Update: NASA Discusses Rightful Ownership of Space Artifacts
- Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:16am by
Liz Klimas
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This checklist has some of James Lovell's mission-saving calculations from Apollo 13.
MIAMI (The Blaze/AP) — Last week, we reported the latest in the contentious issue of who owns what in terms of space artifacts, as NASA called into question the auction of a checklist from Apollo 13. After much press on if Commander James Lovell had the right to sell a checklist with his hand-written notes, the head of NASA met Monday with former astronauts to discuss who owns space artifacts, saying afterward that the agency will work cooperatively to resolve ownership issues.
NASA chief Charles Bolden said in a statement that there have been “fundamental misunderstandings and unclear policies” regarding items that astronauts took home from the Mercury, Gemini, Apollo and Skylab programs. The statement marks a switch from NASA’s recent confrontational stance, which included suing Apollo 14 astronaut Edgar Mitchell in Miami federal court over rights to a 16mm video camera that went to the moon.
“These are American heroes, fellow astronauts, and personal friends who have acted in good faith, and we have committed to work together to find the right policy and legal paths forward to address outstanding ownership questions,” Bolden said.
Mitchell and other astronauts have said NASA officials told them long ago they could keep certain equipment from the missions, and over the years collectors have paid millions for space items.
In a letter to Dallas-based Heritage Auctions regarding the sale of the Apollo 13 checklist, NASA also questioned the ownership of two items from Apollo 9 astronaut Rusty Schweickart — a lunar module identification plate and a hand controller — and a glove worn by Alan Shepard during training for Apollo 14. Those also received sizable bids in the November auction.
Schweickart also attended the Monday meeting, according to NASA, along with fellow Apollo astronauts Gene Cernan and Charlie Duke.
Bolden said the ownership discussions will explore “all policy, legislative and other legal means“ to resolve ownership issues ”and ensure that appropriate artifacts are preserved and available for display to the American people.”
An assistant said Monday that Lovell was traveling and wasn’t immediately available to comment. The checklist and other items from the November auction are being kept in a Heritage Auctions vault pending outcome of the inquiry, company officials said.
Mitchell and others have said they were given broad latitude in deciding which artifacts they could take home.
Before he settled the camera lawsuit with NASA, Mitchell produced a 2002 letter from a former director at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston that appeared to back up their position. That letter, signed by retired director Christopher Kraft Jr., said that he approved a policy allowing Apollo astronauts to keep personal items that flew with them as well anything from the lunar landing module that was abandoned on the moon anyway.
“It was generally accepted that the astronauts could bring back pieces of equipment or hardware from this spacecraft for a keepsake of these journeys,” Kraft wrote.
That letter, however, does not address whether astronauts can sell the items. In its letter to the auction house, NASA insisted only the agency can approve such artifacts for sale.
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Comments (49)
Robert-CA
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:45pmNASA go home & keep working on the islamic relations .
Report Post »jkilson
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:40pm“only the agency can approve such artifacts for sale” I want to see the N.A.S.A. policy this comes from… was this told to them from the beginning? If not then N.A.S.A. doesn’t have a case.
You can’t change the rules after the fact. If they were given these items, which is seems pretty clear by Kraft’s comments, then it’s the astronauts call on the sale of the item that legally belongs to them… not the federal governments!
Report Post »One of the Quiet Ones
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 10:42pmThey could always pull out “National Security” duh duh duhhhhh..
Report Post »Pat Alexander
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:05pmThese are guys that took great personal risks for what was really very little pay. They got a few souvenirs that they obviously had permission to have. Now that they have an high established value after having been kept all these years, NASA wants backsies…
They should be ashamed.
But shame isn’t much in vogue in government circles these days…..
Report Post »tharpdevenport
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 1:33pmWhy does NASA care about any of that? Especially since none of the shuttles are ever going up ever again. This is odd. There’s something more here.
Report Post »Rowgue
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:34pmThere is a big difference between an astronaut wanting to keep an item as a personal momento from a mission, and auctioning it off to the highest bidder on the equivalent of e-bay.
It’s perfectly understandable why NASA would object when people are auctioning things off like this. They were fine with letting the astronauts keep them as personal keepsakes.
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:03pmWhat do you think will happen to those personal keepsakes when the owner dies? Does it not go to the person designated in his will? And can not that person do as they please with what they get? Besides the artifacts in question will more than likely end up in a collection or a museum anyway. If NASA wants those things so badly perhaps they should bid on them like anybody else. And since that organization isn’t doing the general public any good anymore, why not shut it down and save the taxpayers a lot of money.
Report Post »Quest4Freedom
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:29amI read that all of our moon rocks nationwide locked in museums were stolen. Is this true? It doesn’t surprise me knowing who is running this ship. I’m sure that they made millions!
