‘We’re Antagonistic Toward Religious Belief’: Military Atheists Hold Army-Sponsored ‘Rock Beyond Belief’ Festival
- Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:20am by
Billy Hallowell
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(The Blaze/AP) — March was a big month for atheists in America. Last weekend, the Reason Rally — the largest gathering of secularists in world history — unfolded on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. Then, this past Saturday, also in a historical first, the U.S. military hosted an event expressly for soldiers and others who don’t believe in God, with a county fair-like gathering on the main parade ground at one of the world’s largest Army posts.
The Rock Beyond Belief event at Fort Bragg, organized by soldiers here two years after an evangelical Christian event at the eastern North Carolina post, is the most visible sign so far of a growing desire by military personnel with atheist or other secular beliefs to get the same recognition as their religious counterparts.
The purpose was not to make the Army look bad, organizers said, but to show that atheists and other secular believers have a place in institutions like the military. As The Blaze reported last year, the Army agreed to give $50,000 toward the event following atheists’ protests over military sponsorship of a Christian concert put on by the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association.
“I love the military,” said Sgt. Justin Griffith, main organizer of the event and the military director of American Atheists. He added, “This is not meant to be a black eye.”
Griffith said he and other non-religious soldiers are not permitted to hold atheist meetings at the post and have so far been rebuffed in their efforts to change that. They feel their beliefs marginalize them.
Organizers were hoping for a crowd of about 5,000. At least several hundred people gathered on the parade ground by midday Saturday. Rainy weather for most of the morning may have affected the turnout. Fort Bragg officials said they would provide a crowd estimate later.
The atmosphere was festive, with carnival treats like ribbon fries and ice cream, games for children and a demonstration jump by the Army’s Golden Knights parachute team. Speakers and bands performed on the main stage. In many ways it was indistinguishable from a county fair except for the information booths ringing the parade ground and the content of the performances.
People listen to Professor Richard Dawkins the headline speaker at the Rock Beyond Belief event, Saturday, March 31, 2012 at Fort Bragg, N.C. For the first time in history, the U.S. military hosted an event expressly for soldiers and others who don't believe in God, with a gathering sort of like a county fair Saturday on the main parade ground at one of the world's largest Army bases. (AP Photo/The Fayetteville Observer, Raul R. Rubiera)
Back in January, we also reported about the intense controversy surrounding one of the bands — Aiden — whose members have used images of a burning church and a bloody cross, among other elements, in a past music video. With the event pledging to be family-friendly, these inclusions did seem a bit odd. This was compounded by the fact that Justin Griffith, an organizer for Rock Beyond Belief, defended the video on the festival’s web site.
This same issues surrounding questionable content unfolded at the Reason Rally last week, where songwriter Tim Minchin unleashed more than 75 expletives as children and families stood watching his performance (see the video here).
(Related: You and God Are Under Attack: Beck Breaks Down Atheism and the Religious Left)
“We got any Darwin fans in the house?” asked a performer named Baba Brinkman at yesterday’s Rock Beyond Belief, before launching into a rap song about evolutionary biology that culminated in a call-and-response chant of “Creationism is dead wrong!”
Organizers said the goal was not to disparage soldiers with religious beliefs. In the weeks leading up to the event, some bloggers and others expressed concerns. A chaplain currently deployed in Afghanistan posted an open letter on Fort Bragg’s Facebook page, saying he feared the event would be devoted to mocking religious soldiers.
Richard Dawkins
“We’re never antagonistic toward religious believers, we’re antagonistic toward religious belief,” said Richard Dawkins, the British biologist and best-selling atheist author who was the event’s headline speaker.
Dawkins, who frequently makes pointed criticism of religious adherents, delivered some relatively restrained remarks, asserting that none of the common arguments for religious belief stand up to scrutiny.
“There is no good, honest reason to believe in a god or gods of any kind, or indeed in anything supernatural,” he said. “The only reason to believe something is that you have evidence for it.”
Watch Dawkins’ speech, below:
The event marked a coming-out of sorts for atheist and secularist soldiers at Fort Bragg, who have been trying for more than a year to be recognized as a “distinctive faith group,” a designation that would allow them to hold their meetings at Bragg facilities. Curious soldiers in uniform mixed with people in civilian clothes as bands played and children began to race around the huge field when the rain let up.
“I’ve been an atheist pretty much my whole life, and where I was growing up in Texas, I didn’t know another atheist,” said Pfc. Lance Reed. “It’s important to meet people who have some of the same beliefs and interests as you do, and that’s what this is about.”
Reed also said he hoped Christians at Bragg and other believers would attend, to dispel some misconceptions about atheists.
“A lot of people think it’s all about God-bashing or something like that,” he said. “You can see we’re not evil people who want to burn down churches. We’re just here to have fun.”
Sgt. Lance Hollander, who said he’s been looking forward to the event ever since he first heard about it last year, agreed that in some ways the concert could serve as a calling card for soldiers who aren’t religious.
“Atheists are the least trusted group in America, and we want to change that,” he said.
A concert that was planned last year fell apart after a dispute between organizers and the base leadership over questions such as location. Saturday’s gathering was made possible in part by $70,000 in donations from the Raleigh-based Stiefel Freethought Foundation, whose founder, Todd Stiefel, said he hopes the Army ultimately decides that its role doesn’t include events like Rock Beyond Belief and the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association-sponsored concert that prompted it.
