Faith

Vanderbilt University: Christian Campus Groups Can’t Require Leaders to Have Specific Beliefs

Vanderbilt Discrimination Policy Said to Hurt Campus Religious GroupsThe drama over student rights and religious freedom continues to rage at Vanderbilt University, as the higher education facility doubled-down this week on enforcing strict rules that some say discriminate against campus religious groups.

At the center of debate is the university’s nondiscrimination policy, which bans student-led faith groups, among others, from requiring leaders to hold specific beliefs.

The policy, which in many ways contradicts theological requirements, has created angst among members of both the student body and the university’s faculty. These opponents see the ban as a crackdown on their freedom of religion and speech. School leaders, though, maintain that the policy is necessary to ensure that all students feel welcome at campus clubs and events.

The Blaze first reported about the situation back in September. Our original coverage provides the background needed to understand how the situation was started:

Vanderbilt University in Nashville, Tennessee, is making headlines after a Christian fraternity, Beta Upsilon Chi, asked an openly gay member to resign. Upon leaving the group, the young man filed a discrimination complaint and now college administrators are trying to figure out whether the campus organization violated the school’s nondiscrimination policy.

Of course, this incident has grown into a much larger controversy in which university administrators are reviewing all student-led organizations. As a result, officials are concerned about specific clauses that five Christian campus groups have in their constitutions.

These clauses require members of the groups to share their religious beliefs, something that didn‘t concern campus administrators until the student’s complaint was made. Now, the school wants the constitutions amended and the controversial clauses dropped.

Vanderbilt Discrimination Policy Said to Hurt Campus Religious GroupsCurrently, four campus groups violate this policy, as they require their leaders to maintain Christian messages. Club heads argue, though, that leaders responsible for planning Bible studies should actually believe in the material they are preaching. The campus groups in question are the Christian Legal Society, Beta Upsilon Chi, Graduate Student Fellowship and Fellowship of Christian Athletes.

At an event on Tuesday evening, the college defended its policies to an audience of over 200 students. Provost Richard McCarthy and Vice Chancellor for University Affairs and Athletics said that the university doesn’t plan to back down. If student groups fail to comply, they will lose their official status with the college. Despite administrators’ insistence, the community forum did provide students with an opportunity to share their opposition and reasoning with policy-makers at the helm.

“The Vanderbilt discrimination policy is directed against the Christian community,” said Leighton Watts, a member of Beta Upsilon Chi, a Christian fraternity (he wasn’t inside the meeting, but he was watching from a computer outside of the venue and commented to media).

“We want to be able to elect our leaders based on our beliefs,” said Joseph Williams, a former student body president at the university. He spoke out against the restrictions during a question and answer period.

McCarthy’s response to this was intriguing: Students can vote for any individual they’d like, but the clubs cannot have written rules banning students who don’t hold specific views from running for leadership roles. He essentially told students not to vote for people with whom they disagree.

Carol Swain, a law professor at Vanderbilt and an adviser to the Christian Legal Society, disagrees with the college’s stance and is working to assist groups who stand opposed to the rule. In an interview with FOX News, she said:

“There are people on campus who are very threatened by the idea of religious freedom and they would like to create an environment where no one hurts anyone else’s feelings – unless it’s Christians.

This political correctness is running amuck on campus and its constraining one group – and that group tends to be conservatives. They will be forced to either accept the university’s policy or leave campus by the end of the academic year. They are in limbo.”

The Blaze also spoke with Joshua Charles, who co-authored Glenn Beck’s “The Original Argument.” Charles, who was a Founding Father and President of the Beta Upsilon Chi chapter at the University of Kansas, had some strong feelings on the matter.

“It seems difficult to imagine a scenario in which any religious group could, without any infringement whatsoever, worship and practice freely if they
cannot even make decisions on their own membership or leadership,” Charles said. “Groups are formed in order to advance causes, ideals, or something of the sort. But if the integrity of that group cannot be maintained, then neither can
the causes or ideals for which it was founded in the first place.”

In the end, Christian student groups are clearly stuck at this point, as administrators are refusing to budge. But it’s not just religious groups that could encounter a problem. What if a gay and lesbian rights group on campus wants to ensure that those in leadership roles hold true to certain values of equality? Or — what if an environmental group wants members to pledge their allegiance to protecting the earth?

“Freedom of association — the ability to mingle with those you wish to mingle
with, to connect with those you wish to connect with, and to join in common
cause with them, is a fundamental liberty,” Charles continued.

In the end, this is a policy that certainly holds the potential to create further angst and inter-student contention.

