Faith

Sold! Catholic Church to Purchase Crystal Cathedral for $57.5 Million

Catholic Church to Buy Crystal Cathedral for $57.5 Million

This Oct. 27, 2011 photo shows the Crystal Cathedral in Garden Grove, Calif. (AP Photo/Jae C. Hong)

SANTA ANA, California (The Blaze/AP) — In July, we first reported about the the Roman Catholic Diocese of Orange’s bid to purchase the Crystal Cathedral. Now, it’s official. The iconic, gleaming glass building has been approved for sale to the Diocese of Orange in an effort to get the house of worship back on solid financial footing after declaring bankruptcy last year.

The move was approved Thursday by U.S. Bankruptcy Court Judge Robert N. Kwan after a bidding war between the diocese and Orange County’s Chapman University for the sprawling 40-acre property – and was opposed by many Crystal Cathedral congregants who fear it will be the end of their church

The diocese will pay $57.5 million to use the building in Garden Grove made of 10,000 panes of glass as a long-sought countywide cathedral.

“It will become a true center for our Catholic community in Orange County,” Bishop Tod D. Brown told reporters after Thursday’s packed hearing in federal bankruptcy court.

The decision will force congregants of the Crystal Cathedral to find a new home after three years – possibly in a Catholic church up the street that the diocese will vacate.

But some fear the ministry won’t survive the move as congregants – and possibly “Hour of Power” television viewers – feel dismayed after pouring their hearts, and pocketbooks, into the elaborate campus.

Catholic Church to Buy Crystal Cathedral for $57.5 Million

Rather, churchgoers threw their support behind a proposal by Chapman University for the site to expand its health sciences offerings and possibly start a medical school – a plan that would have paid up to $59 million for the site allowed the church to continue to use the famous building designed by renowned architect Philip Johnson.

For the last two weeks, the board of directors of Crystal Cathedral Ministries had supported Chapman as the preferred buyer. But the board did an about-face Wednesday and voted to back the diocese instead to preserve the church as a religious institution, citing church bylaws and a wish to respect the spirit of donors who footed the bill for the building.

“I’m really pleased to know that this campus is likely for at least decades, if not centuries, to be kept as a sacred place of worship,” Carol Milner, daughter of church founder Rev. Robert H. Schuller, said after the hearing.

The decision riled several dozen congregants who attended the six-hour hearing in bankruptcy court and pleaded with the judge to let them remain in their beloved church.

“It shouldn’t be about the money. It should be about what’s inside your heart,” Jim Kirkland Jr. told the court, breaking into tears. “A lot of these beautiful people have put in their hearts, put in their time.”

Schuller started the Crystal Cathedral as a drive-in church in the 1950s under the auspices of the Reformed Church in America. Decades later, the Southern California ministry evolved into an international televangelism empire and erected its now-famous building.

In 2008, the church’s revenues plummeted amid a decline in donations and ticket sales for holiday pageants due to the recession, church officials said. But some experts say the church failed to attract younger members while alienating older churchgoers with an ill-fated attempt to turn the church over to Schuller’s son, ending in a bitter and public family feud.

The church laid off employees and cut salaries, but its debts surpassed $43 million, prompting the Crystal Cathedral to declare bankruptcy last year.

Much of Thursday‘s hearing was devoted to analyzing the church’s sudden change of heart about a buyer, with Kwan urging the church to justify its reason for choosing a lower bid and one that went against the wishes and recommendations of many of its congregants.

Some congregants at the Crystal Cathedral said losing their church would be a sign of failure of the ministry‘s leadership and they wouldn’t follow its leaders to a new site.

Churchgoers also questioned whether the ministry that shares the name of the building it inhabits would be financially viable elsewhere, noting that viewers of the “Hour of Power” are equally attached to the glass-spired church and are the source of 70 percent of the church’s revenue.

But those who supported the board’s decision said the congregation will continue to thrive through the good-hearted people who worship together and band together to help those in need.

“The Crystal Cathedral will go on,” said Susan Dawson, whose husband was recently appointed to the church’s board. “They will love wherever we go because we are a community, we are a community of loving believers.”

Comments (398)

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  • Fitz Gerald
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:18am

    Wow, just shows how superficial “Christianity” has become in the land of milk and honey. It’s no wonder we are in such moral decline in this country. Who cares about the building, Jesus Christ should be your only concern as a Christian. If the pastor is truly a follower of Christ, then why would the “congregants” not go with him? This whole thing stinks on ice and is likely a good gauge for what “Christianity” has become to the masses who call themselves Christian.

    Report Post » Fitz Gerald  
    • MR_ANDERSON
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:01am

      God does not live in the houses of worship, God is greater than any house of worship.

      Report Post »  
    • Tiredof2partyropeadope
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:43am

      MissionaryJames…

      Matthew 7
      Judging Others
      1 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

      Report Post »  
    • Falsegods
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:26am

      57million$ could feed 57million poor people. Who is your God?

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:19pm

      @DOPE – reiterating historical facts of these ungodly organizations isn’t judging. It’s the practice of calling them out for who they are, anit-Christ.

      poverty.sucks  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:48pm

      Why is it so, citizen of the United States Of America who’s a cult member of the Roman Catholic Society be denied marriage between a man and a woman? Why do Catholics subject themselves to a foreign power?

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:16pm

      Fitz I sort of agree but the reason is present best by James there. I do not know how it managed, it should have never been in debt to be a true Christian endeavor. It is a body of New Age and Power of Postivie THinking and that is not Jesus

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:21pm

      Also it is strange the Catholic Church still owes billions in its sex debt how can they afford this? The Pope wants us to keep letting in Illegal Alien Catholics to help his debt. The Catholic Church is what we got away from when we built America and here it is again along with those Russian Jews, Protestant Christians are being surrounded.
      Time to lose some of these occupants, IKE deported milllions of Mexicans in the 50s and the time has come to do it again

      Report Post »  
    • Joker50
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:30pm

      MissionaryJames: Jesus would not speak this way to anyone for any reason. You , good sir are not a true Christian. You are nothing more than a fanatic as the Islamists are. Your type of “Christianity” breed hate and deceit.