“I would like this to be the last one of these events,” Stiefel said, arguing that the government shouldn’t have any role in hosting events geared towards religious belief or lack of it.
Fort Bragg is willing to work with organizers of any event that fits its guidelines, said Garrison Commander Col. Stephen Sicinski, who estimated that the BGEA evangelical concert generated twice as much controversy as the atheist event. As far as the Army is concerned, Siciniski said, the event isn’t a bellwether of changing beliefs – it’s simply another one of the community events that Bragg often hosts.
“We don’t treat soldiers who are atheists as atheists, we treat them as soldiers,” he said. “They’re soldiers first.”
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Comments (254)
momsense
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:37pmI hope your smugness doesn‘t come back to bite you when you’re confronted by something you can’t explain rationally.
Report Post »maccow
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:16pmIs it just coincidental that they missed holding this on April 1st, which is of course National Atheists Day, by just 24 hours?
Report Post »ChrisRodda
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:03pm@ MACCOW … I guess It wouldn‘t occur to you that atheists wouldn’t hold a noisy event near the post chapel on a Sunday, as that would interfere with church services and be disrespectful to the religious people who choose to go to church.
Report Post »Evil_Empire
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:11pm@ MOMSENSE
“…when you’re confronted by something you can’t explain rationally.”
Like supposed intelligent adults abandoning logic and reason for the highly unlikely possibility of eternal bliss being granted by a celestial bogeyman, providing of course you abandon your own free will and spend your life in humbled subservience blindly following ill conceived poorly written dogma.
Report Post »barber2
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:28pmCHRIS is our Atheists in the Military Troll on his Day 1 mission on the Blaze .
Report Post »maccow
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:56pm@Chrisroda
Report Post »I am not referring to it being Sunday but rather the fact that its April Fools Day and making a joke about that being National Atheist Day. Guess I should have made that clearer.
Leopold
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:07pm@ CHRIS
I suppose we are to be thankful for their “sensitivity”?
Who do you people think you are. Telling us what is reasonable to belief and what not.
You people have no idea what you are talking about. You are ignorant and arrogant.
You are intolerant and militant. You want to be trusted? Really? Why would we trust you, All you do is belittle people who, contrary to you, have an open mind.
And if you think it is reasonable to belief that slime became fish, became dinosaurs, became birds and eventually an apple tree and a tulip go right ahead. You have our full support and toleration.
Report Post »INTHEBROTHERHOOD
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 5:44pmDawkins…..hold thy tongue. and come out of him…..in jesus name.. if your not for Him, your against Him. not a good position to be in ill intervine and pray We have the ability to call things that are not, as though they are! imagine the possibilities. repent
Report Post »Balpit
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 6:56pm“Atheists are the least trusted group in America, and we want to change that.”
“We’re antagonistic toward religious belief.”
Because nothing fosters trust like hostility towards your beliefs!
Report Post »Unix
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 7:28pmYa’lls choice, but a pit of fire awaits each and every one of you non-believers, mark my words!
Report Post »GPS-Tech
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 8:04pmFor the true believers
Report Post »http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6UZN8cGTsU
Pigpen
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 9:22pmAnd this is just one more reason why the many generations of US Fighting Men in my family will end with me. The day this man’s Army and Country abandoned God is the same day we abandoned it. So now the “proposition nation” formerly known as America is officially no longer Christian according to its Commander-in-Chief and the military officially sponsors atheism. Welcome to the end. Looks like our mush-headed fathers and grand-fathers high from America’s many successes (and apparently thinking that they were somehow being magnanimous) have “open-minded“ and ”tolerated” the rest of us right out of a country. Like I said: Welcome to the End.
Report Post »TomFerrari
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 9:25pmLike the “big bang”? Or gravity? Or platypussesesesss?
Report Post »Or global warming? Make that global cooling. Oops, make that global climate change.
Oh, just give algore (aka ManBearPig) your money, and obama all your God-given rights.
Oops, make that “reason given” rights.
So much for clinging to their “reason” and their “textbooks.”
yougottabekidding
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:27pmEvil_Empire
You talking about Obama Voters?
Report Post »Steel
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 3:42amFaith – belief without proof. Atheists therefore have no faith in anything.
Report Post »F.O.S. DIAPERHEAD
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 5:02am@ PIGPEN
Hopefully this Commie-in-the-White House is just a temporary thing. Hopefully, this is just a downside of being free enough to make such mistakes and learn from them. Hopefully, this little setback will make us stronger. This is not a time to give up but the time to strenghthen our resolve. Keep the faith and don’t let the unenlightened bring you down. It’s not about numbers (personally) – Jesus didn’t calculate. He knew. Don’t put your cross down because others refuse to carry theirs. Remember what team your on. Don’t let secularistic issues confuse you. Know.
That said, I wouldn’t fight for that b@stard either; but, we surely can’t let him take over our military. Lose the battle but win the war.
Report Post »poorrichard09
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 7:27amThese people take an oath to protect and defend the Constitution-guess that doesn’t include the 1st amendment “free exercise” (of religion) clause? The progressives have finally done it, undermining our military.
Report Post »Patrick Henry II
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 6:04pmAcouple hundred attended. Seemed like awfully chosen camera angles. There are a few idiots in the miliary too, activist antagonizers propped up by the Obama administration.
