Faith

Should Religious Business Owners Be Legally Permitted to Turn Away Gay Customers — And Vice-Versa?

Should Religious Business Owners Be Able to Turn Customers Away?

Victoria Childress, owner of Victoria's Cake Cottage

Remember Victoria Childress, the baker in Des Moines, Iowa, who refused to make a cake for a lesbian couple’s wedding?

There was a great deal of debate surrounding the story, with supporters claiming that it was her right as a Christian business owner to decline the service; opponents, though, called her stance discriminatory and decried it.

Here‘s a recap from The Blaze’s coverage of the story back in November:

Trina Vodraska and Janelle Sievers claim that they were shocked when they approached Victoria Childress, the owner of Victoria’s Cake Cottage, and she declined their business. “It was degrading, you know, it was like she chastised us for wanting to do business with her,” Vodraska said. [...]

“I didn’t do the cake because of my convictions for their lifestyle. It is my right as a business owner,” Childress explained. “It is my right, and it’s not to discriminate against them. It’s not so much to do with them, as it’s to do with me, and my walk with God and what I will answer (to) him for,” she continued.

While the couple were initially mulling legal action, Childress recently told The Blaze that she hasn’t heard anything since the story of her refusal to serve the women initially broke. Additionally, rather than seeing her business decline, Childress says it has actually picked up as a result of the drama.

“I’ve had people call me, see that there’s a boycott against my business…and say, ‘Can I order something from you?,’” she said. “I shipped out 90 dozen Christmas cookies from people who wanted to support me from across the country [back in December].”

Despite the success, she says she is still getting hate mail. However, she maintains a positive outlook on the matter.

“It’s been a blessing,” Childress says. “God has used it.”

The story certainly had strong emotion on both sides of the debate, but what would happen if the roles were reversed? Let’s say the business owner is a gay male or female who refuses to serve an individual who is opposed to same-sex marriage. Does that change the way in which people view it?

Last month, The Blaze reported on a story encompassing this very scenario, as hairstylist Antonio Darden publicly refusal to style New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez’s hair, citing her opposition to gay marriage in his reasoning. While same-sex unions aren’t recognized in the state, Darden is apparently so turned off by the governor’s opinion on the matter that he refuses to cut and style her hair.

Should Religious Business Owners Be Able to Turn Customers Away?

New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez addresses a joint session of the House and Senate at the start of the legislative session in Santa Fe, N.M., on Tuesday, Jan. 17, 2012. (AP Photo/Susan Montoya Bryan)

According to The New York Daily News, the hairdresser told a local outlet that he has cut Martinez’s hair three times, but that he won’t do it any longer — unless she reverses her opposition to gay marriage.

“The governor’s aides called not too long ago, wanting another appointment to come in,” he said in an interview with KOB-TV. “Because of her stances and her views on this, I told her aides no. They called the next day, asking if I’d changed my mind about taking the governor in and I said no.”

These, of course, are only two examples of individuals who have opted to decline service. In the first example, Childress chose to withhold her support of a gay union (for religious reasons). In the second, Darden refused to provide service to a female client, because she opposes same-sex marriage (for personal reasons).

While there notable differences between the cases, an overall question lingers: Should business owners be allowed to decline service to customers based on ideological differences?

Take our poll, below, which explores several questions associated with this intriguing debate and we’ll share the results with you in the coming days:


Freedom to Decline Service

Comments (139)

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  • THXll38
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:10am

    “Should Religious Business Owners Be Legally Permitted to Turn Away Gay Customers — And Vice-Versa?” Yes!

    However, I do remember some social Cons bitching about the hair stylist that refused to cut the hair of New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez’s.

    Report Post » THXll38  
  • hi
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:09am

    Doctors and nurses cannot refuse and are forced to risk their lives treating HIV and AIDS patients! I know the risk is low, but it is ridiculous. Then if the doc contracts HIV from his patient, he or she can not longer practice.