      Report Post »  
    • ShotgunB
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:41pm

      As usuall poverty sucks & others pull out the “Whore of Babylon” every time a Catholic is mentioned, even though they know next to knothing about scripture. Pull a passage here and another there and make your “straw man” arguements against the Catholic Church- who gave us the Bible! If you can’t win them with love then an attack should suffice, right? Try your anti-Catholic banter over at biblechristiansociety.com and we’ll see how your arguement stands up to the Bible. Check out the debates there and then make up your mind. Don’t listen to me or any other fool who can post anything on line; check it out for yourselves. Always strive for the Truth and He will lead you there! PAX

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:58pm

      TIREDOF… now you can go put that in context and with the balance of the Bible and I will talk to you. We do and must judge our brothern and that is BIBLE!

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:03pm

      JOKER has a good name, James has got it right. You SIR show a lot of hate JOKER. You are a PC kind of guy and have no value

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:16pm

      What about that Catholic who made a special place just for Catholics in FLA, yeah the pizza guy of Dominos. Yet how many collect of the state welfare that are Catholics, multiple millions. Thats where that money should go and thats BIBLE again!

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:35pm

      GOD said, what house would you build me, I go to prepare a house for you

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:37pm

      God said what house would you build me

      He is building a house for us

      Report Post »  
    • skurk
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:37pm

      The building is in it’s rightful hands – You want it in the hands of Chapman university?

      Nuff said – go back to MSNBC.

      Report Post » skurk  
    • freddyjoe
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 4:59pm

      I am convert to Catholism, From your so called Prostatant chruchs. What you people do to one Church, Catholic or LDS, or Asmebly of God, or Baptise and Jewish, I could go on and on. Your comments are to and about GOD. Before you tell your brother to remove the spinter in his eye, remove the log from yours. (praphising here, and I am not the best speller eighter).
      Remember when you read your bible, Catholic Chruch made sure you had a Bible. That is the main thing the Catholic Chruch did for you. And yes I am saved by the Savior, and beleive a Christian is known by his Good Works, and maybe we should also say by his Good Words also.

      Report Post »  
    • Jinglebob
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 5:22pm

      Our LORD and savior Jesus Christ would be sooooooooooooo proud of them. Will it be stocked with idols?

      Report Post » Jinglebob  
    • AmazingGrace8
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:00pm

      @freddyjoe

      Saul converted…….Acts 9:1-16
      2Peter 3:15……Peter’s words approx. 30 years after Saul (Paul) conversion and Age of Grace
      2Peter 3:16……legalism to grace, Peter still had trouble about gentiles

      Report Post »  
    • Eliasim
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:02pm

      I’m sure Jesus will have his say about Catholics.

      Report Post »  
    • pargeterspress
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 9:53pm

      You make a good point, church members will generally follow a beloved pastor. I am a Catholic and I grew up watching the Hour of Power. Although I recognize it as “the power of positive thinking”, I also recognize it as the same positive message of Christ. God made creation and he was pleased. We should strive to be like the Apostle Paul and focus on eyes more often on things that are lovely and pleasing. When I do so I feel more gratitude for my life, however humble it may be. Being poor is not a disease. Some of the finest people I know are poor…I do feel for the church members who have been a part of building that building, it must be a sad day for them.

      Report Post »  
    • paintbrushbright
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:29pm

      Hey the Muslims could have bought it and turned it into a Mosque! I am glad it was kept Christian and I am sure the Catholics will send a lot of goodness from its doors.

      Report Post » paintbrushbright  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:47pm

      Oh NO You did not go there freddyjoe Posted on November 19, 2011 at 4:59pm

      The BOOK your pagan organization created is of their own manifestations. It is not the original and yours came long after CHRISTIANS came to be which was during the TIME OF JESUS ON EARTH. They lived and maintained the Jesus version first hand which was not printed except in letters of the original apostles who walked with Jesus.

      Protestant Christians translated the King James Version 16??. Then America was built on the GENEVA Bible, which is translated very well without injections of fantasy. Now least we forget the first text from God came to the Hebrew, Gods chosen. Yes, they rebelled and he scattered them to four corners and are still paying for their rebellion. That is why the Gentiles were given the honor next. Soon the Hebrews of God will see their fault and we will all join together. Mary wont be on the throne though so don’t be disappointed.

      Thanks to Wycliffe, Martin Luther, Calvin (all priest) and a few others that saw the errors your catechism made, the correct translations came outside of your organization. Then we ended your murderous rule of the INQUISITION. Thank God, for Protestant Christians or America would not exist as a free Republic. (It would be called SPAIN) I also give thanks to Queen Elizabeth who saw the light, which helped us on our way.

      Your Universal church which is its correct name came from Constantine and only because his wife had become a Christian among

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:08pm

      Oh NO You did not go there freddyjoe Posted on November 19, 2011 CONTINUED

      YOUR church collected ALL of the PAGAN GODS and their statues and made the Universal church with just a touch of Jesus to suit his wife. If he had not included them they would have killed the him and sacked Rome you idiot. Yes, the statue used for Mary was the one used for the goddess of the Sun? I think that was the one.

      Learn before you burn dude

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:21pm

      @ShotGunB – Enough with your fluff, be specific, which line of scripture has you confused?

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 12:01am

      Testimony from Roman Catholic Priest, priesthood obtained without studying Holy Bible scripture.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • BenFranklin66
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 7:14am

      Well said, Christians can’t afford that much windex to clean that many windows anyway. Let the Catholics put in one of their multi-million dollar gold altars and I think that will be a fitting end to the pop psychology California dreaming drive-in. Anyway, superficial Christianity has its current pop psychology preacher, “Happy time Osteen”. Jesus said make lemonade out of lemons, oh maybe he didn’t, but it sure sounds good.