Report Post »NorthWestMom
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:26pmPerhaps if the Army would refrain from squandering it’s budget on garbage like this ….they might actually have the funds available to PAY MY HUSBAND !!!!! He’s been waiting since JULY for his money!!! This INFURIATES ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Report Post »randy
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:44pmGod Bless your husband and you for your service to our great country!
Report Post »Looks like God rained on their parade.
wvernon1981
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:56pm“The festival is an American Atheists event. It was made possible by a $50,000 donation from the Stiefel Freethought Foundation. ”
http://rockbeyondbelief.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Son-of-Thank-God-For-Dead-Soldiers-Preacher-Nate-Phelps-to-speak-at-Military-Base.pdf
Report Post »whatthecrazy
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:08pm@Northwestmom God bless you and your husband for your sacrafice to this country and i pray that it is not invain.It can only be love of country that would drive someone to serve because it sure isn’t the pay.Thank you again…………
Report Post »ILUVJESUS
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:15pmThese liars know exactly what they are doing when they appeal for money asking for an event based on their “beliefs.” theirs is actually an unbelief! But you can’t hold meetings or rallies or ceremonies to nothing, so they are purposely characterizing themselves as having a belief. Well, no belief in god, yeah, lying is par for the course for them!
Report Post »Now look, don’t be stupid, once you’ve had years of experience with these people you accept that the above it TRUE.
As for this dear woman, her husband who hasn’t been paid and their family, yes, I’ll pray for them, but they have to hound their congressman in brief, respectful notes asking for him/her to do something about his pay! If you can meet with the congressmen, then please, do.
Be sure to provide all of your info, name address, military branch, rank, serial number….
Elena2010
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:27pm@Mom — different pot of money. This event likely came out of the MWR funds rather than personnel funds.
I suggest you get your US Rep involved. Sometimes it take his/her DC clout to fix pay problems that have been messed up for as long as your husband’s seems to have been. It probably would not hurt the admin types to audit his pay record and set it straight.
Report Post »Dr Vel
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 4:25pmSorry Mom but they needed the money for more parties in DC, and globe trotting vacations.
Report Post »lukerw
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 5:51pmThroughout ancient history… Soldiers had Cults… where they Worshipped their Weapons! There are NO REAL ATHEISTS… just Pagans who worship Things, Objects, and People!
Report Post »infidelible
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 8:52pm@ILUVJESUS – I’m an atheist and I agree completely that people “can’t hold meetings or rallies or ceremonies to nothing”. I‘ve said many times here that it is ridiculous to group people by what they don’t believe. It’s why I would avoid things like this and the “Reason Rally” as they aren‘t forthcoming about what they are promoting and life’s too short to be someone’s useful idiot.
Report Post »Cesium
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 12:09am@Randy do you have any statistical data to present showing god favors religious gatherings in his name and thus, refrains from allowing rain on them? And then show there is more rain on those who gather challenging religion.. Otherwise your conjecture is non valid
Report Post »commonsensefreethinker1
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 11:15am@STEEL,
” Faith – belief without proof. Atheists therefore have no faith in anything.”
Could’nt be more wrong, We Believe in ourselves as humans to use our brains to succeed and accomplish our goals in life. Not to depend on or blame an invisable being for our actions or to pound the nonsense of destructable misguidence into our childrens heads telling then if you do’nt abide by this fairytale of a book you will spend eternity in hell, and all of this before they have even lived out life
Report Post »on earth they are to be in fear of where they are going when they die. WAY TO SCEW UP A KIDS HEAD!!! So basicly what your saying is why not just accept god now and off yourself? Why wait? This life dos’nt matter. If heaven is where you want to go and earth is just a pit stop . No wonder so many so called christians comit suicide. Well! one word for it “BRAINWASHED”
binge_thinker
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 4:13pmIt is a fact that it takes a great intellectual capacity to understand, trust, and hope than it does to only understand and believe what you see. So it stands to reason that atheist lack the intellectual capacity to comprehend the concept of God.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:19pmThey’re just dilettantes cowering at the thought of a movement in Muslim countries.
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:38pmCrying to the rocks to fall upon them at the end of time.
Report Post »USAMEDIC3008
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:09pmAfter thinking about this, I must say
I may no like it But God gave us FREE WILL
We gave our country the Constition to protect that FREE WILL.
A long time ago I took an oath to defend same
In this country you can strive to be all you can be
WE can through reason try to change others
but when you use force ,That is where I draw the LINE
WE THE PEOPLE are the Government.and as long as that stands ,so will the US
Report Post »I think we may be in trouble>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
wvernon1981
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:57pmDefine free will. There are multiple definitions.
Report Post »USAMEDIC3008
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:14pmTo be or not to be this is the question ????????
Report Post »If it doesnt break my leg or take from my pocket.
commonsensefreethinker1
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 11:22amYes, Free Will
Report Post »“ I ”am free
and“ I ”will do it.
JJBlazeReader
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:06pm..
This festival will undermine unit cohesion. Todd Stiefel and the rest of the secular bigots want to undermine the military, one of the last bastions they have not been able to ruin.
Our military is under assault from within. No one would ever imagine that the U.S. military would allow homosexuality and bestiality. Now they are looking to denigrate the religious faith of the soldier.
Just more proof that atheists spew bigotry, hate and they are destructive to society.
Report Post »..
