User Profile: tzion

tzion

Member Since: October 05, 2011

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  • November 26, 2014 at 5:39pm

    @mojo
    Can you possibly be any less specific? Haganah and Irgun had a long history of bumping heads. At times they set aside their differences but even then they rarely actually cooperated.

    Besides, name one other time that Haganah bombed anything. Most of the time Haganah was focused on immigration and defending Jewish villages from attack. Palmach occasionally arranged breakouts from detention centers but bombing was Irgun’s forte.

  • [2] November 26, 2014 at 3:51pm

    The UN isn’t the world. The UN is a body of people who like to believe they have more power than they do and enjoy thinking that they and they alone know what’s best for the entire world.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 3:13pm

    “We give aid to Israel and ignore the rest of the region.”

    Uh, no. We give aid to Egypt, the PA, and numerous other countries in the region.

  • November 26, 2014 at 3:09pm

    @mojo
    The King David Hotel was bombed by Irgun, not Haganah. Your facts are entirely off. On top of that, the only reason the hotel was bombed was because of the MILITARY command post operating inside the hotel. Had the command post been anywhere else the bombing wouldn’t have happened.

  • November 26, 2014 at 2:32pm

    @nil
    We bring you another Lie from Nilsson.

    This time his claim is, “Israel has attacked our military and American civilians – the latter in a false flag terror attack to trick the US in to war! See the “Lavon Affair.””

    This example shows how even facts can be used to lie. Yes there was an incident called the Lavon affair. Yes it was a false flag attack by Israel.

    But from that point forward the lies begin. The attack never harmed a single American soldier or civilian. The target was American businesses in Egypt, which were firebombed. Nil claims otherwise and is therefore lying.

    Nil also claims the goal was to get the US to go to war. This is yet another lie. The group Israel sought to blame was the Muslim Brotherhood, a group that was outlawed under Egyptian law at the time. The idea that the US would declare war on a country because outlaws were vandalizing the property of US citizens is ludicrous. We might as well attack Mexico for the robbing of American tourists (though I might support an attack in response to cartel violence and illegal immigration, both of which happen on US soil).

    The true purpose of the attack was to sabotage US efforts to get the Suez Canal placed under Egyptian control (it was still controlled by Britain at the time).

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 2:19pm

    Further research has produced some interesting results on this topic. First, it appears you have mixed up your propaganda. The false quote attributed to the NYT article was:

    “We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel… Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours.”

    Which is a fabricated quote.

    Second, the quote you gave has been taken out of context and altered entirely. The original reads:

    “The Arabs will never win over us by throwing stones. Our response must be a nationalist Zionist response. For every stone that’s thrown–we will build ten settlements. If 100 settlements will exist–and they will–between Nablus and Jerusalem, stones will not be thrown. If this will be the situation, then the Arabs will only be able to scurry around like drugged roaches in a bottle.”

    This quote was made in response to a suggestion by Knesset members that stone throwers be dealt with by either shooting at their feet or throwing stones back. Eitan says to ignore the stones and just build Jewish neighborhoods instead.

  • November 26, 2014 at 1:48pm

    @nil
    “as I have stated elsewhere the founders of Israel were recognized terrorists. See the Irgun and Stern Gang. Look up how they kidnapped Brit soldiers, murdered them, and boobytrapped their bodies.”

    And as I have stated elsewhere, neither Irgun nor Lechi (Stern Gang) founded Israel. Israel was founded by the leaders of the Jewish Agency, who worked primarily with Haganah and Palmach as their military arm. Irgun and Lechi were incorporated into the early IDF in 1948 due to the imminent need but had no active role in forming a government.

    As for the attacks on British soldiers, from the perspective of these groups Britain had actively violated the conditions under which they were permitted to govern Palestine. Thus they saw war against Britain as justified. You’ll notice that they only attacked targets of military value. Moreover, the soldiers were kidnapped in response to the the arrest and execution of Jews by the British.

    Responses (4) +
  • November 26, 2014 at 1:27pm

    Okay, since the blaze doesn’t post links as they are typed, I’ll tell you how I found it. I ran a Bing search on “Raphael Eitan quote” and the third result was titled “CAMERA: Exposing False Zionist Quotes (Quote Busters)”. Should be easy enough to find.

    According to this source: “The quote does not appear in either article. While both sources discuss comments made by then-outgoing Chief of Staff Eitan, there is nothing remotely resembling this quote. A wider search of the New York Times archives, also turns up nothing.”

  • November 26, 2014 at 1:19pm

    A search of the New York Times archives turns up no article from that date referring to Raphael Eitan at all. Moreover, you have not provided the full text of the article or even the title.