      Report Post » BenFranklin66  
    • Citizen
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 10:36am

      many of you want to argue points here on earth and its foolish, do you know Christ himself debated with pharisees and did not convince them – you think your gonna do better ? ha at the foolishness.

      Christ is coming little ones and its going to be a blood bath. good luck.

      Report Post »  
    • DDD
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 2:27pm

      To the Roman Catholics, Mr_Anderson, God IS in the house! They believe is physically there in the form of the Sacred Host kept behind the altar. God can and is everywhere.

      Report Post »  
    • Darren
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 3:59am

      Fitz Gerald;

      “Jesus Christ should be your only concern as a Christian.”

      And Catholics agree 100%, sir. The purpose of buildings is to congregate the masses to learn the word of God and partake of His grace. When you create a church of over a billion members nd do not use elegant buildings, then you may preach about the declaine of the Catholic Church for purchasing a big building.

      Report Post » Darren  
    • Darren
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:03am

      Falsegods;

      “57million$ could feed 57million poor people. Who is your God?”

      What an utterly stupid comment.

      Report Post » Darren  
    • Darren
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:04am

      Poverty Sucks;

      “Why do Catholics subject themselves to a foreign power?”

      You mean, like, God?

      Report Post » Darren  
    • Darren
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:12am

      Noroom…

      “The BOOK your pagan organization created is of their own manifestations. It is not the original and yours came long after CHRISTIANS came to be which was during the TIME OF JESUS ON EARTH. They lived and maintained the Jesus version first hand which was not printed except in letters of the original apostles who walked with Jesus.

      Protestant Christians translated the King James Version 16??. Then America was built on the GENEVA Bible, which is translated very well without injections of fantasy.”

      My faith uses the King James Version ofthe Bible and it is no doubt the single biggest theological source of influence in the English-speaking world. But there are errors. A significant ones are found in the Old Testament which the KJV relies upon the Masoretic texts to translate into English. You’ll find passages significantly different than from the Septuagint and Dead Sea Scrolls scriptures. This is because those who wrote and preserved the Masoretic texts were interested in strict monotheism and thus attempted to eradicate the mentioning of any more than one deity. But when you restore the passages as they should it’s clear that ancient Judaism did indeed believe in more than one deity.

      The Catholics use the Vulgate translations of the bible which too rely upon the Masoretic texts for the Old Testament.

      Report Post » Darren  
    • Darren
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:14am

      Noroom…

      “The Catholic Church is what we got away from when we built America and here it is again along with those Russian Jews, Protestant Christians are being surrounded.”

      What the heck is that all about?

      Report Post » Darren  
    • johnlee
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 5:18am

      That’s not much money, I think I’ll buy it.

      Report Post »  
    • javeca
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 11:03am

      “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church, but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
      — Bishop Fulton J. Sheen, Servant of God (1895 – 1979)

      Report Post »  
    • Obama Snake Oil Co
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 1:21pm

      You have to love it to read the anticatholic rhetoric posted here. Well, I am your worst nightmare, a catholic without the pope. Yep, Ukrainian Orthodox. So now where do you stand? We are not Roman Catholic, in fact we broke away when the church was heading there along with controls. So you thought and placed all of us under that catholic umbrella. So with all the interpretations that you have made with the bible, its sent you in more directions than a IED. I will say one thing about catholics, they are consistant on what they believe. Orthodox are not allowed to interpret the bible and must depend on those that are educated in the bible, both versions. This is why we don’t have an out for gay behaviour, marriage, abortion, birth control and sex before marriage. Catholics have done more positive things for this country to help the needy and the poor than any church in this nation and world. It is a long list of groups to name here and if you don’t know how to google, your problem. To make an encompassing remark that there are more catholics on welfare….is dishonest and untrue. God will judge you on how you judged others and their are no stones to throw in heaven…….

      Report Post » Obama Snake Oil Co  
    • MUSE_FENDERTAMA
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 2:22pm

      @ poverty sucks,
      If you know so much, why don’t you back up what you say with some facts (and dare I say, reason?).
      I don’t understand how the catholic church could be anti-christ if they were the only christian church in existence for the first 1400 years of christianity. In fact protestantism is a new development in christianity, so don’t be so sure that your ideology is the correct one. You need to explore all the facts and make an informed decision. After that, you look wise by backing up your assertions with reason and facts. This will gain you more followers than just saying something as mindless as your last comment.

      Report Post » MUSE_FENDERTAMA  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 3:02pm

      To Poverty

      I am an American whose religion is Catholic. I do not owe any allegience to the country of Vatican City. My grandfather immigrated from Ireland. He fought in the Spanish American War and WWI. My father fought in WWII, Korea and Viet Nam. My uncle was shot down with his remains not retievalbe. I was in Viet Nam. My son is on his 3rd deployment. There should be no question that my family are anything but loyal Americans.

      Just when I think we can unite to combat the aggression of Islam, a person like you takes a shot at Catholics. It is beyond me why you hate so much. The Blaze removed an earlier comment along these same lines but it contained language suited to the barracks and not a blog. I guess I shouldn’t get too worked up.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
    • Ohio4Tea
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 8:39pm

      That “do not judge” passage is taken out of context so much….

      Jesus encouraged His disciples to JUDGE:
      “Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment.” (John 7:24)

      We need to judge – not in a condescending way – but Jesus’ command to “not judge” didn’t mean, “DONT THINK” as many people interpret it. Jesus’ judged the pharisees constantly – and he let them know exactly where they were wrong – Christians need to do the same – and stand up against the sins of our day!