(H/T: Tennessean)

Comments (150)

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  • gemmeri
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:30pm

    Where are the Christian coalitions when you need them? Why aren’t their attorneys stepping up to represent this group & the NYC high school prayer mural? Put your practice where your propaganda is, jerks. You should be representing these people pro bono at the very least. Need money for filing fees? Then your congregations should be kicking in what they can. Wonder why no one takes you & your beliefs seriously anymore? Where are you hiding yourselves when you should be on the front lines taking up your Lord’s cause? Forget signs & empty words & actions. I’m talking real lawsuits & real intentions. Get real, wannabe Christian Soldiers, because right now all we see is the bigots winning this war. You can’t possibly believe that turning the other cheek in this instance is what was meant or appropriate, do you? Either fight appropriately for what is right, or go home in disgrace, because there is no middle road here. Bedroom concerns need to stay in the bedroom. Homosexuality is not a right, it’s a choice & a lifestyle & I don’t want to hear it or see it because it belongs in private. I‘m tired of hearing that atheists have more rights than anyone else when they don’t believe in anything. One would think that philosophy would result in less overall concerns about what is right or wrong, hypocrites. Get your act together, people, you are beyond ridiculous now.

    Report Post »  
    • sndrman
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:49pm

      GEM just like our elected “leaders”(R) refuse to stand for us seems the “Christian” organizations have run for cover as well,the usual…….oh well that‘s how we are where we are our side has not turned the other cheek they’ve turned and run….. what we know and how things used to be ends with us….

      Report Post »  
    • jwt
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:20pm

      maybe it is a good thing to be seperated from this university

      Report Post »  
    • 4truth2all
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 9:15pm

      First paragraph states that this college is a “higher education facility”.
      I’m wondering …….. do they have science teachers teaching science?
      Do they have math teachers teaching math?
      They really should get some people with brains to do the thinking.

      Report Post »  
    • Silence_Dogood_1968
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 9:29pm

      First they came for the communists and I said nothing because I am not a communist.
      Then they came for trade unionists and I said nothing because I am not a trade unionist.
      Then they came for the Jews and I said nothing because I am not a Jew.
      Then they came for the Catholics and I said nothing again because I am not Catholic.
      Then they came for me and their was nobody left to speak for me.
      Pastor Neimoller

      Report Post »  
    • cuinsong
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 10:14pm

      I must wonder why someone who is an open gay would want to belong to a religious group that believes the gay life style is a sin? One must assume it was for ulterior motives! This is such a openly attempt to get some publicity in order to advance the gay cause along with the diversity push.
      you can hear the truth in this song about diversity that is for all who preach such stupidity. http://www.reverbnation.com/play_now/song_11826046

      Report Post » cuinsong  
    • patriot308
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 11:56pm

      So….. how about we consider one of the womens rights groups ( several are listed ) If some of the members announce they are very pro life. Lets see how long they last in that group…..And all you would hear is ths sound of crickets in the night.

      Report Post »  
    • NYHuguenot
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 1:27am

      There is Supreme Court precedence on this as to allowing free association with like minded people
      You arwe right. Where are the Christian legal organizations to help these people?

      Report Post »  
    • Puppy
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 1:52am

      Gemmeri, You’re a Dweeb.

      Report Post »  
    • TomFerrari
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 6:29am

      Why are “clubs” tied to institutions of higher learning to begin with?
      So they lose their official status. They will get no money from the schools. Why is the school funding them to begin with? With the lower tuition created by not funding clubs, students can put money into renting a hall or building one. A religious group should find it an easy task to find a Church or Synagogue that will let then use a meeting room. The “antisemitic, pro-palestinian, gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender, handy-capable, minorities-only, islamic, synchronized underwater basket weaving club” may have a harder time finding a meeting room. The good news is, they wont need more than their own living room, and won’t receive 50,000 dollars per year from the school for use by their two members (many schools give the same amount to every club).

      Report Post » TomFerrari  
    • kaydeebeau
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 6:53am

      I have a better question – where are we? Those who rail against this in blogs and comments? What are we actually doing and why do we seem to think we have to wait for “someone” to do something? We are the someones and until we are understand that, nothing will change

      Report Post » kaydeebeau  
    • acovenantinblood
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 9:28am

      “Where are the Christian coalitions when you need them?”

      They seem to like to run and hide in America these days. Their once was a version of Christianity that transformed an entire empire. Then their was another version that lost an entire nation. But hey, if we just sing praise louder, and buy better pizzas for the meetings, and have more entertainment on youth group night, and repeat the Name Jesus it will all be O.K.

      Report Post » acovenantinblood  
    • jujubeebee
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 9:29am

      Gemmeri: Yes it is now time for christians to come out of the closet and stand up for their rights! right on! We have been pushed into silence through political correctness and it is now the time to rise up and come out of that closet of silence! I agree!