JGraham III
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:22pmYawn… more stupid atheist tricks! By stating dis-belief in God doesn’t negate His being. Truth has never needed acceptance to be valid. Atheists on the other hand do. Go ahead and continue to spew your invective, atheist-boys. What you sow, you shall also reap. And, when yer butt‘s in the ol’ ringer, guess who it will be who reaches down and helps you out? A (gasp!) Christian who is full of the love of God. Now that is “rocking” beyond belief.
Report Post »maccow
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:34pm@JJ
The assault on the military is not from within because the leaders and members of the military are under civilian authorities at the Executive and Legislative levels. Our highest military officials are political appointees so they don’t really qualify as “the military” either. My brothers and sisters in uniform are being force feed this soup sandwich by a current batch of political leaders who have never served and who care more about ideology then they do about the strength of our military.
If Colonel Jessep were speaking to a bunch of atheists about their “right” to use Ft. Bragg’s parade field, here is what he would say;
“We use words like honor, code, loyalty…we use these words as the backbone to a life spent defending something. You use ‘em as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I’d rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don‘t give a damn what you think you’re entitled to!”
Report Post »arx
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:56pmMaccow. Good speech, but Jessup had no business making it. Where was the honor and loyalty in giving an order, then allowing his subordinates to burn while he denied it? ‘A few good men’ was twisted Hollywood garbage.
Report Post »maccow
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:06pm@Arx
Report Post »I fully agree with your take on the movie, it was monumentally disrespectful to those who serve and have served. Hollywood took Jessep, had him speak some true sentiments concerning military service and honor, and then painted him as a monster thus painting duty and honor as potentially monstrous. So I like throwing his true sentiments back in the lefts face when appropriate.
No offense intended to the Corps intended. This from a retired Soldier.
arx
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 4:02pmYour exactly right. Semper Fi.
Report Post »VanceUppercut
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 6:20pm@JJBlazeReader
You speak of people “spewing bigotry” as you equate homosexuality with bestiality. Funny.
Report Post »Howyinthehills
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 4:20pm“Just more proof that atheists spew bigotry, hate and they are destructive to society.”
Report Post »Hate & bigotry are not peculiar to atheists, as a perusal of many of the implied Christian posts on this thread indicate. Is the implication here that if Christians exhibit hate and bigotry, that is not destructive to society?
rednrusty
Posted on April 4, 2012 at 10:57pmIt is all about tearing our country inside out, just as what s happening with the rest of the entities of our Government
Report Post »carl_in_ohio
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:04pmdoesn’t look very busy from the video.
How can we have a religious event for atheists on government property? – when there is so much outcry over a single cross on a hill? Atheism is a religion — its based on faith.
Report Post »Leopold
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:26pm@CARL
ATHEISM – is a religion. It has all the elements of it.
FAITH = in themselves. and of course in THE ALL KNOWING science.
RIGHTEOUSNESS = what THEY say is right instead of what GOD says is right.
WISDOM = their ARROGANCE.
BELIEVE = they BELIEVE there is no God.
BOOKS = about humanism instead of the BIBLE about God.
WORSHIP = of each other and self. And at THE LAB OF SCIENTISTS, of course.
CHURCHES = schools, colleges and universities.
PUNISHMENT = death penalty for the unborn child that has the nerve to come along at an inconvenient time.
And now they are actually building a church to NOTHING in England. Imagine that!
Now, since it is a church for believers in NOTHING to NOTHING I wonder, will it be invisible? How will NOTHINGISTS find it then?
And there is already a lot of satanic music out there to go along with their worship.
Reason Rally.
Is it not great to be a NOTHINGIST? Well, maybe not so much because, unfortunately, they are useful tools for satan.
Do they have some kind of blessing they give each other? Does anyone know?
Now they are all set to grow by leaps and bounds with their revival meetings and evangelizing.
They are so stupid, they don’t even recognize that they are all about a religion.
But then how can they really know.
Ecclesiastes 10:2
A wise man’s heart is at his right hand, but a fools heart at his left.
And I don’t think there is any doubt about their foolishness. It is very
Report Post »flatbroke
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:03pmWhats so funny about this is, even if you dont believe in God, you still have a belief of something, its still a religion of sorts.
Report Post »TheJeffersonian
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:32pmA single belief does not a religion make. They have no organizational structure, no cultus, no creed, no code, and nothing unifying them except for a lack of beliefs in deities. Why people on this board insist that they’re a religion, I will never know.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:42pmHere are Encarta’s definitions of RELIGION:
1. beliefs and worship: people’s beliefs and opinions concerning the existence, nature, and worship of a deity or deities, and divine involvement in the universe and human life.
2. system: an institutionalized or personal system of beliefs and practices relating to the divine.
Notice that an Atheist fits both definitions. Their belief and opinion concerning a deity or deities is that there is/are none. Nowhere does it say that religion is the belief in and worship of God. People have it all wrong.
As for their practices, atheist activists are very involved with God. They are his enemies. These atheists want to dethrone God, just like Satan does. They are actually ANTI-God. The proof is that much of what they do publicly — the cursing and the vilification of Christianity — is similar to the behavior of other God-haters, such as those who practice witchcraft, Satanism or Islam.
Report Post »Evil_Empire
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:29pmNot believing in God is a religion, just like not collecting stamps is a hobby.
Report Post »Your statement is foolish and poorly thought out. By definition everything you refused to believe in would be a religion.