      Report Post » Ohio4Tea  
    • Potus
      Posted on November 22, 2011 at 12:42am

      I think theres a larger picture here than hating on us catholics because of doctrinal diffrences. God has instructed his children (I’m paraphrasing) to own no man nothing but our love. He also teaches us to be good stewards. The nice looking church would still be in the hands of the original owners if had not taken on so much debt as well as have a vey public disagreement on who was going to take over the ministry. You never intentionally pass negative down an orginization because it becomes a posion that destroys. I don’t believe that carrying debt is sinful as long as you can responsibly manage it; however, God knows the frailty of human beings and are proclivities to act irresponsibly. I don’t believe that there will be any catholics, protestants , or any other denomination in heaven. I believe heaven belongs to those who accepted Christ as their Lord and believed as well as live out the two commandments he left which ( I paraphrasing again) Love the Lord your God with your whole heart and Love your neigbor. Many of you have made a lot of disrespectful remarks about Catholic‘s and to some degree maybe it’s deserved. I was raised in a protestant church and I can tell you your CRAP smells too! The protestant churches have higher divorce rates by national averages as well as greater amount of unmarried sexual activities amongst the youth. No orginization is perfect. Thank God that he sent Jesus to redeem mankind from self destructive sin in both Catholic and Protestant.

      Report Post »  
  • Git-R-Done
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:06am

    I don‘t see the problem as long as taxpayer money wasn’t used.

    Mark 14:3-7

    Report Post »  
    • Big Book Harry
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:34am

      “it’s not about the money,it’s whats in your heart” It is written one should do with one hand so that the other does not know what it is doing. Therefore I only reveal this to set the example — I am an auto mechanic who was recently laid off with substancial accreditation under my belt. Another repair shop that has an employee who must take tomorrow off due to the fact his wife has cancer asked me if I would like to make money and fill in for him, to which I agreed. The thought came to mind(and will happen) that what ever work I do to just put it under his name so that it will be the same as if he were there. It is a blessing to be given the opportunity to serve. 1 Peter 4:10

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:38pm

      Tax exempt and it should not be

      Report Post »  
  • Aikes
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:31am

    Jesus wasn’t rich, yet religious leaders today con people out of their money as a regular part of church business. None of those people talk to any gods or spirits… yet people send them money thinking they are something better than human. I am sure many will be shocked at the realization that they are no different than any other con artists through history. Many will still support their so-called leaders. Who cares. “Shocker”.

    Instead of putting your wealth to good use for your family you gave it to someone claiming to be a leader so that he never had to do anything but act out in a religious play. If you don’t want to work and you want to make a lot of money just take drama classes and start a church.

    Report Post » Aikes  
    • Bobgood1
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:57pm

      I have ben watching “The Hour Of Power ” since 1981. i have found it inspiring and uplifting. I visited the campus a few years ago for a conference. I was impresed by the number of members activally engaged in committees. It is sad that such good people have this happen.

      Report Post » Bobgood1  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:13pm

      PAUL said that he could have more than anyone but stayed poor to give the followers no reason to fall on account of richies. A true man of God has no more than he needs to live as did the Apostles.

      The word CHURCH has been added and is not or never was a teaching of Jesus. They met in houses and barns. If we gather money it should be for the BODY of Jesus not a damn building.

      Stop tax exemption and see how many millionaire preachers go back to digging ditches. Too many have seen the money and went to a psuedo school to make there living off someone else, ITS WRONG!

      Report Post »  
    • Lotus4115
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 5:23pm

      Jesus wasn‘t rich because Jesus wasn’t real.

      Report Post » Lotus4115  
  • pear2284
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:30am

    I love reading the huffpost, especially the religious articles. To see all the christian bashing on the comment section really says something about the “tolerant” left. Then I come here and see the catholic bashing is pretty bad.

    I don’t see the problem here, of course i am catholic, but it was a place of worship and it will remain a place of worship. It was expensive but the CC was able to buy it, good for them. They felt it would help the catholic community in OC and they might be right. Could the Catholic church have spent all this money on feeding the hungry, sure. could they sell everything they own and feed millions, yea they could. but then all the money and wealth that lets them do charitable works is gone forever. Any organization is going to have to concentrate some of its resources to self preservation. Don’t be made that the CC has lots of resources, it has over a billion members. A dollar a week from just the American Catholics is over 60 million a week.

    Big organizations have big infrastructure. You don‘t like it don’t donate money to them, join another church. Fact is the Catholic church does a lot of good in this world.

    Report Post »  
    • BETTY CROCKER
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 9:41am

      @Pear2284

      You really hit the nail right on the head. I also am a Catholic and get very saddened by the complete disrespect some of the people have that comment on these stories. I guess they live by the “Do unto to others and then split” scripture verse.

      Report Post »  
    • TheGreyPiper
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:15am

      Not Catholic bu Orthodox here, I consider us as much the same team, and always cringe when I see any story come up here mentioning the Roman Catholic Church even tangentially, because I know they devolve immediately into the most disgusting display of bigoted and ignorant Catholic – bashing ever. I always take pains to defend Rome; I‘m sure the only reason Orthodoxy doesn’t get the same treatment here is that the trailer trash are so stupid they’ve never even heard of it.

      (Yeah, trolling now.)

      Report Post » TheGreyPiper  
    • e7705
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:27am

      Missionary James, You would do well to spend some time reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church. You educated yourself using what OTHERS have said about the Church. Go to the source and read, and learn.

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:28pm

      Roman Catholic Church is disrespectful to our God, creator of all and you direct attention to the Catechism? Why are you not so literate in the Holy Bible? If you truly expect Grace from God, the only way is through Jesus Christ. Otherwise to Hell With You! Bye Bye

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • BETTY CROCKER
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:02pm

      Boy that was fast poverty.sucks proved my point.

      @thegreypiper

      We are bothers and sisters indeed with much respect for each other. We always have your back!

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:28pm

      The Hell it does PEAR2284. I remember the Dark Ages, the Inquistion that murdered so many CHRISTIANs. Many of OUR books and history not burned by the Roman Catholics are hid on the Vatican so people will not get the whole truth.