      Report Post »  
    • Jinglebob
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 12:35pm

      The Devil knocked on the door and Vanderbilt opened the door.

      Report Post » Jinglebob  
    • Maji
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 1:59pm

      Okay!!!
      Just as long as;
      “ Muslims” can’t mention the Koran,refer to their god!
      “Atheist” can‘t say they don’t believe (they‘ve said it’s a type of religon in itself)and
      can’t denigrate other religons!

      Report Post »  
    • thecrazypastor
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 8:38pm

      Gemri this very issue was recently argued at the US Supreme Court by Christian advocacy groups. So they are very involved even if this particular article didn’t mention the recent case at the Supreme Court. I believe the Court may have ruled in favor of universities like Vanderbilt. Which is one reason why Vandy isn’t going to back down. Christian Campus organizations everywhere are threatened because of this issue. Any university can essentially shut them out.

      Report Post »  
  • hi
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:28pm

    It would make more sense if gay men joined sororities and gay women joined fraternities. Then everyone can walk around in their undies and not worry their suite mate has the hots for them. It should be based on sexual attraction.

    Report Post » hi  
    • Rose-Yellen
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:36pm

      That would be ideal for a bi-sexual.
      Like being at the Golden Corral after a 40-day fast.

      Report Post »  
    • grannyrecipe
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 5:48am

      Oh golly, I think I‘ll join the women’s volleyball team…and they better not discriminate when it comes to shower time, I’d really be ticked!!

      Report Post » grannyrecipe  
  • Fiddlededee
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:26pm

    I wonder how open Vandebilt is to placating the muslims on campus? Are there prayer rooms for the muslim employees to use during their lunch hour? Do they allow the students to wear headscarves? Are there lectures promoting islam?

    It seems when there are religious issues, the Christians are the scapegoats and the whipping posts.

    Report Post » Fiddlededee  
  • Fuzislippers
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:23pm

    Are there any Muslim groups at Vanderbilt? Are they being challenged by these same groups?

    Report Post » Fuzislippers  
    • Rose-Yellen
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:47pm

      Amen to that! I want to see a jew try to join a Muslim group, let alone lead one. Muslims wouldn’t let a woman lead a group either.

      Report Post »  
  • norma55
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:21pm

    I have a son at Vandy First –there were only 200 students in the room because that was the maximum capacity of the room. Many more were outside. The faculty present were arrogant and did not care if Alumni threatened to pull their $ from University. I believe this is being driven by the Obama Administration because an editorial in the School Newspaper by a Christian student stated that the Administration said that they had to enforce this “new” policy or federal funding would be cut off. This is a large University that is associated with a major Hospital so I can see that this threat maybe true because of funding for research. This is the same Univeristy that had Van Jones on Campus (October 18, 2011) and Michael More (September 2011)
    First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.
    Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist.
    Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.
    Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me.
    IT IS HAPPENING AGAIN. —–This is a war on Christianity and all Americans liberities.

    Report Post »  
    • Alan
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:21pm

      Actually, the left is doing this to the Christians. And the left is formed, for the large part, of communists and trade unionists. Don’t you ever watch the news? These guys are Obama minions.

      Report Post »  
    • Jackie Rogers, Jr.
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 9:42pm

      I’ve seen this passage, or parts of it, used many times on The Blaze. It’s usually attributed to German pastor Martin Niemoller and references his and others inaction during Nazi crackdowns on various “undesirable” groups. There is disagreement over the exact wording. The quotation may have been changed by Niemoller on different occasions. Here’s one version that is often used:
      First they came for the communists,
      and I didn‘t speak out because I wasn’t a communist.
      Then they came for the trade unionists,
      and I didn‘t speak out because I wasn’t a trade unionist.
      Then they came for the Jews,
      and I didn‘t speak out because I wasn’t a Jew.
      Then they came for the Catholics,
      and I didn’t speak out because I was Protestant.
      Then they came for me
      and there was no one left to speak out for me.

      Report Post » Jackie Rogers, Jr.  
    • Mtroom
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 11:45pm

      Not surprised that a federal grant might be behind it..Does anyone have the name of the student who complained?..Bet his parents are in politics.

      Report Post » Mtroom  
  • Gypsy123
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:20pm

    A institution founded on biblical principles can make the rules for that institution. If you don‘t like the rules don’t go there. They are right if someone is practicing homosexuality or are acting immoral in any form they have a right to fire that person.

    Report Post » Gypsy123  
  • paperpushermj
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:18pm

    Sounds like the University is stuck between a Rock and a Hard Place so they made a decision that plays to their Liberal side and will punt to the Courts to get themselves out of this pickle.

    Report Post » paperpushermj  
  • Texas.7
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:15pm

    Obviously, atheists would love to lead prayer to make a mockery of it, and would love to lead our Christian youth into discussions against Christ.