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:04pm@TheJeffersonian
A single belief does not a religion make. They have no organizational structure, no cultus, no creed, no code, and nothing unifying them except for a lack of beliefs in deities.
—–
You are confusing organized religion with religion. Many people are religious, but do not belong to organized religion. THERE IS DIVERSITY AMONG ATHEISTS, just as there is diversity among those who espouse a belief in a deity or deities, but the most widely held Atheist creed is evolution. It is a big fat lie that evolution is scientifically-based. Evolution is faith-based just like creationism, because evolution cannot prove origins either, and the “missing link” is still missing,
The organizational structure of Atheists is socio-political, because Atheists can only proselytize and expand effectively if they have a socio-political system that forbids or curtails the belief in and worship of God. That is yet another reason why Atheist activists are anti-God. Communism and, less ideally, socialism are examples of political systems that allow Atheism to thrive.
The most common codes Atheists espouse are secularism, secular ethics, or secular humanism, in contrast, e.g., to Judeo-Christian values.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 4:32pm@Evil_Empire
“Not believing in God is a religion, just like not collecting stamps is a hobby.”
It is not advisable to use concrete analogies for abstract/spiritual matters, because often you end up making a false analogy. Since you are using an action in your second proposition, the first proposition would have to be “DENYING God is a religion.” In order to arrive at the correct analogous proposition using HOBBY as a concept, we would have to reason that: “Not everyone collects stamps, but everyone has a hobby.” Using the same source of reference, Encarta, the definition of HOBBY is “an activity engaged in for pleasure and relaxation during spare time.” So the correct second proposition would have to be universal in relation to that concept: “Doing absolutely nothing during your spare time is a hobby.” NOW you can posit an analogy:
“Denying God is a religion, just like doing absolutely nothing during your spare time is a hobby.”
Report Post »(CONT.)
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 4:38pm@Evil_Empire (CONT.)
BTW, that is not my argument. Although the denial of the existence of God is the foundational belief of all Atheists, their religious practices are diverse and complex. See my comment to JEFFERSONIAN.
=> “By definition everything you refused to believe in would be a religion.”
Now that is very poorly thought out. You can’t abandon the parameters of a given concept to make a logical statement concerning that concept. In this case, the definition of religion relates to “beliefs or opinions concerning the existence, nature and worship of a deity or deities.”
Report Post »Balpit
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 7:28pm“Not believing in God is a religion, just like not collecting stamps is a hobby.”
In other words:
I don’t collect stamps, therefore I’m hostile towards anyone who does.
Anyone who uses stamps for anything other than postage is a moron.
I have a list of reasons why stamp collecting is stupid: it wastes money, people hoard stamps when they could give them to poor people who can’t send letters, people waste thousands of dollars for rare stamps, it causes fights between collectors, you need foreign stamps to really complete your collection, your collection will never be complete, they think stamp collections are better than other collections, some murderers collected stamps, etc.
One day, I will make the post office choose a different means of payment.
Thought I’m hostile to other hobbies that involve collections, I’m most hostile towards stamp collecting.
Stamp collectors hate my guts just because I don’t collect stamps. If you try to tell me it‘s because I mock their hobby all the time and they don’t appreciate it, you‘re wrong because they deserve to be mocked because they’re stupid enough to collect stamps.
Report Post »SoNick
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 9:52am@KRYPTONITE
you used Encarta’s definition but apparently, you didn’t bother to read it
1. beliefs and worship: people’s beliefs and opinions concerning the existence, nature, and worship of a deity or deities, and divine involvement in the universe and human life.
2. system: an institutionalized or personal system of beliefs and practices relating to the divine.
Notice the words “deity”; “deities” and “divine”. Religion deals with the divine. Atheists don’t believe in supernatural divine beings. Therefore, atheism does not meet the required criteria to be called a religion. Case closed.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 4, 2012 at 6:38pm@SoNick
you used Encarta’s definition but apparently, you didn’t bother to read it
1. beliefs and worship: people’s beliefs and opinions concerning…
Report Post »——–
I was away, but in case you check back, here’s the key word you are forgetting: “CONCERNING.“ Some ynonyms of concerning are ”relating to, about, regarding, with regard to.” It doesn’t say “IN.” Learn the difference.
Walkabout
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:02pmThe picture shows the event was well attended I see. NOT!
Report Post »Evil_Empire
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:36pm1987 called, it wants its trite colloquialism back.
(It’s unnecessary to point out the irony of this statement, i’m aware.)
Report Post »barber2
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:22pmPlease do not upset our arrogant elitist atheists ! What they lack in good manners and intelligence they make up for in vain, dismissive sensitivity. The New York Times loves their comments.
Report Post »GPS-Tech
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 12:50pm@Feeble Umpire
The failed communist state USSR called, it wants its national symbol back.
Report Post »Walkabout
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:01pm“We’re never antagonistic toward religious believers, we’re antagonistic toward religious belief,” said Richard Dawkins, the British biologist and best-selling atheist author who was the event’s headline speaker.
A person closely identifies with the belief system. You really cannot separate one form the other.
Report Post »This attack on religion is analogous to the left‘s attack on political affiliations they don’t like.
In the political realm people attack Rush Limbaugh or Glenn Beck & then want to say that the listeners misguided or stupid. I really love the ad hominem attacks and then the same people want to be your friend. I listened to NPR for a year before listening to Rush. Once I heard Rush, I turned off NPR. I can get some news from NPR, but I can get more elsewhere without their slant trying to push me to their way of thinking.