      BTW, Mary is DEAD and is not the mother of GOD. Muslims have a lot of our history as well, the Jesus Christian existed since Jesus and the rest of you are fakes

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:34pm

      Well put PEAR, “big orginizations” and that is all it is and that from your own mouth!

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:46pm

      Betty your reading from book your people made up to control you, You do not have the original text. Latin services is another way they kept the peasants stupid

      Report Post »  
    • SavedByTheLamb
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:13pm

      NoRoomForSocialismHere, you need to do your homework about the Catholic Church. The paranoid and mis-informed Catholic bashing that follows in the commentary about any article about the Church is unfortunately very predictable. The Church is not the bogey man, nor is it a cult. It is the Body of Christ, with Christ as it’s head. Do your homework and you will be surprised at how much of the nonsense non-Catholics are so uncharitably taught about Catholicism is wrong. Catholicism is the Church Jesus left on earth, with Peter and the Apostles as its leaders, before the New Testament was written down. Some of the Tradition was written down, some of it wasn’t – just like the history of any family.

      The comment about Mary being “DEAD” is particularly egregious. Mary was chosen by God to play a very significant role in Salvation History. Mary was the first human to adore Jesus. She is the best example of how we can be successful in accepting God’s will in our lives. Mary is very much ALIVE in heaven, having been among the first Redeemed by Christ. Christ gave Mary to us as he died on the Cross. Mary points the way to Christ.

      I pray that like St. Paul, God may open the eyes of those who speak against the Church – the Church which is full of saints and sinners, but which is always the mystical Body of Christ.

      Christians, all of this disharmony takes away from what we need to be focused on – giving Glory to God and saving as many souls as we can.

      Report Post »  
    • BETTY CROCKER
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:11pm

      @noroomforsocialism

      I guess I’m just a simple uneducated Catholic (even through college) that still believes in the golden rule. Cutting, pasting, to make it all fit my needs and elevate myself just ain‘t where I’m at.

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 5:54pm

      Mary, mother of at least 6 kids, isn’t anymore significant than Noah. Through Noah, we all came to be. No where in Gods words there isn’t anyone else to idolize or pray to.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • mdvd
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 11:29pm

      The priests in the Catholic Church have 3 vows: Vow of POVERTY, chastity, and obedience. These priests do not take any of our contributions. The preach but do not get paid. They mind the sheep without getting paid. All their services are free for us. Our Sunday collections go to the poor, and to other good causes.
      For example, Saint Padre Pio of Italy built a hospital for the poor. We have many non-profit hospitals for the poor all over the world. Many saints gave up their wealth for the Church. These are Catholic preachers… They don’t get paid. So let’s not make disparaging comments to the Church, the head of which is Jesus Christ Himself. He was poor right? And so was his apostles. Now his living apostles are the priests. In order for them to become followers of Christ (priests), they have to take the VOW OF POVERTY.

      Report Post »  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 9:00am

      As a Catholic, I am really happy that there was a Reformation. I suspect POVERTY SUCKS would be a really good Inqusitor. He has so much hatred in him. He misses the true message of Jesus. At some point in time he will stand tall before God and justify his life, it would be interesting to see.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 9:07am

      @Betty

      It is no use trying to reason with the anti-Catholics. They hate us. In their eyes, we are a cult just like Islam. In their heart of hearts, they believe that we should not exist. Their hate is part of their religious beliefs. They come from the “fire and brimstone” version of Christianity. Love is not part of their belief system since it is predicated on hate.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:30pm

      2 NOROOM

      You remember the Inquisiton? What was it like? What do you remember? I have never met anyone who remembers the Inqusition.

      Do you remember Oliver Cromwell? He’s the one that invaded Ireland, killed thousands and outlawed the Catholic Church. Yes, I bet he is on your list.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
  • Chr1st14n
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:22am

    its several miles from me and my parents used to go there when i was a toddler lol

    Report Post » Chr1st14n  
  • qzak491
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:18am

    If they can spend this kind of money on a building why can’t they fund lawyers to go after what the Freedom From Religion Foundation is doing. Do you think they

    Report Post »  
    • qzak491
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:22am

      have their priorities a little wrong. If they don’t stop the FFRF they may not need the building.

      SORRY BOUT THAT THIS THING SOMETIMES HAS A MIND OF IT’S OWN.

      Report Post »  
    • NoRoomForSocialismHere
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:43pm

      LAWYERS COST money and the congregation GIVES them money, makes it a little eaiser to understand

      Report Post »  
  • Smokey_Bojangles
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:02am

    The Vatican Bank has DEEP Pockets.I Always thought his program was an Infomercial for his books.

    Report Post » Smokey_Bojangles  
    • Stoopy Afeist
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:18am

      You‘re looking at a worldwide cult that panhandles at a global scale and saying you’re surprised?

      Report Post »  
    • rabidtarg
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:35am

      Haha, it wasn’t the Vatican bank… some people get goofy views of how the Catholic church funds things. It was the diocese that purchased it with independent funds. And no, I’m not Catholic, but I find it silly that so many people are mad at the Catholic church for buying a building that couldn’t be paid for… what did you want, another government bail-out to keep it going?

      Report Post »  
    • mdvd
      Posted on November 20, 2011 at 11:34pm

      When Catholic priests write and sell their books, the money goes to the Church, not in their pockets, unlike some preachers. The Vatican has deep pockets the source of which are contributions.

      Report Post »  
  • AmeriCat
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:40am

    We are heartsick!

    The church and grounds would have been perfect for Chapman University…
    A truly unique opportunity for young burgeoning minds.

    Instead…just another piece of valuable real estate for the Catholic Church.
    Nothing unique or special for the Catholic Church …just the value.

    Sad to say, but sounds like money got in the way….
    The congregation, the community….all wanted it to go to Chapman University.