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:14pmI have heard that a lot of the Moon material was parceled out to different laboratories for experimentation and analysis. Some chunks are in the Smithsonian. But I am sure there are pieces that were sold to the highest bidder by NASA themselves to private collectors for extra money. Besides, it‘s not like they don’t have access to more……….. Oops! did I just say that out loud?
Report Post »Quest4Freedom
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:26amAbsolutely! After all, the WH has every right to spend (squander) our hard-earned monies as it sees fit (PARTY!!!) but what right do our heroes have? NONE. Hey, big “O” be sure you ask Google who this “Quest4Freedom” person is so you can try to destroy their life. Sorry, bud, I’m ready for you!
Report Post »Gonzo
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 10:21amHey NASA, shut up and do your Muslim outreach like you’re supposed to and quit hassling these guys.
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:17pmIs NASA being used as a religious mediator nowadays? Just curious. I thought NASA was designed to conquer outer space, not the empty space that resides between the ears of Islamic extremists.
Report Post »kimberlyjesus
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 10:17amWhat a waste of money and time. You scientists think you know it all. Your wrong. Soon, you will no longer be at work and wasting GOD’S MONEY. That money should have been spent on AMERICANS! SO MANY AMERICANS ARE OUT OF WORK AND HAVE NO HOME OR FOOD!
Report Post »NoNannyState4me
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:47amGod’s Money. LMFAO!
Report Post »Bonnieblue2A
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:10pmFind a new church. The one you are attending is obviously led by a false prophet.
Report Post »CatholicTexanGrandma
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 9:50amThey were given to the astronauts without strings – no one said, for instance, you may take these home but remember they still belong to NASA and upon your death must be returned to us. No one said they are gifts with strings. Actually, a gift cannot have strings. If it is a gift (or a keepsake), the recipient may do with it what he wants. Did they really expect that some family member generations later would NOT sell them?
Report Post »Rowgue
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:03pmThese are not distant family members generations later selling the items, it’s the astronauts themselves.
Either way it’s a pretty insignificant issue, but I would tend to agree with NASA on this one even though I think the agency itself has been entirely useless since it’s inception. They took these items home with them often without anyone saying they could, and in the cases where someone did there were absolutely strings attached.
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:23pmI completely agree! This is just a bureaucratic attempt to interfere with free enterprise. If the MVP of a football game gets to keep the game ball, does he not have the right to sell it to someone who will treasure it for its historical value? Or is he supposed to give it back upon his death? It seems to me to be rather obvious, possession is 9/10 of the law.
Report Post »elvisroy0000
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 9:42amif space junk falls on my property i own it its going on ebay Salvation Army Red Kettles http://youtu.be/N2Cs5xrIIhI 6 Garden in Corry http://youtu.be/6s0hjhkXW6Y
Report Post »KangarooJack
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 8:19amThink of it this way. Were I to bring home an item from work, without their knowledge, it would be stealing. Were I to bring home an item with their knowledge & blessing, it’s a gift. I believe NASA might be entitled to the cost of the sheets of paper (if NASA provided the paper) but NOT THE WRITTEN THOUGHTS of the Astronaut.
Report Post »Jerley
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 8:00amThis is more Redistribution of wealth. Our New Government can’t allow anyone to profit from their labors, contributions or intellectual property or physical properties. Government owns everythingand will provide what you deserve.
Comrades! Do Think of What your Country can do to you! Don’t Question what we demand from you! Be a good party Member and turn on those that resist!
Report Post »grannyrecipe
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 8:00amNASA, we the people own you! Got it in perspective yet?
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:29pmSorry that’s just an illusion. Although we pay for NASA, we have no say in what NASA does or what NASA does to others. NASA is one of those organizations that don’t have to account to the people for anything they have learned or spent on space missions. Everything that NASA does is considered covered under the blanket of National Security. Some information that they do release is information that is very controlled. There is no more live feed video from space missions for obvious reasons.
Report Post »ThePostman
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:19amThere is no constitutional mandate for the federal government to engage in space missions.
Report Post »Baddoggy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:26amExactly. It should have been a privately backed venture. I am still paying off blown up spacecraft and a spacelab the Russinas are farting in…
Report Post »Extraterrestrial
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 11:35pmObviously there was not even the vaguest idea that men would even be capable of going to the Moon when our constitution was written. But you Gotta give the founding fathers credit, they did one helluva good job in foreseeing some of the future problems. Unfortunately the idiots we have in power today ignore the wisdom of the great minds that formed this nation to begin with.