Likewise they hate our churches & synagogues, but they are not antagonistic to us. Such a lie.
whatthecrazy
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:15pmIt’s like slapping someone in the face and then saying i didnt mean for that to sting………..evil sobs plain and simple……..
Report Post »SoNick
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 12:53pmAs an atheist, I find Dawkins supremely annoying and find his statement competely hypocritical (“We’re never antagonistic toward religious believers, we’re antagonistic toward religious belief” ).
Report Post »What I do find hilarious, however, is that the same Blazers who use the empty proclamation “hate the sin, not the sinner” would point out that specific Dawkins quote. You can’t condemn one while using the other..
binge_thinker
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 4:18pmRichard Dawkins is known for his vehement and often times vitriolic promotion of weak atheism and the evolutionary paradigm. Dawkins has repeatedly likened religious faith to a mental defect. Really anything this man says is tainted with so much bias and bigotry, no rational person would or should take him seriously.
Report Post »Zod Cranards
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:59amThe fool says in his heart “There is no God”
Report Post »greatgrandma
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:08pmYour right Zod, and today is their National Holiday. Happy April Fools Day everyone.
Report Post »SoNick
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 12:54pmthis one is getting really old, Please find another Bible quote to throw at us poor atheists
Report Post »princess
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:59amFestivals and fairs are already secular, they aren’t preaching anything, they are just a fair. This, although it says “everyone welcome” is really a “religious” event preaching their anti-God worldview. So as long as you are willing to hear it, you will feel welcome. So although they say they are atheists, they have definate, concrete beliefs based not on fact or evidence but their chosen faith. They too are religious.
Report Post »LewisLorenz
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:59amAtheists are never able to show the evidence that God does not exist. Why they keep talking is dumbfounding. They defeat their own philosophy. It is easy, using scientific methods, to conclude that belief in God is right. Aside from empirical evidence, even if the reason one believes is that it provides comfort is that not a “good, honest reason to believe”?
Report Post »Evil_Empire
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:58pm“Atheists are never able to show the evidence that God does not exist.”
Believers are never able to show the evidence that God does exist.
Report Post »The burden of proof dosn’t rest on the unbeliever, but those espousing the extraordinary claim.
For the record, saying it‘s true because it says so right here in this book we wrote doesn’t count.
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 7:22pm@Evil_Empire
Believers are never able to show the evidence that God does exist.
——
Correction: THEISTS are never able…
Let me put it this way: There are more logical arguments in favor of a God or Gods than of no God. We know that as human beings we have creative power, albeit to a limited extent, since we cannot create something out of nothing. We also know that undirected human endeavors fail or fall apart. For ex., it would be ludicrous for anyone to believe that this comment not only self-generated but self-organized into cohesive and coherent language, without human intervention and direction. LIKEWISE, it is more plausible to believe that a physical universe that is highly complex, bound by laws and ever-expanding, as well as its life forms were created and are controlled by a supernatural intelligent Source.
God never intended for us to be able to prove his existence; we can’t. He exists and lives in a dimension that is beyond the reach of physical laws and experimentation. However, we have been endowed with a spiritual force/substance which, when activated, allows the human spirit to be reborn, so we can fellowship with God and make real his promises for us in this life and for eternity. There is another way to tap into the spirit world, and that is through the occult, but it brings death and destruction. Not surprisingly, some Atheists end up getting involved in the occult.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 7:40pmForgot this: That “spiritual force/substance” is faith, but its Biblical connotation is quite different from the ordinary meaning of the word.
Report Post »Joe Barron
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:57amI just returned from church where I said a prayer for all of you..
Report Post »searching for the Truth
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:26pmThanks.
Report Post »EndTheGOPTEA
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 9:22pmOh my, Is that your Real Name?
Report Post »Just in time
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:48amI believe they are antagonistic, when really they should be agnostic.
Report Post »Charybdis
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:43amExpecting 5000, but only got a few hundred? I’d call that a big FAIL! Regardless of the weather.
Report Post »Ruler4You
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:56amThey demand “tolerance” but act belligerently toward believers as part of their dogmatic principles?
Any body here following the ball, at all? Do you STILL believe that “atheists” are only acting out of no belief in God?
Folks, I just don’t know what it will take, if you can’t see the program from where you sit.
Report Post »rednrusty
Posted on April 4, 2012 at 11:03pmrebellion,is their act
Report Post »therealconservative
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:37amThe poster reminds me of OWS posters, same style.
Report Post »possom
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:33amGriffith said he and other non-religious soldiers are not permitted to hold atheist meetings at the post and have so far been rebuffed in their efforts to change that. They feel their beliefs marginalize them. Q. Their athiest’s, what belief’s?
Report Post »barber2
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:25pmthey are just “ using the system” to cause civil unrest and division. That is their mission ! They want to destroy capitalism. and America .
Report Post »hauschild
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:33am“There is no good, honest reason to believe in a god or gods of any kind, or indeed in anything supernatural.”
Then go move to a god-less country and preach to yer choir you bottom-feeding freak. I hate how these types of people appeal to those who haven’t been reared properly.
Name one free, financially stable and wealthy country where the vast majority are atheists – can’t do it, can ya?