    Report Post »  
    • kwolfburg
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:36am

      It was not the money, Chapman actually bid several million more. It was the usage, the church would only have been able to used on Sunday and the board did not wish that. My opinion, it was a waste to build anyway. a symbol of mans greed and self-importance. The roof of Gods church is the sky above, his floors the very ground we walk on. Man can never build anything more beautiful than that, and we should not try.

      Report Post »  
  • Cant steal my joy
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:33am

    I love the Lord and came from a Catholic upbringing which raised many questions with the church that consequently lead to my being saved and then seeking a church home that truely worshiped the God of the Bible unmuddied with the man-made rules of religion. I now belong to and tithe to a non-denominational church that spends a large portion of it’s budget on missions (both in and outside of the US). We serve the poor with a food pantry and a free second hand clothing store. We seem to barely make ends meet but we do. We have no debt. I Think it’s odd for a religious institution to have the enormous amount of money, that was used to purchase that building, on hand. Seems like a waste of His resources.

    Report Post »  
  • Californiasodbuster
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:32am

    My butt still hurts after forty years, mom, why are you putting five dollars in the basket?
    And why are you mixing powdered milk in the real milk, these fishsticks and shrimp on friday taste like sh[t, use more hamburger helper.
    Can i ever survive the guilt?

    Report Post »  
  • jim
    Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:11am

    Much as I love Chapman… a medical school? It’s a breathtaking structure that should remain a church.

    Report Post » jim  
    • JESUS-IS-LORD
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:19am

      This is not of the Lord God Almighty. That’s for sure.

      Report Post » JESUS-IS-LORD  
    • jim
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:34pm

      Romans 3:10: “There is no one righteous, not even one.”

      Report Post » jim  
    • jim
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:38pm

      Romans 3:10: “There is no one righteous, not even one.”

      Report Post » jim  
    • jim
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:43pm

      Matthew 21:12-13 (Jesus at the Temple): “12 – Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves. 13 – “It is written,” he said to them, “‘My house will be called a house of prayer,’ but you are making it ‘a den of robbers.’”

      Report Post » jim  
  • dontbotherme
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:56pm

    I am Catholic. My Church does more to help underprivileged peoples throughout the world than any other. The money spent on this could have been used for so much more of God’s work. This is embarrassing.

    Report Post »  
    • Mom4Freedom
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:27pm

      I agree, and I’m catholic. Waaaaaay to ostentatious! I never liked that building. Shame on the bishop & the diocese for buying that place. I think the first church building was the MANGER which Jesus was born in. That’s good enough for me, and should be good enough for anyone.

      Every catholic church seems to be either building a new church or school, or renovating the old ones, and I’m back to my disgust over endless collections for the building fund, feeling the exact same way I felt when i was very young in the ‘60’s. We should use the structures we have and send the money to be enhancing the multitudes of excellent ministries that Catholic Charities has here and around the world.

      Report Post » Mom4Freedom  
    • SavedByTheLamb
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:21pm

      I am Catholic also. Please let me charitably remind my fellow Catholics that piling on and focusing scandal on the Church is in fact sinful. I am not talking about the criminal actions of a few sick people in the sex scandal. I am talking about making uninformed judgements and statements about the decisions of the Diocese in this specific case. We do not know what went in to the decision to purchase that building, nor do we know the hearts of those leaders. We need to pray for the Pope and our leaders that they may in fact lead with wisdom and discernment, as did Peter and the Apostles. Blessed John Paul, pray for us.

      Report Post »  
  • Daveed
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:55pm

    Wow, one Orange County Catholic Church can whip out over $57 million? It was not too long ago Catholic Churches were filing Chap 11′s. I don’t know. Billionaire Churches seem like an overgrown Gov’t unto themselves.

    Report Post »  
    • Fitz Gerald
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:21am

      The catholic church sure is.

      Report Post » Fitz Gerald  
    • bleuze
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 2:24am

      I’m a Catholic, but I do not practice. I gave up a bout 10 years ago since every Sunday they just kept asking for more money, once a monthe the would have sisters from Mexico and would have a special collection for Mexico (I guess those people eating dog food, etc. were not deserving of money from the church), and a real turn off was when the priest were driving top automobiles better then me (I guess that we suckers did not miss the money!)

      Report Post » bleuze  
    • Falsegods
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 10:41am

      Organized religion is organized crime.

      Report Post »  
    • SavedByTheLamb
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 6:25pm

      Bleuze, you gave up the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist because you didn’t like the homilies or the appearance of hypocrisy? We are all sinners and saints. The one thing that never changes in the Church is Christ!

      Please come home!

      Report Post »  
  • TRONINTHEMORNING
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:54pm

    What a colossel waste of funds. And can someone tell me why someone sits in a closet and confesses things to another man rather than directly to God thru Jesus Christ? I don‘t thing it’s in the true cannon of scripture.

    Report Post »  
    • garyM
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:39am

      I don’t why anyone would either, no man can forgive sins or wipe them out so the person can be united with God, only Jesus! Many protestants think the same thing by walking an Isle or shaking the preacher’s hand or water baptism but the Bible clearly says we must be born from above of His Spirit and then follow Him in water Baptism as a testimony we have been born from above!

      Report Post »  
    • gdbhusker
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:48am

      you confess with your mouth and are held accountable by your brethren, and your pastors. Only God can forgive…the priests always say that they do NOT forgive, or even attempt to act like they are forgiving sin…..they simply recite what the bible says when you confess with your mouth….. I am a born and raised southern Baptists who married a catholic…and I have been attending mass for 14 years… I have not converted but there are a lot of the teachings I like in the catholic church… but there are still unanswered questions….. and FYI…. they NEVER beg you for money or tell you that you need to dig deeper and all that.. no priest drives a jag and livs in a mansion… they live very meager lives of service…. peace

      Report Post » gdbhusker  
    • horsefeathers99
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:59am

      Confessionals are a thing of the past in most Catholic churches.
      We ask God for forgiveness, some may feel the need go to a priest to pray together for forgiveness from God.
      It is easier to purchase a church, a place to share God’s love, then the alternative.
      People need to be less judgemental of other Christians.
      Our relationship is with God and the more we hold Jesus in our hearts, the less chance for evil to take over.