Report Post »ThePostman
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:17amNASA took the shuttle from Houston and gave it to New York. They seem to have no problem stealing property from the states where the space program operated before it became a muslim outreach agency…
Report Post »ObserverOnTheHill
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:11amNASA needs to stop worrying about these kind of things and get back on track with its mission – MUSLIM Outreach !!! That’s what the people want, Zero said so.
Report Post »Baddoggy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:10amWhy isn’t any of this mine…After all I apid for it. Screw NASA.
Report Post »MR_ANDERSON
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:25amDefinition of KEEPSAKE – Noun: Anything kept, or given to be kept, as a token of friendship or affection; remembrance.
Keepsakes are to be kept, not to be sold. If the items was defined as a “keepsake” then it should not be allowed to be sold.
Going back to what it takes to receive items from the government, the items belong to the US Government. I deal with a problem at one of my buildings where people take toilet paper home to save on having to purchase their own rolls of toilet paper. You would think, it is only toilet paper, but seriously it adds up and cost money. Remember this is just one building out of how many owned by the US Government. We could continue on to pen, and many other items.
Government property is purchased with money spent from what it has taken from us (Taxes), or money we will have to pay for at a later date (Debt). Now each member of the military is a Hero (exempting those who serve dishonorably), so at what point do you say it is OK for them to take things because they deserve it.
While he is a Hero, he cannot sell the book. If he wants to make a copy of the book’s notes and write a new book about it covering what happened, then he can make money off of it. I am sure that some publishing company out there would be interested in doing this. He could probably even earn more money and in the end, he is selling this to make money, not because he is passing on a keepsake.
Stick to the facts, they will lead you on a path to the
Report Post »MR_ANDERSON
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 3:27am…truth.
Don’t know why it cut that off.
Report Post »TomFerrari
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 6:47amNew NASA Director has the right to keep all such things…
HOWEVER, he does NOT have the authority to take back such things that his predecessors ALLOWED people to have – things that they were GIVEN!
If he wants that to be the policy going forward… GO FOR IT ! It is your agency to direct, now.
Report Post »However, you do not have retroactive power over historic actions of other Directors.
Stu D. Baker-Hawk
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 6:59amI’m willing to bet that not one individual at NASA calling for the return of this checklist actually WORKED at NASA during those heady days of space exploration. NASA has fallen to levels of shame since those days. They now kowtow to the likes of a communist president, they push the agenda of imagined man-made global warming, and the most unforgiveable of all, they killed two space shuttle crews through faulty spacecraft design and a poor decision-making process. NASA, go to hell!
Report Post »Baddoggy
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 7:33amIt’s OK for them to take my money at the point of a gun with the IRS…why should anyone get to keep anything? The Government is our complete master now and 90% of the Country could care less…I for one am ready for the Revolution to begin…Hear that TSA Pedophiles? Hear that Homeland Security Gestapo? Up yours!
Ron Paul 2012 for FREEDOM and LIBERTY
Report Post »BOMUSTGO
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 2:44amNASA once shot for the moon..Now they shoot for the cresent moon of Islam…
Report Post »imfrzn
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 2:14amNASA is broke and now it comes down to this?
Report Post »glennisright.com
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 2:03amAfter what Jim Lovell went through, I think he’s earned the right to own pretty much anything from that mission. What would NASA need it for?
Report Post »Elena2010
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:25amIt should belong to Lovell.
Report Post »TXPilot
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:29amSo, this is what NASA has become. Once a proud example of American ingenuity, and now a hippie drum circle, that thinks up ways to promote Al Gore’s evil climate agenda, coddle terrorist Muslims, and the newest fad, harassing great, American hero’s like Lovell…..The man helped get a crippled spacecraft back to Earth and saved NASA’s bacon, so the least they can do, is let him sell the property he risked his life to earn.
Report Post »glong75104
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:38amVery well said… I just recently watched the Tom Hanks portray Lovell in the movie Apollo 13, what a great American Story. Yes I too agree with you Elena2010, OUR HERO JIM LOVELL “EARNED” that checklist.
Report Post »glong75104
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:39amSorry TXPILOT…. it was your comment that I was agreeing with….as well as the other :)
Report Post »TXPilot
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 1:35am@GLONG75104……lol…no prob….I will take half of a compliment as well as a whole one….thanks..
Report Post »BurntHills
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:24amdidn’t obama turn NASA into one more covert arm of the Muslim Brotherhood after he killed the NASA that America was so proud of, no wonder why they need every cent.
Report Post »BurntHills
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:23amyeah yeah yeah we know, obama wants anything that ever said NASA on it to be turned over to the muslims. he’s defecated all over on NASA — and America.
Report Post »CatB
Posted on January 10, 2012 at 12:31amAmen … funny how it wasn’t a problem for decades and now it is.
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