    The same thing happens when “Bible as Literature” is taught on campus- the text books can be VERY anti-Christ, and atheist teachers proceed to teach young believers that the Bible is a lie. (After all, we approved that it be taught by whomever the school wants to put in as teacher, and with a text book of their choosing, so while we think it is a good thing to have these classes, remember that they will teach exactly that- “Bible as Literature” or, fiction.

    But our liberties are very much at stake if student groups cannot have belief statements which the leaders must endorse. This is very different than trying to make a university teach Bible in a positive manner- just don’t let them touch the Bible! But to stifle free expression, and the right to assemble with like-minded individuals, this has ominous overtones which should alarm all. They are really trying to interfere with the rights of individuals to gather for faith period. Soon, churches won’t be able to turn away pastor applicants because of faith.

    This must be stopped, for it has far-reaching consequences.

    Report Post »  
    • rangerp
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:21pm

      do these people ever read the bill of rights?

      Report Post » rangerp  
    • gemmeri
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:51pm

      I don’t think they know how to read.

      Report Post »  
  • TERIPA
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:14pm

    YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE
    & He will permit good changes to occur.

    GET BEHIND GOD RIGHT HERE…

    http://www.TheWarningSecondComing.com

    We have been praying, per Jesus’ call to children all over the world, at this site.
    Devoted followers are being granted many graces now.

    “Hear my urgent plea, to pray for… ”
    Your beloved Saviour Jesus Christ Jan. 23, 2012

    JMJ

    Report Post » TERIPA  
  • Inlightofthings
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:12pm

    Serious question:
    In no way anti-gay but am interested in the interpretation of “sexual orientation” found in so many hiring statements for non-discrimination ie race, religion etc. The sex abuse scandals amongst coaches and some comments made by a couple of my sons regarding an apparently gay male coach prompted me to wonder…if it’s about sexual orientation, why are gay men allowed to coach young boys, see them in locker rooms, showers etc? I’ve heard comments how gays are not pedophiles etc; I get that. My response is that a heterosexual male, married, father of girls is not a statutory rapist either, so why are they not allowed in the locker rooms of the young girls? I just think it’s naive to allow people to be in the same environment just because they share the same body part(s). The fact is I think if you surveyed why male coaches are not allowed in young girls locker rooms, it‘s resoundingly about the young girls’ protection – not modesty. The rules need to be applied across the board and I will say, the young boys I know are uncomfortable showering in front of a gay coach, so modesty does seem to come into play.
    I think this fits with the Vanderbilt discussion because it seems the push is to treat gays as “gender neutral”, when in fact they are not. It appears religions are being forced into viewing it that same way, which is the primary concern in my mind. My question…any thoughts?

    Report Post »  
  • norma55
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:11pm

    The room had only 200 students because that was the maximum capacity of the room. Many more students were shut out of the room. According to my son who was in the room the Faculty present were arogant and did not seem to care if Alumni stop giving $ to the University. I think this is the Obama administration threatening to cut offf funding to the University that is attached to a large Research Hospital. This is also the same University that brought Van Jones on to it’s Campus On October 18, 2011 and Michael Moore in September 2011
    First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.
    Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist.
    Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.
    Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me.
    IT IS HAPPENING AGAIN. —–

    Report Post »  
  • RJJinGadsden
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:08pm

    I’ve said it before and I will say it again. For all this left wing loon demand for separation of church and state, there is an awful lot of state sticking it’s nose into the church! You can’t have it both ways, get over it!

    Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
    • Rose-Yellen
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:39pm

      The constitution is written the keep government out of all churches, not vice versa.
      Typical liberals – constantly standing on their heads and telling the world it is upside down.

      Report Post »  
    • RJJinGadsden
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 12:16am

      ROSE-YELLEN, Dang, I had to do a double take on your moniker there. I whole heartedly agree with you regarding the purpose of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. They are by design restrictions on the government. You would think that church goers and the religious of this country would realize how bad an idea it is to continue voting Dems. This type of assault on religion occured under Clinton as well. He really quietly assaulted the religious personnel of the military with all sorts of harassing regulations and restrictions.

      Report Post » RJJinGadsden  
  • DaveOregon
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:02pm

    Vanderbilt just proved that dumb as dirt applies to virtually ALL levels of academia.

    Report Post »  
  • BBReggie
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:02pm

    While I disagree with their policy, it is a private college. If I were looking to attend college, I would cross Vanderbilt off my list.

    Report Post »  
    • JimCDew
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:28pm

      BAAAAAAAA – Ooooh, Sorry you’re wrong. Any group or organization which receives Federal funds from any source is subject to the rule of Federal law and that includes the amendments to the U.S. Constitution. So, unless Vanderbilt refuses money for research grants or student tuition grants from the Federal government, they must operate within the constraints of the U.S. Constitution.