    Report Post » hi  
    • Vechorik
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:19am

      “no shoes, no shirt, no service”

      Report Post »  
    • lukerw
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:30am

      In America… each individual has a Complete Freedom of Choice… even if there are Consequences to their actions (being Fired; being Arrested). PEVENTIONISM is a SOCIALIST creed that trades SAFETY for FREEDOM (these being OPPOSITES)!

      Report Post » lukerw  
    • CLG 4
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 9:00am

      Just because you have a business that does not mean you have to give to anyone that wants it. But once offered you cannot take it back. Doctors a re subject to a different set of tort laes in this country. What we really need is more socialist democrats to dictate to everyone how to behave toward them.
      I applaud Victoria on her stance as a business owner.

      Report Post »  
    • Link8on
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 9:06am

      In the early 90′s an ER overnight doctor declined a

      1 homeless
      2 dialysis patient
      3 who declared himself having AIDS
      when one of his nurses
      4 recognized him from a recent episode of America’s Most Wanted.

      He still took a blood sample and measured that the urine levels as sustainable for about 3 – 4 more days. The homeless guy was given apple juice and then walked off.

      The main reason for rejection was AIDS. The hospital had only 1 dialysis machine. That machine already served several patients. Cleaning out that machine is a hard, and not guarranteed to clear out bad diseases. He really did not want to risk all of those other patients getting infected. Lots of AIDS patients were discriminated against during that time.

      AIDS puts the rest of your client base at severe medical risk. That doctor got away with it then, but works elsewhere today.

      A gay or Christian isolationist attitude does not.

      I would say that government bailed out business should be expected to be less discriminating than one that is completely private.

      Report Post » Link8on  
    • sawbuck
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 9:29am

      HI
      Thanks for giving us the “go to talking point” ,
      the gay community is going to use on this one.
      Maybe we can stop this snowball ,
      before it pick up speed and becomes law.
      Like the pro-choice people used “ rape and incest“,
      as their “talking points” that gave us “legalized unborn murder” .

      Report Post » sawbuck  
    • bs_detector
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 10:12am

      Doctors and nurses also swore the Hippocratic oath which says they can do no harm to their patients. That includes harm from inaction as well as from their actions.

      Report Post » bs_detector  
    • Walkabout
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 11:55am

      BS Detector
      I have been to a gay website. There was one gay Christian there. I have not seen him post for quite some time. The website is currently in full Jihad mode. If someone published something critical of any religion but especially Christianity, they post it. The make common cause with any atheist organization. I have seen sites with pastors who were gay. I wouldn’t agree with them on points, but you could at least have a dialogue with them. But they are small voices. What I see with the gay community is that they sense victory. They will marginalize, institutionalize or criminalize anyone who gets in their way. They will also pervert science from what I can see of how they treated a major contributor of the DSM 3 & 4, who was instrumental in getting homosexuality delisted as psychiatric condition. It did not matter. They went off on him.

      The gay atheists regard Christianity as a bronze age ethic. That is their new talking point. they are constantly taking a passage here or there out of context to fortify their base, convince atheists & others.

      I see the conflict intensifying.

      Report Post »  
    • smithclar3nc3
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 12:44pm

      well,SPECIAL INTEREST Groups routinely boycott and picket businesses for whatever reason,Business should have the same right the boycott and picket SPECIAL INTEREST groups

      Report Post »  
    • smithclar3nc3
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 12:51pm

      LINK80 WROTE,I would say that government bailed out business should be expected to be less discriminating than one that is completely private.
      Why would you expect that? The government is the most racist business in America. AFFIRMATIVE ACTION,MINORITIES ONLY PROGRAMS,WOMEN ONLY PROGRAMS,SPECIAL INTEREST LOAN,AND SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAMS…….all discriminate against WHITE MALES

      Report Post »  
    • jcldwl
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 4:01pm

      All private businesses have the right to refuse to serve anyone. It is their private business. Never forget that no matter what these whacked out progressives try to say.