      Report Post »  
    • Dudley Do-Right
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:31am

      John 20:19-23

      “on the evening of that first day of the week, even though the disciples had locked the doors of the place where they were for fear of the Jews…Jesus came and stood before them ‘Peace be with you,’ he said. When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. At the sight of the Lord, the Disciples rejoiced. ‘Peace be with you,’ he said again. ‘As the Father has sent me so I send you.’… He breathed on them and said, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit. Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins you retain are retained.”

      Report Post »  
  • Bakko Bomma
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:47pm

    The poor lil ol Catholic church that doesn’t have any money?

    Report Post » Bakko Bomma  
    • RepubliCorp
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:17am

      Who made that claim? Or do you just make it up as you go?

      Report Post » RepubliCorp  
    • gdbhusker
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:57am

      you are not a very good person….just saying.. maybe you should check yourself…before you wreck someone else!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Report Post » gdbhusker  
    • Bakko Bomma
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 5:34pm

      Really GD? Ok I’ll convert become a Priest and molest some kids like your heroes in the church.

      Report Post » Bakko Bomma  
    • Bakko Bomma
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 7:18pm

      On second thought I’ll become a Hitler Youth like the Pope. Then maybe I can be a good person.

      Report Post » Bakko Bomma  
  • poverty.sucks
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:31pm

    What a perfect Icon for the Catholics, no church will save you. You can only be saved be developing a relationship with Jesus Christ, that can happen without ever having to step into a church.

    http://www.PeaceWithGod.Jesus.Net

    Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • angelcat
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:02am

      The Church doesn’t claim to save you. It is faith in God and works that do that. How about actually reading a Catholic catechism to get the truth of what we believe before you spout off?

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:37am

      Here’s your facts stupid, The Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctorines of demons, by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who beleive and know the truth. For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with gratitude; for it is sanctified by means of the word of God and prayer.

      Roman Catholic Doctorine developed considerably during the medieval period and beyond, purgatory 593, prayer to Mary, saints and angels in 600, kissing the pope’s foot in 709, canonization of dead saints in 995, celibacy of the priesthood in 1079, the rosary in 1090, transsubstantiation and confessing sins to priest in 1215, indulgences 1343 – Pope Clement IV, the seven sacraments in 1439, infallibility of the pope in 1870

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:51am

      God word never waivers, men in the Roman Catholic church have changed their rules to what they beleive is salvation. The Roman Catholic view of Salvation promotes an insufficient Christ, an inadequate Cross, a losable salvation, and a salvation that fails to protect you from God’s wrath against sin since is based on your good works.

      I encourage you to read the Gospel of John and Ephesians, Galatians, Romans. However, you just may be too stupid to read.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:05am

      A Catholic plea for a Christian to read a catechism is as ridiculous as a Mormon asking a Christian to read the Book of Mormons. All that does is point out false teaching of Gods words.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • Stoopy Afeist
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 1:35am

      “I encourage you to read the Gospel of John and Ephesians, Galatians, Romans. However, you just may be too stupid to read.”

      Reading that set of self-contradicting and nihilistic nonsense makes you stupider than reading Genesis, Exodus and Revelation at once. Period.

      Report Post »  
    • Rational Man
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:07am

      Easy boys! I agree with your posts, except for the name calling and harshness.
      “Speak the truth in love.”

      Report Post » Rational Man  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 7:18am

      Eh Stupy – the Fat Cat needs to READ the Gospels in order to comprehend FAITH saves, not works dictated by men.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 8:33am

      Irrational man – anyone who’s ignorance to the father our God creator deserves to be called everything but good when denying Faith in Christ is the way to salvation.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • DeepThought42
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 3:18pm

      “For you have the poor always with you; but me you have not always.” Matthew 26:11. Why is God not worthy of such a structure? I see a lot of discussion about God but none about worship. Is worshipping God so trivial to you? A monument to God is at least as important to faith as the new Freedom Tower and the St Louis Arch are to remembering our heroes. Poverty is often a state of mind and there is little true poverty in America. Faith is a free gift but few are willing to accept it. I would accept worshipping God in a nice building that was built to honor Him. I’m glad to see some good news from the Catholic Church. They seem to be the only church with courage to face social issues and I hope they will grow in their community with the purchase of this beautiful place of worship.

      Report Post »  
    • extremist
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 2:02pm

      “Men who forbid marriage”

      I just checked and marriage is not listed in the Catholic sacraments. Now, Holy Matrimony is mentioned. Perhaps that is where you’ve gotten side tracked.

      BTW, you are using 1 Timothy 4: 1-4 to construe something negative about your brethren. I just checked with the Catholic Douay Rheims version of 1 Tim. and being older than the Protestants, they claim:

      [3] Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats: He speaks of the Gnostics, the Marcionites, the Eneratites, the Manicheans, and other ancient heretics, who absolutely condemned marriage, and the use of all kind of meat; because they pretended that all flesh was from an evil principle. Whereas the church of God, so far from condemning marriage, holds it a holy sacrament; and forbids it to none but such as by vow have chosen the better part: and prohibits not the use of any meats whatsoever in proper times and seasons; though she does not judge all kind of diet proper for days of fasting and penance.

      Take care, PBWY

      Report Post »  
  • ThankBabyJesus
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:31pm

    Yup, that’s what happens when you leave God out of your teachings.

    Report Post » ThankBabyJesus  
  • staunch conservative
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:28pm

    I live down the street and know the people involved with the aqcuisition from both Chapman and the Church. I’m Catholic and this is fantastic. Sorry all of you atheist don’t belong to a church. Perhaps you shouldn’t celebrate Christmas or Easter… You can go to work on those days…

    Report Post » staunch conservative  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:33pm

      What a beautiful place to throw away your money. Enjoy all the fake smiles you’ll receive there!