      Report Post »  
  • Thighmaster
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:02pm

    I think it’s time for anyone who wants to be a professor or serve as an administrator of Vanderbilt should be allowed to without restriction so as not to discriminate against anyone.

    Report Post » Thighmaster  
  • Bronco Guy
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:01pm

    In principal, this is appalling and is one more ***** in any armor of protection for our religious freedom and freedom of speech. In practical terms, student groups will undoubtedly do what the administration suggests, mainly not voting for those who they know don’t espouse their ideals. So, on the ground, this will make very little difference, but in principle, this is one more scary step to bias, incarceration and political correctness.

    Report Post »  
    • Exrepublisheep
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:47pm

      Lol, did they censor ch ink?

      Report Post » Exrepublisheep  
    • gemmeri
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:50pm

      Oh, that is too funny… Can’t have slants in armor, now can we? So much for the English language…

      Report Post »  
  • biker mike
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:59pm

    lets see if someone can join a muslim club, with a BLT sandwich in their backpak,

    Report Post »  
    • Blazesurfer
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:11pm

      super-funny

      Report Post » Blazesurfer  
    • gemmeri
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:45pm

      That reminds me of the mosque someone constructed in our area in support of Islam. This area is still very much full of rednecks, however, and there never seems to be anyone inside the mosque at any given time of day or night… Now I wonder why that is…

      Report Post »  
  • Leader1776
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:58pm

    Time for Vandy alums to pull funding from this waste of education.

    Report Post » Leader1776  
    • kickagrandma
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:25pm

      Exactly! My money’s gone from that place.

      Report Post »  
    • PragmaticPrepper
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 10:59pm

      Mine too! The missus and I both went to grad school there. They’ll get nothing from us until that idiot Provost is fired or resigns.

      Report Post »  
  • ZomBrad
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:57pm

    Ridiculous! It’s decided then…I’m joining a LGBT group with my Christian beliefs….and if they don’t want to hear that homosexuality is an abomination….I’m gonna call discrimination….

    …..but I wouldn’t get far >.>

    Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:04pm

      As long as you are willing to list all things that are considered abominations in the Bible.

      Unclean things (Lev. 7:21)
      Customs of pagans (Lev. 18:30)
      Idols (2 Chr. 15:8; 1 Pet. 4:3)
      Sins of men (Ps. 14:1; 53:1)
      Cheating (Mic. 6:10)
      Lost souls (Rev. 21:8)
      A froward man (perverse; one who turns aside (Pro. 3:32; 11:20)
      A proud look (Pro. 6:16-17)
      A lying tongue (Pro. 6:17; 12:22)
      Hands that shed innocent blood ((Pro. 6:17)
      A wicked scheming heart (Pro. 6:18)
      Feet that are quick to sin (Pro. 6:18)
      A false witness that speaks lies (Pro. 6:19)
      A sower of discord (Pro. 6:19)
      Wickedness (Pro. 8:7)
      A false balance or scale (Pro. 11:1)
      Sacrifices of the wicked (Pro. 15:8; 21:27)
      The way of the wicked (Pro. 15:9)
      The thoughts of the wicked (Pro. 15:26)
      The proud of heart (Pro. 16:5)
      Justifying the wicked (Pro. 17:15)
      Condemning the just (Pro. 17:15)
      Divers, dishonest weights (Pro. 20:10, 23)
      Divers, dishonest measures (Pro. 20:10)
      Refusing to hear the law (Pro. 28:9)
      Prayers of the rebel (Pro. 28:9)
      Eating flesh of peace offerings on the 3rd day (Lev. 7:18)
      Some same sex acts (Lev. 18:22; 20:13; Dt. 23:18) See GayPrejudice.com
      Taking ornaments from idols when being destroyed (Dt. 7:25-26)
      Any Idolatrous practices (Dt. 12:31; 13:14; 17:4; 18:9; 20:18; 29:17)
      Offering an imperfect animal to God as a sacrifice (Dt. 17:1)
      Any traffic with demons (Dt. 18:7-12)
      Wearing clothes of the opposite sex (Dt. 22:5) See GayPrejudice.com