      Report Post » jcldwl  
    • JohnnyMidknight
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 5:26pm

      Any private business has a right to reserve any good or service that is not available to the public (thanks to the Civil Rights Bill of 1964). So long as it is club or company that requires membership to gain access to it, patronage can be withheld to whom ever the private owner wishes. This of course is providing that the patron in no way is infringing on rules that apply to all patrons (IE no shoes, no shirt, etc). IE It is illegal to withhold services from people due to sex or race, save if you are a country club of rich, white dudes and want to keep it that way.

      However, it should be that any company should be able to select whom they wish to serve… But why cut such a large percentage of demographics? It would be counter productive to your reason to be in business.

      Report Post » JohnnyMidknight  
    • Link8on
      Posted on March 7, 2012 at 12:15am

      @smithclar3nc3

      You made a good point.

      Educational Affirmative Action scholarships should be privatized.

      Educational Affirmative Action slots in college admitances for otherwise unqualified students should be compensated to the taxpaying public.

      I would not go as far as rewarding the marginally qualified white male students bumped in favor of female/minority students, since
      1 a youth has a tremdous capacity to improve themselves as reflected by higher standardized test scores for qualification to the same institution at a later point.
      2 qualified white male students are likely to qualify at many other educational institutions.

      Businesses that got government bailouts should discriminate in favor of citizens and taxpayers .
      Businesses that got government bailouts should promote fairly from thier ranks.

      The Federal government bailed out neither the Catholic Church nor their hospitals, therefore, they should be able to refrain from hiring athiest zealots and other non-Catholics.

      But we should be wary as the BHO white house attempts to drive many hospitals and medical centers into bankruptcy to advance anti Christian agenda.

      Report Post » Link8on  
    • B_rad
      Posted on March 7, 2012 at 1:11am

      If an OWS protestor came in to my place of business, I would absolutely not serve them, so I understand the sentiment. Business owners should have the right to serve the clientele they choose. If one guy doesn’t want my business, the next guy will. Why does ANYONE believe they have the right to force people to do something for them?? Who would want to do business with someone who is so diametrically opposed to them? Don’t serve me if you wish, I’ll go somewhere else. All I ask is that no one cause me harm for who or what I am. I don‘t think that’s too much to ask.

      Report Post » B_rad  
    • Old Truckers
      Posted on March 8, 2012 at 1:37pm

      “NO SOUP for YOU !!”

      Report Post » Old Truckers  
  • May Clark
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:02am

    Liberals & other special interest group people live in a dreamworld where they think they are the only people who are treated badly in daily life. We live in a harsh, nasty unforgiving world, where everyone is subjected to ill treatment at times. Rudeness and bad behavior are epidemic. Instead of special interest group people approaching life always on the look-out to report ill treatment, they should just learn to take life in it’s stride and make the best of things. If you want to receive some nasty treatment, just try to be a stay-at-home mother. The venom you get just merely for even wearing that title is monstrous. From what I can see, there is already plenty of support for all of the liberal special interest group people. It’s the person who sincerely lives the conservative life who gets attacked the most.

    Report Post »  
  • ShadowPlacebo
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:00am

    In this economy if they wanna lose business and money, their fault. I don’t think anyone should turn away money. If they wanna be bigots that’s their problem, as well.

    Report Post » ShadowPlacebo  
    • TAXEVERYONE
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 9:54am

      Yes it is their choice.
      Please learn how to spell.

      Report Post » TAXEVERYONE  
    • Old Truckers
      Posted on March 8, 2012 at 1:19pm

      Hang a sign on your front door:

      This business will be open when we want to be open, and can close at a moments notice.

      Report Post » Old Truckers  
  • kdshell1
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:57am

    If the situation were reversed, I‘d want to know the business’ position so that I don’t spend my money with businesses who hate God.

    Report Post »  
  • JonSigMan
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:56am

    It comes down to choice, they choose to live their way, and I choose to live mine, simple as that, take a long walk and think about it. They choose to be defiant to their Creator, I choose to be obediant. Sure, it chaffe’s their butt, but that’s again their problem, not mine. So yes, it’s great to see more people say firm and just say “No”. And if I wish to buy something they have and they say no, they I didn’t need it anyway. So be it.