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • staunch conservative
      Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:46pm

      Poverty.sucks…. Are you aware of another property in Orange County that can hold several thousand cheaper?

      Report Post » staunch conservative  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:01am

      Simmer down, we’re happy for you. What’s surprising about the deal is that Islam was unsuccessful in converting this tower into a mosque. Now the Rich White folks will continue to do what ever it is that they do. At ease.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • mdvd
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 1:13am

      After all Jesus Christ is the founder of the Catholic Church. Matthew 16.
      Peter said: You are the son of the living God. Christ said: Ah, Simon son of John, no mere man has revealed this to you but My Father in Heaven. I DECLARE THAT YOU ARE ROCK AND UPON THIS ROCK I WILL BUILD MY CHURCH AND THE GATES OF HELL SHALL NOT PREVAIL AGAINST IT.
      The establishment of the Catholic Church!!!
      Christ is the rock, and when Christ said Peter you are Rock, Christ grasped Peter upon Himself that from that moment on, whenever Peter spoke of Faith and Morals, it is Christ speaking through him.
      That’s why when the Pope is speaking about faith and morality (do not abort your baby, do use contraceptives) it is Christ speaking through him. We Catholics obey it. (most of us, I guess).
      Christ said : If you love me you will obey My Commandments.

      Report Post »  
  • RabidPatriot
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:14pm

    Dumb glass building has nothing to do with God. People gathered in prayer in a hut have a better chance of knowing God.

    Report Post » RabidPatriot  
  • Eblaze44
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 11:04pm

    Changing hands from one hypocritical sect of Christians to another – what’s new? The best thing about Schuler was that he always tried to make everyone feel good. But it had to have been about the most hypocritical hedonistic service I’d ever seen. Attended and spoken in by Hollywood‘s stars who were often in the news with their scandals and who’s screwing who. Now the Catholics get a sparkling glass building where I suppose you can watch the priests carry on with their ways.

    Report Post » Eblaze44  
  • YoungBloodNews
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:51pm

    Catholic chruch huge land owners????? You don’t say…. SMOM the smallest sovereignty recognized… Whats that???? Black pope pullin the strings…. Who’s he ;)

    Report Post » YoungBloodNews  
    • Bakko Bomma
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:35am

      And upon her forehead was written: “Mystery Babylon The Great, The Mother of Harlots and of the Abominations of The Earth.”

      Report Post » Bakko Bomma  
    • Falsegods
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:00am

      I am Catholic,
      the Mother Mary has appeared and prevented harm in my life number of times.
      Believe in the Miracles of God,
      not man acting as if he were god.

      Report Post »  
    • poverty.sucks
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 11:38am

      False God comment is an example of anti-Christ behavior. Glory is to God for all that is good. Your heart is Godless. Where in the Holy Bible does Jesus proclaim prayer Mary his mother, after bearing more children that she’s still a virgin and that she and only she brings miracles upon you?

      You False God are no better than Satan.

      Report Post » poverty.sucks  
    • 4blackhorses
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 5:16pm

      The faith of Catholicism: Among the largest religions and the richest one of the world, the Vatican a sovereign state, yet requiring a percentage of each parishioner’s income as “duly paying for the blessings of God.” Being born poor and raised a Catholic, I began doubting “pay for pray” when I learned arithmetic.

      Schuler, Oral Roberts, those of their ilk may have some redeeming quailty by having guided ‘lost sheep’ back into the folds of God’s graces. But to further continue their greed in guiding dollars into their pockets separates them from religion.

      Report Post »  
    • Falsegods
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 9:01pm

      Poverty,
      I pray to God in Jesus’s name.
      Mother Mary is one of God’s helpers.
      God bless you.

      Report Post »  
    • Dismayed Veteran
      Posted on November 21, 2011 at 4:53pm

      4 Black Horses

      I am 63 years old and have lived in 8 different states. I attend Mass every Sunday. I have never been “required to pay a percentage of my income as “duly paying for the blessings of God”. In fact, the only time I have asked to contribute was to support missions.

      Report Post » Dismayed Veteran  
  • garyM
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:50pm

    23It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.

    24For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:

    25Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;

    26For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

    27And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

    28So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

    Report Post »  
  • B-Neil
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:47pm

    There is a far better need in todays society for the Church to finacially address then Purchesing a building they don’t need. One of the reasons I no longer participate in Organized Religion. Like the Government; they squander all the Monies provided by honest hard working people who truelly believe. Organized Religion never has or never will be chosen by God or will they ever speak for God. CARRY ON McDUFF

    Report Post »  
  • Micmac
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:44pm

    Sad that the congregation is “attached” to the building and not the faith…speaks volumes. They did have some awesome Christmas programs though.

    NoBama 2012
    Reboot Washington

    Report Post »  
  • garyM
    Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:35pm

    Now there is a group that is really concerned about the welfare of people!

    Report Post »  
    • TheGreyPiper
      Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:45pm

      http://www.catholiccharitiesusa.org/ Correct.

      Poor old Schuler, did he ever really understand what a “cathedral” is? Used to watch him, with my mother, on Sunday mornings after local church. It was a long time before I realized that his “Possibility Thinking,” along with his mentor Norman Vincent Peale’s “Power of Positive Thinking,“ was nothing more than ”The Little Engine That Could.”

      Report Post » TheGreyPiper  
    • TheGreyPiper
      Posted on November 18, 2011 at 10:47pm

      See also : http://crs.org/ http://www.cafod.org.uk/ http://www.missionariesofafrica.org/

      Report Post » TheGreyPiper  
    • AmeriCat
      Posted on November 19, 2011 at 12:55am

      @TheGrayPiper….same here.
      I watched the television and even went to services on site when in the area,
      but it took a while to realize that God’s teachings seemed secondary
      to the charisma of encouragement, hope, and the belief in oneself.

      Report Post »  
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