    Meanwhile, I found a source that claims that quote is a complete fabrication.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 1:07pm

    “If not, their support of MEK and PKK are.

    If not that, their practice of assassinations is.”

    As far as MEK and PKK go, you haven’t proven Israel’s support of them.

    As for assassinations, doesn’t the US do that? What would you call the killing of Bin Laden? If a country won’t extradite a terrorist who’s actively planning attacks on your country, assassination is simply an act of war.

  • November 26, 2014 at 12:08pm

    @nil
    Your link would be interesting if it wasn’t for the fact that Jews traditionally don’t define themselves as a race. Rather, they are a nation and a religious group. Conversion to Judaism dates back to Biblical times. King David had Moabite ancestors. Moses’s wife was a Midianite.

    Besides, one thing your link doesn’t address is that Jews were already living in Europe BEFORE 70 CE. There were Jews at that time living in Rome itself. Even your link admits that the Khazar converts intermixed with other Jews from Slavic, Greek, and German lands. After over 1000 years of this indiscriminate intermixing, who can honestly claim that European Jews don’t have even a small percentage of Israelite ancestry?

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:53am

    @nil
    “early on, before they were labeled “ISIS” Israel was aiding that group against Assad. Is that not a tie to terrorism?”

    Another lie from nil. First of all, they weren’t labeled ISIS, they started calling themselves by that name.

    More importantly though, I don’t recall Israel ever arming, funding, or directly supporting this group in any way. If anyone was doing that or proposing that it be done, it would be the US.

    What Israel did was attack weapon shipments to Hezbollah and destroy military facilities belonging to Assad that were in danger of falling into rebel hands. Oh, and attack any force that fired on Israel, which Assad did on at least one occasion I recall, probably more.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:35am

    Actually, during the 50s and 60s, we didn’t support Israel in any meaningful way and were practically in bed with Egypt and the Saudis. In fact, in the case of the Saudis, we still are. That didn’t stop them from funding terrorist attacks against us.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:32am

    “Oh, because our corrupt government is aiding Israel in ethnically cleansing them.”

    But Israel isn’t ethnically cleansing them. Look at their population growth. Equal to or greater than Israel’s own growth rate.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:29am

    The US isn’t aiding in their extermination and they still hate us.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:27am

    What gives them the right to expand their borders?

    What gave the US the right to expand its borders to include what is today the entire Southwestern United States. Answer, Mexico declared war on us.

    Similarly, Egypt, Jordan, and Syria all lost territory after attacking Israel. Ukraine didn’t attack Russia.

  • [2] November 26, 2014 at 11:24am

    @nil
    Quoting a source without citing it is plagiarism.

  • [2] November 26, 2014 at 11:22am

    Let’s look at your list nil:

    “Not been the target of terrorism including the 9/11 attacks”

    This is just an nothing more than an assertion that cannot be proven. Besides, those of us who know you understand that you believe Israel was behind the attacks to begin with, which is entirely false.

    “A few trillion dollars richer”

    Again, this cannot be proven for certain. In any case, considering how much debt we have, including unfunded liabilities, money to Israel is negligible by comparison.

    “Not been dragged in to wars for Israel like in Iraq and Afghanistan”

    An assertion based on a lie. Nothing more.

    “Cheaper oil and gas”

    Not importing a vital resource from the unstable Middle East and producing our own energy would be better. But of course, you oppose energy independence and want the US to be an Iranian puppet state.

    “More allies and influence in the region (whereas now we are pushing the Middle East in to the arms of China.)”

    You want to be allied with these people? Newsflash nil, some of these people have hated the West for over a century.

  • [3] November 26, 2014 at 11:14am

    @ewoks
    I have researched the USS Liberty. I don’t see your point. A US naval vessel, built for mapping enemy deployments based on radio signals, was floating calmly off the Sinai coast in the middle of an active war zone. Why was it there? We don’t know. It was attacked by Israeli forces in what both the US and Israel have called a case of mistaken identity. Israel then paid damages and reparations to the US and to the victims. End of story.

    Not that I don’t find certain questionable issues with the story. But all my questions are directed at the US. Why was the Liberty there? Why was it never assisted by US forces? Why were planes sent to help her recalled? At times I see similarities between how the US government handled the Liberty and how they responded to Benghazi.

  • [1] November 26, 2014 at 11:04am

    @nil
    “Know who else are nationalists and socialists? Israel.”

    So it’s okay if Germans are national socialists but not Israel (not that Israel is national socialist to begin with)? Proof you’re an antisemite. You have different standards for yourself and for others.

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