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:08pm

      Bringing the hire of a harlot or sodomite into God’s house (Dt. 23:18)
      Re-marriage of former companions (Dt. 24:1-4)
      Cheating others (Dt. 25:13-16)
      Making images/idols (Dt. 27:15)
      Idols of Ammon (1 Ki. 11:5)
      Idols of Moab (1 Ki. 11:7; 2 Ki. 11:13)
      Idols of Zidon (2 Ki. 23:13)
      Incense offered by hypocrites (Isa. 1:13)
      Eating unclean things (Isa. 66:17)
      Offering human sacrifices (Jer. 32:35)
      Robbery (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Murder (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Adultery (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Oppression of others, particularly the poor or vulnerable (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Violence (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Breaking vows (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Lending with interest to a brother (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Lying with a menstruous woman (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Hardness of heart (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Injustice (Ezek. 18: 6-13)
      Worship of anti-Christ (Dan. 11:31; 12:11; Mt. 24:15; 2 Th. 2:4; Rev. 13)
      Incest (Lev. 19: 6-30)
      Things highly esteemed by man (Lk. 16:15)
      Many other sins of the nations (Lev. 18: 26-29; Dt. 18: 9-12; 20:18; 29:17; 1 Ki. 14:24; 21:2, 11; 23:24; 2 Chr. 28:3; 33:2; 34:33; 36:14; Ezek. 7: 3-20; 8: 6-17; 16: 2-58; 20: 4-30; Rev. 17: 4-5)

      Accept one, accept all.

      Report Post »  
    • betterthantv
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:21pm

      @MODERATIONISBEST – Absolutely LOVE your post! I wish I could reach out and shake your hand! You just completely destroyed the homophobes hiding behind religion! I love it.

      Report Post » betterthantv  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:31pm

      @BETTERTHANTV

      Thank you.

      My main intent is to show the hypocrisy in what they say and how they act.

      We all make hypocritical statements and act like a hypocrite in our lifetime, the best thing we can do is actually realize that and try not to repeat it again.

      Report Post »  
    • circleDwagons
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:15pm

      @moderation. good post. you have your work cut out for you. but not only do you need to read the Bible you need to pray and meditate on the Word of God

      Report Post » circleDwagons  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:37pm

      @CIRCLEDWAGONS

      Sadly I have read the Bible, and it‘s one of the reasons I’m an atheist.

      Report Post »  
    • warnes
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:43pm

      @MODERATIONISBEST: You may be surprised to find that many of us take th Bibles prohibitions at face value and see that whole list as abominable.

      Report Post »  
    • VinnieCCT
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 9:16pm

      ModerationIsBest said “Accept one, accept all”. Which means that we should be forced to accept murder, paedophilia, bestiality and all the rest along with homosexuality.

      Report Post »  
    • VinnieCCT
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 9:40pm

      Let me put it another way for ya there MODERATIONISBEST. Since you obviously support homosexuality, then using your logic, you personally MUST, i repeat, MUST support all the other things you listed above or you are a hypocrite. So which is it? A) you are a hypocrite. or B) you would not have a problem murdering someone or cheating on your spouse?

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 12:01am

      @WARNES

      I rest my case.

      @VINNIECCT

      I’m sorry, but you aren’t thinking logically here.

      I was saying that anyone who is a Christian, and accepts that the Bible is the word of God, and calls homosexuality an abomination, must also accept those other things as abominations.

      To me, the Bible is simply a book, much like Harry Potter is a book and holds no supernatural or divine principle. I don’t think there is a God, therefore there could be no book from that God that tells us what is right and what is wrong.

      Do you get what I’m saying? The Bible holds no value to anyone who isn’t a Christian. It‘s why I never got that people quote scripture when they’re arguing with a non believer.

      Report Post »  
    • YippeeKiyay
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 7:43am

      Moderationisbest, here’s a thought for you: “The perception of Christianity as a religion of faith disconnected from truth, is especially tragic given that Judeo-Christianity is the only reason anyone today talks about “Truth” that can be stated in rational words and propositions. The secular academy acquired the truth-brand only because Secularism is a Protestant heresy. The university exists because the Church was committed to knowing and believing truth. Secularism didn’t create the university. It obtained it because, Protestantism surrendered to Rationalism and evangelicalism abandoned the life of the mind. The fact is that secular atheism and materialism leave no room for rational propositional truth. That is why Secularism is so dogmatic about relativism.” Vishal Mangalwadi, “Why Christianity Lost America”, 2011

      Great list of things God finds abhorrent btw. Of course you neglected to mention that in the original Hebrew, when it came to gay sex, the degree of abhorrence was expressed in a more emphatic form than all those other references you copied and pasted from some concordance. If you begin with the presupposition that God objectively exists and that he is who he says he is, a reasonable conclusion to which many people both erudite and simple have come rationally, you can find the logic in his hatred for homosexual sex. It’s a Creator thing. He hates when people try to deny that he made them and made them with inherent purpose and function.

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 12:19pm

      @YIPPEEKIYAY

      The fact that you believe in a book that is supposedly the true word of God………that can get translated…….by people who believe this stuff, to not only lose its original meaning is hilarious.

      The translations of the Bible itself prove against the “infallibility” claim of the Bible.

