgovernment/l/bl_party_division_2.htm
sleazyhippo
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 5:16pmThirty years ago, the “private sector” engineers laughed at those nerds who chose the military or teaching, or to work for the county; calling them losers for taking low salary and deferred benefits (and somewhat early retirement). Today these same folks have let their families suffer due to lost prosperity, and now they are outraged by the public workers “entitlements” and are jealously trying to cancel their contracts.
Report Post »Today’s politicians have decided to attack the “huge entitlements” of medicare and social security because they “are the largest portion of the future debt.”
Well, once the future obligation to our old and weak has been eliminated, they will realize that Military retirement is the “largest portion of the Defense budget,“ and they will come after the ”double dipping” veterans who retire after as few as 20 years and go to work with a military pension.
Then it will be time to attack the military disabled and other “entitlements.”
Everyone is scared because of the last decade‘s erosion of the last generation’s fiscal discipline. If we would just pay our war bills, everything else would fall into balance.
Sparky101
Posted on April 5, 2011 at 9:52pmJZS, I’m tending towards being amazed you did not understand my simple example of a company pricing itself out of business. Of course I’m also tending towards believing you just tried to weasel out of it by implying that I am a communist and hate firemen, etc.
Nice try blovator. There are only a few ways companies can survive in California. Make a product that no one else makes. Make a product of such high quality, that people will still buy it even though it is more expensive. Team up with the state govrenment to cut your tax bite and help support your employees, so you can remain competitive, even though overpriced. Seems like most of California is in the latter mode, and they have simply run out of other people’s money. With no where else to go, they will want the rest of the nation to bail them out – but they want it with no ties that bind. They want to keep being money stupid, with other people’s money. JZS, it’s truly simple, you can‘t continuously spend what you don’t have, and remain solvent. Since the major cost for most businesses and enterprises is people, it’s also the quickest way to cut costs, unless your workers are in a union, then you have to just fold.
Report Post »roachesneverdie
Posted on April 6, 2011 at 3:00pmIt’s interesting to note their “Administrative Expenses” went up more than 25% from 2009 to 2010, an increase of more than $27mil to administer the program. Just how many “new” jobs does that represent, who got raises, and how much/what was the distribution? That is California taxpayer money at work, right? How many private sector jobs were lost in Cal. at the same time? I guess it pays to be a retired teacher in the land of fruits and nuts!
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