    Report Post » JonSigMan  
  • cemerius
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:50am

    I reserve the right to refuse service to anyone I damn please!! After all, it’s my business and my profits/business……..

    Report Post » cemerius  
    • Vechorik
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:25am

      Yes, indeed Private Property rights for businesses and homes! It’s the Constitution!

      Same with churches. It’s their property, owned by a group. If someone comes to church in a bikini, then the group (property owners) have to right to ask the bikini-wearer to leave because it doesn’t fit with the greater goal of the PROPERTY OWNER.

      Report Post »  
  • Nemo13
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:47am

    Why would you want to sell a cake to those who are profaining your religion? Religion does not accept gays, thus there is no gay marriage and a cake is not needed. I would throw them out and also tell them to stop using customs and traditions that are not for their freak people.

    Report Post »  
  • SpankDaMonkey
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:46am

    .
    Well she could have made the ladies a great big Penis cake……..

    Report Post » SpankDaMonkey  
  • SamIamTwo
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:44am

    Urmmm they have always reserved the right not to serve anyone they deem inappropriate…you know those, that they deem would run off regular customers, no shirt, no shoes, acting out, skateboarders, MJ smokers, fornicators blah blah blah.

    Yeah, it is their business, their property and they can set standards…

    Report Post » SamIamTwo  
  • RepubliCorp
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:38am

    Does the government have the right to run every aspect of your business?

    Report Post » RepubliCorp  
    • Gonzo
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:49am

      Well, they are dictating what’s included in the benefit package you offer your employees now and half the country seems fine with it.

      Report Post » Gonzo  
  • Nemo13
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:37am

    Of course you should be able to turn away whomever you please. No shirt, no shoes, not hetrosexual? no service. I’m sure there are other ghey outlets in a closet somewhere.

    Report Post »  
  • jujulyly
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:34am

    The cake maker doesn’t support gay marriage so making a cake for one would have violated her conscience. I’m sure if they had wanted a cake for a birthday or some similar celebration, she probably would have made one.

    Report Post »  
  • LOTO
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:34am

    We reserve the RIGHT to refuse service to ANYONE.

    Report Post » LOTO  
  • ShyMan
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:30am

    If you own the business refuse whomever you want.

    No one can force you to shop there either.

    Report Post » ShyMan  
  • garyganu
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:29am

    I believe the government should not force discrimination like they did with “Jim Crow.” laws. The government should also not outlaw discrimination by individuals and businesses. Let the marketplace sort it out. The only place where discrimination should be outlawed is within monopolies like government and public utilities.

    Report Post »  
  • love the kids
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:29am

    This is what amazes me. If I were making plans for one of the biggest days of my life, and one of the people I called told me they didn’t want to make the cake for me, I would go elswhere, somewhere that I felt comfortable with. Why didn’t they go to a baker that is Gay in the first place. I’m sure there are a lot of them out there who would LOVE to bake their cake.
    Basically, I have had many problems with many businesses, I just go away and never use them again, and I usually tell friends, but for some reason, Gays seem to constantly pick on purpose the businesses that don’t provide good service to them to try to force them to comply. There is more than 1 brain defect going on here.

    Report Post »  
    • Git-R-Done
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 2:22pm

      That’s the whole idea with those kind of people. The homosexual rights groups want to force people to accept their way of life as normal or face consequences.

      Report Post »  
  • Baddoggy
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:26am

    The gay community is trying to make this a civil rights issue. The color of one’s skin has no bearing on this to make it so. It is INTEGRITY and SINFUL NATURE we are talking about here,,,not the color of one’s skin.
    If we have to sell something to openly sinful people it shuld be our choice, Like a bartender not serving someone who he thinks is drunk…heck that even became a law! I would not sell a gun to someone who I knew would kill someone else. Its the sin we are talking about and the association with that sin that repulses us to the point where we do not want thier money….
    I love my brother who is openly gay. I however do not help him when he is in trouble, I do not give him money, I do not make his life any easier in any way…His lifestyle repulses me.He is family, but if I owned a business he would know not to try to purchase anything from me.