      Report Post »  
    • YippeeKiyay
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 1:34pm

      Moderationisbest, That’s your best answer? Ha! Whether I believe in it or not has no bearing on its truth claims. I bet you’ve never really seriously considered them. You’re probably just parroting theophobic mumbojumbo you found at atheists dot com or something. The fact that you believe (by default) that human personality (and all the rest of life) “evolved” by accident from absolute impersonality is not hilarious so much as pathetic. Your position actually boils down to nothing more than wishful thinking, a necessary rationalization of your personal moral declaration of autonomy. But it doesn’t actually work you see. You can’t escape the moral cause-and-effect design of our universe. It’s always the same story. You try. You mock believers. You take refuge in your herd. And then you wonder why your life isn‘t very fulfilling or why your relationships aren’t working out or whatever your deal is. The Bible calls you a fool by the way. Proverbs and Psalms both mention it, “The fool says in his heart ‘There is no God.’” Why be a fool? Why not be intellectually honest? Don’t be such a follower. Put down your Dawkins and read through the Bible yourself, friend.

      Report Post »  
    • Sparky101
      Posted on February 3, 2012 at 1:02am

      It always makes me laugh to see one of those church-burning atheists, who have zero understanding of the Bible, try to pretend to tell believers what the Bible says. This moderate character just embarrasses himself everytime he tries to speak about what’s in the Bible, since he does not know the difference between laws written for the Jew and freedoms written for the Christian. Mr. Moderateknowledge, the King James only calls one sin an “abomination.” Since you are an atheist, surely you are award that God states in the Bible that you are unable to understand his word. You are surely proof of that (proving that God does exist because you are doing everything He said an unbeliever would do). You are like a poster child of what God says about the unbeliever. Your rant about different translations of the Bible also shows your complete ignorance of the Bible and its various translations. Today’s Bible translators have ready access to more fundamental texts than ever before, and yet nothing in any of them are theologically in conflict (I know that is a surprise to you, because you are necessarily ignorant of these truths). You are a shameful mess by trying to use God’s love letter to his people as your weapon. FAIL.

      Report Post »  
    • Sparky101
      Posted on February 3, 2012 at 1:07am

      Oh, I suppose you only had access to the King James version. Your loss.

      Report Post »  
    • Fletcher13
      Posted on February 3, 2012 at 8:46am

      I am glad to see how our atheist has proven that God says that homosexuality is a sin along with his or her’s Atheism!

      In a pathetic effort to show absurdity from the Bible, he/she has proven too much! The blind just cannot see their own condemnation in spite of looking at the truth!

      Report Post »  
  • The highlander
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:55pm

    Modern academia is filled with sexual degenerates, marxists, pagan worship, and occult minded lackeys all serving the fallen angel -Lucifer.

    The enemies of God are everywhere.They will try to infiltrate, subvert, deceive, and destroy our institutions, our homes, our children,our freedoms, our very sanity. Why? because the spirit of Anti-Christ is everywhere(1 John 4:2-3) and the only place it is not is where the God fearing man courageously pushes back.

    We in a war. The prize is nothing less than the soul of mankind.

    Report Post »  
    • boundforglory
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 8:42pm

      The only way that evil can succeed is for good people to do nothing! A Christian group should be ran by a Christian.

      Report Post »  
  • mapgirl10
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:54pm

    Take the group off campus and teach each other the truth through Christ! People who want us to comply with things we don’t want to are insidious worms!

    Report Post »  
    • dmforman
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:11pm

      The university needs to stop funding all student organizations then. The Gay community wouldn’t allow a straight, christian person running the club. The African American club wouldn’t allow a white person to be in charge. A Muslim group wouldn’t allow a Jew or Christian running it. A Christian wouldn’t be running the Jewish club. A softball player wouldn’t be running the rowing club, and so on.

      This is BS, and this is why I don’t give money to my university. Hopefully Vanderbilt students will stop and let those in charge know that they have had enough.

      Report Post »  
  • ModerationIsBest
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:43pm

    Isn’t this how we ended up with girls in the boy scouts and boys in the girl scouts?

    Report Post »  
    • islamhater
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:52pm

      So tired of the BS yet? let me know when you are my guns are loaded and i’m ready to roll. Please stand up America i have kids and grandchildren i would like to leave America to. Not a china or russian state. We need to set our country free for a young ones..

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:01pm

      I’ve been tired of BS from both sides.

      If people want freedom of religion, that‘s great and everything but then don’t get upset when another religion wants to express their religion as well.

      There was a school that use to send backpack mail home with children that had to do with new events, policies and activities going on around in the neighborhood. They had a great policy of making it so no religious pamphlets were sent home with the kids. Then Jerry Falwell went to the school and petitioned that religious material should be distributed to kids as part of their backpack mail and the school somehow agreed.