Now, just off the top of your head, name two of the most murderous leaders in history and what they have in common: Stalin and Hitler – atheists.
Ain’t rocket science, people.
Report Post »wvernon1981
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:45amPossibly Sweden, Denmark, Norway, and Japan
Report Post »Walkabout
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:15pmwvernon1981
I would not call Norway, Sweden or Denmark stable. Just because you can’t see the sands shifting beneath you feet does not mean they are not shifting.
People were protesting in Copenhagen the other day because of too much immigration. You wouldn’t see it in U.S. news. It doesn’t fit the narrative of the left. Obviously the country is in turmoil. I should get a better report in 2 weeks.
Let’s put it this way. If the Demographics shift over 2 or 3 generations & the special welfare state fails & starts to look like Egypt, I would not regard those countries as stable.
Egypt is not stable. It is a police state. there are transitioning from 1 oligarchy to another. In the interim it looks like Democracy, but is not. Pretty soon the Coptic minority will shrink from 10% to 5%. The military & the Muslim Brotherhood will keep a lid on protests for a while, so it will look like peace. Keep believing brother.
In liberal U.A.E. I know that ex pat women can’t work outside the home & have to have a note from their husbands to leave the house, which has to be presented to the police upon request.
Turkey is getting worse & I use to think U.A. E. was more egalitarian than Saudi Arabia. Apparently they are becoming more hardline MusIim. Europe is only generations behind if the demographic trend continues. The immigration is the result of lovey dovey socialist policies. Let’s ee if they can hold together a socialist utopia in the future. I bet
Report Post »JJBlazeReader
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:21pm..
Walkabout
The problem Scandinavian and European Nations have is that the Christian moral fabric of their society has been torn apart by atheists/secularists. As a result they cannot withstand a determined attack by another culture, specifically Islam.
..
Report Post »Chet Hempstead
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 3:18pmWalkabout
Report Post »If you’re going to invoke possible invisible instability, you’re rigging the question. The United States is arguably unstable under those terms, even though we still have a nominally religious majority.
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 8:08pm@JJBlazeReader
Report Post »As a result they cannot withstand a determined attack by another culture, specifically Islam.
—–
Islam is a theo-political totalitarian regime. The theocratic element is merely the means to achieve infiltration and ultimate subjugation. If the d*ckheads who rule Iran really believed in “paradise by suicide bombing,” they would have blown themselves up as soon as they realized those women in burqas ain’t the real deal. The alleged paradise for a suicide bomber is beyond any male’s wildest dreams.
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 8:30pm@wvernon1981
Possibly Sweden, Denmark, Norway, and Japan
——-
Hmm. It all depends on how you view freedom. Freedom, as we know it, did not exist in Japan prior to the US occupation. Here’s a good summary: http://www.indyflicks.com/danielle/papers/paper10.htm
As for Denmark, Sweden and Norway, they USED to be Christian countries. Not anymore, and the consequences are telling. I’ve said this before, but it’s worth repeating: Secularism is no match for Islamo-fascism.
I won’t address any other aspect, because once freedom is gone, everything else goes down the drain for the ordinary citizen.
Report Post »JJBlazeReader
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 10:40pm..
@kryptonite
“Islam is a theo-political totalitarian regime.”
We are in agreement. Atheism/secularism’s world paradigm is unable to withstand a determined assault by Islam. Atheists/secularists are so full of hate that all they want to do is destroy Christianity and they fail to see that it will be replaced by Islam. This is what is happening in Europe.
..
Report Post »COFemale
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:31amRained at Reason Rally
Rained at Ft Bragg’s Atheist Rally
Clue!!!
God ain’t happy.
Report Post »MegYaltero
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:20pmI know, right?! http://lmgtfy.com/?q=billy+graham+despite+rainy+weather
Report Post »TonyAgudo
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:53pmSo if God wasn’t happy at atheists and sent a measly rain, then what about this? http://www.google.com/search?q=tornado+damaged+churches&hl=en&safe=off&pws=0&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&ei=Q5R4T-jKGYa20AH9_oGwDQ&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CAsQ_AUoAQ&biw=1600&bih=729
What did those churches do to deserve *that*? Nothing, because rain and tornadoes are just natural(albeit destructive) processes, not “God’s will”.
Report Post »NHwinter
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:30amTake faith out of society, make marriage old fashioned, break up the family unit, make government more important than the rights God gave us, condemn Capitalism, advance racism, class warfare, big business is evil, advocate the rights of gays, sexualize our youth, promote drugs, etc.,etc., and you have accomplished Marxism/Communism. The downfall of America and our Republic.
Report Post »progressiveslayer
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:30amWe have a Marxist president so this is pretty consistent with his thinking,erase God from society completely so you can worship the state.Communism ie atheism is a death cult and they‘re very good at genocide they’ve proven it so many times.
Report Post »barber2
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:55pmBingo. Think you‘ve labelled Obama’s “religion” correctly: he worships Big Brother Government – like all good Marxists do. They hate religions and religious people. One of the first groups they target for their abuse. Big Brother .
Report Post »Pontiac
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 2:08pmProgressives have no problem using religion, specifically christianity, as a medium to propel their ideology.
Report Post »kickagrandma
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:29amWell, you all are just about the cutest, happiest people I’ve ever seen…. NOT!
Go live somewhere else, please, and leave our country, GOD’s country alone. Or is that too difficult for you, too?