    Report Post » Baddoggy  
    • Baddoggy
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:32am

      By the way if Obama care passes the Supreme Court and we are forced to buy insurance, then they could make us buy a Chevy Volt, a windmill for our backyard and even a penis shaped wedding cake if they wanted to…Think about that for a moment…

      Report Post » Baddoggy  
    • Baddoggy
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:33am

      I guess if I ever wanted a penis shaped cake I could come over to your house? Thanks…I will pass…

      Report Post » Baddoggy  
  • blanco5
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:21am

    In a true “free market” the answer is yes. But we haven’t had a true free market for ……….when is the last time we had a true free market?

    Report Post »  
  • SpankDaMonkey
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:18am

    .
    Oh the IRS and every H-Mo within a 100 miles will be knocking at the door soon Sweetie. It’s gonna suck to be you for awhile. But you stand your ground, and the rest of us will stand behind you………

    Report Post » SpankDaMonkey  
  • SanMoo
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:12am

    I would not do what she did—BUT, it is her right to take in business or not take in business. No one can force you to do that–YET! That goes for either direction….whether you are straight or gay.

    Report Post » SanMoo  
  • txwheels
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:11am

    It’s a privately owned business. They can refuse who ever they want!

    Report Post »  
  • Godssailor
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:03am

    It seems that she didn’t refuse ALL service, just A service. Is it discriminatory? I don’t think so. They went to a bakery and asked for a certain kind of cake decoration. The owner said, “We don’t provide that service.”

    If they had just asked for a box of cupcakes, they probably would have been happily supplied. If they had asked for a plain wedding cake and bought the cake topper themselves, it probably would have been happily supplied. But they made a point of asking for a lesbian wedding cake and were told that service was not provided. That isn’t discriminatory, it just happens to be the practice of that business.

    If you went to Burger King (a restaurant that serves hamburgers and even goes as far as to say you can have it your way) and asked for a Big Mac (a hamburger), you would be leave disappointed. Is Burger King discriminating against Big Mac lovers? No. They just don’t provide that service, but there is a restaurant that does. Just as there are bakeries that cater to homosexuals.

    If a person owns a business, they should have the right to refuse service to anyone. I think it might be a good idea to have a disclaimer that says something to the effect of “We happily serve the homosexual members of our community, but we do not provide baked goods that are decorated to promote the homosexual lifestyle.”

    Or something like that.

    Report Post »  
    • dpselfe
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:21am

      The only thing I see here is that the lesbian couple wanted a specific item which would clearly be against the values amd morals of the business owner. Were a motorcycle gang member to walk in and request a cake depicting some sort of violent act (not suggesting that ALL motorcycle gangs are violent or even bad……just an example…….settle down) and she refused, it would be no different. Her mistake was that she ruffled the feathers of a couple who are in a “protected class”. They immediately fell into “victim mode”. Were I a bakery owner, I’d sell anything to anyone, as long as it was within my morals and ethics. That being said I wouldn’t do a cake top with two brides or two grooms, but I’d sell them 2 pairs of brides and grooms, and let them arrange them (after they left my store) as they saw fit. Why not 2 brides and one groom, or 2 grooms and one bride, or……..all 4?

      Report Post » dpselfe  
    • 9111315
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 7:35am

      Meanwhile, the hair stylist refused to provide the normal and customary service offered to all other customers.

      Report Post »  
    • May Clark
      Posted on March 6, 2012 at 8:03am

      GODSSAILOR,

      Excellent analysis.

      Report Post »  
  • Grasshopper42
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 6:58am

    Wouldn’t go to a known homosexual business, anyway.

    Report Post » Grasshopper42  
  • chameleonx
    Posted on March 6, 2012 at 6:47am

    Yes, I support privet business to decline to refuse service to any individual. But I have a bone to pick. What I feel is that no one should turn away business.

    Report Post »  
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