      Well things took an interesting turn when a local wiccan group sent home information about their beliefs with the kids and of surprisingly(jk) the Christians THREW A FIT, even threatening to sue the school. They talked about their kids getting other beliefs forced on them and the parents didn’t like it. So like most things, everything is fine and dandy…..as long as it’s about something you agree with.

      What about that reality show about Muslim families that got boycotted because it didn’t “show the extreme side of Islam”

      What if I wanted to urge a boycott of a similar Christian show because they didn’t show the extreme of Christianity. Like homosexual hatred or abortion doctor killers?

      To me personally, the way to have TRUE religious freedom, and freedom from other religions, is to keep things out of the public arena and Government in gen

      Report Post »  
    • keaton
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:12pm

      Moderation, you made that story up ,didn’t you?

      Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:26pm

      @KEATON

      Sadly no

      http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Va.+Pagans+advertise+through+Falwell-secured+school+%27backpack+mail%27.-a0159504803

      Report Post »  
    • Rose-Yellen
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:45pm

      Our namby-pamby,middle-of-the-road moderation people are the root cause of these ridiculous acts. Always workin so hard to make everyone happy – which means nobody is happy.

      Report Post »  
    • YippeeKiyay
      Posted on February 2, 2012 at 2:01pm

      Moderationisbest – So what’s your point exactly? Moral equivalence? There you go again, ignoring truth claims. Either Christianity is true or it is false. If it is false, why afford “freedom of religion to it”? The position of the Christian parents in your little bedtime story is more logical and more consistent. Their position is that Wicca is poisonous falsehood and should not be promoted anywhere, let alone the school where their kids attend. The notion that the only absolute is that there are none is an absurdity that you keep reiterating. It’s absolutely laughable. Any five year-old could tell you that it doesn’t match reality. Get a clue “Moderation”. By the way, for a self-proclaimed moderate you’re quite the theophobic extremist.

      Report Post »  
  • chicago76
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:40pm

    The Civil Rights Laws should be repealed or let sunset. If not they will make slaves of all of us in the name of equality.

    Report Post »  
    • ModerationIsBest
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:52pm

      I love how we talk about affirmative action.

      If we as a society want to say that it’s necessary to right past wrongs, that‘s fine and dandy but let’s call it what it is….Legalized racism. Flat out it’s a legal form of racism.

      I get annoyed filling out job applications online and at the end of the application, I always get an “Optional” form to fill out where they ask my race and sex. Wait, I thought we were now supposed to be judging people by the content of their character and not the color of their skin or what sex they are.

      Report Post »  
  • chicago76
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:38pm

    Again the government uses civil rights to destroy our constitutional rights. NO surprise there. When will people realize that the civil rights laws will destroy all of our constitutional rights. That was always the purpose of civil rights laws. In the short run and feel good they were supposedly to help minorities, but in the long run the writers knew that all of our constitutional rights would be destroyed by civil rights laws. That is why they put a sunset on them. Our rights to free speech, free religion, our property rights and our rights to a free press would all be destroyed in the name of civil rights.

    Report Post »  
    • techengineer11
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:50pm

      In Russia today where Jews are no longer running the country they actually promote Christianity…. Imagine that. America can’t even practice Christianity at its Universities any longer… ha ha What a farce!
      Long live the Jewish Apartheid!

      Report Post » techengineer11  
  • Meyvn
    Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:23pm

    How lame. Let the gay person join a gay fraternity at a gay university.

    Report Post » Meyvn  
    • rocketwrangler
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:39pm

      Great idea! Lets make the gay university in the gay state of California.

      Report Post »  
    • Sirfoldallot
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 6:41pm

      Student xchange to Iran

      Report Post » Sirfoldallot  
    • Blazesurfer
      Posted on February 1, 2012 at 7:27pm

      Stop being P..C…They are called homosexuals.

      Report Post » Blazesurfer  
    • Fletcher13
      Posted on February 3, 2012 at 8:39am

      Or be more truthful… call the SEXUAL PERVERTS!

      The manner in which they replace their sick perverseness is typical;

      Being “GAY” used to mean “HAPPY, CHEERFUL” They thought that their lifestyle was happy and cheerful, something that was not to be ashamed of, so they stole a positive description to replace the obvious and truthful negative.

      The rainbow used to be a symbol in Christianity to describe the Promises of God, now it stands for acceptance of homosexual perversion.

      Now they want MARRIAGE re-defined to include their perversion; just so it can be legally forced on all as “acceptable.”

      Homosexuals are not GAY, they are SICK, PERVERTS, MENTALLY ILL, UNNATURAL… call them what they are! Don’t be a dupe of their propagandist revisionism!

      Report Post »  
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