Report Post »VanceUppercut
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 6:25pm@kickagrandma
Telling a bunch of soldiers to “leave this country”? Oh, I forgot, you people only pretend to care about soldiers when it suits you.
Report Post »VanceUppercut
Posted on April 2, 2012 at 2:04pm@kryptonite
First, being an atheist doesn’t make you a Communist. Second, Obama is not a Communist, just look at the fact that many liberals have turned against him because they feel he’s been too friendly to Big Business. Lastly, thankfully the days of McCarthyism are over, and citizens of these United States can hold any political view that they choose without being brought before a Congressional hearing to explain themselves. To say that someone should “leave our country” because of a political belief that you assume they have is truly un-American, but I don’t expect you to understand that.
Report Post »binge_thinker
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 4:24pm@ Vance
It sounds like you are a drone, who has grown up being spoon fed your preferred meal of left-wing propaganda….to the point, you can no longer think for yourself, and simply repeatedly parrot whatever atheist propaganda you have had pumped into your mind.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 4, 2012 at 6:53pm@VanceUppercut
First, being an atheist doesn’t make you a Communist. Second, Obama is not a Communist, just look at the fact that many liberals have turned against him because they feel he’s been too friendly to Big Business. Lastly, thankfully the days of McCarthyism are over, and citizens of these United States can hold any political view that they choose without being brought before a Congressional hearing to explain themselves. To say that someone should “leave our country” because of a political belief that you assume they have is truly un-American, but I don’t expect you to understand that.
——–
I. I never said all atheists are commies, but all commies ARE atheists.
2. Obama is friendly to Big Business that supports him and are helping him further his agenda. FYI, we are in the neo-commie era, where communism has been refurbished and goes by the more palatable name of “state capitalism.” I prefer neo-communism, just to keep things clear.
3. No, you don’t expect me to understand that, and I don’t expect liberal useful idiots to understand that communists are the enemy within. They infiltrate a country until they grow strong, and then they destroy the Republic. If Obama stays another four years, you can kiss America goodbye.
Was it you who reported me, or did I hurt the sensibilities of one of dear Betsy’s moderators?
Report Post »quenchmarks
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:27am“Organizers were hoping for a crowd of about 5,000. At least several hundred people gathered on the parade ground by midday Saturday. ”
I guess their hopes weren’t answered.
Report Post »COFemale
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:44amNo their prayers were not answered…. LOL
Report Post »usedCZARsalesman
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:08pmLOL, now thats funny
Report Post »SamIamTwo
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:26amFort Bragg is willing to work with organizers of any event that fits its guidelines, said Garrison Commander Col. Stephen Sicinski, who estimated that the BGEA evangelical concert generated twice as much controversy as the atheist event. As far as the Army is concerned, Siciniski said, the event isn’t a bellwether of changing beliefs – it’s simply another one of the community events that Bragg often hosts.
____________________________________________________________
Yeah and you are using my hard earned money to support this? Yes you are…Fraud waste and abuse by any other name.
Atheists are haters…period.
Report Post »marine249
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:25amI bet when that hot hunk of lead heads
Report Post »up your backside yoy say “ OH GOD ”
SamIamTwo
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 11:28amForgive them for they no not what they do, say and behave. The lost ones, the ones in the desert seeking to fill a void in their lives and they fill it by attacking other peoples faith…useful idiots for terrorists. JIMHO
Report Post »drago
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 12:46pm@Marine249.
Report Post »They look like more targets of opportunity to me………
Pontiac
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:17pm@marine249
Well I would suspect the correct spelling would be “gawd” in that instance… Do you honestly think a making light of someones moment of panic does theism any favors?
@drago
Report Post »You‘re a sick individual and you’re just further proving how sick and twisted theist are.
marine249
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:25pm@ PONTIAC
no the correct spelling is GOD
Report Post »Pontiac
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 1:45pm@marine249
Report Post »Oh my yes. You have defeated me. I concede. We atheist always call upon theist gods every time we’re injured because we stopped disbelieving your myths & superstitions for a moment…
kryptonite
Posted on April 1, 2012 at 10:41pm@Pontiac
Well I would suspect the correct spelling would be “gawd” in that instance… Do you honestly think a making light of someones moment of panic does theism any favors?
——–
“Making light?” On the contrary, he is being gravely, dead serious.
Many unbelievers do turn to God, not when they experience a moment of panic but when they are faced with imminent death. Others, like Hussein of Iraq or Hussein of America, never turn to the living God no matter what. I’ll look for you by your username when I get to heaven. Maybe I’ll be pleasantly surprised.
Report Post »Pontiac
Posted on April 3, 2012 at 10:34pmAlright I’ll play your silly game. I sometimes say “OH GOD” when I take a huge dump or when I’m having sex. I guess that makes me a believer…
Please spare us from your idiocy and meet “your maker” at your earliest convenience.
Report Post »kryptonite
Posted on April 4, 2012 at 7:01pm@Pontiac
Alright I’ll play your silly game. I sometimes say “OH GOD” when I take a huge dump or when I’m having sex. I guess that makes me a believer
——
No, that makes you full of cr@p.
——–
==> meet “your maker” at your earliest convenience.
Wasn’t it you who accused Drago of being “sick and twisted?” Ah, the typical liberal. Always accusing the right of what they are guilty of.
Report Post »